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You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

Edgy DC Feb 09 2009 10:05 AM 2009 Insults and Injuries Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Feb 09 2009 02:00 PM

Fartinez out for three weeks with a "elbow strain." That should take him into the start of training camp. (Merged from 2009 Insults and Injuries, 3/12/2009)

metirish Feb 09 2009 01:30 PM

At least he's not out with a twisted testicle. (Merged from 2009 Insults and Injuries, 3/12/2009)

John Cougar Lunchbucket Feb 18 2009 07:57 AM

Brian Stokes, hammy. "It's not like I heard a pop or anything."

Centerfield Feb 18 2009 08:00 AM

I was kinda hoping Stokes would develop into our 7th inning guy.

Benjamin Grimm Feb 18 2009 08:12 AM

He still might. I'm hoping that the Mets will still have their starting pitcher in the game through the seventh inning a lot more than they did last year.

metirish Feb 18 2009 08:45 AM

I was stoked by Brian last season......yeah I'm lame so what.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 18 2009 07:42 PM

If it's a tight race for the last BP spot, we have somewhere to stash him for 3-4 weeks into the season, as he doesn't have any minor-league options left. A blessing in disguise?

John Cougar Lunchbucket Feb 25 2009 09:02 AM

Tobi Stoner: Shoulder pain, shut down Tatis: Bruised palm, but should play in today xhibition opener Tim Redding: Had shoulder soreness but scheduled to throw and start a game March 8.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 25 2009 01:07 PM

Heard a terrible rumor: Did Sean Green just take one off the pitching hand from Wigginton?

attgig Feb 25 2009 01:34 PM

his fingernail split. from what I heard, it wasn't taking a pitch on his hand. just split as he was pitching.

metirish Feb 25 2009 01:46 PM

Lennon Blog update Sean Green update -- with quotes from the reliever BY DAVID LENNON FT. LAUDERDALE – The Mets’ debut of Sean Green was short-lived as the highly touted reliever was forced to leave in the first inning of today’s Grapefruit League opener because of a small cut on the middle fingernail of his right hand. “My nail cracked a little bit a couple pitches before the end of that inning,” Green said, “so before I ripped it off completely, I just wanted to stop. I just didn’t want it to get worse. It’s one of those things that if you let if keep going it can get pretty nasty.” After a relatively quiet two weeks of spring training, the Mets suffered their first injury in the very first game. Starting against the Orioles, Green allowed an infield single to Ryan Freel before striking out Adam Jones and retiring Luke Scott on a fly ball to centerfield. The next batter was former Met Ty Wigginton, and he slapped an RBI single past the diving Luis Castillo. Green then walked off the mound, and was checked on by trainer Ray Ramirez and manager Jerry Manuel. After a brief discussion, Green headed for the clubhouse and was replaced by Pedro Feliciano. Green plans to have the nail repaired and does not anticipate skipping his next turn. “It never happened before, but it’s a pretty easy fix,” Green said. “I’ll just put a fake nail on it and it will be fine. I don’t plan on missing any time. “I was scheduled for two today, I was hoping for two innings, not two outs.

Edgy DC Mar 06 2009 08:26 AM

Tom Martin, out for a week with a calf strain. He's also wearing the dreaded boot. Fernando Martinez stilll seems a week away from playing defense, with a sore elbow.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Mar 07 2009 08:22 PM

Pelfrey with leg discomfort disgnosed as a strain likely not to make his next scheduled appearance Castillo has a hammy issue Pagan out with something or other

metirish Mar 07 2009 08:25 PM

I'm going to pray for Pagan.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Mar 07 2009 08:29 PM

I'm praying for Pelf.

Edgy DC Mar 07 2009 08:54 PM

Pagan out with an excuse to stash him on the DL.

Edgy DC Mar 10 2009 06:09 AM

My snarky snarkiness aside, Pagan apparently has a bone spur in his elbow (stupid MRI), and could be looking at arthroscopic surgery.

MFS62 Mar 10 2009 05:37 PM

[quote="Edgy DC":3ldfsrfr]My snarky snarkiness aside, Pagan apparently has a bone spur in his elbow (stupid MRI), and could be looking at arthroscopic surgery.[/quote:3ldfsrfr] Poor guy. As the old expression goes, if he didn't have bad luck, he'd have no luck at all. I wish him well. Later

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 10 2009 07:11 PM

On the plus side, he starts on the DL, and Bobby Kielty grabs a month-long tryout as our fifth OF/bench bat. He rehabs, and comes up in May when he's ready. No bigs... (Righty pop. Plus, hey-- token bench ginger.)

metirish Mar 12 2009 08:05 PM

Tom Martin fractured his right wrist yesterday when he fell down a stairs. (Merged from 2009 Insults and Injuries, 3/12/2009)

Edgy DC Mar 12 2009 08:41 PM

One less leftie. Ouch. Least it's not his pitching arm.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Mar 13 2009 07:20 AM

How do you suppose Tom Martin came to fall down the stairs? a) wine b) beer c) hard stuff

metirish Mar 13 2009 07:34 AM

Probably fell over a big fat pitch.

Edgy DC Mar 13 2009 07:43 AM

The Mets had him walking around in one of those damn boots. Maybe he failed to negotiate a step due to bootish issues. The boot is never an encouraging thing.

TransMonk Mar 13 2009 07:46 AM

Gwreck Mar 13 2009 08:33 AM

[quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":3exyez7j]How do you suppose Tom Martin came to fall down the stairs? a) wine b) beer c) hard stuff[/quote:3exyez7j] d) Stumbled while carrying deer meat from a deer he shot? Oh, wait, that was the other guy..

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 15 2009 09:00 PM

Jesus. http://blogs.trb.com/sports/baseball/bl ... re_du.html

Edgy DC Mar 16 2009 05:56 AM

Ironically, Feliciano and Vazquez are represented by the same agents, Melvin Roman and David Schwartz. Huh?

metsguyinmichigan Mar 16 2009 07:55 AM

[quote="Edgy DC"] Ironically, Feliciano and Vazquez are represented by the same agents, Melvin Roman and David Schwartz. Huh?

That's not irony, that's a coincidence.

Like Alanis, many people don't understand what irony is.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 19 2009 11:21 AM

It's a good thing Pudge is still--- oh, wait. http://www.nj.com/mets/index.ssf/2009/0 ... an_sc.html

seawolf17 Mar 19 2009 11:29 AM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"]It's a good thing Pudge is still--- oh, wait. http://www.nj.com/mets/index.ssf/2009/0 ... an_sc.html

"I'm just saying I'm available, and I could catch 120 games if I had to."

metirish Mar 19 2009 11:39 AM

ut indefinitely with a right knee injury Not good obviously. Hey this is Castro's big chance....he'll not be pleased about this.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 19 2009 11:50 AM

Beyond Darth Ramon and Cancel... Josh Bard (.265/.333/.395 career, iffy but not terrible defensively) was released by the Sawx yesterday. (Supposedly because he was less knuckler-friendly/older than PawSoxer George Kottaras.) Beyond that, there's Estrada, LoDuca, Gary Bennett and several other even less desirable options.

Benjamin Grimm Mar 19 2009 12:12 PM

And there's Josh Thole.

Edgy DC Mar 19 2009 12:15 PM

No at-bats above A-ball for Tholio yet, and still raw as a receiver.

Benjamin Grimm Mar 19 2009 12:26 PM

Yeah, I just looked him up. He's 22 and a half and hasn't played above St. Lucie. (He hit .300 there with 25 doubles, 5 homers and 45 walks in 347 at bats in 2008.)

OlerudOwned Mar 19 2009 01:54 PM

Bard could usually hit pretty well for a catcher, though I'm not really sure what the hell happened to him last year. I remember when Boston let Mirabelli walk and signed Bard, then traded Bard to San Diego for Mirabelli early in the year when they realized that the dude just could not handle the knuckleball.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 19 2009 04:55 PM

[quote="OlerudOwned":2m0jj1vh]Bard could usually hit pretty well for a catcher, though I'm not really sure what the hell happened to him last year. I remember when Boston let Mirabelli walk and signed Bard, then traded Bard to San Diego for Mirabelli early in the year when they realized that the dude just could not handle the knuckleball.[/quote:2m0jj1vh] And then they did the exact same thing again this off-season. A glitch in the Mass-trix?

MFS62 Mar 19 2009 05:37 PM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":tn7aqi8o]Beyond Darth Ramon [/quote:tn7aqi8o] Darth Ramon? Jabba the Hutt comes more readily to mind. Later

John Cougar Lunchbucket Mar 19 2009 09:30 PM

Has no one but me noticed Rene Rivera is slugging .786 during spring training? I do believe he'll hit 87 home runs if he can just manage 400 at-bats this year. Plus it'll be cool to have our first No. 77.

metirish Mar 20 2009 08:56 AM

That's just the kind of optimism we need , his B-R page sponsored by Mets types. Those 87 home runs would bring his career total to a nice round number - 90 http://www.baseball-reference.com/r/riverre01.shtml

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 20 2009 09:05 AM

"Rene (Rivera) Rivera" Was just thinking that he'd be our first Rene-- apparently, he'd also be our first Rivera-as-FN? That's major major.

Edgy DC Apr 01 2009 05:09 PM

April Fool's Day Joke? Putz leaves Mets win with irritated fingernail 20 hours ago JUPITER, Fla. (AP) — Setup man J.J. Putz left the New York Mets' 9-2 victory over the Florida Marlins on Tuesday night after irritating the fingernail on his right middle finger. Putz struck out Alejandro De Aza looking and Andy Gonzalez swinging in the eighth inning. He then walked off the mound and was greeted by manager Jerry Manuel near the first-base line. Manuel said it was nothing serious. Darren O'Day replaced Putz and Francisco Rodriguez pitched a scoreless ninth. John Maine allowed two runs and six hits in 5 2-3 innings for New York. Anibal Sanchez went six innings for the Marlins, yielding three runs, one earned, and six hits. Florida's Cody Ross hit a solo homer in the fifth inning.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Apr 01 2009 05:47 PM

No that really happened. I heard it called live.

Edgy DC Apr 01 2009 06:00 PM

It's just such a milquetoastey diagnosis. It's putzy, is what it is. I mean, it's spring training and all, so certainly pull him, but you'd think the training staff could come up with something darker sounding --- a ruptured manus or something.

OlerudOwned Apr 01 2009 07:28 PM

Disgruntled lunula.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Apr 01 2009 07:54 PM

Unquiet unguis.

OlerudOwned Apr 01 2009 08:23 PM

Cantankerous cuticle?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Apr 01 2009 10:38 PM

Keyed-up keratin-deposits?

metirish Apr 16 2009 10:07 AM

Pelfrey has tendinitis in his pitching forearm, will probably miss a start. I hope that's all.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Apr 16 2009 10:12 AM

Tendons get better with rest, I wouldn't see the harm in his skipping a start this week. They say Niese is on turn and would be the likely replacement.

Edgy DC Apr 16 2009 02:59 PM

Adam Rubin is predicting Nelson Figueroa after Figgy got pulled after two innings against Scranton-Wilkes Barre today.

Edgy DC Apr 28 2009 07:03 AM

So, how about that Delgado hip? In lineup that shares Murphy and Tatis, I'd sure like to see Murphy at first and Tatis in left. It'd help get me past the idea that they fear the controversy of playing Murphy anyplace but left.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Apr 28 2009 07:07 AM

As per Manuel-via-Cerrone, CarlosDos'll "see a doctor" today. Also, Castillo's likely out tonight with back spasms. And yeah, I'm with whoever said we should be giving Murph the Mitchell-in-'86 treatment-- if LF isn't working out so well, let's explore the studio space a bit, no?

Edgy DC Apr 28 2009 07:31 AM

That's me. The worst thing he needs is to be putting so much pressure on himself to get good at a position that he (a) gets bad, and (b) wastes the mental energy that should go into hitting. Just hit, Baby. The world is full of guys who came up without being much good at any position but bounced around while their bat did the talking. Some of them eventually settled in somewhere and did well. Some didn't.

metirish Apr 28 2009 07:57 PM

SNY reports and shows Hamels rolling his ankle in the Phils game tonight , needless to say it looked not good.

batmagadanleadoff Apr 28 2009 08:14 PM

[quote="metirish":1kof63az]SNY reports and shows Hamels rolling his ankle in the Phils game tonight , needless to say it looked not good.[/quote:1kof63az] Not only did it not look good, but it didn't look bad either. In fact, it didn't look like anything. The SNY announcer warned its squeamish viewers to look away but when they replayed the injury, there was enough graphics, clutter and other junk on the screen to totally obscure Hamel's ankle. Did anybody else see this? Or I should say: not see this?

metirish Apr 28 2009 08:25 PM

My Bad , i took Carlin's word on this . I was in the computer room listening to the telly.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Apr 29 2009 07:57 AM

Snooze today says The Schneid isn't progressing as well as they'd like and so a weekend DL return is now unlikely.

Fman99 Apr 29 2009 08:04 AM

Delgado taking today off also and getting Thursday as a team off day, tentatively scheduled to return to the lineup Friday. I would be nonplussed if Castillo gets the same treatment.

Benjamin Grimm Apr 29 2009 08:12 AM

[quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket"]Snooze today says The Schneid isn't progressing as well as they'd like and so a weekend DL return is now unlikely.

I wonder if this is a stalling tactic, to give them more time to come up with a way to retain Santos.

I find that I hope it is.

metirish May 06 2009 08:20 PM

Ollie to the DL....something about a right knee

Benjamin Grimm May 06 2009 08:25 PM

And Niese is going to get Friday's start instead of Takahashi.

Fman99 May 07 2009 06:53 AM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm":2af2qdbz]And Niese is going to get Friday's start instead of Takahashi.[/quote:2af2qdbz] Niese, 0-2, 6.55 ERA in Buffalo, and this is our first guy up to make a pinch start. Jeez. I wonder if Mrs. Figueroa is pitching a fit online.

soupcan May 07 2009 07:02 AM

[quote="metirish":28e2541s]Ollie to the DL....something about a right knee[/quote:28e2541s] Patella tendonitis. *cough*bullshit*cough*

Benjamin Grimm May 07 2009 07:04 AM

Seems fishy to me, too. Maybe this will let them give him a rehab assignment to Buffalo and the Mets can conveniently forget to recall him.

John Cougar Lunchbucket May 07 2009 07:42 AM

I don't know why everyone thinks the only possible explanation for how shitty Perez has been is "a ten-cent head." Patellar tendonitis, if that's what he's got, certainly would fuck up one's ability to pitch comfortably and it is cured with rest. That's probably an aftereffect of comingin out of shape as Warthen declared, but anyway. We should all be thankful it's not his elbow.

Edgy DC May 07 2009 07:44 AM

Hey, we all need to feel superior to somebody, and Victor Zambrano isn't available.

MFS62 May 07 2009 07:49 AM

[quote="soupcan":v5rwpeoh][quote="metirish":v5rwpeoh]Ollie to the DL....something about a right knee[/quote:v5rwpeoh] Patella tendonitis. *cough*bullshit*cough*[/quote:v5rwpeoh] It's a small tear in the nonexistus ligimantus. Later

metirish May 07 2009 07:54 AM

Perez gets cut zero slack at all , when the news broke last night on SNY the studio guys made some jokes about it being his head or something. When I heard it one thought I had was that it was a convenient injury. For whatever reason Perez is an easy target.

Edgy DC May 07 2009 08:03 AM

I think the reasons are clear.

soupcan May 07 2009 08:15 AM

If his knee has been hurting him all this time why did we first just hear about it on Sunday afternoon? How come it wasn't mentioned after any of his other meltdowns? None of the quotes I've read says anything about Ollie being remiss in not saying anything earlier. A bad knee doesn't seem like something you'd want a guy guaranteed $36mm to keep pitching through.

John Cougar Lunchbucket May 07 2009 08:16 AM

Like they wouldn't have called him an out-of-shape pussy had he immediately come up lame.

Fman99 May 07 2009 11:25 AM

[quote="soupcan":13168rj8]If his knee has been hurting him all this time why did we first just hear about it on Sunday afternoon? How come it wasn't mentioned after any of his other meltdowns? None of the quotes I've read says anything about Ollie being remiss in not saying anything earlier. A bad knee doesn't seem like something you'd want a guy guaranteed $36mm to keep pitching through.[/quote:13168rj8] I like it - they put him on the Disgraceful List until he "feels better."

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr May 07 2009 11:55 AM

[quote="soupcan":3kqmjtsw]If his knee has been hurting him all this time why did we first just hear about it on Sunday afternoon? How come it wasn't mentioned after any of his other meltdowns? None of the quotes I've read says anything about Ollie being remiss in not saying anything earlier. A bad knee doesn't seem like something you'd want a guy guaranteed $36mm to keep pitching through.[/quote:3kqmjtsw] I'm thinking it took a few days of rehearsal before Ollie could remember which knee was supposed to be tendonit-y.

Chad Ochoseis May 11 2009 04:04 PM

Star-Ledger saying that Delgado and his hip are back to day-to-day status.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr May 16 2009 06:15 AM

From Adam Rubin's blog (and echoed elsewhere): Carlos Delgado's balky right hip will send him to the disabled list Saturday, multiple sources told the Daily News after the Mets rallied to beat the Giants, 8-6, Friday night. The call-up will not be top prospect Fernando Martinez, a team insider added. Surgery-- either the season-ending kind or the A-Rod kind-- is still on the table as an option. (From the Pollyanna department: Delgado has shown the ability so far to Utley it through the pain of the impingement, at least for stretches. Is rest now and a timeshare later the best solution?) Less disturbing/more promising... ... the Daily News has learned that Billy Wagner is already hitting 90 mph on a mound in Port St. Lucie. He returned to the Mets' complex in recent days after a one-month moratorium on throwing off a mound. An August return now seems entirely realistic. Food for thought, anyway; let the alpacas' disappointment be our fantasy fodder.

Ashie62 May 16 2009 09:07 AM

Lets all hope Carlos hasn't become Bo Jackson and played his last game. Evalution for HOF status may come all too soon Delgado & Perez 52 million potentionally down the drain. After Madoff and these signings I doubt Fred & Jeff are giving any investment advice out at Cocktail parties

OlerudOwned May 16 2009 09:23 AM

Rodriguez, Putz, Parnell, and Wagner is a lot of heat at the back of bullpen.

Edgy DC May 16 2009 10:07 AM

The fate of the Oliver Perez contract is sealed after less than six weeks? I really dislike this thing of disparaging owners for not throwing their money around, and then mocking them when they do, but some of their investments (inevitably) go sour. It's awful.

OlerudOwned May 16 2009 10:16 AM

[quote="Edgy DC":2m003qtb]The fate of the Oliver Perez contract is sealed after less than six weeks? I really dislike this thing of disparaging owners for not throwing their money around, and then mocking them when they do, but some of their investments (inevitably) go sour. It's Ashie.[/quote:2m003qtb]

Edgy DC May 16 2009 10:30 AM

Thing is that you can read that catch-22 stuff at any sports site out there.

Fman99 May 16 2009 11:05 AM

Delgado to DL, Pagan up from AAA as per Rotoworld.

Edgy DC May 16 2009 12:18 PM

Bracing for the next round of recriminations if/when Pagan has to be forced back down through waivers. Meantime, welcome back to the place you belong, Angel Pagan.

Ashie62 May 16 2009 01:54 PM

[quote="OlerudOwned":g8nrkaed]Rodriguez, Putz, Parnell, and Wagner is a lot of heat at the back of bullpen.[/quote:g8nrkaed] Rodriguez and Parnell are alot of heat at the back of the bullpen

Rockin' Doc May 16 2009 02:37 PM

I hope Wagner can make it back by August to help the pen. It would be great to gain a quality, rested arm late in the season. I could live with Wagner being the eighth inning guy leading up to Rodriguez or he could help spell Feliciano with the LOOGY workload.

Edgy DC May 16 2009 08:41 PM Edited 2 time(s), most recently on May 23 2009 09:21 PM

I'm hoping that, by August, the very notion of an "eighth-inning guy" seems to Jerry Manuel like a dimly remembered foolish jaunt of an embarassing youth --- something he talks about only among intimates and still with some sense of unease. Like that time I tried to jump onto a waterslide in the middle, climbing over the wall and trying to jump into somebody else's raft. To impress my younger cousin. Almost got kicked out of Wetland, or whatever it was called. I hope that, by August, when somebody says, "Hey, Jerry, remember when you were trying to establish an 'eighth-inning guy'?" he says, "Yeah, well, that was then, and I guess we've all come a long..." And when they interrupt him there, saying, "Yeah, you were all about, 'after the sixth, the bullpen is going into lockdown mode; you were all..." he interrupts right back and says "Can we... can we just change the subject? Can we? Thank you. God!"

Centerfield May 16 2009 08:54 PM

Adam Rubin says Delgado will see a hip specialist Sunday to determine whether surgery will be necessary. No report I've read so far indicates how long he would be out if such surgery is necessary. I don't usually join the "our doctors suck" bandwagon, but this seems pretty dumb on a bunch of levels. 1. If this is going to be at least 15 days (and could lead to surgery) how is there any question whether or not he should go on the DL. Especially in May. They played shorthanded all week long for nothing. 2. Why wait until you fly out to San Francisco to determine that he should see the hip specialist in New York. No one thought of this at any point last week during the homestand? If surgery is necessary, that's an unnecessary week that's been lost. 3. How was this missed the first time his hip acted up?

Edgy DC May 16 2009 09:07 PM

Did Delgado fly out to San Francisco?

Benjamin Grimm May 17 2009 04:33 AM

During the FOX telecast, Jerry said that Delgado could be out "for a very long time."

Edgy DC May 17 2009 05:49 AM

My plan is sticking with the Murphy/Tatis platoon, but moving it to first, and Pagan and Sheffield can shake things out in the void they leave behind. The bashfulness about Murphy at first ends NOW!!!!

Benjamin Grimm May 17 2009 06:16 AM

My guess is that we'll be seeing more of Reed at first, but I prefer Edgy's idea. Let Murphy and Tatis play first, and Reed can join Pagan and Sheffield in the left field mix.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr May 17 2009 11:11 AM

[quote="Edgy DC":1tarilsj]My plan is sticking with the Murphy/Tatis platoon, but moving it to first, and Pagan and Sheffield can shake things out in the void they leave behind. The bashfulness about Murphy at first ends NOW!!!![/quote:1tarilsj] I SOMEWHAT AGREE! GAH! (Bangs fist on chair, sweeps papers off coffee table) Minus Delgado, and plus a semi-productive Sheff (12/33, 12 runs, 4 XBH, 3 RBI, 8 BB/3 K in May), this team has an interesting, flexible look-- play Murph/Reed/Tatis/Pagan at 1B/corner OF as matchups/defensive needs dictate. (Interesting and flexble, though, doesn't necessarily mean better.) It's also a team that requires more active management, which may or may not be a good thing, considering the man at the tiller.

MFS62 May 17 2009 01:00 PM

[quote="Edgy DC":1i33jdpq]Did Delgado fly out to San Francisco?[/quote:1i33jdpq] Yes he did,. And I still haven't read an explanation of why the team felt two cross-country plane rides would help the situation, since the hip doctor he'd be seeing (if needed) is back here. Even before they left, Manuel had said it didn't look like the injury would cure itself (my paraphrase) It seemed to me like Ryan Chruch Part Deux. Later

metirish May 17 2009 01:08 PM

I think they had the seat payed for so he went.

Benjamin Grimm May 17 2009 01:40 PM

I don't think a plane flight is as likely to aggravate a hip tear as it is a concussion, but they do seem to have inconvenienced Delgado unnecessarily. The Ryan Church thing last year was insane. This is just kind of dumb.

Edgy DC May 17 2009 02:01 PM

Stop with the perspective. It's going to give Mets fan a good name.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr May 23 2009 08:48 PM

A touch of poop in the shoe after a great win: as per Jerry Manuel on postgame, Frankie Rodriguez was out tonight with back spasms so bad "he couldn't walk."

metirish May 23 2009 08:49 PM

Not good.....

OlerudOwned May 23 2009 09:06 PM

# K-Rod is now sidelined indefinitely by back spasms.about 1 hour ago from Tweetie # K-Rod just collapsed from the spasms outside the clubhouse and is requiring medical attention.30 minutes ago from Tweetie # A stretcher has just been called for K-Rod outside the clubhouse.29 minutes ago from Tweetie # K-Rod is now crying from the spasms as the EMTs arrive.27 minutes ago from Tweetie # Team officials have now shielded K-Rod from reporters, so no more live updates, unfortunately.25 minutes ago from Tweetie # Here is more on the K-Rod medical situation: http://bit.ly/Gi5Tr9 minutes ago from bit.ly (http://twitter.com/NYPost_Mets) Yeesh.

Edgy DC May 23 2009 09:26 PM

No good news coming out about this.

John Cougar Lunchbucket May 23 2009 09:43 PM

He'll be fine.

Edgy DC May 23 2009 09:53 PM

I think so. I'd just like to be told so by a source on the scene before I go to bedly.

OlerudOwned May 23 2009 09:56 PM

The Twitter account I posted read like an SNL skit. #K-Rod has just lost control of his bowels #A pack of wolves has descended upon K-Rod. Watch how the pack makes sure to get meat to the sick and the young first.

Edgy DC May 23 2009 10:02 PM

I figured it was all bullshit. So, he's at Beth Israel, right? They're nice.

metirish May 24 2009 08:25 AM

K-Rod hospitalized with severe back spasms 1:13 AM EDT, May 24, 2009 BOSTON - Francisco Rodriguez was taken by ambulance to a local hospital after last night's game after suffering from back spasms so severe that he collapsed leaving the clubhouse. The Mets' $37-million closer was sent to the hospital for observation and more tests, but there was no further update on his condition after he departed Fenway Park. Immediately after the Mets' 3-2 win over the Red Sox, Rodriguez was in agony as he tried to dress at his locker. He remained hunched over and could barely slip on his shoes. K-Rod took questions from reporters seated at his chair and could barely look up. "Right now, it's very painful," he said. "I can't stand up." K-Rod, who said he has no history of back problems, felt it tighten up as he ran on the field during batting practice. Although he received treatment on his back, the problem got progressively worse as the night went on. "It's been a tough day," he said. As his teammates dressed, Rodriguez was escorted out through a side door by clubhouse personnel, then collapsed while still inside the stadium. A stretcher was quickly summoned, but Rodriguez was placed in a golf cart before the gates closed behind him and he was out of view. "He was in bad shape," manager Jerry Manuel said. "As for how long spasms last, his history with that, I really don't know. We'll see where he is tomorrow." WOW

Edgy DC May 24 2009 08:41 AM

Same report as last night. What is the press corps up to?

Ashie62 May 24 2009 08:48 AM

It almost reads like a prank

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr May 24 2009 11:57 PM

Jesus. Really? From Adam Rubin's blog: The Mets' shortstops continue to fall. Jose Reyes did not try to run Sunday as Jerry Manuel expected, and the shortstop told the Daily News there's "no chance" he'll play Monday. Meanwhile, Manuel removed Ramon Martinez in the eighth inning with back discomfort, which nearly prevented him from starting. Manuel said he had two lineups on his desk pregame, the other with Fernando Tatis. Martinez said he'd try to start Monday at Citi Field.

Methead May 25 2009 05:02 AM

Mets : Shortstops :: Spinal Tap : Drummers

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr May 26 2009 10:18 AM

Now Beltran? You've gotta be f*cking kidding me-- at this point, I'm just waiting for the "Wright day-to-day with right-hand-dangling-from-a-tendon" announcement. Thank God Johan isn't born of man. http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd ... p&c_id=mlb

Edgy DC May 29 2009 08:06 AM

"I can't guarantee that. But it looks that that's going to be the case. The most important thing is to get better, get healthy, that you can perform effectively, and that's our goal. "I think that's going to happen sometime this year, but I can't guarantee nothing." You don't want to read to much into that (unless you're the News and you need a headline, but that's Carlos Delgado with the double negative there.

Benjamin Grimm May 29 2009 08:14 AM

He says he expects to be back, but he can't be sure. Delgado is just expressing the doubts that anyone would feel who's had surgery and has been on crutches for two weeks.

MFS62 May 29 2009 08:22 AM

Speaking of injuries (and other stuff) Omar Minaya was on WFAN this morning, and said he hopes to see Carlos Beltran back in the lineup either tonight or this weekend. To listen to the full interview, go to WFAN.com. Minaya also said Jose Reyes will remain with the team this weekend, he will then go to Florida to play in a few minor-league rehab games. Late next week, Minaya hopes to get Reyes and Alex Cora back, ‘which will help stabilize things a bit.’ The team will continue to be ‘conservative with Reyes, Minaya explained, because the team will need him if it plans to win a Championship. Lastly, he said, ‘Billy Wagner is coming along good,’ and Minaya believes there is a good chance Wagner pitches for the Mets in September, meaning the team could have Wagner, J.J. Putz, Bobby Parnell and Francisco Rodriguez in the bullpen during the stretch run. To listen to the full 25–minute interview, during which Minaya also talks about how he acquired Gary Sheffield, Oliver Perez’s rehab, and the development and hustle of Fernando Martinez, go to WFAN.com. http://www.wfan.com/ -- (by way of Metsblog) Later

The Second Spitter May 29 2009 08:30 AM

[quote="MFS62"]. Lastly, he said, ‘Billy Wagner is coming along good,’ and Minaya believes there is a good chance Wagner pitches for the Mets in September,

*THUD*

That noise you just heard was Bucket falling off his chair.

Edgy DC May 29 2009 10:07 AM

David Lennon indulges in wild speculation. As for Reyes, he still has no idea how or why his knee tendinitis popped up, and it was interesting to note that the shoe reps from Under Armour showed up on Wednesday to take a closer look at his customized foot measurements. This is Reyes' first year with Under Armour -- after leaving Nike -- and given his long history of leg problems, it makes you wonder if there's any connection. I'm not saying it's UA's fault. It's just that Reyes hasn't been on the DL since 2004 and I don't know what other changes he's made to his routine other than a new shoe contract.

Centerfield May 29 2009 10:17 AM

In March, I got a purple tie as one of my birthday presents. I've never worn a purple tie, or anything else purple, prior to this year. It's just not one of my preferred colors. But this tie is really nice, and so I worked it into my rotation. I even bought a light purplish shirt to wear it with. I'm not sure that there's any connection, but I start wearing a purple tie, and all of a sudden Delgado's hip needs surgery. Obviously I can't conclude anything for sure, but it certainly does make you wonder.

HahnSolo May 29 2009 10:34 AM

a few things: I heard the sound byte of Delgado on the radio this morning. Right before the "I can't guarantee that." ; he said: "I'm pretty sure I will be back this year." Again, the News can't make a headline out of that. Wagner coming back: Billy doesn't strike me as the kind of guy who will happily accept a 7th or 8th inning set - up role. Lennon's piece: Come on David, you can do better. He has a "long history of leg problems", but "hasn't been on the DL since 2004"? Which is it?

Benjamin Grimm May 29 2009 10:37 AM

[quote="HahnSolo":zclazjns] Wagner coming back: Billy doesn't strike me as the kind of guy who will happily accept a 7th or 8th inning set - up role. [/quote:zclazjns] For a month or two? I think even Billy Wagner will be okay with it, especially since it gives him a chance to prove his health and show off his skills prior to reentering the free agent market.

Edgy DC May 29 2009 10:45 AM

Do you really think he's so deluded as to expect Francisco Rodriguez to step aside? He's playing for his last contract and he needs to get back on the mound in any role.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr May 29 2009 01:22 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 29 2009 01:29 PM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm"][quote="HahnSolo"] Wagner coming back: Billy doesn't strike me as the kind of guy who will happily accept a 7th or 8th inning set - up role.

For a month or two? I think even Billy Wagner will be okay with it, especially since it gives him a chance to prove his health and show off his skills prior to reentering the free agent market.

So... should this happen, does that mean Putzie will start walking two guys to start off each 7th, owing to the even-lower adrenaline levels?

Chad Ochoseis May 29 2009 01:27 PM

Didn't Wagner make some sort of putz-like comment about not being able to get motivated for four-out saves? It can't hurt to give him a shot once he's healthy, but my expectations for Wagner are low.

The Second Spitter May 30 2009 12:04 AM

It woudl make more sense to use Wagner as a LOOGY - at least initially. Then they can see if he fits into another role.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 02 2009 03:07 PM

Yeah, so I've been trying to mentally pooh-pooh this take on CB's leg "knee bruise" ever since reading it (in the generally unimpeachable BP injury specialist's column, but Carlos Uno's continued absence has made it a bit tougher to ignore. [quote="Will Carroll ("Under the Knife")":28drb8s0]A greater matter of concern is Beltran's situation. He played through a knee injury that has been diagnosed as a bruise to his tibial plateau. That's the 'top' of the bone, where most would say it's the knee, and where the load from the body is born. Yes, that means that the cushioning inside failed for some reason, and that the bruise was probably caused by the femur slamming into it enough to cause damage. That's very bad in the long term, especially if Beltran's meniscus has a deficit. (I couldn't find if he's had a previous meniscectomy, though I'm sure you'll chirp in comments.) If there's no cushioning, this will continue to be a problem, with grinding as well as the occasional traumatic injury such as a bruise or worse, a fracture. I think that we have to take a year or two off the back end of Beltran's career unless he finds something like Synvisc or microfracture to reduce some of the damage. For now, he'll miss a couple of games after a cortisone injection, but the team thinks he'll be able to avoid the DL.[/quote:28drb8s0]

MFS62 Jun 03 2009 08:57 AM

And sometimes "knee" injuries can hide a multitude of things. I remember being at the ballpark (daytime game Ebbetts Field) when Roy Campanella was catching for Brooklyn. A foul ball hit off the plate and caught him square in the, er, balls. He went down like he had been shot. The radio guy couldn't say that, so he said "Looks like Campy got hit in the ..... (thoughtful delay) knee. It hit him in the knee." Later

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 03 2009 09:36 AM

[quote="MFS62":3ajyju60]And sometimes "knee" injuries can hide a multitude of things. I remember being at the ballpark (daytime game Ebbetts Field) when Roy Campanella was catching for Brooklyn. A foul ball hit off the plate and caught him square in the, er, balls. He went down like he had been shot. The radio guy couldn't say that, so he said "Looks like Campy got hit in the ..... (thoughtful delay) knee. It hit him in the knee." Later[/quote:3ajyju60] Would that we could trade the tendinitis of Messrs. Perez, Putz and Reyes for cockpunches. In all seriousness? If the meniscus-deficit theory is at all correct, this shortens Beltran's career by at least a year, and maybe shunts him to a corner spot within a couple of years.

Benjamin Grimm Jun 03 2009 09:39 AM

If he keeps his bat speed, he can prolong his career by DHing or First Basing. (I prefer the latter, because I'd like to see him stay with the Mets beyond his current contract.)

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 03 2009 09:43 AM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm":1esxjvo1]If he keeps his bat speed, he can prolong his career by DHing or First Basing. (I prefer the latter, because I'd like to see him stay with the Mets beyond his current contract.)[/quote:1esxjvo1] Yeah, even granting the premise of a close-to-worst-case-scenario, there's options and possibilities. That said, I find myself almost too sad for words about the prospect of Carlos Uno doing anything BUT playing center, and playing it well.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 03 2009 09:55 AM

Not for nothing but, I view "UTK" about as skeptically as anything I read. It's not just that the guy isn't a doctor, or that the column is fundamentally flawed by tending to drill a "big picture" perspective down to a very specific case he rarely has particular knowledge of, but he's also reported wildly inaccurate stuff previously and comes off very douche-y, IMO.

Edgy DC Jun 03 2009 10:04 AM

I infer from Lunchbucket's comment paranoia, and I'm not ruling out psychosis. And that could spell trouble for the forum long-term as his psyche breaks down as he's reduced to punk posting or possibly random seven-paragraph flames. I don't know if he's had delusional episosdes in the past (though I'm sure you'll chirp in comments) but this could accelerate Bucket's decline by a year or two, if it hasn't already.

Edgy DC Jun 08 2009 08:49 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jun 08 2009 09:12 PM

I'm on the DL four to six weeks after fracturing my fist Friday night with an ill-advised punching of a pane of plexiglass in a fit of distress (not a scratch on the plexiglass. It hurt like hell when I tried to clap at Saturday's game). Thanks to the Mets, that wasn't much of an issue. I know my foolishness has let my team down, as I might be needed if, say, 3 million other men ahead of me on the depth chart were to get hurt. They would have to go with Seawolf.

Fman99 Jun 08 2009 08:59 PM

[quote="Edgy DC":36aw27wt]I'm on the DL four to six weeks after fracturing my fist Friday night with an ill-advised punching of a pane of plexiglass in a fit of distress (not a scratch on the plexiglass. It hurt like hell when I tried to clap at Saturday's game. Thanks to the Mets, that wasn't much of an issue. I know my foolishness has let my team down, as I might be needed if, say, 3 million other men ahead of me on the depth chart were to get hurt. They would have to go with Seawolf.[/quote:36aw27wt] You punched a solid object? Jeez. Now, being a Jew, I would more likely just write a check and hire a white person to punch a wall for me. But that's how I roll. Was this Mets-related angst or are you just a crazy person?

Edgy DC Jun 08 2009 09:14 PM

Temporary insanity.

themetfairy Jun 08 2009 09:18 PM

Did you really break your wrist?

Edgy DC Jun 08 2009 09:20 PM

Fist. Knuckle of the index finger to be more precise. Got a royal blue cast on my left hand.

themetfairy Jun 08 2009 09:30 PM

Ouch! Feel better!

metsguyinmichigan Jun 08 2009 09:32 PM

Ouch! Typing with one hand. Get better, Edgy. And next time you feel the urge to punch something, I have a list of people you can work your way down....

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 08 2009 09:33 PM

[quote="Edgy DC":22rd1khs]Temporary insanity.[/quote:22rd1khs] We really need more than this.

Edgy DC Jun 09 2009 05:50 AM

Angry in general and unable to find a more productive outlet, I punched the sunroof of the Tercel while stuck in traffic, 'kay?

bmfc1 Jun 11 2009 02:06 PM

Tweet from the NY Post: John Maine will make his next start but says his shoulder is "acting up" and probably will need to be looked at medically.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 11 2009 02:38 PM

Um, that sucks.

themetfairy Jun 11 2009 02:44 PM

It's only a flesh wound....

smg58 Jun 12 2009 05:47 AM

Does anybody know if something is wrong with Brian Stokes? Does anybody else think it's odd that we had three close games with Philly, two of which went extra innings, and we never saw him?

Hawkeye57 Jun 12 2009 06:40 AM

Well, the Phillies are predominantly a lefty lineup, I'm not sure Manuel trusts Stokes, a rightie, against the lefties right now. I think the Top 5 of the Phillies order are lefties, plus included in there are Howard and Ibanez. Stokes is much better against righties than he is lefties.

Frayed Knot Jun 12 2009 07:00 AM

He was seen warming up at least once.

metirish Jun 12 2009 07:05 AM

Weeks can go by and I don't think about Stokes.

Fman99 Jun 12 2009 07:23 AM

[quote="Hawkeye57":2w5kn8h9]Well, the Phillies are predominantly a lefty lineup, I'm not sure Manuel trusts Stokes, a rightie, against the lefties right now. I think the Top 5 of the Phillies order are lefties, plus included in there are Howard and Ibanez. Stokes is much better against righties than he is lefties.[/quote:2w5kn8h9] Coming into last night's game, lefties were hitting .440 against Takahashi. Could Stokes really have been any worse? I think Stokes is being tragically underused this year. Boo Jerry.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 12 2009 07:29 AM

[quote="bmfc1":3mm1j870]Tweet from the NY Post: John Maine will make his next start but says his shoulder is "acting up" and probably will need to be looked at medically.[/quote:3mm1j870] So... actual medical scienticians, or dudes wearing "Trust me" t-shirts? Near as I can tell, the diagnosis is "let's rest him a bit more." [quote="Frayed Knot":3mm1j870]He was seen warming up at least once.[/quote:3mm1j870] That might have been an optical illusion you saw, there. Adam Rubin tweet affirms that Brian Stokes has been following the Britney tour in London this week. As I understand it, he's currently headed back to the States for a wedding in North Carolina this weekend. (Congrats, Jenny and Alvis!)

Rockin' Doc Jun 12 2009 04:31 PM

I wondered why Stokes hasn't made an in game appearance since 6/5 against the Nationals. I think the lefty laden line up of the Phillies kept Stokes out of action. Right handed batters are hitting a mere .189 while lefties are hitting a robust .344 against Stokes. Still, I think I trust Stokes more than I do Takahashi to get Utley, Howard, and Ibanaez. Of course, Jerry will most often play it by the book and go with Takahashi (since he had already used Feliciano).

Edgy DC Jun 12 2009 04:40 PM

Jerry totally didn't wanto to use Tak there. There were just no good options available. One I hadn't consided... walking Ibañez, moving the go-ahead to third and letting Stokes go after Werth.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 13 2009 10:21 PM

Wait... what? (Irish: care to set the odds that Franco is full of crap?) http://www.metsblog.com/2009/06/12/note ... ng-90-mph/

Centerfield Jun 15 2009 08:43 AM

Talk all weekend long was that Sheffield would have an MRI soon. They would do it today rather than wait until they get to Baltimore, then fly him back right? Right?

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 15 2009 09:06 AM

Warthen says Johan had a blister.

Swan Swan H Jun 15 2009 09:08 AM

Paging Gus Mauch and his jar of pickle brine.

metirish Jun 15 2009 09:24 AM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"]Wait... what? (Irish: care to set the odds that Franco is full of crap?) http://www.metsblog.com/2009/06/12/note ... ng-90-mph/

Latest odds on weather John Franco is full of crap.

1/2

the book is closed on this , sorry

that btw is Franco's Irish cousin.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 15 2009 10:20 AM

[quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":2cnkm3ym]Warthen says Johan had a blister.[/quote:2cnkm3ym] The blister was two weeks/3-4 starts ago. I caught Warthen saying somewhere in the postgame salad toss that he thought its healing might have affected the way Johan was tossing the ball. Sounded more like conjecture than observation to my ears, though.

Centerfield Jun 16 2009 12:03 PM

According to several reports, Sheffield did not have the MRI. Stupid Mets.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 16 2009 12:07 PM

Apparently Sheff is the one who said he needed an MRI, the Mets docs and the MFY doc said he didn't. Sheff may have been talking out of his ass. In other news, it's sad to have to tell Lunchpail every day that "'Jose Jose' isn't playing today because his leg hurts." "Is it better yet?" No.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 16 2009 01:00 PM

[quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":2adeanuy]Apparently Sheff is the one who said he needed an MRI, the Mets docs and the MFY doc said he didn't. Sheff may have been talking out of his ass. [/quote:2adeanuy] This in no way squares with the contemplative, circumspect, non-ass-talking Gary Sheffield that I know, and I wish you would stop telling lies. [quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":2adeanuy] In other news, it's sad to have to tell Lunchpail every day that "'Jose Jose' isn't playing today because his leg hurts." "Is it better yet?" No.[/quote:2adeanuy] That's just about as sad as a legless puppy.

Ashie62 Jun 16 2009 08:01 PM

Any Met able to play may talk out of any orifice they desire.. Jo-se Jo-se Jo-se To the moon Jose

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 17 2009 11:03 AM

Snooze sez Maine and Ollie will oppose one another in an extended ST game tomorrow. Word is "positive" for both guys recoveries.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 18 2009 10:35 AM

Looks like Phils fans will be able to empathize a bit more with our plight... at least for a couple of weeks. (Here's the thing, though... how do you tell the difference between "hobbled" Raul Ibanez running in the OF and regular Raul Ibanez running in the outfield?) PHILADELPHIA -- The Phillies placed outfielder Raul Ibanez on the 15-day disabled list on Thursday morning with a strained left groin and recalled outfielder John Mayberry Jr. from Triple-A Lehigh Valley to take his place. Ibanez was hitting .312 and was second in the National League with 22 homers and 59 RBIs. "He was not pleased with it," general manager Ruben Amaro Jr. said. "[But] we have to kind of see the forest for the trees here. He stood a chance to really damage the groin if he continues to play on it, and if he does that, he could be out for a very, very long period of time, and it just doesn't make any sense for us to do that with him." Amaro did not set a timetable for Ibanez's return. The 37-year-old is scheduled for an MRI exam on Thursday afternoon. Ibanez's groin had been bothering him periodically since April, Amaro said, but it only became debilitating recently. He was 0-for-8 with five strikeouts in two games against the Blue Jays, and had just six hits in his past 31 at-bats (.194). He had noticeable difficulty running in the outfield and on the basepaths during Wednesday's 7-1 loss to Toronto. "Oh, it's affected his play," Amaro said. "When he got back on the field yesterday and played, it got to the point where the discomfort was enough for us to shut him down."

Ashie62 Jun 18 2009 04:57 PM

[quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":3lg81g6g]Snooze sez Maine and Ollie will oppose one another in an extended ST game tomorrow. Word is "positive" for both guys recoveries.[/quote:3lg81g6g] Remember the Maine for at least 2 weeks

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 21 2009 06:50 PM

Yeah, it would be good if young Sugar Pants started hitting again-- Beltran doesn't sound quite as grin-and-bear-it as yesterday: Beltran, who said on Saturday that he could play through the pain as long as it wouldn't aggravate the injury, had a different opinion following Sunday's 10-6 loss to the Rays. "I don't feel I can play a lot of games the way it felt today," Beltran said. "I'm a little bit worried, to be honest, because the way it was today, it was painful." http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/news/articl ... p&c_id=nym

Gwreck Jun 22 2009 10:31 PM

Ok, so, they weren't hurt, but jeez... From Adam Rubin's Blog: Talk about snakebit. Word is that Jose Reyes and trainer Ray Ramirez were rear-ended on the RFK-Triboro Bridge by a fire truck this afternoon while stopped. Neither was hurt.

Edgy DC Jun 25 2009 08:15 AM

[quote="Rubin"]Gary Sheffield finally did get that elusive MRI. It came Tuesday and revealed swelling in the right knee joint. Because the cortisone shot needs 48 hours to kick in, Manuel expects Sheffield will be out until Friday against the Yankees, when he should start against CC Sabathia. Also on the injury front, SI.com reported that Carlos Beltran may seek a second opinion on what has been diagnosed as a bone bruise of his right knee. A team official said the organization’s trainers have yet to be informed, if that’s the case. Regardless, Beltran getting activated after spending only 15 days on the DL seems unlikely. http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/mets/2 ... JS2VoBPF&D

Is Heyman actually out-scooping you, Adam?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 25 2009 03:27 PM

Yes, it's speculation, and nothing more. But it's an interesting thought/conversation point, at least, no? http://metsmerizedonline.com/2009/06/no ... -mets.html

Benjamin Grimm Jun 25 2009 03:34 PM

Now the Mets pretty much just flushed $35 million down the train. $35 million that they could of given to a more capable player (Raul Ibanez). Down the train? It's too early to write off the full value of Oliver Perez' contract. I'm not confident that he'll prove to be worth the money, but he's only missed a couple of months. If he gives two and a half solid seasons from this point on, the money isn't at all down the train.

Gwreck Jun 25 2009 04:29 PM

Yabbbut, isn't Ibanez hurt too? Any reason to think that if the Mets signed him instead of Perez that Ibanez wouldn't be hurt now? Nope.

Edgy DC Jun 25 2009 05:35 PM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm"] Now the Mets pretty much just flushed $35 million down the train. $35 million that they could of given to a more capable player (Raul Ibanez). Down the train? It's too early to write off the full value of Oliver Perez' contract. I'm not confident that he'll prove to be worth the money, but he's only missed a couple of months. If he gives two and a half solid seasons from this point on, the money isn't at all down the train.

Maddening, isn't it? I'd end up spending two days arguing with him about that one statement.

Edgy DC Jun 25 2009 05:41 PM

I think Luis Castillo, Alex Cora, John Maine, Ramon Martinez, Angel Pagan, and Gary Sheffield all got hurt this season because they didn't play in the World Baseball Classic. in fact, I'm pretty sure, Billy Wagner would be done with his rehab right now if he played in the World Baseball Classic.

Edgy DC Jun 26 2009 08:29 AM

minorleaguebaseball.com doesn't have a hsot of John Maine in his current team's uniform. NOt as fast on the photoshop as the bigleague guys, they show him in his old Tides hat.

Nymr83 Jun 26 2009 03:51 PM

Mets SP John Maine felt pain in his shoulder during a session of catch Thursday and received a cortisone shot. Danny Knobler of CBSSports.com reports that he will out until at least the All-Star break.

Edgy DC Jun 26 2009 05:07 PM

Wow. Small upside is that it challenges the columnists to find a more creative way to mock Oliver Perez than crap about the Mets tossnig $39 million into the pen.

Ashie62 Jun 26 2009 07:50 PM

We need Ollie...Maine is no in no mans land..The season from hell

Edgy DC Jun 27 2009 12:01 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jun 27 2009 12:07 PM

Carlos Delgado takes a baby step back. He entered the batting cage. He entered it... and stood there. He wanted to just track some balls to keep his timing sharp, but he wasn't allowed to swing yet.

Benjamin Grimm Jun 27 2009 12:03 PM

At least he's ready to be intentionally walked.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 07 2009 08:10 AM

An intriguing article by the Times' aptly-named baseball writer Michael Schmidt: Nearly a quarter of the Mets’ roster from opening day — a collection of players making more than $50 million this season — is out because of injuries. In their place, the Mets have resorted to a ragtag group that includes several minor leaguers. The problem is representative of a larger trend in Major League Baseball that has left people in the sport grasping for an explanation: the amount of time players were out with injuries increased 26 percent from 2006 to 2008. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/07/sport ... wanted=all

Benjamin Grimm Jul 07 2009 08:14 AM

Could the reason have something to do with tighter PED testing?

Edgy DC Jul 07 2009 08:19 AM

Well, you look at the things that have changed, and that's one of them. You can look at what they might be turning to --- be it a more tradtional regimen of bodybuilding and nutrition or a later, but more disabling, generation of PEDs.

seawolf17 Jul 07 2009 08:29 AM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm":1d4y6bbq]Could the reason have something to do with tighter PED testing?[/quote:1d4y6bbq] I think that makes a lot of sense. Gary was talking about amphetamines the other night... I think there's a lot to it. These sons of pitching coaches have been mollycoddled their whole lives, and now that they can't get their meds, they break down. Eff 'em.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 07 2009 09:24 AM

Also, it seems like a record-breaking year for this-guy-needs-mechanical-adjustment/this-guy-sucks DLing (a la Wang). Has it been this way all along (and merely gone uncovered)?

Nymr83 Jul 07 2009 01:59 PM

from Yahoo Sports, just a quick glance at where the injured guys are Medical Watch: RHP John Maine(notes) (right shoulder fatigue) went on the 15-day disabled list retroactive to June 7. He made a rehab appearance with Class A St. Lucie on June 22. He was scratched from a June 27 start with Class A Brooklyn. CF Carlos Beltran (bone bruise in right knee) went on the 15-day disabled list June 22. He is not expected back before the All-Star break, but he won’t need surgery. LHP Oliver Perez (right knee inflammation) went on the 15-day disabled list retroactive to May 3. He pitched in extended spring training games May 16 and May 21. He began a rehab assignment with Class AAA Buffalo on May 26, but he was scratched from a May 31 start because of continued knee trouble. He began a new minor league rehab assignment June 22, and he is expected to be activated for a start July 8. RHP J.J. Putz(notes) (bone spur in right elbow) went on the 60-day disabled list June 5. He had surgery June 9, and he is expected to miss 10 to 12 weeks. OF Angel Pagan(notes) (strained right groin) went on the 15-day disabled list June 1. He might begin a rehab assignment in early July. INF Ramon Martinez(notes) (fractured left pinkie) went on the 15-day disabled list June 3, and he was transferred to the 60-day DL on June 19. He had surgery June 4. SS Jose Reyes (right calf tendinitis) went on the 15-day disabled list retroactive to May 21. He left an extended spring training game June 3 and was diagnosed with a small hamstring tear. He could return in July. 1B Carlos Delgado(notes) (labrum tear in right hip) went on the 15-day disabled list retroactive to May 11, and he was transferred to the 60-day DL on June 5. He had surgery May 19, and he won’t return before late July. LHP Billy Wagner(notes) (Tommy John surgery in September 2008) went on the 15-day disabled list retroactive to March 27, and he was transferred to the 60-day disabled list on June 5. He was throwing bullpen sessions in mid-June, and he hopes to return by August.

DocTee Jul 07 2009 03:24 PM

More from Schmidt: [url]http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/08/sports/baseball/08injuries.html?hp

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 08 2009 12:53 AM

Gone largely unmentioned in this festivale de hand-wringing of late: Fernando Martinez, day-to-day (but without playing in 4 games) with right knee pain/discomfort. Yay! http://metsmerizedonline.com/2009/07/fe ... -knee.html

Edgy DC Jul 16 2009 03:41 PM

Rubin updates injuries. An MRI showed Carlos Beltran still has a significant enough bone bruise in his right knee to not be cleared to begin even jogging. "It hasn’t gone down sufficient enough to get to an area where he can start sprinting and playing," Minaya said. Fernando Martinez has undergone surgery on his right knee to repair a torn meniscus. He will be out six to eight weeks. John Maine threw live batting practice today to Jose Reyes. Maine may be in a game within 10 days. Minaya said there's a possiblity that Maine and Reyes could be back by the end of the month, but those are the only ones, and that's doesn't seem the likelihood. Reyes is running, but he's not cutting the bases. "We hopefully will get him on the basepaths soon," Minaya said about Reyes. "We are much closer today than a week ago." Minaya said there's no discussion of surgery right now with Beltran. "Down the line if it doesn’t go down it’s something that will have to be evaluated," Minaya said. Carlos Delgado is swinging a bat, with August still eyed.

themetfairy Jul 16 2009 03:55 PM

Holy fucking shit....

MFS62 Jul 16 2009 03:58 PM

[quote="themetfairy":2kfhmvj9]Holy fucking shit....[/quote:2kfhmvj9] A brief, but accurate, description. :) I'm tellin' ya'. Compared to the Mets, there was a higher survival rate at the Alamo. Later

dgwphotography Jul 16 2009 05:34 PM

Does this team employ the three stooges for doctors? It's not just the number of injuries, it's how so many of them have been misdiagnosed and mistreated...

Frayed Knot Jul 16 2009 08:33 PM

I know blaming Met doctors has been fashionable since the Ryan Church concussion days but I'm missing what's being misdiagnosed and mistreated here. Mainly I think this is becoming an all-too-easy and almost knee-jerk reaction when guys don't get back as quickly as we'd like them to.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 16 2009 08:43 PM

Fartinez had a pretty minor procedure that in some cases isn't required treatment for the type of injury he had. There's no negligence there.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 16 2009 08:44 PM

[quote="Frayed Knot":3rlotcd0]I know blaming Met doctors has been fashionable since the Ryan Church concussion days but I'm missing what's being misdiagnosed and mistreated here. Mainly I think this is becoming an all-too-easy and almost knee-jerk reaction when guys don't get back as quickly as we'd like them to.[/quote:3rlotcd0] I don't blame the doctors/trainers at all. Whenever someone takes a cortisone shot and go-out-there-and-get-'em instead of immediate rest, a surgical solution or other aggressive treatment, it's NEVER the medical folk leading the decision-making train on that call.

MFS62 Jul 16 2009 09:25 PM

Its the under-estimated recovery times that get to me. They've been using the Doctors at the Hospital for Special Surgery in New York City. Maybe they should try the Doctors at the Hospital for Usual Surgery. Later

Edgy DC Jul 16 2009 10:02 PM

Which estimates are we talking about?

MFS62 Jul 16 2009 10:22 PM

You're dwelling on my setup line and overlooking the punch line. Later

metirish Jul 17 2009 09:03 AM

Hospital for Special Surgery is rated every year as one of the best orthopedic hospitals in the country. This year it is rated #2 in the US News & World Report just out. That certainly means a lot to me as my son goes there, his cardiologist when sending us there remarked to me that not only are the best ortho doctors there but it's the best run hospital in NYC.....I guess my point is that the Mets can get great advice and shitty advice and it's up to them what they do with it. http://health.usnews.com/health/best-ho ... -rankings/ David Wright for one is sick of talking about injured players "I'm so tired of talking about hurt guys," Wright said after the Mets opened their second half with a 5-3 loss to the Braves at Turner Field. "I'm just worried about what's going on here. It's to a point where if we get them back, great. If not, we have to find a way. It's just too much talk about the hurt guys."

Edgy DC Jul 17 2009 09:54 AM

I'm not dwelling on anything. I asked a question.

MFS62 Jul 17 2009 10:36 AM

[quote="Edgy DC":3t4ay94x]I'm not dwelling on anything. I asked a question.[/quote:3t4ay94x] Nothing specific. It was a table setter. Just like a Jay Leno might have asked the audience if they had read about the drive -by shootings on the freeway. Then he'd say the shooters were impatient to get to a bathroom because they'd just had the new special at Taco Bell. He (or his writers) probably didn't have specific shootings in mind. Later

Edgy DC Jul 17 2009 11:28 AM

I'm going to guess they probably are typically referring to an actual news item.

Centerfield Jul 17 2009 11:40 AM

There was an article a few weeks ago that suggested that the Mets doctors were not to blame, but rather Mets officials. It cited one case where Dr. Andrews recommended surgery for Putz, the Mets officials overruled, went with cortisone, only to have Putz suck and then have the surgery a few weeks later. There is also the Mets telling Beltran he could continue to play on the bone bruise because it wouldn't get worse (and again, going with cortisone) only to have the bruise double in size. When he was ultimately put on the DL, they said he'd be back in 15 days. We all know now how foolish that was. Delgadot's surgery was delayed (cortisone again) several weeks. There's enough there that the gripers (who are there every season) may actually have somewhat of a case this year.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 17 2009 12:02 PM

[quote="Centerfield":1m688afb]There was an article a few weeks ago that suggested that the Mets doctors were not to blame, but rather Mets officials. It cited one case where Dr. Andrews recommended surgery for Putz, the Mets officials overruled, went with cortisone, only to have Putz suck and then have the surgery a few weeks later. There is also the Mets telling Beltran he could continue to play on the bone bruise because it wouldn't get worse (and again, going with cortisone) only to have the bruise double in size. When he was ultimately put on the DL, they said he'd be back in 15 days. We all know now how foolish that was. Delgadot's surgery was delayed (cortisone again) several weeks. There's enough there that the gripers (who are there every season) may actually have somewhat of a case this year.[/quote:1m688afb] That would be the Rubin article. If the gripers are targeting the medical staff, it seems they're setting their sights incorrectly. http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseb ... _mess.html

Fman99 Jul 20 2009 07:46 PM

Nieve with a muscle tear, out 6 weeks minimum. And so it goes.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 22 2009 12:32 PM

Lost in the talk of Halladays and shirtless Bernazards... Sheff's looking like another DL All-Star. (Which makes ten; isn't there a free sandwich coming somebody's way?) http://www.nypost.com/seven/07222009/sp ... 180700.htm

metirish Jul 22 2009 12:37 PM

I would never have thought but looking back Sheffield's 500th home run is one of my highlights of this season.

G-Fafif Jul 22 2009 12:45 PM

Sheffield also had an admission of his own, revealing the day after the injury that the continued cramping and soreness in his hamstring is the result of an electrolyte imbalance. And with all that Gatorade in the dugout.

Ashie62 Jul 23 2009 01:58 AM

[quote="metirish":2qon0gpv]I would never have thought but looking back Sheffield's 500th home run is one of my highlights of this season.[/quote:2qon0gpv] you and me both. On another note, is Beltran in the witness protection program?

Nymr83 Jul 24 2009 07:38 AM

[quote="cbssports":1vt0wtbd] Newsday reports that Mets SP John Maine will seek a second opinion on the injury from Dr. James Andrews and that a source says he could miss the rest of the season. [/quote:1vt0wtbd] Are "Doctor James Andrews" the scariest three words in baseball or what?

Edgy DC Jul 24 2009 07:41 AM

Yeah, though running with that quote from an un-named source on a non-game (slow-news) day may be a weenie move by Newsday. So says my source.

Nymr83 Jul 24 2009 07:49 AM

In fairness to Newsday I lifted the quote from CBS's fantasy sports pages, its possible the full Newsday article was more specific. I promise not to rehash my diatribe on looser standards in sports journalism.

dgwphotography Jul 24 2009 10:38 AM

[quote="Nymr83":2vpbwbl2][quote="cbssports":2vpbwbl2] Newsday reports that Mets SP John Maine will seek a second opinion on the injury from Dr. James Andrews and that a source says he could miss the rest of the season. [/quote:2vpbwbl2] Are "Doctor James Andrews" the scariest three words in baseball or what?[/quote:2vpbwbl2] This made me go back to see who from CBS Sports joined the pool....

MFS62 Jul 24 2009 10:47 AM

[quote="Nymr83":mjv1pme0][quote="cbssports":mjv1pme0] Newsday reports that Mets SP John Maine will seek a second opinion on the injury from Dr. James Andrews and that a source says he could miss the rest of the season. [/quote:mjv1pme0] Are "Doctor James Andrews" the scariest three words in baseball or what?[/quote:mjv1pme0] Those three words follow the five scariest words: "He'll be day-to-day". Later

Ashie62 Jul 24 2009 11:41 AM

Again..Rotoworld from CBS that Reyes wants to return as soon as possible and realizes he may not be 100% this but will play at 80% Fine by me, management? maybe..he can re-recover in October

Nymr83 Jul 24 2009 12:01 PM

the Mets would be negligent to let anyone, particularly Reyes, rush back from an injury when they're ten games out. I'd be happy to shelve him for the year even just to make sure he's fine in 2010 when the Mets will next need him.

metirish Jul 24 2009 12:05 PM

The Mets need to be concerned with their brand , Reyes on the field helps that. I don't like it but I would think it plays into a decision.

Nymr83 Jul 24 2009 12:07 PM

Yeah I know they want him back for more than just Ws, but if he re-injures anything they'll really regret it. I want Minaya's head, along with the heads of anyone on the medical staff who approves it, if Reyes comes back this yaer at less than 100% healthy.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 24 2009 12:47 PM

[quote="metirish":24s3ivms]The Mets need to be concerned with their brand , Reyes on the field helps that. I don't like it but I would think it plays into a decision.[/quote:24s3ivms] A swift, public statement from above Minaya and Dave Howard-- to confirm O's job security, to assure stakeholders/fans that the organization isn't a monkey house-- would go a much longer way toward brand preservation than rushing a hobbled Reyes. So why am I bet-my-left-testicle certain that they're going to do the latter?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 04 2009 02:29 PM

Encouraging? NEW YORK -- All-Star center fielder Carlos Beltran shagged fly balls Monday for the first time since going on the disabled list with a bruised right knee, part of another encouraging day for the injury-riddled New York Mets. Billy Wagner, out all season following elbow ligament replacement surgery, worked another perfect inning in his second minor league rehab appearance and first baseman Carlos Delgado took batting practice on the field for the first time since hip surgery. Beltran said he fielded about 30 fly balls and the bone bruise on his knee bothered him twice, but with much less pain than before. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4375227

Farmer Ted Aug 04 2009 02:41 PM

Not that I can claim to be Jose Reyes, but I tore both my calf muscle (grastroc) and hamstring many years ago. Bad. I was only jogging on both occasions and POW, the leg tightened up instantly like a cramp and POP. I went down hard. The recovery period was 12 weeks to get back to 70 percent just like the doctor said it would be. Once Jose went down, I really didn't expect him to be back.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 04 2009 03:49 PM

Funny you should mention that, Ted: As per David Lennon tweets, Reyes is back in NYC-- due to discomfort in the leg-- being reexamined. (Were I a smarter brand of bear, I would probably do the same with my team loyalties.)

Ashie62 Aug 04 2009 04:43 PM

Years from now people may ask who was the Mets SS in 2009. The answer will be Alex Cora

MFS62 Aug 05 2009 04:37 PM

With the Niese injury today, the Mets roster now has a higher turnover rate than Menudo. Later

RealityChuck Aug 05 2009 06:55 PM

Interesting contrast: Neise gets injured covering first. The team asks him to throw a pitch, and he collapses. I'm willing to bet the muscle tear happened then and not when he was covering the bag. Sheffield gets injured running to first. He doesn't go into any "let's test and find out" crap, but just walks off the field. It may not have made a difference, but was throwing a warm-up pitch really a good idea in that situation?

seawolf17 Aug 05 2009 06:59 PM

You're right, it might not have mattered, but isn't a warmup toss or two SOP when the trainer comes out to check on the pitcher for just about any reason?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 05 2009 07:50 PM

[quote="seawolf17":20vynti9]You're right, it might not have mattered, but isn't a warmup toss or two SOP when the trainer comes out to check on the pitcher for just about any reason?[/quote:20vynti9] How else-- apart from quasi-useful self report ("How do you feel, Johan Santana, about leaving a game in mid-inning?")-- do you determine whether the guy can continue? They weren't asking for a max-effort pitch.

RealityChuck Aug 05 2009 08:26 PM

Maybe. But saying "I felt a pain in my hammy on my landing foot" should have raised a red flag. Even on an easy pitch, he's going to land there with all his weight. If there's a potential problem that's a good way to make it worse.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 12 2009 07:48 PM

Yay! Sheffield back (and semi-effective)! HA!This is absurd, but it figures! After speaking with (Dr. Struan) Coleman, Ricco said about the conversation: "The one thing he did say is the hip is feeling better."

Edgy DC Aug 13 2009 09:43 AM

Carlos Delgado's rehabilitation after hip surgery has been put on hold because of a strained right oblique muscle. The new injury occurred while the New York Mets first baseman was working out over the weekend at the team's facility in Port St. Lucie, Fla. I mean, yeah, pack up the tents and all, but it would be nice just to field a team before the season ends, to remind me of what might have been and shit.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 13 2009 09:46 AM

Wright is denying a knee and/or groin injury, btw.

Edgy DC Aug 13 2009 09:51 AM

Top young Nats pitcher Jordan Zimmerman? Reconstructive elbow surgery. I hear "reconstructive" and "surgery" I think New York Jets. That's going to be a long rehab road for that guy, perhaps to nowhere.

Valadius Aug 13 2009 10:01 AM

I feel like someone at Port St. Lucie should be fired.

metirish Aug 13 2009 10:02 AM

All going well with his surgery and recovery it will be 2011 when he is back , I iamgine one would need a strong will to get through all that.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 13 2009 10:15 AM

[quote="metirish":1pl2gnuu]All going well with his surgery and recovery it will be 2011 when he is back , I iamgine one would need a strong will to get through all that.[/quote:1pl2gnuu] Cincinnati's Edison Vasquez, too, no? (IIRC)

metirish Aug 13 2009 10:25 AM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":2eke8nza][quote="metirish":2eke8nza]All going well with his surgery and recovery it will be 2011 when he is back , I iamgine one would need a strong will to get through all that.[/quote:2eke8nza] Cincinnati's Edison Vasquez, too, no? (IIRC)[/quote:2eke8nza] Yeah him too , liked watching him pitch. Intresting link here to an article from 2008 wondering if Dusty was riding his young Reds pitchers too much http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/blog/big_le ... =mlb,81407

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 13 2009 10:41 AM

[quote="metirish":168l0xx3][quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":168l0xx3][quote="metirish":168l0xx3]All going well with his surgery and recovery it will be 2011 when he is back , I iamgine one would need a strong will to get through all that.[/quote:168l0xx3] Cincinnati's Edison Vasquez, too, no? (IIRC)[/quote:168l0xx3] Yeah him too , liked watching him pitch. Intresting link here to an article from 2008 wondering if Dusty was riding his young Reds pitchers too much http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/blog/big_le ... =mlb,81407[/quote:168l0xx3] I'm not sure Dusty Baker's learned anything since he first heard about the infield-fly rule. Judging from his interviews, he appears constitutionally unable to do so.

Edgy DC Aug 13 2009 11:49 AM

There was a great interview with Dick Williams in San Diego. Among the things he railed against in the contemporary game was pitch counts. But the argument shouldn't be between a pro-pitch counts camp and anti-camp, but rather about how to apply them. The more Dick talked, the lees trustworthy he seemed. I mean congratulations on your two championships, you angry nut, but Jim Hunter won 184 games in his 20s and 35 in his 30s. Vida Blue won 155 in his 20s and 53 in his 30s. It's only natural that somebody curious might wonder about the best way to sustain a young pitcher's effectiveness.

MFS62 Aug 13 2009 12:42 PM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":1kqd7vvy] I'm not sure Dusty Baker's learned anything since he first heard about the infield-fly rule. Judging from his interviews, he appears constitutionally unable to do so.[/quote:1kqd7vvy] Maybe he learned his baseball from Joe Morgan. Later

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 13 2009 01:02 PM

[quote="MFS62":11wymrzb][quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":11wymrzb] I'm not sure Dusty Baker's learned anything since he first heard about the infield-fly rule. Judging from his interviews, he appears constitutionally unable to do so.[/quote:11wymrzb] Maybe he learned his baseball from Joe Morgan. [/quote:11wymrzb] Cut from the same cloth, attitudinally. Only difference is, Baker's been put in charge of managing multimillion dollar assets indefinitely, and reports to about a half-dozen folk, all of whom should know better than to trust his stubborn-ass instincts. Morgan's only in charge of ruining one broadcast a week, and maybe supplying a little unintentional comedy. It's always seemed batshit to me how much Morgan rails against the use of OBP as a batting-skill evaluator... since he had a crazy-high 16 percent career walk rate, and was on base like a crackhead (.392 lifetime, .466 in 1975!).

Benjamin Grimm Aug 13 2009 01:48 PM

[quote="Edgy DC"]But the argument shouldn't be between a pro-pitch counts camp and anti-camp, but rather about how to apply them.

I agree. Using 100 pitches as a magic number seems rather arbitrary. (Is it just because 100 "sounds" like a high number?)

If 130 was used as the magic number, I think pitch counts would be a lot less objectionable.

Tom Seaver, when being interviewed on SNY just before the "Shea Good-bye" game, said that they did have pitch counts in his day, but each pitcher had his own number. His may have been 145, while Koosman's may have been 135. Now it seems that everyone's number is 100, unless there's some reason to make it lower. (As in Bobby Parnell's case the other day.)

metirish Aug 13 2009 02:30 PM

I'm sure you have all heard about Nolan Ryan trying to change attitudes down in Texas....... Pitch counts or old school approach? Ryan Knows! Fi Aug 12, 2009 09:35 PM Team President Nolan Ryan of the Texas Rangers had a huge problem to deal with when he took over, that being the terrible starting pitching of the franchise. Everyone thought that even though the team had big league hitters in the lineup, that as usual, the starting pitching and bullpen, would be the demise of the Rangers once again this year. Not so, under the new mandate of Nolan Ryan set forth this spring, the focus has changed in a big way. The Rangers were growing tired of seeing many of their pitchers wind up with injuries from previous years past and without success in the win column. This season, Nolan Ryan has decided to break away from the established system in place......known as "pitch counts" and endorse the "old school" approach by pitching guru, Alan Jaeger. Jaeger's approach is highly criticized by many in the established system of "pitch counts" because his system is simply allowing players to play catch at long distances for a very long time. Pitchers are encouraged to "air it out" at distances of up to 350 feet without the use of a speed gun or toss-counts. The point being.........without constraints like the current system in place, the arm is able to grow, and only thru this method, can the coaches determine how healthy, strong, and durable a pitcher's arm can be. By using "pitch counts" you place limits on a pitchers true potential and total abilities, which is why you hardly see the 20 game winners these days. "No more babying of arms. It's time to stop pampering and start pushing!" said, Nolan Ryan who has given full support of Jaeger's "old school" approach during spring training 2009. So far, the pitching injuries throughout the entire Rangers major and minor league teams are down by a wide margin this year. With the success of the Rangers pitching staff this season, the team is in contention and, now other teams are wondering if they too should stay with the current status quo of "pitch counts." One of these teams is the Athletics, who are very much interested in keeping their young arms of Anderson, Mazzaro, and Cahill healthy for many years to come. Jaeger has just begun this season with the Texas Rangers system with his old school approach and, the results cannot be dismissed by anyone. Add the endorsement by HOF pitcher Nolan Ryan and you have a winning ball club this season. No one can deny the successful results of the Rangers this season and, I thank HOF pitcher and team president Nolan Ryan for breaking away from the established norm of "pitch counts" this season and, to the return of true winning baseball. Hopefully, other teams will soon be following in Nolan Ryan's footsteps as I've grown tired of watching many pitchers continue to get injured regardless of the philosophy that "pitch counts" are supposed to prevent such injuries. http://www.sportingnews.com/blog/bearst ... ery/197191

metirish Aug 13 2009 02:32 PM

This is better.....a Q&A with Ryan , first question is about pitch counts http://www.bbtia.com/the-clubhouse/2009 ... cript.html

Vic Sage Aug 13 2009 03:01 PM

...on base like a crackhead... BOC nominee!

Edgy DC Aug 13 2009 09:17 PM

I don't know who "Fi" is, but that Sporting News article needs an inappropriate comma count. And really, is it any shock that Nolan Ryan wants to better use pitch counts than to trash them all together, as Dick Williams and many others have inferred?

MFS62 Aug 13 2009 09:24 PM

He makes millions, but I don't want to trade places with Adrian Beltre. From the news wire: Adrian Beltre-3B-Mariners Aug. 13 - 7:53 pm et Mariners placed 3B Adrian Beltre on the 15-day disabled list with an injured testicle. Cue the laugh track. Beltre, who doesn't wear a protective cup, had a ball clip him in the groin during Wednesday's game. There was some tearing and internal bleeding. The team is waiting to see if he will require surgery. With surgery, he would be out a month. Without, roughly two weeks. Later

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 13 2009 09:51 PM

[quote="MFS62"]He makes millions, but I don't want to trade places with Adrian Beltre. From the news wire: Adrian Beltre-3B-Mariners Aug. 13 - 7:53 pm et Mariners placed 3B Adrian Beltre on the 15-day disabled list with an injured testicle. Cue the laugh track. Beltre, who doesn't wear a protective cup, had a ball clip him in the groin during Wednesday's game. There was some tearing and internal bleeding. The team is waiting to see if he will require surgery. With surgery, he would be out a month. Without, roughly two weeks. Later

2008 was a bad year for the ol' egg clutch: 'Zona's Chris Snyder got laid up last year with this, as did then-Cub/current O' Felix Pie. (Don't Google after eating-- "testicular fracture" doesn't involve bone breaking; it does involve sac rupture and extrusion.)

PiggiesTomatoes Aug 14 2009 06:55 AM

Looks like Delgado is effectively done with a strained right oblique muscle. No baseball activities for two weeks. On the bright side, "The one thing you could say is this hip is feeling better, so it's unfortunate that this popped up," said Mets assistant general manager John Ricco, the ranking executive with the team in Arizona.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 14 2009 07:06 AM

When this thread was created on February 9, we had no idea it would be the story of the season.

seawolf17 Aug 14 2009 07:21 AM

Can we post a lot more on this thread quickly so the injured testicle discussion goes far, far away? Thanks.

MFS62 Aug 14 2009 07:29 AM

[quote="seawolf17":3hog7153]Can we post a lot more on this thread quickly so the injured testicle discussion goes far, far away? Thanks.[/quote:3hog7153] Are you trying to be a ballbuster? Later

Benjamin Grimm Aug 15 2009 06:37 PM Wright beaned, suffers concussion

It's a concussion for David Wright: Mets’ Wright beaned, suffers concussion Pitch by Giants’ Cain hits New York third baseman squarely in helmet The Associated Press updated 6:26 p.m. ET, Sat., Aug 15, 2009 NEW YORK - Mets third baseman David Wright was taken from Citi Field in an ambulance after being hit squarely in the helmet by a 94 mph fastball from San Francisco Giants starter Matt Cain on Saturday. Wright, wearing a gray shirt and black shorts, was shown on television stepping unaided into the back of an ambulance about 50 minutes after he was hit in the fourth inning of a scoreless game. The ambulance left the ballpark with a police escort. Wright was taken to the Hospital for Special Surgery by ambulance about 50 minutes after being hit. Mets spokesman Jay Horwitz said a CT scan was negative and that Wright had a concussion. He was expected to stay in the hospital overnight for observation. Cain’s 0-2 pitch hit Wright just above the brim of the helmet, sending it flying as Wright fell to the ground in the right-handed batter’s box. Wright lay motionless on his stomach for over a minute before trainers helped turn him over onto his back. One trainer leaned in close as Wright was on his stomach, talking to the third baseman. After Wright was turned over, he sat up and a trainer shone a light in his eyes. Wright was helped to his feet and walked off the field with limited help. Fans gave him a loud ovation. Cain, who had thrown just seven balls in the first three innings, walked halfway in toward the plate and sat in a crouch as trainers attended to Wright. Giants manager Bruce Bochy visited the mound at the end of the 3-minute delay. Fernando Tatis ran for the All-Star starter and stayed in the game at third. Wright, who had a cold earlier in the week and did not start Tuesday in Arizona, has played in all but one of the Mets’ 116 games this season. New York starter Johan Santana threw behind the back of San Francisco’s Pablo Sandoval, but missed him in the seventh inning. That drew a warning for both teams from home plate umpire Brian O’Nora. Sandoval responded by hitting a home run, boosting the Giants’ lead to 4-1. Santana then hit the next batter, catcher Bengie Molina, but wasn’t ejected. San Francisco manager Bruce Bochy argued with O’Nora about the non-ejection, but Mets manager Jerry Manuel removed the star left-hander at that point anyway.

Nymr83 Aug 15 2009 07:03 PM

Who wants to join me at LaGuardia? I'm planning on calling in a bomb threat if the Mets let David within 50 yards of an airplane.

Frayed Knot Aug 15 2009 07:15 PM

Well seeing as how this is the beginning of their longest home stand of the year I think we can spare the posse. BTW, just out of curiosity, does anyone know anything concrete about the effects of air travel following a concussion (either immediate or long term) or is this just one of those things we all "know" is bad simply because it sounds like it is?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 16 2009 02:22 AM

[quote="Frayed Knot"]Well seeing as how this is the beginning of their longest home stand of the year I think we can spare the posse. BTW, just out of curiosity, does anyone know anything concrete about the effects of air travel following a concussion (either immediate or long term) or is this just one of those things we all "know" is bad simply because it sounds like it is?

Googled for a while. It seems there's nothing conclusive on the matter.

But speaking of "concrete"...

... her trip to Citi Field was marred by disconnections. She was late and, despite an escort and radio, could not find this reporter for an hour. "Unlike being christened with water [at Yankee Stadium], I felt energetically blocked," she said. "When I did dowse around the site, my rod spun wildly in various spots, thus denoting disturbed energy."

http://www.nypost.com/seven/10282007/ne ... _field.htm

Nymr83 Aug 16 2009 07:46 AM

pfft, like i trust a feng shui expert with a name like "Wendell", lets get a second opinion from someone whose name looks chinese in print.

MFS62 Aug 16 2009 09:04 AM

How ironic.: Check out the quote by Wright. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/13/sport ... .html?_r=2 What if? Later

Ashie62 Aug 16 2009 09:05 AM

Donna Chang?

Ashie62 Aug 16 2009 09:06 AM

[quote="MFS62":1v5wvjhv]How ironic.: Check out the quote by Wright. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/13/sport ... .html?_r=2 What if? Later[/quote:1v5wvjhv] Wright proves to be the only quoted player to have a working brain, now lets protect it

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 16 2009 11:19 AM

For the moment, the Mets are doing the right thing: Wright shut down indefinitely with PCS, and sent home from the hospital for some rest and Molly-coddling. Doing the right thing on one front, that is. Why this?

Benjamin Grimm Aug 16 2009 11:36 AM

These guys very much want to play again, rather than go into the offseason with an element of doubt. I don't mind indulging them in this.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 16 2009 02:52 PM

Fair point, but virtually ALL athletes at this level are ultracompetitive by nature, and aren't necessarily thinking long-term. And well... there's Beltran the guy, and then there's Beltran the irreplaceable asset with degenerative knees. Only one of the two is best served by allowing him to elect for rushing back with a month to go in a lost season. Oh, and as per Dave Lennon, Wright's headed to the DL.

Ashie62 Aug 16 2009 06:16 PM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":26ta1x5c]Fair point, but virtually ALL athletes at this level are ultracompetitive by nature, and aren't necessarily thinking long-term. And well... there's Beltran the guy, and then there's Beltran the irreplaceable asset with degenerative knees. Only one of the two is best served by allowing him to elect for rushing back with a month to go in a lost season. Oh, and as per Dave Lennon, Wright's headed to the DL.[/quote:26ta1x5c] It was suggested on this forum a week ago or so to put Wright on the D.L. before he got hurt. management needs to start reading here

seawolf17 Aug 16 2009 06:36 PM

Wright to the fucking DL. You know what, Injury Gods? Go eff yourself. You happy? You've completely broken us. It's because they tore down Shea Stadium, you know.

Kong76 Aug 16 2009 06:51 PM

sea: It's because they tore down Shea Stadium, you know<<< I said a decade ago there must be a way to remove the upper deck and just renovate the rest but NO!!!

Edgy DC Aug 16 2009 07:17 PM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":38brv4d8]Only one of the two is best served by allowing him to elect for rushing back with a month to go in a lost season.[/quote:38brv4d8] Yabbut, I don't necessarily know that he's being rushed.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 16 2009 08:09 PM

[quote="Edgy DC"][quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"]Only one of the two is best served by allowing him to elect for rushing back with a month to go in a lost season.

Yabbut, I don't necessarily know that he's being rushed.

Fair point; none of us do for sure.

What we do know (or have been told) is that he's had-- and, presumably, still has-- a severe bone bruise; that this bruise was so bad that surgical solutions have been on the table; and that in lieu of more aggressive solutions, lots and lots of rest has been the suggested treatment.

Given that and the fact that the team's playing/planning for next year at this point, it seems that any attempt to get back on the field or continual testing in the cause of doing so would be a rush job, you know?

metirish Aug 16 2009 08:13 PM

I just watched an SNY update on Wright , show opens up and the talking head gives the headlines but says we must start with Wright , cut to a helicopter shot of an ambulance with an entourage of cars leaving I guess Citi Field? It's like Diana dies all over or something.

Ashie62 Aug 16 2009 08:49 PM

[quote="metirish":51pdctn7]I just watched an SNY update on Wright , show opens up and the talking head gives the headlines but says we must start with Wright , cut to a helicopter shot of an ambulance with an entourage of cars leaving I guess Citi Field? It's like Diana dies all over or something.[/quote:51pdctn7] Fear and consumption sells media

Edgy DC Aug 16 2009 08:55 PM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"][quote="Edgy DC"][quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"]Only one of the two is best served by allowing him to elect for rushing back with a month to go in a lost season.

Yabbut, I don't necessarily know that he's being rushed.

Given that and the fact that the team's playing/planning for next year at this point, it seems that any attempt to get back on the field or continual testing in the cause of doing so would be a rush job, you know?

I don't know. How much is rest is lots and lots? Eventually, he has to come back out and test it. Eventually the team has to know what they've got. Perhaps playing is part of the diagnostic process.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 16 2009 09:27 PM

[quote="Edgy DC"][quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"][quote="Edgy DC"][quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"]Only one of the two is best served by allowing him to elect for rushing back with a month to go in a lost season.

Yabbut, I don't necessarily know that he's being rushed.

Given that and the fact that the team's playing/planning for next year at this point, it seems that any attempt to get back on the field or continual testing in the cause of doing so would be a rush job, you know?

I don't know. How much is rest is lots and lots? Eventually, he has to come back out and test it. Eventually the team has to know what they've got. Perhaps playing is part of the diagnostic process.

P'raps.

Maybe I'm getting swayed a little by the bad juju... it's beginning to feel like nothing lasting and good-- absolutely nothing, including prospect evaluation (see Nieve, Niese)-- will come from this team's on-field endeavors this year.

Gwreck Aug 17 2009 01:06 AM

Also Fernando Martinez (although in fairness it was time for his annual injury anyway). I think it's time to preemptively put Johan on the DL. Or at least keep him wrapped in bubble wrap when he's not on the field.

metsmarathon Aug 17 2009 08:34 AM

giving beltran the opportunity to play this season gives the team the chance to find out if they might still have a centerfielder for next year. if he can run and cover ground free enough of difficulty and pain, then maybe they don't need to make "new centerfielder" or "backup outfielder good enough to start" a top priority for next year.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 17 2009 09:33 AM

[quote="metsmarathon":3am4rzsd]giving beltran the opportunity to play this season gives the team the chance to find out if they might still have a centerfielder for next year. if he can run and cover ground free enough of difficulty and pain, then maybe they don't need to make "new centerfielder" or "backup outfielder good enough to start" a top priority for next year.[/quote:3am4rzsd] A fair point, and I'll concede it. That said, I think "backup outfielder good enough to start (for stretches)" is a priority, anyway (Pagan, with a slight brain adjustment, fits the bill decently).

metirish Aug 17 2009 10:28 AM

Can't win? Mets make Wright decision, but questions linger What is it about the Mets that they can end the day having done the right thing, and yet we still shake our heads at how they got there? Help me out here, folks. Does any other company/entity/person possess such a proclivity? E-mail me at kdavidoff@newsday.com. We'll turn it into a blog post. Anyway, David Wright was placed on the disabled list Sunday, and Mets fans should exhale in relief. There won't be a repeat of last year's Ryan Church fiasco. Nevertheless, while their final answer proved correct, the Mets' actions in the roughly 23 hours from Wright's beaning to his shelving raised more questions. Namely: 1. What took them so long? Why did they leave themselves two men short - Alex Cora, with an ailing right thumb, was unavailable - for yesterday's game? 2. Why in the world did they send a wildly uninformed Jerry Manuel to address this issue before the game? 3. What was up with Omar Minaya's postgame news conference, in which he repeatedly stressed that Wright wanted to play but that the paternal Mets insisted that their face of the franchise join fellow Core members Carlos Beltran, Carlos Delgado and Jose Reyes on the DL? Sorry to be such a buzz kill, especially on a day when the Mets beat the contending Giants, 3-2, in a smooth game at Citi Field. Really, though, the Mets didn't inspire much confidence on a day when such a feat should've been a slam dunk. The day began with Manuel holding his traditional pregame news conference and sounding as educated on concussions as Homer Simpson does on parenting. I did find the Minaya conference quite funny.

A Boy Named Seo Aug 17 2009 10:50 AM

Yah, agreed. This guy at the Post goes so far as to say the "rushed to judgment" putting him on the DL. Yeesh.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 17 2009 11:19 AM

The way this has dragged Church's situation-- and, by entension, the player himself-- into a kind of second-stage spotlight is perhaps the oddest tangent of this story. (Witness, as well, Manuel's-- unintentional?-- cheap shot at the departed.) From Manuel at yesterday's pregame: "David is a different animal, so to speak," Manuel said. "And how he is made up is a little different than, say, Ryan Church, in my opinion. And that's not to say one is better than the other. But they're different... ... With Church, it was, 'I want to play, but,' " the manager said. "It was, 'I want to play, but I'm queasy.' It was just always stuff coming out of left field." The Snooze's John Harperspeculates: Maybe that's why he felt the need to push Church, going all the way back to spring training when he declared young Murphy already a better hitter and said he didn't think Church's post-concussion problems were a factor in his late-season woes at the plate. From Wallace Matthews (yeah, I know) yesterday: The Mets played fast and loose with Church's health and not only got away with it but capitalized on it when they traded him for Francoeur, who has been a good addition. From an Adam Rubin joint todayquoting Church hisself: He's going to need to rest," said Church, who twice suffered concussions last year while with the Mets. "I don't know how bad it was, but a concussion is a concussion. You need time. Don't try to be a hero. Don't let anyone make you play.

metirish Aug 17 2009 11:29 AM

The Manuel jab was classless IMO.....no class Jerry , no class.

Edgy DC Aug 17 2009 11:54 AM

Jerry needs a little blunt head trauma to see how he likes it. Seriously, though, we're talking about brain injury. Come on, Jerry.

MFS62 Aug 17 2009 12:31 PM

Seems like the Mets are damned if they do (Put a guy on the DL immediately) or damned of they don't (they delay). It sells newspapers, I guess. Later

Frayed Knot Aug 17 2009 02:06 PM

[quote="A Boy Named Seo"]Yah, agreed. This guy at the Post goes so far as to say the "rushed to judgment" putting him on the DL.

Brooks is the Post's hockey writer normally, but I think he got this one right.
Maybe Wright does need the DL (maybe even probably) but I think at least part of the decision came about because of the second-guessing they took over the Church decision (or non-decision I guess). Again worrying about the pr first and right thing to do second.

btw, Dodger pitcher Kuroda got conked with a line-drive the same day and was also held overnight in a hospital for observation. He was medically cleared to be put on a plane the next day.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 17 2009 02:10 PM

Mike Piazza was beaned by Roger Clemens, and suffered his concussion, on July 8, 2000. He was back in the Mets starting lineup, and behind the plate, on July 13. He missed four days, and three of them were taken up by the All-Star break. I don't know how Piazza's concussion compares to Wright's (or to Church's) but this talk of David maybe being out for the season does seem a little extreme.

Frayed Knot Aug 17 2009 02:19 PM

And Jon Matlack missed one start after getting hit with a liner that had some who saw it thinking could be fatal. And that's the problem with concussions or other head injuries, no two are alike so there's no reason to treat them that way. Maybe Wright needs this or maybe he doesn't, I just get the feeling that the decision was made for a variety of reasons only some of which are medical just so they can shield themselves from comments of those who's medical knowledge stems from watching reruns of ER & House.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 17 2009 02:26 PM

[quote="Frayed Knot"][quote="A Boy Named Seo"]Yah, agreed. This guy at the Post goes so far as to say the "rushed to judgment" putting him on the DL.

Brooks is the Post's hockey writer normally, but I think he got this one right.
Maybe Wright does need the DL (maybe even probably) but I think at least part of the decision came about because of the second-guessing they took over the Church decision (or non-decision I guess). Again worrying about the pr first and right thing to do second.

One could make the argument that putting him on the DL gives them an extra body, preventing the team from playing yet ANOTHER man down, and giving David a guilt-free opportunity to rest.

One could make that argument... but then, one would be betraying how little they actually follow the Mets' recent history in roster management.

Nymr83 Aug 17 2009 02:32 PM

this is absurd. if they don't DL him everyone would be cursing them out and invoking the Church incident as proof the Mets don't kbow how to handle a concussion. the mets want to play it safe with their star player's HEAD INJURY in an already lost season? fine by me.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 17 2009 02:36 PM

I agree with them being cautious, and since they're not in a pennant race, the DL thing makes sense. (It prevents Jerry from trying to leverage Wright's "toughness.") I do expect that David will resume playing shortly after his DL time runs out.

seawolf17 Aug 17 2009 02:38 PM

[quote="Frayed Knot":1p1b3qe0]btw, Dodger pitcher Kuroda got conked with a line-drive the same day and was also held overnight in a hospital for observation. He was medically cleared to be put on a plane the next day.[/quote:1p1b3qe0] Maybe Fred could use the Dodgers' doctors!

Benjamin Grimm Aug 17 2009 02:44 PM

He is. But it's the Brooklyn Dodgers doctors he's using, and they're all in their 90's and haven't been keeping up with medical developments.

metsmarathon Aug 17 2009 02:46 PM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"] From Wallace Matthews (yeah, I know) yesterday: The Mets played fast and loose with Church's health and not only got away with it but capitalized on it when they traded him for Francoeur, who has been a good addition.

how the fuck did the mets capitalize on the church injury by getting francouer? that's fucking stupid.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 17 2009 02:51 PM

They capitalized on his eventual recovery, but certainly not on his injury.

Farmer Ted Aug 17 2009 03:37 PM

David's vision must still be blurry. No other explanation for wearing this shirt. http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2009/ ... -early.jpg Still wearing that Flavor Flav watch, too.

A Boy Named Seo Aug 17 2009 03:48 PM

Yikes. It should be in his contract that he has to wear the home pinstripes at all times. Shower, sexy time, doesn't matter. Always.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 17 2009 03:54 PM

[quote="metsmarathon"][quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"] From Wallace Matthews (yeah, I know) yesterday: The Mets played fast and loose with Church's health and not only got away with it but capitalized on it when they traded him for Francoeur, who has been a good addition.

how the fuck did the mets capitalize on the church injury by getting francouer? that's fucking stupid.

I know, right? I mean, even for Mr. Matthews, it's a doozy.

Yeah, if you follow the literal meaning of the sentence, he's actually saying that the Mets profited from said "fast and loose" injury mistreatment. Although, to be fair, I think it's another distasteful thing that he's attempting to imply here. (Double tasteless fail!)

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 17 2009 03:56 PM

[quote="Farmer Ted"]David's vision must still be blurry. No other explanation for wearing this shirt. http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2009/ ... -early.jpg Still wearing that Flavor Flav watch, too.

ACK! IT'S A BRAUN SHIRT! A RYAN BRAUN SHIRT!

Frayed Knot Aug 17 2009 04:12 PM

[quote="seawolf17":1cp0nkey][quote="Frayed Knot":1cp0nkey]btw, Dodger pitcher Kuroda got conked with a line-drive the same day and was also held overnight in a hospital for observation. He was medically cleared to be put on a plane the next day.[/quote:1cp0nkey] Maybe Fred could use the Dodgers' doctors![/quote:1cp0nkey] And Texas's Ian Kinsler got beaned the same day too (actually looked worse than Wright's initially) but he never even left the game. Larger point being that all head injuries aren't the same so treating one based solely on the result of another is stupid.

bmfc1 Aug 17 2009 08:05 PM

Cora: done for the season. Rubin: Alex Cora has decided to have season-ending surgeries to repair torn ligaments in both thumbs. He'll have the right thumb repaired first by team doctor Andrew Weiland, then wait five weeks and have the left thumb repaired.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 17 2009 08:18 PM

Any word on when he'll be able to resume hitchhiking?

Frayed Knot Aug 17 2009 08:21 PM

Are you kidding? Immediately man!!! Thumbs in large casts will be visible from like a mile away!! Might need help getting the door open though.

Nymr83 Aug 17 2009 08:37 PM

i prefer doors that can be kicked anyway, this way i dont have to get other people's germs when i touch them.

metsmarathon Aug 18 2009 07:07 AM

[img width=500]http://store.remetee.com/store/images/largeover/id217.jpg> http://store.remetee.com/store/index.ph ... cts_id=217 Gypsy -Red w/Stones 30/Single 100% Pfd Over Dyed Cotton Tee, Grinding, Gold Foil, Rhinestones On Face, Headpiece, Rose, And Winged Timepiece, Red, Garment Wash. gold foil. rhinestones. holy fuck, man. $119 gets you a whole lot of ugly! if this was 10 years ago, he's be dying his hair blonde and holding awkward press conferences assuring us of his straightness.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 18 2009 08:05 AM

"It's like getting beaned in the head with a 94 mph fastball of fashion."

Benjamin Grimm Aug 18 2009 08:09 AM

I have to say, it goes nicely with the bright-yellow watch band. I wonder why a guy who makes millions per year has to dress himself in Salvation Army hand-me-downs.

metirish Aug 18 2009 08:12 AM

"oh sweetheart a 97mph fastball to the coconut is the least he deserves for this fashion faux pas"

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 18 2009 08:18 AM

"I'm underwhelmed."

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 18 2009 09:28 AM

Bitch! (snaps fingers in JCL and Irish's general direction)

Ashie62 Aug 18 2009 03:44 PM

Cut Cora some slack..a torn thumb tendon. I don't see how he could play at all. and then we find out 2 tendons. He may not have been the best but he walked the walk and had to play with an injury that not even strong pain meds can make bearable.

Farmer Ted Aug 18 2009 04:13 PM

Another conspiracy theorist on the WBC and injuries. I subscribe to the theory, wholeheartedly. By Eddie Mayrose, July 9, 2009 Under Commissioner Bud Selig’s reign, Major League Baseball has become more and more about marketing and sales and way less about the fans or even the game, itself. If there’s a way to create a new revenue stream or bump up the current prices, Selig and his merry band of carpet baggers, baseball’s owners, will leap at it with no regard for who may be incurring the cost. Looking forward to taking your kids to an afternoon game on a summer Sunday? Check back with the team two weeks prior, as ESPN may have moved it to Sunday evening; a privilege the Commish and Co. signed away for extra cash when the last network deal was inked. Ticked off at the ridiculous prices being charged by the Mets and Yankees in their new homes? Selig can’t wait to tell anyone who’ll listen that he thinks the ducats have been priced responsibly. Even the nice patriotic gesture that sees teams wear Stars and Stripes hats on the three national holidays that fall within the season has been corrupted. Last year, when they debuted, each team wore a blue version of the cap, which was a big seller among fans. However, when Memorial Day rolled around this year, a red edition adorned the heads of all big leaguers. Let’s face it, how many more blue lids were actually going to be sold? As for the kids who thought they’d be wearing the same apparel as their heroes? Let Dad pony up another thirty five bucks and they’ll be up to date. But, it is Selig’s most far reaching money grab, the World Baseball Classic, which has managed to put the players, themselves, in jeopardy. A made for television event played in 2006 and 2009, the WBC, features professional players representing their native countries in a two week tournament played at the beginning of March; or the time when most are just beginning the routine of preparing for the season. That many of the players might not be ready to compete so early was an issue seemingly disregarded as soon as a network exec reached for his checkbook. That there didn’t seem to be a whole lot of interest among fans was another factor that was ignored. So, on the games went, with their consequences to be realized during the regular season. Of the 115 MLB players that participated in the event, 24 have spent time on the disabled list this year; more than twenty percent. There have been 7 more that have missed time to injury during the season but have not been disabled and still another 10 experiencing seasons that range from extremely sub-par to career-worst. That’s thirty five percent of those who played in the Classic having to deal with an unexpectedly disappointing season. Hope the payday was a good one, Bud. Now, there are more than a few injuries that would have occurred no matter the situation. You can’t blame Cesar Izturis’ appendicitis or Brian McCann’s adverse reaction to laser surgery on the WBC. But some interesting patterns still exist. The Mets, for instance, not only sent the most players to the tournament but have had the most land on the DL. Even the Japanese, two time winners of the Classic and renowned for their conditioning, have seen no less than four from their roster miss time to injury. Former Commissioner Bowie Kuhn was ridiculed at time by owners and fans alike for invoking the “best interest of the game” clause. Maybe that’s something Selig should consider. For, as the accompanying list shows, the “best interest of the game” is clearly not being served by the WBC. These players are paying the price for a shortened Spring Training. Unfortunately, until it hits him in his wallet, Selig probably won’t care. DISABLED LIST Mike Aviles Brian McCann Alex Cora Oliver Perez David Davidson J.J. Putz Carlos Delgado Jose Reyes Stephen Drew Carlos Ruiz Jose Guillen Carlos Silva Scott Hairston Joakim Soria Chris Iannetta Ichiro Suzuki Akinori Iwamura Edinson Volquez Cesar Izturis Joey Votto Daisuke Matsuzaka Brad Ziegler MISSED TIME Carlos Beltran Miguel Cabrera Carlos Guillen Chipper Jones Evan Longoria Hanley Ramirez Shane Victorino UNDERPERFORMING Joel Hanrahan Matt Lindstrom Jose Lopez Magglio Ordonez David Ortiz Roy Oswalt Jimmy Rollins Jonathan Sanchez Geovany Soto Fernando Tatis http://thisisdiversity.com/articles/all ... lb-players

Frayed Knot Aug 18 2009 04:21 PM

I think this is a conclusion in search of evidence.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 18 2009 05:29 PM

I don't agree that the WBC is the "cause" of injuries or that its an egregious money-grab, necessarily.

Ashie62 Aug 18 2009 06:15 PM

I hate the WBC but I don't see an injury connection

Edgy DC Aug 18 2009 08:25 PM

How about we start with a control group?

MFS62 Aug 19 2009 08:51 AM

[quote="Edgy DC":3kgeobsa]How about we start with a control group?[/quote:3kgeobsa] Based on the Mets DL this year, the control group should be Olympic javelin catchers. Later

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 19 2009 03:15 PM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"]The way this has dragged Church's situation-- and, by entension, the player himself-- into a kind of second-stage spotlight is perhaps the oddest tangent of this story. (Witness, as well, Manuel's-- unintentional?-- cheap shot at the departed.) From Manuel at yesterday's pregame: "David is a different animal, so to speak," Manuel said. "And how he is made up is a little different than, say, Ryan Church, in my opinion. And that's not to say one is better than the other. But they're different... ... With Church, it was, 'I want to play, but,' " the manager said. "It was, 'I want to play, but I'm queasy.' It was just always stuff coming out of left field." The Snooze's John Harperspeculates: Maybe that's why he felt the need to push Church, going all the way back to spring training when he declared young Murphy already a better hitter and said he didn't think Church's post-concussion problems were a factor in his late-season woes at the plate. From Wallace Matthews (yeah, I know) yesterday: The Mets played fast and loose with Church's health and not only got away with it but capitalized on it when they traded him for Francoeur, who has been a good addition. From an Adam Rubin joint todayquoting Church hisself: He's going to need to rest," said Church, who twice suffered concussions last year while with the Mets. "I don't know how bad it was, but a concussion is a concussion. You need time. Don't try to be a hero. Don't let anyone make you play.

Did anyone catch Church's pregame rejoinder last night? Just caught thismyself:

"It just felt like a low blow," Church said. "I saw it. I wasn't happy. If he had a problem with me or anything like that, you'd think he'd tell it to my face. I had plenty of opportunity to talk while I was wearing that uniform. It just was like, all right, now that I'm wearing another one, why would he come out and say that?"

Perhaps more surprising... as per the Star-Ledger, he had an interesting reaction when asked about Hospital of Special Surgery staff:

The Manhattan hospital is world-renowned, and team medical director David Altchek is highly regarded in the world of sports medicine. When a reporter mentioned the reputation of HSS, though, Church rolled his eyes and smirked. "No comment," Church said. "That's why everybody's got their own doctors and physicians."

Nymr83 Aug 19 2009 04:40 PM

article on funny injury cover-ups: [url]http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=crasnick_jerry&page=starting9/090819

Edgy DC Aug 19 2009 07:32 PM

The other thing that came out from Church is that he wasn't straight with the team about his readiness to play. Jerry may be throwin low blows there, but (1) he kind of lends some credibility to Jerry's frustration with his account, and (2) you don't have to necessarily interpret it as Jerry questioning his manhood.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 19 2009 09:06 PM

I agree that calling-Church-a-pussy is only one potential interpretation of what came out of his mouth, and I don't think that Manuel even intended to phrase it quite that way. (Honestly, it seems to me like he missed his meaning a bit, and was attempting to compliment David's gumption and/or discuss his value to the team relative to any other injured player.) That said, that phrasing is what came out of his mouth. Based on word and deed during Ryan's time in pinstripes, it's difficult to deny that Manuel had a little bit less respect for Church than for most of the players in his stable, for what seems like several reasons; once he unwisely brought Church's name into the conversation, that couldn't help but wend its way into Manuel's off-the-cuff remarks. Either way, it's probably for the best that we're not voting on least-favorite recent manager now. And I'm not sure I'd characterize Church's reaction as any less honest than that of most any other player who suffers an injury and feels momentarily better*. If the player says he's fine, and those who know better say he may not be, it's on the team to make the determination, isn't it? *Honest though it may be, though, I'm not sure that I'd take opinions about medical qualifications from Mr. Church without a rack's worth of seasoning.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 19 2009 09:25 PM

On a bit of a tangent, I heard Jerry speak in a radio interview today and it struck me he's come off as a man not having even the least bit of fun. Not because of anything he said, which was typical jocky bland talk, but that he was clearly sick to death of the injuries, of trying to put a positive spin on everything, of making it seem as if Bobby Parnell's start is really part of a larger plan etc etc etc.

Edgy DC Aug 20 2009 09:24 AM

Well, the retaliation is covered, anyhow.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 20 2009 09:26 AM

lol

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 20 2009 10:03 AM

[quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":1p55t7ky]On a bit of a tangent, I heard Jerry speak in a radio interview today and it struck me he's come off as a man not having even the least bit of fun. Not because of anything he said, which was typical jocky bland talk, but that he was clearly sick to death of the injuries, of trying to put a positive spin on everything, of making it seem as if Bobby Parnell's start is really part of a larger plan etc etc etc.[/quote:1p55t7ky] Well, hell, Jerry-- if you're sick to death with it, there's a pretty simple fix. Also, there's a certain Stamford native who wouldn't mind taking that burden off your hands for a while.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 20 2009 10:38 AM

I think Jerry survives if Omar does. And I think Omar is going to get "promoted."

Kong76 Aug 24 2009 02:37 PM

Jerry in post game Q & A with reporters ... oh and by the way, Santana won't start tomorrow and has been hurt for months. (paraphrasing, of course)

metirish Aug 24 2009 02:39 PM

[quote="Kong76":3lkkxmi2]Jerry in post game Q & A with reporters ... oh and by the way, Santana won't start tomorrow and has been hurt for months. (paraphrasing, of course)[/quote:3lkkxmi2] Hurt like injured or hurt becasue the season went down the swanny?

seawolf17 Aug 24 2009 02:41 PM

Seriously? Oh, and we might as well mention Jeff Francoeur's ligament damage so it's properly recorded in this thread.

Kong76 Aug 24 2009 02:47 PM

I was on the phone so I could only half listen. He'll miss the start because something bothering him with his elbow (discomfort) and it's gotten worse and he's seeing the doctor tomorrow.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 24 2009 03:54 PM Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Aug 24 2009 09:10 PM

ROLL CALL Currently on DL: Beltran (Knee--Bone Bruise) Cora (Hand--Torn Ligaments) Delgado (Hip labral tear, strained oblique) Maine (Shoulder-- inflammation?) FMartinez (Knee-- meniscus tear) RMartinez (Finger-- torn ligament) Nieve (Leg-- quad tear) Niese (Hamstring-- tear) Putz (Elbow-- inflammation/cartilage issue?) Reyes (Hamstring-- strain/tear) Wright (Concussion) Previous DL time: Church (Neck-- strain) Pagan (Hamstring-- strain) Perez (Knee-- inflammation) Schneider (Back-- strained muscle) Sheffield (Hamstring-- strain) Wagner-- (Elbow-- recovery, TJ surgery) Missed time, no DL: Castillo (Ankle) Castro (Back?) Francoeur (Thumb) Pelfrey (Shoulder-- Tendinitis) Santana (Back/Elbow) Am I missing anyone?

Ashie62 Aug 24 2009 04:53 PM

Rotoworld has Santana out next start per Manuel's press conference and seeing the Dr. "tuesday"

MFS62 Aug 24 2009 05:40 PM

I'm bginning to think that CitiField was built on an Indian burial ground. Later

Benjamin Grimm Aug 24 2009 06:00 PM

Holy crap. I was blissfully ignorant of this. Until now, of course.

metirish Aug 24 2009 06:25 PM

Nice work LWFS , I hope you did't injure yourself typing all that.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 24 2009 06:26 PM

[quote="metirish":3ehyb8k5]Nice work LWFS , I hope you did't injure yourself typing all that.[/quote:3ehyb8k5] Nothing major. Like most of us, I'm day-to-day.

Ashie62 Aug 24 2009 07:31 PM

Time to hire Dr. Nick from the Simpsons You all need a rahdical appendectomy!

Ashie62 Aug 24 2009 07:32 PM

[quote="MFS62":3mjm5esz]I'm bginning to think that CitiField was built on an Indian burial ground. Later[/quote:3mjm5esz] or Flushing is a "sick bay"

PiggiesTomatoes Aug 24 2009 09:17 PM

ESPN reporting season-ending (duh) left elbow surgery for Santana. When questioned about Santana, Manual laughed some crazy-ass cackle. I think that was to prevent from crying.

Nymr83 Aug 24 2009 10:57 PM

[quote="Ashie62"]Time to hire Dr. Nick from the Simpsons You all need a rahdical appendectomy!

Hello Everybody!!

metirish Aug 25 2009 04:30 AM

[quote="PiggiesTomatoes":19issclr]ESPN reporting season-ending (duh) left elbow surgery for Santana. When questioned about Santana, Manual laughed some crazy-ass cackle. I think that was to prevent from crying.[/quote:19issclr] WOW.....

PiggiesTomatoes Aug 25 2009 05:46 AM

ESPN also reporting a torn ligament in the left thumb of Francoeur. WTF!!!

Benjamin Grimm Aug 25 2009 05:51 AM

[quote="metirish":t2uzondd][quote="PiggiesTomatoes":t2uzondd]ESPN reporting season-ending (duh) left elbow surgery for Santana. When questioned about Santana, Manual laughed some crazy-ass cackle. I think that was to prevent from crying.[/quote:t2uzondd] WOW.....[/quote:t2uzondd] Hold that wow, for now. It doesn't look like any decision has been made. (He hasn't even met with the doctor yet.) And Francoeur says he plans to try to play through the pain, like Alex Cora did, and he'll get his thumb taken care of once the season ends.

Nymr83 Aug 25 2009 06:05 AM

I'd rather he gets it taken care of NOW so he has an extra 2 months to heal for 2010. Fire all the team doctors and trainers please, the "coincidences" are just mounting too quickly around here.

dgwphotography Aug 25 2009 07:08 AM

I realize that he started off on fire this season, but didn't Santana "tweak" the elbow in spring training, because he was trying to get ready faster for the WBC?

seawolf17 Aug 25 2009 07:18 AM

CBS Sportsline reports that Luis Castillo, boating out in the Atlantic Ocean early this morning, was eaten by sharks.

metirish Aug 25 2009 07:21 AM

Looking at his BR page to see how many innings to has tossed the last several seasons , In 2004 he broke 200 innings with 228 2004 - 228 2005 - 231.2 2006 - 233.2 2007 - 219 2008 - 234.1 2009 - 166.2 When I think of innigs eaters Sabbathis comes to mind , he's broke 200 innings poicthed in a season twice , 2007/08 This is not a comment on anything just looking is all.

MFS62 Aug 25 2009 07:23 AM

[quote="seawolf17":yxechjg1]CBS Sportsline reports that Luis Castillo, boating out in the Atlantic Ocean early this morning, was eaten by sharks.[/quote:yxechjg1] Santana considered him to be a pal. Now I guess he's just chum. Later

Benjamin Grimm Aug 25 2009 07:28 AM

[quote="seawolf17":2x94a6eo]CBS Sportsline reports that Luis Castillo, boating out in the Atlantic Ocean early this morning, was eaten by sharks.[/quote:2x94a6eo] I think the telling thing about this joke is that Luis Castillo has risen to the top of the list of players for whom we'd dread an injury. Do you realize he's currently third on the season list of Schaefer recipients for 2009?

TransMonk Aug 25 2009 07:34 AM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm":2urfrb2k] I think the telling thing about this joke is that Luis Castillo has risen to the top of the list of players for whom we'd dread an injury. Do you realize he's currently third on the season list of Schaefer recipients for 2009?[/quote:2urfrb2k] He's 2nd on the team in plate appearances this season, and could jump to #1 depending how soon Wright comes back.

Edgy DC Aug 25 2009 07:38 AM

[quote="Nymr83":2nvin52l]I'd rather he gets it taken care of NOW so he has an extra 2 months to heal for 2010. Fire all the team doctors and trainers please, the "coincidences" are just mounting too quickly around here.[/quote:2nvin52l] Is the prevalence of thumb fractures a training or a medical issue?

HahnSolo Aug 25 2009 07:53 AM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm":30m5xvnz] Do you realize he's currently third on the season list of Schaefer recipients for 2009?[/quote:30m5xvnz] Should we have an Anacin player of the year?

dgwphotography Aug 25 2009 07:55 AM

[quote="HahnSolo":1dztmvm3][quote="Benjamin Grimm":1dztmvm3] Do you realize he's currently third on the season list of Schaefer recipients for 2009?[/quote:1dztmvm3] Should we have an Anacin player of the year?[/quote:1dztmvm3] Due to how this season has made me feel, I'm thinking Alka Seltzer might be even more appropriate.

MFS62 Aug 25 2009 07:56 AM

[quote="Edgy DC":1s6k06jk] Is the prevalence of thumb fractures a training or a medical issue?[/quote:1s6k06jk] Or this? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaos_theory Later

themetfairy Aug 25 2009 08:00 AM

[quote="seawolf17":3izgyzml]CBS Sportsline reports that Luis Castillo, boating out in the Atlantic Ocean early this morning, was eaten by sharks.[/quote:3izgyzml] So there's some positive news this week....

Nymr83 Aug 25 2009 08:32 AM

[quote="Edgy DC":bb8cbeql][quote="Nymr83":bb8cbeql]I'd rather he gets it taken care of NOW so he has an extra 2 months to heal for 2010. Fire all the team doctors and trainers please, the "coincidences" are just mounting too quickly around here.[/quote:bb8cbeql] Is the prevalence of thumb fractures a training or a medical issue?[/quote:bb8cbeql] you're never going to be able to pin specific injuries to the doctors or training staff any more than you can say a team would be better with a different manager, but managers get fired when the team plays poorly so why not let medical staff go when the team can't stay on the field? edit- just to clarify i am not blaming the doctors for Francoeur's injury, but there have just been too many injuries. maybe they are partially to blame for cora's as they let him play when his thumb wasnt fully healed, and if they said "no" and he was allowed to play anyway then someone else (omar) needs to be fired for overruling doctors on a medical issue. Mets DL stints this year: Angel Pagan (3/27-5/16, 6/1-7/10) Tim Redding (3/27-5/18) Billy Wagner (3/27-8/20) Brian Schneider (4/17-5/30) Oliver Perez (5/3-7/8) Carlos Delgado (5/11-??) Alex Cora (5/18-6/2, 8/18-??) Jose Reyes (5/21-??) Ryan Church (5/23-6/7) Ramon Martinez (6/3-??) JJ Putz (6/5-??) John Maine (6/7-??) Fernando Martinez (7/4-??) Fernando Nieve (7/20-??) Gary Sheffield (7/18-8/2) Johnathan Niese (8/6-??) David Wright (8/16-??) and now Santana and Francoeur are hurt, who has escaped injury? Murphy, Castillo (i think he had a minor one but no dl-stint), Pelfrey, Stokes and Feliciano?

Edgy DC Aug 25 2009 08:38 AM

[quote="Nymr83"]you're never going to be able to pin specific injuries to the doctors or training staff any more than you can say a team would be better with a different manager

But pinning it on them is what you're doing.

but managers get fired when the team plays poorly so why not let medical staff go when the team can't stay on the field?

I certainly don't support ill-considered reasons for firing managers, or think guilt by association is enough.

Mets DL stints this year:

I haven't missed the extent of disabled list useage this season.

seawolf17 Aug 25 2009 08:40 AM

Only ten guys from the Opening Day roster have been here all year. Pelfrey Feliciano Sean Green Parnell F Rodriguez Stokes Castillo Murphy Reed Tatis

Benjamin Grimm Aug 25 2009 08:58 AM

Well, to be fair, Namor isn't pinning specific injuries to the medical staff. The Mets should, I think, bring in a third party to review the decisions made, both by the doctors and the people who are supposed to listen to the doctors, and see if the team was well served this year, and was just unlucky, or if there's something more. It's easy to say FIRE THEM ALL, and it's also easy to say that that's an overreaction. But it's also possible that somebody should be fired. A season-end review is certainly in order.

Edgy DC Aug 25 2009 09:09 AM

I certainly didn't suggest nobody should be fired. And yeah, I think firing people because of the injuries is pinning the injuries on such people. Maybe the doctors treated the players excellently, but the rehabilitative personnel did terribly. Maybe the rehabilitative therapists did their jobs, kept players on programs, but the coaches pushed the players out of their programs when they got into the mix. Maybe the trainers totally switched the training routines from 2008 --- something that's been suggested here based on a staff change from last offseason --- and the medical personnel did everything they could once the players started going down, but they were too badly damaged. Maybe the doctors gave wonderfully realistic prognoses that the HR staff wasn't realistic about at all. And maybe there are fissures within these staves. Maybe one trainer will be found to have continuously warned against the policies and procedures of a senior trainer, but had had his or her cries ignored, only to be bittersweetly justified by the rash of injuries. Maybe one of these things is true in one case, and another of these things is true in another case. And maybe none are true in any case. If you sweep everybody out indiscriminately, you never see where you went wrong hiring them in the first place, and you are prone to make the same mistakes in your next round of hires. "Evolution, not revolution." --- Miles Davis

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 25 2009 10:30 AM Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Aug 25 2009 10:39 AM

Forgot Redding. Damn. ROLL CALL Currently on DL: Beltran (Knee--Bone Bruise) Cora (Hand--Torn Ligaments) Delgado (Hip labral tear, strained oblique) Maine (Shoulder-- inflammation?) FMartinez (Knee-- meniscus tear) RMartinez (Finger-- torn ligament) Nieve (Leg-- quad tear) Niese (Hamstring-- tear) Putz (Elbow-- inflammation/cartilage issue?) Reyes (Hamstring-- strain/tear) Wright (Concussion) Previous DL time: Church (Neck-- strain) Pagan (2 stints: Groin-- strain; hamstring-- strain) Perez (Knee-- inflammation) Redding (Shoulder-- weakness/ache) Schneider (Back-- strained muscle) Sheffield (Hamstring-- strain) Wagner-- (Elbow-- recovery, TJ surgery) Missed time, no DL: Castillo (Ankle) Castro (Back?) Francoeur (Thumb-- torn ligament) Pelfrey (Forearm-- tendinitis) Santana (Back/Elbow) Anyone else missing? EDIT: Pagan's first stint on DL added.

Edgy DC Aug 25 2009 10:36 AM

It was a groin injury (and possibly further rehab for his post-op shoulder) that knocked Pagan out the first two months. He was also busted for failure to pay traffic fines.

Edgy DC Aug 25 2009 10:53 AM

Other injuries and ailments that didn't result in DL time: Marlon Anderson: turf toe Emil Brown: dyspepsia Andy Green: winter vomiting in August Darren O'Day: symptoms not unlike flu-like symptoms Jon Switzer: moral turpitude Daniel Murphy: acute and chronic deja vu Casey Fossum: banjo on the knee Nelson Figueroa: Rapid Eyebrow Growth Syndrome Nick Evans: crabs Ken Takahashi: ennui Angel Berroa: galloping knobrot Wilson Valdez: cabinetmakers disease Bobby Parnell: St. Vitus dance See, the trainers aren't getting the credit they deserve for who they kept on the field!

seawolf17 Aug 25 2009 12:14 PM

The most depressing part about that list is that I would love to have a thumper like Marlon Anderson in the middle of this lineup right now.

bmfc1 Aug 25 2009 01:00 PM

It never ends: Putz's rehab appearance for Brooklyn tonight has been postponed.

MFS62 Aug 25 2009 01:08 PM

[quote="bmfc1":1lfhkyny]It never ends: Putz's rehab appearance for Brooklyn tonight has been postponed.[/quote:1lfhkyny] The news leaked out? I thought whatever happens in Brooklyn stays in Brooklyn. Later

bmfc1 Aug 25 2009 01:26 PM

Not all injury news is bad: Ollie is going back to NY to have his knee checked. Maybe they'll sit him down for the rest of the year and hope he has his head together in the spring.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 25 2009 01:32 PM

[quote="bmfc1":3ewql8tp]Ollie is going back to NY to have his knee checked. [/quote:3ewql8tp] Geez, who will the starting 5 be for the rest of the year? If Oliver gets shut down, we're left with Pelfrey, Parnell, Redding, Figueroa, and...?

Vic Sage Aug 25 2009 01:33 PM

[quote="MFS62":26onnuib][quote="bmfc1":26onnuib]It never ends: Putz's rehab appearance for Brooklyn tonight has been postponed.[/quote:26onnuib] The news leaked out? I thought whatever happens in Brooklyn stays in Brooklyn. Later[/quote:26onnuib] well, I happened in Brooklyn, yet i managed an escape. so it is possible.

HahnSolo Aug 25 2009 01:42 PM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm"][quote="bmfc1"]Ollie is going back to NY to have his knee checked.

Geez, who will the starting 5 be for the rest of the year? If Oliver gets shut down, we're left with Pelfrey, Parnell, Redding, Figueroa, and...?

This guy would fit right in...



Plus, he's used to playing with dogs behind him.

bmfc1 Aug 25 2009 01:48 PM

I'm guessing Misch. He was used as a starter during at Buffalo. Amazing/pathetic that Redding is a definite starter when he was on the verge of being released and that Figueroa is a definite starter even though he was released by the Mets at least twice. And Misch was released by the Giants this season.

seawolf17 Aug 25 2009 02:03 PM

What does Lance Broadway have to do to get a callup? I know he hasn't exactly been a world-beater in AAA, but he's only 26 -- you have to give him a shot at some point, right?

metsguyinmichigan Aug 25 2009 02:03 PM

Why not give Broadway or Pettyjohn some starts? We know Redding's not going to be around next season, so at least give someone else a chance to show what they have. Maybe they were premature in cutting Livan loose.

TheOldMole Aug 25 2009 02:09 PM

Anyone predict at the beginning of the season how big this topic was going to be?

seawolf17 Aug 25 2009 02:11 PM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm"]Geez, who will the starting 5 be for the rest of the year? If Oliver gets shut down, we're left with Pelfrey, Parnell, Redding, Figueroa, and...?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 25 2009 02:26 PM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm"]Geez, who will the starting 5 be for the rest of the year? If Oliver gets shut down, we're left with Pelfrey, Parnell, Redding, Figueroa, and...?

I see you, Wolf, and raise you...

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 25 2009 03:11 PM

Johan to have season-ending surgery... to remove elbow bone chips. Back by spring training. (Phew.) And oh yeah-- as per Jerry's comments yesterday, Johan's been unable to take his throw days for close to 8 weeks now! So he's been pitching for nearly two months with elbow pain for a team that has been pretty much playing out the string since the All-Star break! I continue to have the utmost faith in and respect for this club's management team! UPDATED ROLL CALL Currently on DL: Beltran (Knee--Bone Bruise) Cora (Hand--Torn Ligaments) Delgado (Hip labral tear, strained oblique) Maine (Shoulder-- inflammation?) FMartinez (Knee-- meniscus tear) RMartinez (Finger-- torn ligament) Nieve (Leg-- quad tear) Niese (Hamstring-- tear) Putz (Elbow-- inflammation/cartilage issue?) Reyes (Hamstring-- strain/tear) Santana (Elbow-- bone chips) Wright (Concussion) Previous DL time: Church (Neck-- strain) Pagan (2 stints: Groin-- strain; hamstring-- strain) Perez (Knee-- inflammation) Redding (Shoulder-- weakness/ache) Schneider (Back-- strained muscle) Sheffield (Hamstring-- strain) Wagner-- (Elbow-- recovery, TJ surgery) Missed time, no DL: Castillo (Ankle) Castro (Back?) Francoeur (Thumb-- torn ligament) Pelfrey (Forearm-- tendinitis)

smg58 Aug 25 2009 04:00 PM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":sn99q1wo]And oh yeah-- as per Jerry's comments yesterday, Johan's been unable to take his throw days for close to 8 weeks now! So he's been pitching for nearly two months with elbow pain for a team that has been pretty much playing out the string since the All-Star break! I continue to have the utmost faith in and respect for this club's management team![/quote:sn99q1wo] Somebody at Fangraphs made essentially the same point. Unfortunately, it is a perfectly valid one. Misch is back up. With Sept. 1 around the corner, it is probably now safe for him to unpack. In other news, Putz' pitching session was cut short on Saturday due to "forearm discomfort." He has been shut down indefinitely. Sheesh, at least Wagner came back long enough to say goodbye.

Nymr83 Aug 25 2009 04:40 PM

this season has been dead for 2-3 months and the Mets kept trotting out their $100 million investment despite KNOWING he was hurt?? fire everyone who was involved in or even complicit in this decision. fuck this stupid franchise

metirish Aug 25 2009 04:43 PM

Imagine if this lot ran the country , it would be in a terrible mess.

Centerfield Aug 25 2009 05:04 PM

[quote="Nymr83":3kefksp2]this season has been dead for 2-3 months and the Mets kept trotting out their $100 million investment despite KNOWING he was hurt?? fire everyone who was involved in or even complicit in this decision. fuck this stupid franchise[/quote:3kefksp2] What he said. Except more emphatically and with more cursing.

Edgy DC Aug 25 2009 06:49 PM

Do we have any reason to believe that pitching wth bone chips was making it worse? Because I think I've read enough indefensible "fire everyone" declarations. I mean, I know it seems intuitive, but felix qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas, you know?

Nymr83 Aug 26 2009 01:29 AM

In other news, Putz' pitching session was cut short on Saturday due to "forearm discomfort." He has been shut down indefinitely they're now saying out for the year

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 26 2009 01:40 AM

[quote="Edgy DC"]Do we have any reason to believe that pitching wth bone chips was making it worse? Because I think I've read enough indefensible "fire everyone" declarations. I mean, I know it seems intuitive, but felix qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas, you know?

Not that it was making it worse, but it very well could. Repetitive pitching motions with bone chips in the joint can irritate the UCL, making problematic microtears-- and potentially, larger ones-- more likely.

Edgy DC Aug 26 2009 06:55 AM

Sure, but any kind of usage could be making it worse. The reality is that pitchers pitch in pain and hurt all the time. We know nothing of the particulars as to when the nature of the pain became apparent, what the degree of the injury is and where the placement of the chips were. And they were right to sit on it because the rush to judgment has become delerious. And the season has not been lost for two to three months.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 26 2009 07:40 AM

Certainly not. Three months ago it was May and the Mets were surging towards first place. I'd say it started feeling lost when the bad June turned into a bad July, with no signs of improvement. So I'd say it's been lost for, at most, about six weeks. (It just SEEMS like two or three months.)

dgwphotography Aug 26 2009 08:02 AM

It wasn't until about two weeks ago that I realized that there would be no miracle comeback, so I don't blame Santana at all for pitching as long as he did with this.

Centerfield Aug 26 2009 08:08 AM

If Johan Santana is not healthy enough to be throwing between starts, he should not be pitching. He has had too much pain to do so since the All-Star break, a time when we knew the season had been lost. Therefore, I think anyone involved in this decision to run him out there should be fired. It's incompetence to an incomprehensible level.

Edgy DC Aug 26 2009 08:24 AM

[quote="Centerfield":jelhoyc6]If Johan Santana is not healthy enough to be throwing between starts, he should not be pitching.[/quote:jelhoyc6] Do you have any idea how many pitchers at any given time are being held off from regular work between starts?

Centerfield Aug 26 2009 08:40 AM

No, but I imagine it's quite a few. And I realize not all of them are shut down, but if the pitcher is Johan Santana, and you've got him signed for a bizzillion dollars, and you are out of the pennant race, and the problem persists for six weeks, then it goes beyond the realm of defensible decisions. For me anyway. I'm surprised to see so many that do not agree.

Edgy DC Aug 26 2009 09:13 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 26 2009 09:23 AM

Well, it's easy to work backwards. The season is lost now, so one can make a logical argument that he never should have thrown an inning. But going forward is much harder to do, and a team has to constantly weigh risks against rewards, constantly trying to quantify the key factors --- "Is he feeling better? How much better? Is there risk that he's doing damage? How much risk? Has the likeihood of saving the season fallen since yesterday? How are our rehabbies doing?" You go into a season with a one-in-30 shot. Who would logically put any multi-million bets on such a gamble? But they do and that's the business.

seawolf17 Aug 26 2009 09:20 AM

And in defense of letting him pitch -- as of the break, the Mets were only six and a half games away from the division and the WC. One hot streak, and this team was back in it. That was before Bernazard, before we realized that none of the injured guys were coming back -- there was still a chance there, and shutting him down then would have been suicide. We would have been going crazy here, ripping them up and down. At least he's shut down now, when it really doesn't matter any more.

Centerfield Aug 26 2009 09:38 AM

As of August 4, the team was 10 games back of the division. They were 9 out of the Wild Card with 8 teams in front of them. They were, effectively, out of both races. At that point, Johan Santana had been in sufficient pain that he was unable to do his throwing session after his last three starts. However, they ran him out there four more times. We're arguing over opinion here, so obviously your mileage may vary. But I cannot see how anyone would justify allowing Santana to make his start on August 4. Much less three more starts after that.

smg58 Aug 26 2009 09:56 AM

[quote="seawolf17"]That was before Bernazard, before we realized that none of the injured guys were coming back -- there was still a chance there, and shutting him down then would have been suicide.

We might not have known that none of the guys were coming back, but they presumably knew more than we did. The ASB might have been too early, but the writing was on the wall by the deadline, and if they had reasons to have long-term concerns regarding Johan at that point they should have addressed them at that point.

Edgy DC Aug 26 2009 10:13 AM

So, we're to hang them for what they might have known?

SteveJRogers Aug 26 2009 10:27 AM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"][quote="Benjamin Grimm"]Geez, who will the starting 5 be for the rest of the year? If Oliver gets shut down, we're left with Pelfrey, Parnell, Redding, Figueroa, and...?

I see you, Wolf, and raise you...


Hmmm, I saw three guys on Saturday night that the Mets might want to take a flyer on

themetfairy Aug 26 2009 10:33 AM

[quote="dgwphotography":3tsu9dje]It wasn't until about two weeks ago that I realized that there would be no miracle comeback, so I don't blame Santana at all for pitching as long as he did with this.[/quote:3tsu9dje] No miracle comeback?

seawolf17 Aug 26 2009 10:52 AM

Centerfield Aug 26 2009 12:04 PM

[quote="Edgy DC"]So, we're to hang them for what they might have known?

I know you're addressing smg, but to be clear, my point was that they should be hanged (hung?) for what they did know.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 26 2009 01:41 PM

[quote="Centerfield"][quote="Edgy DC"]So, we're to hang them for what they might have known?

I know you're addressing smg, but to be clear, my point was that they should be hanged (hung?) for what they did know.

You got it, CF. As my eighth grade English teacher used to say: people are hanged; clothes are hung.

Frankly, I'm kind of past automatic grant of benefit-of-the-doubt for Omar and Company. While I'm not exactly calling for heads to roll when I hear something like the pitching-with-an-injury business, I've been conditioned to expect the worst. Hell, they've done most of the conditioning; how much should one expect from a leadership that can't even seem to handle a straightforward, for-cause firing without a cross-country fiasco or a burst of scattershot accusations?

When I hear something that amounts to "just trust us" from this front office, I don't. Not any longer. The most I can muster, really, is polite wariness.

seawolf17 Aug 26 2009 01:43 PM

Burkhardt reporting that they're shutting down Ollie for knee surgery. You really can't make this stuff up.

bmfc1 Aug 26 2009 01:44 PM

Ollie to the DL. Done for the year.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 26 2009 01:45 PM

Unreal.

metsmarathon Aug 26 2009 01:46 PM

[quote="bmfc1":3jmfc6ht]Ollie to the DL. Done for the year.[/quote:3jmfc6ht] hey, lookathat, an injury that can make us happy!

seawolf17 Aug 26 2009 01:46 PM

It's okay; they're calling up Misch again to replace him. There will be two of him on the roster, since they already called him up the other day, but it's much easier that way, because it's one less person to worry about getting hurt, and as a bonus, because he's on the roster twice, you can use him out of the bullpen twice in one game.

Edgy DC Aug 26 2009 01:46 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 26 2009 01:58 PM

If we've got to go back to Willie Randolph, we're trying too hard. It's a tough game. As for Ollie, good.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 26 2009 01:49 PM

[quote="Edgy DC":3a9rru8k]If we've got to go back to Willie Randolph, we're trying too hard.[/quote:3a9rru8k] It's a little facile, yes. And yeah, there's stuff that has bugged me more. But it's a brick in the wall.

bmfc1 Aug 26 2009 02:04 PM

I expected this one--no need for him to go out and get lit up anymore this year. Let him go go home and get his head, such as it is, together for ST. The Mets current rotation: Pelfrey Figueroa--released earlier this year Misch (probably)--released earlier this year by SF Redding--demoted from the rotation earlier this year and then almost released Parnell--a middle inning reliever at the start of the year.

Edgy DC Aug 27 2009 12:19 PM

J.R. Watkins Apothecary Liniment Topical Pain Reliever has disappointed me for the last time. Curse you, J.R. Watkins.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 27 2009 03:42 PM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"] Frankly, I'm kind of past automatic grant of benefit-of-the-doubt for Omar and Company. While I'm not exactly calling for heads to roll when I hear something like the pitching-with-an-injury business, I've been conditioned to expect the worst. Hell, they've done most of the conditioning; how much should one expect from a leadership that can't even seem to handle a straightforward, for-cause firing without a cross-country fiasco or a burst of scattershot accusations? When I hear something that amounts to "just trust us" from this front office, I don't. Not any longer. The most I can muster, really, is polite wariness.

This is the kind of stuff I was talking about, Edge. YouknowwhatI'msayin?

In his latest public slip-up, Minaya seemed to forget that Santana, his $137.5 million ace, had elbow problems in February and early March that jeopardized his availability for the start of the season. That happened “such a long time ago,” said Minaya, who added that he “did not remember that part” when asked whether he regretted not giving Santana a magnetic resonance imaging test in spring training.

Also, this, from Sherman. (Yeah, I know. But it's true.)

Because in that brief period, Minaya revealed he did not remember Santana had an elbow injury in spring that nearly cost him an Opening Day start. "Spring training ... was such a long time ago," he said. Yeah, it was about 20 inexplicable injuries ago. Minaya said he could not remember what the All-Star break medical evaluation of Santana's sore elbow showed. And he also said he had a call in, but had yet to talk to Santana about the results of yesterday's test.

Either you believe him-- and he's an incompetent/has the memory of a fruit fly with a head injury-- or you don't, and he's a liar/just terrible at managing expectations and communicating plans-- as they are-- to the general public. Either way... he can't be the public face of a respectable organization. But he is... and, so, he isn't.

MFS62 Aug 28 2009 07:14 AM

And from the "Oh Shit! Why not?" category: MIAMI - Jose Reyes may be the next Met in line for surgery, joining Johan Santana and Oliver Perez on operating tables in the coming days. Reyes, who has not appeared in a major-league game since pulling himself from a May20 game at Dodger Stadium, has a completely torn hamstring tendon behind his right knee, a source confirmed to the Daily News. While hardly ideal, surgery is not necessarily as ominous as it might sound. That tendon is expendable, and is sometimes partly removed and inserted into the elbow when a pitcher undergoes Tommy John surgery. The Mets aren't resigned to Reyes undergoing surgery just yet, although the decision is looming. Reyes, who is presumed to be out for the year, continues to get treatment, with physical therapists trying to break up scar tissue that is irritating the severed tendon and causing significant pain. Reyes was suffering from bursitis early in the season and eventually suffered a hamstring tendon strain. That injury became further irritated when Reyes tried to run full-throttle to first base during a June 3 extended spring training game in Port St. Lucie. It is believed that Reyes subsequently fully tore the tendon, the scar tissue and inflammation are aggravating the tendon. Surgery should be able to alleviate the discomfort and allow Reyes to return unimpeded next season. Reyes, 26, was tormented by leg problems early in his career, which is one of the reasons why he signed a four-year, $23.25 million contract in August 2006. That deal is guaranteed through next season, with a team option for 2011 at $11 million. His salary leaps from $5.75 million this year to $9 million in 2010. The shortstop will finish this season with the fewest at-bats in his career (147). He is coming off consecutive seasons in which he produced the top two plate-appearance totals in franchise history, with 765 and 763, respectively. The next-highest total is Felix Millan's 743 in 1975. Six other players have started at shortstop for the Mets this season: Alex Cora (54 games), Anderson Hernandez (15), Ramon Martinez (nine), Wilson Valdez (eight), Angel Berroa (six) and Argenis Reyes (one). Cora also is lost for the year. He underwent surgery to repair a torn ligament in his right thumb last week, and will undergo the same procedure for a torn ligament in his left thumb in a month. Without Reyes in the lineup, the Mets are getting the worst production in the league from the leadoff spot. The team's No. 1 hitters this season, including Reyes, have combined to score a National League-low 68 runs. Mets shortstops have scored only 50 runs, ahead of only Pittsburgh, and are batting .241. Leadoff man Angel Pagan went 2-for-4 with three runs in yesterday's 10-3 win over the Marlins, while shortstop Wilson Valdez had two hits and scored twice. Reyes is one of 13 Mets on the disabled list. Already this week, the Mets announced Santana will have arthroscopic surgery to remove bone chips from his left elbow and Perez will undergo a procedure to clean out his right knee. http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseb ... z0PTnbbXKZ Did we expect anything else? Later

seawolf17 Aug 28 2009 07:18 AM

[quote="Edgy DC":32dkvap2]J.R. Watkins Apothecary Liniment Topical Pain Reliever has disappointed me for the last time. Curse you, J.R. Watkins.[/quote:32dkvap2] Sonovabitch! Why hasn't anyone raised this issue? We should storm their headquarters and take Mr. Watkins hostage.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 28 2009 07:39 AM

[quote="MFS62"] MIAMI - Jose Reyes may be the next Met in line for surgery, joining Johan Santana and Oliver Perez on operating tables in the coming days.

At least they're not waiting until, say, March, for him to have the surgery.

Did you see the quote from Jerry Manuel about how when David Wright comes back, he's only going to play every other day?

[quote="David Lennon"]Wright argued about going on the DL, and now the manager expects another fight on his hands.

"It will be Ali-Frazier," Manuel said. "But I'm Ali."

Geez, Jerry. Shut up!

I liked Jerry last year, but I'm getting really sick of his act.

metirish Aug 28 2009 07:48 AM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm"][quote="MFS62"] MIAMI - Jose Reyes may be the next Met in line for surgery, joining Johan Santana and Oliver Perez on operating tables in the coming days.

At least they're not waiting until, say, March, for him to have the surgery.

Did you see the quote from Jerry Manuel about how when David Wright comes back, he's only going to play every other day?

[quote="David Lennon"]Wright argued about going on the DL, and now the manager expects another fight on his hands.

"It will be Ali-Frazier," Manuel said. "But I'm Ali."

Geez, Jerry. Shut up!

I liked Jerry last year, but I'm getting really sick of his act.


Yeah I tired of it early in the season....

RealityChuck Aug 28 2009 11:39 AM

The thing is, with all this complaints about how the Mets handled injuries this year, it's unlikely that anything they did made things worse. Even if the key players were put on the DL immediately each time, the lineup in July and August would have been the same as it was. Consider: 1. Delgado. Hip injury that required surgery. If he had gotten surgery immediately, he'd possibly be close to being able to return now (or maybe not). But it's far too late for him. 2. Reyes. His injury was originally a sprain. He could have gone on the DL earlier, but the sprain was not why he hasn't returned. The injury to his leg when he was on the DL is what's kept him out, and that was diagnosed and treated immediately. In any case, he'd still be out. 3. Beltran. He could have gone on the DL sooner, but at that rate he still would have missed most of June, July, and August and might be able to play in September. It's possible he injured himself more by not going on the DL sooner, but he'd still have been out a couple of months. As an aside, the fact that he went to an outside specialist is given as a sign the Mets's medical staff is not to be trusted. But the outside specialist came to the same conclusion as they did. Obviously, the Mets diagnosed things correctly. 4. Wright. No one has any problems with how this was handled. BTW, the comparison to Church was bogus -- Church's problems were due to his second concussion; after his first, he had an OPS of .913 and was tearing up the league. Wright certainly bears watching -- you're more prone to concussions once you have had one -- but if there's a parallel, he's going to do quite well in September and no one was complaining about Church's treatment after the first concussion. 5. Santana. Bone chips are weird things; they float around. You can pitch without pain even when you have them and on another day, be unable to throw. The team's wait-and-see was not unreasonable. But shutting him down for surgery at the all-star break would certainly have made the team worse, and would have ended his season. Ultimately, he and the team would be in the same position in either case. 6. Alex Cora. Not a star, but consider: July 15: Cora's a gutsy player who continues to play hurt. We need more players like him. August 15: The Mets mismanage an injury again. Raise your hands if you took issue to Cora's treatment before August. 7. Oliver Perez. Was put on the DL after a couple of bad starts. Came back, pitched badly, but seemed to be improving before his knee failed. In any case, he wouldn't have been available in June, July, and August after knee surgey. 8. John Maine. Again, he wouldn't have been back in time to make a difference. 9. Jonathan Niese. Joined the team when it was in free-fall; no one can complain about how the team handled his injury. 10. J.J. Putz -- pitched effectively until May 31 -- batters were hitting .200 against him and he had 9 holds, three saves and only one blown save. Is that when you shut him down? His next three appearances were disasters, however, and he went on the DL. So it is highly unlikely the team would have had these players available (and would have missed Santana) in June and July when the season fell apart. Another argument is that all these injuries were due to bad training methods. Possible, but in order to back that up, you need to indicate how Mets training methods differed from other team's and from how they differed from the methods used in previous years. If they are using similar regimens to the Red Sox, say, what's wrong with their methods?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 28 2009 11:58 AM

[quote="seawolf17":1ahrqiwy][quote="Edgy DC":1ahrqiwy]J.R. Watkins Apothecary Liniment Topical Pain Reliever has disappointed me for the last time. Curse you, J.R. Watkins.[/quote:1ahrqiwy] Sonovabitch! Why hasn't anyone raised this issue? We should storm their headquarters and take Mr. Watkins hostage.[/quote:1ahrqiwy] What they don't tell you in the radio ads: The secret ingredient in J.R. Watkins Liniment... is Caribbean human cartilage!

PiggiesTomatoes Aug 28 2009 08:41 PM

A.P. reports today that Reyes may need surgery to repair the hamstring tendon. If that's the case, somebody's fucking head has to roll. This shit should have been handled long ago, and I don't want to hear any bullshit about having him trying to work through the injury.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 29 2009 05:53 AM

[quote="BEN SHPIGEL, N.Y. Times":3poimz35]Any surgery is expected to be minor because the tendon itself is nonessential, sometimes removed to replace a torn ligament in reconstructive elbow surgery. An operation would still allow Reyes to be ready by spring training.[/quote:3poimz35]

Edgy DC Aug 29 2009 10:05 AM

It's a forum. You're going to hear (or read) differing opinions whether you want to or not.

PiggiesTomatoes Aug 29 2009 02:14 PM

[quote="Edgy DC":153mwm7z]It's a forum. You're going to hear (or read) differing opinions whether you want to or not.[/quote:153mwm7z] I understand how the forums work but thanks for the clarification anyway. The words I used were meant as a rhetorical device, not a demand of other forum participants.

smg58 Aug 29 2009 05:08 PM

I really don't like the idea of playing Wright on alternating days. Either he's healthy enough to play, or he isn't. Regarding Putz, I said this on May 14: "Putz has 20 innings in 33 games. That's a ridiculous workload to give a reliever coming off an injury. You have to protect your relievers sometimes too." So yes, I do think Manuel has to take some responsibility for what happened in his case.

Ashie62 Aug 29 2009 07:44 PM

[quote="PiggiesTomatoes":1pca9vrx]A.P. reports today that Reyes may need surgery to repair the hamstring tendon. If that's the case, somebody's fucking head has to roll. This shit should have been handled long ago, and I don't want to hear any bullshit about having him trying to work through the injury.[/quote:1pca9vrx] I share your frustraton and anger but am now quietly resigned from this mess of a season and await what I will be a very quiet Mets off-season. As in..Hope the wounded heal and a couple of fill-ins..no butter

Edgy DC Aug 29 2009 10:18 PM

I agree that Jerry has been going nuts with his relievers. And Putz was the start of it. Find who has the hot hand, and grind him until he's cold... or hurt. That's been Jerry's motto. I don't know what Stokes was doing in yesterday's game, but it was his third in a row and sixth in the Mets' last eight. Like, ugh, like.

themetfairy Aug 30 2009 05:53 AM

Whatever happened to John Maine? Wasn't he supposed to be back after the All Star Break?

seawolf17 Aug 30 2009 10:25 AM

[quote="themetfairy":2oww376b]Whatever happened to John Maine? Wasn't he supposed to be back after the All Star Break?[/quote:2oww376b] The NHL All-Star Break.

dgwphotography Aug 31 2009 07:19 PM

From Adam Rubin's blog: Johan Santana and Oliver Perez will undergo their surgeries Tuesday. I can see them operating on Santana's knee, and Perez' elbow....

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 31 2009 11:52 PM

Beltran cleared for rehab without a knee brace. The team hasn't publicly ruled out duct tape, fun-tack or Polident.

Centerfield Sep 01 2009 09:44 AM

[quote="dgwphotography"]From Adam Rubin's blog: Johan Santana and Oliver Perez will undergo their surgeries Tuesday. I can see them operating on Santana's knee, and Perez' elbow....

BoC!!!

Centerfield Sep 01 2009 09:49 AM

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"]Beltran cleared for rehab without a knee brace. The team hasn't publicly ruled out duct tape, fun-tack or Polident.

Maybe I'm just paranoid, but I'd feel a lot better if that article had more information.

He took an MRI this week. What did that show? Is his bone bruise gone?

Did Dr. Altcheck check the cartilage in his knee? Does it look like he'll be healthy? Or are we going to see another bone bruise inevitably?

Swan Swan H Sep 01 2009 10:03 AM

[quote="Centerfield"][quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"]Beltran cleared for rehab without a knee brace. The team hasn't publicly ruled out duct tape, fun-tack or Polident.

Maybe I'm just paranoid, but I'd feel a lot better if that article had more information.

He took an MRI this week. What did that show? Is his bone bruise gone?

Did Dr. Altcheck check the cartilage in his knee? Does it look like he'll be healthy? Or are we going to see another bone bruise inevitably?

And what about Naomi? For the answers to these and other burning sensations tune in tomorrow, same time, same channel, for "David Altcheck, Special Surgeon"

Gwreck Sep 03 2009 08:38 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

Beltran 1-3 (RBI Single) with walk and K in Brooklyn last night, playing as DH.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Sep 04 2009 01:45 PM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

A map of our pain(thanks to talented/enterprising graphic designer Sean Englehardt).

metirish Sep 04 2009 02:17 PM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

Nice work but tough to look at as it is very big.

Edgy DC Sep 04 2009 03:07 PM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

Thereby setting up Fman to swing in with the ol' "That's what she said."

PiggiesTomatoes Sep 04 2009 06:43 PM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

That's great. A graphical representation of our pain this year. Great job, Sean!

Benjamin Grimm Sep 10 2009 06:51 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

According to the Daily News this morning, there's a chance (although probably a very slim one) that both Reyes and Delgado will return to play for the Mets before the season ends.

Farmer Ted Sep 15 2009 04:35 PM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

The Mets medical staff is soooo bad, that dolphin face still uses the Mets docs. Interesting indeed. HOUSTON (AP) -- The Houston Astros say left-handed starting pitcher Mike Hampton will miss next season after undergoing surgery on his left shoulder. A statement issued by the Astros on Tuesday say surgeons at the Hospital for Special Surgery in New York repaired a full left rotator cuff tear in Hampton's pitching shoulder. Dr. David Altchek, the New York Mets' medical director, also repaired partial damage to the labrum in the shoulder. The 37-year-old lefty was 7-10 in 21 starts this season with a 5.30 ERA in 112 innings. He's 148-115 in 409 career appearances with a 4.07 ERA in 2,264 career innings.

metirish Sep 15 2009 04:58 PM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

I give Mike some credit for constantly battling back from serious injuries, got to be more than money driving him on.

Edgy DC Sep 15 2009 09:26 PM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

Altcheck is respected throughout the sport. Many teams and individual players consult with him, including the Yankees.

MFS62 Sep 16 2009 07:07 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

[quote="Edgy DC":1imy919d]Altcheck is respected throughout the sport. Many teams and individual players consult with him, including the Yankees.[/quote:1imy919d] But Hampton wouldn't go to him until he confirmed that Altchech wasn't educated in New York. (SM=96) Later

Centerfield Sep 16 2009 07:27 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

You guys are dumb. It's obviously because he sees Altcheck that his shoulder is screwed up.

The Second Spitter Sep 16 2009 07:41 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

[quote="MFS62":947vrjri][quote="Edgy DC":947vrjri]Altcheck is respected throughout the sport. Many teams and individual players consult with him, including the Yankees.[/quote:947vrjri] But Hampton wouldn't go to him until he confirmed that Altchech wasn't educated in New York. (SM=96) [/quote:947vrjri] I was actually going ask whether Altcheck earned his medical qualifications in Colorado , but was afraid my contribution would find its way onto this thread; http://cranepoolforum.net/phpbb2/viewto ... f9bd8659dc Which, admittedly, is my favorite thread from 2008 (discovered only quite recently while trying to Google something else).....but I did miss a fair few that year.

Benjamin Grimm Sep 16 2009 07:41 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

[quote="Centerfield"]You guys are dumb. It's obviously because he sees Altcheck that his shoulder is screwed up.

Hah! I bet he let Jeff Wilpon operate on his shoulder!

It's funny because I'm blaming Jeff Wilpon!

Benjamin Grimm Sep 16 2009 07:44 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

[quote="Triple Dee":3p4j4458]I was actually going ask whether Altcheck earned his medical qualifications in Colorado , but was afraid my contribution would find its way onto this thread; http://cranepoolforum.net/phpbb2/viewto ... f9bd8659dc [/quote:3p4j4458] That link may not be working for much longer. You can view the same thread in its permanent home here: http://archives.cranepoolforum.net/1040 ... 0459.shtml

Edgy DC Sep 16 2009 07:51 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

Wow, pulling up a thread where I claim folks have nothing on Bernazard. Ouch.

metirish Sep 21 2009 09:21 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

On Reyes Jerry Manuel is happy Carlos Beltran is back, even if on a limited schedule, because the Mets' manager doesn't have to wait until spring training to evaluate him. That's not the case with Jose Reyes, who hasn't played since May 20 and might need offseason surgery to repair a torn hamstring. "As we sit here today, I would have to say yes, [Reyes] would be a question [for spring training]," Manuel said Sunday. "Because I haven't seen him run, I haven't seen all those things, so that's still a question for me. What I would like to do is know that he's healthy, that he's 100 percent. That's the whole key for me . . . Spring training becomes a very important time for him versus what it has been in the last few years." Manuel said Reyes' injury - of all the Mets have suffered this season - is the most troubling to him. "Just the length of time for what we thought was [a minor injury]," he said. "That was probably our toughest one in terms of the uncertainty of it and the expectation. We'd say, 'Well, at least I know I'll have him after the [All-Star] break. At least I know I'll have him in August. At least I know I can get to see him in September.' " Now he'll get to see him in February. He hopes. Beltran went 2-for-4 with an RBI in the Mets' 6-2 win over the Nationals. He took Saturday off after playing Friday night.

Benjamin Grimm Sep 21 2009 09:27 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

Meanwhile, Pedro Martinez is injured in Philadelphia. While he was pitching he felt something in his neck and removed himself from the game. Raise your hand if you're at all surprised by this.

Centerfield Sep 21 2009 10:27 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

Interesting. So we should be expecting a flood of mea culpas from all those columnists who said the Mets were stupid last week. Any day now. Um. Maybe tomorrow.

metsguyinmichigan Sep 21 2009 11:04 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries) Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Sep 21 2009 12:00 PM

[quote="Centerfield"]Interesting. So we should be expecting a flood of mea culpas from all those columnists who said the Mets were stupid last week. Any day now. Um. Maybe tomorrow.

Verducci version: "Gutty Pedro shows Jeter-like determination by playing injured to help Phils stick it to Mets"

Klapisch: "Pedro's injury show's how incompetent Mets training staff turned him into damaged goods."

Wallace Matthews: "Pedro could have been in better shape had he been with Mets all season, but team beset by Tarp Field, Madoff money woes denied him the chance."

Adam Rubin: "Had I been director of player development, I'd have known that Pedro was good for only a handful of key starts."

seawolf17 Sep 21 2009 11:49 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

I'd bet your Klapisch line is closest to what we'd actually see. Something along those lines.

metirish Sep 21 2009 12:04 PM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

According to reports online Pedro should take his rotation turn come Friday....apparently he pulled a neck muscle swinging at an 0-2 pitch and oulled himself after throwing a warmup pitch when he took the mound. Pedro lost the 100th game of his career that night .

Benjamin Grimm Sep 21 2009 12:23 PM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

I had heard that his head literally rolled off his neck, leading to a panicky search in the clubhouse. The bat boy eventually found it under a chair, and everyone had a good laugh. At least, that's what I heard. And now that it's been posted on the Internet, it must be true.

MFS62 Sep 21 2009 12:37 PM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

[quote="metirish"]On Reyes Jerry Manuel is happy Carlos Beltran is back, even if on a limited schedule, because the Mets' manager doesn't have to wait until spring training to evaluate him. That's not the case with Jose Reyes, who hasn't played since May 20 and might need offseason surgery to repair a torn hamstring.

Now its being reported that he might need surgery on his hamstring?
It seems like Aaron Boone recovered quicker from open heart surgery. (OK, maybe I'm off by a few months, my life clock damaged by sarcasm.)

Later

Ashie62 Sep 21 2009 04:17 PM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

Good Lord..shortstop mystery ALL winter long. Hope they can find an SS quick if need be in the Spring..An Orlando Cabrera type, or Lugo Not ideal, but what else can they do if Reyes comes up lame?

Benjamin Grimm Sep 22 2009 06:14 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

Jose, quoted in the Daily News this morning, is still hoping to play in a game or two before the season ends. If that doesn't work out, then he'll get the surgery, which is said to require two months of recovery time.

metirish Sep 22 2009 06:30 AM Re: You're Entering A World of Pain (2009 Injuries)

Reading the article this struck me .... Reyes admitted he might finally relent and undergo surgery for what has been diagnosed as a torn hamstring tendon. I'm sure everyone from Jose to Minaya and the rest are involved in the decisions but that line from Rubin that Reyes might relent to surgery has me thinking that they want him to have it and he has yet to relent.