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The Fate of Umpiring

Kong76 Oct 22 2009 06:46 PM

It's almost like they're blowing calls on purpose so they can next expand the instant replay rules to include new things without the umpires coming out and saying they're ok with it. Gone are the days of, "get some glasses, Blue" ... Just go to the booth?

Kong76 Oct 22 2009 06:47 PM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

And I brought it up a minute or two before they did on the telecast!

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Oct 22 2009 06:49 PM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

[quote="Kong76":s9seuxlm]And I brought it up a minute or two before they did on the telecast![/quote:s9seuxlm] That was freaky. QUICK, START TALKING ABOUT A-ROD'S WENIS FALLING OFF!

metirish Oct 22 2009 06:53 PM Re: The Fate of Umpiring Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Oct 22 2009 06:59 PM

Some of these umpires are rather ripe aren't they?, in the 12 years I've been watching the game it seems like it has been the same guys. I doubt the umpires want more reviews as it might make their numbers shrink in the long term.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Oct 22 2009 06:55 PM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

[quote="metirish":yq2dg17y]Some of these umpires are rather ripe aren't they?, in the 12 years I've been watching the game it seems like it has been the same guys. I doubt the umpires want more reviews as it might make there numbers shrink in the long term.[/quote:yq2dg17y] The smart ones do, realizing it gets them off the hot seat. Done right, it doesn't have to be a team thing. Have the crew chief handle his business, with alacrity. Like football, one guy, one minute, call made or not.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Oct 22 2009 09:39 PM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

I don't think more instant replay is warranted or a good idea. The umps liked replay on HR calls because they're next to impossible to call correctly from such a distance and often they have other things they're required to focus on than the flight of a ball during a play.

Frayed Knot Oct 22 2009 09:47 PM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

Instant replay reviews are always much smoother in imagining than in implementation. Like football, one guy, one minute, call made or not. Has a football replay call EVER been made inside one minute? They have a rule that states 90 seconds (I think) but even the seemingly simple ones frequently take 2 minutes or 3 (or more).

Edgy DC Oct 22 2009 10:07 PM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

Reform can start by positioning the extra offseason umps all the way back at the wall. What the extra perspective should actually bring to the table are [list:2npyi56k][*:2npyi56k]A better perspective on which balls cleared the outfield wall,[/*:m:2npyi56k] [*:2npyi56k]A better perspective on which balls stayed inside the foul post and which went outside,[/*:m:2npyi56k] [*:2npyi56k]A better perspective on fair/foul balls that hit behind the outfielder.[/*:m:2npyi56k][/list:u:2npyi56k] All three are best called by positioning yourself where the wall meets the foul line. The first and third umps don't need their help on fair-foul calls that hit in front of the outfielders, and they're not much help to the second base ump on trap-catch calls. Stick them back against the wall and buy them a couple of franks.

Frayed Knot Oct 23 2009 07:02 AM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

The umps actually claim that further distance (to an extent obviously) gives them a better perspective on foul pole hits than does closer up (kind of like McClellen the other day with the botched tag-up call) even if in short foul line parks (like YS III) the OF umps look like they're breathing down the backs of their 1st & 3rd base buddies. Having those extra guys also might cause as many problems as they solve; umpires aren't used to working with the larger crew so it can occasionally screw up their assignment and rotation system on batted balls leaving veterans used to doing things a particular way unsure of where to go.

metirish Oct 23 2009 07:12 AM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

Umpire News ANAHEIM - Major League Baseball has responded to the slew of bad umpiring calls this postseason by selecting a crew of only veterans to work this year's World Series. In 24 of the last 25 Fall Classics, at least one umpire on the six-man crew was working his first World Series. In each of the last five, at least two of the six were working their first World Series. The past two years, three of six were first-timers. C.B. Bucknor, who worked Thursday night's Game 5 of the ALCS, was slated to work the World Series for the first time this season, but The Associated Press cited an unnamed source saying he had been removed after making two erroneous calls at first base in Game 1 of the AL division series between the Angels and Red Sox. The news service said three longtime crew chiefs - Joe West, Dana DeMuth and Gerry Davis - will be on the six-man crew. They will be joined by Brian Gorman, Jeff Nelson and Mike Everitt. World Series umpires are chosen from the pool of 24 umpires who work in the first round, with those two dozen picked on merit. ALCS and NLCS umpires aren't in play, because umps don't work in consecutive rounds of the postseason. According to VP of umpiring Mike Port, MLB's front office gets a recommendation from his staff. It is considered in the selection process. However, even umps with the best track records make mistakes in big games. Tim McClelland blew the call at third base in Game 4 of the ALCS when neither Robinson Cano nor Jorge Posada was on third base and Angels catcher Mike Napoli tagged them both. McClelland called only Posada out. In that same game, McClelland ruled that Nick Swisher had left early on a sacrifice fly when replays showed that he had not. Earlier in that inning, umpire Dale Scott called Swisher safe on a pickoff play when replays showed him to be out. Sources told the Daily News that MLB is so red-faced about the rash of mistaken calls that McClelland was forbidden to give an interview to Dan Patrick's nationally broadcast radio show. With News Wire Services

Edgy DC Oct 23 2009 07:23 AM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

I'm pretty certain that it causes as many problems as it solves. As for only veterans, that solves, um, nothing. I mean, Tim F'in' McClellan.

Frayed Knot Oct 23 2009 08:06 AM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

The funny part is that most if not all of the stories dealing with umpiring this week have used some form of the -- Tim McClennen is considered one of the best umpires in baseball -- qualifier. The problem with the umpire post-season rotation system is that it doesn't always select the best umps because ... that's not really what it's designed to do! The umpires union - acting the way unions often do - long took the stance that all umps are equal so any kind of 'merit system' which determines that one umpire is better than any other is inherently wrong and therefore unfair. The self-destruction of the old union which resulted in MLB having more control than they did in the old days ended that orthodoxy, at least on an absolute basis, although the resultant process is a kind of compromise which retains some of the old attitude. There is now a merit system of sorts but one that works with a rotation dictating several provisions, including ones that say that no ump gets to work more than one post-season in a row (so as to spread the wealth); that umpires working a WS one year can't work it again the next (ditto); and that all umps will eventually get some post-season work whether they rate highly on their evaluations or not (a remnant of the: 'we're all equals and you can't say otherwise' philosophy). So yeah the umps working in October have supposedly earned their way on, although all those qualifiers waters down the 'get the best guys in there when it matters' goal to the point where it's only partially true. Sounds like with CB Bucknor (about whom Gammons said last week: 'I don't know why he's even out there') MLB is making an example of him so as to make it appear that they're taking action.

Edgy DC Oct 23 2009 09:07 AM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

some form of the -- Tim McClennen is considered one of the best umpires in baseball -- qualifier. I don't want to beat up on McC. when he's down, but isn't this just a falsely objective way of saying, "He's been around for a while, everybody seems to like him, and I don't want to beat up on him when he's down." I mean, I'm certain that phrase has been written or uttered the last two nights by folks who have no idea who the best umpires in baseball are. I certainly know that I don't know who they are. I'm a fan and I mostly notice umps when they screw up.

Frayed Knot Oct 23 2009 11:50 AM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

[quote="Edgy DC"] some form of the -- Tim McClennen is considered one of the best umpires in baseball -- qualifier. I don't want to beat up on McC. when he's down, but isn't this just a falsely objective way of saying, "He's been around for a while, everybody seems to like him, and I don't want to beat up on him when he's down." I mean, I'm certain that phrase has been written or uttered the last two nights by folks who have no idea who the best umpires in baseball are. I certainly know that I don't know who they are. I'm a fan and I mostly notice umps when they screw up.

I seem to remember at least some of the comments coming from insiders who seemed to sincerely believe he was considered among the best by those on the field - - and I'm just as sure that some of it came via know-nothings equating longest-lasting with best-out-there or simply repeating what they heard the others say and passing it off as some kind of insider knowledge.

The disturbing part to me about the McClellan calls was that he seemed lazy on both of them; out of position on the tag-up play and then making no attempt to see what was going on past the tangle of legs at 3rd base on the other.

metirish Oct 24 2009 07:20 PM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

I'm watching 1993 WS highlights on MLB and Tim McClelland & Dana DeMuth are working the game, Paul Runge ,Dave Phillips & Charlie Williams are the others.

Frayed Knot Oct 25 2009 07:36 AM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

Mike Vaccaro in Sunday's NY Post: "Tim McClelland is considered by many to be the best umpire in the world."

Edgy DC Oct 25 2009 07:57 PM Re: The Fate of Umpiring

Because Mike Vaccaro is intimately familiar with the work and reputation of Minoru Nakamura?