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Prince Albert Rules

G-Fafif
Nov 24 2009 12:18 PM

Pujols unanimous N.L. MVP choice. Ramirez, Howard, Fielder, Tulowitzki follow. Full totals not yet released.

RealityChuck
Nov 24 2009 12:20 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

So do you have Prince Albert in a can?

G-Fafif
Nov 24 2009 12:23 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

Found vote on BBWAA site. No Mets listed among 30 vote-getters.

Benjamin Grimm
Nov 24 2009 12:31 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

[quote="G-Fafif"] No Mets listed among 30 vote-getters.



I'm not surprised. My prediction of three points for Santana was overly optimistic.

Hopefully next year the Mets will have the number one guy and three of the top five.

G-Fafif
Nov 24 2009 12:46 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

First time since 2002 that no Met has elicited a single vote in any of the major awards: MVP, Cy Young, Rookie of the Year, Manager of the Year. If you add in Gold Glove and Silver Slugger winners (not votes; those aren't widely disseminated), this is the most barren offseason since 1993.

Luis Castillo finished seventh for N.L. Comeback Player of the Year (one second-place, two third-place votes), an award presented by MLB.com and voted on by its beat writers.

metsguyinmichigan
Nov 24 2009 01:27 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

No Mets in the balloting. Too bad that AL Japanese writer wasn't casting ballots!

Edgy DC
Nov 24 2009 01:29 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

Hey, Francisco Rodriguez was eighth in Rolaids points.

And I'm sure that if there was a Jesse Orosco Award for the LOOGy who pitches every day, Pedro Feliciano would've been all over it.

Frayed Knot
Nov 24 2009 01:53 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

A unanimous verdict for 1st place and then no clear-cut choice for runner-up (6 different guys got 2nd place votes) is about how it should be for this season

----1st2nd3rd4th5thPoints
Albert Pujols - StL32--------448
Hanley Ramirez - FLA--15533233
Ryan Howard - Phi--6875217
Prince Fielder - Mil--5973203
Troy Tulowitski - Col--3655172
Andre Ethier - LAD--2--32113
Pedro Sandoval - SFG----1--289
Chase Utley - Phi----22184
Derrick Lee - ChiC--1----366
Matt Kemp - LAD------2149



Also receiving nods:
Ryan Braun - Mil
Adrian Gonzalez - SD
Todd Helton - Col
Chris Carpenter - StL
Adam Wainwright - StL
Matt Holliday - StL
Jayson Werth - Phi
Shane Victorino - Phi
Tim Lincecum - SFG
Yunel Escobar - Atl
Mark Reynolds - Ariz
Joey Votto - Cin
Yadier Molina - StL
Miguel Tejada - Hou
Huston Street - Col
BJ Upton - Ariz
Ryan Zimmerman - Wash
Jeremy Affeldt - SFG
Chris Coghlan - Fla
Brad Hawpe - Col



Mets & Pirates only teams not represented by a warm body

Vic Sage
Nov 24 2009 02:31 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

Mets & Pirates only teams not represented by a warm body


great company we're keeping...

here's one of my son's favorite jokes:
Q: "why are pirates called `pirates'?"
A: "I don't know... they just arrrrrrrrr"

Ashie62
Nov 24 2009 05:58 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

Pujols-runaway, deserved winner

Frayed Knot
Nov 25 2009 07:42 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

btw, Pujols has now been in MLB for nine seasons. His MVP status in those years:
4th (plus 1st in RoY)
2nd
2nd
3rd
1st
2nd
9th
1st
1st

So that's not only 3 wins but also 3 runner-ups with all top-10 finishes, eight of which were top-5s

He turns 30 in January,
He was a 13th round draft pick.

metsguyinmichigan
Nov 25 2009 07:46 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

And how many of those second-place finishes were behind Barry Bonds, he of the questionable chemical digestion? Dude could have had four or more at this point.

Frayed Knot
Nov 25 2009 07:54 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

Two of his 2nds were behind Bonds, plus he finished 3rd behind Bonds and Adrian Beltre.
His other 2nd was behind Ryan Howard.

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Nov 25 2009 07:56 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

[quote="metsguyinmichigan":3gjyhr5b]And how many of those second-place finishes were behind Barry Bonds, he of the questionable chemical digestion? Dude could have had four or more at this point.[/quote:3gjyhr5b]

Like Pujols is clean.

Benjamin Grimm
Nov 25 2009 08:00 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

That was my first thought as well.

Frayed Knot
Nov 25 2009 08:24 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

Some also question whether he's really 29

Centerfield
Nov 25 2009 08:26 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

Is there any evidence he used? (Or is older?)

Or is that just speculation because he is really, really good?

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Nov 25 2009 08:32 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

He's either the greatest player ever, totally and completely great from the first day he stepped on the field, unbelievably strong, and completely on the level in an era when the only players capable of achieving what he has have been shown to be or widely suspected to be juicers, or he just hasn't been caught.

MFS62
Nov 25 2009 08:38 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

[quote="RealityChuck":14pr348d]So do you have Prince Albert in a can?[/quote:14pr348d]

No. I let him out.

BA DA BING!

Later

Ashie62
Nov 25 2009 10:07 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

[quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":25p6opsj]He's either the greatest player ever, totally and completely great from the first day he stepped on the field, unbelievably strong, and completely on the level in an era when the only players capable of achieving what he has have been shown to be or widely suspected to be juicers, or he just hasn't been caught.[/quote:25p6opsj]

Pujols could be the greatest player ever??

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Nov 25 2009 10:12 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

[quote="Ashie62"][quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket"]He's either the greatest player ever, totally and completely great from the first day he stepped on the field, unbelievably strong, and completely on the level in an era when the only players capable of achieving what he has have been shown to be or widely suspected to be juicers, or he just hasn't been caught.



Pujols could be the greatest player ever??

You could look it up.

[url]http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/pujolal01.shtml

metirish
Nov 25 2009 10:14 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

Ralph Kiner rates Pujols as one of the best, can't remember the exact words but he often raves about him.

MFS62
Nov 25 2009 11:02 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

[quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket"]
[url]http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/pujolal01.shtml


WOW!
The names in those similarity scores jump off the page at you.
Greatest ever? Maybe not.
IMO he is lacking one of the "five tools" - speed.
But he will certainly be in the conversation if he keeps going at his current pace.

Later

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Nov 25 2009 12:35 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

[quote="Ashie62":xea4v31t][quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":xea4v31t]He's either the greatest player ever, totally and completely great from the first day he stepped on the field, unbelievably strong, and completely on the level in an era when the only players capable of achieving what he has have been shown to be or widely suspected to be juicers, or he just hasn't been caught.[/quote:xea4v31t]

Pujols could be the greatest player ever??[/quote:xea4v31t]

Well, he's no Lou Brock, but he is in the Dimaggio/Foxx/Aaron/Greenberg/Ott neighborhood... with LOTS of hitting to go.

You could make a very credible argument that he's a HOFer if he retires tomorrow.

Frayed Knot
Nov 25 2009 01:21 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

Except that he only has nine seasons right now and ten are required to even be eligible.
But by this point next year you could pull out the 'if he got hit by a train tomorrow' argument and I'd vote him in fer shure.

Ashie62
Nov 25 2009 01:32 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":1njfm8ua][quote="Ashie62":1njfm8ua][quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":1njfm8ua]He's either the greatest player ever, totally and completely great from the first day he stepped on the field, unbelievably strong, and completely on the level in an era when the only players capable of achieving what he has have been shown to be or widely suspected to be juicers, or he just hasn't been caught.[/quote:1njfm8ua]

Pujols could be the greatest player ever??[/quote:1njfm8ua]

Well, he's no Lou Brock, but he is in the Dimaggio/Foxx/Aaron/Greenberg/Ott neighborhood... with LOTS of hitting to go.

You could make a very credible argument that he's a HOFer if he retires tomorrow.[/quote:1njfm8ua]


Lets wait til he does the "LOTS" more hitting before he is compared to Dimaggio/Foxx/Aaron/Greenberg/Ott etal

batmagadanleadoff
Nov 25 2009 02:14 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

Compare Pujols' career to the first nine seasons of any other player in the game's history. By that standard, you could make a reasonable argument that Pujols is the best. Ever.

Nymr83
Nov 25 2009 07:00 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

[quote="Ashie62":2uiwaibi][quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":2uiwaibi]He's either the greatest player ever, totally and completely great from the first day he stepped on the field, unbelievably strong, and completely on the level in an era when the only players capable of achieving what he has have been shown to be or widely suspected to be juicers, or he just hasn't been caught.[/quote:2uiwaibi]

Pujols could be the greatest player ever??[/quote:2uiwaibi]

He'd have to keep doing what he's been doing for another 10+ years to even be in the discussion with Ruth and Bonds, thats tough to do.

Edgy DC
Nov 25 2009 08:08 PM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

Not really, I think, because his 20s were better than Bonds'.

Career MVP Shares
1. Barry Bonds (7 wins) 9.30
2. Stan Musial* (3 wins) 6.96
3. Ted Williams* (2 wins) 6.43
4. Willie Mays* (2 wins) 6.06
5. Albert Pujols (3 wins) 5.89

Frayed Knot
Nov 26 2009 06:03 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

Similarity scores thru age 29:

Jimmie Foxx
Hank Aaron
Lou Gehrig
Ken Griffey
Frank Robinson
Mickey Mantle
Juan Gonzalez
Mel Ott (794)
Hank Greenberg
Orlando Cepeda

That's 8 HoFers plus one to-be HoFer and one probably not (JuanGone)

All were high average/high power guys who had great early careers and mostly played (exceptions Cepeda & Robinson) during good offensive eras - especially the 1930s crowd of Foxx, Ott, Gehrig & Greenberg.

Of that group, Mantle, Griffey, Cepeda, Ott, and especially Foxx & Gonzalez, had considerably better years in their 20s than in their 30s.
Only Aaron really got better (more power).
Cepeda (the least similar to begin with) was the only borderline HoF vote. Gonzalez's fall-off (last full season came at age 31) was the only one that will likely keep him out.



His overall similarity scores are also a bunch of players who either fell-off early (for various reasons) or, like Albert, are still works in progress.

Hank Greenberg (WWII interrupted career) - HoF
Albert Belle (career ending injury)
Lance Berkman (still active)
Johnny Mize (814) (HoF)
David Ortiz (active)
Dick Allen (grumped his way out of the game)
Mo Vaughn (injuries, weight, steroids)
Todd Helton (active)
Ralph Kiner (cut short by injuries) - HoF
Chuck Klein - HoF

MFS62
Nov 26 2009 08:05 AM
Re: Prince Albert Rules

That's what I said about the similarity scores a few posts above. The names jump off the page.
But, thanks for re-posting them here for all who didn't read them earlier.

Later