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Giving Up The Plan

themetfairy Nov 25 2009 11:35 AM

Today I received my invoice for the 2010 "Sunday-Plus" plan. Like last year's Sunday plan, it includes 10 Sundays and 5 midweek games. I called the Mets ticket office and let them know I wouldn't be renewing the plan, for the following reasons: [list:2wqmfpyl] The inclusion of midweek games in the Sunday plan, which is a hardship when you have to travel a distance for games; The fact that the 15-game plan tickets are in the least desirable parts of the ballpark; and The fact that plan holders are denied access to any of the clubs at Citi Field.[/list:u:2wqmfpyl] To the third point, the very nice young man on the phone told me that Promenade Box plan holders would be allowed Promenade Club access in 2010. But I have been in the Promenade Club, and it's not good enough to be an incentive to spend the kind of money they require for those tickets. If I'm spending that kind of money, I'd rather be in a better part of the ballpark. The nice young man said that he was jotting down my concerns, and he'd get back to me if any different plans became available. I doubt that will happen, but at least I had the satisfaction of being able to tell the ticket office the reasons behind my dissatisfaction.

G-Fafif Nov 25 2009 11:39 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Interestingly enough, the Mets gave up having a plan years ago.

metirish Nov 25 2009 11:40 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

John Cougar Lunchbucket Nov 25 2009 11:58 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Season tixx are for suckas anyway. You guys should do the JCL Plan. Pick a game you want to go to, and plan to go to it.

Fman99 Nov 25 2009 12:25 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

[quote="themetfairy":1p0nw9hl]Today I received my invoice for the 2010 "Sunday-Plus" plan. Like last year's Sunday plan, it includes 10 Sundays and 5 midweek games. I called the Mets ticket office and let them know I wouldn't be renewing the plan, for the following reasons: [list:1p0nw9hl] The inclusion of midweek games in the Sunday plan, which is a hardship when you have to travel a distance for games; The fact that the 15-game plan tickets are in the least desirable parts of the ballpark; and The fact that plan holders are denied access to any of the clubs at Citi Field.[/list:u:1p0nw9hl] To the third point, the very nice young man on the phone told me that Promenade Box plan holders would be allowed Promenade Club access in 2010. But I have been in the Promenade Club, and it's not good enough to be an incentive to spend the kind of money they require for those tickets. If I'm spending that kind of money, I'd rather be in a better part of the ballpark. The nice young man said that he was jotting down my concerns, and he'd get back to me if any different plans became available. I doubt that will happen, but at least I had the satisfaction of being able to tell the ticket office the reasons behind my dissatisfaction.[/quote:1p0nw9hl] Having a "Sundays" plan that forces you to buy weekday tickets is a joke. And entirely predictable behavior by these bozos.

themetfairy Nov 25 2009 12:45 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

[quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":47u36d0n]Season tixx are for suckas anyway. You guys should do the JCL Plan. Pick a game you want to go to, and plan to go to it.[/quote:47u36d0n] The thing is, we liked the Sunday plan when it was actually a Sunday plan. It was a nice thing to do during the baseball season, and a way to connect with fellow Mets fans in person. It was an enjoyable thing for us.

Ashie62 Nov 25 2009 12:54 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Show up a half hour before a game and get em for 10 bucks tops...Tickets start to turn into pumpkins each minute closer to game time

themetfairy Nov 25 2009 01:03 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Ashie - if it was just me and D-Dad, I'd risk it. But we usually go to games with our son and with friends. At that point, it's less convenient to just show up and take your chances (especially since we have to travel a minimum of two hours in each direction to get to the ballpark).

Kong76 Nov 25 2009 01:16 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

This is all really about not being able to get a cocktail, isn't it?

Frayed Knot Nov 25 2009 01:18 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Give up the plan ... Hell, I still waiting for them to *show us the plan!!!! * really old forum joke

themetfairy Nov 25 2009 01:34 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

[quote="Kong76":fayck5t1]This is all really about not being able to get a cocktail, isn't it?[/quote:fayck5t1] All? No. Partially? Yes. The fact that one can't get a Sunday plan without buying midweek games is the biggest factor. But the fact that plan holders aren't automatically granted some kind of club access is a factor.

Swan Swan H Nov 25 2009 01:40 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Ours came today as well. We had a Saturday plan, and will be renewing. We have six seats total, three of ours and three belonging to my sister and her family. Our seats are in section 513, almost directly behind home plate, and the view is fine. We're under cover in the rain and out of the sun, but don't have any of the 'roof' effect the old Loge and Mezz had at Shea. The total invoice was $2245, making the average ticket price $25. It's less than we paid per seat for Loge tickets on the Saturday plan in '08, and while we're up higher the overall view is as good if not better. When we first got the plan in '86 tickets were $8 each, for whatever that's worth. Regarding the weeknight games, I have mixed feelings. I like going to the odd weeknight game, so that's not a big deal, but I would have preferred getting all 13 Saturdays and a few weeknights sprinkled in. For '10 we will miss the Twins on a Saturday, but we will get the Tigers on the previous Thursday, so that's kind of a wash. We get the Braves (twice), Phillies and Yankees on Saturdays. We also get three Nats games, which is no bargain. We also became pretty friendly with our neighbors last year, and they said they were definitely coming back, so while that's hardly reason to renew it's nice to know they'll be there. As for the access to the clubs, I do understand why this would rankle people. That said, I had tickets for three games last year where I had club access and never set foot in any of them, so for me it's not an issue.

Kong76 Nov 25 2009 02:47 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Why call some non-paid intern to tell him/her you're not renewing your crappy plan anyways? If someone doesn't renew a crappy plan and ends up in season tickets or a share of season tickets that has coc, er, I mean club access, where one can drop even more dough there in addition to seats $... who really wins? Wilpon, et al of course. Guess I trudge out to the mailbox and see if my invoice came ... we get our mail really late in the day.

G-Fafif Nov 25 2009 03:41 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

The Mets play in 2009 required generous access to cocktails.

Kong76 Nov 25 2009 03:49 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

2007 and 2008 weren't too easy either without dulled senses.

Kong76 Nov 25 2009 05:46 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

I did get my invoice today .... $600 for two tickets to enter the ballpark for 15 games is ok with me. I don't sit in my seats anyway for the most part. And I will get a new seating location somehow this year.

themetfairy Nov 25 2009 09:34 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

[quote="Kong76":2emo28fq]Why call some non-paid intern to tell him/her you're not renewing your crappy plan anyways? [/quote:2emo28fq] I wanted to let the Mets know why I decided not to renew the plan. Since I don't have Fred or Jeff's numbers, I settled for the number of the ticket office that was listed on the invoice. And as I said before, the inclusion of midweek games in the "Sunday" plan is a much bigger factor than the lack of club access. The club access is something I would like, but it's not a primary factor in this decision. If you want to fixate on that it's up to you, but that is not the main reason why I'm not renewing the plan.

Gwreck Nov 26 2009 11:37 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Why would one buy season tickets/ticket plans to their favorite sports teams? Here's why: 1. Discount (off single game ticket price) for buying in bulk; 2. Postseason purchase rights 3. Better seating location than single-game tickets 4. Same seating location for all games 5. Access to "premium" games (ie. opening day, prime interleague) Unfortunately, the Mets: 1. Offer no discount for buying in bulk. They are the (only?) MLB team that does business this way. Even the Yankees offer a meaningful discount off the single-game price if you buy a plan. 2. All joking about postseason aside, the Mets have refused to guarantee postseason rights to anyone except full-season holders. 15-game plan holders are supposedly going to get a "pre-sale" but this is the second year of the plans and the Mets still can't offer any concrete details about how that would even work (again, hold all your jokes about the postseason). 40-game plan holders get every other game in an "alternate" seating location. Which could mean your 40-game plan in the Metropolitan Box winds up giving you postseason tickets in the Promenade section 534. 3. In addition to not offering 15-game plans in the better seating locations, the Mets have also refused to offer 40-game plans in the affordable seating locations. Strictly a take-it or leave-it approach to where you can get a plan in the park. The Gwreck household wanted to do a 40-game plan for last season but the Mets wound up getting significantly less money from us because of their inflexibility. 4. There's also the problem that plans are only offered in lesser seating locations than full-season tickets. Unfortunately, as some full-season seats go unsold, they are released for general sale, putting the walk-up buyer in a better seat than the 15-game plan holder. 5. Opening day and Yankees tickets are indeed a pain to get if you don't have a plan. That's the biggest advantage to having one these days, you get one of those games under 4 of the 5 15-game plans. ---- Our household is dumping at least one of our two 15-game plans and are thinking our money is better spent traveling to some road games instead. (Don't worry, we'll be writing to the Mets to give them a piece of our mind as well). We like our seats (both plans are in Section 514, directly behind the plate) and would miss having the guaranteed location but the Mets really aren't making it worth having the plan(s).

86-Dreamer Nov 27 2009 07:32 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

In one form or another, I have been part of a plan with 5 other guys since 1991. The 6,7 and 8 weeknight packs that the Mets offered for the last 9 or 10 years at Shea worked out best for us. The 15 pack offered last year was too many games, and we all decided at the end to become free agents unless they offered a the 8 pack again. Another friend with a full season plan is also throwing in the towel. He and I discussed last week that we thought the Mets were likely to underestimate the bad taste many fans had last year and were in a for 15-20% cancellation rate this year on plan sales unless they made the types of common sense changes to the plan packages suggested by Gwreck and others in this thread. Sounds like they have not, and the sales will be down significantly.

Fman99 Nov 27 2009 09:14 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

[quote="86-Dreamer":1qr25nre]In one form or another, I have been part of a plan with 5 other guys since 1991. The 6,7 and 8 weeknight packs that the Mets offered for the last 9 or 10 years at Shea worked out best for us. The 15 pack offered last year was too many games, and we all decided at the end to become free agents unless they offered a the 8 pack again. Another friend with a full season plan is also throwing in the towel. He and I discussed last week that we thought the Mets were likely to underestimate the bad taste many fans had last year and were in a for 15-20% cancellation rate this year on plan sales unless they made the types of common sense changes to the plan packages suggested by Gwreck and others in this thread. Sounds like they have not, and the sales will be down significantly.[/quote:1qr25nre] What's funny, to me, is that the Dope-pons will chalk it all up to "well, it's the second year in the new park and the luster starts to wear off" effect. (see Pirates, Pittsburgh). They consistently, and with alarming predictability, make decisions designed to scare their fans off to other pursuits. Well, duh.

batmagadanleadoff Nov 27 2009 11:24 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

[quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":2r8j9d88]Season tixx are for suckas anyway. You guys should do the JCL Plan. Pick a game you want to go to, and plan to go to it.[/quote:2r8j9d88] I’ve come around to your way of doing it. (See rest of post) [quote="86-Dreamer":2r8j9d88] …we thought the Mets were likely to underestimate the bad taste many fans had last year and were in a for 15-20% cancellation rate this year on plan sales unless they made the types of common sense changes to the plan packages suggested by Gwreck and others in this thread….[/quote:2r8j9d88] One explanation for the Mets inflexibility with their Citi Field seating plans might be that there are 13,000 less seats to go around compared to the Shea days. A major league baseball stadium that seats 42,000 belongs in Kansas City or Cincinnati, or any of the other smaller markets -- not New York City. But the Wilpons apparently chose a business model where exorbitantly higher ticket prices would supposedly compensate them for whatever revenue they would’ve otherwise lost to the diminished seating capacity of Citi Field. (That, and revenue from modern luxury suites). Hardly a fan friendly solution, the model is further proof of just how little fans matter when it comes to ownership's pursuit of money. (Personally, I think that fan satisfaction counts for close to the zero in management's money-making formulas and that team owners operate largely on the premise that fans will tolerate almost anything because they are as addicted to their teams as smokers are to their cigarettes). I was a Mets full season ticket holder for over 15 seasons. I had a pair of field box seats in the infield (first base side, a few rows behind the major aisle that split the Shea field box section in half). I gave up the plan a few years ago when I got reliable advance wind of the (here comes a pun) ballpark figures for ticket prices to Citi Field’s inaugural season. The steep price increases offended me and I just wasn’t going to commit to sit significantly farther away from the action than what I had become accustomed to for the same money that just the year before, would’ve placed me 25 yards behind the Mets dugout. So I’ve been on the JCL plan for the last few seasons. I’m not committed to attending any particular game months in advance. I go whenever I want, often on a whim and at the spur of a moment. And just to stick it to Fred, whenever possible, I make sure that I’m buying tickets from someone that already purchased the tickets from the Mets.

A Boy Named Seo Nov 27 2009 12:12 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

[quote="batmagadanleadoff":1fq7mkok][quote="John Cougar Lunchbucket":1fq7mkok]Season tixx are for suckas anyway. You guys should do the JCL Plan. Pick a game you want to go to, and plan to go to it.[/quote:1fq7mkok] I’ve come around to your way of doing it. (See rest of post) [quote="86-Dreamer":1fq7mkok] …we thought the Mets were likely to underestimate the bad taste many fans had last year and were in a for 15-20% cancellation rate this year on plan sales unless they made the types of common sense changes to the plan packages suggested by Gwreck and others in this thread….[/quote:1fq7mkok] One explanation for the Mets inflexibility with their Citi Field seating plans might be that there are 13,000 less seats to go around compared to the Shea days. A major league baseball stadium that seats 42,000 belongs in Kansas City or Cincinnati, or any of the other smaller markets -- not New York City. But the Wilpons apparently chose a business model where exorbitantly higher ticket prices would supposedly compensate them for whatever revenue they would’ve otherwise lost to the diminished seating capacity of Citi Field. It’s not a fan friendly solution and is, in fact, further proof of just how little fans count when it comes to ownership's pursuit of money. (Personally, I think that the fan satisfaction counts for close to the zero in management's money-making formulas and that team owners operate largely on the premise that fans are as addicted to their teams as smokers are to their cigarettes). I was a Mets full season ticket holder for over 15 seasons. I had a pair of field box seats in the infield (first base side, a few rows behind the major aisle that split the Shea field box section in half). I gave up the plan a few years ago when I got reliable advance wind of the (here comes a pun) ballpark figures for ticket prices to Citi Field’s inaugural season. The steep price increases offended me and I just wasn’t going to commit to sit significantly farther away from the action than what I had become accustomed to for the same money that just the year before, would’ve placed me 25 yards behind the Mets dugout. So I’ve been on the JCL plan for the last few seasons. I’m not committed to attending any particular game months in advance. I go whenever I want, often on a whim and at the spur of a moment. And just to stick it to Fred, whenever possible, I make sure that I’m buying tickets from someone that already purchased the tickets from the Mets.[/quote:1fq7mkok] I'd imagine artificially pumping up demand and price by having less of your product to sell works way better when your product is worth buying. Lots of interesting stuff on attendance from this site: http://www.bizofbaseball.com/index.php? ... Itemid=136 Not sure how many sellouts they had at Citi (any?), but the Mets only ranked 7th in attendance in MLB in the first year of a brand-spankin' new park. Not a great sign for year 2 if the team doesn't play appreciably better. 3.1 million people is a lot of people, but with the smaller capacity, they still saw 22% fewer people from 08 to 09, with the average attendance at almost 39K, less than capacity. Looks like about 3.4 mil is the max they could ever draw. The Mets had the worst drop-off in MLB, narrowly "beating" Toronto, Washington, and San Diego. The Yanks attendance dropped 13%. Did they make it up in ticket $ales??? Further drop-off in 2010 seems entirely possible.

batmagadanleadoff Nov 27 2009 12:31 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 27 2009 12:49 PM

It's hard to tell. Everything went wrong for last year's Mets. Were ticket prices too high, or was it the weakened economy? Or both? It didn't help matters that injuries reduced the Mets to fielding a team that would lose 100 games in the shade over the course of a full season. Here's a tidbit from that site you recommended: In 2009, the Yankees filled their new ballpark to 87.8% capacity, a decline from the 92.3% capacity figure the team generated in 2008. This statistic is interesting because the New Yankee Stadium has a smaller capacity than the previous one and also, because of the team's success last season.

A Boy Named Seo Nov 27 2009 12:49 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

I'd say all of those were a factor, including crappy team, and with new stadium fever less of a thing this year, you could definitely see a few more empties this season. Did the Mets raise, lower, or keep prices the same for 2010? Didn't they lower the super-expensive front row-type seats during the season last year?

Frayed Knot Nov 27 2009 01:18 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

They lowered (as did the Yanx) some of the super-high priced real estate up front towards the end of the '09 season because it wasn't selling. Both teams vastly over-estimated the demand for those seats and the economic collapse made it even worse. There's going to be a slight lowering of some of the regular priced seats for 2010. The reason for the elimination of the smaller plans (6/7/8-packs, plus some of the mini-season plans) isn't a big mystery anymore than was their creation in the first place: they thought they needed them then and they no longer think they do now. With the smaller joint, the (hopefully for them) increased demand due to new stadium-itis and fewer better overall seats, food, "experience" etc., they saw themselves as able to sell the bulk of the inventory via full-sized (or at least fullER sized) plans plus the usual individual buys. Are they pricing the seats to where they think it's going to generate the highest revenue? ... Of course they are! - and, like any other business, if they mis-price their stuff their going to get burned on it and have to adjust.

themetfairy Dec 01 2009 09:11 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Giving up the plan is going to work out. A friend of mine is getting a full season plan and doesn't like going Sundays, so she's selling me her two seats for the thirteen games. I'll be on the Field Level, so The Powers That Be will deem me worthy enough of being able to buy a drink at the game (which I wouldn't be able to do as a plan holder in the Promenade). We'll buy a third ticket from time to time so that D-Dad, MK and I can go to some games together. We'll see how it works out, but it has to be better than the Sundayish plan.

Kong76 Dec 01 2009 09:35 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

You showed them!

themetfairy Dec 01 2009 09:39 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

I wasn't looking to show anybody anything. I was seeking a way to get what I wanted without having to purchase midweek games that I didn't want, and to be able to get better seats. The Mets wouldn't work with me, but my friend did.

Kong76 Dec 01 2009 09:42 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Just being annoying ... carry on.

Kong76 Dec 18 2009 01:02 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Dec 18 2009 02:00 PM

I was on hold with the "existing ticket plan" option for a twenty minutes and then got disconnected. Called again, waited ten more minutes and hung up. Took the option "for plans and new bbbyyy" and got right through and the guy wouldn't help me. It's typical Mets crap, once they got you on the hook they don't care about you. All I want to do is get some assurance that I can move my freakin' obstructed view seats for a fifteen game plan. PICK UP THE F'N PHONE YOU DOLTS.

Kong76 Dec 18 2009 01:13 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Nice young man helped me out like a minute after I hit sub- mit -- I told ya Jeffie monitors the boards.

themetfairy Jan 07 2010 02:56 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

I still have no regrets for giving up the Sunday plan. But D-Dad and I decided to go for a different plan. There's a 15-game midweek plan that includes Opening Day. We decided that rather than try to get tickets for the opener on Stub Hub we'd go for this plan for roughly the same money. If anyone wants to buy tickets off of me (other than for the opener), I'm willing to give a deep CPF discount. Otherwise, I'll be spending some summer nights at the Citi :) Cubs Monday April 19 7:10 p.m. Cubs Thursday April 22 7:10 p.m. Dodgers Tuesday April 27 7:10 p.m. Nationals Monday May 10 7:10 p.m. Phillies Wednesday May 26 7:10 p.m. Padres Wednesday June 9 7:10 p.m. Tigers Wednesday June 23 7:10 p.m. Reds Tuesday July 6 7:10 p.m. Cardinals Tuesday July 27 7:10 p.m. Rockies Tuesday August 10 7:10 p.m. Marlins Wednesday August 25 7:10 p.m. Pirates Tuesday September 14 7:10 p.m. Brewers Monday September 27 7:10 p.m. Brewers Thursday September 30 7:10 p.m.

Kong76 Jan 07 2010 03:22 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

That's a pretty good idea, where did they stick you?

themetfairy Jan 07 2010 03:54 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

I don't know yet - I'll have to wait for a representative to call me.

Kong76 Jan 07 2010 04:31 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

I'm waiting by the phone too to move my Sun tix. I ain't waiting much past the 15th before I become a pain in the ass. I want to move into that thin box section up top.

Swan Swan H Jan 16 2010 11:37 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

We had called to ask if we could move our seats (513, row 17) down a bit. The view is excellent, but the back row is a bit cold in the early and late season. We got a call today, and despite not having six together right behind the plate they did get us four together with two right behind them in 516, which is pretty much the 3rd base mirror of our old seats, only a couple of rows down. The two people I spoke with gave us five or six options, and this was the one that worked for us. Last year was the first year we went from four to six seats, and when we had the chance to we would often move a couple of people into the row in front, partially from the wind but it's also easier to talk that way, so this works out just fine.

Kong76 Jan 21 2010 08:40 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Well, I moved to that smaller five row section upstairs in left field. Price difference is significant ... I hope these seats don't suck too. When asked about possible blind spots and obstructions of view I was told, "well, that's a matter of personal opinion." I was nice, and didn't say what I was thinking (for a change).

Ashie62 Jan 21 2010 09:18 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

[quote="Kong76":3dtbktkn]I'm waiting by the phone too to move my Sun tix. I ain't waiting much past the 15th before I become a pain in the ass. I want to move into that thin box section up top.[/quote:3dtbktkn] And the pain in the ass part would differ from? Just kidding**

batmagadanleadoff Jan 21 2010 10:04 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

[quote="Kong76":2xecrnh3]When asked about possible blind spots and obstructions of view I was told, "well, that's a matter of personal opinion."[/quote:2xecrnh3] Clark Kent said those seats are fine. But he's got X-ray vision.

HahnSolo Jan 21 2010 10:07 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Me and three of my boyz jumped in on a 15-game plan. It allows the four of us to go to a few games together, then gives up a few games each to which we can take our family. I personally will end up going to 6 or 7 games in this. We're in section 512.

Swan Swan H Jan 21 2010 10:13 AM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Hahn, you'll love the view from 512, plus you have that little picnic/shopping area right downstairs.

Gwreck Feb 04 2010 01:39 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

The Mets recently quietly changed their postseason rights to partial plans, with 15-game plans now being guaranteed the same number of seats to one potential game per round.

Rockin' Doc Feb 04 2010 08:35 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

[quote="Gwreck"]The Mets recently quietly changed their postseason rights to partial plans, with 15-game plans now being guaranteed the same number of seats to one potential game per round.

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3-eavMSBnk

Gwreck Feb 09 2010 04:15 PM Re: Giving Up The Plan

Fun times today as the Mets called, realizing that we had given up one of our two fifteen game plans and wanted us to buy more tickets. Gave him a lesson on what they should be doing instead: 1. The Mets do a pretty good job of taking care of their best customers, the season ticket holders. They do a comparatively poor job of taking care of their second-best customers, the partial-plan holder: -No price discount (every other team has this) -Deliberate exclusion from opening day or Yankees pre-sale (other teams don't do this) -Poor seating choices; stick us in row 14 but single-game customers will be able to sit in lower rows. 2. Although the playoffs rights were improved for 2010, the mysterious "pre-sale" option for 2009 was poorly executed: there were no details, no information about quantity of tickets or games available, or for which rounds, or if people with 2 or 3 plans had better chances than those with 1 plan. 3. Was also nice to have a chance to register the supposedly-unheard "outrage" with the offensive way the Mets addressed their customers this offseason, particularly Dave Howard's condescension and the handing of the mythical "percentage" price reduction.