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battles?

duan Mar 18 2010 10:31 AM

anyone want to go through the battles that are present this spring and how they're evolving? 5th Starter 4,5,6,7(?) bullpen guys starting centre fielder 5th OF starting short stop back up Corner IF maybe it's too early

Valadius Mar 18 2010 10:36 AM Re: battles?

Well, the fifth starter race boils down to Jon Niese, Fernando Nieve, and Nelson Figueroa. By my observation, the Mets would prefer Niese to win the job, but Figueroa has the edge based on performance right now.

Edgy DC Mar 18 2010 10:42 AM Re: battles?

I think Takahashi may be on the fringes of the fifth starter situation. I'm totally down with Figgy right now. Nieve and Takahashi (if they can fit him) go in the pen, and Niese to Buffalo. It's really important to factor in that Nieve and Niese are both coming off of injuries and need to find their comfort levels again.

TransMonk Mar 18 2010 10:43 AM Re: battles?

Takahashi!!!

metirish Mar 18 2010 10:46 AM Re: battles?

Fernando Martinez won't be the center fielder going north, Jerry sees that as between Matthews and Pagan with FMart starting in the minors.

Valadius Mar 18 2010 10:58 AM Re: battles?

Jerry can suck it, Matthews is nothing but dead weight.

metirish Mar 18 2010 11:02 AM Re: battles?

It's a bit confusing , perhaps it's my reading comprehension but he seems to be saying that Martinez is not ready to be a center fielder. FORT MYERS, Fla. -- Jenrry Mejia has been the most hyped Mets prospect this spring. Ike Davis has gotten his share of attention, too. But Fernando Martinez is having as good a spring as both of them, if not a better one. The 21-year-old outfield prospect is hitting .538 with two doubles, two triples, three homers and 10 RBI through nine Grapefruit League games. As it happens, the Mets are looking for a starting center fielder until Carlos Beltran returns. But they remain intent on having Martinez start the season at Triple-A Buffalo, leaving Angel Pagan and Gary Matthews Jr. to slug it out for the big-league job. When asked if he would consider F-Mart for the job Thursday, manager Jerry Manuel said, "That would be difficult, in all honesty. That would be difficult. The center field part is very important to us right now. We came in here with the mantra that we're going to catch the baseball, play good defense, that type of thing, so we'll see how that turns out. But right now, we have Gary and Angel slated for that spot." Martinez struggled at the plate during a month-long stint in the majors last season. He hit just .176 before having season-ending knee surgery. But Manuel indicated defense was a bigger concern. "If we keep it on the ground, he'll be a good center fielder," Manuel said. "He hasn't played there for any extended period of time, but I think this is a great experience for him."

Valadius Mar 18 2010 11:12 AM Re: battles?

[quote="Jerry Manuel"]We came in here with the mantra that we're going to catch the baseball

Frayed Knot Mar 18 2010 11:13 AM Re: battles?

[quote="Valadius":dx2g7vvg]Jerry can suck it, Matthews is nothing but dead weight.[/quote:dx2g7vvg] So then you make him the 5th OFer (4th until Carlos comes back). There's no sense in carrying Fernando on the team unless he's ready to play full-time - which he almost certainly isn't and except for the first month there's not even a job opening if he were. If GMJ starts most of the time in CF over Pagan whilst waiting for Beltran then I'll join you in the anti-Jerry catcalls.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 18 2010 11:15 AM Re: battles?

"If we keep it on the ground, he'll be a good center fielder," Manuel said. "He hasn't played there for any extended period of time, but I think this is a great experience for him." What the flerg does this mean? Also, last bench slot (I suppose this is 5th OF?). Catalanotto seems to be flailing his way out of the last bench slot, leaving it up to-- most likely-- Jacobs or Carter. Sadly, going by playing time, the race appears to be proceeding in that order.

metirish Mar 18 2010 11:19 AM Re: battles?

Can I say something stoopid?(insert joke here). If all Jacobs can do is hit mistake fastballs then wouldn't he be a good bat of the bench to face the other teams closer when what we need might be that big shot? Most closers are not unhittable like you know who so I think he'd be a good one to have around.

Frayed Knot Mar 18 2010 11:21 AM Re: battles?

It's a bit confusing , perhaps it's my reading comprehension but he seems to be saying that Martinez is not ready to be a center fielder. Scouts have generally leaned toward the notion all along that Martinez was never destined to be a true CFer. Because of his (young at every level) age there's always the possibility that he could grow into one but minor league OFs (and IFers for that matter) tend to move towards the corners as they age and the competition gets tougher rather than the other way around. So when you stack his lack of true CF instincts onto his mediocre foot speed and overall dearth of experience at the position and you've got just part of the stack of reasons why he shouldn't be the temp CF replacement for the opening month.

TransMonk Mar 18 2010 11:55 AM Re: battles?

I think FMart should start at AAA. But once Beltran gets back, GMJ, Pagan and even Francoeur should be put on alert that they could lose time or jobs to FMart.

Edgy DC Mar 18 2010 12:42 PM Re: battles?

I think they should be on alert now. But as Mr. Deadwood is OSP-ing at 1.317 and Jerry has given more plate apperances to Martinez than any other outfielder, I think we can hold off on looking for a whipping boy.

Frayed Knot Mar 18 2010 02:14 PM Re: battles?

[quote="TransMonk":1rzd62n1]I think FMart should start at AAA. But once Beltran gets back, GMJ, Pagan and even Francoeur should be put on alert that they could lose time or jobs to FMart.[/quote:1rzd62n1] Ideally he goes to AAA **Stays Healthy** and kicks butt for a half season -- at that point you're much more comfortable bringing him up either to cover for an injury or to even get a couple days a week in giving any of the OFers an off-day, particularly against a RHP. What move you make to make room for him then- like maybe drop-kicking GMJ, platooning w/Francoeur, trading Pagan - would depend on any one of a number of factors.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 18 2010 04:29 PM Re: battles?

[quote="metirish"]Can I say something stoopid?(insert joke here). If all Jacobs can do is hit mistake fastballs then wouldn't he be a good bat of the bench to face the other teams closer when what we need might be that big shot? Most closers are not unhittable like you know who so I think he'd be a good one to have around.

Carter's got the same power, though... and he's an actual GOOD offensive player overall, besides (taking walks and such). Also, he plays both corner OF spots, and is merely not very good at first, whereas Jacobs-- this spring's very limited chances aside-- only plays there when DH isn't an option, and makes Carlos Delgado look like Keith when he does.

Also, Jacobs apparently can't hit sliders-- like, at all-- unless they're the kind that don't bend.

Ashie62 Mar 18 2010 04:43 PM Re: battles?

[quote="TransMonk":2kz2g8bt]I think FMart should start at AAA. But once Beltran gets back, GMJ, Pagan and even Francoeur should be put on alert that they could lose time or jobs to FMart.[/quote:2kz2g8bt] Yeah, what he said! and a Jon Niese #5 for myself

Nymr83 Mar 18 2010 04:43 PM Re: battles?

I'd be very disappointed not to see Carter on the roster. he and Jacobs cant make it together unless the Mets decide to have a smaller pitching staff

metirish Mar 18 2010 04:52 PM Re: battles?

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"][quote="metirish"]Can I say something stoopid?(insert joke here). If all Jacobs can do is hit mistake fastballs then wouldn't he be a good bat of the bench to face the other teams closer when what we need might be that big shot? Most closers are not unhittable like you know who so I think he'd be a good one to have around.

Carter's got the same power, though... and he's an actual GOOD offensive player overall, besides (taking walks and such). Also, he plays both corner OF spots, and is merely not very good at first, whereas Jacobs-- this spring's very limited chances aside-- only plays there when DH isn't an option, and makes Carlos Delgado look like Keith when he does.

Also, Jacobs apparently can't hit sliders-- like, at all-- unless they're the kind that don't bend.


Completely forgot about Carter.....

Edgy DC Mar 18 2010 08:10 PM Re: battles?

Adn Jacobs taking a donut tonight couldn't have helped him any.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 18 2010 08:27 PM Re: battles? Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Mar 18 2010 09:47 PM

Jacobs: 25 PA, 4 H, 5 BB (!), 2 K (!), 2 HR, .200 AVG/.267 OBP/.500 SLG. Carter: 14 PA, 5 H, 2 BB, 2 K, 3 HR, .417 AVG/.500 OBP/1.250 SLG. I has lobby for Chris Carter to have starting-lineup position next game or two. HisaMania now has 10 Ks to 1 BB on the season. He's like Glavine, all right, except he gets strike calls by throwing actual strikes, and not by being Tom Glavine/rolling his eyes.

Ashie62 Mar 18 2010 09:30 PM Re: battles?

strikes are good...

attgig Mar 19 2010 10:41 AM Re: battles?

from everything I read, it seems like figgy is getting absolutely no consideration to win the #5 job. I just don't get it. he's pitching great, putting up numbers... and nothing. ie: http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/mets/2 ... g+the+Mets) (japan? really?) maybe i should start a facebook page to get figgy a rotation spot... maybe that'll help... either that, or he'll end up hosting SNL.... oh, and good little figgy interview here: http://mets360.com/2010/03/14/360-secon ... -figueroa/ he's taking it like a pro...all the more reason I want him to win the job.

metirish Mar 19 2010 10:59 AM Re: battles?

From the same link BY ADAM RUBIN Yes, that was Mike Jacobs this morning, with a bag of catching equipment in front of his locker. Jacobs looks like he's the leading candidate for the final bench spot with the Mets, and the organization has asked him to catch on a limited basis in order to increase his versatility. So Jacobs, who caught in the minors with the Mets before being converted to first base in 2005, is planning to catch Tobi Stoner's bullpen session before today's Mets-Twins game. "It's like riding a bike," Jacobs told the Daily News. Jacobs ordered his own Rawlings glove, which he was considering using for the session. But because it's not broken in, he may settle for a Chris Coste extra instead. Bottom line: Jacobs won't be more than an emergency catcher in a major-league game. And when was the last time you saw the Mets use an emergency catcher? "I don't think this is a Brandon Inge situation where I'm going to be catching once or twice a week," Jacobs said. For the record, Jacobs also caught a bullpen session last year with Kansas City. He had not been asked to do that in his three previous years with the Marlins. Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/mets/#ixzz0iduJckBd

Ashie62 Mar 20 2010 07:34 AM Re: battles?

Is Muffy on the verge of losing the starting 1B gig? Jacobs' stock seems to be rising. Then if they both crap out "I like Ike" could be spending a bit of time in Queens this summer.

smg58 Mar 20 2010 08:56 AM Re: battles?

I would argue that Jacobs has exactly zero value at this point unless he can catch. I'm really not sure what Carter has to do to get a spot. The only outfielder or first baseman the Mets have who can hit righthanded pitchers better than him is Bay -- except possibly Martinez, and I'm not sure what he has to do to get a spot either.

smg58 Mar 20 2010 09:18 AM Re: battles?

While we're on the subject of what people have to do to make the team, I just noticed that in 25.1 IP, Takahashi, Figueroa, and Misch have combined for zero runs. Nobody's even mentioning Misch.

Ashie62 Mar 20 2010 09:56 AM Re: battles?

I'm gonna disagree that Jacobs has zero value. It feels as if he is going to make the team and loom over Muffy. True about Misch. I had forgotten him myself. I guess he needs to get a shot a make a job his own.

Frayed Knot Mar 20 2010 10:32 AM Re: battles?

... except possibly Martinez, and I'm not sure what he has to do to get a spot either. Stay healthy and show he can do what he doing in ST for a few months in a row. Remember that this is a guy who did get 100 ML ABs last year and hit a mostly punchless .176 ... before getting hurt again - and in 4 years of pro ball has had barely 2 full seasons worth of reps (1,100 ABs) due to being sidelined with one problem after another. 2 dozen or so ST ABs doesn't wipe all of that out. Plus there's the snag where the one "open" position right now is CF and that's not only temporary (we hope) but it's the one spot where they're not really sure he can play.

Edgy DC Mar 20 2010 10:41 AM Re: battles?

I think we're all prone to get caught up in the idea that the most recent news is the most definitive. At the start of spring, blogs were arguing for the Mets to quit kiddng themselves and trade Martinez while he still has value. Now the balance is tipped to blogs dismayed by the Mets keeping the brother down. And the difference is 32 spring training at-bats. Zero walks in there, by the way. I'm rooting for him too, but it's silly to root against a team deliberating. Developing players should be filled with constant deliberations.

Swan Swan H Mar 20 2010 03:15 PM Re: battles?

Not that he ever had much of a chance, but Adam Rubin reports that the Fogg has lifted - Josh has been released so he can go and be injured with another team.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 20 2010 05:45 PM Re: battles?

[quote="smg58":4vs52qar]I would argue that Jacobs has exactly zero value at this point unless he can catch. I'm really not sure what Carter has to do to get a spot. The only outfielder or first baseman the Mets have who can hit righthanded pitchers better than him is Bay -- except possibly Martinez, and I'm not sure what he has to do to get a spot either.[/quote:4vs52qar] After Saturday's game: Jacobs: 28 PA, 4 H, 5 BB, 4 K, 2 HR, 10 TB, .174 AVG, .321 OBP, .435 SLG, .756 OPS, has shat the bed offensively and defensively for the virtual entirety of his major-league career, 2 of last 3 and 3 of last 5 starts (w/ 1 TB in them) Carter: 15 PA, 5 H, 2 BB, 2 K, 3 HR, 15 TB, .385 AVG, .467 OBP, 1.154 SLG, 1.621 OPS, has dominated minor-league pitching since 2006, no starts in 10 days I'm not just "Team Carter;" I don't see how anyone in their right mind could count themselves on "Team Jacobs."

Valadius Mar 21 2010 08:08 AM Re: battles?

TheOldMole Mar 21 2010 09:44 AM Re: battles?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 22 2010 12:52 PM Re: battles?

I feel you, Nelly. I feel you. (Courtesy of young Mr. Waldstein at the Paper of Record.) PORT ST. LUCIE, Fla. — Nelson Figueroa walked up to the clubhouse door of Estadio Nueva Esparta last month and knocked on the door. A small flap opened at eye level, and a security guard asked Figueroa, a star pitcher for the Dominican Winter League champion Leones Del Escogido, for identification. Figueroa had just arrived at Margarita Island, Venezuela, the site of the Caribbean Series, planning to meet his team at the stadium and had not been given his player’s credential yet. No credential, the guard said, no entry, and like a bouncer at a speakeasy, he slapped the flap shut in Figueroa’s face. Figueroa, who was scheduled to start that night’s game, was left standing in the noon heat wondering how he would get inside to begin his day’s work. Demonstrating the resourcefulness that has helped him survive 15 years in professional baseball in North, Central and South America and in Asia, Figueroa reached into his bag, pulled out his passport and his baseball glove and knocked again. When the guard answered, Figueroa held up the passport and his baseball glove with his name stitched on it. Unimpressed, the guard still refused to allow Figueroa in without his pass. After a few more moments of uncertainty, a credentialed crew member from ESPN Deportes, which was broadcasting the game, spotted Figueroa and persuaded the guard to allow the pitcher onto the grounds. Once inside (and after he was held up by another security guard), Figueroa pitched masterfully, striking out eight in a three-hitter to lead Escogido to a 7-1 victory en route to the Caribbean championship. Less than two months later, he is still performing well, allowing one run in 11 innings for the Mets in spring training. But despite his success, Figueroa was assigned to pitch in a B game lately, on Sunday against the University of Michigan. He is still looking for the recognition that will allow him to walk through baseball’s front doors without being questioned. “Things don’t always work out the way you plan them,” Figueroa said after allowing his first run of the spring in the Mets’ 8-1 victory over Michigan. “I’ve learned that throughout my career. I’m in the position where I’m going out there throwing for 29 other teams right now.” For Figueroa, making the Mets or any other major league team is almost a matter of family survival. He is the major league equivalent of an assembly-line worker concerned about paying this month’s electricity bill. “It’s frustrating,” said Figueroa, who pitched 16 games for the Mets last year and 17 for Class AAA Buffalo. “Everybody says they’re not playing for that payday, but it would be nice. It would be nice not to have to go to winter ball to get a check. I go to winter ball to stay in shape, have fun and win championships, and that’s all great. “But bottom line is it pays the bills. I don’t get paid until April 15, and sometimes, it gets a little scary. You’ve got to make the money when you can, and I’m getting a great opportunity every winter.” If Figueroa makes the Mets’ roster, as a reliever or the fifth starter, he will make a healthy $416,000 — with checks arriving every two weeks starting April 15 — but that is $34,000 less than his contract called for last year. If he is sent to the minors, he will make $119,500, which is also a nice salary, but the major league average last year was $3.2 million. At 35, Figueroa is not looking to fulfill childhood dreams but to find a job in a hard economy. Since he was first signed in 1995 after being drafted by the Mets, Figueroa has spent time in the minor leagues every year except 2005, when he was out of baseball. Figueroa’s financial concerns show when he talks about how fortunate he was that one day in the majors last year enabled him to have $18,500 worth of health insurance for his family. Or how he was two days short of enough service time to be eligible for arbitration, which could have resulted in a heftier salary. If he does not stick with the Mets this year, Figueroa could ask for his release and sign overseas, perhaps in Japan, where he stands to make substantially more money. “I’ve been playing for 15 years and I haven’t made a million dollars,” he said. “I’d like some security for my family, of course.” If the Mets try to send him to the minors, Figueroa will have to clear waivers, which he has done six times in his career. Could every team pass on him again after such an impressive spring? “I think you’ve got to kind of be blind if you’re one of the other 29 teams to see what comes out of it,” Figueroa said. “Hopefully they’re not.”

Ashie62 Mar 22 2010 09:46 PM Re: battles?

Figgy, sometimes a career path can be stalled through no fault of your own

MFS62 Mar 23 2010 07:18 AM Re: battles?

Does Daniel Murphy still have minor league options left? If Carter keeps hitting, and with power, do you think the Mets would send Murphy down at the start of the season to "get his swing together" like they did with Evans last year? Later

metirish Mar 23 2010 07:33 AM Re: battles?

Lennon on his blog Decisions, decisions. Two weeks left before Opening Day Exactly two weeks from today, the Mets will send Johan Santana to the mound -- keep your fingers crossed -- to oppose the Marlins' Josh Johnson in the season opener at Citi Field. Which is why it's time for the roster analysis to kick into high gear because the clock is ticking. I spoke with Omar Minaya yesterday about these final two weeks and what needs to get accomplished. The short answer? Plenty. The Mets' bullpen is in disarray and they still need to figure out the bench, which also is dependent on the status of Jose Reyes. If Reyes can't make it back for Opening Day -- and that seems to be the case -- the Mets will need Alex Cora plus another shortstop, meaning Ruben Tejada is going to be coming north as well. That's a wrinkle the team hadn't planned on a few weeks ago. With so much uncertainty in the bullpen, is there any chance Nelson Figueroa makes the Opening Day roster? He's still holding out hope, but if not, Figueroa sounds like he will not shuffle off to Buffalo when the time comes. Figueroa talked candidly yesterday about the finances of the game for a player on the margin, and he seems frustrated by his limited use this spring. On a positive note, Figgy did win free tacos for Section 111yesterday by striking out a Michigan hitter in the "Taco Inning" at Tradition. Disarray? , hardly the kind of talk that inspires one with two weeks to go.

Benjamin Grimm Mar 23 2010 07:44 AM Re: battles?

You should focus on the positive: free tacos for section 111! Is the bullpen really in disarray? Or is it simply that there are decisions still to be made? I have to confess that I haven't been paying a whole lot of attention to how many of the individual Mets players have been doing this spring.

metirish Mar 23 2010 07:48 AM Re: battles?

And those people in section 111 looked like they needed the free tacos too.......... Lennon follows up today The Putz conundrum: Still searching for a set-up man 8:20 AM By David Lennon Less than two weeks before Opening Day, and the Mets are no closer to finding an eighth-inning pitcher than they were when spring training began back in mid-February. And here's the problem: The most intriguing candidate -- Jenrry Mejia - is not even being considered because Jerry Manuel insists on protecting him if he does make the Opening Day roster (which he will). Mejia looked decent yesterday, Bobby Parnell was uninspiring and Ryota Igarashi was a mess as he tried to tinker with his delivery, hoping for more sink on his forkball. But we'll get another look at all of them today as they work on back-to-back days for the first time this spring in what should be a critical test. As for Mike Pelfrey, the box score said he served up four homers yesterday at Viera. But everyone can take two steps back from the ledge. Three were windblown in a big way. The fourth was a blast off a light pole. Pelfrey has shown improvement this spring -- there's no question about that. I thought Oliver Perez, who starts today, would be the surprise of the season this year but I'm switching over to Pelfrey. A strange headline me thinks

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 23 2010 08:17 AM Re: battles?

[quote="MFS62":1hv4bbtg]Does Daniel Murphy still have minor league options left? If Carter keeps hitting, and with power, do you think the Mets would send Murphy down at the start of the season to "get his swing together" like they did with Evans last year? Later[/quote:1hv4bbtg] Murphy has options. Jacobs, on the other hand, has an invisible "release me" sign around his neck.

attgig Mar 23 2010 09:34 AM Re: battles?

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":35swpivh] Murphy has options. Jacobs, on the other hand, has an invisible "release me" sign around his neck.[/quote:35swpivh] but murphy ain't goin nowhere: http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball ... 9981_x.htm and jacobs? who knows why jerry keeps on thinking about him.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 23 2010 06:47 PM Re: battles?

Jacobs pinch-hits with the bases loaded in today's ST game, and provides the clutchiest of clutch singles... his first hit in a week! Awesome! JACOBS 29 PA, 5 H, 5 BB, 4 K, 2 HR (his only XBH), .208 BA/.345 OBP/.458 SLG, ugly fucking Phillie goatee, slight-to-moderate douchiness, hands of stone, heart of glass, owns catcher's glove CARTER 20 PA, 8 H, 2 BB, 2 K, 3 HR (6 XBH), .444 BA/.500 OBP/1.056 SLG, clean face, nice smile, Stanford-edu-ma-cated, hammers righties better than anyone else currently projected to be on the Opening Day roster NOT named Jason Bay, owns outfielder's glove that he actually uses

Ashie62 Mar 23 2010 07:52 PM Re: battles?

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":oqiuq122]Jacobs pinch-hits with the bases loaded in today's ST game, and provides the clutchiest of clutch singles... his first hit in a week! Awesome! JACOBS 29 PA, 5 H, 5 BB, 4 K, 2 HR (his only XBH), .208 BA/.345 OBP/.458 SLG, ugly fucking Phillie goatee, slight-to-moderate douchiness, hands of stone, heart of glass, owns catcher's glove CARTER 20 PA, 8 H, 2 BB, 2 K, 3 HR (6 XBH), .444 BA/.500 OBP/1.056 SLG, clean face, nice smile, Stanford-edu-ma-cated, hammers righties better than anyone else currently projected to be on the Opening Day roster NOT named Jason Bay, owns outfielder's glove that he actually uses[/quote:oqiuq122] Carter hammers righties better than anyone on the roster not named Bay? That is absurd.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 23 2010 07:59 PM Re: battles?

[quote="Ashie62":2p688bmx][quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr":2p688bmx]Jacobs pinch-hits with the bases loaded in today's ST game, and provides the clutchiest of clutch singles... his first hit in a week! Awesome! JACOBS 29 PA, 5 H, 5 BB, 4 K, 2 HR (his only XBH), .208 BA/.345 OBP/.458 SLG, ugly fucking Phillie goatee, slight-to-moderate douchiness, hands of stone, heart of glass, owns catcher's glove CARTER 20 PA, 8 H, 2 BB, 2 K, 3 HR (6 XBH), .444 BA/.500 OBP/1.056 SLG, clean face, nice smile, Stanford-edu-ma-cated, hammers righties better than anyone else currently projected to be on the Opening Day roster NOT named Jason Bay, owns outfielder's glove that he actually uses[/quote:2p688bmx] Carter hammers righties better than anyone on the roster not named Bay? That is absurd.[/quote:2p688bmx] Thanks for your thoughtful, well-considered rebuttal. Got a name?

Ashie62 Mar 23 2010 08:20 PM Re: battles?

I don't see how you can compare Carter's hammering ability to anyone on the major league level as Carter has yet to do anything at the Major league level or make the 2010 big team as of yet How about Daniel Murphy, Jose Reyes, David Wright, Angel Pagan, Frenchie, and Barajas as names til Carter proves otherwise on a major league level

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 23 2010 08:49 PM Re: battles?

Point sorta granted. Because there's a significant amount of vagueness around Major League equivalency of minor league stats. Even if he's demonstrated an ability to rake over the past four years in the high minors (cumulative wOBA-- like OPS, but weighting OBP more-- of .389 over the past three years, with major-league average for an OF at around .340). And even though his ability with the bat has had less to do with his making the team than (A) the fact that he was blocked by Kevin Youkilis, David Ortiz, and (B) Omar Minaya's evaluation of his ability with the bat. And even if the point you made is a bit like-- actually, MUCH like-- saying Sean Green is a better pitcher than Jjenrry Mejia against lefties because he's struck out a lefty* at the major league level. Oh, and Francoeur (.300 OBP/.410 SLG career against righties)? Barajas (.282/.402)? Who's being absurd now? *Actually, several lefties.

attgig Mar 24 2010 05:35 PM Re: battles?

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd ... Id=rss_nym PORT ST. LUCIE, Fla. -- Last summer, before his leg betrayed him, Jon Niese provided his manager a glimpse of how good it all could be. Jerry Manuel has retained an image of a young left-handed starting pitcher finding and fighting his way through big league lineups. The Mets manager appreciated what he saw to such a degree that he wants to see more. So it is that Niese has all but secured the fifth position in the Mets' starting rotation. Manuel indicated as much without saying the words Wednesday. Niese had pitched two scoreless innings in relief against the Astros in the Mets' 5-2 victory. And that cameo appearance, his body of work in 7 2/3 other innings, his large curveball -- pitching coach Dan Warthen says it's the best curve in camp -- and the club's need for Fernando Nieve in the bullpen left Manuel with no alternative. As a result, the rotation will be 60 percent left-handed, with Niese, Johan Santana and Oliver Perez -- not such a bad thing in the National League East -- and 80 percent unproven. Niese had left the clubhouse Wednesday before Manuel provided a qualified declaration/lukewarm endorsement. "I kind of see it might fit better for us, as we speak here today," Manuel said. "As I look at it today, I would say it's still open, but he would have somewhat of an inside track." Those words were followed by an acknowledgment that the club needs Nieve to work in relief, possibly in the still-unassigned eighth-inning role. Manuel was more direct in subsequent remarks, making a stronger case for Nieve in the bullpen, even though the club and scouts have wondered about Nieve's secondary pitches. Niese, 23, has made five starts in the big leagues, three of them last summer before he ruptured the hamstring tendon in his right leg on Aug. 5. He produced a 1-1 record and 4.21 ERA in the five starts last year, after posting a 1-1 record and 7.07 ERA in two starts in 2008. In four Grapefruit League appearances -- two in relief -- this spring, Niese has allowed 12 hits and four walks in 9 2/3 innings. He hadn't pitched in relief since 2005, his first season as a professional. "He was pretty impressive when we called him up last year," Manuel said. "I haven't seen anything different from him [in exhibition competition]." "I think his time has come," Warthen said last week, without reference to the rotation. "He's done his growing and his learning. Now it's time to do his pitching." unofficially, Niese is our official #5 starter Nieve goes to the pen. I still think that it's a bad idea. and imo, we're going to be missing the depth nelson gives us when one of the starters struggles bad or goes down with an injury(hopefully that won't happen...but...)....

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 24 2010 06:34 PM Re: battles?

Nelson, we got you a parting gift! It travels pretty well, so you should be able to carry it on the flight to Japan, no problem.

smg58 Mar 24 2010 07:37 PM Re: battles?

We "need" Nieve in the pen? At whose expense?

metirish Mar 24 2010 07:53 PM Re: battles?

Listen, I don't want to talk up a journey man pitcher like he's Johnny fucking Podres but there is a feeling that Figgy never really had a shot at the fifth spot in the minds of the brass.

bmfc1 Mar 24 2010 08:05 PM Re: battles?

Figueroa's spring ERA is 0.00. The way the staff is constructed, and from the pitching we've seen this spring, he shouldn't be the 5th starter... he should be the #2. I don't have any more confidence in Pelfrey or Maine than I do in Figueroa. And Perez is still a nightmare--yesterday was like reliving a bad dream, looking up and seeing runners on base all the time. This shouldn't have happened: Piniero and Marquis should have been in the rotation but our GM stood pat. Right now, the rotation is Santana and a bunch of 4's and 5's and from that bunch, Figueroa deserves to be in the rotation. http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/stats/sorta ... ByStat=ERA

Edgy DC Mar 24 2010 08:49 PM Re: battles?

Shed not tear one for Jason Marquis. If you actually get nightmares over spring starts (really?), then Marquis' spring performances would would give you PTSD.

Valadius Mar 24 2010 09:12 PM Re: battles?

Niese has the best curveball in camp? Doesn't Santana have something to say about that?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 24 2010 10:08 PM Re: battles?

Santana throws a fastball, slider and-- but of course-- changeup. (Get your head out of those bills and into something important, son.)

G-Fafif Mar 25 2010 05:12 AM Re: battles?

Figueroa, Misch and Takahashi inspire more immediate confidence than Pelfrey, Perez and Maine as in if I needed three pitchers for three games that counted at this very moment, I'd take the first trio, not the scholarship boys. I'd take them over Niese right now, too, for the short term. Perhaps this is why Spring Training is as long as it is, so though those who are penciled in can match their graphite quotient.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Mar 25 2010 07:31 AM Re: battles?

I think the Mets subscribe to the shopping-mall shootup theory: If talent were bullets, which three would leave the most gruesome crime scene behind? Maine is the one I'm most concerned about. I was thinking they might just make him the 8th inning guy and slide Figgy on down.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 25 2010 10:33 AM Re: battles? Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Mar 25 2010 10:40 AM

STAFF: Santana Pelfrey Maine Perez Niese BULLPEN: Figueroa Takahashi Nieve Calero Feliciano Igarashi Rodriguez Even if the team feels the pressing need to keep Nieve at all costs-- and I'm not sure I get that-- you still don't discard cheap, average starting pitching talent (NellyFigs). If you're in love with Niese-- and if you are, I can't exactly blame you, since he's got the highest ceiling/talent level of the starting candidates-- then use Green and Parnell's options.

Edgy DC Mar 25 2010 10:37 AM Re: battles?

Even if the team feels the pressing need to keep Nieve at all costs-- and I'm not sure I get that-- you still don't discard cheap, average starting pitching talent (NellyFigs). Wouldn't you describe Nieve the same way --- and just as claimable if the Mets try and sneak him into Buffalo? If I'm in love with Niese (and I'm not, but, you know, we've gone out a few times), I stick him in the minors under the "we don't need a fifth starter the first ten days" theory," and see if (a) a slot opens up, or (b) the situation on the ground changes.

duan Mar 25 2010 10:49 AM Re: battles?

that's exactly what I was driving at earlier, it's very clear to me that the starting rotation has a bunch of question marks around it and that the last thing we need is to let potentially league average starters get lost to other teams, so you try and shuffle through your best options over the first 2 weeks to a month, safe in the knowledge that an injury or two is probably going to help you use the whole deck and that at the very least you'll have competitive data rather then spring training data on everyone.. I'd hate to lose Misch/Nieve/Figgy on waivers, when they've ALL done good sales pitches either this spring or last season.

duan Mar 25 2010 10:50 AM Re: battles?

sorry for starting rotation, I actually mean pitching staff as a whole.

Ashie62 Mar 25 2010 10:51 AM Re: battles?

Lennon tweetybirding the Mets may have an interest in newly released MFY Chad Gaudin.. I see him as an innings eater with a 1.51 comp. We shall see I guess

TransMonk Mar 25 2010 10:53 AM Re: battles?

I see him as comparable to every other starter or starting candidate we have not named Johan.

Valadius Mar 25 2010 10:55 AM Re: battles?

If they would just bite the bullet and release Perez, this would be a whole different ballgame.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Mar 25 2010 10:57 AM Re: battles?

[quote="Valadius":3mtlbzxk]If they would just bite the bullet and release Perez, this would be a whole different ballgame.[/quote:3mtlbzxk] Yes, a game of stupidball.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 25 2010 11:15 AM Re: battles?

[quote="Edgy DC"] Even if the team feels the pressing need to keep Nieve at all costs-- and I'm not sure I get that-- you still don't discard cheap, average starting pitching talent (NellyFigs). Wouldn't you describe Nieve the same way --- and just as claimable if the Mets try and sneak him into Buffalo?

Figueroa has pitched repeatably well in a fill-in role over parts of the past two seasons, and only seems to be getting better at working with his tools. Nieve had a nice three-week stretch last year that looks less... well... good in retrospect (a 4.90 FIP and a .285 opponent BABIP indicates a good deal of luck went into that sub-3 ERA).

And for the record, I do like-like Niese.

Edgy DC Mar 25 2010 11:21 AM Re: battles?

I think keeping as many options on the table as possilbe is the key, and I don't make decisions that I'm not forced to, which means I carry Figueroa, I carry Nieve, and I keep Niese in reserve until someone fails or gets hurt, because somebody almost certainly will, and life will be wonderful if nobody does.

attgig Mar 25 2010 11:32 AM Re: battles?

usually, when a club is at this point, they'll release the veteran to give them a chance to latch onto another club out of spring training. Not as something they HAVE to do, but just out of professional courtesy. Now, I understand figgy isn't the prototypical 'veteran', given his service time, but given his age, I'd think they'd give him this courtesy...

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 25 2010 11:44 PM Re: battles?

Speaking of courtesy releases... Hisa Takahashi's contract has some quirks to it (some unwritten), as elucidated by Joel Sherman: [quote="Joel Sherman"]On March 20 the Mets released Hisanori Takahashi. No worries Mets’ fans, it was just a technicality. The Mets and Takahashi had a contract understanding that if he reached the majors that he would be paid $1 million with $2 million possible in performance bonuses. But MLB rules for first-time contracts to players not on the 40-man roster are very restrictive. For example, those players cannot receive bonuses based on performance. So what the Mets did with the blessing of the Commissioners Office and with a handshake agreement with Takahashi’s agent, Peter Greenberg, was to waive Takahashi and then instantly re-sign him to what now becomes his second contract, which strips away most restrictions. The Mets did the same thing last year with another Greenberg client from Japan, Ken Takahashi. Parties spoken to about this issue feel MLB and the union may work to change the language of their rules so that experienced players from Japan such as Takahashi do not fall under the same rules as, say, a second-round draft pick or a teenage amateur from Venezuela. One other item that Takahashi had formalized from an agreement that could not be honored from his first deal to now part of his second deal is the right to become a free agent after the season if the Mets cannot come to terms on a future contract relatively quickly after the season. One item that is not written in any contract, but is an understanding between Takahashi and the Mets is that if he is not on the 25-man roster by mid-May and has a chance to go elsewhere and pitch in the majors then the Mets will release him from his obligation to let him go to another team.

Ashie62 Mar 26 2010 09:29 AM Re: battles?

"An understanding" Let's hope the issue of a verbal contracts doesn't come up in Oral Arguments

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 26 2010 12:24 PM Re: battles?

Curious and curiouser. (They must love his intensity.)

metirish Mar 26 2010 12:25 PM Re: battles?

[quote="LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr"]Curious and curiouser. (They must love his intensity.)

According to Newsday’s David Lennon, the race is between Frank Catalonotto and Mike Jacobs, and Chris Carter has “no shot.”

I'm finding it hard to even read past this

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Mar 26 2010 12:27 PM Re: battles?

Berg makes a great point* regarding the relative major-league-iness of the three bench candidates... sadly, it doesn't take a lot of mental squinting to see a number of the key FO decision-makers thinking along these sorts of lines. Also, my opinion of Lennon is starting to curdle a bit. *When doesn't he, though, really?