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Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

seawolf17 Jan 25 2011 11:28 AM

Among other things. http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/blog/big_le ... mlb-312240 With Jeter in the outfield, Carl Crawford will have thirty triples a season just in his eighteen games against the Yankees.

metirish Jan 25 2011 11:41 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

I mean seriously Brian , the outfield?......have you actually seen the way Jeter runs , he's got this weird bow legged way of running that is just not suited for out there.

Valadius Jan 25 2011 11:45 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Jeets will take to the media, say "they never discussed this with me," generally whine and complain to Francesa et al., Cashman will say he only said it to motivate.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jan 25 2011 11:53 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Apparently Cash made the remark initially to mean that OF would be a better spot for Jeets to wind up than 3B, was overheard, tweeted, and when it came time to go on record was already in damage control. When did the MFYs turn into the Mets?

Ceetar Jan 25 2011 11:55 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Apparently Cash made the remark initially to mean that OF would be a better spot for Jeets to wind up than 3B, was overheard, tweeted, and when it came time to go on record was already in damage control. When did the MFYs turn into the Mets? They've always been worse than the Mets at all the stuff the Mets are criticized for. It's just they've had more success so it's glossed over, at best.

Edgy DC Jan 25 2011 11:56 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

metirish wrote: I mean seriously Brian , the outfield?......have you actually seen the way Jeter runs , he's got this weird bow legged way of running that is just not suited for out there. I might disagree. Some bowlegged dudes have managed just fine in the outfield. Puckett comes to mind. Dykstra was a little bowlegged. Bill James had a theory that a little bowleggedness was an underappreciated postive baseball trait.

Ceetar Jan 25 2011 12:02 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Edgy DC wrote: metirish wrote: I mean seriously Brian , the outfield?......have you actually seen the way Jeter runs , he's got this weird bow legged way of running that is just not suited for out there. I might disagree. Some bowlegged dudes have managed just fine in the outfield. Puckett comes to mind. Dykstra was a little bowlegged. Bill James had a theory that a little bowleggedness was an underappreciated postive baseball trait. Well, since the major issue is "Where do you hide him?" because he's got the contract and you have to, theoretically, play him. The outfield probably works as well as anything else. less critical than SS, and you're not expecting him to play great defense. But 3B is still probably the more likely answer no? Obviously Cashman couldn't say that without creating a "Will A-Rod be at 3B for the rest of his contract" followup.

holychicken Jan 25 2011 12:04 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

I am trying to figure out how many gold gloves his patented useless spin move will earn him while he plays out there.

metsguyinmichigan Jan 25 2011 12:27 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

I think Cashman's trying to get fired. They're stuck with Jeter at short unless they want to move his greasy butt to DH, but the MFYs tend to overstock their team with slugging DHs and not slap hitters who resort to faking getting hit to get on base any way possible.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jan 25 2011 12:38 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

metsguyinmichigan wrote: I think Cashman's trying to get fired. It really does seem that way, doesn't it? The yapping's rather... uncharacteristic.

Ceetar Jan 25 2011 12:40 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: metsguyinmichigan wrote: I think Cashman's trying to get fired. It really does seem that way, doesn't it? The yapping's rather... uncharacteristic. Final year on his deal. Maybe he _would_ rather work elsewhere, and sees the Soriano deal is a black mark and is justbeing vocal that it wasnt' his call.

Benjamin Grimm Jan 25 2011 12:56 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

It's not hard to imagine that George Steinbrenner's kids might be even more dickish than their father.

Frayed Knot Jan 25 2011 01:58 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

At least two articles in the past week or so - one was Bill Madden, I forget the other - suggested that it's looking increasingly like Cashman wants out. The spouting off in the news conference about the Soriano signing not being his idea was the major piece of evidence. There were also hints about him probably taking an even tougher stance with Jeter if left to his own devices (like two years tops or there's the door) and other such stuff. The idea is that he's wary (and probably weary) of being known as the guy who does little but write big checks (he's said that flat out) and is almost making it sound like he'd be happier in a small market job.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jan 25 2011 03:06 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Holy shit. Goldman should be ashamed. Also why I tend not to trust MetsBlog. [url]http://www.theyankeeu.com/2011/01/yes-censors-affiliated-blogs-over-rafael-soriano-criticism-24584

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jan 25 2011 03:17 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

No huge surprise, really, other than the bloggers' prompt acquiesence. Check the editorial content on the YES site and YES itself. But, dude, SNY ain't YES. (Praises be to Le Grand Orange upstairs for that.)

metirish Jan 25 2011 04:14 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

I can imagine how it works. Levine has a fool watching those sites and when the offending articles appear he makes a call and said fool has to call Goldman to tell him of Levin's displeasure. ...of course what probably happened is that Goldman gets a call from a high priced firm and told to get it the fuck down or else.

Frayed Knot Jan 25 2011 04:37 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

btw YES did not even cover the Soriano introductory presser, sort of making his signing the corporate equivalent of hiring a minority in the 1950s but then sneaking the new guy in through the kitchen door lest anyone raise a fuss. But of course the station has a ton of other things on their plate during the winter months so maybe there wasn't time. There's the Francesa show for instance ... except that there was no time conflict in this case. There's also their Nets schedule and the occasional Ivy League hoops game ... except that the Soriano thing was in the morning so that wasn't a problem either. No, your friends at YES were showing an old Yanqui game at the time - specifically the Luis Castillo drop-pop game. Ahhh yes (or ahhh YES), journalism at its finest.

seawolf17 Jan 26 2011 08:29 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

I'm fighting with Gene Wojciechowski on Twitter. He's trying to compare Jeter to Robin Yount. The good news is that I got him to retweet me calling Jeter "Captain Intangibles."

metsguyinmichigan Jan 26 2011 08:38 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Speaking of Tweets, Ian O'Connor had this gem: If Jeter moves in a few years, I see left field, not center. the #Yankees used to win titles with everyone and his brother playing LF. Centerfield? Did anyone ever, for even a moment, think Jeter could play center?

Edgy DC Jan 26 2011 08:39 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

I thinik Yount is a pretty comparable player. He hit the outfield mid-career --- around 30 --- however, which was about the time Jeter started winning Gold Gloves. Of course he could play center. Could he play it well? He doesn't have to. He didn't play shortsop well and they gave him awards for it.

Ashie62 Jan 26 2011 08:41 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Jeter who?

seawolf17 Jan 26 2011 08:44 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Edgy DC wrote: I thinik Yount is a pretty comparable player. He hit the outfield mid-career --- around 30 --- however, which was about the time Jeter started winning Gold Gloves. See, that's just it. Yount was "mid-career" when he switched, but Jeter's not "mid-career." He's "end-career." Learning a new position at 38 is going to be hilarious.

Edgy DC Jan 26 2011 08:52 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

I don't know. Outfielding isn't that nuanced. If you're a big league ballplayer and legs still work, you can do a passable job. And again, unless the ball is consistently bouncing off his person, everybody will pretend he's doing OK anyway.

batmagadanleadoff Jan 26 2011 08:53 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Do you suppose that A-Rod will replace Jeter at SS?

Edgy DC Jan 26 2011 08:56 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Nope.

batmagadanleadoff Jan 26 2011 08:57 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

What about you?

Edgy DC Jan 26 2011 08:59 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

My shortstop days are over. I got a thing in my shoulder.

dgwphotography Jan 26 2011 11:43 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Nope - I fear they are eying someone else...

metirish Jan 26 2011 11:45 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

dgwphotography wrote: Nope - I fear they are eying someone else... Jimmy Rollins?...oh wait......fuck

Ashie62 Jan 26 2011 12:02 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Jose Reyes

metsguyinmichigan Jan 26 2011 01:37 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Andrew Marchand gets in Darryl's head: When Darryl Strawberry was asked about Derek Jeter moving positions, he just snickered. Just from talking to players and people around the game, it seems as if they find it funny how the Yankees are treating Jeter. In the Strawberry story, Strawberry was joined by Davey Johnson and Howard Johnsonas being pretty incredulous that Jeter could make a move in his late-30s to the outfield. What is interesting to watch is the perception of the Yankees around baseball. Players may wonder: If the Yankees would treat Jeter the way they have this offseason, what would they do to me? Did this impact Cliff Lee? Who knows? Really, besides the rhetoric, the Yankees have not treated Jeter poorly. The contract he received is excellent for a soon-to-be 37-year-old, who hit .270 with limited power. He will get all the deference in the world when he becomes the first Yankee with hit No. 3,000 this season. But the questions about how Jeter is going to age are only being illuminated by the Yankees. Players feel that players should be treated differently. They are for most of their lives. Strawberry laughed at the suggestion that Jeter will ever move positions. He said it will never happen. In other words, he doesn't think it should ever happen. Ah, Andrew, let's not put words in Darryl's mouth. Maybe Darryl, a former outfielder, thinks that the idea of putting a aging shortstop with no range into the outfield won't happen because he thinks A) Derek is a prima donna who won't move for the sake of the team, like he wouldn't move when ARod came, or B) he doesn't think Derek has the skills to pull it off.

Ceetar Jan 26 2011 02:09 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

I need to add "if" Jeter gets 3000 hits this season. Injuries and suckitude aren't out of the question.

Edgy DC Jan 26 2011 02:15 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

I think he'll get there if we all have to look the other way while fielders run halfheartedly after routine flares to make them look like hits.

Ceetar Jan 26 2011 02:20 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Edgy DC wrote: I think he'll get there if we all have to look the other way while fielders run halfheartedly after routine flares to make them look like hits. Well sure, but he's not a spring chicken and it's not like he couldn't twist an ankle diving into stands after he catches a popup and be out 4 months.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jan 26 2011 02:32 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Edgy DC wrote: I think he'll get there if we all have to look the other way while fielders run halfheartedly after routine flares to make them look like hits. So, in tribute to him offensively AND defensively?

Lefty Specialist Jan 26 2011 05:56 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Edgy DC wrote: I don't know. Outfielding isn't that nuanced. If you're a big league ballplayer and legs still work, you can do a passable job. Daniel Murphy says hi.

seawolf17 Jan 26 2011 07:03 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Lefty Specialist wrote: Edgy DC wrote: I don't know. Outfielding isn't that nuanced. If you're a big league ballplayer and legs still work, you can do a passable job. Daniel Murphy says hi. And Todd Hundley says "eff you."

MFS62 Jan 27 2011 06:32 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

When Jeter is moved (to the outfield), there will be stories waxing poetic about how the Yankees have been successful with shortstops moving to center. They will mention past Mantle, Tresh, Murcer and Kubek. Funny though. They will fail to mention that those players were in their 20s when they made the move. (Maybe not Kubek). Later

Edgy DC Jan 27 2011 09:35 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Lefty Specialist wrote: Edgy DC wrote: I don't know. Outfielding isn't that nuanced. If you're a big league ballplayer and legs still work, you can do a passable job. Daniel Murphy says hi. Murphy did a passable job in 2008. He failed in 2009 after working out as a secondbasebman in the offseason and then getting hurt.

Valadius Jan 27 2011 10:08 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

MFS62 wrote: When Jeter is moved (to the outfield), there will be stories waxing poetic about how the Yankees have been successful with shortstops moving to center. They will mention past Mantle, Tresh, Murcer and Kubek. Funny though. They will fail to mention that those players were in their 20s when they made the move. (Maybe not Kubek). Later And they'll completely gloss over Chuck Knoblauch.

Frayed Knot Jan 27 2011 10:23 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Murphy did a passable job in 2008. Not in the outfield he didn't. The general rule is that if someone can handle SS defensively they can handle anywhere else (except catcher). Problem with Muffy was that he was never anything other than a mediocre at best 3B in college or in the minors. When Jeter is moved (to the outfield), there will be stories waxing poetic about how the Yankees have been successful with shortstops moving to center. They will mention past Mantle, Tresh, Murcer and Kubek. Funny though. They will fail to mention that those players were in their 20s when they made the move. (Maybe not Kubek). For the most part (except Kubek) they were moved before their careers ever got going. None of those guys were ever going to cut it as SS - but, hell, you could say the same thing about half the major leaguers, many of whom played SS either in the minors or as amateurs. With Kubek: I hadn't realized he played as much OF as he did although (looking it up) it appears to be more a case of mixing it in here and there rather than an in-career position change ala Banks or Yount. dgwphotography wrote: Nope - I fear they are eying someone else... You wonder if Cashman's statement was a "slip" designed to let Reyes + agent know that they're willing to move Jeter if they can find the right candidate?

Edgy DC Jan 27 2011 10:26 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Frayed Knot wrote: EdgyDC wrote: Murphy did a passable job in 2008. Not in the outfield he didn't. My eyes said he did.

Frayed Knot Jan 27 2011 12:07 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Your eyes need a check-up.

Edgy DC Jan 27 2011 01:44 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

I just checked 'em up at Baseball-Reference who said he was 0.2 defensive wins above replacement.

Valadius Jan 27 2011 02:05 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

Edgy DC wrote: I just checked 'em up at Baseball-Reference who said he was 0.2 defensive wins above replacement. And that's statistically significant how?

Edgy DC Jan 27 2011 02:18 PM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

My statement refers to 2008 and that's baseball-reference's representation of sum total of his performance in 2008.

Lefty Specialist Jan 28 2011 07:22 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

How'd they grade him in 2009? Or, put another way, how low does the scale go?

Edgy DC Jan 28 2011 07:52 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

It's hard to say. He gets a -0.2 dWAR, but I don't know where left field ends and firstbase begins there. Let's not hate. Maybe you can suss it out from the advanced data. I can't.

metirish Jan 28 2011 07:59 AM Re: Cap'n Intangibles to the Outfield Eventually, Sez Cashman

I think it was JCL who last week wondered if Cashman was trying to get fired......Lupica wonders the same this....and no I am not comparing JCL to Lupica......the video below the article has Cashman explaining his thought process on Jeter.....from Foley's pub where he was bartending. http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseb ... chest.html