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Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Frayed Knot Jan 23 2011 09:37 PM

That’s right, we threatened to do this about 16 months ago but, for some reason and despite great interest showed, just never got around to kicking it off. So now, because it’s cold as shit outside, and because we’re still a month away from pitchers & catchers, and because I find the next two weeks the most tedious on the sports calendar -- fourteen days of every geek who can finagle a press credential asking everyone remotely connected to football plus every pseudo-celebrity on the planet some variation of the question: ”so, who do you like in the big game?”, over and over and over and over again -- I went and mined the material from the old thread and have revived this project along with a system to determine an eventual winner ... and we’re going to start it NOW!!!. When we left off last year we had compiled (and when I say ‘We’ I mean ‘Vic Sage’) a comprehensive list consisting of 96 shows which most closely fit a definition of ‘sit-com’** so there should be little or no complaints about what was left out. Divided roughly by decade into six groups of sixteen, we’re going to start by voting within those groups. The top vote getters in each group plus a number of wild-cards will move on to a second round. Those shows making the cut will be re-grouped for another round of voting and after Round 2 we’ll be down to the final sixteen with only a minimum of polls at which point the surviving shows will go into a straight head-to-head bracket-style competition until we have a winner. In Round 1 two polls per day will be put up on each of the next three days; each poll will remain open for 96 hours. Within each group of sixteen you can vote for up to eight choices. So keep a look out in this forum for: - Monday: Groups A & B -- The early years (more or less the 1950s + 1960s). Voting will continue until Friday. - Tuesday: Groups C & D -- Shows from the 1970s & 1980s. Polls close mid-day Saturday. - Wednesday: Groups E & F -- Shows of the 1990s through the present. Polls will close on Sunday. So get ready to get your geek on!!! ** Defined roughly as: 1/2 hour comedy, originally produced on U.S. network, syndication or basic cable. No UK, no animation, no pay cable series, no 1hour shows ... they all have different economic or aesthetic parameters which leads to comparing apples to oranges. As to distinguishing comedy from "dramady" or other genres, a laugh track is a sufficient condition, but not a necessary condition.

Valadius Jan 23 2011 09:57 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

If How I Met Your Mother isn't included in this, the whole concept falls apart. Please ensure that it is.

Edgy DC Jan 24 2011 05:58 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

If My Mother the Car isn't included in this, the whole concept falls apart. Please ensure that it is.

metirish Jan 24 2011 06:09 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Val makes me laugh on a daily basis , so earnest. The only current sitcom I watch is Modern Family, if it's not included. ....

themetfairy Jan 24 2011 06:10 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Seinfeld and Cheers must be on the list, along with All in the Family and The Odd Couple. I am currently into The Office, but I won't have a fit if it doesn't make the cut.

Frayed Knot Jan 24 2011 07:36 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jan 24 2011 10:52 AM

The good news is, that with a list of 96 shows, there's very little that was left out so your favorite is probably included. The bad news is that we did have to combine some shows for space reasons so there'll be an entry in one of the polls for 'How I Met My Mother the Car 54 Where are You' And really, do you think that our own Vic Sage, a man who has been known to create entire threads and filmologies just upon the mere mention of an actor's name, is going to concoct a deficient list and leave out deserving shows? Well maybe he did, I don't know, but the time to argue about what should and shouldn't be included was in last year's thread. As of now the time to hesitate is through; there's no time to wallow in the mire; Now you can only choose; and cast your vote for Gomer Pyle ... or something like that. Polling will start around noon.

TransMonk Jan 24 2011 07:37 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

themetfairy wrote: I am currently into The Office, but I won't have a fit if it doesn't make the cut. I will...best show of the 00's, IMO.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jan 24 2011 08:04 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Valadius wrote: If How I Met Your Mother isn't included in this, the whole concept falls apart. Please ensure that it is. This is why it never got started.

Ceetar Jan 24 2011 10:31 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jan 24 2011 11:12 AM

Edgy DC didn't wrote: If Gilligan's Planet isn't included in this, the whole concept falls apart. Please ensure that it is.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jan 24 2011 10:42 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

If Centripetal Forceisn't included in this, the whole planet falls apart. Please ensure that it is.

Edgy DC Jan 24 2011 11:00 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Ceetar wrote: Edgy DC wrote: If Gilligan's Planet isn't included in this, the whole concept falls apart. Please ensure that it is. Wait. No, I didn't.

Ceetar Jan 24 2011 11:11 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Edgy DC wrote: Edgy DC wrote: If Gilligan's Planet is like the bestest show eva! Wait. No, I didn't. Oh, I meant to delete the tag. oops.

Edgy DC Jan 24 2011 11:12 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Laughing. Ass. Off.

Vic Sage Jan 24 2011 01:39 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

i think the last grouping of sitcoms (the one that includes current ones) may need some quick re-evaluation, since the list was made like forever ago, and probably doesn't include current shows that have broken through this past season. i really don't remember. do you have a link to those threads?

Frayed Knot Jan 24 2011 02:25 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Not forever, just a year ago October and not that much has changed since. Here's what's on deck for the most recent era: Everybody loves Raymond (1996-2005) Office, The (2005-Present) 30 Rock (2006-Present) Scrubs (2001-2009) Will & Grace (1998-2006) How I Met Your Mother (2005-Present) 2 & 1/2 Men (2003-Present) My Name is Earl (2005-2009) It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia (2005-Present) Big Bang Theory (2007-Present) Arrested Development (2003-2006) King of Queens (1998-2007) That 70s show (1998-2006) Just Shoot Me (1997-2003) Malcolm in the Middle (2000-2006) Bernie Mac (2001-2006) Six of the sixteen are currently running; a couple others recently ended. If you want to edit, someone mentioned 'Modern Family' as a current fave and that was a show just kicking off at the time. But that still means it's got just one season plus a partial second under its belt and one of the inclusion criteria seemed to be shows that had shown at least some kind of longevity. Plus, you'd have to kick something else out just to get it in and while I'm sure there will be no shortage of suggestions the idea wasn't to pre-select favorites before the voting even begins. Ditto for 'Parks & Recreation' or 'Community', etc. Maybe when we're voting on the 'Twenty-Teens' era in ten years those will be high on the list having just finished decade-long runs on network TV (assuming network TV still exits ten years from now) but I'm not sure there's a lot of perspective on them just yet.

seawolf17 Jan 24 2011 02:47 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Never even heard of "Philadelphia." I'd bump that for "Modern Family." But that's just me. Is "Community" too new to be listed? (Am I biased because I'm a college administrator and know every one of those students?)

Benjamin Grimm Jan 24 2011 02:53 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Community and Modern Family are both of the same age; debuted in the 2009-10 season. It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia is, from what I understand, about a group of unlikable people. (I've never seen it, so I could be getting that wrong.) Danny Devito is one of the stars. It's on the CW network.

Benjamin Grimm Jan 24 2011 02:55 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

If it was on the list, Everybody Hates Chris would have gotten a vote from me.

Vic Sage Jan 24 2011 03:27 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

yeah, despite the sudden success of MODERN FAMILY, i think we need more than 1 season of a current show to put it in the running. No other 1 season show has had MF's success justifying further review. carry on.

Valadius Jan 24 2011 03:48 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I'm surprised that no animated sitcoms appear to have been considered. The Flintstones ought to have squeezed in somewhere in the first two eras we're voting on. Maybe that's the next thing we ought to do a World Series of.

TransMonk Jan 24 2011 03:53 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Wouldn't The Simpsons win any animated World Series of Television? Hardly worth the effort.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jan 24 2011 06:00 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Community and Modern Family are both of the same age; debuted in the 2009-10 season. It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia is, from what I understand, about a group of unlikable people. (I've never seen it, so I could be getting that wrong.) Danny Devito is one of the stars. It's on the CW network. It originated/continues to air on FX. Think "Absolutely Fabulous" or "Married With Children," or "Seinfeld"-with-a-white-trash-bent (insofar as the characters are stunningly self-absorbed and shallow), only single-camera and sans laugh track. It has some definite moments.

Ashie62 Jan 24 2011 09:34 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Glee?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jan 25 2011 10:02 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Hourlong, not a straight sitcom.

Frayed Knot Jan 28 2011 06:47 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Just a reminder that the voting for Groups A & B will close later this morning - so anyone who has yet to vote or wants to change or augment their votes (yes, you can still do that) needs to do so in the next few hours. The voting for Groups C & D close late morning tomorrow, and for E & F on Sunday.

Frayed Knot Jan 30 2011 08:24 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

So - thanks to your voting over the past week - 2/3 of the shows have now been eliminated and the brackets are set for the remaining 32 shows to move onto Round 2 beginning on Monday. The two shows with the most votes from each bracket were selected as top seeds and the rest of the field was filled by the next twenty highest totals from across the groups as wild cards. This way each era was guaranteed some representation but the total list still reflects the overall tastes and demographics of this crowd. In all, the 1970’s era group garnered the most votes with 189 total, followed by the 1960s (183), the 1950s (161), the 1980s (159), the 1990s (138), with the most recent group bringing up the rear (126). Not sure I would have guessed that order coming in. In addition to the two automatic qualifiers from each group, there were 2 Wild Card selections from Group A, 6 from B, 5 from C, 4 from D, 2 from E, and 1 from F. A very big UN-congratulations goes to ‘Petticoat Junction’ for being the only show on the list to take the dreaded collar. ‘Maude’ and ‘Alice’ managed a single vote each. From that we can only conclude that the CPF is misogynistic. The shows will be seeded into the new brackets not by era but as per the results of round 1 votes and divided into four roughly balanced brackets of eight shows each. Two groups will go up on each Monday & Tuesday and I’ll leave the voting open for 72 hours. Top [u:1445estz]Twelve[/u:1445estz] show advance to the knock-out round with the winner in each group getting a one-round bye.

Fman99 Jan 30 2011 08:32 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I am erect with anticipation (and gin).

Edgy DC Jan 30 2011 08:33 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Can you post a list of the eliminated?

Frayed Knot Jan 30 2011 08:53 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Going ... Going ... GONE Getting 12 votes each but falling one short of making it (or at least making it into a run-off): F Troop (Wah!!) Hogan’s Heroes Mister Ed Also not seeing Round 2 action: With 11 votes each: Brady Bunch (of losers) Car 54, Where are You? (not in Round 2, that's where) Everybody Loves Raymond (Not ENOUGH people liked Raymond apparently) and (too few) Friends With 10 votes each: Abbott & Costello Burns & Allen My Favorite Martian Phil Silvers (Sgt Bilko) Scrubs ... (SEE, I didn't rig it) 9 votes: Big Bang Theory Home Improvement It’s Gary Shandling’s Show Sports Night Welcome Back Kotter 8 votes: Diff'rent Strokes How I met Your Mother (sorry Val) Mad About You Malcolm in the Middle Roseanne Sanford & Son Soap 7 votes: Dobie Gillis, Many Loves of Golden Girls Good Times King of Queens Mork & Mindy Murphy Brown My Three Sons Spin City That 70s Show Three’s Company 6 votes: Beverly Hillbillies Fresh Prince 5 votes: Drew Carey Facts of Life Green Acres It's always Sunny in Philadelphia My Name is Earl One Day At a Time Will & Grace 4 votes: Alf Donna Reed Make Room for Daddy Partridge Family Who’s the Boss? 3 votes: 2 & 1/2 Men (at least it got more than 2-1/2 votes) Boy Meets World Gomer Pyle Laverne & Shirley Nanny Ozzie & Harriet Wings 2 votes: Bernie Mac Hazel Just Shoot Me Real McCoys Silver Spoons That Girl 1 vote: Alice Maude 0 votes: Petticoat Junction

Edgy DC Jan 30 2011 09:07 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

The big surprise there is Rosanne, a show which --- more than perhaps any on this list --- featured totally reconizeable people, even as the star grew totally surreal. After that is The Partridge Family, a show which (a) rocked, (b) had Danny, (c) had Ruben Kinkaid, and (d) is totally watchable to this day, I don't care what you say.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jan 30 2011 09:16 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Roseanne is a travesty. It IMO prolly deserved a top 10 or maybe top 5 finish.

batmagadanleadoff Jan 30 2011 09:18 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms Edited 3 time(s), most recently on Jan 30 2011 10:26 PM

I was surprised that Soap fared so poorly, especially since it was grouped in the most heavily voted bracket. Soap was groundbreaking and outrageously funny. Richard Mulligan might've been the best physical comedian of that era. I'd rank Soap among my personal top 20 of all time. [youtube]GKRFmpWLTwg[/youtube] I never watched any Roseanne. So I don't know about that one.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jan 30 2011 09:20 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Roseanne is a travesty. It IMO prolly deserved a top 10 or maybe top 5 finish. A-fucking-men.

Frayed Knot Jan 30 2011 09:22 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Roseanne is a travesty. It IMO prolly deserved a top 10 or maybe top 5 finish. I saw one-half of one show and thought she in particular was so bad that I never watched another minute of its entire run.

batmagadanleadoff Jan 30 2011 09:24 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Time Magazine included both Soap and Roseanne in its list of top 100 TV shows. And that list includes all TV shows, not just sitcoms.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jan 30 2011 09:31 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Frayed Knot wrote: John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Roseanne is a travesty. It IMO prolly deserved a top 10 or maybe top 5 finish. I saw one-half of one show and thought she in particular was so bad that I never watched another minute of its entire run. Everyone's entitled to their opinion. Willie Mays wasn't a unianimous HoF inductee.

Benjamin Grimm Jan 31 2011 07:15 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I've seen very little Roseanne, and didn't think much of it. I'm very surprised that it's getting respect here! I've always thought of it in the category of shows like The Nanny and Family Matters. (Two other shows that I've seen very little of.) The shows that I'm most sorry missed the cut are Burns and Allen and Raymond.

dgwphotography Jan 31 2011 07:27 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Time Magazine included both Soap and Roseanne in its list of top 100 TV shows. And that list includes all TV shows, not just sitcoms. and Ayatullah Khomeini was once their man of the year... Roseanne was good for one season, then she became a train wreck, and no amount of talent around her could save it.

Edgy DC Jan 31 2011 07:35 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Rosanne Barr was a trash-talking train wreck, but not Rosanne Connor. I've given up on TV and don't watch it no more, so let me say, "No way does Rosanne compare to those shows." Rosanne is remarkable for a lot of reasons, but the courage of its ordinariness is most striking --- and not in a "har, har, look at this white trash" sort of way. The kids had bad haircuts, ugly TJ Maxx sweaters, and no visible stage makeup (apart from the cheapo lip gloss the older wannabe girl wore) and were the sort of dime-a-dozen that would be afterthoughts in most schools. The little boy was presented pretty much borderline autistic --- certainly far along the spectrum. The only one that exhibited any of the precociousness that is standard for sitcom kids was the middle daughter --- and she expressed it in chilling contempt for her family. John Goodman plays a sheetrock contractor. You'd figure they'd make his blue-collar working-manness a noble trait. He owns his own business, sets his own hours, provides for his family, gives an honest hour for honest money --- but he fucking hates it. And her job (at the start of the series) is even more demeaning. A plastic fork factory, working for an ambitious young George Clooney, alternately charming and douchey at the same time as he forces a staff of all women to pull unscheduled overtime. And there's no campy "Is this the living end or what?" about it. They somehow wrest meaning in their family and friends from this dehumanizing life. There's this great episode finding humor in American pathos: the father gets arrested for beating up the boyfriend who beat on his sister-in-law, and the (by now, borderline delinquent) middle daughter gets dispatched to bail him out. But she shows up, looks at him through the bars, and can't resist: "Well, I bet you didn't imagine this scene playing out quite like this, did you?" "Darlene, will you just get me out?!" "Well, things have changed while you've been on the inside. Mom says we have a new daddy now." The tone of it is perfect, as they all go through the emotions of this awful day doing everything they can to take it in stride as they protect their neurotic aunt.

Frayed Knot Jan 31 2011 08:04 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Again, quite possibly a show I gave up on too quickly, but my one impression of it was that of dialog being so clearly directed for the sole purpose of her getting in a wise-ass line as if to show that Rosanne Connor WAS Rosanne Barr, and then her delivering it with body language that just screamed; 'OK, here's the spot where I deliver my wise-ass line ... get ready for it because here it comes ... don't want to miss it now do ya'. I hit the remote so quickly after that I sprained a thumb.

Centerfield Jan 31 2011 08:13 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I stayed away from Roseanne for the longest time because of its "star". But after catching an episode or two, I was surprised to see how good the show was. I think it would have done a lot better had it been named anything else.

Vic Sage Jan 31 2011 08:28 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

it at least aspired to be authentically working class family sitcom. I liked it early; when they pulled a Darren on the older daughter, it hit a pothole in the road... when Sandra Bernhardt, showed up, the hole became a chasm. And when they got rich, it fell deep into the abyss. But that often happens to long-running shows and, at its best, it was as good as anything else on the air.

Vic Sage Jan 31 2011 08:33 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

FK, i'm loving your methodology.

Frayed Knot Jan 31 2011 08:37 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Vic Sage wrote: FK, i'm loving your methodology. That's what she said! (wait ... what?)

Centerfield Jan 31 2011 09:19 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

One question, are we voting for what we think were the best shows? Or are we voting for personal favorites?

batmagadanleadoff Jan 31 2011 09:52 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jan 31 2011 10:59 AM

Centerfield wrote: One question, are we voting for what we think were the best shows? Or are we voting for personal favorites? I dunno, but I've decided for myself that in the knockout round phase of this tournament, I'm going to abstain from voting on any head to head matchups unless I'm familiar with both of the shows involved.

Edgy DC Jan 31 2011 09:56 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

f we have enough respect for ourselves, there shouldn't be too much distinction.

Centerfield Jan 31 2011 10:26 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Ideally, but I am too young to have seen a lot of these (or at least, appreciate them) but I know full-well the importance of these shows, even if there is no personal connection. Others became favorites of mine just by being around when I was a kid.

Edgy DC Jan 31 2011 10:31 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

It's not like objectivity is needed. It's not presidents or elements or military powers we're voting on. It's TV sitcoms. The only purpose is to delight. If a more highly reputed show didn't delight you as much a lesser reputed (or "important" one) don't pull the trigger. Interestingly enough, I saw maybe two episodes of Newhart's 1980s show. Maybe. I never got around to watching it, but I saw why everybody liked it, so I voted for it. I feel funny about that, though.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jan 31 2011 10:44 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jan 31 2011 10:56 AM

Vic Sage wrote: it at least aspired to be authentically working class family sitcom. I liked it early; when they pulled a Darren on the older daughter, it hit a pothole in the road... when Sandra Bernhardt, showed up, the hole became a chasm. And when they got rich, it fell deep into the abyss. But that often happens to long-running shows and, at its best, it was as good as anything else on the air. The "Darren" switch didn't come until about Season 5 or 6. (OE: Season 6.) Bernhard showed up earlier-- season 4 or so (OE: yup)-- but wasn't unavoidable until much later (OE: okay, the next season). Whether it's the money issues-- which, outside of Good Times, hadn't really been addressed well and in any meaningful way on family sitcoms-- or the constant battles of teens and parents, or adults dealing with the failings of very real, very flawed parents... Roseanne at its best dealt with an ultrawide range of subject matter in a straightforward way. More importantly, unlike, say, M*A*S*H*, it actually located some gutbusting comedy in these things. Also, between Goodman and Metcalf and 2/3 of the kids, as well as some of the supporting cast... THIS was close to an all-time ensemble, as well.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jan 31 2011 10:51 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Yeah, the issue with this contest is that ultimately most shows will go down to defeat because people who didn't watch them will be asked to vote on them, not necessarily that the show(s) up against them were/are superior.

metsmarathon Jan 31 2011 10:56 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

if the older show was good enough, it would've been showed in rerun after rerun after rerun, giving all of us younger folks a chance to watch it. like the honeymooners, or gilligans island. if the newer show is good enough, it would draw in even the old fogeys on the board. like the office or, uh... walker texas ranger.

batmagadanleadoff Jan 31 2011 11:08 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Burns & Allen has to be one of the all-timers. I remember B&A reruns as a teenager in the late '70's -- I'm guessing on WPIX right after the Honeymooners. A few years ago (during the Willie Ugh Randolph era) I picked up a few B&A DVD's in a Rite Aid or Duane Reade. Each DVD sold for 99 cents and was packaged on the cheap in a paper envelope -- four episodes to a DVD. The image quality was the crappy bootleg kind. This wasn't no fancy remaster job done by a major studio with the right resources. I thought that B&A was as clever as any modern show, even 50 years after the fact. B&A was laugh out loud good. Yet I'd speculate that it hasn't been in reruns in close to 30 years.

Benjamin Grimm Jan 31 2011 01:02 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I caught a few episodes of Burns and Allen on cable while I was living in my current house (I've been here since 2000) but it came and went so quickly that I barely had time to savor them. (I think it was TV Land, but I'm not sure.) I discovered George and Gracie when you did, during the 70's on Channel 11. And to metsmarathon: I wish it was true that great shows end up in reruns. I mean, they do, but they eventually stop being rerun. There's no opportunity today to discover shows like Mary Tyler Moore or Dick Van Dyke or The Odd Couple; instead the shows being rerun are things like The Nanny and Fresh Prince and (UGH!) Full House.

Vic Sage Jan 31 2011 01:13 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I wish it was true that great shows end up in reruns. I mean, they do, but they eventually stop being rerun. There's no opportunity today to discover shows like Mary Tyler Moore or Dick Van Dyke or The Odd Couple; instead the shows being rerun are things like The Nanny and Fresh Prince and (UGH!) Full House. It'll be interesting to see how the new technologies affect this part of the tv industry. With shows available on demand and online, on your phone, your computer, and your cable tv, 24/7, will shows ever really be unavailable? Of course the marketing hype that a media company/channel/etc puts behind a particular broadcast/schedule/program niche will be largely absent, but "repeats" will be whatever it is you want to watch again. I know one thing, i'll be happy to watch BURNS & ALLEN again long after Fran Drescher's voice is no more than an unpleasant childhood memory for future generations.

Vic Sage Jan 31 2011 01:19 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

As to "best" vs "favorite", this is a long-standing debate on our board. The answer has always seemed to me to vote on whatever criteria you choose, and let god (or, in this case, FK) sort it out. In any event, if enough of us vote, the consensus reached will only create a portrait of us, not the shows. If we want to have a more scholarly approach, then that is not arrived at by polls. It has to do with theories, evidence, debate... rigorous attempts do establish definitioins, criteria, methodologies... not really appropriate to an online Mets bulletin board. Although, i'm game!

Frayed Knot Jan 31 2011 02:11 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

and let god (or, in this case, FK) sort it out. You give those choices as if there's a difference.

Vic Sage Jan 31 2011 03:08 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

not in my cosmology... you rock, Deus Knottus!

batmagadanleadoff Jan 31 2011 03:09 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

dgwphotography wrote: batmagadanleadoff wrote: Time Magazine included both Soap and Roseanne in its list of top 100 TV shows. And that list includes all TV shows, not just sitcoms. and Ayatullah Khomeini was once their man of the year... Yeah, but at least the Ayatollah's TV show -- All in the Embassy -- didn't crack Time's top 100 list.

Vic Sage Feb 01 2011 03:21 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

25 sitcoms (as we've defined them) listed on Time mag's 2007 list of "top 100 tv shows" The Abbott and Costello Show All in the Family Arrested Development The Bob Newhart Show Buffalo Bill Cheers The Cosby Show The Dick Van Dyke Show Friends The George Burns and Gracie Allen Show The Honeymooners I Love Lucy Leave It to Beaver Married... With Children The Mary Tyler Moore Show M*A*S*H The Monkees The Odd Couple The Office Roseanne Sanford and Son Seinfeld Soap Taxi WKRP in Cincinnati Our little exercised missed only WKRP and BUFFALO BILL, neither of which was likely to make it to a final round, but they were unfortunate oversights. My bad.

Frayed Knot Feb 01 2011 03:40 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I remember Buffalo Bill getting some critical acclaim in its time, but it also only had about 2 dozen episodes over parts of two seasons to its credit which put it in a kind of iffy situation. WKRP was our one big swing-and-miss here which was a shame as I suspect it would have been at least a round 2 participant. I thought we might need a small run-off election to break ties among shows fighting for the final spots at the end of round 1 and, if so, I was going to grant special dispensation to WKRP and throw it into that sink-or-swim poll - but it turned out that the 32-show cut-off fell exactly on a break in voting (13 votes = in, 12 meant you were out) so I just let it slide.

Willets Point Feb 01 2011 05:07 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Smoldering Jan Smithers looks back on you in anger. WKRP was better than at least half of the shows nominated.

metirish Feb 01 2011 05:29 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Not many could get away with wearing white jeans......she could though.....hot

Benjamin Grimm Feb 02 2011 06:51 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

My daughter is watching Happy Days in the next room. Chachi just made some kind of a deal with Satan's nephew Melvin. What a stupid fucking show.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Feb 02 2011 07:00 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

might wana look back at the archives but we'd addressed the krp oversight in the runup to the aborted first atempt. wi think we're working here with a proto version of that final list.

Edgy DC Feb 02 2011 07:04 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

How will Fonzie get him out of that?!

Frayed Knot Feb 03 2011 06:19 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Deadline reminder to cast or update your votes in for Round 2. The polls for Groups A & B close in just a few hours; Group C & D voting will close mid-morning on Friday.

Frayed Knot Feb 06 2011 10:01 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

So Round 2 ends with 'Barney Miller' pulling out a closely contested run-off election for the twelfth and final spot in the knockout round Your Survivors: These top four shows, on the basis of earning the most votes in round 2, get a bye for the next go-around -- Archie gets to kick back at Kelsey’s bar for a while as All in the Family gets the overall top seed -- a bye week means free rounds at Cheers for the next few days, something which will make Norm very happy -- the Taxi stand is closed for the week; Louie will use the time off to hit on Nardo -- The Odd Couple’s strong round 2 showing means Oscar heads to the track while Felix finally finds time to defrost the freezer Other surviving shows in order of seeding: - Bob Newhart Show -- despite tighter voting choices and tougher competition in round 2, this show showed the biggest voting increase over round 1 - Honeymooners - the leading vote getter in round 1 slipped a bit as the competition got tougher - Seinfeld -- no bye for you! - Mary Tyler Moore -- don’t cry Mary, you’re still in it - M*A*S*H -- I wonder if Tuttle voted? - Dick Van Dyke -- Dick stumbles a bit (see what I did there?) but hangs on - I Love Lucy - showed the largest decrease from round 1 to round 2 and ... - Barney Miller, winner of Survivor: CPF GONE!! In addition to the just eliminated ‘Get Smart’ and ‘The Office’, these shows are also going home Arrested Development - Quirky show got a ton of critical acclaim but never enough rating points or, seemingly, support from the network 30 Rock - Another critical darling goes down and, with it, the final entrant from the most recent decade DOWN GOES FRAIZER ... DOWN GOES FRAIZER ... DOWN GOES FRAIZER News Radio - Maybe if Phil Hartman was around longer it could have cemented a better legacy Newhart - 1980s Bob less well-liked than 1970s Bob I Dream of Jeannie - Dreams of young boys only take a show so far Night Court - The verdict was not favorable Married ... with Children - Dreams of older boys only take a show so far Monkees - Lasted too long, not long enough, or never should have been allowed in the pile in the first place depending on your view Happy Days -- The child of ‘American Graffitti’ and an episode of ‘Love American Style’ heads off to the drive-in for a chocolate shake Cosby -- TV returns to warm, fuzzy family adventures only this time with darker faces Munsters -- Finished behind ‘The Addams Family’ in round 1, beat them out this time Addams Family -- see above Gilligan’s Island -- Turns out the real answer is NEITHER Ginger or Mary Ann Family Ties -- Michael J. Fox still has no Elvis in him Bewitched -- No magic here Andy Griffith -- Too old and dated is my guess here. Plus you just don't get to see them during Braves rain delays like you used to Leave it to Beaver -- see above. Just avoided being shut-out So what remains now is essentially an NFL-style playoff without the conference break-up: - 12 shows ranked in order of 'regular season' prowess and with the top 4 getting early byes; - the remaining 8 face off in a single elimination head-to-head match-up for the right to do the same against the top shows. 11 such match-ups later and we'll have the CPF all-time sit-com winner. Competition resumes on Monday.

Frayed Knot Feb 09 2011 09:12 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

First knock-out round is now over and it's on to the quarterfinals All the higher rated shows moved on - which makes sense when you think about it seeing as how those voting on the shows were the same ones who voted them to a higher seed in the first place. Moving on to meet the top seeded shows are: - Mary Tyler Moore - winner over M*A*SH by a score of 16-12 - Bob Newhart Show - defeated Barney Miller 16-11 - Honeymooners - dispatched I Love Lucy 19-10 - Seinfeld - at the expense of Dick Van Dyke 17-11 Quarterfinal matchups will be up later today. Voting will be open through Friday afternoon.

Benjamin Grimm Feb 09 2011 09:39 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

My choices went 3 and 1 in this round. The only loser that I backed was Dick Van Dyke.

Edgy DC Feb 09 2011 10:07 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Sheesh, where's the referential commentary --- "Honeymooners sends Lucy to the Moon1"; "Seinfeld Trips Up Van Dyke!"? I thought that was the whole purpose of this exercise.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 09 2011 10:20 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Benjamin Grimm Feb 09 2011 12:17 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Five of the final eight shows are set in New York City. (And it could have been six out of eight if Barney Miller had beaten Bob Newhart.) I wonder if, as New Yorkers ourselves, if that led us to prefer them over shows from places like Mayberry or LA, or if it's more a result of the quantity of shows set in the Big Apple. Of course, there were many New York City (Friends, Mad About You) and suburban (Raymond, Dick Van Dyke, Bewitched) shows that didn't make it this far.

Edgy DC Feb 09 2011 12:20 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

To some extent, that's true. To a larger extent, there're a lot of shows set in New York. Minneapolis? Probably one.

Vic Sage Feb 09 2011 01:52 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

this exercise is more about us then the shows... its more a reflection of our demographics than the history of sitcoms. which is fine, i think.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 09 2011 02:09 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Tricky matchups, these. If you care to make your vote an informed one, you can check some samples-- in some case, entire seasons-- at Hulu... The Bob Newhart Show The Mary Tyler Moore Show The others aren't there. But a host of other, eliminated shows are: Barney Miller, Arrested Development, 30 Rock, Soap, The Office, Newsradio, Dick Van Dyke... Taxi, Cheers, The Odd Couple and AitF are all over TV Land, though, and Seinfeld and Cheers are still being syndicated locally.

Edgy DC Feb 09 2011 02:39 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Vic Sage wrote: this exercise is more about us then the shows... its more a reflection of our demographics than the history of sitcoms. which is fine, i think. The funny thing is --- our prejudices or not --- if we voted a sitcom character Hall of Fame, the plaques would be so Yankee-hat-free and Met-hat-rich it would be silly. Early inductees would include Met-hatters Oscar Madison, Archie Bunker, and Jerry Seinfeld. George Jefferson comes later. Ralph Kramden --- while they probably raised his blood pressure to the point where his doctor said to steer clear --- you know had a Dodgers jones in his formative years. Toody and Muldoon can likewise be inferred to be brokenhearted Giants fans. Howard Cunningham raised a Braves-loving family. Lou Grant crushed on the Twins. BJ Cunniningham dug the Giants even before they came to his hometown of San Francisco, and you know about Klinger and the Mud Hens. But what do the Yankees get? George Costanza on a technicality and a veterans' committee selection like Joey Tribbiani? Suckers.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Feb 09 2011 07:33 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

tribiani's a complete douche.

Edgy DC Feb 09 2011 07:58 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

That's actually what it would say on his plaque.

Willets Point Feb 09 2011 08:05 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

One of the few episodes I can recall of "Mr. Ed" featured the eponymous horse trying out for Leo Durocher at Dodgers Stadium.

Edgy DC Feb 09 2011 08:08 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

There you go --- Mr. Ed? Dodger fan. Herman and Grandpa Munster? Dodger fans. Greg Brady? Both Chris Partridges? Dodger fans. Everybody on Cheers? Sox fans. We're not in first ballot territory here, but still. Poor Yankees.

G-Fafif Feb 09 2011 08:13 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

In one Edpisode, the horse told Wilbur he lost more often than the Mets. "Fuck you, Mr. Ed," I thought to myself.

Frayed Knot Feb 11 2011 02:20 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Your CPF Final Four: Odd Couple All in the Family Honeymooners Seinfeld Semis begin on Monday -- Finals (including a 3/4 consolation match) on Wednesday

Benjamin Grimm Feb 11 2011 02:25 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I'm pleased. Three great shows. (And Seinfeld.) I think the final battle should be a showdown between All in the Family and The Honeymooners. And that's still in play.

Willets Point Feb 11 2011 02:36 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

An all New York City semifinal. Are you sure this thing is not rigged geographically? The Boston fans will forever curse the name of Jerry Bleepin' Seinfeld.

batmagadanleadoff Feb 11 2011 04:40 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Willets Point wrote: One of the few episodes I can recall of "Mr. Ed" featured the eponymous horse trying out for Leo Durocher at Dodgers Stadium. Talk about recycling a plot. Herman Munster also tried out for Durocher (The Munsters) And so did Jodie Dallas (Soap).

Frayed Knot Feb 11 2011 04:49 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Leo may have been a lot of things, but camera-shy wasn't one of them.

batmagadanleadoff Feb 11 2011 07:40 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Wilbur, Ed and Sandy. Don and Mike. Keith, Jerry and George

Kong76 Feb 11 2011 07:58 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Frayed Knot wrote: Your CPF Final Four: Odd Couple All in the Family Honeymooners Seinfeld Funny, I have four seasons of Odd Couple, like six of All in the Family, all of The Honeymooners and a bunch of 'lost' episodes and skits on DVD's of the final four. Would anyone really buy a Seinfeld season? I like the show, but it's not looking classic in this list. All in the Family should win in a landslide!!

themetfairy Feb 11 2011 08:13 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

We have Seinfeld Seasons 1 and 2. It was part of our 2009-2010 offseason DVD viewing.

Kong76 Feb 12 2011 01:43 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Those are the seasons to own, if you're gonna buy. What I meant was the show (for me) was/is shown so much on mul- tiple channels in syndication that I feel like I've seen each episode ten times at least.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 12 2011 06:20 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Seasons 3 (George gets a massage and "it" moves, peeing in the parking garage, George and Jerry co-opt a Nazi's limo, the Keith episodes) through 6 (George with the MFYs, "The Kiss Hello," "Assman" and The Fusilli Jerry, Poppy/make-your-own-pizza/abortion, The Jimmy and Mel Torme) are probably the Seinfeld prime.

Benjamin Grimm Feb 12 2011 06:34 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I was trying to find the episode that was the last straw, that made me stop watching Seinfeld, and I think it was this one. If so, I lasted longer than I thought I did. I did return to watch the final episode, but I would have guessed that it was after more than a one-year layoff. I was probably discontented with the show for a while before that episode. I wouldn't have given it up just for one bad show.

The Second Spitter Feb 12 2011 07:31 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: [...] through 6 (George with the MFYs, "The Kiss Hello," "Assman" and The Fusilli Jerry, Poppy/make-your-own-pizza/abortion, The Jimmy and Mel Torme) are probably the Seinfeld prime. The Face Painter was 6, as well.

Kong76 Feb 12 2011 07:56 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Not really looking to start a Seiney season debate here. *insert envelope filtered bass little riff thingy**

themetfairy Feb 12 2011 08:03 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Seasons 3 (George gets a massage and "it" moves, peeing in the parking garage, George and Jerry co-opt a Nazi's limo, the Keith episodes) through 6 (George with the MFYs, "The Kiss Hello," "Assman" and The Fusilli Jerry, Poppy/make-your-own-pizza/abortion, The Jimmy and Mel Torme) are probably the Seinfeld prime. Seasons 3-5 were great. And, initially, Season 5 was supposed to be the last one. But the network offered Seinfeld a dumptruck full of money to continue the show - Jerry took it, but Larry David walked away anyway. Once he left, the quality of the scripts fell precipitously. I loved the arc of Season 5 - basically, Jerry's parents were forced to leave their retirement facility in Florida because George's parents took back the marble rye.

Fman99 Feb 12 2011 08:35 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

"So, Don, you want to go get a martini after the shoot?" "Sorry, Robert, I, uh, like vaginas."

Benjamin Grimm Feb 14 2011 11:21 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Interesting (a little) that of the final four shows, two are white-collar Manhattan shows, and two are blue-collar outer borough shows. Despite being a white collar guy myself, who has no memory of living in Brooklyn but lived for four year (in college) in Manhattan, in both cases I'm going for the blue-collar outer-borough shows.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 14 2011 11:28 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Said might call that "Orientalist."

G-Fafif Feb 14 2011 12:10 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Interesting (a little) that of the final four shows, two are white-collar Manhattan shows, and two are blue-collar outer borough shows. Despite being a white collar guy myself, who has no memory of living in Brooklyn but lived for four year (in college) in Manhattan, in both cases I'm going for the blue-collar outer-borough shows. Felix favored pastels. Oscar's collars were grungy. Did the puffy shirt even have a collar?

Frayed Knot Feb 18 2011 08:02 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Feb 18 2011 11:26 AM

CPF Sit-Com World Series Final Standings PLACE SHOW Eliminated 1st All in the Family WINNER 2nd The Odd Couple Finals 3rd The Honeymooners Semifinals 4th Seinfeld Semifinals 5th Cheers Quarterfinals 6th Taxi Quarterfinals 7th Mary Tyler Moore Quarterfinals 8th Bob Newhart Show Quarterfinals 9th M*A*S*H 3rd Round 10th Dick Van Dyke Show 3rd Round 11th Barney Miller 3rd Round 12th I Love Lucy 3rd Round 13th Get Smart 2nd Round 14th The Office 2nd Round 15th Arrested Development 2nd Round 16th 30 Rock 2nd Round 17th Frazier 2nd Round T-18th Newsradio 2nd Round T-18th Newhart 2nd Round 20th I Dream of Jeannie 2nd Round 21st Night Court 2nd Round 22nd Married … with Children 2nd Round 23rd The Monkees 2nd Round 24th Happy Days 2nd Round 25th Cosby Show 2nd Round 26th Munsters 2nd Round 27th Addams Family 2nd Round 28th Gilligan’s Island 2nd Round 29th Family Ties 2nd Round 30th Bewitched 2nd Round 31st Andy Griffith 2nd Round 32nd Leave It to Beaver 2nd Round T-33rd F-Troop 1st Round T-33rd Hogan’s Heroes 1st Round T-33rd Mister Ed 1st Round T-36th The Brady Bunch 1st Round T-36th Car 54, Where are You 1st Round T-36th Everybody Loves Raymond 1st Round T-36th Friends 1st Round T-40th Abbott & Costello 1st Round T-40th Burns & Allen 1st Round T-40th My Favorite Martian 1st Round T-40th Phil Silvers (Sgt Bilko) 1st Round T-40th Scrubs 1st Round T-45th Big Bang Theory 1st Round T-45th Home Improvement 1st Round T-45th It’s Gary Shandling’s Show 1st Round T-45th Sports Night 1st Round T-45th Welcome Back Kotter 1st Round T-50th Diff’rent Strokes 1st Round T-50th How I Met Your Mother 1st Round T-50th Mad About You 1st Round T-50th Malcolm in the Middle 1st Round T-50th Roseanne 1st Round T-50th Sanford & Son 1st Round T-50th Soap 1st Round T-57th Many Lives of Dobie Gillis 1st Round T-57th Golden Girls 1st Round T-57th Good Times 1st Round T-57th King of Queens 1st Round T-57th Mork & Mindy 1st Round T-57th Murphy Brown 1st Round T-57th My Three Sons 1st Round T-57th Spin City 1st Round T-57th That 70s Show 1st Round T-57th Three’s Company 1st Round T-67th Beverly Hillbillies 1st Round T-67th Fresh Prince 1st Round T-69th Drew Carey 1st Round T-69th Facts of Life 1st Round T-69th Green Acres 1st Round T-69th It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia 1st Round T-69th My Name is Earl 1st Round T-69th One Day At a Time 1st Round T-69th Will & Grace 1st Round T-76th Alf 1st Round T-76th Donna Reed Show 1st Round T-76th Make Room for Daddy 1st Round T-76th Partridge Family 1st Round T-76th Who’s the Boss? 1st Round T-81st 2 & 1/2 Men 1st Round T-81st Boy Meets World 1st Round T-81st Gomer Pyle 1st Round T-81st Laverne & Shirley 1st Round T-81st Nanny 1st Round T-81st Ozzie & Harriet 1st Round T-81st Wings 1st Round T-88th Bernie Mac 1st Round T-88th Hazel 1st Round T-88th Just Shoot Me 1st Round T-88th Real McCoys 1st Round T-88th Silver Spoons 1st Round T-88th That Girl 1st Round T-94th Alice 1st Round T-94th Maude 1st Round 96th Petticoat Junction 1st Round 1st Round -- 96 shows were voted down to 32 2nd Round -- 32 shows were shaved down to 12 3rd round -- 4 byes, remaining 8 shows down to 4 via head-to-head Quarterfinals -- 4 byes faced the 4 survivors of Round 3 Semifinals -- 4 shows down to 2 Consolation - Semifinal losers face off Finals - Semifinal winners face off Shows eliminated in the same round were ranked by votes received in that round and, if tied there, by total votes received in that round plus the previous one if applicable.

Benjamin Grimm Feb 18 2011 08:09 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Well done! And congratulations to the Bunkers and the Stivics!

John Cougar Lunchbucket Feb 18 2011 08:17 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I'm glad we finally pulled this one off and can't quibble with the results but I felt uncomfortable with much of my voting in this contest, knowing that my viewing habits haven't always aligned with "quality" when it comes to TV sitcoms.

metirish Feb 18 2011 08:19 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

The whole concept didn't fall apart, well done on the running of it . Hell of a list when viewed above.

Edgy DC Feb 18 2011 08:21 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Could you imagine being in a reasonably long-running show only to see it ranked below Silver Spoons?

Benjamin Grimm Feb 18 2011 08:24 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

True. Maude probably deserved better.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 18 2011 09:11 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

"Roseanne" at 50-- below, say, "Scrubs" and "Big Bang Theory" and "Munsters"-- still rankles a bit. Not a bad job, though, overall. Nice proctorin', FK.

Nymr83 Feb 18 2011 07:09 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I wasn't here for the beginning of this so i just want to mention, while i'm sure everyone has few shows they'd like to seen make the tournament theres only one that I see as absent that is "top 20" in my mind- Family Matters.

metsmarathon Feb 18 2011 07:19 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

as a whole, abc's tgif lineup did not get a fair shake. i mean, c'mon, where's perfect strangers?

Nymr83 Feb 18 2011 08:19 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Perfect Strangers was great. Other shows I watched that didnt make it were The Wonder Years, ALF, and Sabrina the teenage witch (i admit the latter is probably not on any kind of great list)

MFS62 Feb 18 2011 08:24 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Nymr83 wrote: Sabrina the teenage witch (i admit the latter is probably not on any kind of great list) Its on MY list of favorite Melissa Joan Hart shows. Its a very short list. (As in, please don't ask me to name another.) Later

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 18 2011 09:11 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

It's not even the best Melissa Joan Hart show. (See: "Clarissa Explains It All.")

batmagadanleadoff Feb 18 2011 09:38 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Was Wonder Years a sitcom? It had comical moments, but ....

Nymr83 Feb 18 2011 11:26 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Was Wonder Years a sitcom? It had comical moments, but .... yeah, I'm not really sure where to draw that line. I'd call BATMAN a sitcom by some standards, but i'm not sure if it was meant to be as funny at the time as we now see it?

Willets Point Feb 19 2011 08:18 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

The term dramedy was invented to describe The Wonder Years. It was a great show. I'm still in love with Winnie Cooper.

Rockin' Doc Feb 19 2011 10:05 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

The Wonder Years was one of the shows I tried to never miss during it's run. It wasn't really a sit-com, but it was wonderful television. It made me reflect nostalgically upon my own childhood of the 60's. Northern Exposure was the other show that wasn't actually a sit-com, but had some funny moments. It was must see television in our household.

Frayed Knot Feb 19 2011 11:00 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Going back again to our original working definition: a sit-com is defined roughly as: 1/2 hour comedy, originally produced on U.S. network, syndication or basic cable. No UK, no animation, no pay cable series, no 1hour shows ... they all have different economic or aesthetic parameters which leads to comparing apples to oranges. As to distinguishing comedy from "dramady" or other genres, a laugh track is a sufficient condition, but not a necessary condition. 'Wonder Years' fails on several counts seeing as it was not only "dramady" but also an hour-long show (at least I think it was ... I might be the only person in America who was of age to see it but never watched even a minute). Ditto 'Northern Exposure'. 'Alf' was on our list (it just didn't do very well) although 'Perfect Strangers', 'Bosom Buddies', Sabrina, Clarissa, 'Family Matters', 'New Adventures of Old Christine' can join 'WKRP' and I'm sure a handful of others in the 'fell through the cracks' club.

Vic Sage Feb 19 2011 01:01 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

wonder years was a 1/2 show... but it got left out, with "brooklyn bridge" / "molly dodd", etc - in the "dramedy" exclusion. as for the "left out" shows, maybe we can do 1 last consulation round of excluded shows? i doubt there were more than 8-12 to consider... 1 round, with top vote getter getting added to the overall list based on [votes x2], with other votegetters in the round just added based on votes x1. then, we can say we considered everything.

Frayed Knot Feb 20 2011 08:17 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

After someone noticed the prevalence of NYC-set shows in our final groups, I took to wondering about breakdowns of all the shows on our list, In doing so I realized that there's a bunch of them where I have no idea; either I never watched them or simply forgot. I suspect there's also a bunch where the setting was totally fictional or purposely vague. Anyone want to correct and/or fill in blanks. SHOW SETTING All in the Family NYC - Queens The Odd Couple NYC - Manhattan The Honeymooners NYC - Brooklyn Seinfeld NYC - Manhattan Cheers Boston Taxi NYC - Manhattan? Mary Tyler Moore Minneapolis Bob Newhart Show Chicago M*A*S*H Korea Dick Van Dyke Show NYC/New Rochelle Barney Miller NYC - Manhattan I Love Lucy NYC - Manhattan? Get Smart Washiington DC The Office Scranton, PA Arrested Development ??? 30 Rock NYC - Manhattan Frazier Seattle, WA Newsradio NYC - Manhattan Newhart Vermont I Dream of Jeannie Florida??? Night Court ??? Married … with Children ??? The Monkees Monkeyland? Happy Days Milwaukee, WI Cosby Show NYC - Manhattan Munsters ??? Addams Family ??? Gilligan’s Island Uncharted Desert Isle Family Ties ??? Bewitched ??? Andy Griffith Mayberry, ?? Leave It to Beaver ??? F-Troop Texas, Okla?, Kansas? Hogan’s Heroes Germany Mister Ed ??? The Brady Bunch ??? Car 54, Where are You NYC - ?? Everybody Loves Raymond NYC - Queens Friends NYC - Manhattan Abbott & Costello ??? Burns & Allen ??? My Favorite Martian ??? Phil Silvers (Sgt Bilko) ??? Scrubs Location never named Big Bang Theory ??? Home Improvement ??? It’s Gary Shandling’s Show ??? Sports Night NYC - Manhattan Welcome Back Kotter NYC - ?? Diff’rent Strokes ??? How I Met Your Mother NYC - Manhattan Mad About You NYC - Manhattan Malcolm in the Middle ??? Roseanne ??? Sanford & Son ??? Soap ??? Many Lives of Dobie Gillis ??? Golden Girls Florida somewhere? Good Times ??? King of Queens NYC - Queens Mork & Mindy ??? Murphy Brown ??? My Three Sons ??? Spin City NYC - Manhattan That 70s Show ???, Wisconsin Three’s Company ??? Beverly Hillbillies Beverly Hills, CA Fresh Prince Bel-Air, CA Drew Carey Cleveland, OH Facts of Life ??? Green Acres ??? It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia Philadelphia, PA My Name is Earl ??? One Day At a Time ??? Will & Grace NYC - Manhattan Alf ??? Donna Reed Show ??? Make Room for Daddy ??? Partridge Family ??? Who’s the Boss? ??? 2 & 1/2 Men Malibu, CA Boy Meets World ??? Gomer Pyle ??? Laverne & Shirley Milwaukee, WI The Nanny ??? Ozzie & Harriet ??? Wings ??? Bernie Mac ??? Hazel ??? Just Shoot Me NYC - Manhattan Real McCoys ??? Silver Spoons ??? That Girl ??? Alice ??? Maude ??? Petticoat Junction ???

Edgy DC Feb 20 2011 08:27 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Night Court was Manhattan. Darrin and Samantha Stephens lived in suburban Connecticut and he commuted to Madison Avenue. The Partridge family lived in San Pueblo, a northern California suburb of the Bay Area.

Edgy DC Feb 20 2011 08:30 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Wings was set in Nantucket. (And that sounds like the start of a limerick.)

batmagadanleadoff Feb 20 2011 08:36 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

The Monkees live in a beach house in Malibu, California. Arrested Development also takes place in California, but I forget exactly where even though I saw an episode that reveals the locale, very recently.

batmagadanleadoff Feb 20 2011 08:38 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Welcome Back Kotter takes place at the fictional Buchanan H.S., Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, New York. (Where else?)

batmagadanleadoff Feb 20 2011 08:43 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Working my way through this list ... Soap takes place in Dunn's River, Connecticut -- a fictional locale.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 20 2011 08:44 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Newport Beach for AD. Shandling was Santa Monica/LA. Family Ties was Columbus, OH. Roseanne was Lanford, Illinois (fictional). Facts of Life was Peekskill, NY. Three's Company, San Diego.

batmagadanleadoff Feb 20 2011 08:47 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

You can delete the question marks for I Love Lucy and I Dream of Jeannie. Major Nelson lived in Cocoa Beach, Florida. Lucy and Ricky (and Fred and Ethel) lived in Manhattan, at a fictional East Side address. The number of their street address was so high (800's?) that if it existed, it would be floating in the East River.

Edgy DC Feb 20 2011 08:48 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

That Girl --- Manhattan Alice --- Phonix, AZ Lucy and Ricky eventually moved to a Connecticut farmhouse as well.

Edgy DC Feb 20 2011 08:50 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Sanford & Son was Watts. We discussed this here some time back. I got reamed on a Sanford & Son forum for asking if they lived in El Segundo.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 20 2011 08:55 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Mork landed in Boulder, CO. Who's the Boss was somewhere in suburban CT (Fairfield? Greenwich?). Nanny, Diff'rent Strokes, and Murphy Brown were all in different parts of Manhattan. Maude was Westchester. Good Times... Chicago?

Willets Point Feb 20 2011 08:55 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I hate myself for knowing this but Three's Company was set in Santa Monica, CA, although I believe the credits sequence for a time was filmed at the San Diego Zoo.

Edgy DC Feb 20 2011 08:58 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Gomer Pyle, USMC: Camp Henderson (fictional) in California (real). The Nanny: A mansion in Manhattan and her family's place in Flushing. Good Times, I think, was supposed to be in the Cabrini Green housing projects.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 20 2011 09:01 PM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I thought it was San Diego (OE: Three's Company being the referrent). Weird. Boy Meets World was Philly. One Day at a Time was Indy.

Benjamin Grimm Feb 21 2011 04:35 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Burns and Allen took place in Los Angeles.

Frayed Knot Feb 21 2011 07:22 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

SHOW SETTING All in the Family NYC - Queens The Odd Couple NYC - Manhattan The Honeymooners NYC - Brooklyn Seinfeld NYC - Manhattan Cheers Boston Taxi NYC - Manhattan? Mary Tyler Moore Minneapolis Bob Newhart Show Chicago M*A*S*H Korea Dick Van Dyke Show NYC/New Rochelle Barney Miller NYC - Manhattan I Love Lucy NYC - Manhattan Get Smart Washiington DC The Office Scranton, PA Arrested Development Newport Beach, CA 30 Rock NYC - Manhattan Frazier Seattle, WA Newsradio NYC - Manhattan Newhart Vermont I Dream of Jeannie Cocoa Beach, FLA Night Court NYC - Manhattan Married … with Children ??? The Monkees Malibu, CA Happy Days Milwaukee, WI Cosby Show NYC - Manhattan Munsters ??? Addams Family ??? Gilligan’s Island Uncharted Desert Isle Family Ties Columbus, OH Bewitched Connecticut/NYC Andy Griffith Mayberry, ?? Leave It to Beaver ??? F-Troop Texas, Okla?, Kansas? Hogan’s Heroes Germany Mister Ed ??? The Brady Bunch ??? Car 54, Where are You NYC - ?? Everybody Loves Raymond NYC - Queens Friends NYC - Manhattan Abbott & Costello ??? Burns & Allen Los Angeles, CA My Favorite Martian ??? Phil Silvers (Sgt Bilko) ??? Scrubs Location never named Big Bang Theory ??? Home Improvement ??? It’s Gary Shandling’s Show Santa Monica, CA Sports Night NYC - Manhattan Welcome Back Kotter NYC - Brooklyn Diff’rent Strokes ??? How I Met Your Mother NYC - Manhattan Mad About You NYC - Manhattan Malcolm in the Middle ??? Roseanne Lanford, IL (Fictional) Sanford & Son LA - Watts, CA Soap Dunns River, CT (Fictional) Many Lives of Dobie Gillis ??? Golden Girls Florida somewhere? Good Times Chicago, IL King of Queens NYC - Queens Mork & Mindy Boulder, CO Murphy Brown NYC - Manhattan My Three Sons ??? Spin City NYC - Manhattan That 70s Show ???, Wisconsin Three’s Company San Diego, CA Beverly Hillbillies Beverly Hills, CA Fresh Prince Bel-Air, CA Drew Carey Cleveland, OH Facts of Life ??? Green Acres ??? It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia Philadelphia, PA My Name is Earl ??? One Day At a Time Indianapolis, IN Will & Grace NYC - Manhattan Alf ??? Donna Reed Show ??? Make Room for Daddy ??? Partridge Family San Pueblo, CA Who’s the Boss? Connecticut 2 & 1/2 Men Malibu, CA Boy Meets World Philadelphia, PA Gomer Pyle Camp Henderson (Fict), CA Laverne & Shirley Milwaukee, WI The Nanny NYC - Manhattan Ozzie & Harriet ??? Wings Nantucket, MA Bernie Mac ??? Hazel ??? Just Shoot Me NYC - Manhattan Real McCoys ??? Silver Spoons ??? That Girl NYC - Manhattan Alice Phoenix, AZ Maude Westchester County, NY Petticoat Junction ???

Benjamin Grimm Feb 21 2011 07:42 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I think the Brady Bunch lived in Sacramento, but I'm not sure. My Name is Earl took place in a city called Camden, in an unspecified state. Green Acres took place in a fictional town called Hooterville. I don't know if they ever specified the state. I think the Huxtables from the Cosby show lived in Brooklyn, didn't they? Maude, I think, took place in Tuckahoe. (I have to confess, I don't know if that's in New York or New Jersey.) I always thought that the Stephens family of Bewitched lived in Westchester County, New York, not Connecticut, but I'm not sure about that, either. Also, I never really watched Home Improvement, but I seem to think it took place in Detroit, or its suburbs. Is that right?

Edgy DC Feb 21 2011 07:45 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

My Three Sons starts out in a fictional midwestern town called Bryant Park and the family eventually moves to Los Angeles. Laverne and Shirley also move to LA. The Huxtables were all about Brooklyn Heights.

Benjamin Grimm Feb 21 2011 07:54 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Did Everybody Loves Raymond really take place in Queens? I always got the sense that the Barrone family lived somewhere in Nassau County. Oh, and Petticoat Junction took place in a town called Petticoat Junction, didn't it? I do know that it was a neighboring town to Green Acres' Hooterville. Characters in both shows shopped at Sam Drucker's store.

TransMonk Feb 21 2011 07:55 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Married with Children = Chicago That 70's Show = Point Place, WI (fictional)

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 21 2011 08:26 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Blair and the gang learned the Facts of Life at prep school in Peekskill, NY. I think Malcolm and Bernie Mac were both suburban southern CA, presumably suburban L.A.?

Edgy DC Feb 21 2011 08:30 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

I would've pegged Silver Spoons for Westchester, but a a little Google research tells me "Shallow Springs, Long Island, New York."

Edgy DC Feb 21 2011 08:33 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Maude lived in Tuckahoe. The Cabrini Green housing projects were shown in the opening credits of Good Times but never mentioned by name. Florida Evans was re-written for Good Times. On Maude, her husband was named Henry. Although still played by John Amos, the firefighter Henry became the whatever-work-is-available James, and Florida's old bosses in New York were never alluded to.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Feb 21 2011 08:39 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Diff'rent Strokes had a Park Avenue address. (Which makes one wonder which neighborhood high-end cheese/wine retailer or vintage map shop formerly housed Gordon Jump's House of Spoke Repair/Child Pornography.)

seawolf17 Feb 21 2011 09:06 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

The "Big Bang Theory" guys all work at Caltech, so I'm assuming they live somewhere in the Pasadena area.

seawolf17 Feb 21 2011 09:08 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

And I'd assume that "Home Improvement" is somewhere in the greater Detroit area, b/c of Tim Allen.

Edgy DC Feb 21 2011 09:24 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

Wally and the Beav lived in the fictitious community of Mayfield.

Valadius Feb 21 2011 09:58 AM Re: Coming up - the World Series of TV Sit-Coms

The Munsters lived at 1313 Mockingbird Lane in the fictional town of Mockingbird Heights, California.