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NL Gold Gloves

Frayed Knot Nov 03 2005 12:06 AM

P - Greg Maddux, Chi ... 15th one for him. He's real good although Hampton should have won it one of these years (just not this one) C - Mike Matheny, SF ... OK 1B - Derrick Lee, Chi ... No problem here 2B - Luis Castillo, Fla ... he was hurt and immobile for much of the later season SS - Omar Vizquel, SF ... whenever they can't figure out who to give it to they fall back on the old standard. Geez! how 'bout Jack Wilson guys? 3B - Mike Lowell, Fla ... he was horrid when we saw him late in the year, waiving at anything hit more than 2 feet from him. OF (with the usual complaints that they don't break them out by position) - Jim Edmonds, Andruw Jones, Bobby Abreu. Jones (a bit) and Edmonds (more than a bit) aren't what they were tho are probably still deserving. Abreu can be good but is too lackadasical and takes too many plays off. The problem with these things is that they're based too much on 'rep' and can be affected by how the player's offensive season went (although that doesn't explain Lowell). The irony is that for all the complaining about how the fans (AS game) and writers (other awards) botch their votes, this vote - done by managers and coaches - is usually the worst of the lot.

Valadius Nov 03 2005 03:53 AM

Hampton did win one. And how ridiculous is it that Cliff Floyd didn't get one?

Elster88 Nov 03 2005 08:53 AM

Lowell is a huge surprise to me. Though I guess I don't know who to put instead of him.

Yancy Street Gang Nov 03 2005 09:02 AM

I was hoping that David Wright would win it at third base.

Edgy DC Nov 03 2005 09:30 AM

David Wright was pretty discombulated the first half of the season. I've said before, but I think Andruw Jones has faded more than a bit, and is merely above average right now. Abreu is one insonsitent dude. Done some weird things against the Mets, also, hasn't he?

Yancy Street Gang Nov 03 2005 09:34 AM

]David Wright was pretty discombulated the first half of the season. True. But I thought that his highly-publicized "web gems" might tip the balance in his favor. Guess not, though.

Edgy DC Nov 03 2005 09:38 AM

Did I really write "discombulated'?

metirish Nov 03 2005 09:40 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 03 2005 09:56 AM

All I need to know about this is that Lowell won, IIRC against the Mets he made some terrible plays, I suppose you can't judge just on a few games but was he Gold Glove caliber all season?

Edgy DC Nov 03 2005 09:49 AM

Met fans told me that Miguel Cairo was Gold-Glove-caliber.

Elster88 Nov 03 2005 09:56 AM

I want names and times. If you're going to make fun of someone who thought Miguel Cairo was the shit, you have to do it right.

Edgy DC Nov 03 2005 10:03 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 03 2005 12:10 PM

Yeah, I guess I should. But it all went down with the old Pool. Two early season testaments made by Poolers I'd like to have back in order to brandish. Replace Matsui with Cairo, who is the better hitter and a Gold Glove-quality fielder. Don't touch Aaron Heilman, who has proven that he sucks.

Edgy DC Nov 03 2005 10:10 AM

It isn't much, but it backs up my account somewhat. At the end of this thread, LF recalls recent (at the time) WFAN callers dexcribing Cairo as "near Gold Glove." Now, the callers aren't necessarily Met fans, and "near Gold Glove" isn't exactly synonomous with "Gold Glove caliber," but just so you know I'm not completely fabricating this.

metirish Nov 03 2005 10:22 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 03 2005 10:41 AM

A good read...Mark Grace is funny.... ]"Cairo's hitting better, he's better with the glove, and he's one of the top players in all of baseball in advancing the runner. Other than Matsui making $6 million more a year, this is a no-brainer. Go with Cairo." one of the top players in all of baseball in advancing the runner.......he wasn't even a great bunter for Christs sake..

Edgy DC Nov 03 2005 10:40 AM

Yeah, sometimes a guy adding two cents really is just two cents. Thanks, Will.

Elster88 Nov 03 2005 11:30 AM

Edgy DC wrote: Don't touch Aaron Heilman, who has proven that he sucks. This one was mine too. I though Aaron Heilman had gotten enough chances to prove his stuff.

Elster88 Nov 03 2005 11:32 AM

Edgy DC wrote: . At the end of this thread, LF recalls recent (at the time) WFAN callers dexcribing Cairo as "near Gold Glove." Ugh. I contributed one movie quote, two sarcastic remarks, and one point that was fairly obvious (though I guess not obvious to the poster I was pointing it out to). Overall a bad thread for me. 2 out of 10.

Valadius Nov 03 2005 11:39 AM

Again. Cliff Floyd. ROBBED.

Elster88 Nov 03 2005 11:43 AM

I dunno. I loved his defense all year, but same random left fielder could've been making the same plays for another team without me realizing it. Edit: I am a jacked outfielder. If we could tell who was on 'roids based on muscle tone, I would be kicked out of baseball. _____________________________ This post had the designation 130) Mike Cameron

Frayed Knot Nov 03 2005 12:05 PM

In a fair fight among NL LFers only Cliff might have a decent chance at a GG - but of course that's not how they do things. His main competion would probably be Jason Bay & Colorado's Matt Holliday but most of the other regulars are pretty much Clysedales: Dunn, C. Lee, Klesko, Burrell; playing out of position: Miguel Cabrera; or part-timers. I guess that's why they treat the best fielding LFer as akin to being the tallest midget in the circus and pick multiple CFers instead.

Nymr83 Nov 03 2005 01:21 PM

the GGs lost all credibility when Palmiero won one essentially as a DH, i don't even want to hear about them anymore.

Edgy DC Nov 03 2005 01:27 PM

A pitcher of historically modest skills pitches way over his head (at least his old head) all year --- call him Steve Stone --- it's going to be rocognized at Cy Young time as the remarkable achievement it is. A batter of historically modest skills hits way over his head (at least his old head) all year --- call him Hubie Brooks --- it's going to be rocognized at Silver Slugger time as the remarkable achievement it is. A fielder of historically modest skills defends way over his head (at least his old head) all year --- call him Cliff Floyd --- it's going to be absolutely ignored at Gold Glove time. I doubt he got any support at all.

Valadius Nov 03 2005 02:25 PM

Remember when Ivan Rodriguez won the Gold Glove even when he was out the second half of the year?

Nymr83 Nov 03 2005 03:11 PM

Valadius wrote: Remember when Ivan Rodriguez won the Gold Glove even when he was out the second half of the year? and again, PALMIERO is th only example you ever need. the gold gloves are a joke and the guys voting for them should be deprived of their ballots.

seawolf17 Nov 03 2005 03:12 PM

I've never gotten worked up about Gold Gloves either. It's a nice award, and if they gave me one, I wouldn't turn it down, but it seems like the voting is either really arbitrary (like defensive stats) or just "goes to the same guys every year." That said, Keith Hernandez is still a Hall of Famer.

Vic Sage Nov 04 2005 03:11 PM

yes, if its the Hall of Fame located in Narnia. As for the one in Cooperstown, the 1bmen there wouldn't let Mex play in any of their reindeer games.