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Offseason trading begins, Nats move Castilla to Padres
OlerudOwned Nov 03 2005 09:58 PM |
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2213182
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smg58 Nov 03 2005 10:17 PM |
Sounds like both teams were making room for younger players by moving mediocre veterans. I think Lawrence has a bit more upside. If Castilla needed Coors Field to put up big numbers, he's not going to like Petco very much.
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Edgy DC Nov 03 2005 10:34 PM |
Let's put all off-season trades in this thread.
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metirish Nov 03 2005 10:36 PM |
Was Lawrence a big time prospect at one time?.
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Nymr83 Nov 03 2005 10:44 PM |
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ok, but then we need a title-change. castilla stinks, take away his coors field numbers and he's a glorified scott brosius. lawrence had a bad year but i'd trust him to rebound based on the previous 3, good move for washington.
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Johnny Dickshot Nov 03 2005 11:32 PM |
No loss for Washington for sure, if Zimmerman is as studly as he looked early on.
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Elster88 Nov 04 2005 08:40 AM |
I'm glad that neither of those players are on the Mets.
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Nymr83 Nov 04 2005 11:30 AM |
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lawrence is as good as zambrano if not better. but yeah, i don't particularly want either of those players.
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Elster88 Nov 04 2005 11:31 AM |
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I guess, but I put Zambrano at seventh in our rotation anyway.
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Nymr83 Nov 04 2005 11:54 AM |
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so do i, but unfortunately Willie may not be on the same wavelength. i'd be VERY upset to see Zambrano in our rotation the way things stand right now. the ERA+ over the last 3 years for our (main) current options: player 2005 2004 2003 Martinez 148 125 212 Glavine 118 119 94 Benson 101 97 85 Seo 162 87 111 Traschel 101 107 112 Heilman 132 78 63 Zambrano 100 101 108 It is clear that Pedro is and should be in. it is clear (i think) that Glavine is and should be in. after that its pretty difficult, but here's what i'd do and why: the 3rd spot would go to Jae Seo who clearly outpitched the others this past year. this leaves Heilman, Benson, Traschel, and Zambrano for 2 spots. I would leave Heilman in the bullpen. he might be better than these other guys, but he might not be, and his (i think) proven value in the bullpen makes him worth leaving there as long as there are roughly equivalent options available for the rotation. Traschel has been slightly better than the other 2 and, we believe, he would not be easily converted to relief pitching. i'd give him the 4th spot. that leaves us with zambrano and benson...and you know what? i might have spent the last year and a half bashing zambrano, but when you look at the numbers he has been a slightly better pitcher than kris benson (though both have spent their careers being essentially average.) the only thing to think about here is that since the two of them (and Traschel) are probably about equal, shouldn't you trade the one with the most value to other teams insteda of the one with the most objective value? in the end i'd start Martinez, Glavine, Seo, Traschel, and Benson with Heilman in the bullpen and trading Zambrano for some kind of help.
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Elster88 Nov 04 2005 11:59 AM |
I'd keep Zambrano around just because recent history shows that just about every team needs an emergency starter for a solid month, if not more. The guy I see being traded is Traxxxxx. I get the (totally unsupported by solid facts) feeling that Willie doesn't have him in his plans, and that Traxxxxx was turned off by the drama from last year, and will get pissed if it happens again in 2006. Then Heilman goes to the rotation. My guesses for '06.
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Edgy DC Nov 04 2005 12:37 PM |
Do I correctly assume that his DL time delayed Trax's 10-and-five eligibility?
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Yancy Street Gang Nov 04 2005 12:38 PM |
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I don' t think so. I think he attained 5-and-10 at the end of the season.
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Elster88 Nov 04 2005 01:40 PM |
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True enough. But if he's ticked off maybe he'll waive it. Everyone had a hard-on for the Red Sox's catching prospect earlier on. They need pitching, we need a long term plan for catcher. Though maybe Trax would garner more if we held onto him until right before the trading deadline. There will probably again be about 10 teams right at .500 who will be fighting for every scrap of pitching out there. I'm sure we could find a use for him over the first half of the season.
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Nymr83 Nov 04 2005 02:33 PM |
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moving Heilman into the rotation would be my plan if that happened.
if we could get Shopach for him i'd probably want to do it now, if not holding him (or zambrano, whichever you want to trade) till june doesn't sound like a bad idea
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seawolf17 Nov 04 2005 03:28 PM |
Hey! Is this a Zambrano thread, or are we discussing trades?
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Nymr83 Nov 04 2005 03:50 PM |
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we're discussing trading zambrano. burroughs had a high BA for whatever reason (maybe luck?) in the minors but never showed any other skills to go along with it. the average dried up and now he's in the same place as every other singles hitter with no ability to draw a walk or get extra base hits should be...the dog house.
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Frayed Knot Nov 04 2005 04:12 PM |
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Nope. DL time = Service time, putting Trax officially in the 10 & 5 club now. Speaking of DL time equaling service time, that little fact got me to wondering whether Reyes is arb-eligible yet. At this point he's got 2 yrs + 111 days of ML time (or approx 2.62 years as the ML season is divided into 180 days). All 3 yr players are eligible, plus 1/6 of those with the most time between 2 & 3 years. Since I haven't heard that he is I assume he falls short although it's probably pretty close. It would all depend on how many "super-2" players there are and whether enough of them are over the 2 + 111 mark.
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OlerudOwned Nov 05 2005 02:51 PM |
If we really do want this to be another All Purpose Thread, just tell me and I'll change the subject line.
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metirish Dec 08 2005 09:00 PM |
The Yankees trade Lofton to the Reds for a pair of 24-year-old prospects and are close to signing Mike Myers.
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OlerudOwned Dec 08 2005 09:07 PM |
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metirish Dec 08 2005 09:09 PM |
Yeah of course, what was I thinking....
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OlerudOwned Dec 08 2005 09:12 PM |
Hmm, this thread made me notice something. I think every deal the Padres have made was a direct player-player swap.
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Nymr83 Dec 08 2005 09:42 PM |
the loretta move was foolish and i like lawrence, but they do seem to be doing ok this offseason.
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smg58 Dec 08 2005 09:54 PM |
I'm trying to figure out why Mirabelli instead of Shoppach, but I can understand making an opening for Josh Barfield. And returning Giles and Hoffman doesn't hurt them, either. But will 82 wins take their division again?
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Edgy DC Dec 08 2005 10:06 PM |
Do you see any team in the West besides San Diego that has anything like their act together?
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Nymr83 Dec 08 2005 10:25 PM |
the pythagorean wins for each team last year:
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metirish Dec 08 2005 11:42 PM |
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Tejada is not happy...
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Nymr83 Dec 08 2005 11:55 PM |
Tejada's 2005 may look worse than his 2004 across the board, but his OPS+ was actualy 6 points better. the AL league OPS this past year dropped significantly to what i believe was its 2nd lowest number in 15 years.
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Frayed Knot Dec 09 2005 12:06 AM |
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Dems da breaks big guy. When you sign a multi-year deal the team gets you - and PAYS you - for better or for worse, in sickness and in health. Well guess what? You get THEM for better or for worse too. You can request all you want but they don't have to oblige.
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Edgy DC Dec 09 2005 08:05 AM |
His opinion would have been more useful before they acquired Sammy Sosa and Rafael Palmeiro.
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Frayed Knot Dec 09 2005 09:46 AM |
It also doesn't say much for his brand new catcher when - virtually the same day as they sign Ramon Hernandez to a big deal - Tejada says something along the lines of; "how come we ain't done shit?"
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Edgy DC Dec 09 2005 09:56 AM |
Boston would probably do it in a New York minute.
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Frayed Knot Dec 09 2005 10:08 AM |
Yeah, I like this (totally made up - no hint of reality) deal from Boston's end a lot more than from Baltimore's.
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sharpie Dec 09 2005 10:11 AM |
Tejada played with Ramon Hernandez in Oakland. Maybe he knows that Ramon isn't a major acquisition. Or maybe he thinks Ramon is an asshole and left the A's to get away from him.
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Johnny Dickshot Dec 09 2005 10:14 AM |
Boy the Ramirez-for-Tejaada thingy is a great idea (Boston throws in their SS prospect Hanley Ramirez to make it OK for Baltimore), but since a trade would require Manny's OK, the Sox ought to be limited in their ability to push something this through.
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metirish Dec 09 2005 10:16 AM |
That trade would help both teams in a big way, one thing, didn't the Sox use Hanley to get Beckett?
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OlerudOwned Dec 09 2005 10:16 AM |
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Nymr83 Dec 09 2005 11:54 AM |
it would be criminal for the Mets not to make a serious offer if Tejada is available.
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Edgy DC Dec 09 2005 12:06 PM |
No it wouldn't.
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Elster88 Dec 09 2005 12:23 PM Edited 3 time(s), most recently on Dec 09 2005 01:28 PM |
Maybe not criminal, but all players who are available should be given a cursory look. In the case of a youngish stud like Tejada, the look should be more than cursory. Since we are one of the few teams that have a shortstop who could be considered a decent replacement for Tejada, we should give it an extra hard look.
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Edgy DC Dec 09 2005 12:27 PM |
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I don't understand this at all.
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Elster88 Dec 09 2005 12:39 PM |
Ah I said that funny. What I meant was, it is not criminal to not take a look at Tejada, but it should be done to some degree. To not explore all avenues is stupid.
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Rotblatt Dec 09 2005 01:48 PM |
If I were Omar, I'd totally explore a trade too.
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Vic Sage Dec 09 2005 02:29 PM |
it wouldn't be enough for me, if i were GM-ing Baltimore.
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metirish Dec 09 2005 02:35 PM |
I would think you would have to make that trade, basically you are giving up Reyes and two players in Seo and Diaz where one seems to have to prove himself with every outing and the other pegged as a DH in the furture...if you will settle for Reyes, Seo and Diaz then yes I would do that.
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Nymr83 Dec 09 2005 02:38 PM |
Seo > heilman IMO, i'd give up Reyes and heilman, i wouldnt give reyes and milledge unless they either gave us something else or paid some of the contract.
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Yancy Street Gang Dec 09 2005 02:41 PM |
I wish the ezBoards hadn't been wiped out, so I could confirm if my memory is correct. But I seem to remember that when Tejada was a free agent, almost nobody in this forum wanted him.
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Vic Sage Dec 09 2005 02:44 PM |
i'm pretty sure i was not amongst such small-minded rabble.
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Elster88 Dec 09 2005 02:45 PM |
Nor I.
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Yancy Street Gang Dec 09 2005 02:50 PM |
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I remember liking the idea of Tejada, but being in the minority. I think the objection was, "We have Reyes why do we need Tejada?" I'm more inclined now to align myself with the small-minded, mainly because Reyes is less of an unknown quantity, and I like it better when we import players via free agency instead of through a trade. Free agents only cost money.
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Nymr83 Dec 09 2005 03:09 PM |
who cares if we had reyes at the time? we moved him to 2B for kaz matsucki but we wouldn't do it for tejada? thats the kind of thinking that got the last GM booted.
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Yancy Street Gang Dec 09 2005 03:12 PM |
I don't know if that's what the Mets were thinking; I think that's what some fans were thinking.
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Elster88 Dec 09 2005 03:26 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Dec 09 2005 03:29 PM |
That's the second worst argument ever. The worst is that ARod is a cooler.
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Valadius Dec 09 2005 03:28 PM |
Had I been active on Mets boards when this "we don't need Rodriguez because of Ordonez" argument was raging, my head would likely have exploded.
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Edgy DC Dec 09 2005 03:35 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Dec 09 2005 03:47 PM |
I don't remember "The Mets don't need Alex Rodriguez because they have Rey Ordonez."
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Rotblatt Dec 09 2005 03:42 PM |
Hm. I'm not sure if I'd do that trade, Vic. I've got no problem including Reyes & Diaz, but Seo was flat out brilliant last season and he's completely unheralded this winter--which in my mind equals undervalued.
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Elster88 Dec 09 2005 03:51 PM |
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This is a line my [normally] intelligent Met-fan buddy laid on me as the reason why he wouldn't want on the Mets. A cooler is a guy who drains the surrounding area of luck and success. His opinion was based on the success of Seattle and Texas after ARod's departure, and the failure of the teams he has played on to win a WS. I went on a rant about this right on the CPF after the MVP award was announced because it was incomprehensible to me. I am NOT attributing it to anyone on this or any other Met board.
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Vic Sage Dec 09 2005 04:23 PM |
"The Cooler" is a great movie with William H. Macy and Alec Baldwin.
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Elster88 Dec 09 2005 04:28 PM |
And a nude scene for Maria Bello.
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metirish Dec 09 2005 07:12 PM |
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More moves, good move for the Angels.
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