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IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

bmfc1 Jul 17 2011 06:14 AM Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Jul 17 2011 09:01 AM

METS: 1. Angel Pagan (S) CF 2. Justin Turner (R) 2B 3. Willie Harris (L) RF 4. Daniel Murphy (L) 3B 5. Jason Bay (R) LF 6. Lucas Duda (L) 1B 7. Ronny Paulino (R) C 8. Ruben Tejada (R) SS 9. Mike Pelfrey (R) P Phillies: 1. Jimmy Rollins (S) SS 2. Michael Martinez (S) 3B 3. Chase Utley (L) 2B 4. Ryan Howard (L) 1B 5. Raul Ibanez (L) LF 6. Domonic Brown (L) RF 7. John Mayberry (R) CF 8. Brian Schneider (L) C 9. Kyle Kendrick (R) P http://baseballpress.com/lineup.php TBS has this one.

Ashie62 Jul 17 2011 06:44 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

LETS!

TransMonk Jul 17 2011 06:52 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 17 2011 07:05 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

bmfc1 Jul 17 2011 09:02 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Willie Harris batting 3d, no Carlos (see above). But Jose is back on Tuesday!

Ashie62 Jul 17 2011 10:39 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

The league of hotties is in attendance to root us on! GO TEAM!

Ashie62 Jul 17 2011 11:31 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Somebody take away those blue shades from Baysuck. Better yet, dump his contract.

bmfc1 Jul 17 2011 12:33 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

When Morgan Freeman said that Clint Eastwood "works fast", I was hoping he'd then say "unlike Pelfrey." I wonder if Pelfrey could even give away Pelfrey.

Ashie62 Jul 17 2011 01:18 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Not quickly?

Ashie62 Jul 17 2011 01:32 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Baysuck using his shoulder as a glove.

Ashie62 Jul 17 2011 02:03 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Hope CPF contingent had a nice day. The weather was nice..

Ashie62 Jul 17 2011 02:11 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Bring it Pagan!

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 17 2011 02:12 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Let's Go Myrna. Tying run up!

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 17 2011 02:18 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

F'd on that strike 2 call

bmfc1 Jul 17 2011 02:18 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

I thought that Turner would come through. The 2d strike was a lousy call. I'm surprised that Keith didn't howl about it.

Ashie62 Jul 17 2011 02:28 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Antonio is a tuff bastard Is there anyone who would take Bay's friggin contract?...no prospects in return even..

bmfc1 Jul 17 2011 02:38 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Question for the group: is it time to sit Bay? You could platoon Hairston and Harris. My guess is that Bay is being paid so much that it won't happen.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 17 2011 02:40 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Bay should just retire. Or sit for Hairston or something.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 17 2011 02:41 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

bmfc1 wrote: Question for the group: is it time to sit Bay? You could platoon Hairston and Harris. My guess is that Bay is being paid so much that it won't happen. lol, hadn't seen this when I started my message. He absolutely sucks.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 17 2011 02:44 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Thanks, Jason Bay. What a show you put on today.

bmfc1 Jul 17 2011 02:45 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Gary politely said "tough day at the office" for Bay. Tough season, too. Since his 2 HR game in LA, it seems like every one of his ABs is either a strikeout or a groundout to short.

Frayed Knot Jul 17 2011 03:42 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

bmfc1 wrote: I thought that Turner would come through. The 2d strike was a lousy call. I'm surprised that Keith didn't howl about it. Duda got screwed on a pitch too that put him in an 0-2 count right before he GiDP'd with the bases loaded and no outs. Not that the game was taken away from us or anything. Too many pitching mistakes mainly (walks and 2-out hits allowed) and too many missed offensive chances early on that just made the comeback that much more improbable. Oh yeah, and Bay too.

MFS62 Jul 17 2011 04:00 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Ashie62 wrote: Is there anyone who would take Bay's friggin contract?...no prospects in return even.. If they would try to unload Bay's contract (who wouldn't?) they're currently in the position of the poker player who is down a lot of money. Does he keep playing, hoping to get some return back? Or does he stop, and cut his losses now? Later

Edgy DC Jul 17 2011 04:11 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Bay sure seems to be in the middle of every rally that comes up short. I don't like hoping he walks. Those are the hopes we should be using on Tejada. Benchng? It's not either-or, I think, but he should be earning any trips to the plate he gets, certainly. He's playing Beltran off this team just as surely as his paycheck has threatened to price Reyes off the team.

HahnSolo Jul 17 2011 04:46 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

The number of Phillies fans all around me (and all around the stadium for that matter) was pretty nauseating. I know how Baltimore fans now feel whenever the Yanks and Sox come to town.

Ceetar Jul 17 2011 04:51 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

HahnSolo wrote: The number of Phillies fans all around me (and all around the stadium for that matter) was pretty nauseating. I know how Baltimore fans now feel whenever the Yanks and Sox come to town. Are the Yanks/Sox fans as ignorant as the Phillies fans I encountered at Citi? probably. Harris mostly sucks and Hairston has been good against lefties but that's also where Bay has been better.. Did Collins maybe get too hopeful that Bay had 'returned' as he started to pick it up a bit? Maybe he should've still sat him here and there, or maybe the injuries have just made it so that the 'potential' of Bay actually hitting is still better than sitting him most days. I dunno. If we're really going to try to get him out of the lineup more, I'd rather it be for the likes of Evans or Duda or Martinez. Not that any of them have necessarily warranted it, but..

Ashie62 Jul 17 2011 06:19 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

I'm wondering if any of the South Jersey Piney people came up?? Referring to Bay..Gary said something like "His game has dissappeared." to which Ron said "for over a year." I hope Bay is not washed up because the Mets own his ass for a long time.

Ceetar Jul 17 2011 09:50 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Doesn't exactly look like a fierce lineup, and yet they find ways. Could the difference be when Ibanez doesn't suck, he hits a home run and drives in 2-3, and when Bay doesn't suck..he walks or gets a single?

Ashie62 Jul 17 2011 10:07 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

3-5 are pretty tough. Nice photo.

Frayed Knot Jul 17 2011 10:08 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

No, I think the difference is pitching. The Mets are actually scoring 0.2 R/G higher than the Phils this season which, when you consider the home park differential and the injuries, is fucking stunning.

Ashie62 Jul 17 2011 10:20 PM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Halladay Hamels Lee v. Pelfrey Niese Dickey Jesus, Joseph and Mary I'm gonna puke.

Ceetar Jul 18 2011 05:26 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Frayed Knot wrote: No, I think the difference is pitching. The Mets are actually scoring 0.2 R/G higher than the Phils this season which, when you consider the home park differential and the injuries, is fucking stunning. clearly the difference is pitching, but that lineup looks like it should be near the bottom in runs scored

Edgy DC Jul 18 2011 06:45 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

It may look like that, but kudos to them for grinding it out anyhoow. I think maybe the reconciliation between perception and reality may be in the all-or-nothing-ness of the lineup. When they've got it working, they open up the spigot and score double digits in runs. When they don't, they struggle to score two. But they can't seem to settle themsleves into that 5-8-run range. Plefrey has certainly had a crap year. Too many hits and too many one-disastrous-inning starts. Nobody's quite pitching themselves out of the rotation, but we could use someone who excels. We've a team of 3.80-4.30 ERA starters, with a bullpen that's been capable until we ask too much of it.

Ceetar Jul 18 2011 06:53 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Edgy DC wrote: It may look like that, but kudos to them for grinding it out anyhoow. I think maybe the reconciliation between perception and reality may be in the all-or-nothing-ness of the lineup. When they've got it working, they open up the spigot and score double digits in runs. When they don't, they struggle to score two. But they can't seem to settle themsleves into that 5-8-run range. Plefrey has certainly had a crap year. Too many hits and too many one-disastrous-inning starts. Nobody's quite pitching themselves out of the rotation, but we could use someone who excels. We've a team of 3.80-4.30 ERA starters, with a bullpen that's been capable until we ask too much of it. That's kinda what I was referring to in the all-or-nothing-ness, and it's probably a fair example of how poor a tool for analysis batting average actually is. I mean, Ibanez is hitting .243 and yet when he does hit the ball it's over the fence AND with runners on. The same for Howard who has 87 hits and 72 RBI which seems like a pretty high rate. You'd think some of this would be unsustainable, but it just doesn't seem to fall off. Carlos Ruiz has a higher OBP than SLG, hitting .255. How do you walk a guy like that? (I often wondered this with Castillo too.)

Edgy DC Jul 18 2011 07:10 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Yeah, but we're using runs/game here as a standard. I have no doubt that low average and high power is a more-or-less sustainable way to build an offense. I certainly prefer ours, but I'd prefer it more with our infield back in the lineup.

Ceetar Jul 18 2011 07:22 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Edgy DC wrote: Yeah, but we're using runs/game here as a standard. I have no doubt that low average and high power is a more-or-less sustainable way to build an offense. I certainly prefer ours, but I'd prefer it more with our infield back in the lineup. Well yeah, that'd be nice. Offense was already pushing it without Reyes, and then add in Beltran? Pitching wasn't great this weekend, but it was the offense that did the Mets in. And it's not like you tip your hat to cy young winners, it was Worley and Kendrick, both of who the Mets have hit, and should hit.

Gwreck Jul 18 2011 07:41 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Ceetar wrote: Pitching wasn't great this weekend, but it was the offense that did the Mets in. And it's not like you tip your hat to cy young winners, it was Worley and Kendrick, both of who the Mets have hit, and should hit. I totally disagree. They scored 5 runs Sunday (enough to win most games) and of course there were no offense problems on Saturday. Yes, the Mets should have scored more runs off Worley but they would have needed 8 to win on Friday and 9 to win on Sunday. That's because the pitching is the problem.

Ceetar Jul 18 2011 07:50 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Gwreck wrote: Ceetar wrote: Pitching wasn't great this weekend, but it was the offense that did the Mets in. And it's not like you tip your hat to cy young winners, it was Worley and Kendrick, both of who the Mets have hit, and should hit. I totally disagree. They scored 5 runs Sunday (enough to win most games) and of course there were no offense problems on Saturday. Yes, the Mets should have scored more runs off Worley but they would have needed 8 to win on Friday and 9 to win on Sunday. That's because the pitching is the problem. If they actually score off Worley or Kendrick, the entire landscape of the game is different. different pitchers are used, with different amounts of leash. Probably would've helped if this makeshift infield actually fielded the ball once in a while too.

Edgy DC Jul 18 2011 07:59 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Yeah, maybe we're overlooking the obvious on this. [list:1g4unljk][*:1g4unljk]Three unearned runs on Friday (Tejada).[/*:m:1g4unljk] [*:1g4unljk]One unearned run on Saturday (Tejada).[/*:m:1g4unljk] [*:1g4unljk]Three unearned runs on Sunday (Bay).[/*:m:1g4unljk][/list:u:1g4unljk]

Ceetar Jul 18 2011 08:04 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Edgy DC wrote: Yeah, maybe we're overlooking the obvious on this. [list][*]Three unearned runs on Friday (Tejada).[/*:m] [*]One unearned run on Saturday (Tejada).[/*:m] [*]Three unearned runs on Sunday (Bay).[/*:m][/list:u] I try not to get on Tejada because he's young and overmatched, but I think he needs to head to Buffalo tomorrow. It's not just him, some of these guys seem to be letting the pressure get to them. Turner was alternating between really nice play and stupid play on Friday too.

Edgy DC Jul 18 2011 08:20 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Sort of why I was wonderin' about searching the waiver wires for someone who could give him a blow, though don't ask me, please, to directly connect his errors to a lack of time off.

seawolf17 Jul 18 2011 08:25 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Edgy DC wrote: Sort of why I was wonderin' about searching the waiver wires for someone who could give him a blow, though don't ask me, please, to directly connect his errors to a lack of time off. Didn't he just have four days off?

Edgy DC Jul 18 2011 08:29 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

But no blows. A man needs blows.

metsmarathon Jul 18 2011 08:35 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Edgy DC wrote: But no blows. A man needs blows. yes. yes he does.

Ceetar Jul 18 2011 08:36 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Edgy DC wrote: But no blows. A man needs blows. They're cheaper in Buffalo.

Ceetar Jul 18 2011 11:39 AM Re: IGT 07/17/11: Phillies @ Mets

Jason Bay is slugging .160 in "high leverage" situations this season. Give me a month of Spring Training (or an actual healthy 29 year old) and I'd take the over..