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"Fire Wayne Hagin"

Edgy MD Sep 30 2011 08:52 PM

Not me necessarily saying that. I just stumbled across a blog dedicated to it. You'd figure that it wouldn't be that stimulating, what with the really narrow agenda, but bam, it's really well written. Then I click the "More About Me" link and find out it's Paul Lukas. Where do they find the time?

John Cougar Lunchbucket Sep 30 2011 09:49 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

I am certain we've discussed this site here before. Most of it was a 2010 project.

Gwreck Sep 30 2011 10:48 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

I recall that the sentiment was that while Wayne isn't very good the project trended towards being just a little too mean.

metirish Oct 01 2011 05:03 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Gwreck wrote: I recall that the sentiment was that while Wayne isn't very good the project trended towards being just a little too mean. Exactly, was surprised it was Lukas if I remember correctly.

Edgy MD Oct 01 2011 06:32 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Memory. Such a precious thing to lose. What was this thread about again? Anyway, I also found this funny place called the Crane Pool....

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Oct 01 2011 06:57 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

One of the commenters raises an interesting question. Who's calling the perpetual Mets-Marlins-at-Moist-Shark-Stadium game (with Pelf starting, natch) in your Metsian purgatory: Hagin or Fran X? Who's worse?

dgwphotography Oct 01 2011 07:02 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: One of the commenters raises an interesting question. Who's calling the perpetual Mets-Marlins-at-Moist-Shark-Stadium game (with Pelf starting, natch) in your Metsian purgatory: Hagin or Fran X? Who's worse? They're calling it together, with Steve LaMarr...

Edgy MD Oct 01 2011 07:17 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

I'm getting the Marlins feed, with the Mulrooney's commercials running.

Frayed Knot Oct 01 2011 07:23 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Hagin or Fran X? Who's worse? The answer to who's worse is always Fran - no matter the competition or even the question.

Benjamin Grimm Oct 01 2011 07:27 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Lorn Brown.

metirish Oct 01 2011 10:28 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Fran" arms extended,elevated nervous system" Healy wins in a romp.

G-Fafif Oct 01 2011 12:21 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Art Shamsky and Tom McCarthy are doing the international broadcast with latter-day Gary Thorne.

Ceetar Oct 01 2011 12:47 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

After much research, I've decided I'm fine with Wayne as a color guy, but don't need his play by play. That's the true awkward stuff. He may tend towards some stupid analysis at times, but no more than most guys and occasionally has some fun nuggets. Not that I'd miss him if/when he's gone. Of course, he's better than Mike Francesa.

Edgy MD Oct 01 2011 04:56 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

I think that's more or less a fair assessment. Problem is that it mostly takes Howie Rose out of the color business. But it's not like being a pbp guy ever kept Tim McCarver from offering reflections.

Ashie62 Oct 01 2011 05:49 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: One of the commenters raises an interesting question. Who's calling the perpetual Mets-Marlins-at-Moist-Shark-Stadium game (with Pelf starting, natch) in your Metsian purgatory: Hagin or Fran X? Who's worse? Hagin

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Oct 01 2011 06:45 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Oh, I forgot about McCarthy. Hoooooboy. Is it too late for an annex to the Circles of Met Hell, G-Fafif?

G-Fafif Oct 01 2011 08:44 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Oh, I forgot about McCarthy. Hoooooboy. Is it too late for an annex to the Circles of Met Hell, G-Fafif? Tom McCarthy broadcast T#m Gl@v!ne's last outing, and we inducted Gl@v!ne into the one-third circle of hell, so by association, he's already on fire.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Oct 02 2011 06:27 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

The problem isn't that Wayne's stupid. I think he has a good amount of knowledge, or you know, enough. But the broadcast requires more than color from him, if it's a color guy you want there are plenty of ex-jocks out there. Hagin's just a dreadful pbp announcer whose main problem, as Paul says elegantly on that site, is a brain writing checks that his mouth can't cash. It's as though his words lead him down an alley with no escape other than an abrupt, awkward reversal. It's at times impossible to listen to. I'm not so down on his hokey references, at least he's not trying to be something he's not, and I have a small amount of sympathy for his having to work with Howie who to someone like Hagin probably seems extremely peculiar. I can't really imagine Howie going to a foreign market and call games in the same way we might expect a guy like Hagin to succeed behind any microphone. Again, it's all about his awkward delivery and the resulting issue of plays unfolding before he can describe them that drives me nuts. If the Mets/660 were to keep him employed it would be worth the investment in 3 weeks of offseason play by play boot camp with a guy like Cohen who's always on top of the unfolding action.

Frayed Knot Oct 02 2011 06:59 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

And speaking of bad (or at least quirky depending on your POV) radio announcers, huge article on John Sterling in today's NYTimes sports section.

metirish Oct 02 2011 07:23 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Frayed Knot wrote: And speaking of bad (or at least quirky depending on your POV) radio announcers, huge article on John Sterling in today's NYTimes sports section. early 70's... that was a surprise. wiki has him at 63 but with ????

Edgy MD Oct 02 2011 07:30 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Hagin's just a dreadful pbp announcer whose main problem, as Paul says elegantly on that site, is a brain writing checks that his mouth can't cash. It's as though his words lead him down an alley with no escape other than an abrupt, awkward reversal. It's at times impossible to listen to. I think this is exactly right. But I think by and large, folks have a very different problem with him. The ship has run into bad luck and he's like the guy in Master and Commander who's always the officer on watch when it happens. When things go bad and folks start looking around for a dog to kick, he seems like less a member of the family. You've said this before, but it's only really gotten to me the second half of this year. Pitcher gets to a ball but can't make the play at first. He'll go at great length to describe how the pitcher can't get the ball out of his glove. He'll describe his anxiety that forced him to rush, he'll use a metaphor, he'll describe the guy's disappointment in himself after the play. "And here comes the catcher out to the mound to calm him down," he'll say, while I'm still wondering, "THE RUNNER ON THIRD... DID HE SCORE?! That's the issue. Good team or bad, it's an issue. Wayne isn't without skills, and he'll be working a long time --- long after I've forgotten his name --- but his p-b-p is maddening first hand, night after night.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Oct 02 2011 08:49 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Frayed Knot wrote: And speaking of bad (or at least quirky depending on your POV) radio announcers, huge article on John Sterling in today's NYTimes sports section. Great article. I love John Sterling, nobody alive is better suited to chronicle the pomposity of MFY Universe than him. And I kinda appreciate his underlying goofiness. Seriously, I can't listen to a second of Michael Kay call a MFY game but I always tune in Sterling.

MFS62 Oct 03 2011 08:09 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Frayed Knot wrote: And speaking of bad (or at least quirky depending on your POV) radio announcers, huge article on John Sterling in today's NYTimes sports section. Great article. I love John Sterling, nobody alive is better suited to chronicle the pomposity of MFY Universe than him. And I kinda appreciate his underlying goofiness. Seriously, I can't listen to a second of Michael Kay call a MFY game but I always tune in Sterling. Exactly. I've liked Sterling from the days he used to broadcast Nets games when they played in the ABA. Nobody says you can't both call a decent game and have a distinct personality. Baseball fans have appreciated that for years, from Dizzy Dean to Bob Prince to Red Barber to Bob Uecker. The list goes on. But, to be loved for the second, you have to be able to do the first. And Hagin doesn't. Later

Ashie62 Oct 03 2011 09:28 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Sonny Dove of the Johnnies hits for three putting the Nets up double digits!

MFS62 Oct 03 2011 09:34 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Ashie62 wrote: Sonny Dove of the Johnnies hits for three putting the Nets up double digits! I can still hear him call that. LOL! Sterling coined the expression "downtown" for a 3 point shot. Marv Albert "stole" it and it became one of his trademark calls. We now return this thread to the topic of how really bad an announcer Hagin is. Later

Frayed Knot Oct 03 2011 10:13 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

'Yankees win, Yankees win' had the same cadence as 'Islander goal, Islander goal' My first memory of Sterling was as a sports talk guy on WMCA (a two or so hours/night show well prior to the days of 24-hr sports talk) where he played the acerbic know-it-all who'd cut off callers while screaming, "You don't know what you're talking about - get off my air" to them when he thought they didn't bring enough to the discussion.

Edgy MD Oct 04 2011 05:47 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

I'm going to respond with deep doubt that Sterling coined "downtown" as a term for a three-point shot. On the one hand, it's not particularly clever and must have been used seven seconds after somebody painted a three-point stripe --- or even earlier, simply to refer to a long jump shot. On the other hand, it's just the kind of un-clever phrasing that Sterling would think is clever, and rush to secure trademark claims on.

Frayed Knot Oct 04 2011 06:35 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

The use of "Downtown" in basketball - whoever coined it - way pre-dated the three-point line. I guess it's MFS's contention that Sterling was using it in NYC before Marv even though it was he who eventually became more famous for it. On that burning question I have nothing to contribute.

Edgy MD Oct 04 2011 07:28 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

My feeling is that when discussion about a sports broacaster is which coinages he gets credit for, we're in dangerous territory, as his job no longer becomes about delivering the game, but delivering his schtick. And the fact that a guy has a signature call or phrasing becomes somehow something to celebrate whether it's clever or not. And nowhere is this confusion more prevalent than in the bubble immediately surrounding John Sterling, who clearly stays up nights trying to come up with coinages. "Hmmm. Russell Martin. 'A dry Martini!' That doesn't make any sense --- he's from Canada, not Italy. 'A northern light!' That's too obscure --- THINK, JOHN, THINK! Russell with the muscle!! That's good, but not good enough! What time is it...?"

MFS62 Oct 04 2011 07:50 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin" Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Oct 04 2011 08:02 AM

Frayed Knot wrote: The use of "Downtown" in basketball - whoever coined it - way pre-dated the three-point line. I guess it's MFS's contention that Sterling was using it in NYC before Marv even though it was he who eventually became more famous for it. On that burning question I have nothing to contribute. I was a fan of the ABA from its first game. Another announcer of their games (the Spirit of St Louis and later their national tv games) was Bob Costas. I don't recall he ever used the term. Of course, the NBA did not have the three point shot until the leagues merged. So there would have been no need for Marv to use it. But Sterling had been using the term on Nets broadcasts for years. Since they both were in New York at the time, I believe Marv must have heard Sterling use it and later adopted it as his own. Later

Edgy MD Oct 04 2011 08:01 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

MFS62 wrote: Of course, the NBA did not have the three point shot until the leagues merged. So there would have been no need for Marv to use it. And he and I are both saying that it was used for long jump shots before there was a three-point line in the ABA or anywhere else. Downtown Freddie Brown was so called for his ability to hit long jump shots as far back as high school --- in the late sixties with no three-point line.

Edgy MD Oct 04 2011 08:05 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

This guy has Celtics announcer Johnny Most using the term in the sixties.

metirish Oct 04 2011 08:09 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

So ,John Sterling may or may not have coined the term "Downtown", let's stop wasting bandwidth on this nonsense.

Benjamin Grimm Oct 04 2011 08:09 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Edgy DC wrote: This guy has Celtics announcer Johnny Most using the term in the sixties.

Edgy MD Oct 04 2011 08:17 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

metirish wrote: So ,John Sterling may or may not have coined the term "Downtown", let's stop wasting bandwidth on this nonsense. Sorry, you have next subject.

metirish Oct 04 2011 08:21 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Edgy DC wrote: metirish wrote: So ,John Sterling may or may not have coined the term "Downtown", let's stop wasting bandwidth on this nonsense. Sorry, you have next subject. ah man, I was taking the piss.....a phrase I coined on this board...really

Ceetar Oct 04 2011 08:21 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Again, it's all about his awkward delivery and the resulting issue of plays unfolding before he can describe them that drives me nuts. If the Mets/660 were to keep him employed it would be worth the investment in 3 weeks of offseason play by play boot camp with a guy like Cohen who's always on top of the unfolding action. Can you teach it? Gary's been doing TV all summer where he doesn't need to get descriptive, and he stepped into the radio booth for the ALDS and didn't miss a step.

metirish Oct 04 2011 08:52 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Ceetar wrote: John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Again, it's all about his awkward delivery and the resulting issue of plays unfolding before he can describe them that drives me nuts. If the Mets/660 were to keep him employed it would be worth the investment in 3 weeks of offseason play by play boot camp with a guy like Cohen who's always on top of the unfolding action. Can you teach it? Gary's been doing TV all summer where he doesn't need to get descriptive, and he stepped into the radio booth for the ALDS and didn't miss a step. caught some of the Rangers game yesterday on the radio, Cohen was great , I really miss him doing radio.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Oct 04 2011 11:51 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

I'm just worried a little when I hear him doing national radio... gives me a little of the my-favorite-little-band-has-a-cresting-radio-hit agita. The more people hear him (combined with the best-play-by-play-men encomiums in the odd periodical), the more likely it is that someone offers him more money than he can turn down to leave our Metly orbit for a much grander stage.

Frayed Knot Oct 04 2011 11:57 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Except that there really is no grander stage. He's already in NYC and if there's one thing we KNOW about Gary it's that he's not going to the Bronx. And in baseball the local gig is really more prestigious than the national one. I think the worst that happens is that he gets an occasional national game in addition to his NYM job meaning we'd lose him for a handful of games each year.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Oct 04 2011 11:59 AM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Not to mention that he's from here, of here, yadda yadda. Like all fears, it's not 100 percent rational.

Edgy MD Oct 04 2011 12:00 PM Re: "Fire Wayne Hagin"

Yeah. McCarver went national and it only meant that the Mets lost him every other Sunday. But gained him back when they were the national broadcast, which was pretty often. Then everything went... terribly wrong.