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Thoughts on Terry Collins

Still don't like him

1 votes

Didn't like him but now I do

1 votes

Always liked this guy

7 votes

Other

9 votes

metirish Jun 04 2012 07:07 AM

I've really grown to like Terry a lot , he seems like the perfect man for this team and seems to have changed the thinking around the place. No more talk of threading water until so and so pitcher/hitter comes back, the guys that replaced them need to produce. The players seems to really like playing for him and he seems to genuinely care about them. Thoughts?

Ceetar Jun 04 2012 07:13 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

metirish wrote: No more talk of threading water until so and so pitcher/hitter comes back, the guys that replaced them need to produce. The players seems to really like playing for him and he seems to genuinely care about them. I think there's a decent amount of value in this, in the accountability. As far as some of the more 'in the game' moments, I think he's average, but that's probably fine. Or maybe it's just because he's coming in after the worst manager in Mets history. I'd quibble with a couple of his bullpen priorities and his infatuation with platoon matchups, but overall i think he's doing an okay job. I'll sum it up with a Collins like quote: "He's a baseball manager"

batmagadanleadoff Jun 04 2012 07:14 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

I just had this conversation with a friend of mine the other day. Collins has grown on me this season in a good way more than any other Met. Though he's no Johnson or Bobby V. And that talk about having to be proud to put on the uniform gave me some bad Dallas Green flashbacks. (Are there any other kind of Dallas Green flashbacks)?

metirish Jun 04 2012 07:15 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

I think we could quibble about every managers in game stuff, obviously some are worse than others, Collins does seem streets ahead of the previous ones.

Benjamin Grimm Jun 04 2012 07:19 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

I voted other. I'm lukewarm on him. He's okay.

batmagadanleadoff Jun 04 2012 07:27 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

Ceetar wrote: Or maybe it's just because he's coming in after the worst manager in Mets history. Here's my personal list of the five worst Mets managers that I saw: Worst - Dallas Green (a moron and an asshole) Next - Willie Randolph ( a moron and a half) 3d - Jeff Torborg 4th - (tie) Art Howe; Jerry Manuel

Ceetar Jun 04 2012 07:33 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Or maybe it's just because he's coming in after the worst manager in Mets history. Here's my personal list of the five worst Mets managers that I saw: Worst - Dallas Green (a moron and an asshole) Next - Willie Randolph ( a moron and a half) 3d - Jeff Torborg 4th - (tie) Art Howe; Jerry Manuel Mine's obviously a very small sample. Willie gets points for getting the Mets to the postseason, and i think he managed differently, and better, while there so that definitely bumped him up for me. Valentine, Randolph, Howe, Manuel. I wasn't really following closely enough for Green, and everyone else I was too young for.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 04 2012 07:41 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

I still think he's a bit of strategic appointment for the organization, a kind of "turnaround specialist" who would not be here were the team not in a financial crisis, deep in low expectations, and in need of a someone who can make "playing the game the right way" and "believing in the guys we have here" as credible as possible while the guys behind the curtain execute the financial restructuring. It's all working out as planned on that front. Game-managing wise, I'm only okay on him. And while he's getting a lot of credit for the magic that's happening now, his downfall will come once the expectations heighten and the "magic" wears off. By then, the org can look to a "winner" type to get the rest of the way. That's why I find all this "extend him NOW!!!!" talk is a little unrealistic.

Ceetar Jun 04 2012 07:44 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: That's why I find all this "extend him NOW!!!!" talk is a little unrealistic. yeah, no on that. I never worry about a managers contract, no reason to get locked in. I think it also helped that Collins had a year here, knew the organization, specifically the minor leaguers. So now when he gets these guys called up, he knows them a little.

Edgy MD Jun 04 2012 07:46 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

I like him and I liked him when he was the field coordinator. He was the best minor league field coordinator, whatever the hell that means, the Mets have ever had. That said, if the Mets are giving out extensions, Terry's about 17th on my list.

metirish Jun 04 2012 07:53 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

This is the first I have heard about extending Terry......not a priority, agree with Bucket there , although I think this front office would not appoint a person radically different than Terry if it came to that, a so called free thinker(whatever that means) like Joe Madden doesn't strike me as an Alderson type......

MFS62 Jun 04 2012 07:53 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

I voted "other". Seems to be a good leader for whom players really hustle. But I wish he'd lose that Tony LaRussa book on ritualistic pitching changes. Later

bmfc1 Jun 04 2012 07:57 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

We were told that he is an excitable boy but for the most part he has been reserved. He seems to be a strong leader and has the respect of the team. Sadly, he is a bad in-game manager, making changes and bunting when "the book" says he should.

Ceetar Jun 04 2012 08:00 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

metirish wrote: This is the first I have heard about extending Terry......not a priority, agree with Bucket there , although I think this front office would not appoint a person radically different than Terry if it came to that, a so called free thinker(whatever that means) like Joe Madden doesn't strike me as an Alderson type...... people mention it on Twitter occasionally. Not real people mind you, but the sentiment is out there and it's only a matter of time before some of the national writers or beat guys start talking about it. Managers often get credit for perceived over-performance.

Ceetar Jun 04 2012 08:02 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

bmfc1 wrote: We were told that he is an excitable boy but for the most part he has been reserved. He seems to be a strong leader and has the respect of the team. Sadly, he is a bad in-game manager, making changes and bunting when "the book" says he should. I'll say this though, my favorite thing about Terry is that he's not afraid to say he was wrong, and adjust. He free admits to making a ton of mistakes in previous managerial stints and this attitude always leaves me with the feeling that if presented with enough evidence he'll make a needed change. Some of the comments he made this Spring Training revolved around fixing up some of the stuff that went wrong last year and I think the added shifting and the seemingly better pitcher bunts and such seem to be born out of that adjustment.

TransMonk Jun 04 2012 08:10 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

I thought he did a great job last season and is doing even better now. I question some of his on the field decisions, but I think any manager is going to be questioned. I question him less than Willie or Jerry. I think mentally he has this team showing the confidence to win when his predecessors did not. I agree with Bucket that he is only here because of the situation the team is in, but he is making the most of it. After the 5-13 start in 2011, the Mets played .500 ball the rest of the season...and they are 8 games over through a third of the season this year. That puts him at .500 through 216 games in his Mets career as of today. I expected less than that and I think he is doing a fine job given what he has to work with.

sharpie Jun 04 2012 08:15 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

I like him and had a good feeling about him the first time I heard him speak. I don't find myself in situations where I think my guy is going to be out-managed by the other guy which had been the case for the previous three managers. I have to vote Torborg as my least favorite Met manager. Dallas Green gets a few points for badmouthing George Steinbrenner and his in-game managing wasn't terrible. Torborg managed to do everything badly and was a jerk besides.

Vic Sage Jun 04 2012 08:46 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

Ceetar wrote: Ceetar wrote: Or maybe it's just because he's coming in after the worst manager in Mets history. Here's my personal list of the five worst Mets managers that I saw: Worst - Dallas Green (a moron and an asshole) Next - Willie Randolph ( a moron and a half) 3d - Jeff Torborg 4th - (tie) Art Howe; Jerry Manuel Mine's obviously a very small sample. Willie gets points for getting the Mets to the postseason, and i think he managed differently, and better, while there so that definitely bumped him up for me. Valentine, Randolph, Howe, Manuel. I wasn't really following closely enough for Green, and everyone else I was too young for. Valentine? VALENTINE? he's the top of your "worst Mets managers"? Wow. At first, i wanted you to explain that. but you know, i just don't think i want to hear it. Reading the tortured logic behind that assertion would be a bad way to start a work week.

Edgy MD Jun 04 2012 08:50 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

I think ceetar just rated best to worst among managers that appeared on his watch.

Ceetar Jun 04 2012 08:53 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

yeah, I'd said Manuel was the worst manager ever above so I figured the order was obvious.

Vic Sage Jun 04 2012 08:58 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

[u:2f1ix2xc]Best Mets managers:[/u:2f1ix2xc] Davey Johnson Gil Hodges Bobby Valentine Yogi Berra Casey Stengel [u:2f1ix2xc]Worst Mets managers:[/u:2f1ix2xc] Dallas Green Art Howe Jerry Manuel Jeff Torborg Willie Randolph [u:2f1ix2xc]mediocrities:[/u:2f1ix2xc] Terry Collins Joe Torre George Bamberger Wes Westrum Joe Frazier [u:2f1ix2xc]incompletes (less-than-full season):[/u:2f1ix2xc] Buddy Harrelson Frank Howard Roy McMillan Salty Parker Mike Cubbage

sharpie Jun 04 2012 09:39 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

Bud Harrelson managed 274 Met games. He doesn't get an incomplete. He goes in the mediocrities column and an argument can be made that he goes in the worst column.

Vic Sage Jun 04 2012 09:52 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

true, and i had listed him that way originally (in the mediocrities list; i couldn't in good conscience put him on the "worst" list). It's just that he only managed PARTS of 2 seasons, and was never given the opportunity to manage one entire season from beginning to end, and that was the criteria i was using. plus this way i get 4 neat lists of 5 managers each to satisfy my anal list-making compulsion.

metsguyinmichigan Jun 04 2012 10:06 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

Willie DID take a team to within a game of the World Series, and a (painful) second place finish.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 04 2012 10:12 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

I'll never know why since Wayne Coffey shelved the book and made millions writing with Red-carpet Appearances Dickey instead but at some point the team stopped responding to Willie late in that '06 season and never tuned him back in. I hated that he was so paranoid and defensive and churlish, maybe that was it.

sharpie Jun 04 2012 10:17 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

Vic, you could do 5 lists of 4 adding a mediocre-to-good and mediocre-to-bad list.

TheOldMole Jun 04 2012 11:21 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

Wes Westrum was a terrible manager. I didn't have serious problems with either Jerry or Willie. I thought they both did decent jobs. You can't compare them to Art Howe or Dallas Green. Too early to rate Terry Collins. I voted "other" -- was OK with him, still OK with him. I agree with Vic's five best.

TheOldMole Jun 04 2012 11:23 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

And I'd put George Bamberger down on the worst list too. He was hired as a great teacher of pitchers, and the Mets' pitchers never performed worse than under Bambi.

Edgy MD Jun 04 2012 11:24 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

I thought you liked Wes. It's through you that I learned the key fact that he had no take sign because take was the default until you got a sign that it was OK to swing. That lone fact feeds me like 75% of my perception of Wes Westrum.

Ashie62 Jun 04 2012 11:37 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

Terry is long on something I do not have..patience.

metirish Jun 06 2012 09:08 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

About last night Terry?

Ceetar Jun 06 2012 09:10 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

metirish wrote: About last night Terry? Was Terry putting Valdespin in over Quintinilla doublespeak going against his "he's not a SS" line or was it a measure of accountability for Q? "You make an error, you don't get to play"? Of course, the infield's gonna only have David Wright on it tonight if that's the logic.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 06 2012 11:13 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jun 06 2012 01:04 PM

Yeah, I don't think there are enough bodies for a full-on accountability movement right now. Soon though. Outside of strategy, I kinda like the Daddy-cares-too-much vibe he's got going right now. It makes me wonder whether he ends up pulling a "Good Will Hunting"/"It's not your fault" with Ike or Valdespin. (Voted "Other.")

duan Jun 06 2012 11:44 AM Re: Thoughts on Terry Collins

I voted other, in that I find him pretty grating in lots of ways and there's far too much 'pep' in the way he operates and I reckon he'd drive me nuts if I had to work with him, but it seems like he's got the players on board to some degree so I'll give him a pass on it for now. Strategically I'm not as qualified because my late inning game watching is relatively rare, one thing I do like though is the willingness to plug and play - he's had a whale load of guys shuffle through and he's kind of just got on with it and giving them chances to succeed mostly rather then opportunities to fail. I always felt Jerry Manuel in particular was almost always hoping the replacements would fail to produce so he could whine about not having better gangstas to hang with.