All-Star Break Boredom Poll

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All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Caracas, Venezuela 0 votes

Charlotte, North Carolina 5 votes

Columbus, Ohio 0 votes

Havana, Cuba 6 votes

Indianapolis, Indiana 2 votes

Las Vegas, Nevada 7 votes

Mexico City, Mexico 2 votes

Monterrey, Mexico 0 votes

Montreal, Quebec 0 votes

Nashville, Tennessee 3 votes

Norfolk, Virginia 1 votes

Ottawa, Ontario 0 votes

Portland, Oregon 6 votes

Providence, Rhode Island 1 votes

Sacramento, California 1 votes

San Antonio, Texas 0 votes

San Jose, California 0 votes

San Juan, Puerto Rico 5 votes

Santo Domingo, Dominican Republic 0 votes

Vancouver, British Columbia 4 votes

Other [Write in below] 2 votes

Mets – Willets Point
Jul 11 2012 12:24 AM

So, Major League Baseball has decided to expand to 32 teams and you're on the committee that will select which two cities will host the new teams. For the purposes of this poll, assume that all cities listed have a fiscally sound ownership group with a plans for a new or reconditioned baseball stadium. You only have to decide which two cities would be best for baseball.

duan
Jul 11 2012 03:47 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I voted Havana & Providence.
Havana cause it'd be so fucking amazing and Providence cause my american cousins have a huge summer house in Rhode Island (near Newport rather then Providence) that I'd like to go back to.

The ASB is crap.

Benjamin Grimm
Jul 11 2012 04:06 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Charlotte and Nashville.

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Jul 11 2012 04:10 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Going all Corleone with Havana and Las Vegas.

I refuse to vote for "cities" named "______-ville."

bmfc1
Jul 11 2012 05:09 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Good question. MLB would love a temptress so they could hold up their current cities for a new stadium or renovations. MLB used to have this with Tampa and the NFL currently has this with Los Angeles. I went with Indianapolis and Central New Jersey. I don't think that the southern cities could support a team. I wonder if Portland has enough interest. San Juan is too small.

The population is there in mid-New Jersey. There are enough cable networks to attract interest. It won't happen because the Mets, MFY and MFP would object, but the market is there.

Edgy MD
Jul 11 2012 05:16 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I voted San Juan and Norfolk, but Duan has me utterly convinced that true expansion means switching to a system of promotion/relegation. That, at least in theory, would be expanding everywhere. That's the future.

Ceetar
Jul 11 2012 05:36 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Vegas and Vancouver. I think more West Coast Baseball is a good idea. Portland was a close third.

metirish
Jul 11 2012 05:45 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Is this expansion for real?

I went with Oregon

Looks like a good sports town....passionate fans

I'd like San Juan but games there in the past didn't sell out , MLB prices were too steep for the locals.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Jul 11 2012 06:42 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Portland's a great sports town, and pleasantly Austin-y. I'll go with the weirdos y Habana.

Ceetar
Jul 11 2012 06:56 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote:
Portland's a great sports town, and pleasantly Austin-y. I'll go with the weirdos y Habana.

Does Portland have the population? The Portland Hop-Growers! Hoppers? Portland would have to be NL so we can force a Mariners interleague rivalry.

Benjamin Grimm
Jul 11 2012 06:59 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I would want a Portland team to be called the "Beavers" but I don't think MLB has enough guts to let that happen.

metirish
Jul 11 2012 07:01 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Would Seattle have anything stupid like territorial rights over Portland....

metsmarathon
Jul 11 2012 07:12 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

i voted havana and mexico city, but would like to nominate for consideration, europe.

Ceetar
Jul 11 2012 07:17 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

metsmarathon wrote:
i voted havana and mexico city, but would like to nominate for consideration, europe.

I don't like the travel involved in any of those. Maybe Mexico City. add it to Vegas, Houston, Arlington and.. San Diego? as AL SouthWest division?

Nymr83
Jul 11 2012 07:42 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Wouldn't Mexico City make Coors field look friendly to pitchers? I think its at a much higher elevation.

San Juan can't support it, and neither can Havana or anywhere else outside the US/Canada unless you are talking about a 'playboy millionaire' owner who is willing to operate his new toy at a huge loss paying American Dollars to his players and taking in Monopoly Money.

I believe Portland is the largest market without a team and its a long way from Atlanta to Washington on a very populated East Coast so I'll take Charlotte as well. Vegas was my 3rd choice.

soupcan
Jul 11 2012 07:43 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jul 11 2012 07:46 AM

I picked Portland and Charlotte because I guess those two are probably the most realistic locations.

I would LOVE to see Havana and Mexico City though...

Benjamin Grimm wrote:
I would want a Portland team to be called the "Beavers" but I don't think MLB has enough guts to let that happen.

Yup. Just like the Rockies should have been the Denver Bears and the D'Bags should have been the Phoenix Rattlers. the Portland team would probably be called the Portland Rain or the Portland Mist or some other ridiculous, dumbass name.

And let me give some overdue kudos to MLB for FINALLY getting it right and renaming the National League team in South Florida, the 'Miami' Marlins. Yes, I know that it was a condition of the city funding the stadium but still - good job acquiescing.

MFS62
Jul 11 2012 07:45 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I voted Havana and Vancouver.

Later

Benjamin Grimm
Jul 11 2012 07:47 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

soupcan wrote:
Yup. Just like the Rockies should have been the Denver Bears and the D'Bags should have been the Phoenix Rattlers.

Phoneix Rattlers? I seem to remember the AAA team being called the Phoenix Firebirds.

Ceetar
Jul 11 2012 07:48 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

soupcan wrote:
I picked Portland and Charlotte because I guess those two are probably the most realistic locations.

I would LOVE to see Havana and Mexico City though...

Benjamin Grimm wrote:
I would want a Portland team to be called the "Beavers" but I don't think MLB has enough guts to let that happen.

Yup. Just like the Rockies should have been the Denver Bears and the D'Bags should have been the Phoenix Rattlers. the Portland team would probably be called the Portland Rain or the Portland Mist or some other ridiculous, dumbass name.

I kinda like the Portland Mist, although it sounds more like an NBA name.

I associate Portland with amazing local cuisine and excellent beer and local hops. (I put Mt. Hood hops in my Strawberry NieuwenWeiss)

What about the others? Vegas Rollers? Vegas Neons? (Would love to see the Neons play the Rays)

(I'm tired of animals personally) How about Phoenix Phoenix?

Benjamin Grimm
Jul 11 2012 07:50 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I hate singular names. Thankfully MLB hasn't had any teams with names like that... yet. I hope it continues.

And I would call a Vegas team the Las Vegas Stars.

Swan Swan H
Jul 11 2012 08:04 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Vancouver and San Juan, provided that Vancouver is in the AL so I don't have to stay up for more west coast games.

Edgy MD
Jul 11 2012 08:16 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

In a free market, city sizes and incidence of wealth wouldn't much matter.

San Juan could flourish fine. City's not rich enough? Well, Cleveland and Detroit aren't enrichening themselves particularly these days, but they have baseball.

But there are wealthy suburbs around San Juan, and certainly tourists looking to drop money. If the team captures people's imaginations, it would capture their money.

The truth is that professional sports leagues are gravitating toward gambling towns.

batmagadanleadoff
Jul 11 2012 08:24 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

One write in vote for Brooklyn. Then I'd vote for an ownership swap. Then I'd give the new team our You Know Who Rotunda with all of the accompanying 42 memorabilia, too.

soupcan
Jul 11 2012 08:30 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Benjamin Grimm wrote:
soupcan wrote:
Yup. Just like the Rockies should have been the Denver Bears and the D'Bags should have been the Phoenix Rattlers.

Phoneix Rattlers? I seem to remember the AAA team being called the Phoenix Firebirds.

Yeah - as in 'Rattlesnakes'. I don't know that it has any historical significance but at least the name sounds cool and fits the region. And since they want to be associated with snakes, Rattlers or Rattlesnakes is waaaay better than D'Backs or Diamondbacks.

Firebirds goes with 'Phoenix' of course but I'm partial local wildlife I guess.

Chad Ochoseis
Jul 11 2012 08:36 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Havana. They hate the Yanquis even more than we do.

Fidel isn't going to be around forever. No better time than the present to start engaging with Cuba.

San Juan. I'm doubling down on the Caribbean. Easy travel, natural fan base, economies that could use a boost outside the tourist season.

Ceetar
Jul 11 2012 08:41 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Chad Ochoseis wrote:

San Juan. I'm doubling down on the Caribbean. Easy travel, natural fan base, economies that could use a boost outside the tourist season.

That stadium would probably be worth of a Carlos Beltran rotunda.

metsmarathon
Jul 11 2012 08:54 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

phoenix rising

las vegas gold dust

havana torcedors

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Jul 11 2012 08:59 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Caracas Maracas
Havana Filter Kings
Las Vegas Gay White Tigers

duan
Jul 11 2012 09:00 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Edgy DC wrote:
I voted San Juan and Norfolk, but Duan has me utterly convinced that true expansion means switching to a system of promotion/relegation. That, at least in theory, would be expanding everywhere. That's the future.

You're not wrong there.

Vic Sage
Jul 11 2012 09:03 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

i would take 2 southeastern teams, so that divisional realignment would make geographical sense and be regionally balanced, as follows:

AL East - NYY, BOS, TOR, BLT
NL East - NYM, PHI, PIT, DC

AL Central - ChW, CLE, DET, MNN
NL Central - ChC, STL, MILW, CINN

AL South - TB, KC, TX, [NASHVILLE] (or Charlotte, San Juan, Norfolk, etc)
NL South - MIA, ATL, HOU, [SAN JUAN] (ditto)

AL West - LAA, OAK, SEA, COL (move to AL)
NL West - LA, SF, SD, AZ

Mets – Willets Point
Jul 11 2012 09:04 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

For those of you concerned about population base, I checked the most recent population statistics and every one of these cities listed is in a metropolitan area that is more populous than the smallest market currently in MLB (which is Milwaukee). The Latin American cities are all very large so they'd definitely have the people, but realistically it would be a challenge for them to support teams financially against the US teams. I'm pretty amused that Havana is leading the poll right now since I listed it just for a laugh. I expect the communist government would have be overthrown before Havana could even be considered for expansion.

Mets – Willets Point
Jul 11 2012 09:09 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

duan wrote:
Edgy DC wrote:
I voted San Juan and Norfolk, but Duan has me utterly convinced that true expansion means switching to a system of promotion/relegation. That, at least in theory, would be expanding everywhere. That's the future.

You're not wrong there.

I've pondered a promotion/relegation system for MLB (and the NHL) myself. I think it would work well, eventually, but it would have to start by totally dismantling the farm system and making it so that none of the current major league teams have any players under contract beyond their 40-man roster.

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Jul 11 2012 09:20 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I think your crazy relegation/promotion might be fun but feel it'd be next to impossible to implement: Owners would never go for it, everything would need to be negotiated with the union etc etc. But if has a shot it starts by getting a real believer/reformer in the commissioner's chair when Selig finally steps aside in 2014.

Better start advocating.

MFS62
Jul 11 2012 09:23 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

To quote Jim Bouton "Vancouver Damn Mountie".
And I always like the Havana Sun Kings of the IL. The last major leaguer I remember who played for them was Vic Davalillo.

Later

Edgy MD
Jul 11 2012 09:30 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Mets – Willets Point wrote:
For those of you concerned about population base, I checked the most recent population statistics and every one of these cities listed is in a metropolitan area that is more populous than the smallest market currently in MLB (which is Milwaukee). The Latin American cities are all very large so they'd definitely have the people, but realistically it would be a challenge for them to support teams financially against the US teams. I'm pretty amused that Havana is leading the poll right now since I listed it just for a laugh. I expect the communist government would have be overthrown before Havana could even be considered for expansion.

My feeling is that poor people support sports. And while they won't pay, on average, what Bostonians will pay for a ticket, poor folks in Boston occasionally get to the game, too.

If you get a San Juan team folks can bet behind, even at $3 a ticket, that's success. And as the NBA has proven, you make a sport popular enough with people struggling to make ends meet, the ones with money will come out too --- to prove they're down with the people and, by gobbling up expensive seats, to show they're better.

Ceetar
Jul 11 2012 09:34 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Edgy DC wrote:

If you get a San Juan team folks can bet behind, even at $3 a ticket, that's success. And as the NBA has proven, you make a sport popular enough with people struggling to make ends meet, the ones with money will come out too --- to prove they're down with the people and, by gobbling up expensive seats, to show they're better.

Be difficult to field even a 50-100 million dollar payroll at $3 a seat though initially.

Mets – Willets Point
Jul 11 2012 09:36 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Edgy DC wrote:
Mets – Willets Point wrote:
For those of you concerned about population base, I checked the most recent population statistics and every one of these cities listed is in a metropolitan area that is more populous than the smallest market currently in MLB (which is Milwaukee). The Latin American cities are all very large so they'd definitely have the people, but realistically it would be a challenge for them to support teams financially against the US teams. I'm pretty amused that Havana is leading the poll right now since I listed it just for a laugh. I expect the communist government would have be overthrown before Havana could even be considered for expansion.

My feeling is that poor people support sports. And while they won't pay, on average, what Bostonians will pay for a ticket, poor folks in Boston occasionally get to the game, too.

If you get a San Juan team folks can bet behind, even at $3 a ticket, that's success. And as the NBA has proven, you make a sport popular enough with people struggling to make ends meet, the ones with money will come out too --- to prove they're down with the people and, by gobbling up expensive seats, to show they're better.

I don't disagree with that, and I expect a Latin American team would have avid support, but teams today don't bring in the money through selling tickets. They have cable TV deals and lucrative sponsorships and the like. That's where I'd see a Latin American city being at a disadvantage even if they sell out all of their games.

Edgy MD
Jul 11 2012 09:43 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I don't know. Maybe. But I see broadcast rights being sold throughout the Caribbean, big-time resort sponsors coming on board to reach the tourist market, and the team becoming a home team of sorts to the Spanish-speaking Caribbean diaspora in the US, who will subscribe to cable and internet packages to follow their team.

Ceetar
Jul 11 2012 09:52 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Edgy DC wrote:
I don't know. Maybe. But I see broadcast rights being sold throughout the Caribbean, big-time resort sponsors coming on board to reach the tourist market, and the team becoming a home team of sorts to the Spanish-speaking Caribbean diaspora in the US, who will subscribe to cable and internet packages to follow their team.

The Marlins would HATE that.

would resort sponsors come on board? being that the broadcasts will be to the people already down there, would you reach the tourist market? I could seem them preferring to spend money for a spot on SNY to get New Yorkers to come down to see the Mets on the road more so.

Edgy MD
Jul 11 2012 09:58 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I don't know. If you work hard at your business, yeah. You're a Met fan down in San Juan watching the Mets play Los Azucareros. You see a giant billboard to come stay at the San Royale, you think, "You know, maybe that's better than the shithole I'm staying in --- La Cucaracha --- and maybe more affordable than I thought. I'm new at this Caribbean travel thing, but I'd like to come back, maybe bring the family some time. Hey, maybe I can do some dining and gambling over there tonight!"

And yeah, if they're selling broadcast rights to cable carriers or Univision or Telemundo or something, they can include ads for fans in the US to hop aboard Jet Blue and be in the sunny Caribe, home of the Los Azucareros.

Dream it and see it through.

Swan Swan H
Jul 11 2012 09:59 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Ceetar wrote:
Edgy DC wrote:
I don't know. Maybe. But I see broadcast rights being sold throughout the Caribbean, big-time resort sponsors coming on board to reach the tourist market, and the team becoming a home team of sorts to the Spanish-speaking Caribbean diaspora in the US, who will subscribe to cable and internet packages to follow their team.

The Marlins would HATE that.

would resort sponsors come on board? being that the broadcasts will be to the people already down there, would you reach the tourist market? I could seem them preferring to spend money for a spot on SNY to get New Yorkers to come down to see the Mets on the road more so.

It's not just for locals. When FMan or cooby, for example, listens to a Mets-San Juan game on MLB.tv or radio, they will often get the other team's broadcasters. They may not play commercials, but every pitching change and home run promotion sponsored by a resort does get get broadcast.

There is also stadium signage that will be seen by fans of the visiting team whenever they play the San Juan club. The Marlins, I believe, have had a resort advertising behind the plate for years.

MFS62
Jul 11 2012 10:01 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I saw the all-star game when I was in Aruba a few years ago. There was only one tv station. They only had one commercial - for Aruba tourism. And if you watched the entire game, you saw it over 20 times.

Later

themetfairy
Jul 11 2012 10:07 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Vegas. Simply for the road trip possibilities.

Mets – Willets Point
Jul 11 2012 10:08 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Edgy has totally got me ready to invest in his San Juan expansion team project.

seawolf17
Jul 11 2012 10:21 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

MFS62 wrote:
I saw the all-star game when I was in Aruba a few years ago. There was only one tv station. They only had one commercial - for Aruba tourism. And if you watched the entire game, you saw it over 20 times.

Later

That's pretty funny, but if you're watching it on Aruba TV, then maybe they missed their market. Aren't you already there?

Frayed Knot
Jul 11 2012 10:38 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I think the scoreboard in Caracas would be interesting.
It could show: Runs - HIts - Errors - Kidnappings

metsmarathon
Jul 11 2012 10:45 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

themetfairy wrote:
Vegas. Simply for the road trip possibilities.

then i propose an alternative... the bermuda shorts. not so much a road trip, but a boat trip is pretty nice as well.

themetfairy
Jul 11 2012 10:49 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

metsmarathon wrote:
Vegas. Simply for the road trip possibilities.

then i propose an alternative... the bermuda shorts. not so much a road trip, but a boat trip is pretty nice as well.

Perfect - that's my second location!

Added benefit - Bermuda is only a 2-hour flight from NYC :)

Mets – Willets Point
Jul 11 2012 11:27 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I don't think Bermuda has a flat, grassy space large enough to hold a baseball field.

metsmarathon
Jul 11 2012 11:34 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

float it. how awesome would that be?

Mets – Willets Point
Jul 11 2012 11:41 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

metsmarathon wrote:
float it. how awesome would that be?

So they'd play on a cruise ship? They could bring their ballpark to New York for road trips.

metsmarathon
Jul 11 2012 11:45 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

some sort of large, sea-worthy platform. perhaps a modified cruse ship or a carrier. something that's massive and stable enough to damp out any waves, and which can also carry the requisite number of people. it would be a massive tourist attraction all by itself. a wonder of the world, if you will.

Edgy MD
Jul 11 2012 11:49 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Mets – Willets Point wrote:
I don't think Bermuda has a flat, grassy space large enough to hold a baseball field.

My cousin Chris and a bunch of other Long Islanders started a Bermudan National Lacrosse League. Got to represent Bermuda in the World Championships.

I've never been, but they must practice somewhere.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Jul 11 2012 11:52 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Another consideration for those about to rock Havana (like me), Mexico City, San Juan, or anywhere else Caribbean or semi-Caribbean: you're laying down a franchise who'll spend about 2/3 of their season looking over their shoulder at the Atlantic hurricane season.

Ceetar
Jul 11 2012 11:57 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote:
Another consideration for those about to rock Havana (like me), Mexico City, San Juan, or anywhere else Caribbean or semi-Caribbean: you're laying down a franchise who'll spend about 2/3 of their season looking over their shoulder at the Atlantic hurricane season.

Aruba? They're always clear of the hurricanes right?

I like the floating stadium idea though.

or...

underground! you walk through an underground 'aquarium' to get into the place. The field is actually BELOW sea level. The LF wall is thick solid glass and you can take the underwater tour and watch an inning with SCUBA gear from under water.

Of course, it'd probably have to be named Google Field to have the money to build it, but it's worth it. This might be a better idea in New Orleans than in the middle of the ocean though. Plus drainage would be a bitch when it rains.

themetfairy
Jul 11 2012 08:03 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Mets – Willets Point wrote:
I don't think Bermuda has a flat, grassy space large enough to hold a baseball field.

The soccer stadium can double up.

Ashie62
Jul 11 2012 08:20 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Nashville and Las Vegas.

Valadius
Jul 12 2012 10:28 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Surprised Austin and Orlando aren't on here.

Irrespective of realignment, I'm inclined to move the A's to Sacramento (they have their AAA club there already) and expand to Austin and either Portland or Orlando.

TransMonk
Jul 12 2012 10:37 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Oklahoma City?

Mets – Willets Point
Jul 12 2012 10:45 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

themetfairy wrote:
Mets – Willets Point wrote:
I don't think Bermuda has a flat, grassy space large enough to hold a baseball field.

The soccer stadium can double up.

I recall now that I attended the Bermuda Cup at the St. George's Cricket Club. I suppose they could adapt that to baseball.

metsmarathon
Jul 12 2012 11:32 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

nah, they should really float it. and hurry, too, before dubai gets in on the action.

Edgy MD
Jul 12 2012 11:44 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Want to expand to the Latin American world but fear instability and economic scarcity, there's always Costa Rica, where lots of Americans

Call themselves the Nahuatl.

Nymr83
Jul 13 2012 07:34 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Valadius wrote:
Surprised Austin and Orlando aren't on here.

Irrespective of realignment, I'm inclined to move the A's to Sacramento (they have their AAA club there already) and expand to Austin and either Portland or Orlando.

Austin maybe, but does Florida really need another team? They've proven incapable of giving the Marlins much support, even now that they've built a palacial new stadium.

Ceetar
Jul 13 2012 07:42 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Nymr83 wrote:
Surprised Austin and Orlando aren't on here.

Irrespective of realignment, I'm inclined to move the A's to Sacramento (they have their AAA club there already) and expand to Austin and either Portland or Orlando.

Austin maybe, but does Florida really need another team? They've proven incapable of giving the Marlins much support, even now that they've built a palacial new stadium.

I wonder how Orlando could do just based on tourism though. 7:30 games..have Disney-admission/game-admission tickets deals? Have Mickey be the mascot?

Edgy MD
Jul 13 2012 07:43 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Norfolk/Tidewater/Virginia Beach = largest metropolitan area in the US without a big league sports franchise.

Mets – Willets Point
Jul 13 2012 08:10 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Looks like Las Vegas is a clear winner with Portland and Havana neck-in-neck for the second slot.

My view is that Portland is a clear expansion favorite: a large and growing city with a dense city center and strong civic pride that is already showing a lot of support for their MLS team. Plus they'd be natural rivals for the Mariners who I believe are currently the most isolated team in MLB.

I gave my other vote to Vancouver but think Monterrey, Montreal (not one vote, really?), Norfolk, and San Jose would also be good options.

Vic Sage
Jul 13 2012 09:11 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Edgy DC wrote:
Norfolk/Tidewater/Virginia Beach = largest metropolitan area in the US without a big league sports franchise.

how far is that from DC?

Nymr83
Jul 13 2012 09:17 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Mets – Willets Point wrote:

I gave my other vote to Vancouver but think Monterrey, Montreal (not one vote, really?), Norfolk, and San Jose would also be good options.

Expos attendance and other problems are a strike against Montreal. Didn't they have trouble even finding an english-language radio station for a couple of years (or was it television?). Pass.

MFS62
Jul 13 2012 09:31 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Vic Sage wrote:
Edgy DC wrote:
Norfolk/Tidewater/Virginia Beach = largest metropolitan area in the US without a big league sports franchise.

how far is that from DC?

Depends on if you mean as the crow flies or if you have to drive.
To drive to that area from DC, you first have to drive about 90 miles to Richmond, then turn East and go about another hour or two. So another 100 miles or so. But the hypotenuse of that triangle might be short enough to upset any territorial protection radius the Nats might have.

Later

Edgy MD
Jul 13 2012 09:32 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

About 200 miles. Certainly further than New York to Philly.

Benjamin Grimm
Jul 13 2012 09:45 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

With contraction on the table so recently, I don't think expansion is in the cards any time soon. I would say that it won't happen until and unless the Athletics find a new home. The conventional wisdom (with which I disagree) is that there are no markets that a team can move to, but I think this thread indicates otherwise.

I would think that Indianapolis, Tennessee, North Carolina, and Oregon could all easily support teams. If I could put the Athletics anywhere, I'd put them in Valley Forge, Pennsylvania. It would be a return to their original roots, it would give the Phillies a financial pinch, and I'd have a local team that's not a division rival. Win-win-win!

Ashie62
Jul 13 2012 09:57 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Edgy DC wrote:
About 200 miles. Certainly further than New York to Philly.

Atlantic City to Cififield 265
AC to Philly 39

I can only go to Citifield when I visit my brother in NY

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Jul 13 2012 10:07 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Ashie62 wrote:
About 200 miles. Certainly further than New York to Philly.

Atlantic City to Cififield 265
AC to Philly 39

Philly to Queens, via I-95: 112

What I don't quite get, to be honest, is the A's-San Jose thing. Isn't that part of the A's turf, too? If the Mets decided to move to Brooklyn, they could do that w/o Yankee approval, no?

Edgy MD
Jul 13 2012 10:24 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

There's a map at the commish's office with like "Menlo Park belongs to the Giants. but Fremont to the Athletics. San Jose belongs to the Giants, but Palo Alto to the Athletics."

It's stupid. Nothing belongs to nobody. How about that?

Nymr83
Jul 13 2012 10:54 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Edgy DC wrote:
There's a map at the commish's office with like "Menlo Park belongs to the Giants. but Fremont to the Athletics. San Jose belongs to the Giants, but Palo Alto to the Athletics."

It's stupid. Nothing belongs to nobody. How about that?

The stadiums belong to the teams (even though they were usually paid for by the taxpayers), so you shouldn't be allowed to move inside another team's stadium.

I think its bad for the game to have constant movement and I think the owners, recognizing this, have made agreements not to move and even pay [crossout]bribe money[/crossout] revenue sharing to the teams stuck in the shittier markets as a result. But even though I think excessive movement is bad for the game, it should probably be allowed.

Mets – Willets Point
Jul 13 2012 11:27 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Nymr83 wrote:
Edgy DC wrote:
There's a map at the commish's office with like "Menlo Park belongs to the Giants. but Fremont to the Athletics. San Jose belongs to the Giants, but Palo Alto to the Athletics."

It's stupid. Nothing belongs to nobody. How about that?

The stadiums belong to the teams (even though they were usually paid for by the taxpayers), so you shouldn't be allowed to move inside another team's stadium.

I think its bad for the game to have constant movement and I think the owners, recognizing this, have made agreements not to move and even pay [crossout]bribe money[/crossout] revenue sharing to the teams stuck in the shittier markets as a result. But even though I think excessive movement is bad for the game, it should probably be allowed.

Well, this goes back to the promotion/regulation model that allows the teams to stay in the same place but move into different level of competition. It's pretty much pure capitalist meritocracy that the teams play the best play at the highest level. And it can be a benefit to small-market teams I think as well. Can't compete in the big leagues? Just get relegated and be a big fish in a small pond while you rebuild and then see if you can come back up.

Ceetar
Nov 13 2012 08:52 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

[url]http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=18886#.UKJkTf73n0w.twitter

Maury Brown weighs in on the subject with some research and ranking of 10 possible locations.

Edgy MD
Nov 13 2012 09:05 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

If the silly, scared, and grossly monopolistic territorial rights rules were lifted, there would be an initial instability as organizations rushed to fill opportunities that should have been filled decades ago. This would soon settle down and an honorable stability would reign. This would be more true if the parallel reform of the emancipation of the minor leagues took place.

Even now the indy minors --- Eastern League, Northern League, ALPB, Can-Am --- should be flooding MLB markets and reminding them that they own nothing.

metsmarathon
Nov 13 2012 09:15 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

i like the idea of a northern new jersey team. sussex county needs some damned baseball!

or is that too far north?

Edgy MD
Nov 13 2012 09:29 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

A Northern New Jersey team, a Brooklyn team, a Long Island team, and possibly a Conncecticut team too.

Bad for the Mets and Yankees, and possibly the Red Sox, but good for just about the whole world.

Benjamin Grimm
Nov 13 2012 09:59 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I like that idea.

Here's the short version of the list from the article:

1. Northern New Jersey
2. Sacramento, CA
3. Portland, OR
4. Charlotte, NC
5. Las Vegas, NV
6. San Antonio, TX
7. Monterrey, Mexico
8. Montreal, Canada
9. San Juan, Puerto Rico
10. Norfolk, VA

There are other areas that host NFL teams that are not on the list. (I know, NFL and MLB are different in many ways, but it's at least a starting point.) I can think offhand of Indianapolis, Tennessee, Buffalo, and Jacksonville. Of those, I think Tennessee might be most promising.

Philadelphia could probably support a second team, perhaps in the Valley Forge area of the suburbs. How great would it be if the Athletics moved back to their roots?

Edgy MD
Nov 13 2012 10:47 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Great beyond great. And possibly the Athletics reclaiming old territory would be the first pebble moved to break the dam of territorial exclusivity.

I believe that the Norfolk/Virginia Beach area is the US metropolitan region with the largest population to be represented by no major league sports.

Mets – Willets Point
Nov 13 2012 11:00 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Can you imagine this paragraph written about any American city 10 years ago? 5 years ago?

While PGE Park could be used as an interim facility, it’s an exceptional longshot now that it has been converted into a soccer-only venue. Getting into PGE Park means getting around MLS, and given the immense popularity of soccer in Portland, the odds of that are exceptionally long.

Ceetar
Nov 13 2012 11:59 AM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Mets – Willets Point wrote:
Can you imagine this paragraph written about any American city 10 years ago? 5 years ago?

While PGE Park could be used as an interim facility, it’s an exceptional longshot now that it has been converted into a soccer-only venue. Getting into PGE Park means getting around MLS, and given the immense popularity of soccer in Portland, the odds of that are exceptionally long.

yes.

seawolf17
Nov 13 2012 12:17 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Ceetar wrote:
Mets – Willets Point wrote:
Can you imagine this paragraph written about any American city 10 years ago? 5 years ago?

While PGE Park could be used as an interim facility, it’s an exceptional longshot now that it has been converted into a soccer-only venue. Getting into PGE Park means getting around MLS, and given the immense popularity of soccer in Portland, the odds of that are exceptionally long.

yes.

South American cities don't count.

Benjamin Grimm
Nov 13 2012 12:18 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

I was surprised to see it written in 2012.

Portland, Oregon is full of rabid soccer fans? I had no idea.

Ceetar
Nov 13 2012 12:21 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

seawolf17 wrote:
Ceetar wrote:
Mets – Willets Point wrote:
Can you imagine this paragraph written about any American city 10 years ago? 5 years ago?

While PGE Park could be used as an interim facility, it’s an exceptional longshot now that it has been converted into a soccer-only venue. Getting into PGE Park means getting around MLS, and given the immense popularity of soccer in Portland, the odds of that are exceptionally long.

yes.

South American cities don't count.

People have been talking big about soccer for as long as I can remember. A converted soccer-only stadium and one city supposedly big on it doesn't seem all that shocking. I suspect it's extremely exaggerated too. Not that I was looking for it, but I was there 3 years ago and can't remember anything about soccer being there. I didn't know soccer was there.

Hell, you can find cities that are all up in arms about other second-tier sports like Nascar and high school football.

metsguyinmichigan
Nov 13 2012 12:25 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

And what would be the average attendance at a Portland soccer game?

Ceetar
Nov 13 2012 12:28 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

metsguyinmichigan wrote:
And what would be the average attendance at a Portland soccer game?

looks like they sellout. 20,438.

Swan Swan H
Nov 13 2012 12:29 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Benjamin Grimm wrote:
I was surprised to see it written in 2012.

Portland, Oregon is full of rabid soccer fans? I had no idea.

I saw the end of an MLS game in Portland while waiting for something else to come on, and not knowing what or where it was I assumed it had to be in Europe - the place was packed and the crowd was going insane.

Apparently the key to soccer's success in the US is finding cities with relatively high levels of rain, ennui and marijuana.

Ceetar
Nov 13 2012 12:31 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

comparatively the "easy to get to" (it's along the PATH line which is no different than taking a train to Penn Station and taking a random subway to the UWS or the Financial district, but apparently it scares people) Red Bull Stadium was at ~60% capacity for the playoff game last thursday.

edit: this is unfair, didn't realize the PATH still wasn't running. geeze.

Frayed Knot
Nov 13 2012 12:37 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

The Portland team is a fairly new entry in MLS but it has proven to be extremely popular up there in its short life. Seattle too (which makes for a nice rivalry) but even they aren't to the same extent as Portland.

- Part of it is kids with a new toy syndrome
- Part is that it's been a one-team town up there for so long and this gives them a 2nd one in a different season
- the soccer-only stadium helps, 30K (or whatever) have a lot more fun in a 30K stadium than 30K will have in a 70K stadium
- the college sports up there (Oregon State & U-Oregon - aka Nike Univ) are only semi-big in football but neither is right in Portland
- and I suspect that being a bit off the beaten track gives them the feeling that they're ignored by the big eastern media (partly true) so they'll just go out and find their own thing as opposed to following the trend. Even track is still big up there.

Mets – Willets Point
Nov 13 2012 12:57 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

It's not just the popularity of soccer in Portland, but that this writer thinks MLS would get in the way of MLB expansion.

Ceetar
Nov 13 2012 01:06 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Mets – Willets Point wrote:
It's not just the popularity of soccer in Portland, but that this writer thinks MLS would get in the way of MLB expansion.

only in the financial sense of 'stealing' the stadium and re-renovating it.

Edgy MD
Nov 13 2012 01:28 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

The Portland franchise in the NASL was also successful --- perhaps second in fan support only to the Cosmos --- and both the name and the logo of the MLS franchise comes from the NASL forerunner.

That team went to the NASL finals in year one and the excitement was so palpable that the city nickname of "Soccer City USA" caught on. Problem was that making the finals your first year can be a letdown when you never get that far again.

Notable NASL Timbers included Clyde Best and John Bain.

To keep this in the baseball forum, it's worth noting that among those trying to wreck their joy was Vancouver Whitecaps defender Mark Nickeas.

metirish
Nov 13 2012 01:38 PM
Re: All-Star Break Boredom Poll - MLB Expansion

Must be something in the air up that way because anytime I have watched a Seattle Sounders game the football stadium looks near capacity...