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Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Ike

4 votes

Lucas

22 votes

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 20 2012 07:50 AM

Pretend for a moment that circumstances require you trade one of either Duda or Davis. Not because you want to, but because you have to. Pretend Bud Selig made it a requirement of winning the All-Star Game or whatever. Assume also that a trade brings the very same return (Infielder X and Pitching Prospect Y, they're not bad, you can see the upside). You're welcome to play the one you keep however you like. Which guy do you trade? Why?

bmfc1 Jul 20 2012 08:03 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Duda. I like them both but Ike is a premier fielder and Duda is, right now, a poor RF who probably should be a DH or playing first. BTW, Sherman says today that the Rays like Duda.

Edgy MD Jul 20 2012 08:16 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I hate to use a plastic word like "makeup," but Duda just doesn't seem to have the emotional constitution to thrive under a spotlight in the bigs. That's what I love about him to an extent, and I would hope he could perform well on a team that has so much offensive redundancy that he could lay low and not have to hit cleanup. But Selig has this gun to my head.

Benjamin Grimm Jul 20 2012 08:18 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Even with the horrendous start to his season, I think Ike has a much bigger upside than Duda. (I haven't checked out their backsides, but that's another story anyway.)

TransMonk Jul 20 2012 08:20 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I trade Duda. I think Davis has the higher ceiling and is the better defender.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 20 2012 08:33 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I'm inclined to agree with what you guys are saying except: 1) I'm less convinced Duda is done improving while I think we've seen everything Ike can be already 2) Assuming they are about the same offensively, moving Duda from right field to first base might improve the team. (Eh, probably a wash there with worse d he'd provide at first) 3) Duda less prone to ugly slumps (so far) 4) Duda less prone to injury (so far) 5) Duda cheaper for longer

Edgy MD Jul 20 2012 08:57 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I think history might dispute (3). Duda dug himself some deep dark holes at the start of his career in 2010 and again at the start of his 2011.

Frayed Knot Jul 20 2012 10:44 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: 5) Duda cheaper for longer Only one year's worth. That's the difference in service time which, in some ways moreso than performance, is the biggest factor in salary. Arb & FA will each come one year later for Duda. I'd deal Duda first also in this scenario. As a side note: Looking over Duda's stats (now that his 2012 ABs are conveniently just about equal to what he got in all of 2011) I was partially surprised to see that his HR-rate is actually up a bit l this season compared to last - I would have guessed he was down some. But the problem is that his BA is down about 50 points and that he's hitting doubles at about half the pace.

metirish Jul 20 2012 11:02 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

All those pretends are for you Ceetar......please play along :)

metirish Jul 20 2012 11:03 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I'll trade Davis.....Duda is Jim Thome ,but he doesn't know that yet and isn't acting like him at all.

Frayed Knot Jul 20 2012 11:12 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Thome also had 93 total HRs, a 38 HR season, a .400+ career OBA, a Silver Slugger award and a middle-of-the-pack MVP finish by the time he was Duda's age. And then he got good.

Ceetar Jul 20 2012 11:26 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

metirish wrote: All those pretends are for you Ceetar......please play along :) I hate pretend. but fine, I trade Davis because my hitting consultants, Keith Hernandez, Ralph Kiner, and my father, like Duda's swing better.

smg58 Jul 20 2012 01:20 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Duda's complete lack of defensive ability is hurting the Mets way more than his bat is helping. Davis has more upside, and I think we've already seen the worst stretch he'll have in his career.

Zvon Jul 20 2012 02:20 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Ceetar wrote: All those pretends are for you Ceetar......please play along :) I hate pretend. but fine, I trade Davis because my hitting consultants, Keith Hernandez, Ralph Kiner, and my father, like Duda's swing better. I trade Duda cuz my doctor says watching him play right is bad for my health. But you've got a good point there Ceets.

G-Fafif Jul 20 2012 02:39 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I have a real affinity for Ike and feel nothing in particular for Lucas, but I just traded Ike because I don't trust my affinities. Also, as JCL suggested, I think there's more to Duda than we're seeing (at 1B, probably) while we may have a pretty good picture of everything Ike can do. Also, indispensable power-hitting first basemen are sometimes dispensable, Albert. This is not a real-world endorsement of trading Ike Davis, mind you. Just a pretend-world answer to the question.

Nymr83 Jul 20 2012 02:58 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

The response looks pretty overwhelming even after Ike's putrid start to the season. I have to agree. I'm kinda shocked that Baseball-Reference has Ike with a negative dWAR, I'd think he's a contributor on defense, maybe its just sample size?

Ashie62 Jul 20 2012 03:59 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I trade Duda. Ike has better baseball instincts. Duda would make a great cleanup hitter for some crappy AL team.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 20 2012 05:09 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Nymr83 wrote: The response looks pretty overwhelming even after Ike's putrid start to the season. I have to agree. I'm kinda shocked that Baseball-Reference has Ike with a negative dWAR, I'd think he's a contributor on defense, maybe its just sample size? According to what defensive measures there be, he's been pretty stinky there, too. (And my eyes kindasorta agree.)

Swan Swan H Jul 20 2012 05:12 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Yup. I don't know if he was bringing his offensive troubles out there with him, but Ike hasn't been nearly as good with the glove as he was in his first two seasons.

The Second Spitter Jul 20 2012 06:31 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Shocked to see Ike has a higher SLG% than Duda.

Frayed Knot Jul 20 2012 06:38 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

The Second Spitter wrote: Shocked to see Ike has a higher SLG% than Duda. Especially when Ike is starting with a 40 point gap in BA Lucas's Isolated Slugging numbers are right around league average which isn't a good thing for a 250 pound right fielder with neither speed nor a glove.

Fman99 Jul 20 2012 07:39 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I'm smarter than all of you. I take a picture of Justin Turner wearing Duda's jersey, flip the negative around so he looks like a lefty. AND I FLIP THAT SHIT.

G-Fafif Sep 18 2012 05:45 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Rubin reports the Mets may be mulling a choice, and it could be the unpopular one per the poll results here and, one would guess, sentiment everywhere. The Mets will consider trading Ike Davis this offseason as a way to upgrade other areas of the team and open a spot for Lucas Duda at his natural position, a baseball source told ESPNNewYork.com. While that does not guarantee Davis will be moved, it at least is a very plausible option. Davis should be marketable despite a slow start because he is a 30-homer threat with the potential for above-average fielding at first base. The Mets are disappointed with Davis' unwillingness to make changes based on coaching advice. Although he is personable and by no means a troublemaker, they also worry about his impact on other young players in social settings away from the ballpark. The danger in trading Davis would be that there are few doubts about his ability to perform as a starter at the major league level. There is no guarantee Duda would perform at that level. And certainly he could not perform at the same level in the field. So being comfortable trading Davis would mean trusting the evaluation skills of the front office that Duda would thrive at his natural position. The Mets recently have been using Duda at first base against left-handers over Davis. Personally, trade 'em all.

The Second Spitter Sep 18 2012 05:53 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Good to see Adam keeping himself busy writing fluff pieces.

Edgy MD Sep 18 2012 05:58 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Purely speculation but I'd guess there's probably about 26 teams interested in Davis and maybe twenty fewer in Duda.

metirish Sep 18 2012 06:37 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

they also worry about his impact on other young players in social settings away from the ballpark. wtf Rubin..... don't just throw that bone out there and then nothing , does he turn into a total douchebag with drink?

HahnSolo Sep 18 2012 06:38 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Edgy DC wrote: Purely speculation but I'd guess there's probably about 26 teams interested in Davis and maybe twenty fewer in Duda. I'd probably agree...I would think the return would be greater for Davis, too.

Frayed Knot Sep 18 2012 06:38 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

"... they also worry about his impact on other young players in social settings away from the ballpark." Well now there's a sentence that's subject to a lot of speculation. Keeping late hours? Drinking? Whoring? Cross-dressing? Attending neo-Nazi rallies?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Sep 18 2012 06:40 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I'm guessing he swings wildly, then watches stuff he shouldn't.

Edgy MD Sep 18 2012 07:46 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I hacked Davis's account to find pictures of him partying away from the ballpark, and frankly, I'm stunned. Fucking deviant.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Sep 18 2012 07:51 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Of course the Deep Throat that leaked this story to Rubin also had to tear down Davis at the same time. So Wilponny. But at least they're finally talking about what we as a forum have been talking about. I'm wide open to this idea. Davis has zero wheels, prone to awful slumps, is a slow healer and lest we forget, is the son of an MFY. If he could bring us back an outfielder who could hit, geez we oughta consider it.

Benjamin Grimm Sep 18 2012 08:32 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I don't like the idea of committing to Duda, though. I hope that if they do trade Davis, that there's a better player that they can turn to to play first base.

metirish Sep 18 2012 08:33 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I'd explore it , no doubt, I do wonder how bad Duda would be at 1st? Can he play the position?, not expecting Mex here but he doesn't strike me as having much coordination.

MFS62 Sep 18 2012 08:47 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Benjamin Grimm wrote: I don't like the idea of committing to Duda, though. I hope that if they do trade Davis, that there's a better player that they can turn to to play first base. First base has been a possible destination for Wilmer Flores ever since the scouts (and fans) saw him run. Later

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Sep 18 2012 08:52 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Of course the Deep Throat that leaked this story to Rubin also had to tear down Davis at the same time. So Wilponny. But at least they're finally talking about what we as a forum have been talking about. I'm wide open to this idea. Davis has zero wheels, prone to awful slumps, is a slow healer and lest we forget, is the son of an MFY. If he could bring us back an outfielder who could hit, geez we oughta consider it. Unfortunately, even though he's got more value than the Duda, I'm not sure about how rare/valuable power-hitting-lefty-first-basemen-who-are-pretty-good-with-the-glove-but-have-no-other-position are. I'm thinking that's about the most he could net us-- an outfielder who could potentially hit.

The Second Spitter Sep 18 2012 08:58 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Davis has a 134 OPS+ post-ASG. On a team that can't buy home runs facing a realistic possibility of losing its next best HR hitter, trading him would be an act of lunacy. Edgy DC wrote: Fucking deviant. These are NSW Police. Fucking deviants, indeed. LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Unfortunately, even though he's got more value than the Duda, I'm not sure about how rare/valuable power-hitting-lefty-first-basemen-who-are-pretty-good-with-the-glove-but-have-no-other-position are. I'm thinking that's about the most he could net us-- an outfielder who could potentially hit. Who's going to cost a lot more $$$.

Vic Sage Sep 18 2012 10:18 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

you trade whichever one gets you back more. Neither has earned much more consideration than that, so far.

smg58 Sep 18 2012 12:00 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

So the one guy on the team whose power numbers haven't plummeted is the guy who doesn't listen to the hitting instructor. Doesn't that say more about the hitting instructor? I don't like it when people associated with the Mets say negative things publicly about players on the team. That's poison. This reminds me too much of what the Mets said about Angel Pagan last year. Pagan doesn't appear to be holding the Giants back any. Oh, and you never want to sell low on a guy. You certainly don't want to be the ones lowering the guy's value, either.

G-Fafif Sep 18 2012 12:01 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

It's too late. Justin Turner has already organized another theme road trip in which the players all dress up and enlisted Josh Thole to lend support.

G-Fafif Sep 18 2012 12:52 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

"I am not a late-night carouser," insists player implied to be late-night carouser. Ike Davis was surpised and confused Tuesday morning to read that the Mets were concerned about his nightlife habits. ESPN, citing a "baseball source," reported that the team was open to trading the first baseman, in part because "he is out too late after games." "I have never missed games or not been ready to work because of anything to do with staying up too late," Davis told the Daily News Tuesday morning. "I show up every day. I play hard. It is unfair to me, and it doesn't make sense." While the 25-year-old said that, since he does not often leave the ballpark until midnight, he is sometimes out a few hours after that - the norm among many in baseball - he does not do so in excess. "I just don't understand it, because I have always been able to play, except for one freak ankle injury," Davis said, referring to the 2011 on-field collision that ended his season. According to team insiders, the Mets are debating whether to make Davis or Lucas Duda the first baseman of the future. The team "won't shop either aggressively this winter, but will be open to the right deal for either," according to one club source. In a possibly related story, members of the Chicago Cubs and Pittsburgh Pirates admit they were out very late last night.

Zvon Sep 18 2012 01:46 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

smg58 wrote: I don't like it when people associated with the Mets say negative things publicly about players on the team. That's poison. I agree, this is bad stuff. Personally I think Rubins just trying to stir up some shit.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Sep 18 2012 01:52 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Zvon wrote: smg58 wrote: I don't like it when people associated with the Mets say negative things publicly about players on the team. That's poison. I agree, this is bad stuff. Personally I think Rubins just trying to stir up some shit. Come on, that's the least likely explanation. What's in it for Rubin to pass along inaccurate information? I am certain someone said this about Davis, and to one of the most widely read reporters on the beat. It's not like it was a mistake. The Mets do this over and over.

metirish Sep 18 2012 01:58 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Davis should move in with Wright , end of.

Edgy MD Sep 18 2012 02:26 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

It'd be pretty interesting if there was a belief in the Mets front office that Davis's glacial start was tied to some egregious party foul, or seriies of. "... sources say Davis had no idea she was Baxter's sister."

G-Fafif Sep 18 2012 03:44 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Molehill grows. In response to an ESPNNewYork.com report about potentially being traded this offseason, Ike Davis disputed allegations from a baseball source that he is resistant to coaching and out too late. "I don't really have an answer for that because it's never been an issue," Davis said. "I've never done anything wrong. I show up to the field ready to play every day. I really don't even know where it's coming from, and it's not really true. It is what it is. People can say whatever they want. It's not going to bother us. "I don't know what 'late' is, because when you leave the ballpark at 12 [midnight] and you get back to your place at 12:30, if you watch a movie it's 2:30. Is that late? It's up to everyone to decide what late is. If I had a job where I had to wake up at 6 in the morning, it would probably be late. But it's not. Our lifestyle is a little different. "I've never had a meeting. Nothing," Davis continued, when asked about whether the issues had been raised with him. "It's just out of the blue. It's hard to answer questions when no one can say who it was or why they even said it. I don't know if it's a cheap shot. It's falsely accused, I guess. It comes out of nowhere. It happens to athletes like this -- a rumor or something is said and it's blown out of proportion." As for the resistance-to-coaching suggestion, Davis added: "If you've seen my stances this year, we've tried a lot of things. I don't know about the 'uncoachable' thing. I don't know who would ever say that. I've done everything the coaches have asked me. It's really just a bunch of unknown statements. I talked to the coaches, and none of them said they said it. You can talk to teammates, coaches and everybody says the opposite. I don't know what to tell you, because it doesn't really make sense." Said Terry Collins: "There's not a coach in that office, there's not the manager, the front office that has ever brought up a problem with Ike Davis. You cannot do in today's game what Ike Davis has done, play 141 games suffering from valley fever at the same time -- obviously he had a bad first half -- but put up the things he's done the second half and do the things he's being accused of doing. "As far as being a teammate, you guys were here when there was a question of whether he was going to be sent out. And there were 15 players waiting to find out that supported him. ... "As far as being a hard guy to coach, there's not a guy in that locker room who hasn't had a disagreement with a coach at one time about something -- be it positioning, be it where his hands need to be at the plate, or the grip on the baseball -- No. 1 for reinforcement why it's going to work. "Now, as far as the possible trade, there's not a guy in that clubhouse who can't get traded. Not a guy. I just want to make sure everybody understands, we're behind Ike Davis 100 percent. I don't want this to ever be a defamation on his character. He's a standup guy. As a matter of fact, he speaks the truth above and beyond the need for it." Takeaways: • Ike up late watching porn. • That weird blinking thing he does as he's about to bat is to clear his head from all the bad advice he's getting from Hudgens. • Whispers about Terry and his "ability to communicate" will be posted by Rubin tomorrow.

Edgy MD Sep 18 2012 03:57 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

G-Fafif quoting Terry Collins wrote: "Now, as far as the possible trade, there's not a guy in that clubhouse who can't get traded. " "Hi, I'm Jason Bay! You may remember me from such movies as... Omar's Folly and... The Guy Who Couldn't Get Traded!"

TransMonk Sep 18 2012 04:08 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

The fact that someone in the Mets org said any of these things regarding Davis is embarrassing. Jeez.

batmagadanleadoff Sep 18 2012 04:32 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Did you ever see two scoreboards so close together? It's uglier than my slash lines. Me, I might've gone for one big wraparound curvilinear scoreboard if the scoreboard absolutely hadda go there.

Frayed Knot Sep 18 2012 04:38 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

TransMonk wrote: The fact that someone in the Mets org said any of these things regarding Davis is embarrassing. If you'll note Rubin's reporting it does say 'baseball source' and not the more usual 'team source' - implying that maybe these comments aren't coming from within. On the other hand, there's not much to be gained for someone outside the organization to say anything less than positive about Ike so maybe they are. I have no doubt that someone fed Adam this info (he's not going to just make stuff like this up folks), I just don't want to jump to conclusions about who it might be. That they're contemplating dealing him (or anyone!!) over the off-season shouldn't be a surprise. What's causing these 'he's straying off the reservation' comments is a bit more intriguing but I don't know quite what to make of them. It's not like it helps the NYM org to make these public either.

Ashie62 Sep 18 2012 04:47 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Yuppers to you and Spitter.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Sep 18 2012 05:55 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

The fact that someone in the Mets org said any of these things regarding Davis is embarrassing. If you'll note Rubin's reporting it does say 'baseball source' and not the more usual 'team source' - implying that maybe these comments aren't coming from within. On the other hand, there's not much to be gained for someone outside the organization to say anything less than positive about Ike so maybe they are. Yeah, but, it'd be odd if a non-team source fed him info that would lead him to write: The Mets are disappointed with Davis' unwillingness to make changes based on coaching advice. Although he is personable and by no means a troublemaker, they also worry about his impact on other young players in social settings away from the ballpark. emphasis added.

The Second Spitter Sep 18 2012 05:57 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Zvon wrote: smg58 wrote: I don't like it when people associated with the Mets say negative things publicly about players on the team. That's poison. I agree, this is bad stuff. Personally I think Rubins just trying to stir up some shit. So do I. Because "The Mets suck" stories are becoming rather gauche. TransMonk wrote: The fact that someone in the Mets org said any of these things regarding Davis is embarrassing. Jeez. A far cry from "good hitter, shitty team".

batmagadanleadoff Sep 20 2012 08:14 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Are the Mets sliming Ike Davis now, too? By Howard Megdal 10:51 am Sep. 19, 2012 It was a familiar sight: a Mets player, surrounded by reporters, defending himself from criticism that came from the team employing him. This time, the player was Ike Davis, the 25-year-old first baseman who has been one of the few feel-good stories of the Mets' disastrous second half. Davis had struggled mightily in the season's first two months, dealing with the twin handicaps of returning after missing most of 2011, and a case of Valley Fever. But since early June, Davis had hit like an elite first baseman, and hopes for his 2013 and beyond are bright. ESPN New York's Adam Rubin reported on Tuesday morning that the Mets were looking to trade Davis this offseason to make room for miscast outfielder Lucas Duda at first base. And not content with merely making the baseball argument, the Mets apparently found it necessary to either tell Rubin, or the "baseball source" Rubin cited, that Davis stays out too late and doesn't respond well to coaching, either. At best, this was information that the Mets ought to have kept to themselves, lest they drive down Davis' trade value. At worst, this was a smear put out by the Mets to pave the way publicly for the trading of one of their few remaining popular players. The move probably should be patented by the Mets. They did it to Jose Reyes back in 2009, after misdiagnosing his injury, leading Reyes to have to conduct an emotional press conference at his locker defending his own toughness and desire. Naturally, an ill-advised comeback bid that September, inexplicably geared toward playing the final weekend of a lost season, resulted in further injury and surgery. With Carlos Beltran in 2010, the ire was public, including a conference call weighing legal options against Beltran for following the advice of multiple doctors and having his knee surgically repaired. And lest you think this is some kind of pre-Sandy Alderson routine, witness the efforts to convince David Wright to play through a pinky injury this April, complete with anonymous leak to the Daily News tying Wright's future contract options to his ability to prove he isn't "injury-prone". Most famously, of course, was Fred Wilpon himself, finding perceived weaknesses in the games of Wright, Beltran and Reyes, who were the three players most responsible for making the Mets a good team from 2006-2008. The point isn't that Ike Davis shouldn't be traded under any circumstances, though the difficulty in finding a trading partner who can improve the Mets through a deal for prospects, or better yet, a young, cost-controlled outfielder, may not be so easy. Instead, the Mets have managed to denigrate one of their own players, making their task even harder, providing a reminder to Wright and R.A. Dickey, both free agents after 2013, of what awaits them if they decide to stay in New York. As for Davis, who let's remember, missed most of 2011 in large part because the Mets misdiagnosed his injury repeatedly, and who has publicly credited the coaches for helping him to turn around his 2012 season, he may well be out the door this winter. It would be nice to think this will only happen because the Mets can improve a roster in need through trading him; sadly, there are other, cost-related reasons for such a move that are the likelier impetus. But perhaps the routine simply means that Ike Davis has arrived. After all, the Mets tend only to smear their very best. http://www.capitalnewyork.com/article/s ... is-now-too

Edgy MD Sep 20 2012 08:19 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

He slimed me. I like how Megdal starts with a question, and by the end, having presented nothing definitive in pursuit of it, states the answer as fact. And by "like," I mean to say that his brand of play-journalism "just sucks."

HahnSolo Sep 20 2012 09:01 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I guess it is possible that somebody else wrote the headline.

Edgy MD Sep 20 2012 09:17 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Adam Rubin wrote: The Mets will consider trading Ike Davis this offseason as a way to upgrade other areas of the team and open a spot for Lucas Duda at his natural position, a baseball source told ESPNNewYork.com. Howard Megdal wrote: ESPN New York's Adam Rubin reported on Tuesday morning that the Mets were looking to trade Davis this offseason to make room for miscast outfielder Lucas Duda at first base. Then he proceeds to report (perfectly valid) speculation that the "baseball source" has been deliberately fed a story by the Mets (not even a Mets source, but "the Mets") as a clear and established fact. It's like his cause his so righteous, that there's no ethics he's going to allow to stand in his way.

batmagadanleadoff Sep 20 2012 09:36 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Swan Swan H Sep 20 2012 09:38 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Megdal's been grinding that axe so long it's probably a penknife by now.

batmagadanleadoff Oct 02 2012 09:27 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Two notes here: Jon Heyman speculates that the Red Sox might be interested in Ike Davis after Sox scouts are noticed at last night's Mets-Marlins game. http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/blog/jon-h ... st-baseman excerpt: MIAMI -- Could Ike Davis be a Red Sox trade target? The Red Sox will be looking for a first baseman this winter after sending Adrian Gonzalez to the Dodgers in late August and seeing placeholder James Loney continue to struggle offensively. The Mets haven't ruled out a trade for Davis, who will be arbitration elgible for the first time. Curiously, two Red Sox scouts -- maybe the only two scouts in attendance -- were at the Mets-Marlins game Monday night, and it's known the Red Sox seek help in the outfield, the rotation and at first base. The Mets don't have any outfielders to trade, not [sic] do they have an abundance of starting pitchers. Davis could be an obvious potential fit. _______________________ G-Fafif wrote: Rubin reports the Mets may be mulling a choice, and it could be the unpopular one per the poll results here and, one would guess, sentiment everywhere. The Mets will consider trading Ike Davis this offseason as a way to upgrade other areas of the team and open a spot for Lucas Duda at his natural position, a baseball source told ESPNNewYork.com. While that does not guarantee Davis will be moved, it at least is a very plausible option. Davis should be marketable despite a slow start because he is a 30-homer threat with the potential for above-average fielding at first base. The Mets are disappointed with Davis' unwillingness to make changes based on coaching advice. Although he is personable and by no means a troublemaker, they also worry about his impact on other young players in social settings away from the ballpark. The danger in trading Davis would be that there are few doubts about his ability to perform as a starter at the major league level. There is no guarantee Duda would perform at that level. And certainly he could not perform at the same level in the field. So being comfortable trading Davis would mean trusting the evaluation skills of the front office that Duda would thrive at his natural position. The Mets recently have been using Duda at first base against left-handers over Davis. Personally, trade 'em all. I may be giving the Mets too much credit here, but I wonder whether the Ike Davis smear of two weeks ago might be a disinformation campaign. Perhaps there's some interest in Duda and the Mets want to make it appear as if they'd rather keep Duda over Davis in order to extract more value from the interested team. Who knows?

Benjamin Grimm Oct 02 2012 09:32 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I can't imagine keeping Duda over Davis. Just... can't... imagine... Sandy said something the other day about how the Mets were starved for power in 2012, and it doesn't make sense to trade the guy who has 31 homers. I hope that that really reflects what the Mets are thinking here.

Edgy MD Oct 02 2012 09:34 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I keepy Ikey too, but I'm a keeper. What do you like on the Sox that might lead you to change your thinking?

Edgy MD Oct 02 2012 09:37 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Curiously, two Red Sox scouts -- maybe the only two scouts in attendance -- were at the Mets-Marlins game Monday night, and it's known the Red Sox seek help in the outfield, the rotation and at first base. The Mets don't have any outfielders to trade, not [sic] do they have an abundance of starting pitchers. Davis could be an obvious potential fit. Or, the writer may just be seeing what he wanted to see. The scouts may have been there to see Duda, or they may be looking at Familia. What's interesting is that the Shoppach-Beato deal may make these two beseiged franchises happy trading partners.

Ceetar Oct 02 2012 09:44 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

The Mets don't have any outfielders to trade..except Torres, Bay, Duda, Baxter, Valdespin* etc..

Gwreck Oct 02 2012 11:36 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Yes, they should have specified that the Mets don't have any "outfielders that would start on .500 or better teams"

batmagadanleadoff Oct 02 2012 11:41 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I've seen Lucas Duda. He's no outfielder.

Ceetar Oct 02 2012 11:42 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Gwreck wrote: Yes, they should have specified that the Mets don't have any "outfielders that would start on .500 or better teams" The Red Sox aren't that, now are they? It's also not true. All those guys could easily have a role of some sort on a good team, depending on what they do next year. Figuring out what they're going to do next year is the tough part, but that's why you send scouts to a Mets-Marlins game in September.

Edgy MD Oct 02 2012 11:45 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Well, I'd say that just because they aren't envisioned as starters doesn't mean they aren't worth scouting. Presumably teams have a lot of personnel available in southern Florida anybutts.

Gwreck Oct 02 2012 11:47 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Ceetar wrote: It's also not true. Sure. Jason Bay and Andres Torres are bound to have break-out seasons again.

Ceetar Oct 02 2012 11:50 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Gwreck wrote: Ceetar wrote: It's also not true. Sure. Jason Bay and Andres Torres are bound to have break-out seasons again. Would be one of the least surprising things. This happens ALL THE TIME. and regardless, even if they're not starters, doesn't mean they can't be helpful.

RealityChuck Oct 02 2012 04:56 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I can't see the slightest sense in trading Davis. There is a weird mindset that once you develop a major league talent, the smart thing is to trade him away for prospects (who might never make it) on the odd chance that one of them might be better. This is Steve Philips-type thinking -- any trade is better than nothing. But it can't possibly improve the team if you keep trading away your best players and have to wait a few years before the trade sees results, if at all. And then, once you do develop one of those players, you trade him away for more prospects and the circle of baseball mediocrity goes on.

DocTee Oct 02 2012 05:24 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

I suspect papers in Miami are speculating that Sox scouts were in attendance at last night's game, eyeing Jose Reyes, Carlos Lee and possibily Ozzie Guillen. That said, I'd be really disappointed if the Mets dealt Davis this offseason.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Oct 02 2012 06:55 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

RealityChuck wrote: I can't see the slightest sense in trading Davis. There is a weird mindset that once you develop a major league talent, the smart thing is to trade him away for prospects (who might never make it) on the odd chance that one of them might be better. This is Steve Philips-type thinking -- any trade is better than nothing. But it can't possibly improve the team if you keep trading away your best players and have to wait a few years before the trade sees results, if at all. And then, once you do develop one of those players, you trade him away for more prospects and the circle of baseball mediocrity goes on. I don't think Davis would go for a young player who might be better; he'd go for a comparable player who plays a different position, and that's if he goes at all.

Ceetar Oct 02 2012 08:29 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: RealityChuck wrote: I can't see the slightest sense in trading Davis. There is a weird mindset that once you develop a major league talent, the smart thing is to trade him away for prospects (who might never make it) on the odd chance that one of them might be better. This is Steve Philips-type thinking -- any trade is better than nothing. But it can't possibly improve the team if you keep trading away your best players and have to wait a few years before the trade sees results, if at all. And then, once you do develop one of those players, you trade him away for more prospects and the circle of baseball mediocrity goes on. I don't think Davis would go for a young player who might be better; he'd go for a comparable player who plays a different position, and that's if he goes at all. straight up for Justin Upton?

Edgy MD Oct 02 2012 09:06 PM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Trade for Justin and sign B.J., hmmm?

metsmarathon Oct 03 2012 07:25 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Ceetar wrote: straight up for Justin Upton? i'm thinking arizona might just want to keep that paul goldschmidt kid at first for a while, see how that pans out. unless they really would envision either of them for the outfield.

batmagadanleadoff Oct 04 2012 08:31 AM Re: Davis-Duda: This Time It's Personal

Ike Davis finishes in tie with Miami's Giancarlo Stanton for most NL road HR's (21), second in majors only to Adam Dunn (23).