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Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

batmagadanleadoff Aug 02 2012 07:58 AM

'Vertigo' bumps 'Citizen Kane' from top spot in poll of best movies of all time "Citizen Kane" has long sat atop many critics' best movies of all time lists. Just like The Beatles for music or "The Great Gatsby" for books, it's become such a top-10-list fixture that it's hard to remember a time when its rank was questioned. Until now. Orson Welles' 1941 classic has topped the Sight & Sound magazine poll for 50 years, but in the latest poll, Alfred Hitchcock's 1958 psychological thriller "Vertigo" took the No. 1 spot. Whle Americans may not know the magazine, a monthly published by the British Film Institute, Roger Ebert has called its best-film poll "the only one most serious movie people take seriously." Movies are voted for by an international group of film experts. The magazine notes that "Vertigo" only entered the list's top 10 in 1982, but has "risen steadily in esteem over the course of 30 years." It goes on to wonder whether "the first poll to be conducted since the Internet became almost certainly the main channel of communication about films – mark a revolution in taste, such as happened in 1962 (when "Kane" topped the list for the first time)?" The top 10 films on the list are: 1. "Vertigo" 2. "Citizen Kane" 3. "Tokyo Story" 4. "La Regle du jeu" 5. "Sunrise: A Song of Two Humans" 6. "2001: A Space Odyssey" 7. "The Searchers" 8. "Man with a Movie Camera" 9. "The Passion of Joan of Arc" 10. "8 1/2" http://entertainment.nbcnews.com/_news/ ... f-all-time viewtopic.php?f=11&t=14841&start=0 viewtopic.php?f=11&t=14819

Edgy MD Aug 02 2012 08:22 AM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

Where did Predator rank?

sharpie Aug 03 2012 07:45 AM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

Haven't seen Tokyo Story; Sunrise; or Man With a Movie Camera. Of the remaining seven I'm still going with my old friend Citizen Kane: 1. Citizen Kane 2. 8 1/2 3. La Regle de Jeu (The Rules of the Game) 4. Vertigo 5. The Passion of Joan of Arc 6. 2001 7. The Searchers

Vic Sage Aug 03 2012 08:39 AM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

1. "Vertigo" - it's arguable, but worthwhile 2. "Citizen Kane" - always felt it was somewhat overrated, but not by much 3. "Tokyo Story" - never saw it, but i've seen other of Ozu films ("Floating Weeds" for one) and they're slow soap operas, like watching paint dry 4. "La Regle du jeu" - love love love this movie; totally one of the top 10 5. "Sunrise: A Song of Two Humans" - never saw it, but i've seen other Murnau films. This one seemed more like melodrama than his others ("Nosferatu", for example), but its supposed to have had some technical innovations and its always been on my "to see" list. 6. "2001: A Space Odyssey" - As slow as an on Ozu film, but at least it has primates at war, and a killer computer, and a trippy finale leading to a space baby. 7. "The Searchers" - one of my favorite westerns; top 10? Ok. 8. "Man with a Movie Camera" - never saw this doc, but its post-modern structure and themes would seem to have kept it from dating and i'd still like to see it 9. "The Passion of Joan of Arc" - saw "Vampyr" but not this prior Dreyer work; i'm sure the lighting and angles are gorgeous, but i've no interest. 10. "8 1/2" - Of all the great fellini films, this isn't one. Its silly, self-indulgent and has dated badly, like La Dolce Vita. "Nights of Cabiria", "Amarcord", "La Strada" are all better than this.

metirish Aug 03 2012 09:02 AM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

Article in the Irish Times yesterday about this, the critic then gave his own Top Ten http://www.irishtimes.com/blogs/screenw ... ite-films/ Top 10 Films: Critics' Choice 1 Vertigo (Alfred Hitchcock, 1958) 2 Citizen Kane (Orson Welles, 1941) 3 Tokyo Story (Yasujiro Ozu, 1953) 4 La Règle du Jeu (Jean Renoir, 1939) 5 Sunrise: a Song for Two Humans (Murnau, 1927) 6 2001: A Space Odyssey (Stanley Kubrick, 1968) 7 The Searchers (John Ford, 1956) 8 Man with a Movie Camera (Dziga Vertov, 1929) 9 The Passion of Joan of Arc (Carl Dreyer, 1927) 10 8½ (Federico Fellini, 1963) Top 10 Films: Directors' Choice 1 Tokyo Story (Yasujiro Ozu, 1953) 2 2001: A Space Odyssey (Stanley Kubrick, 1968) 2 (joint second)Citizen Kane (Orson Welles, 1941) 4 8 (Federico Fellini, 1963) 5 Taxi Driver (Martin Scorsese, 1980) 6 Apocalypse Now (Francis Ford Coppola, 1979) 7 The Godfather (Francis Ford Coppola, 1972) 8 Vertigo (Alfred Hitchcock, 1958) 9 Mirror (Andrei Tarkovsky, 1974) 10 Bicycle Thieves (Vittorio De Sica, 1948) Donald Clarke's Top Ten 1. BRIDE OF FRANKENSTEIN (James Whale, 1935) 2. STALKER (Andrei Tarkovsky, 1979) [29] 3. THE LIFE AND DEATH OF COLONEL BLIMP (Michael Powell, Emeric Pressburger, 1943) 4. SWEET SMELL OF SUCCESS (Alexander Mackendrick, 1957) 5. THE APARTMENT (Billy Wilder, 1960) 6. THE SEVENTH SEAL (Ingmar Bergman, 1957) 7. REPULSION (Roman Polanski, 1965) 8. THE GHOST AND MRS MUIR (Joseph L Mankiewicz, 1947) 9. ERASERHEAD (David Lynch, 1977) 10. THE PASSION OF JOAN OF ARC (Carl Theodor Dreyer, 1928) [9] In the letter that Nick James, editor of Sight & Sound, sent out to voters, he made it clear that we could interpret “greatest film” pretty much any way we wished. This was both helpful and unhelpful. On the one hand, there were few rules; on the other, well, there were few rules. It seemed reasonable to do one’s best to come up with films that, after applying a critical slide rule, could be scientifically proven to be better than the competition. Then again, one couldn’t entirely ignore the eccentric, individual obsessions that fire one’s cultural synapses. James Whale’s Bride of Frankenstein brought, for me, those two mildly conflicting drives together. The picture appeals to my love of windy, camp gothic. But it is also acts as a rather brilliant cinematic demonstration of how high art (all those expressionistic sets) and low art (Ernest Thesiger’s music-hall leers) can be merged without passing through the dreaded middle-brow interzone. It figured nowhere in the top 50. Oh, well.

Edgy MD Aug 03 2012 09:08 AM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

Back at the MoFo, the former Big Ralph listed Eraserhead as an all-time favorite film, to which Doc G replied by likening watchign the film to watching paint dry. Now Vic plays the paint card against Ozu. What can I take away? I don't know. Maybe that boring films tend to make lists.

Vic Sage Aug 03 2012 09:15 AM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

one man's meat is another man's boring piece of shit. but really i have not seen the Ozu film and make no comment on it; i was bored by another one of his films, and the subject matter of this one doesn't entice me in the least. and "boring" can also be a matter of context. When i first saw "2001", i think it was a theatrical re-release when i was a teenager and it totally blew me away. It was so startlingly new and original and (seemingly) profound that it's "slowness" seemed like an essential element of its artfulness. I bought it on DVD but now the movie just bores the crap out of me. I don't know how i would feel about ERASERHEAD if i saw it again now, but i saw it often in my teens and 20s and never grew tired of its funny, perverse, sad kind of strangeness. maybe it would just bore me now, too, but that might speak more about me than the film. i don't know.

Vic Sage Aug 03 2012 09:18 AM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

we went thru an exercise here where we listed our top 10s, but i opined that such a thing fluctuated daily for me, so i kept posting a different top 10 every day for like a week. viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4124

RealityChuck Aug 27 2012 02:00 PM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

I'm always surprised that Vertigo is so well regarded: Hitchcock made far better films. It's good, but not like Psycho, North by Northwest, Strangers on a Train or Rear Window. The same with The Searchers; Ford was far better with She Wore a Yellow Ribon, Fort Apache, and The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance. And 2001 is hardly Kubrick's best, either. It suffers because Kubrick painted himself into a corner, then gave up, using a flashy psychedelic light show instead of resolving their problem. It was the triumph of bright, shiny objects over plot and characterizations and is ultimately responsible for all the empty films that are special effects and nothing else.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 27 2012 02:09 PM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

The first (and only) time that I saw 2001 I was well into my 30's, and it did bore the crap out of me. I kept waiting for it to get good, but it never did. I also liked Strangers on a Train more than I do Vertigo. But as far as Hitchcock movies go, I have a special fondness for Shadow of a Doubt. I haven't yet seen The Searchers or Fort Apache. I like Liberty Valance a lot, but was disappointed by She Wore a Yellow Ribbon.

Ceetar Aug 27 2012 02:13 PM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

RealityChuck wrote: And 2001 is hardly Kubrick's best, either. It suffers because Kubrick painted himself into a corner, then gave up, using a flashy psychedelic light show instead of resolving their problem. It was the triumph of bright, shiny objects over plot and characterizations and is ultimately responsible for all the empty films that are special effects and nothing else. I did enjoy it when I saw it (in a UFO class in college), but I enjoyed the three subsequent books much more. I know they made a 2010 movie but I haven't seen it. But I think having read the books and the explanations contained within has probably colored my opinion of the movie in retrospect. I think it probably could've done with out the starchild and flashy bits at the end. leaving the ambiguity to why Hal, a presumably perfect computer, did what he did. but maybe not. The movie is iconic at this point, the sound track too. I don't know if it's cultural impact makes it a 'top ten' or not though. I do remember reading somewhere on the "life imitating art" front that one of the astronauts going to the moon noted similarities to something in the movie. I should watch more Kubrick movies, and also, read more Clark novels.

Vic Sage Sep 04 2012 09:24 AM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

I'm always surprised that Vertigo is so well regarded: Hitchcock made far better films. It's good, but not like Psycho, North by Northwest, Strangers on a Train or Rear Window. The same with The Searchers; Ford was far better with She Wore a Yellow Ribon, Fort Apache, and The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance. And 2001 is hardly Kubrick's best, either. It suffers because Kubrick painted himself into a corner, then gave up, using a flashy psychedelic light show instead of resolving their problem. It was the triumph of bright, shiny objects over plot and characterizations and is ultimately responsible for all the empty films that are special effects and nothing else. i don't think these judgments are that surprising. The voters in these types of polls are critics and directors, and what they are voting for isn't which film is most entertaining to an audience. Surely NORTH BY NORTHWEST (and a number of Hitchcock's other films) are more generally entertaining than VERTIGO. But VERTIGO is an excessively personal depiction of obsession leading to tragedy and it doesn't seem to care whether you like it or not. Same with SEARCHERS and 2001 (and other selections like ERASERHEAD). They speak of artists with guns blazing, balls out, with little to no interest if an audience finds their work entertaining or not. And that's what stands the test of time, and that's what critics respond to, IMO. Also, they are making lists of "greatest" films, not "best" films. Unlike "Best", "Greatness" speaks not just of quality but of largeness (of size and/or number); of something of an extreme or notable degree; and of something unusual or considerable in degree, power, intensity, etc. So while there may be better Hitchcock films than VERTIGO, i don't know that there is a greater one. ditto Ford/SEARCHERS and Kubrick/2001.

The Second Spitter Sep 09 2012 10:52 PM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

Why "North by Northwest" isn't held in higher regard by professional critics baffles me....always figured it was because Kim Novak was more revered than EMS. However, it gets lots of love on CPF -- iirc when we posted on our all-time top 10 lists, it appeared on the list of at least 5 CPFers. (Maybe it's time for us to repeat this exercise). Btw, has everybody seen the reimagined poster ? It made me laff.

Edgy MD Sep 10 2012 07:22 AM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

The Second Spitter wrote: ....always figured it was because Kim Novak was more revered than EMS. Is she? Maybe in the Hitchock pantheon, but in the broader Hollywood pantheon, I'm not so sure. EMS not only anchors this top-shelf Hitchcock classic but also the signature Elia Kazan film. I've heard her name pronounced all American-like as "EvUH-Marie Saynt" but also in a breathlessly French accented "Eve-Marie SAHNT," as it was in Lloyd Cole's "Rattlesnakes," and you can't get more reverent with a Hollywood actress than to pronounce her name all Frenchly. And in NxNW, even as she is torn from her pedestal, as Hitchcock's golden women almost invariably are, she at least retains her dignity. Novak is made lower than mud. And I think it's them uncomfortable issues out in the open that gets it bumped to the top of the critical pile. NxNW made be gooder, but Vertigo greater, as Vic Sage seems to assert.

Vic Sage Sep 10 2012 08:09 AM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

The Second Spitter wrote: Why "North by Northwest" isn't held in higher regard by professional critics baffles me....always figured it was because Kim Novak was more revered than EMS. However, it gets lots of love on CPF -- iirc when we posted on our all-time top 10 lists, it appeared on the list of at least 5 CPFers. (Maybe it's time for us to repeat this exercise). Btw, has everybody seen the reimagined poster ? It made me laff. i have no doubt NXNW would make a lot of top10 lists on the CPF, or even among critics, if the criteria was "what are your FAVORITE (or even the BEST) films of all time?" I just think if your asking professionals (including critics) what are the "greatest" films, you'll get a slightly different set of responses (and they did). Because its a different question. "favorite" is entirely subjective, with no other criteria necessary beyond the listmaker's taste; "best" is a more qualitative, objective analysis, though still subject to the preferences of the listmaker's era; "greatest" is really about a picture's scale (i.e., largeness [not necessarily of physical size or scope]) of an extreme or notable degree, and of considerable originality, emotional power or intensity. These are not just semantic distinctions. "favorite" and even "best" are temporal judgments; "greatness" is a judgment that can last over time, as its more (though of course not totally) independent of subjective tastes.

The Second Spitter Sep 10 2012 08:21 PM Re: Vertigo Climbs to Dizzying New Heights

Edgy DC wrote: The Second Spitter wrote: ....always figured it was because Kim Novak was more revered than EMS. Is she? Maybe in the Hitchock pantheon, but in the broader Hollywood pantheon, I'm not so sure. EMS not only anchors this top-shelf Hitchcock classic but also the signature Elia Kazan film. I've heard her name pronounced all American-like as "EvUH-Marie Saynt" but also in a breathlessly French accented "Eve-Marie SAHNT," as it was in Lloyd Cole's "Rattlesnakes," and you can't get more reverent with a Hollywood actress than to pronounce her name all Frenchly. And in NxNW, even as she is torn from her pedestal, as Hitchcock's golden women almost invariably are, she at least retains her dignity. Novak is made lower than mud. Don't get me wrong I think EMS is a much better actress and my view that Novak was more revered is probably skewed -- the upshot of growing up overseas where EMS's Broadway legacy was less heralded. Also, Kim Novak did something to get more famous here. Not sure what exactly. As for Vertigo, I've been meaning to rewatch it as it's been awhile. I was holding off to watch it on bluray but currently it's the only Hitchcock mainstream film not available.