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New Year's is a Religious Holiday?

ScarletKnight41 Dec 21 2005 10:49 AM

I have a friend who contends that New Year's is a religious holiday - that it commemorates the day of Christ's circumcision. I have NEVER heard of this before. Are any of you familiar with this? For my part, New Year's is a chance to share champagne with friends. Nothing changes that for me. But I'm debating the assault agains Christmas nonsense with this person, and I'm just curious to know whether anyone else thinks of New Year's as a religious holiday.

cooby Dec 21 2005 10:57 AM

At what age do Jewish baby boys get circumsized. I really don't know but isn't it past one week old?

Edgy DC Dec 21 2005 10:57 AM

If it's religious to your friend, more power to him or her. If he claims he or she is under assualt, perhaps you should demonstrate what an assault actually is. It astounds me what people talk about these days. They get manipulated into these pointless cultural arguments. I find myself excusing myself a lot.

MFS62 Dec 21 2005 11:00 AM

Well, the circumcision is traditionally performed when the baby is eight days old, so it would be probable that it happened on January 1. But I have never heard of the religious holiday aspect of this. B'sides, the alternate side of the street parking law is lifted on that day anyhow. Later

Willets Point Dec 21 2005 11:01 AM

The Feast of the Circumcision falls on January 1st, one week after the date on which the Nativity of Christ is celebrated. This day is also celebrated as the Solemnity of St. Mary, the Mother of Jesus. New Year's Day is a different celebration on the same day. I would say that New Year's is NOT a religious holiday in of itself but coincides with a religious holiday.

Edgy DC Dec 21 2005 11:05 AM

All is quiet on New Year's Day. A world in white gets underway. Stop defying such tradition.

ScarletKnight41 Dec 21 2005 11:10 AM

62 is correct - the briss generally takes place on the 8th day (exceptions if the child is in poor health or if there is a C-section). Thanks for the tutorial.

seawolf17 Dec 21 2005 11:27 AM

There's a "Feast Of The Circumcision"!?!? Religious people are weird.

Benjamin Grimm Dec 21 2005 11:37 AM

I do remember that in the Catholic Church, January 1 is a holy day of obligation; you're required to attend mass. I think there are eight such holy days in the year. They always snuck up on me. My mother would say on a Tuesday that we had to go to church that day. Those eight extra days just killed me.

Willets Point Dec 21 2005 11:42 AM

Luckily Jan 1st is on Sunday this year.

metsmarathon Dec 21 2005 11:47 AM

well, seeing how christ wasn't born on christmas day anyways...

Benjamin Grimm Dec 21 2005 11:54 AM

Yeah, but Rickey Henderson was.

Willets Point Dec 21 2005 11:59 AM

So when do we celebrate Rickey's circumcision?

MFS62 Dec 21 2005 12:02 PM

Willets Point wrote: So when do we celebrate Rickey's circumcision? This thread has taken an interesting turn,eh? Later

TheOldMole Dec 21 2005 12:07 PM

]There's a "Feast Of The Circumcision"!?!? Religious people are weird. What do they serve?

Benjamin Grimm Dec 21 2005 12:11 PM

Willets Point wrote: So when do we celebrate Rickey's circumcision? I celebrate it every damn day!

cooby Dec 21 2005 12:13 PM

="TheOldMole"] ]There's a "Feast Of The Circumcision"!?!? Religious people are weird. What do they serve?

seawolf17 Dec 21 2005 12:15 PM

Sometimes people ask me, "Seawolf, what exactly do you discuss on this Crane Pool Forum?" And sometimes, I'm honestly afraid to answer.

MFS62 Dec 21 2005 12:23 PM

Ok, we’ve sunk to a new low. But it an attempt to drive it down even more, here’s a joke as told by Henny Youngman on the old Ed Sullivan Show about 50 years ago: A guy is walking down the street and passes by a shop with clocks in the window. The conversation goes something like this. Guy: I’d like to buy a clock. Shopkeeper: We don’t sell clocks Guy: Well, what do you do here? Shopkeeper: I’m a Moyl. I perform circumcisions. Guy: Then why do you have clocks in the window? Shopkeeper: Mister, if you were a Moyl, what would you put in your window? BA DA BUM! Later

Frayed Knot Dec 21 2005 12:40 PM

]"What do they serve?" I'm not sure, but the servers do take tips

KC Dec 21 2005 01:55 PM

I just called my pastor and asked him if he can think of any churchly sig- nificance of January 1st and he said, "yes, that's the day we switch from the yellow 2005 collection envelopes to the green 2006 ones." He also mumbled something under his breath about how I could use ours more. And as a side note, I generally still say Merry Xmas to most people instead of happy holidays unless I know the person doesn't celebrate xmas or is someone who has an xmas stick up their ass.

Benjamin Grimm Dec 21 2005 02:00 PM

http://www.rcbo.org/calendar/holydays.htm What are the Holy Days of Obligation in the United States? At their plenary assembly in November 1991, the members of the National Conference of Catholic Bishops approved two motions, which affect the observance of holy days of obligation in the dioceses of the United States. They decided that whenever January 1, the solemnity of Mary, Mother of God, or August 15, the solemnity of the Assumption, or November 1, the solemnity of All Saints, falls on a Saturday or Monday, the precept to attend Mass is abrogated. The action was confirmed by the Conference for Bishops on July 4, 1992 (Prot. N. 296/84) and the letter of confirmation was signed by Bernardin Cardinal Gantin, Prefect, and Archbishop Justin Rigali, Secretary. Pope John Paul II approved and confirmed the same on the same date. http://catholicism.about.com/cs/basicbeliefs/a/holydaysob04.htm Roman Catholicism Holy Days of Obligation In Roman Catholicism, Holy Days of Obligation are the days other than Sundays when Catholics are obligated to attend Mass. Below are the Holy Days of Obligation: * December 8, the solemnity of the Immaculate Conception * December 25, the solemnity of the Nativity of Our Lord Jesus Christ * January 1, the solemnity of Mary * Thursday of the Sixth Week of Easter, the solemnity of the Ascension * August 15, the solemnity of the Assumption of the Blessed Virgin Mary * November 1, the solemnity of All Saints So there are only six of them. Maybe it just seemed like eight.

KC Dec 21 2005 02:04 PM

Thanks, I'll straighten out my pastor - I love it when he's wrong.

Willets Point Dec 21 2005 02:09 PM

I was only able to get 5 when I was thinking on it. Stupidly, Christmas was the one I didn't think of. I would think that Holy Thursday and Good Friday should be on that list too.

KC Dec 21 2005 02:12 PM

I would have guessed Good Friday would be number one.

Benjamin Grimm Dec 21 2005 02:14 PM

I think August 15 was the one I most wanted to "abrogate" because it came in the summertime when the days were long and there was fun stuff to do. January 1 was a pain, too, because generally it was the only day in the year when I wanted to sleep late. (I am, by nature, an early riser.)

metsmarathon Dec 21 2005 03:37 PM

i think that for as long as i knew that a baby spends 9 months in its mommy's tummy, i've had a problem with the immacualte conception being celebrated some three weeks prior to the subsequent birth. i've gotta stop before i kick off religious debate...

KC Dec 21 2005 03:45 PM

Rising from the dead, turnin' water into wine, the immaculate conception. Either ya buy it or ya don't - nothing really to debate. My beef is with the absurdity of "happy holidays" and what THAT'S become.

Benjamin Grimm Dec 21 2005 03:53 PM

I feel strange, being the agnostic giving religious lessons, but the Immaculate Conception refers not to the conception of Jesus, but to the conception of Mary. She had to be conceived without Original Sin, so that she couldn't pass it on to Jesus.

Edgy DC Dec 21 2005 04:55 PM Edited 3 time(s), most recently on Dec 21 2005 09:35 PM

Yupsters. The Feast of the Annunciation marks the symbolic beginning of Jesus's gestation. And it indeed falls nine months before Christmas. That must be a load off, huh, 'thon? The Immaculate Conception is late-arriving as an official feast, and is a little problemactic in how it came into being as an official doctrine. My beef is with beefs. And with beef, too. I also have a beef with barf. Particularly beef barf.

KC Dec 21 2005 05:17 PM

>>>My beef is with beefs<<< Clear thinking sensibility will just kill this thread if you keep it up. (I hope I spelled sensibility right)

metsmarathon Dec 21 2005 09:11 PM

ah, right... maybe i shoulda paid more attention in CCD!

ScarletKnight41 Dec 22 2005 08:44 AM

The dialogue with this person has devolved to the point that she's now claiming that people are saying Happy Holidays instead of Happy Thanksgiving, and that it's a horrible thing. I need to stop hanging out with crazy people. It's interfering with my holiday spirit.

cooby Dec 22 2005 08:46 AM

IS this the same person you drove to the mall yesterday?

TheOldMole Dec 22 2005 08:56 AM

]I need to stop hanging out with crazy people. It's interfering with my holiday spirit. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

ScarletKnight41 Dec 22 2005 09:03 AM

No - the person I drove to the mall is a member of my household of the teenage persuasion.

metsmarathon Dec 22 2005 09:05 AM

i dunno... i always thought hapy holidays was a great way to wish well for a) multiple days and b) those whose religious affiliation you held in doubt. it sucks to wish someone a merry christmas only to find out shortly thereafter that they are jewish. (boy could that be taken the worng way!)

ScarletKnight41 Dec 22 2005 09:07 AM

marathon - those are my thoughts exactly.

Benjamin Grimm Dec 22 2005 09:13 AM

True, but it doesn't make sense for that same caution to carry over to Thanksgiving, which applies to everybody, although I guess you run the risk of offending someone who might be Canadian.

ScarletKnight41 Dec 22 2005 09:16 AM

First of all, I can't recall anyone avoiding the phrase Happy Thanksgiving in my life. Can you? Secondly, whether it's nonsensical or not, is it important enough a thing to be offended over?

MFS62 Dec 22 2005 09:25 AM

ScarletKnight41 wrote: First of all, I can't recall anyone avoiding the phrase Happy Thanksgiving in my life. Can you? Yes, to a Jeh... Witness, even a "Happy Birthday" is not appropriate. Later

Benjamin Grimm Dec 22 2005 09:35 AM

I hear it all the time. On the day before Thanksgiving, as everyone was leaving the office, most people were saying "Have a good holiday." I thought it odd that even the word "Thanksgiving" has to be avoided, but I doubt that anybody was "offended" by that.

ScarletKnight41 Dec 22 2005 09:37 AM

That's my point. Whatever the philosophy behind it and the language used, is it ever worth getting offended to the point of ranting over somebody extending good tidings?

Benjamin Grimm Dec 22 2005 09:51 AM

Many Christians seem to feel that Christmas is under seige. Jesus is the "reason for the season" but so many people (myself among them) celebrate Christmas for secular reasons. There's also Hanukkah and Kwanzaa, which seem to be seen as interlopers. (I've heard the argument that Hanukkah wouldn't be so prominent if it weren't for its proximity to Christmas. And that oil burning for eight days isn't as important as the birth of Jesus.) I don't understand this kind of resentment. It's not like Christians are a persecuted minority. (Those days ended a long time ago.) Why do there have to be public Nativity scenes, but public menorahs are seen as pandering to a minority. There's room enough for everyone to celebrate however and whatever they want. I think that any non-Christian who celebrates Christmas (or anything else) in December are seen as some kind of bandwagoneer, hopping on the coattails of the one true December celebration, of the birth of Jesus. And when "Happy Holidays" supplants "Merry Christmas" they see their holiday being buried by the much-loathed political correctness. Again, I'M not among those who feel that way. This is my possibly awkward attempt at explaining an emotion that I don't feel.

Edgy DC Dec 22 2005 10:05 AM

This isn't worth this much discussion. Be pleasant to one another. Try not to be rude. Avoid people determined to take offense despite your best efforts. As always.

ScarletKnight41 Dec 22 2005 11:24 AM

Well said Edgy.

MFS62 Dec 22 2005 12:28 PM

Received this email today. ***************************************************************************** Dear Friends, I wanted to send out some sort of holiday greeting, but it is so difficult in today's world to know exactly what to say without offending someone. So I met with my attorney today and on her advice I want to say to all of you: Please accept with no obligation, implied or implicit, my best wishes for an environmentally conscious, socially responsible, low stress, non-addictive, gender neutral celebration of the winter solstice holiday, practiced within the most enjoyable traditions of the religious persuasion of your choice or secular practices of your choice with respect for the religious/secular persuasions and/or traditions of others, or their choice not to practice religious or secular traditions at all. I also wish you a fiscally successful, personally fulfilling, and medically uncomplicated recognition of the onset of the generally accepted calendar year 2006, but not without due respect for the calendars of choice of other cultures whose contributions to society have helped make America great (not to imply that America is necessarily greater than any other country nor the only "America" in the western hemisphere), and without regard to the race, creed, color, age, physical ability, religious faith, or sexual preference of the wishee. By accepting this greeting, you are accepting these terms: This greeting is subject to clarification or withdrawal. It is freely transferable with no alteration to the original greeting. It implies no promise by the wisher to actually implement any of the wishes for her/himself or others, and is void where prohibited by law, and is revocable at the sole discretion of the wisher. This wish is warranted to perform as expected within the usual application of good tidings for a period of one year or until the issuance of a subsequent holiday greeting, whichever comes first, and warranty is limited to replacement of this wish or issuance of a new wish at the sole discretion of the wisher. Regards,