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First Base, 2014

Edgy MD
Nov 26 2013 04:43 PM

2013 Guys:
[list][*]Ike Davis[/*:m]
[*]Lucas Duda[/*:m]
[*]Josh Satin[/*:m]
[*]Justin Turner[/*:m]
[*]Daniel Murphy[/*:m]
[*]Zach Lutz[/*:m]
[*]Andrew Brown[/*:m][/list:u]

2014 Leading Internal Candidates:
[list][*]Ike Davis[/*:m]
[*]Josh Satin[/*:m][/list:u]

2014 Potential Position Switchers:
[list][*]Lucas Duda[/*:m]
[*]Daniel Murphy[/*:m]
[*]Zach Lutz[/*:m][/list:u]
All appeared at first in 2013, but were primarily stationed elsewhere. Any of them might potentially find first to be a primary assignment, depending on where the chips fall.

2014 Fringey Internal Candidates:
[list][*]Wilmer Flores[/*:m]
[*]Eric Campbell[/*:m]
[*]Allan Dykstra (heal fast!)[/*:m][/list:u]

You Snooze, You Lose:
[list][*]Adam Lind (.288 / .357 / .497 // .854 in 521 PA - 132 OPS+)
Signed by Blue Jays (picked up opton) 1 year, 7 mllion[/*:m][/list:u]

Remaining Free Agents:
[list][*]Mike Napoli (.259 / .360 / .482 // .842 in 578 PA - 129 OPS+)[/*:m]
[*]Corey Hart (.270 / .334 / .507 // .841 in 622 PA - 120 OPS+ in 2012)[/*:m]
[*]Kendrys Morales (.277 / .336 / .449 // .785 in 657 PA - 123 OPS+)[/*:m]
[*]James Loney (.299 / .348 / .430 // .778 in 598 PA - 118 OPS+)[/*:m]
[*]Mike Morse (.215 / .270 / .381 // .651 in 337 PA - 84 OPS+)[/*:m]
[*]Justin Morneau (.259 / .323 / .411 // .734 in 635 PA - 103 OPS+)[/*:m]
[*]Paul Konerko (.244 / .313 / .355 // .669 in 520 PA - 80 OPS+)[/*:m]
[*]Mark Reynolds (.220 / .306 / .393 // .699 in 504 PA - 96 OPS+)[/*:m]
[*]Jeff Baker (.279 / .360 / .545 // .905 in 175 PA - 143 OPS+)[/*:m]
[*]Carlos Pena (.207 / .321 / .346 // .668 in 328 PA - 86 OPS+)[/*:m]
[*]Casey McGehee (.217 / .284 / .358 // .643 in 352 PA - 77 OPS+)[/*:m]
[*]Lyle Overbay (.240 / .295 / .393 // .688 in 486 PA - 87 OPS+)[/*:m]
[*]Casey Kotchman (.000 / .048 / .000 // .048 in 21 PA - -85 OPS+; 2012 Numbers: .229 / .280 / .333 // .612 in 500 PA - 72 OPS+)[/*:m]
[*]Yuniesky Betancourt (.212 / .240 / .355 // .595 in 49 PA - 60 OPS+)[/*:m][/list:u]

Seems the Mets could gobble up a bunch of ex-Dodgers or a bunch of ex-Brewers. The 2013 Yankees have also generously donated a bunch of names to this list. Anyhow, a lot of options remain available, and perhaps a good chance to get creative, but making it perhaps not the best season for the Mets to be flush with underwhelming options at first.

How do you see/would you like the see the things playing out at first for the team?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Nov 26 2013 05:53 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

With the year he had last year, Mongo Morse seems like an interesting cheapo-route Show Me sign, don't he?

Edgy MD
Nov 26 2013 06:01 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Kind of. Depending on how cheapo. They're already betting on Young to bounce back, and it's hard to see anything in Morse that you aren't getting in Davis.

If they're dipping in the free-agent pool, I'd guess it would be for a stabilizing candidate, not a(nother) mercurial one.

Benjamin Grimm
Nov 26 2013 07:49 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

How much money is Loney expected to get? I figure if they sign a decent first baseman, maybe they trade Davis and/or Duda for a shortstop who's better than Tejada, a standard that shouldn't be at all hard to meet.

Edgy MD
Nov 26 2013 08:13 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Seems to be about five genuine candidates in that pool. Can there be enough suitors to bid them up?

On the face of it, that looks like a buyer's market. Although every AL team could always use an extra firstbaseman to park at DH.

86-Dreamer
Nov 26 2013 09:09 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Kendrys Morales is my Choice for an impact bat. Trade Ike and a pitcher for a corner Outfielder and sign Feldman, arroyo and Furball. Trade or hold Ruben and Lucas in Vegas. Go $10 million over budget to win 85 games this year and build some momentum for the return of king Harvey.

MFS62
Nov 26 2013 09:46 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Who says you need power to play first base?
I have this feeling that if they put Wilmer Flores at first and just leave him there, he will go on to have a career like Wade Boggs.
Just a feeling.
If they do sign a power bat for a corner outfield spot, I see them moving EYJ to second and maybe Murphy to first.

Later

Edgy MD
Nov 26 2013 11:03 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Nobody says it, but since it's likely the easiest position on the diamond, a team likes to get as complete and profound and productive a hitter as possible there.

You put Wade Boggs at first base and you effectively cut 40 to 50 points off of his OPS.

And the last righthanded batter to have a career like Boggs was.... I dunno... Jimmy "The Pony" Ryan? Boggs is just too ambitious to think of, I think. A great, if still ambitious, comparable might be Julio Franco, maybe, but Franco was able to pass muster as a secondbaseman. Maybe Gregg Jefferies, but without the switch-hitting skills --- a minor league shortstop who can't pass muster at that position, gravitating toward first and DH way too early in this big league career, despite hitting productivity that's... darn good... for a shortstop.

But again, Jefferies at least had that lefthanded bat to go after righthanded pitchers.

What's the more grave view? Manny Alexander? An unhappy thought, but probably a likelier outcome than Wade Boggs.

Ashie62
Nov 27 2013 07:13 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

I see value in Mike Morse and Kendrys Morales.

However it seems to be a need filled by trade or within...

Ashie62
Dec 08 2013 05:57 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

There was talk earlier in the day of a Mets PR at 6pm today.

It would appear Rubin got a few questions into Sandy tonight and Rubin has concluded Davis or Duda will be traded sooner rather than later..

Nothing new really...

[url]http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/mets/post/_/id/79912/mets-hope-to-deal-first-baseman-shortly

Centerfield
Dec 09 2013 07:46 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

I hope that the Mets will not feel compelled to move one or the other and feel pressure to take whatever is offered. If the reward coming back is some back-end starter, I'd prefer to just let Davis and Duda duke it out in spring training. If we can build up the rest of the lineup so that Davis has to bat no higher than 6th, I can live with this.

That being said, I feel confident Sandy will be patient and find the right guy. I think they need two more legitimate bats to turn this team around.

Frayed Knot
Dec 09 2013 07:55 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Centerfield wrote:
... If the reward coming back is some back-end starter, I'd prefer to just let Davis and Duda duke it out in spring training.


Which leads to the question ... And then what?

Dealing the presumptive loser of that duel towards the end of ST when most rosters are set would likely mean less of a haul than now and I think everyone is pretty much in agreement that keeping both isn't really an option.
The alternative, I suppose, would be to send the loser to the minors (is that even possible anymore?) and hope he tears things up but, again, what kind of return are you going to get in May or June that you won't get now?

The bottom line is, two mid/late 20s under-performing 1Bmen with (occasional) power but who bring little else to the party simply aren't going to bring back that much.

Edgy MD
Dec 09 2013 08:15 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Well, an alternative option, while maybe not considered viable by many, is something akin to last year's status quo, with Davis at first and Duda in the outfield, and Duda continuing to fight for more time at first and better outfielders fighting to take away his time in left.

The status quo may be unpalatable, but certainly nobody's won the job outright yet. So keeping options open is defensible.

Benjamin Grimm
Dec 09 2013 08:35 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Well, Duda is extremely unlikely to bump Granderson out of the outfield, and probably not Young either. He may be able to dislodge Lagares.

It's really hard to know what the best move is. Davis' upside is really good, but his downside is really bad. There's certainly a possibility that he can hit 35 homers for the 2014 Mets, but after the way he started the last two seasons, he's lost any right to be cut any slack. If they don't want to give him another shot, I completely understand.

I'm sure that both Davis and Duda have trade value, but have no idea what that value might be. If it's lower than we'd like it to be, then I suppose that keeping them both may be a viable option. I doubt it shakes out that way, however. I think Davis will be somewhere else by next weekend.

Edgy MD
Dec 09 2013 09:05 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Benjamin Grimm wrote:
Well, Duda is extremely unlikely to bump Granderson out of the outfield, and probably not Young either. He may be able to dislodge Lagares.

Or end up as backup outfielder and firstbaseman, hopefully providing the team a pinch-hitter and a fallback alternative.

Gwreck
Dec 09 2013 11:55 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Isn't there also the issue of Davis' salary, which would be decided pre-spring training? There may be better uses of that $3.5 million.

Centerfield
Dec 10 2013 07:12 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

I know I'm in the minority here, but I think there's nothing wrong with paying Davis $3.5 million and hoping he can recover to 2012 form. If Davis were coming from another team, and Sandy signed a guy who, as recently as 2012, hit 30 HR's and plays solid defense, for one year, $3.5 million, I think a lot of folks would say it's a good move. And so for that reason, I'd be perfectly happy to keep as long as we build other pieces around him.

(Maybe I'm softening since it's been months since I've seen Squinty flailing away at pitches in the dirt.)

My point before about not needing to move these guys is that Duda is still pretty cheap. There is value in having him around as a backup. People get hurt (not only on our team but others, so a market may develop later). I hope that the Mets don't feel some artificial need to move one or the other while in Florida. Instead, I hope they go in with an idea of their value, and if they don't get it, won't feel any shame in coming back home with both guys. And I feel pretty confident that Sandy will do this.

As an aside, isn't it odd we haven't heard a single legitimate rumor about either guy? If that keeps up, WFAN callers won't be able to gripe next season about how we should have moved Davis/Duda for (insert name here) when we had the chance.

Edgy MD
Dec 10 2013 07:26 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

I'm there too. Don't think the Mets are, though.

Frayed Knot
Dec 10 2013 07:54 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Centerfield wrote:
I know I'm in the minority here, but I think there's nothing wrong with paying Davis $3.5 million and hoping he can recover to 2012 form. If Davis were coming from another team, and Sandy signed a guy who, as recently as 2012, hit 30 HR's and plays solid defense, for one year, $3.5 million, I think a lot of folks would say it's a good move. And so for that reason, I'd be perfectly happy to keep as long as we build other pieces around him.


I don't mind taking a chance of Ike rebounding -- but, if so, I want to trade Duda (or vice-versa).
The two are just too similar [low-BA, decent walk-rate, high-Ks, good though only sometimes-realized LH power, slow-footed, emergency-only OFs] to justify keeping both while other holes go unfulfilled.

Edgy MD
Dec 10 2013 08:01 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Well, when they play poorly, they're similar. When they excel, they're a little different.

But being similar isn't an issue as far as I'm concerned. Getting good play out of at least one of them is the issue. And that's less likely if they deal one away.

Benjamin Grimm
Dec 10 2013 08:14 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

If they want to contend this year (and they say they do; the likelihood of that is another story) the plan can't be to go with a first baseman who tends to practically go oh-for-April, May, and June. I know there's a risk that Ike will break out for another team, which is why even though I'm in favor of dealing him, I'm still a little uneasy. But there's also a risk involved in keeping him; that another three-month slump to start the season will kill whatever faint hopes the Met may have. There's a fear that another slump would also destroy his trade value, but that may not be an issue since it's looking like that may have already happened.

Benjamin Grimm
Dec 10 2013 08:15 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy's post snuck in ahead of mine. If they keep both Davis and Duda, they can give Ike one more try and if he flops, there's still Duda and Satin.

Edgy MD
Dec 10 2013 08:26 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Maybe "We went out and bought some guys and now there's only room for one of youse in this lineup" focuses one or both of them to produce like never before.

Benjamin Grimm
Dec 10 2013 09:08 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Adam McCalvy wrote:
#Brewers & #Mets met today to talk about NY's available first basemen. Brewers also met with Corey Hart's agent. Groundwork on both fronts.


Adam McCalvy (?@AdamMcCalvy) is the Brewers beat writer for MLB.com

Frayed Knot
Dec 11 2013 07:41 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
Well, when they play poorly, they're similar. When they excel, they're a little different.


Not very different.

ID career per/600 ABs -- .242/.334/.434 // 768; 30 2Bs, 1 3B, 25 HRs in 1,711 ML ABs
LD career per/600 ABs -- .246/.342/.424 // 766; 27 2Bs, 1 3B, 20 HRs in 1,282 ML ABs

Ike had the better peak the year he hit 32 HRs, but both have seen their BA & OBA tumble every year since 2011
BA = .302 ... then .227 ... then .205 for Ike vs .292 ... .239 ... .223 (Duda)



But being similar isn't an issue as far as I'm concerned. Getting good play out of at least one of them is the issue. And that's less likely if they deal one away.


You also have (theoretically) one fewer hole elsewhere by dealing either/or as opposed to redundancy at one spot with two guys who may both be out of options at this point(?) and will turn 27 & 28 y/o (Lucas is 13 months older) before the season starts.
Is the hope that keeping both will light a fire under one or the other really that high (after all - it hasn't worked so far) to justify burning a roster spot with two guys who essentially have the same strengths and weaknesses. I don't want to dump either one just to dump them, but if I'm Sandy I'm turning over every rock to see what I can find in a SS, a prospect, a pitcher, or even a good bench player in exchange.

Centerfield
Dec 11 2013 07:50 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

No way I trade either for a guy I know will be a bench player, even a good one.

If I keep both, I've got already got first baseman and a good bench player.

Edgy MD
Dec 11 2013 08:01 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Frayed Knot wrote:
Well, when they play poorly, they're similar. When they excel, they're a little different.


Not very different.

ID career per/600 ABs -- .242/.334/.434 // 768; 30 2Bs, 1 3B, 25 HRs in 1,711 ML ABs
LD career per/600 ABs -- .246/.342/.424 // 766; 27 2Bs, 1 3B, 20 HRs in 1,282 ML ABs


That speaks to their career averages but not to the distinctions between how they perform when they excel, when Duda is a better contact hitter who uses the whole field, and Davis is the better pull hitter for power. When they fail, which they both mostly have for two years, we get neither of this, and so, yes, their career averages are similar.

Frayed Knot wrote:
You also have (theoretically) one fewer hole elsewhere by dealing either/or as opposed to redundancy at one spot with two guys who may both be out of options at this point(?) and will turn 27 & 28 y/o (Lucas is 13 months older) before the season starts.

Well, we speak here of not dealing one for the sake of a deal, and encouraging the Mets to hold rather than to take a less-than-advantageous deal that would not plug much of a hole. We do not speak of refusing to deal outright.

Frayed Knot wrote:
Is the hope that keeping both will light a fire under one or the other really that high (after all - it hasn't worked so far)...

They haven't been pitted up against one another for playing time thus far.

Frayed Knot wrote:
...to justify burning a roster spot with two guys who essentially have the same strengths and weaknesses. I don't want to dump either one just to dump them, but if I'm Sandy I'm turning over every rock to see what I can find in a SS, a prospect, a pitcher, or even a good bench player in exchange.

I do not consider a roster spot given to a capable player to be "burned." Teams tend to carry lefthanded hitting outfielder/firstbaseman types with power on their bench under any circumstances. Many of these guys are former starters who have been downgraded. If Duda breaks camp in the role that Baxter had last year, what's burned?

Ceetar
Dec 11 2013 08:13 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

It's worth noting that Lucas Duda's career is as an above average hitter (18% better by OPS+ actually).

Davis is 12% but last year his injury cost his comeback at 89%

This is really about Ike, who's the better defender so doesn't sap value that way, although it's minimized at first for Duda. Is Ike going to completely disappear for months at a time? You can live with a poor month where he's like .200/.300/.400..everyone slumps..but not .100/.200/.300 stuff. But it's not like he put up poor years uniformly, I'll take the second half of Davis over just about any options available to the Mets via trade or free agency or whatnot.

The problem is now it's been two years of complete abandonment of participation in the lineup. You can't have that. But you won't. Davis won't last until May if he starts the season on the team and doesn't produce.

The simplest solution is Davis at first and Duda in the minors (or sacrifice the defense in left with Young and Granderson making up a decent rest, but that's probably not wise) since Duda still has an option. Duda will fine and will produce. He's shown no real inclination to press and flail when he's in a funk, maintaining OBP and value at least. So if Ike flails, you get Duda. redundancy. Josh Satin fits in somewhere too. Probably going to be the 1b/3b backup if I had to guess.

But certainly, if you can get a reliable piece for either of them, it's worthwhile, but they're not junk to be discarded either. Ike's peaks even the last two seasons (even without as much power last year, he had a .429 OBP after recall. That's elite level. 15 XBH. 170 PA) is certainly something every team would like. It's figuring out how/if it can be harnessed.

Ashie62
Dec 11 2013 09:37 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

I'd be happy to discard them like junk.. They both suck..

Edgy MD
Dec 11 2013 09:43 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

I would beg you to try again with that post.

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Dec 11 2013 09:45 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Thanks for yet another illuminating contribution.

From the WATPy world, some media twatterers suggesting dBaggs would unload one of either Didi Gregorius or Chris Owings to get pitching AND would like David Price. Seems to me Mets could get in on this action seeing as Tampa likes Ike Davis (we hear) and the dBaggs don't have the riches to acquire Price straight-up.

Ceetar
Dec 11 2013 09:48 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

From the supposed word about the Brewers camp about the Ike Davis negotiations, it sounds like Sandy's sticking to his "GIVE US AN AWESOME PROSPECT. No? You're out." strategy that seems to have netted us Wheeler and others.

We'll see if someone bites I guess.

Frayed Knot
Dec 11 2013 10:18 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Centerfield wrote:
No way I trade either for a guy I know will be a bench player, even a good one.


Maybe that is setting the standard a bit too low -- but at the moment we're not sure that whoever turns out to be the better of these two will qualify as much more than a decent bench player and maybe neither will. All's I'm saying is that I'd prefer to have one of these guys plus a mediocre player who plays a different position and brings a different set of skills rather than two similar mediocre guys.

Mets Guy in Michigan
Dec 11 2013 10:24 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Sandy also has plenty of time. Tracky and friends might be impatient. But there's no real rush.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Dec 11 2013 12:52 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Ceetar wrote:
From the supposed word about the Brewers camp about the Ike Davis negotiations, it sounds like Sandy's sticking to his "GIVE US AN AWESOME PROSPECT. No? You're out." strategy that seems to have netted us Wheeler and others.

We'll see if someone bites I guess.


You can leverage Beltran like that. Hell, you can even, in a thin market, kindasorta leverage Marlon Byrd like that, apparently.

But you CAN'T do that with Ike Davis, at full arbitrated price. Well, you can't, and expect to succeed.

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Dec 11 2013 12:54 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Hart is signing with Seattle, Internet says, perhaps increasing their appetite for Davisness.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Dec 11 2013 01:03 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Thanks, Fake Smart GM!

With midpriced guys like Kendrys Morales, Jeff Baker, Morse, and Loney still out there, it's STILL a buyer's market, innit?

OE: And Carlos Pena. And Overbay. AND Michael Young.

Ceetar
Dec 11 2013 01:14 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote:
Ceetar wrote:
From the supposed word about the Brewers camp about the Ike Davis negotiations, it sounds like Sandy's sticking to his "GIVE US AN AWESOME PROSPECT. No? You're out." strategy that seems to have netted us Wheeler and others.

We'll see if someone bites I guess.


You can leverage Beltran like that. Hell, you can even, in a thin market, kindasorta leverage Marlon Byrd like that, apparently.

But you CAN'T do that with Ike Davis, at full arbitrated price. Well, you can't, and expect to succeed.


Depends. I've always said Alderson's biggest card to play is his willingness to walk away and NOT make a deal. I suspect he's got the 'nothing good' contingency for Davis and will end up playing him if that happens and dangle Duda or put him in the minors or something.

Not trading Hairston is a similar case. It shows teams that he's NOT going to come down to your level and accept your crap trade offer. If you want Ike, you pay the price Sandy demands.

Mets Guy in Michigan
Dec 11 2013 01:31 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote:
Thanks, Fake Smart GM!

With midpriced guys like Kendrys Morales, Jeff Baker, Morse, and Loney still out there, it's STILL a buyer's market, innit?

OE: And Carlos Pena. And Overbay. AND Michael Young.



But are we looking to dump Ike because he's a bad player, or are we leveraging a surplus of talent in one area to fill a hole.

There are worse things than having Ike Davis at first base next season.

Benjamin Grimm
Dec 11 2013 01:32 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

I know it's probably not the wisest move, but I'd kinda like to see Sandy drive up the market for Davis and Duda by signing Loney, thereby removing him as an option for the Brewers, the Rays, and whoever else.

That evil plan would have a better chance of working if there weren't so many other first basemen available, as listed in a previous post.

Benjamin Grimm
Dec 11 2013 01:33 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

metsguyinmichigan wrote:
There are worse things than having Ike Davis at first base next season.


Even if he's hitting .160 on June 30? As we've seen, that's a very real possibility.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Dec 11 2013 01:34 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

The way Sandy et. al. have been talking/leaking, it seems that they're looking to trade Ike or bust, doesn't it?

dinosaur jesus
Dec 11 2013 01:37 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Benjamin Grimm wrote:
I know it's probably not the wisest move, but I'd kinda like to see Sandy drive up the market for Davis and Duda by signing Loney, thereby removing him as an option for the Brewers, the Rays, and whoever else.

That evil plan would have a better chance of working if there weren't so many other first basemen available, as listed in a previous post.


So maybe he should sign all of them, and then auction off the ones he doesn't want?

Benjamin Grimm
Dec 11 2013 02:04 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

There used to be a rule, I don't know if it's still in effect, that said that a newly signed free agent couldn't be traded until June 1 (or July 1?) of his first year with his new team.

Vic Sage
Dec 11 2013 02:34 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

sign Kendrys morales, trade Davis for a SS or SPer, send Duda to AAA.
done. next.

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Dec 11 2013 02:47 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

I think we gotta distinguish which shortstop you swap Davis for.

Frayed Knot
Dec 11 2013 02:52 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Benjamin Grimm wrote:
I know it's probably not the wisest move, but I'd kinda like to see Sandy drive up the market for Davis and Duda by signing Loney, thereby removing him as an option for the Brewers, the Rays, and whoever else.


The only problem with that theory is that you then put yourself in the position where everyone knows you have to trade your guy - thereby increasing the odds that you'd be driving down the price you'd get for him instead of raising it.
And that's also part of the problem with the 'Keep Both' school of thinking. Didn't we just recently pick-up as low-BA/hi-Slg type of 1st sacker to go along with the already crowded Duda + Davis + Allen Dykstra trio?



There used to be a rule, I don't know if it's still in effect, that said that a newly signed free agent couldn't be traded until June 1 (or July 1?) of his first year with his new team.


Without said player's permission, yes.

Vic Sage
Dec 11 2013 02:54 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote:
I think we gotta distinguish which shortstop you swap Davis for.


i've done enough of Sandy's job for one day... now its time for a mai tai.

Edgy MD
Dec 11 2013 03:16 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Frayed Knot wrote:
Benjamin Grimm wrote:
I know it's probably not the wisest move, but I'd kinda like to see Sandy drive up the market for Davis and Duda by signing Loney, thereby removing him as an option for the Brewers, the Rays, and whoever else.


The only problem with that theory is that you then put yourself in the position where everyone knows you have to trade your guy - thereby increasing the odds that you'd be driving down the price you'd get for him instead of raising it.
And that's also part of the problem with the 'Keep Both' school of thinking. Didn't we just recently pick-up as low-BA/hi-Slg type of 1st sacker to go along with the already crowded Duda + Davis + Allen Dykstra trio?

I didn't know we were a school.

I think I've tried extensively to make clear that the notion is you can keep both, not that you must keep both. So calling it a "'Keep Both' school" is a little unfair. As is the idea that that nameless first sacker (Brandon Allen) and Dykstra are somehow forcing the issue. For one, the latter has never until this been considered part of a "trio," a false equivalency made more risible by the fact that he's yet to appear in AAA, let alone the majors. For two, his name is "Allan." For three, he's got a broken fibula.

And I love my Allan Dykstra!

Frayed Knot
Dec 11 2013 05:17 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Yes, neither you, nor anyone else I know, is stating that we must keep both, just as I'm not saying that we can't keep both.
So to state my Ike/Lucas philosophy as clearly as possible so as to maybe wrap this up and to avoid the specter of a thread-long parsing contest:

* To those who say that we shouldn't trade one of the other unless we get in return either a solid starter at another position or a good young prospect --- my answer would be that neither ID or LD themselves qualify as solid starters at the moment; nor do either have their stats going in the right direction; nor have either shown any particular knack for staying healthy; nor are either young enough (27 & 28 by ST) to be considered up-and-comers themselves anymore.
Yeah, I'd like to get a haul for either one of them too, I just don't think it's going to happen.

* To the idea that we can/should keep both so as to back up each other and/or spur on each other --- I'd prefer to use that redundancy as trade bait so as to shore up a different position, of which we have several.

* To the part about simply stashing Duda in AAA --- the team has recently picked up one player with similar type age & skills, and has another with 1-1/2 seasons of AA under his belt with a performance last year that merits at least a one-step promotion so there'd also be some redundancy with that strategy as well.
I also suspect that hanging onto both with the idea that their trade value might rise in the future is that it's at least as likely to go the other way.

Edgy MD
Dec 11 2013 07:31 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

It's hardly a parsing contest, but hell, folks are going to clarify a position if it's misrepresented.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Dec 11 2013 08:04 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

dinosaur jesus wrote:
Benjamin Grimm wrote:
I know it's probably not the wisest move, but I'd kinda like to see Sandy drive up the market for Davis and Duda by signing Loney, thereby removing him as an option for the Brewers, the Rays, and whoever else.

That evil plan would have a better chance of working if there weren't so many other first basemen available, as listed in a previous post.


So maybe he should sign all of them, and then auction off the ones he doesn't want?


The Mariners appear to be exploring this avenue.

Benjamin Grimm
Dec 12 2013 11:55 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Jon Heyman says that the Mets and Brewers are meeting today to talk about Ike Davis.

Ashie62
Dec 12 2013 12:49 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Rubin tweets the Mets will not "give away" Ike..

Well duh... It may be easier to move a red headed stepchild than Ike..

Edgy MD
Dec 12 2013 12:58 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Well, if you disagree, then it makes no sense to preface that disagreement with "Duh."

It would actually be quite easy to move him.

Ceetar
Dec 12 2013 01:08 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
Well, if you disagree, then it makes no sense to preface that disagreement with "Duh."

It would actually be quite easy to move him.


Now Bartolo..you might need a bulldozer to move.


oops, wrong thread.

Ashie62
Dec 12 2013 04:41 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
Well, if you disagree, then it makes no sense to preface that disagreement with "Duh."

It would actually be quite easy to move him.


I want Davis in section 108 in the Meaodowlands...

Edgy MD
Dec 12 2013 05:35 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

That would be quite obviously counterproductive and pointlessly vindictive. Please try harder.

Frayed Knot
Dec 13 2013 06:37 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Ken Davidoff -- Clubs are intrigued by Ike Davis’ ceiling but scared by both his swing (the mechanics) and his swings (the streakiness) so it just doesn’t look realistic for the Mets to get a strong return on Davis. A bullpen piece could be as good as it gets.

Benjamin Grimm
Dec 13 2013 07:03 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

There's been a lot of talk about Ike's ceiling (especially on Mets Hot Stove this week) but you can't overlook his basement. And it seems that the teams the Mets are talking to are well aware of Ike's basement.

batmagadanleadoff
Dec 13 2013 10:50 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

I don't think the Mets can keep both Ike and Duda. They really are redundant, not only because they're similar offensive players, but because, mainly, they're first baseman. Duda can't play the outfield. Just can't. And, apparently, neither can Ike, now. Ike and Duda are less versatile than Eddie Kranepool. You've got two inconsistent left-handed exclusive first basemen, and given today's pitch count era with more roster slots taken up by pitchers and less bench players, it's inefficient to keep both. Putting Duda in the outfield is baseball suicide. The Mets really have to get rid of at least one of these, and if they keep one instead of none, hope that the keeper improves. That's all they can do. I also think it's likelier that the kept guy improves with more playing time. I disagree that Ike and Duda aren't competing. Or at least, I don't think Duda sees it that way. Duda sees himself as a first baseman -- therefore, Ike's taking away his playing time. According to Duda. That's really all there is to it. Who the Mets get for which of these two? How the hell would I know?

If the Mets keep both, then they're not trying to contend as much as they claim to. Not that I'm against a rebuild done right. Besides, only one team can win the World Series, and I've long ago given up the ghost about how the Mets, because of their big market competitive advantage, should be winning the WS more than once every 30 years or so. Accepting this makes rebuilds that much more tolerable.

Benjamin Grimm
Dec 20 2013 07:30 AM
And now a word from Pittsburgh...

This is from the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, arguing that the Pirates should consider Ike Davis:


Bob Smizik: What price prospects?

By Bob Smizik / Special to the Post-Gazette

The suggestion posted yesterday that the Pirates should trade for a first baseman was not met with much enthusiasm. Many, if not most, readers did not want to part with a prospect for the first basemen mentioned: Ike Davis, Mitch Moreland or Justin Smoak.

What is it about prospects that so fascinates baseball fans? How many of them have to fail before people come to grips with the fact they are not all sure things?

In the course of the discussion, someone wanted to know what was the big deal about Davis?

How about this: He hit 32 home runs in 2012.

Or this: After a horrendous start in 2013, he had a .954 OPS in the second half of the season.

Or that he’s younger than Jordy Mercer, younger than Pedro Alvarez and he has three more years of team control.

How is that not better than Andrew Lambo, who seemed to be preferred over Davis?

Some insisted on hoarding the Pirates treasure chest of stud pitching prospects.

Which leads to this question: If there are so many, why not consider trading one of them for a guy who hit 32 home runs just one season ago?

The fact some wanted nothing to do with Smoak only served to show the absurdity of this love affair with prospects. In 2009, Smoak was the No. 23 prospect in MLB, according to Baseball America. In 2010, he was No. 13.

Which means some people don’t want to give up a good prospect, even if it’s for a player who once was a better prospect. Even if that better prospect, Smoak, had an .838 OPS vs. right-handed pitching last season, which would be his primary role with the Pirates in 2014.

I have no idea how Davis, the No. 62 prospect in 2010, Smoak or Moreland would do with the Pirates. Any or all could fail miserably. Or not. I do know this: The Pirates are a contender and if they wish to capitalize on that status, it would behoove them to upgrade at first base.

I’m not suggesting the Pirates give whomever the Mets, Rangers or Mariners would want for Davis, Moreland or Smoak. Of course, certain prospect would not be available. According to MLB.com, the Pirates have six top-100 prospects: Right-handed pitcher Jameson Taillon, 10; outfielder Gregory Polanco, 13; shortstop Alen Hanson, 40; outfielder Austin Meadows, 69; right-handed pitcher Luis Heredia 76; right-handed pitcher Tyler Glasnow, 97.

Those players are off the board. Almost no one else is.

Let’s keep in mind in discussing the Pirates' first base situation that there is no one on the horizon. The team’s so-called first baseman of the future was Alex Dickerson. He was traded to San Diego in November for outfielder Jaff Decker and right-handed reliever Miles Mikolas. So it’s not like trading for a first baseman would be blocking anyone. In fact, with no prospects close to being ready to help the Pirates at first base, it would seem trading for one would be a priority -- not an afterthought.

One last point about trading for prospects. Dickerson was the Pirates No. 13 prospect, according to MLB.com, and he was traded for two minor leaguers the Padres did not have much use for. If the Pirates can trade No. 13 for a couple of borderline prospects, why not trade No. 9, right-handed pitcher Nick Kingham, for an MLB ready first baseman?

Just yesterday, Keith Law of ESPN.com, one of the leading authorities on prospects, was asked in a chat about the possibility of trading Kingham, the Pirates fourth-ranked pitching prospect, for Davis:

His answer: ''Not Kingham, of course.’’

The Pirates have a mountain of right-handed pitching prospects -- also including Stolmy Pimentel, Brandon Cumpton and Clay Holmes -- and nary a first base prospect close to helping the team.

To Law and to all of those afflicted with PSS (Prospect Separation Syndrome): Why not Kingham for Davis?

batmagadanleadoff
Dec 20 2013 08:04 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Did anyone know that Ike Davis led the NL in post All-Star Game OBP last season (.449)?

batmagadanleadoff
Dec 20 2013 08:09 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Did anyone know that Ike Davis led the NL in post All-Star Game OBP last season (.449)?




Rumor Roundup
Who Likes Ike?

by Daniel Rathman

excerpt:

Mets hunting for power arms in exchange for Ike Davis....

Since taking over the reins of the Mets in October 2010, general manager Sandy Alderson has done much of his best work on the trade market, exporting aging assets like Carlos Beltran and R.A. Dickey for high-end pitching prospects like Zack Wheeler and Noah Syndergaard. This offseason, Alderson is working with a much younger and less-accomplished trade chip, but when it comes to the return, he has mid-90s heat on his mind again.

According to USA Today’s John Perrotto, Alderson asked his Pirates counterpart, Neal Huntington, for right-hander Nick Kingham during their discussions about Ike Davis. The market for the 26-year-old Davis grew clearer last week, when the Rays brought back James Loney on a three-year deal, leaving the Buccos and Brewers to vie for the Mets’ first baseman.

Davis buoyed his value by posting a league-high .449 on-base percentage in 204 plate appearances after the All-Star break, and while that gaudy mark was fueled in part by a .351 BABIP, the Arizona State product also sliced his strikeout rate and padded his walk rate considerably. Both are promising signs for Davis, who slugged 32 home runs in 2012 but has been exploited by pitchers able to find holes in his swing.

Kingham ranked ninth on the Pirates’ top 10 prospects list entering last season, earning a mid-rotation projection from Jason Parks, and proceeded to pitch well for both High-A Bradenton, where he fanned more than a batter per inning, and Double-A Altoona, where he logged a 2.70 ERA. Assuming his pre-2013 projection holds, the 2010 fourth-rounder could see time in a major-league rotation by 2015.

A potential no. 3 starter about a year removed from the Show is a lofty asking price for Davis, and if Alderson has floated similar demands to other suitors, it might explain why no deal has materialized yet. Even though Loney and Justin Morneau have found new homes, there are still alternatives to Davis for clubs in need of first-base help....


http://www.baseballprospectus.com/artic ... leid=22442

Ceetar
Dec 20 2013 08:13 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

batmagadanleadoff wrote:
Did anyone know that Ike Davis led the NL in post All-Star Game OBP last season (.449)?


yes. And that was after a 2 week 'slump' because he went a stretch where he was approaching .500

Edgy MD
Dec 20 2013 08:21 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Rumor Roundup wrote:
Davis buoyed his value by posting a league-high .449 on-base percentage in 204 plate appearances after the All-Star break, and while that gaudy mark was fueled in part by a .351 BABIP, the Arizona State product also sliced his strikeout rate and padded his walk rate considerably. Both are promising signs for Davis, who slugged 32 home runs in 2012 but has been exploited by pitchers able to find holes in his swing.

I disagree with that, unless "holes in his swing" means "he can't hit the breaking pitch under his knees."

But that's a hole in most people's swing, and that's why it's a ball if you don't swing at it. The problem is that he chased continually in the first half and that was all anybody tended to throw him. In the second half, he came back with a new discipline, and laid off that crap. It was encouraging, but it remained to be seen what would happen when the pitchers adjusted. Would he be able to punish pitchers when they came back up to him? Would he fall back in the rut and start hacking at the low slider again when it became less common? It's a shame he got hurt.

Ashie62
Dec 20 2013 03:42 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Davis...Smoak....and Moreland...

I felt like Smoak had the highest ceiling on arrival but he has been totally dreadful..

None will get a power arm in return...

Edgy MD
Dec 20 2013 05:31 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

I'm not particular on the type of talent I would get, just hope for equal or better value or hoping the team holds.

Edgy MD
Dec 31 2013 07:46 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Looking at the movement to bring in Kendrys Morales, as expressed in another thread, I took the ten most comparable batters to Kendrys Morale (as per baseball-reference.com) through age 30 and put them up side-by-side with the ten most similar to to Duda through 27 and Davis through 26, and for each of the coming three years, the data favors Davis and Duda. While the bottom line offers nothing conclusive, it's conclusive enough to discourage me from investing tens of millions at first when deeper needs lie elsewhere.

While the Mets may not have a wealth of talent at first, Alderson's contention that he has a glut is correct, and the players in that glut certainly still have value, as weary as we may have grown of them.

And man, dividing by 10 is easy.

Morales

RankFirst NameLast NameSimilarity ScoreWAR at 31WAR at 32WAR at 33
1GordonColeman960-0.8-0.20.0
2JoeHauser9510.00.00.0
3PaulSorrento9502.1-0.5-0.9
4ReggieJefferson9470.00.00.0
5JohnJaha9471.00.04.6
6EurbielDurazo944-0.30.00.0
7WaltDropo9430.01.2-0.5
8WillieAikens9420.00.00.0
9MikeJacobs942-0.20.00.0
10JuanRivera942-0.30.5-0.9
Net1.51.02.3
Average0.150.100.23


=#FF0000]Duda
RankFirst NameLast NameSimilarity ScoreWAR at 28WAR at 29WAR at 30
1BobbyKielty9740.91.4-0.2
2OttoVelez9682.91.40.9
3GlenallenHill9671.41.12.0
4ButchNieman9660.00.00.0
5TomGrieve9651.3-1.0-0.3
6ArtShamsky9652.30.0-0.1
7BobbyOliver964-0.70.62.4
8WaltBond9620.00.10.0
9KarimGarica961-0.70.00.0
10HalMcRae9613.91.94.6
Net11.35.59.3
Average1.130.550.93


=#0000FF]Davis
RankFirst NameLast NameSimilarity ScoreWAR at 27WAR at 28WAR at 29
1CarlosPena9710.10.17.2
2TinoMartinez9644.52.15.1
3EricKarros9623.91.40.9
4BobRobertson9581.11.0-0.8
5NickJohnson9565.00.01.1
6JustinSmoak9470.00.00.0
7MikeEpstein9462.00.95.2
8Willie MaysAikens9461.62.1-0.7
9GregVaughn9466.71.3-0.4
10GlennDavis9394.24.42.2
Net29.113.319.8
Average2.911.331.98

Edgy MD
Dec 31 2013 08:01 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Also, he comes into the game as "Kendry," gets spectacuarly hurt and misses 1 2/3 seasons, and then comes back as "Kendrys"? that's a huge red flag there.

Centerfield
Dec 31 2013 08:38 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

If all we are going to get is a fringe prospect, I'd rather keep Davis and see what he's got for one more year. Place Duda in AAA and see how Ike does.

If he sucks, cut him and call up Duda. If he's good, keep him and hope Duda raises his trade value while in AAA.

Benjamin Grimm
Dec 31 2013 08:49 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Centerfield wrote:
If all we are going to get is a fringe prospect, I'd rather keep Davis and see what he's got for one more year. Place Duda in AAA and see how Ike does.

If he sucks, cut him and call up Duda. If he's good, keep him and hope Duda raises his trade value while in AAA.


I think that makes sense. (I'd include Satin among the fallback options too.) The only thing is, I'd give Ike a lot less rope than he's received in the last two seasons.

Edgy MD
Dec 31 2013 08:54 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Well, the presence of Duda and Satin would certainly give them a much more ready pair o' fallback plans.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Dec 31 2013 10:05 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
Also, he comes into the game as "Kendry," gets spectacuarly hurt and misses 1 2/3 seasons, and then comes back as "Kendrys"? that's a huge red flag there.


HE'S KENDRY 2! THAT'S A CLONE, MOTHERFATHERS!

Ashie62
Dec 31 2013 10:29 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Sandy was/is supposed to fix 1B.. Thus far its a fail..

SS also..

Centerfield
Dec 31 2013 12:13 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Benjamin Grimm wrote:
Centerfield wrote:
If all we are going to get is a fringe prospect, I'd rather keep Davis and see what he's got for one more year. Place Duda in AAA and see how Ike does.

If he sucks, cut him and call up Duda. If he's good, keep him and hope Duda raises his trade value while in AAA.


I think that makes sense. (I'd include Satin among the fallback options too.) The only thing is, I'd give Ike a lot less rope than he's received in the last two seasons.


Certainly on this. No way we can have him suck for an entire half-season. Especially in a season where we are hoping to be in the mix. I think if he goes 0 for April again, we can declare the Davis era officially over.

Edgy MD
Dec 31 2013 12:40 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Ashie62 wrote:
Sandy was/is supposed to fix 1B.. Thus far its a fail..

SS also..

Sandy was/is supposed to improve his team and the organization around him.

Ashie62
Dec 31 2013 02:36 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
Ashie62 wrote:
Sandy was/is supposed to fix 1B.. Thus far its a fail..

SS also..

Sandy was/is supposed to improve his team and the organization around him.


Granted..those two positions are not the whole team but I believe improvement from those two spots came from Sandy's mouth.

He noted SS..1B..OF..SP..C specifically...

He has nailed 2 for 5 that I see...

Nymr83
Jan 01 2014 09:35 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Ashie62 wrote:
Ashie62 wrote:
Sandy was/is supposed to fix 1B.. Thus far its a fail..

SS also..

Sandy was/is supposed to improve his team and the organization around him.


Granted..those two positions are not the whole team but I believe improvement from those two spots came from Sandy's mouth.

He noted SS..1B..OF..SP..C specifically...

He has nailed 2 for 5 that I see...


I'll judge him by the product on the field and the direction the team seems to be headed. I'd be happy if he doesn't fill a specific position at any cost just because he said at some point that we needed it.

Benjamin Grimm
Jan 05 2014 03:00 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Adam Rubin wrote:
Can anyone say awkward?

Mets insiders now expect Ike Davis will be in spring training with the team in Port St. Lucie, Fla. -- while cautioning they are willing to reengage the Pittsburgh Pirates or Milwaukee Brewers or any other club in search of a first baseman in trade talks in the six weeks before pitchers and catchers report on Feb. 15.

Sources add that Davis genuinely does want to remain with the Mets.

Of course, there is a difference between Davis coming to spring training and making it all the way to Opening Day.

Another team could have an injury during spring training and need to acquire a first baseman. Or, a team like the Pirates -- who recently traded for Triple-A first baseman Chris McGuiness -- could become dissatisfied with their internal options during spring training and resume speaking with the Mets.

Mets officials largely project Lucas Duda as having the better long-term potential, but are not averse to Davis being the first baseman in 2014.

If both players were on the Opening Day roster, there technically would be a first-base competition during spring training. Still, Davis likely would get the bulk of the early season duty. After all, while Duda has significant home-run potential, Davis has hit 32 homers in a season as recently as 2012.

A surplus at the position is viewed as a good problem to have by team officials.

Davis, who is eligible for arbitration, is projected to earn $3.825 million this season. Duda, also eligible for arbitration, should earn about $1.8 million.

Edgy MD
Jan 05 2014 04:52 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Shouldn't really be anything awkward about it.

Ruby can be weird about drama.

Ceetar
Jan 06 2014 08:54 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
Shouldn't really be anything awkward about it.

Ruby can be weird about drama.


he's hardly the first place to have trade talks surface and not be traded. Or to have bad things said about him and not be traded.

And 'bulk of the early season time' is silly because A. I doubt Collins has decided on 2 weeks worth of Spring Training line ups in early January, and B. with split squads and the general 3-4 innings played early on, there's plenty of time for Ike, Duda, Satin and a score of others.

Edgy MD
Jan 06 2014 09:13 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Sandy, welcoming players to camp: Great to see you, Ike! How you feeling?

Ike: I hate you and your ASS FACE!

Sandy: Whoah, hey. Maybe we just step over here and talk.

Ike: I can't believe... that just came out like that. I'm just... (HUGE heaving sobs.)

(Sandy hugs Ike awkwardly. Nods over Davis's shoulder to Dykstra to get out on the field and start fielding grounders at first.)

Mets Guy in Michigan
Jan 06 2014 09:20 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Metsblog today says the teams that were talking to the Mets expect the team to release him in spring training to save on the salary, and they'll just pick him up then without having the give up a prospect.

Vic Sage
Jan 06 2014 10:17 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

why on earth would they just release him? It's not like production by Duda and Satin have made Ike irrelevant... those guys haven't produced much either, and neither has shown the ability to date to hit 32 HRs and drive in 90r in the majors. And its not like we'd lose Duda if we just sent him down; he has options. I don't know what the baseball rationale is for a move like this. It seems to me that cutting Ike for nothing to anoint Duda and save $3m would be an indicator of a larger systemic problem.

metsmarathon
Jan 06 2014 10:21 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

but... isn't the contract guaranteed...? or is it only if he's on a major league roster at the start of the season?

Edgy MD
Jan 06 2014 10:23 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Guaranteed if he's with the team past a certain date.

Do we know what he's projected to make? More like $4 million, right?

If he gets released, it's likely to be at the end of spring training, when his performance will have influenced the calculus in the decision.

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Jan 06 2014 10:25 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Yeah I don';t believe they'd release him either. He's not Jason Bay.

I still think Ike's going in a trade, and that trade will be a whopper with cheese.

batmagadanleadoff
Jan 06 2014 10:35 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

metsguyinmichigan wrote:
Metsblog today says the teams that were talking to the Mets expect the team to release him in spring training to save on the salary, and they'll just pick him up then without having the give up a prospect.


It's the rich exploiting the poor.

Mets Guy in Michigan
Jan 06 2014 10:36 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Maybe the idea is to release him and save the money, which then can be spent on Drew.

batmagadanleadoff
Jan 06 2014 10:36 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Vic Sage wrote:
It seems to me that cutting Ike for nothing to anoint Duda and save $3m would be an indicator of a larger systemic problem.


It really is, if there's any semblance of truth to the other teams' supposed thinking.

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Jan 06 2014 10:39 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

metsguyinmichigan wrote:
Maybe the idea is to release him and save the money, which then can be spent on Drew.


bleh. I'd sooner trade him for a "lesser" shortstop.

Vic Sage
Jan 06 2014 12:01 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jan 06 2014 12:31 PM

whatever value we may or may not ascribe to Drew, the notion that the $3.8m (edit: $3.2m; $600K guaranteed) the Mets would save by releasing Ike would be necessary in order to make that acquisition, is truly galling. When Milwaukee and Pitt are the "rich teams" looking to exploit our poverty-stricken franchise by waiting for us to give up on $4m players because they're too "expensive", we're looking at systemic problems.

Edgy MD
Jan 06 2014 12:30 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

I don't see where it makes much difference which teams are hoping to get him on the cheap, if that's in fact what's going on, which is pretty much a point of speculation at this juncture, so you may have been prematurely galled.

batmagadanleadoff
Jan 06 2014 12:35 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
I don't see where it makes much difference which teams are hoping to get him on the cheap, if that's in fact what's going on, which is pretty much a point of speculation at this juncture, so you may have been prematurely galled.


It doesn't. But that small market teams like the Pirates and the Brewers might be preying on the Mets financial condition is yet another marker of just how far the Mets have fallen, and also indicates that contrary to what the Mets claim, they ain't anywhere near out of this mess yet.

Vic Sage
Jan 06 2014 12:36 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
I don't see where it makes much difference which teams are hoping to get him on the cheap, if that's in fact what's going on, which is pretty much a point of speculation at this juncture, so you may have been prematurely galled.


there is no difference; it is simply ironic and points out the role reversal our team may be involved in thanks to changing fortunes of the Wilpons. As for my premature galling, i'm taking medication for that. at any rate, i said the notion was galling, speculative or not... and it is. Whether the Mets actually behave this way obviously remains to be seen, and there will be plenty more gall to go around at that point, should it occur.

Edgy MD
Jan 06 2014 12:48 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Well, it's not like the teams would be paying full freight for Davis, so wouldn't be exploiting any superior budget. They'd simply be hoping to grab a castoff. And it's all speculative.

This isn't predatory. Predatory would be teams signing away high-end Mets free agents the Mets like but cannot afford. This scenario, if it indeed comes to pass (and I'm dubious), involves teams not signing or acquiring a starting firstbaseman, but instead waiting until the dawn of the season, hoping for the Mets toss a highly questionable one aside.

They are welcome to run their teams that way.

Ceetar
Jan 06 2014 12:57 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

This is code.

It means

The expected value for Davis now coupled with his price is less than the expected value teams think they get can from what's available in other ways before the season starts, including the possibility that the Mets choose to save Ike's salary by releasing him.

There's a whole lot of difference between being willing to give a guy a shot and willing to part with something to give a guy a shot.

It's just one end of the game of chicken Sandy's playing. Sandy says they might play him, other teams say they don't need him. They claim they'll get him later, Sandy claims he'll hit 40 HR. Your guy sucks, but I'll give him a try for (peanuts). Are you kidding? This guy's going to bounce-back like crazy, you should've seen his swings in the cage earlier last week. Better get him before someone else does.

Zvon
Jan 06 2014 01:11 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Vic Sage wrote:
whatever value we may or may not ascribe to Drew, the notion that the $3.8m (edit: $3.2m; $600K guaranteed) the Mets would save by releasing Ike would be necessary in order to make that acquisition, is truly galling. When Milwaukee and Pitt are the "rich teams" looking to exploit our poverty-stricken franchise by waiting for us to give up on $4m players because they're too "expensive", we're looking at systemic problems.
Vic Sage wrote:
why on earth would they just release him? It's not like production by Duda and Satin have made Ike irrelevant... those guys haven't produced much either, and neither has shown the ability to date to hit 32 HRs and drive in 90r in the majors. And its not like we'd lose Duda if we just sent him down; he has options. I don't know what the baseball rationale is for a move like this. It seems to me that cutting Ike for nothing to anoint Duda and save $3m would be an indicator of a larger systemic problem.


I also suffer from this systematic problem, premature galling. ^ That says it all.

Mets Guy in Michigan
Jan 06 2014 03:57 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

I think the real issue is not the Wilpon's finances, but the challenge of trying to get something of value for an under-performing firstbaseman, of which there are many in the league.

Ashie62
Jan 06 2014 05:21 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

It may be as simple as other team assigning very little value to Ike Davis...

I was hoping the off season would go a little better where Ike and Duda were not involved in discussions about their roles as 2014 Mets at this point.

Vic Sage
Jan 06 2014 06:28 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

metsguyinmichigan wrote:
I think the real issue is not the Wilpon's finances, but the challenge of trying to get something of value for an under-performing firstbaseman, of which there are many in the league.


But trying to get something for him wouldn't be an issue if not for the Wilpon financial woes.

Mets Guy in Michigan
Jan 06 2014 07:51 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Vic Sage wrote:
metsguyinmichigan wrote:
I think the real issue is not the Wilpon's finances, but the challenge of trying to get something of value for an under-performing firstbaseman, of which there are many in the league.


But trying to get something for him wouldn't be an issue if not for the Wilpon financial woes.


How so? We'd still have three first basemen who kinda sorta do -- or could do -- the same thing. Seems like one would be going away whether we added a new shortstop or not.

Edgy MD
Jan 06 2014 09:31 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Vic Sage wrote:
metsguyinmichigan wrote:
I think the real issue is not the Wilpon's finances, but the challenge of trying to get something of value for an under-performing firstbaseman, of which there are many in the league.


But trying to get something for him wouldn't be an issue if not for the Wilpon financial woes.

Of course it would, and it certainly should be.

Ashie62
Jan 06 2014 09:40 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Trying to get the best for Ike has nothing to do with the Wilpons financial woes..

Hell, I'm not sure there even are financial woes...

Enlighten me..

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Jan 06 2014 09:58 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

There are Wilpon financial woes? Why the hell didn't anyone say anything about this before?

Most organizations-- be they small-market, large-market, or chain supermarket-- don't tend to pay full freight for iffy-but-promising resources at a very low ebb. Sandy's apparently not offering clearance pricing, so it stands to reason that nobody's buying.

Frayed Knot
Jan 07 2014 07:25 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

These are the sort of players the Mets have reportedly sought (and, if true, been rejected for) in exchange for Ike:

Eduardo Rodriguez -- LHP in Balt system; turns 21 in April; 10-7; 3.41 in 25 starts between High-A & AA in 2013

Nick Kingham -- RHP in Pitt system; 22 y/o; 9-6 w/2.81 ERA over 25 starts between High-A & AA

Tyler Thornburg -- RHP; 25 y/o; parts of 2 ML seasons w/Milwaukee; 26 games / 10 starts; 2.64 ERA, 1.21 WHiP

Edgy MD
Jan 16 2014 05:00 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Brewers pass on Ike Davis, go for unblushing strikeout machine Mark Reynolds, who will only cost them money and dignity.

Vic Sage
Jan 17 2014 02:59 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

metsguyinmichigan wrote:
metsguyinmichigan wrote:
I think the real issue is not the Wilpon's finances, but the challenge of trying to get something of value for an under-performing firstbaseman, of which there are many in the league.


But trying to get something for him wouldn't be an issue if not for the Wilpon financial woes.


How so? We'd still have three first basemen who kinda sorta do -- or could do -- the same thing. Seems like one would be going away whether we added a new shortstop or not.


My point was just that they wouldn't necessarily be looking to move Ike if he wasn't going to make $3.5m this year. Yes, they have other 1bmen that are similarly unproductive, but those guys have minor league options and don't have to take up space on the major league roster. Nobody is pushing Ike for the spot, and trading him now would definitely be a "sell low" proposition on a guy with 30+hr upside. The only reason Sandy might've considered trading him is either to cut the budget and give the spot to one of the other unproductive 1bmen who are making much less, or try to turn Ike around for a better prospect than he's worth. Apparently, Sandy tried the latter. He may yet try the former, depending on the Wilpons' cash flow at the time.

Edgy MD
Jan 17 2014 09:54 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Now you're stretching.

Edgy MD
Jan 21 2014 03:41 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Man, you need an article, buy Ron Davis a beer and let him talk your ear off.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Jan 22 2014 08:50 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jan 22 2014 07:03 PM

One gets the feeling Ron's been waiting a while for someone to buy him that drink.

Zvon
Jan 22 2014 02:38 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Is he right though? At first I thought yes, the Mets should not have put out that info prior to being able to actually do anything with Ike.
But then I thought that back when papa Davis played there wasn't this huge media frenzy caused by the age of instant information. I guess the Mets felt compelled to say something because people were waiting to hear something. Still, I think it an unwise decision to have, in a sense, smeared Ike all winter long.

Frayed Knot
Jan 22 2014 02:50 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

The Mets could have clammed up and said nothing at all, but it wouldn't have prevented the idea that they were trying to peddle Ike from becoming public knowledge.

Ashie62
Jan 22 2014 09:47 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Ron Davis is an MFY....I guess the Mets aren't doing it the Yanqui way...

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Feb 01 2014 01:24 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Mets sign Matt Clark, 27 year old minor-league/Japan vet.

Bats L, throws R, also plays the outfield? Pretty good minor league slugger but never reached the bigs. 25 homers for the Chinuchi Dragons last season.

Here's Matt.


Here's his girl, Astros "sideline reporter" Julia Morales:

Frayed Knot
Feb 01 2014 01:39 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Oh good, a low-BA / high-K / decent walk-rate / slow / LH-hitting 1st sacker.
I was wondering when we were going to get one of those.

Ashie62
Feb 01 2014 03:36 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

I'm not sure if her sneakers are trendy or just shot...

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Feb 01 2014 06:23 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

He strikes me as a guy who doesn't mind looking in the mirror while having sex.

Benjamin Grimm
Feb 19 2014 02:20 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

There seems to be some buzz that the Pirates and/or Orioles may have revived their earlier interest in Ike Davis.

Edgy MD
Feb 19 2014 02:40 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Ashie62 wrote:
I'm not sure if her sneakers are trendy or just shot...

She laces them top to bottom. Is that even LEGAL in Texas?

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Feb 19 2014 02:47 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Benjamin Grimm wrote:
There seems to be some buzz that the Pirates and/or Orioles may have revived their earlier interest in Ike Davis.


Of course they have!

Ike will be traded! It'll be a coup for Mets!! Just wait!!

Benjamin Grimm
Apr 03 2014 02:58 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Terry says he's going to pick a first baseman and stick with him for a while. (He's not saying who yet; probably wants to talk to the players before he says anything to the press.)

So who will it be? Who do you hope it is?

I find myself thinking it will be Duda. I don't think I'm rooting for one or the other, but I am curious.

Ceetar
Apr 03 2014 03:04 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Benjamin Grimm wrote:
Terry says he's going to pick a first baseman and stick with him for a while. (He's not saying who yet; probably wants to talk to the players before he says anything to the press.)

So who will it be? Who do you hope it is?

I find myself thinking it will be Duda. I don't think I'm rooting for one or the other, but I am curious.


3 righties. It won't be Satin.

I think it'll be Ike, I hope it'll be Duda since he's the steady and good one and we need offense although that's relatively meaningless in 3-6 games (DH available after that for 3)

Zvon
Apr 03 2014 03:06 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Benjamin Grimm wrote:
Terry says he's going to pick a first baseman and stick with him for a while. (He's not saying who yet; probably wants to talk to the players before he says anything to the press.)

So who will it be? Who do you hope it is?

I find myself thinking it will be Duda. I don't think I'm rooting for one or the other, but I am curious.


Right or wrong, I dunno, but it'll be Duda.

Ashie62
Apr 03 2014 03:23 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Doodah..

Edgy MD
Apr 03 2014 07:31 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Reports have Lucas Doo designated as the firstbasey guy.

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Apr 04 2014 07:37 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
Reports have Lucas Doo designated as the firstbasey guy.


This whole thing continues to be weird though.

If they're willing to give one guy a shot, and they believe that guy is best-suited for the job, then why did that one sit on the bench for the first 2 days of the year? Still hurting? What?

And if you've made a decision, why be coy about it only to "leak" the info? I don't get the impression that Terry is particularly savvy but a manager going on the record to make a declaration like that, with every beat guy subsequently crediting "a source with direct knowledge" identifying Doodoo, sounds like Terry nodded his head 'yes' when a crowd of reporters guessed the right starter.

Ike Davis should be traded for a relief pitcher, and/or a prospect to replace the ones we need to call up, or as part of a Big Deal for relief pitchers and shortstops like we've been waiting for since last summer.

Ceetar
Apr 04 2014 07:45 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote:
Edgy MD wrote:
Reports have Lucas Doo designated as the firstbasey guy.


This whole thing continues to be weird though.

If they're willing to give one guy a shot, and they believe that guy is best-suited for the job, then why did that one sit on the bench for the first 2 days of the year? Still hurting? What?

And if you've made a decision, why be coy about it only to "leak" the info? I don't get the impression that Terry is particularly savvy but a manager going on the record to make a declaration like that, with every beat guy subsequently crediting "a source with direct knowledge" identifying Doodoo, sounds like Terry nodded his head 'yes' when a crowd of reporters guessed the right starter.

Ike Davis should be traded for a relief pitcher, and/or a prospect to replace the ones we need to call up, or as part of a Big Deal for relief pitchers and shortstops like we've been waiting for since last summer.


I suspect a lot of it was "getting everybody in" There's presumably some value to that, and even if not there's an old-school train of thought to it. Now we're at a string of righties so you presumably pick a first baseman and go with it.

But it should be Ike. Particularly if you want to trade one of them. We know what Duda is. We know he's an above average offense player who's flawed defensively but can probably hold down 1B well enough. Maybe he hits a little better this year than last, but it's not likely to be significant.

But Ike? Ike's the wild card. he's been up and down. he was up last but got hurt and made the whole year look bad. So why not play that guy, hope for a hot streak, and then try to sell high, or sell as 'fixed'? I don't think his value can really drop if he were to play badly for a couple of weeks. Perhaps even if he plays badly, someone else will see something they think they can fix, like how you might buy a house with leaky pipes if you're a plumber.

Edgy MD
Apr 04 2014 07:47 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Why make a decision at all? What new data suggests that anybody has won? Mix and match until somebody actually excels beyond the others.

Ceetar
Apr 04 2014 07:52 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
Why make a decision at all? What new data suggests that anybody has won? Mix and match until somebody actually excels beyond the others.


In 6 games we've got 3 with a DH. I'd wager it'll be 4 Duda, 1 Ike, 1 Satin up until then.

Edgy MD
Apr 04 2014 08:01 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

All the more reason not to designate Duda as your firstbasey guy.

Benjamin Grimm
Apr 04 2014 08:05 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

My guess is that is Terry is making a decision it's more for psychological than on-the-field reasons. He may be feeling that the uncertainty of who is going to be in the lineup on any given day is harming both Duda and Davis, and he wants to end that uncertainty as best he can.

That's my guess, anyway.

Ceetar
Apr 04 2014 08:22 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
All the more reason not to designate Duda as your firstbasey guy.


yes, but giving a tangible answers makes the reporters get up and walk away and you can go back to doing your real job.

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Apr 04 2014 08:55 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Why make a decision at all? What new data suggests that anybody has won? Mix and match until somebody actually excels beyond the others.


But you have to decide on how to mix and match. Sounds as though a decision has been made to give Doodoo a shot for a certain unspecified period of time.

We're not in the clubhouse to know for sure but I get a strong impression that these kinds of situations tend not to come up too often because it's just not how ballplayers are wired and baseball works. We see the same in bullpen management: It's clear that the closer/set-up/specialist/long man designations aren't always ideal but they provide guys with specific roles to fill so when they're asked to do that job they understand what their role is.

metirish
Apr 04 2014 08:58 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Apr 04 2014 09:07 AM

Certainly Ron Darling doesn't agree with how this is being handled, during the game he said that a decision should have been made before the season, play that guy for whatever specified amount of time etc. I guess like mentioned above players are wired that way.

Edgy MD
Apr 04 2014 09:06 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote:
Edgy MD wrote:
Why make a decision at all? What new data suggests that anybody has won? Mix and match until somebody actually excels beyond the others.


But you have to decide on how to mix and match. Sounds as though a decision has been made to give Doodoo a shot for a certain unspecified period of time.

Sure, you have to make a decision. I just wouldn't go making such an announcement. Creates more drama if things swing in another direction.

batmagadanleadoff
Apr 04 2014 12:30 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
Edgy MD wrote:
Why make a decision at all? What new data suggests that anybody has won? Mix and match until somebody actually excels beyond the others.


But you have to decide on how to mix and match. Sounds as though a decision has been made to give Doodoo a shot for a certain unspecified period of time.

Sure, you have to make a decision. I just wouldn't go making such an announcement. Creates more drama if things swing in another direction.


It'd come out anyway, even if Collins didn't make a public disclosure. Ike and Looook would hafta know. And then it ain't no secret anymore. In NY, Terry's decision would eventually end up in some writer's smartphone. I wanted to say notepad but that's old fashioned, right?

Edgy MD
Apr 04 2014 12:39 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

I don't know that they have to be told anything. You want to see if you're the firstbaseman? Check the lineup card. If Duda gets the call three days in a row, Duda, Davis, the press, you, and me, will know Terry's made something of a commitment.

When they ask if this means Duda is the 2014 firstbaseman, he can give one of those maddeingingly thoughtfully-engaging-but-empty Alderson answers. "You may see more Lucas going forward. That's a definite possibility. Things could shake out any number of ways depending on a lot of variables. Lucas starting there regularly... yes, I would say that's one of the more likely outcomes. One of several. But a lot things are unknown at this juncture and it behooves us all to be humble."

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Apr 04 2014 12:44 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

I just don't believe -- and don't believe that managers and players believe -- that not knowing your role till you look at the lineup card each night is compatible with disposition required of being a professional baseball player, particularly when you are with your first organization and "in your prime." Oftentimes, the transition from ascended prospect to reserve accompanies a change in employers.

Edgy MD
Apr 04 2014 12:46 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

That was pretty good. You refuted my point and made it sound like Alderson also.

I applaud.

Benjamin Grimm
Apr 04 2014 12:50 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Edgy MD wrote:
I don't know that they have to be told anything. You want to see if you're the firstbaseman? Check the lineup card.


I feel the same way, but as JCL says, the modern ballplayer doesn't function well that way. As we've seen with the bullpen usage, players need to "know their role" more than in the past.

Lefty Specialist
Apr 04 2014 02:32 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

"Ike Davis, your role is to sit your ass on the bench."

Done.

Frayed Knot
Apr 04 2014 02:37 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Benjamin Grimm wrote:
Edgy MD wrote:
I don't know that they have to be told anything. You want to see if you're the firstbaseman? Check the lineup card.


I feel the same way, but as JCL says, the modern ballplayer doesn't function well that way.


And also the manager doesn't want his starter--even if that starter is starter in name only and is hardly etched in stone for the future--to be thinking that he's going to lose his job on account of a bad game or two. Even saying "you're the starter until I say otherwise" sounds a little less dicey to one's ears even if it actually isn't.

Ceetar
Apr 04 2014 02:38 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Frayed Knot wrote:


And also the manager doesn't want his starter--even if that starter is starter in name only and is hardly etched in stone for the future--to be thinking that he's going to lose his job on account of a bad game or two. Even saying "you're the starter until I say otherwise" sounds a little less dicey to one's ears even if it actually isn't.


And conversely, you don't want him getting all pissy if he thinks he played well but the manager goes with a different guy for whatever reason the next day.

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Apr 04 2014 02:45 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Lefty Specialist wrote:
"Ike Davis, your role is to sit your ass on the bench."



"and think about your favorite restaurants in Pittsburgh."

Ashie62
Apr 04 2014 04:25 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Would this mean Ike heads to the minors again?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr
Apr 04 2014 04:28 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote:
Lefty Specialist wrote:
"Ike Davis, your role is to sit your ass on the bench."



"and think about your favorite restaurants in Pittsburgh."


Can you blame Ike for being upset at this treatment? Such a waste.

I mean, everything tastes the same after three Jager bombs.

John Cougar Lunchbucket
Apr 04 2014 04:37 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Lololollo

Nymr83
Apr 04 2014 08:20 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

How dare you doubt Collins???

batmagadanleadoff
Apr 04 2014 10:10 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

Who the hell can tell what Collins wants people to think, including Ike and Looook?

“Well, again, only time will tell,” Collins said of Davis’s future role. “He may be the first baseman next week. I know you guys, that’s why I don’t want to say anything because everything is etched in stone around here. Make one statement, it’s a headline. This is not a headline. It’s a move we’re going to make for a while and see what happens to try and get some consistent at-bats and see if Lucas can do what we all thought he can do. If he doesn’t, then we’ve got another option.”


And does Ike think the game was rigged all along?

“It was a supposed competition ...."


[fimg=333]http://a1.nyt.com/assets/foundation/20140331-134620/images/logos/nyt-logo-185x26.svg[/fimg]

Starting Duda Pays Off as Mets Win Their First

By JORGE ARANGURE Jr.APRIL 4, 2014

In the midst of a miserable first week of the season, the Mets tried to eliminate at least one potential controversy by naming Lucas Duda as the starting first baseman on Friday. The protracted battle between Duda and Ike Davis threatened to be a distraction to a team fraught with bullpen, hitting and attendance issues.

Before the game, Duda said that the more regularly he played, the more comfortable he was likely to feel at the plate.

As if proving his point, Duda’s two home runs helped the Mets to their first win of the season, 4-3, over the Cincinnati Reds. Jenrry Mejia struck out a career-high eight batters in six innings to get the win.

“It’s just one day,” Duda said, playing down his performance. He added, “I was just glad to play.”

In his second at bat, with the Mets trailing, 1-0, in the fourth, Duda walloped a two-run shot against Reds starter Mike Leake that landed in the Mets’ bullpen. In the sixth, with the Mets holding a 2-1 lead, Duda hit a line drive two-run homer to right field against Leake to widen the margin, no small thing for a team whose bullpen had allowed 11 earned runs in nine and a third innings heading into Friday’s game. Sure enough, reliever John Lannan allowed two runs in the seventh, but Duda’s two home runs proved to be enough.

“We needed it as a team immensely,” Manager Terry Collins said of Duda’s night. “As I’ve said, sometimes it’s just about confidence. When you feel good about yourself, you can do what you’re supposed to do.”

Duda might need several more nights like Friday to secure the job permanently. Collins said before the game that the Mets could revisit the situation later in the season.

“Well, again, only time will tell,” Collins said of Davis’s future role. “He may be the first baseman next week. I know you guys, that’s why I don’t want to say anything because everything is etched in stone around here. Make one statement, it’s a headline. This is not a headline. It’s a move we’re going to make for a while and see what happens to try and get some consistent at-bats and see if Lucas can do what we all thought he can do. If he doesn’t, then we’ve got another option.”

In his four-plus-year career in New York, Duda has never played more than 43 games at first. Most often, he was asked to play the outfield, where his defensive struggles were epic.

Both Davis and Duda entered spring training with the belief that they could earn the starting job, but both ended up missing a portion of the spring with injuries, Duda with a strained left hamstring and Davis with stiffness in his right calf. In a limited sample this spring, Davis had an .830 on-base plus slugging percentage in 29 at-bats, while Duda had a .748 O.P.S. in 27 at-bats.

Despite getting limited looks at both players, Collins said he entered this season knowing that Duda was going to be his starting first baseman. But he also wanted to give Davis, who started the season opener, an opportunity to play against the Washington Nationals, against whom he has a career .827 O.P.S.

Davis said he was not surprised to find out that Duda would replace him for now.

“It was a supposed competition, so there was going to be a winner and there’s only two choices,” Davis said.

The Mets reportedly tried to trade Davis this spring, but found no takers as a result of his disappointing 2013 season, when he hit .205. A strong surge at the plate by Duda — and Friday was a great start — will help Collins resolve what could turn into tricky situation, with two players who believe they should be the starting first baseman.

“Our job is not to give players away,” Collins said of the possibility of trading Davis, adding: “This is partly a business, too. So when you say he should go someplace else, yeah, maybe he should. But there’d better be something coming back that you can use that’s of same value.”

But the Mets might take whatever they can get for Davis if Duda has more nights like Friday’s.


http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/05/sport ... .html?_r=0

Edgy MD
Apr 04 2014 10:18 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

That last sentence doesn't particularly make a whole lot of sense.

Ceetar
Apr 05 2014 05:52 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

Davis wrote:
“It was a supposed competition, so there was going to be a winner and there’s only two choices,” Davis said.


"uhh..sorry Josh" he added.

TransMonk
Apr 05 2014 09:46 PM
Re: First Base, 2014

5 games in...Duda and Davis tied for the team lead in RBI.

sharpie
Apr 06 2014 09:52 AM
Re: First Base, 2014

and Davis to start today.