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Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

Mex17 Dec 07 2013 01:53 PM

You can argue that a Davis/Murphy package gets him. The O's can move Machado back to shortstop, keep Chris Davis at DH (I'm not sure how C. Davis is defensively, but I know that Ike gives you good defense), play Murphy at third, and Jonathan Schoop at second. For a player they can lose as a free agent in a year, they get two players who are still under team control (albiet arbitration eligible) for the next few years. The Mets get a clear upgrade at shortstop (while not trading any pitching) and can throw second base into a three-way competition between Eric Young, Flores, and Tejada. Hardy is due $7 million next year. Murphy and Davis combined are estimated to get $9 million between them in arbitration.

Gwreck Dec 07 2013 02:17 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

This would be a great trade for the Mets.

Edgy MD Dec 07 2013 02:27 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

'Ceptin' they would lose Hardy in a year, too.

smg58 Dec 07 2013 02:57 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

His performance is up and down. His last six seasons include two excellent years, two mediocre years, and two years that are worse than we can get from Tejada. Not sure I'd pay for that.

Benjamin Grimm Dec 07 2013 03:19 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

And that clear upgrade at shortstop would be linked to a clear downgrade at second base.

Gwreck Dec 07 2013 04:10 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

It depends on what who we would put at second base. There is no doubt in my mind that Hardy + replacement level second baseman is superior to Tejada/Murphy.

Frayed Knot Dec 07 2013 04:16 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

I don't see the Orioles wanting Ike. Their Davis is quite fine defensively and is barely older than ours with only one less year of club control (two years rather than three)

Edgy MD Dec 07 2013 04:21 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

It depends on what who we would put at second base. There is no doubt in my mind that Hardy + replacement level second baseman is superior to Tejada/Murphy. Hmmm, I imagine I have a doubt or two. Grass is greener and all. On the hand of the opposite side, though, I feel confident that whoever they choose among Young, Satin, Tovar, and Tejada, Flores would probably be above replacement level. But yeah, how do we expect the Baltimores will go for this?

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Dec 07 2013 08:11 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

smg58 wrote: His performance is up and down. His last six seasons include two excellent years, two mediocre years, and two years that are worse than we can get from Tejada. Not sure I'd pay for that. You're speaking in terms of the batwork. The thing is, though, that Hardy is also excellent defensively, and gives you 1-2 wins of value per season just with the glove; when he's decent offensively, he's a Murph-level player, and when he's good offensively? WHOO boy... then, he's basically Sugar Pants having a middling year. Which is to say, an All-Star. The only thing is... I'm not sure this is enough to snag Hardy, not in terms of value, but in terms of fit. By bringing in Ike and losing a shortstop, the O's would actually lose lineup flexibility, really.

Ashie62 Dec 08 2013 12:38 AM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

Some scenarios include Ike going to Baltimore. It is starting to feel like Ike Davis is borderline unmoveable. Regarding J.J. Hardy? meh....

smg58 Dec 08 2013 10:56 AM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

I would agree that two of Hardy's last six season were All-Star caliber (especially when defense is factored in). But two of those seasons were also worse than what Tejada did for us in 2011 and 2012. You have to factor in both sides of Hardy' stats when you decide what one year of him is worth.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Dec 08 2013 07:10 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

Sure, I'll stipulate that his floor-- during two injury- and weird-management-decision-shortened seasons-- is just below Ruben Tejada's thus-far-demonstrated ceiling. Said floor hasn't been scraped in three-plus years. The other four of the last six (six of the last eight, really) were at least 3-win-plus seasons. It's disingenuous to call it his "other side," as if he's played poorly half the time; he was iffy/hurt for the better part of two seasons a half-decade ago. He was good-to-great before, and he's good-to-great now.

Vic Sage Dec 09 2013 12:38 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

i'd take Hardy. Shoeless Joe Hardy.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Dec 09 2013 09:14 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

Hmm. HMMM. Adam Rubin wrote: The Baltimore Orioles are among the teams looking "hard" at Daniel Murphy, Joel Sherman reports.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Dec 09 2013 09:15 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

A Muffy-Hardy deal would be nice.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Dec 09 2013 09:18 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

A Muffy-Hardy deal might get me thinking stupid, stupid, hopeful thoughts about the future.

Ashie62 Dec 10 2013 10:25 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

Other than getting an OF that has power Sandy has done what to..??? rectify SS....Get an SP...a durable C nothing I can see....

Benjamin Grimm Dec 11 2013 04:08 AM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

It's December 11.

Edgy MD Dec 11 2013 07:20 AM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

Why do people confuse a closed transaction with activity?

Centerfield Dec 11 2013 07:41 AM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

It's December 11. I'm willing to give him until December 13, at 2:38 p.m. Not a minute more.

Ashie62 Dec 11 2013 09:41 AM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

Edgy MD wrote: Why do people confuse a closed transaction with activity? Cause its the Mets...

Edgy MD Dec 11 2013 09:45 AM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

That doesn't make any sense in the world. Do you really believe "the Mets" are all in Florida fucking around and getting drunk and not working to improve the team? That the offseason has been a festival of carnality and leisure with little activity to speak of except for half-thought-out contract thrown at Granderson to make it look like you did some work for the year-end report? You can't possibly think this.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Dec 11 2013 12:46 PM Re: Let's talk about J.J. Hardy

No, but now I'm picturing Alderson's idea of carnality and leisure, and I want to Brillo pad my brainpan.