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Tulo Temps

It's never gonna happen. I'd be SHOCKED to learn I am wrong.

4 votes

It's unlikely. I'd be surprised.

15 votes

It could happen. I wouldn't be surprised, just as I wouldn't be surprised to learn there was nothing there.

2 votes

It's probably going to happen. I see forces aligning.

0 votes

Gotta happen. It makes sense like nothing else. Other things that didn't make sense will suddenly MAKE sense once this destined deal happens.

0 votes

Edgy MD Jul 28 2014 02:11 PM

More reputable sources (Jeff F. Passan, are you reputable?) continue to run with reports of the Mets making serious inquiries about serious shortstop Troy Tulowitzki. I'm too old to get excited by anything less than a bird in the hand, but I guess I hear gears moving. What do you think is going to happen with the Mets and this oft-injured Hall of Fame-quality talent? [fimg=600:1hghcp60]http://ts4.mm.bing.net/th?id=HN.607988904863532519&pid=15.1&P=0[/fimg:1hghcp60]

batmagadanleadoff Jul 28 2014 02:22 PM Re: Tulo Temps

I'd vote "It could happen but I'd be surprised", which is not an option. Do the Rockies need pitching? I haven't been following. But if the Rockies do, and really, who doesn't, the Mets have surplus young arms with high ceilings in such quantities that you'd think this was 1967 and Whitey Herzog was shaping the Mets development system. [fimg=444:v5y22i78]http://hunkereddowninbrooklyn.files.wordpress.com/2014/05/disraeli-gears.jpg[/fimg:v5y22i78]

smg58 Jul 28 2014 02:34 PM Re: Tulo Temps

It's very tough to say. Tulo and Cargo have been the subject of rumors for several years, mainly because the Rockies always look like sellers, but they're both under reasonable contracts for quite some time. I'm not sure how dealing either of them would speed up their rebuilding process, but then again they've had both of them long enough that should have a lot more to show for it than they do. I'm not expecting anything, but you absolutely have to ask about Tulowitski -- getting him would make getting Piazza seem underwhelming in comparison.

Ceetar Jul 28 2014 02:39 PM Re: Tulo Temps

I sometimes wonder if like ESPN whispers to a writer "hey, we need something to talk about, start up a trade rumor for us. big guy." I mean as far as I can see the Mets may have inquired as to the availability of said players. The Rockies have hinting they'd possible be willing to move him, but there are about a billion hurdles before we get to the "The Mets and Rockies are nearing a deal" I mean, we're getting close to the deadline now so anything's possible. They certainly are going to be taking offers and passing offers along to the other suitors to try to get someone to top it. But we're probably at the initial stage where they've thrown out an initial price and people are calling their backers but no one's come close to actually meeting, much less exceeding, the initial price. So yeah. the second one.

d'Kong76 Jul 28 2014 02:45 PM Re: Tulo Temps Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jul 28 2014 02:50 PM

What is he DL'd for this time?

d'Kong76 Jul 28 2014 02:49 PM Re: Tulo Temps

I took #2

Edgy MD Jul 28 2014 03:00 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Ceetar wrote: I sometimes wonder if like ESPN whispers to a writer "hey, we need something to talk about, start up a trade rumor for us. big guy." Except we're days from the trade deadline. Nobody has to fabricate anything in order to pursue a story.

Ceetar Jul 28 2014 03:07 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Edgy MD wrote: Ceetar wrote: I sometimes wonder if like ESPN whispers to a writer "hey, we need something to talk about, start up a trade rumor for us. big guy." Except we're days from the trade deadline. Nobody has to fabricate anything in order to pursue a story. Trade deadline ain't what it used to be. Besides, this story's been going on a week now. Has it actually heated up as we approach the deadline or is it one of those recursive buzz feeding the rumor feeding the buzz stories? That's all I mean, that it sometimes feels like there's a collective push to over-indulge in certain rumors.

Frayed Knot Jul 28 2014 03:09 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Some Tulo-facts so as to help you along * Contract runs thru 2020 plus an option for 2021: $20/per thru 2019; $14 mil in 2020; $15mil in 2021 or $4mil buyout. IOW, approx $123mil with the remainder of this year's money and assuming the buyout * [u:1f3rsgus]Can only be traded once[/u:1f3rsgus] during the length of the contract, IOW acquiring team effectively inherits a N-T situation even though there's no clause now and he will not reach 10/5 rights until this deal is just about up * Turns 30 in October - about the same age as Wright was when he was signed. The two deals will run concurrently and end at the same time * Has missed 210 games over the past four seasons (2010-2013) and around 300 (and counting) since 2008 - IOW, between 10-15% of the time (or close to 2 full seasons) over the last 7 years * Is from southern California so naturally his dream is to succeed Derek Jeter in the Bronx ... or so it is assumed.

Ashie62 Jul 28 2014 03:41 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Tulo is injured more than Reyes was.. #1

d'Kong76 Jul 28 2014 03:47 PM Re: Tulo Temps

And I refuse to call him Tulo no matter where he ends up!

Edgy MD Jul 28 2014 03:55 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Ashie62 wrote: Tulo is injured more than Reyes was.. #1 Well, that depends on how you frame the question, I imagine. He certainly is good more than Reyes was.

batmagadanleadoff Jul 28 2014 04:10 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Frayed Knot wrote: Some Tulo-facts so as to help you along * Contract runs thru 2020 plus an option for 2021: $20/per thru 2019; $14 mil in 2020; $15mil in 2021 or $4mil buyout. IOW, approx $123mil with the remainder of this year's money and assuming the buyout * Can only be traded once during the length of the contract, IOW acquiring team effectively inherits a N-T situation even though there's no clause now and he will not reach 10/5 rights until this deal is just about up I forgot to consider TT's contract when I first posted in this thread. On second thought, this ain't happening. I suppose.

TransMonk Jul 28 2014 04:22 PM Re: Tulo Temps

A trade for Tulo doesn't sound very "Sandy" to me (or modern-day "Wilpon", for that matter). But it would fit a current need very nicely. I went with #2. I'd be surprised, but not upset.

metirish Jul 28 2014 05:36 PM Re: Tulo Temps

d'Kong76 wrote: I took #2 me too....

themetfairy Jul 28 2014 05:50 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Me three.

metsmarathon Jul 28 2014 06:47 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Of COURSE it's going to happen. Otherwise why would the internet be speculating about it? The internet never guesses wrong guys. If this doesn't pan out, it's all because Jeff opened up his stupid cereal-filled mouth and ruined the goddamn thing.

bmfc1 Jul 28 2014 07:00 PM Re: Tulo Temps

O'Connor found a way to rip Tulowitzki and praise Jeter: http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/story/_ ... erek-jeter

Frayed Knot Jul 28 2014 07:11 PM Re: Tulo Temps

O'Connor found a way to rip Tulowitzki and praise Jeter: http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/story/_ ... erek-jeter From that piece: Tulowitzki has made it fairly clear he wants to play Jeter's position, in Jeter's house, in 2015, and by taking in [the game] among 45,062 fellow fans, he all but rented a plane and put it in writing across the Bronx sky. Has Tulowitzki really "made it clear" or is it more O'Connor (Jeter's biographer don't forget) and his fellow writers inviting the story they want to see? And if TT really is pining to succeed Jeter in the Bronx then he shouldn't have signed a contract to play in Denver that runs until Jeter turns 63. Guess what players?: those lengthy contracts have drawbacks to them as well as (ridiculous) upsides and you have to live with them both.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 28 2014 07:12 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Thassa long, long, big contract to eat.

Edgy MD Jul 28 2014 07:19 PM Re: Tulo Temps

O'Connor deeming him un-worthy ("Jeter's position"? Really?) only serves to grease the skids to Flushing. It's a long deal, but he's got a lot more chance of living up to it than Johan Santana (for instance) ever had of living up to his.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 28 2014 07:24 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Oh, I don't mean I wouldn't want to pay it. I mean, it's a long, big contract for these guys to take on.

Fman99 Jul 28 2014 07:24 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Trust me, you can't get "too low."

Edgy MD Jul 28 2014 08:14 PM Re: Tulo Temps

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Oh, I don't mean I wouldn't want to pay it. I mean, it's a long, big contract for these guys to take on. I don't believe, if they believe he's worth it, according to their calculus, they wouldn't pay it. Whether he is worth it, and whether he's worth the package that Colorady will ask, that's certainly another question.

Gwreck Jul 28 2014 08:43 PM Re: Tulo Temps

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Thassa long, long, big contract to eat. But costs no draft picks the way a FA signing would. Besides, we have comitted ownership in the biggest media market in the country, of course.

Ceetar Jul 28 2014 08:44 PM Re: Tulo Temps

d'Kong76 wrote: And I refuse to call him Tulo no matter where he ends up! I'm pretty sure he's only called Tulo because people are too lazy to figure out how to spell Tulowitzki

Edgy MD Jul 28 2014 08:57 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Gwreck wrote: LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Thassa long, long, big contract to eat. But costs no draft picks the way a FA signing would. Besides, we have comitted ownership in the biggest media market in the country, of course. Oh, man, are you gonna be sorry when Fred comes home.

bmfc1 Jul 29 2014 05:42 AM Re: Tulo Temps

All the NY writers quickly say that Tulowitzki wears "2" for Jeter. Maybe that's true to an extent, but his name isn't "Eightowitzski".

Edgy MD Jul 30 2014 01:49 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Off day on July 30, coming off a winning series. I imagine something is being bandied about, if only a present-for-present deal, like Bartolo-for-an-outfielder.

Benjamin Grimm Jul 30 2014 02:13 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Jon Heyman wrote: The Rockies and Mets haven't gotten off the ground on talk about Colorado superstars Troy Tulowitzki and Carlos Gonzalez, so any chance to do a deal will likely have to wait for the winter. "Unless we do speed dating, I think that's safe to say [that any deal will wait until winter]," one person involved in the limited talks said. There was a suggestion that the Rockies were waiting for a call Monday that never came, but a Mets person denied they neglected to call. In any case, all sides agree that there has been nothing beyond base touching here. The Rockies believe the Mets are one of the teams that matches up well with them since New York has an impressive list of pitching prospects. Ultimately, the Mets don't see themselves as likely to land Tulowitzki -- "he wants to be a Yankee" one Mets person said, stating what has becoming obvious -- so Gonzalez will presumably be the main focus of talks once they hook up.

Edgy MD Jul 30 2014 02:21 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Googling "rumors" + "Bartolo Colon," I see reported interest coming from Kansas City and, well, Kansas City.

Frayed Knot Jul 30 2014 03:08 PM Re: Tulo Temps Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jul 30 2014 03:11 PM

KC is close to WC and/or division contention (Tigers looking beatable these days) and should be in "go for it" mode, so they'd make sense from a logic POV. Have no idea about their higher prospects right now as they "graduated" or traded many of them in the last year or three. The good thing about Bartolo from the acquiring team's side is that he's signed through next season and so isn't just a two month rental. The bad thing about Bartolo from the acquiring team's side is that he's signed through next season and so isn't just a two month rental.

batmagadanleadoff Jul 30 2014 03:10 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Jon Heyman wrote: Ultimately, the Mets don't see themselves as likely to land Tulowitzki -- "he wants to be a Yankee" one Mets person said.... Funny how this didn't thwart the Mets successful pursuit of Carlos Beltran. It's MetSpeak for "we're broke and can't afford Tulo, right?

Ceetar Jul 30 2014 04:31 PM Re: Tulo Temps

batmagadanleadoff wrote: Benjamin Grimm wrote: Jon Heyman wrote: Ultimately, the Mets don't see themselves as likely to land Tulowitzki -- "he wants to be a Yankee" one Mets person said.... Funny how this didn't thwart the Mets successful pursuit of Carlos Beltran. It's MetSpeak for "we're broke and can't afford Tulo, right? It's generally code for "we're trying to create a bidding war, raise your offer" I'm sure they tell the Yankees he wants to be a Dodger.

Lefty Specialist Jul 30 2014 04:42 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Sorry kids, we're gonna do this on the cheap. Tulo will go elsewhere, and the Yanks are just too perfect a fit once St. Jeter leaves.

Edgy MD Jul 30 2014 04:57 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Frayed Knot wrote: KC is close to WC and/or division contention (Tigers looking beatable these days) and should be in "go for it" mode, so they'd make sense from a logic POV. Have no idea about their higher prospects right now as they "graduated" or traded many of them in the last year or three. The good thing about Bartolo from the acquiring team's side is that he's signed through next season and so isn't just a two month rental. The bad thing about Bartolo from the acquiring team's side is that he's signed through next season and so isn't just a two month rental. Well, I was thinking not about prospects but about the likelihood of an equal-footing trade, present value for present value. I can live with Tulowitzki and his coif and I can happily live without him, but I couldn't give a barnful of shits about what Jon Heyman says some "Mets source" says about Tulowitzki's desires.

batmagadanleadoff Jul 30 2014 05:36 PM Re: Tulo Temps

I'm not so sold on TT either. He's gonna hit 30. Shortstops tend to fade earlier (but they can be shifted easier). I see a Coors effect here (not that TT's a bad shortstop -- but I'm not convinced he's as great as they say he is). Still, TT would be a monumental upgrade over the Mets current SS, a position that might be the team's biggest hole. And any doubt or disagreement as to what the Mets biggest hole is is further proof of how flawed the present Mets are. As usual with the Mets in the present, it comes down to money more than it should. I find it difficult to discuss the probability of the Mets acquiring TT without this post turning into another rant on the Mets finances. It can't be ignored, even though I get the sense that many here are sick and tired of the topic. But whaddyagonnado? Pretend that if only TT weren't a Yankee fan, he'd be a Met tomorrow? I've got no problem with the Mets, for once, getting bang for their buck ... maximizing output with minimal payroll levels. That's fine if they can pull it off. But I don't think they should have to take that approach. Mainly because it's harder to win with smaller payrolls. And also, because they're the NY franchise. Some posters here say we shouldn't count the Mets pocketbook. I say: Why not? They're counting our pocketbooks. Their ticket prices are among baseball's highest, as are their food, concession and parking fees. That alone probably obligates them, at least ethically, to maintain a high payroll commensurate with the geographic region they play in. If they can't, they shouldn't be allowed to own the team. There's plenty other Masters of the Universe interested in owning the Mets. What's in it for me if the Mets can succeed with one of baseball's lower payrolls? They're not gonna mail me a dividend. They're not gonna lower their prices either. It ain't my money they're hoarding to pay the electricity. So spend or get the hell out, I say.

Ceetar Jul 30 2014 06:47 PM Re: Tulo Temps

If money is no object, yes, you take Tulo (provided you don't have to mortgage EVERYTHING about the farm) and if he breaks you don't bat an eye. But _most_ teams don't work that way. The question isn't if Tulo's cost is worth the value upgrade over Tejada, but if it's the best option altogether. Perhaps there's a different SS (I would've signed Peralta) that is drastically less money and prospects and still bridges 75% of the difference in Tejada and Tulowizki. Then you upgrade elsewhere and have a pretty nice offense. There's no one way to build a good team and just picking the (second) biggest hole in the offense and shoving the biggest peg in isn't always the best one.

Frayed Knot Jul 30 2014 07:17 PM Re: Tulo Temps

One of the more common complaints from back in the days when the Mets DID consistently have one of the higher payrolls in MLB was: 'well sure they spend, but they don't spend it in the right places or for the right players'. And with Tulowitzki hitting many of the topics--turning 30, oft-injured, Coors-inflated, lengthy contract, paying for his twenties but getting his thirties, will require money AND players to obtain--which can and will be cited, if and when he fails to live up to expectations, as proof that even a retarded gorilla coulda/shoulda have known he was the wrong guy at the wrong time, both trading for or NOT trading for this guy lays the groundwork for complaints no matter what happens. The only question remains whether those complaints will read: 'They're too Cheap' or, 'They're so Stupid". In short, I really don't care what they do and I don't believe Tulo is going to be dealt this week anyway (he may very well be on the winter-time block). Of course obtaining him will strengthen the club as SS but it's virtually by definition going to weaken them elsewhere, how much depends on who and how many get sent the other way. As far as the money, I don't pretend to know what the team's finances look like now or in the future or what the constraints are. I've never cared much how much these players make except to the degree that if affects what other moves can be made and, make no mistake, any time ANY team imports a $125 million commitment it is going to affect other moves.

Mets Guy in Michigan Jul 30 2014 09:23 PM Re: Tulo Temps

The Mets can't win in these situations. They're getting beat up and called cheap for not acquiring a player they're only rumored to be actively chasing -- and who is hurt as we speak. This seems to be an entire storyline created by columnists leading to the inevitable Mets mockery and Yankee love.

Edgy MD Jul 30 2014 09:42 PM Re: Tulo Temps

Meanwhile, dawn.

batmagadanleadoff Jul 30 2014 10:45 PM Re: Tulo Temps

One of the more common complaints from back in the days when the Mets DID consistently have one of the higher payrolls in MLB was: 'well sure they spend, but they don't spend it in the right places or for the right players'. And with Tulowitzki hitting many of the topics--turning 30, oft-injured, Coors-inflated, lengthy contract, paying for his twenties but getting his thirties, will require money AND players to obtain--which can and will be cited, if and when he fails to live up to expectations, as proof that even a retarded gorilla coulda/shoulda have known he was the wrong guy at the wrong time, both trading for or NOT trading for this guy lays the groundwork for complaints no matter what happens. The only question remains whether those complaints will read: 'They're too Cheap' or, 'They're so Stupid". In short, I really don't care what they do and I don't believe Tulo is going to be dealt this week anyway (he may very well be on the winter-time block). Of course obtaining him will strengthen the club as SS but it's virtually by definition going to weaken them elsewhere, how much depends on who and how many get sent the other way. As far as the money, I don't pretend to know what the team's finances look like now or in the future or what the constraints are. I've never cared much how much these players make except to the degree that if affects what other moves can be made and, make no mistake, any time ANY team imports a $125 million commitment it is going to affect other moves. I agree with your whole post. I wasn't advocating for a TT acquisition. I think it's pointless anyway because my gut sez the Mets can't afford him, whether I'd want him or not. So if it's pointless, what's the point? Not that I'm hot for TT, but I think he's not in their price range. Granted, I don't know what the Mets finances are. I simply read the Times and the tabloids and Megdal and figure that Saul Katz probably really did say that he wants out .. and whatever Fred and Jeff say about their money, I assume that the opposite is true ... I mix it all together and look at the last coupl'a years of Mets payroll and figure that it's bleak and it's gonna be bleak for a few more years. But what do I know? Broke for the Mets isn't like broke for me and you. I'm just saying that the Mets payroll level is a disgrace. And if people think the Mets can't win a discussion whenever a top tier (i.e. expensive) player is mentioned as a potential Mets target, well that's the way it should be .. the Mets shouldn't come out looking good in those discussions. They shouldn't win. Because their payroll is a disgrace. And if their finances really are as bad as I think, really as bad as the sources I read claim it is, then they shouldn't bring up these stories about how they asked the Rockies to keep them in mind as far as TT goes. Because if they're that broke, then they can't afford TT, and the idea that they asked to be kept in the TT pipeline was probably just another PR ruse to make everybody think they're flush again.

Gwreck Jul 31 2014 12:40 AM Re: Tulo Temps

Setting money aside, there are basically see three ways to get top-tier talent: a. draft and develop; b. sign as free agent (which costs draft picks); or c. trade (which costs prospects). The Mets have had several notable failures in category 'b" and that is likely where the issue of "spending money poorly" comes from. Those failures are the most frustrating. Failures in category "c" are much more tolerable, in my opinion. Additionally, while past results are no guarantee of future performance, I like the Mets' chances in category "c" a lot more. Examples that come to mind: the Roberto Alomar trade was a bust, but nobody the Mets traded away ever amounted to anything. The Carlos Delgado trade: nothing doing with those prospects; all it cost the Mets was money. I like the Mets' chances to compete for playoff spots in 2015 and 2016 with one or two big supplements to the core team they've developed. I'm fully prepared to trade away a Syndergaard or similar prospect to acquire Tulowitzki's contract. So what if the Mets get only 2-3 good years from Tulowitzki and then have sunk costs at the end of the contract? That's where the financial advantage to playing in New York comes in. Ownership should be able to eat that cost, especially if the acquisition pays off in playoff appearance(s). Losing one (or even two) prospects but no draft picks sounds like a fine way of improving the team at this point.

bmfc1 Jul 31 2014 05:35 AM Re: Tulo Temps

I concur with Gwreck. The Mets are getting there but do not have a major league SS at present or on the horizon. FA or a trade are the only ways to get one for '15. Perhaps the Mets will try for another short term solution in LF next year while they wait for Nimmo or Conforto but SS is the #1 priority.

Frayed Knot Jul 31 2014 07:04 AM Re: Tulo Temps

Gwreck wrote: Losing one (or even two) prospects but no draft picks sounds like a fine way of improving the team at this point. In general I'd rather lose draft picks than prospects. MOST draft picks fail, even 1st rounders. Prospects on the other hand (meaning those high up on a team's depth chart) are those who virtually by definition have reached a point where they've survived the weeding out process that eats up the majority of picks and turn them into guys who either never will make the majors or will wind up as part-timers and roster filler. Odds are that most if not al of your next ten 1st rounders never reach the point where they have the promise that Syndergaard has now. There are a ton of other factors involved of course, not all draft picks the same anymore than all prospects are, but I wouldn't be so willing to deal those who have in effect already succeeded twice: getting drafted in the first place then going on to shine through the minor league system, while holding on to some future somebody who is only now approaching step one of that process. Draft picks are also much further away, so if you're looking to contend in '15/'16 then leave the gun and take the cannoli. As far as the more general points: * Do I want to upgrade at SS? -- SURE. * Should we look into Tulowitzki? -- Absolutely. But at the same time there's always trouble if/when you get yourself into a mindset where you think you HAVE TO HAVE THIS PLAYER and you have to have him NOW!!! costs be damned. Fans and media (sometimes for different reasons) tend to get hung up on snagging the prettiest girl at the dance as if she makes all others not even worthy of consideration. * Who should we give up? -- Everything's negotiable / don't rule out anything / but always be willing to walk away. There'll be another bus along after this one, and another one after that, and if they run out of buses then there are other ways to get to work. There's a difference between not being able to afford Tulowitzki and thinking it's not a wise investment even though you could afford him. * which of course brings us to: MONEY! -- Sure, a NYC market team SHOULD be able to have a higher payroll. But if the stories about the team losing money are true--because they have to pay down the cost of their new stadium, because they built just as the economy tanked, because they over-estimated the projections of fans x seat prices at the new stadium (see: economy), because SNY isn't the windfall they thought, because their rainy-day money flew the coop w/Madoff, because they've gone ultra-conservative in their approach since Madoff, because the Madoff prosecutor was much more aggressive than they thought in trying to re-coup lost money from them, because of past bad deals (Bonilla, Bay, Santana), and yadda, yadda, yadda--then we can say SHOULD all we want but if the money's not there then the money's not there. Now maybe things have turned the corner and the 'Pons are looking over their grounds optimistically saying "Tomorrow is Another Day" like a couple of cereal-eating Scarlett O'Haras, but I have no idea. The bottom line (no pun intended ... well maybe it was) is that I don't get myself all worked up over what the payroll level should be because I don't have the facts to back it up, or where it's going to be in the future because there's nothing I can do about it.

Benjamin Grimm Jul 31 2014 07:29 AM Re: Tulo Temps

Frayed Knot wrote: In general I'd rather lose draft picks than prospects. Me too.

Edgy MD Jul 31 2014 07:32 AM Re: Tulo Temps

I don't think shortstop is the #1 priority. [list:1dqyo9by][*:1dqyo9by]They are performing far higher relative to the league at shortstop than they are in left.[/*:m:1dqyo9by] [*:1dqyo9by]Their shortstop is covered for next year. Their leftfielder (at least, Chris Young) is not.[/*:m:1dqyo9by] [*:1dqyo9by]The market for leftfielders isn't as steep as it is for shortstop, because almost anybody (or any batsman) is a potential leftfielder.[/*:m:1dqyo9by] [*:1dqyo9by]They aren't exactly demonstrably set as center, either. So general outfield depth is a priority.[/*:m:1dqyo9by][/list:u:1dqyo9by] Brandon Nimmo and Dilson Herrera are both probably a year away from appearing. Herrera will probably arrive more fully developed, but not really a shortstop (and Cecchini and Rosario further behind). Nimmo will arrive probably with some growing (read: power development) still to be done, but ready to slot in. So neither should be expected to be instant redemption (no rookie should). But Tejada (and even Wilmer) certainly presents as a more viable bridge to the future at short than Young/Young/Nieuwenhuis/Abreu/den Dekker do in left. An improvement in left field right now would help them a lot more than a similar-level shortstop, and be easier to find at whatever budget they have. Gimme a better leftfielder and you have a contender.

Gwreck Jul 31 2014 07:37 AM Re: Tulo Temps

Outfielders who will be free agents at the end of 2014. Outfielders Norichika Aoki Emilio Bonifacio Melky Cabrera Nelson Cruz Michael Cuddyer Rajai Davis Chris Denorfia Jeff Francoeur Jonny Gomes Franklin Gutierrez Tony Gwynn Jr. Scott Hairston Torii Hunter Raul Ibanez Reed Johnson Darnell McDonald Mike Morse Colby Rasmus Nate Schierholtz Grady Sizemore Seth Smith Alfonso Soriano Ichiro Suzuki Ryan Sweeney Josh Willingham Chris Young Delmon Young

Edgy MD Jul 31 2014 07:44 AM Re: Tulo Temps

Well, I was thinking more along the lines of what the trade market looks like this morning.

Benjamin Grimm Jul 31 2014 07:46 AM Re: Tulo Temps

I'm also on Team Left Field. An improvement at shortstop would be very nice, but an improvement in left field is vital.

Gwreck Jul 31 2014 07:58 AM Re: Tulo Temps

I'm all in favor of upgrading left field too. I just don't see an impact player available at that position the way there (supposedly) is at shortstop with Tulowitzki.* I am unimpressed with that list of free agents. I am unimpressed with the in-house options. I am curious if there are any viable trade options but unaware of any good ideas at this point. *I'd also consider a free-agent signing of Hanley Ramirez in the offseason for shortstop.

Edgy MD Jul 31 2014 08:23 AM Re: Tulo Temps

When you are at the bottom of the league in production at a position, any number of improvements represents an impact player. Marlon Byrd is an impact player. Matt Joyce? Impact player. Álex Ríos? Fuckin' impact player.

Gwreck Jul 31 2014 11:07 AM Re: Tulo Temps

Great. I'll take this opportunity to revise and/or clarify my description of "impact player" to instead be "player of sufficient upgrade to make team into legitimate playoff contender given the mostly solid team core that pre-exists"

Edgy MD Jul 31 2014 11:33 AM Re: Tulo Temps

Well, I think they're a lot closer than you do, I guess. But, as noted in the "Where They Struggle" thread, LF is really... where they struggle. At least at catcher and shortstop, they've improved markedly as the season has progressed.

Edgy MD Jul 31 2014 11:49 AM Re: Tulo Temps

Based on our performance to date, in LF, we're 1.69 standard deviations from the mean, OPS-wise. At shortstop, we're 0.71 standard deviations from the mean. And as I noted, the pool of players who can play left is much larger, so an improvement is not only much easier to find, but the the outlay in pursuit of an improvement is likely to be much smaller. I could well have (perhaps should have) worked with OPS+, rather than OPS, but I think it's safe to say the point would still be supported, if not to the same degree, more or less.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 07 2014 09:47 AM Re: Tulo Temps

What actually happened last month between the NY Mets and Colorado Rockies with Carlos Gonzalez and Troy Tulowitzki? In the days before the trade deadline last week, as a suitable market for Bartolo Colon failed to develop, the limited speculation around the Mets surrounded more exciting and remote possibilities: Colorado Rockies stars Carlos Gonzalez and Troy Tulowitzki. So, now that we’re a week out, let’s dig. What actually happened between the two teams? Did anything get serious? And what is worth watching in the near future? We were interested to learn that the Rockies did a lot of poking around the Mets’ system late last month, sending several top evaluators – including general manager Dan O’Dowd -- to watch their minor league teams. The Rox scouted Noah Syndergaard, specifically, but were also poking around about Rafael Montero, Jacob deGrom, Matt den Dekker, Ruben Tejada and Matt Reynolds, according to people who caught wind of the poking. Said to be seeking power pitching, Colorado is unlikely to be interested in Jon Niese or Dillon Gee. As for actual contact between the two teams, here is exactly what happened, in the recollection of several sources: The Mets reached out in July to express interest in Tulowitzki and Gonzalez, and the Rockies responded that, in general terms, they liked the Mets’ young pitchers. And that was it, for now. This is what is often called a “preliminary discussion,” and was not dissimilar to the chat between Sandy Alderson and then-Marlins GM Larry Beinfest in March 2013 regarding Giancarlo Stanton. Stanton, you might have noticed, is still a Marlin. While talks did not progress last month, it is good to know what happened, as a foundation for the winter wave of reports and speculation involving these players. Tulowitzki is preparing for a winter that might bring a trade, with the Mets, Yankees, Red Sox and Cardinals appearing on the short list of possible destinations. Still, our reporting leads us to strongly believe that Gonzalez in a more likely addition to the Flushing Nine, in part because of a far more reasonable contract, and fewer years of control. “That is real,” said one Mets person of the interest in Gonzalez. Could the Mets accommodate a more significant leap in payroll and acquire Tulowitzki, owed $126 million through 2019? People around Alderson believe that he would have a chance, if he made a strong case to ownership – but that he is more inclined to present the CarGo option (four years, $60 million), especially if he can dump most of Colon’s $11 million salary on another team. And remember, it is more likely that the Mets retain all of their coveted pitchers, and seek lineup improvements less splashy than those mentioned here. But the Rockies are a team to watch, if Alderson chooses a more aggressive approach. Read more at http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/baseba ... IwI6Ujz.99

Nymr83 Aug 07 2014 10:55 AM Re: Tulo Temps

The Rox scouted Noah Syndergaard, specifically, but were also poking around about Rafael Montero, Jacob deGrom, Matt den Dekker, Ruben Tejada and Matt Reynolds, according to people who caught wind of the poking. Tejada for Tulo! done!

Vic Sage Aug 07 2014 02:02 PM Re: Tulo Temps

i have no interest in CarGo. He's hurt as much as (if not more than) Tulowitzki, and he's basically a Coors hitter, with significant home/road splits. In Citi, even healthy, he'd probably hit .260/20hr/75runs at most, for which they'd have to pay him $20m/yr. And there are more OFers who can hit than SSs.