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Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 29 2015 07:58 AM

So many considerations.... Has Tejada shown you enough that you're comfortable sending Hererra back to Vegas? Gavin Cecchini is really having a good year in Bingo, but he only just turned 21. Reynolds is kinda "eh" with the stick in Vegas, and I don;t believe the Mets feel like he can handle the glove at SS or we may have already seen him. Or is he more of an option today now that he only has to outproduce Tejada? Ideally we'd get a shortstop could also lead off and get Grandy's more productive bat behind him. Looking at the options, we're probably best if we could get Segura from Milwaukee. Miller or Tylor from Seattle? Miller is hitting alright, Taylor was sent to AAA with poor figures. Gregorious of the MFYs is having a terrible year offensively, it'd be a shame to take that away from them. I feel like we have a decent amount of stuff to trade, from Niese, Gee, Montero, Muffy, Tejada, Plawecki ... Lagares? Grandy?? Discuss

TransMonk Jun 29 2015 08:34 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Tejada has a 92 OPS+ while Segura has a 73 OPS+ (in about 100 more ABs). I have to think Ruben is a better defender, too. Miller looks to be offensively better than both...but I have not seen him with my eyeballs and could not pick him out of a police lineup. Before making any moves, I would want to see that Muffy can stay healthy and that Tejada cannot hold down the position himself. Personally, I think this team has several other areas of need to fill before I'd start picking on Ruben.

TheOldMole Jun 29 2015 08:45 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Tulo's healthy so far.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 29 2015 12:09 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

There's not nearly enough wild speculation in this thread for my liking. Why don't we do the Dodgers a favor and bring over Jimmy Rollins? Yes he's having a shitty year, he's 36, all that, but if he sucks then you go back to Tejada or Reynolds or Flores or whatever. The Dodgers want to bring that Corey Seager guy up anyway, they can fake it with Turner and Enrique Hernandez and if they really bitch and moan I'll throw in Wilfredo Tovar. They'll probably pay us to take him and he's not committed beyond this year. Gee for Rollins. Who says no?

Frayed Knot Jun 29 2015 12:22 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jun 29 2015 12:22 PM

I believe Jed Lowrie is close to coming off Houston's DL list (torn thumb ligament in April) and will he's be gone they promoted their SS uber-prospect Carlos Correa. They might want Lowrie at 3B instead but every team (with the possible exception of the Nats) would give us something for a piece of our pitching and the switch-hitting Lowrie is 3 years younger than the much-discussed Ben Zobrist and is at least close to as versatile. Lowrie 2013-2015: 1,302 PA; .273/.339/.413 Zobrist 2013-2015: 1,533 PA; .271/.354/.404 Niese + something for Lowrie + possible future leadoff dude Tony Kemp

Ceetar Jun 29 2015 12:22 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Zobrist is my wild speculation guy. Not really a SS but he's played there. won't be worse than Flores.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 29 2015 12:28 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Ceetar wrote: Zobrist is my wild speculation guy. Not really a SS but he's played there. won't be worse than Flores. The only thing wild about your speculation is imagining Zobrist at SS. By this point of a guy's career if he could be trusted to do it he'd have done it. And putting a 23 year old iffy glove at SS to generate some offense is not at all akin to puytting a 34 iffy glove at SS. I'd be interested in that Kemp-Lowrie deal.

Benjamin Grimm Jun 29 2015 12:33 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

If I was John Harper I would say that the Mets should get Starlin Castro, but on the other hand maybe they shouldn't, but then again maybe they should.

Ceetar Jun 29 2015 12:54 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Ceetar wrote: Zobrist is my wild speculation guy. Not really a SS but he's played there. won't be worse than Flores. The only thing wild about your speculation is imagining Zobrist at SS. By this point of a guy's career if he could be trusted to do it he'd have done it. And putting a 23 year old iffy glove at SS to generate some offense is not at all akin to puytting a 34 iffy glove at SS. I'd be interested in that Kemp-Lowrie deal. it's not akin in the 'actually generates offense' avenue. That's more where I'm going with that. The more I think about it though, the more I'm looking for a blockbuster here for a top25 type guy. Fuck these marginal upgrades that small sample size or random luck could make not overly helpful. Gimme Todd Frazier for 3B-LF and move one of Granderson/Cuddyer as a throw in. Syndergaard, Lagares, Colon and .. I dunno, Conforto for McCutchen.

d'Kong76 Jun 29 2015 12:58 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Yeah, I'm more in the bowl-me-over or save-your-shot camp. See wooden peg(s) comment in the other thread.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 29 2015 01:33 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Ceetar wrote: Gimme Todd Frazier for 3B-LF and move one of Granderson/Cuddyer as a throw in. I mean, it'll take Syndergaard or some such, too, but... [Nods head, hard] As far as short goes... how about Niese for Rollins and cash? There's apparently talk the Dodgers are interested in him.

Edgy MD Jun 29 2015 01:36 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Jimmy Rollins may be a Dodger now, but he's playing like a Phillie — which is to say, very poorly and not very cheaply. You want him to be a Met, show me how you are dealing off a burdensome contract at the Mets' end. Like Bonilla or somebody.

Benjamin Grimm Jun 29 2015 01:45 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

I'm not saying the Mets shouldn't trade Niese, but we should be aware that if they do, they'll probably have to be in the market for a starting pitcher over the offseason. Their 2016 rotation would include Harvey, deGrom, Syndergaard, and Matz, but with Niese gone, and Colon sure to be gone, and Gee likely gone, they'll have used up all of that depth that they had this season. Montero would be an internal option, and maybe Logan Verrett, but Wheeler will miss much (or all) of the first half of the season.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jun 29 2015 02:23 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Benjamin Grimm wrote: I'm not saying the Mets shouldn't trade Niese, but we should be aware that if they do, they'll probably have to be in the market for a starting pitcher over the offseason. Their 2016 rotation would include Harvey, deGrom, Syndergaard, and Matz, but with Niese gone, and Colon sure to be gone, and Gee likely gone, they'll have used up all of that depth that they had this season. Montero would be an internal option, and maybe Logan Verrett, but Wheeler will miss much (or all) of the first half of the season. There tend to be more fifth-starter options available each winter/spring than starting shortstops. Edgy MD wrote: Jimmy Rollins may be a Dodger now, but he's playing like a Phillie — which is to say, very poorly and not very cheaply. You want him to be a Met, show me how you are dealing off a burdensome contract at the Mets' end. Like Bonilla or somebody. PSST! LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: As far as short goes... how about Niese for Rollins and cash? There's apparently talk the Dodgers are interested in him. Rollins walks in November, by the by, so this would be strictly a (moderately) cheap rental thing.

Frayed Knot Jun 29 2015 02:25 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Ceetar wrote: The more I think about it though, the more I'm looking for a blockbuster here for a top25 type guy. Fuck these marginal upgrades that small sample size or random luck could make not overly helpful. Syndergaard to the Cubs for Addison Russell -- which side says no or says they want more?

Edgy MD Jun 29 2015 02:45 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Jimmy Rollins may be a Dodger now, but he's playing like a Phillie — which is to say, very poorly and not very cheaply. You want him to be a Met, show me how you are dealing off a burdensome contract at the Mets' end. Like Bonilla or somebody. PSST! LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: As far as short goes... how about Niese for Rollins and cash? There's apparently talk the Dodgers are interested in him. Rollins walks in November, by the by, so this would be strictly a (moderately) cheap rental thing. Well, sure, but that would still represent the Mets likely getting worse. Can the Dodgers throw in three or four wins? There's just so many mixed blessings (and currently, dodged bullets) beneath the Tulowitzki threshold. I'm starting to think the team is focused on Tulo or nobody, except maybe an insurance plan. Tulo is an easy call, if the price can be arranged. Who else, alternatively, is a really tough call to make. I don't know.

Ashie62 Jun 29 2015 04:18 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Jon Niese for Starlin Castro.

Nymr83 Jun 30 2015 10:31 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Ashie62 wrote: Jon Niese for Starlin Castro. I would rather do that then Sydergaard for Russell yeah. but i think the Cubs think they get more than that for him

Vic Sage Jun 30 2015 01:33 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

So far this season, Starlin Castro is the lowest ranked SS in the NL based on WAR and next to last in all of baseball (Flores is at +0.9 WAR; Castro is at -0.4). Plus, he reportedly has some dog in him, and isn't exactly beloved. So no thanks on Castro.

Nymr83 Jun 30 2015 03:16 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

yeah, the problem with upgrading SS is that there isnt really a guy out there who is a clear upgrade on Wilmer Flores assuming the Mets "fully healthy" infield alignment of 3B Wright SS Flores 2B Murphy 1B Duda. I'm not even sure there is a Tejada upgrade that is available in-season at a reasonable cost.

Ashie62 Jun 30 2015 03:41 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

The best value upgrade is a return of David Wright. Correct on Starlin Castro. Geez, the guy is only 25 and it seems 2010 and 2011 will be his career years, Yeesh. Then theres that Tulo guy.

Edgy MD Jun 30 2015 04:32 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Nymr83 wrote: yeah, the problem with upgrading SS is that there isnt really a guy out there who is a clear upgrade on Wilmer Flores assuming the Mets "fully healthy" infield alignment of 3B Wright SS Flores 2B Murphy 1B Duda. I'm not even sure there is a Tejada upgrade that is available in-season at a reasonable cost. There's been some hinting that Alderson might be willing to go for a guy with an un-reasonable cost. Yeah, I know, but I'm just repeating the reporters and reporting the repeaters.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 16 2015 08:33 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Rubie posts (I tend to believe for several reasons) that outside OF help is not forthcoming, unless it's a surprise and we get a center fielder and acknowledge that Lagares is hurt, needs surgery and will miss part of next year too, so, we're getting a shorty. So, bump. Who's it gonna be?

TransMonk Jul 16 2015 08:38 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Did Rubin post that a SS was being sought? I only saw that he thought an OF was NOT going to be brought in. I still think if a move is made in the next two weeks it will be for a benchy/utility dude only.

Benjamin Grimm Jul 16 2015 08:40 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

I'd rather see them get an outfielder. I know that Tejada isn't likely to be productive with the bat over a long stretch, but the Mets infield is pretty decent right now. There's more room for improvement in the outfield.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 16 2015 08:40 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Adam Rubin ?@AdamRubinESPN 19h19 hours ago I think it's pretty clear if the Mets upgrade it's going to be at SS, a versatile player or straight bench. It's not exactly a secret. Edit, today he also says: ...look for something more along the lines of a versatile player (a Ben Zobrist type), shortstop or bench help. And don't count on a big splash, such as Troy Tulowitzki or Starlin Castro. After all, the Mets are not parting with any of their core young starting pitchers. Also, don’t look for an outfielder such as Justin Upton. The Mets do not feel it is a wise use of resources to use their chips on an outfield rental.

Ceetar Jul 16 2015 08:45 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Benjamin Grimm wrote: I'd rather see them get an outfielder. I know that Tejada isn't likely to be productive with the bat over a long stretch, but the Mets infield is pretty decent right now. There's more room for improvement in the outfield. the biggest place to improve right now is second base but the Mets have a myriad of maybes there. They just gave a long term contract to Lagares, Granderson is good, and Cuddyer is good if he's healthy. The outfield is crowded. Plus, despite Nimmo and Conforto probably not being ready, they're not that far off. Kirk and John are good backups. We really don't need a straight outfielder. now Ben Zobrist? sure. I like how the Mets are linked to him and Sandy says "Don't expect an outfielder" like they're not mutually exclusive. i.e. don't believe anything a GM says publicly, and that includes 'leaks'.

d'Kong76 Jul 16 2015 08:49 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Ceetar wrote: We really don't need a straight outfielder. Yeah! Let's get a gay one and put his locker next to Muffy's.

seawolf17 Jul 16 2015 08:50 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

d'Kong76 wrote: Ceetar wrote: We really don't need a straight outfielder. Yeah! Let's get a gay one and put his locker next to Muffy's. LOLOLOLOL

Edgy MD Jul 16 2015 09:12 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

d'Kong76 wrote: Ceetar wrote: We really don't need a straight outfielder. Yeah! Let's get a gay one and put his locker next to Muffy's. See, I had a couple of soft singles that I could have hit on this one, but you muscled up and cleared the Party City Deck.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 16 2015 02:03 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Carig says the Mets are very open sexually or otherwise to outfielders.

Benjamin Grimm Jul 17 2015 02:24 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

The Mets will be aiming high on the offensive front, with Justin Upton and ex-Met property Carlos Gomez said to be on their radar. Upton and Gomez are seen as difference makers in an otherwise less-than-robust offensive market, though Upton, uncharacteristically, hasn't really hit lefthanders this year (.484 OPS) ... They talked to the Brewers about Aramis Ramirez but would only have interest if there's more bad news on David Wright. Mets people are hoping Wright (spinal stenosis) can transition from back rehab in California to Port St. Lucie within a couple weeks, though it's said to very much be "up in the air." If he can't, they will need to get a third baseman, as they prefer to move Daniel Murphy off third ... The Mets may still look at Segura, but he's seen as more of a fallback option for them ... Untouchable for the Mets: the big four pitchers ... The Braves have suggested Uribe, but the Mets haven't shown much interest to this point

TransMonk Jul 17 2015 02:48 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Benjamin Grimm wrote: ... Untouchable for the Mets: the big four pitchers ... That's all I want to hear. I'll be happy with whatever they do (or don't do) as long as they keep the big four intact.

Ashie62 Jul 17 2015 03:02 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

I suspect John Smoltz might agree with you.

Benjamin Grimm Jul 17 2015 03:30 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Of course, only three of the Big Four are tradeable at this point: Syndergaard, Harvey, and deGrom. Matz is on the DL (that's the Disabled List, not the "down low"). And Wheeler, of course, is the fifth guy in the Big Four and he can't be dealt either. I have to say, I wouldn't be too upset if the Mets traded Harvey for a kickass power-hitting outfielder who's 26 years old and three or four years away from free agency.

Edgy MD Jul 17 2015 03:34 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Matz will be off the DL before the deadline hits. And he can also be dealt as a PtBNL. Just a little surprised to hear he's achieved the same untouchability status as their other top pitching assets. Wheeler is no longer particuarly big, it would seem.

Gwreck Jul 17 2015 07:51 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Benjamin Grimm wrote: I have to say, I wouldn't be too upset if the Mets traded Harvey for a kickass power-hitting outfielder who's 26 years old and three or four years away from free agency. If you know of one, please let us know!

Benjamin Grimm Jul 17 2015 08:10 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

I'm probably the last person here who would know of one!

DocTee Jul 18 2015 11:04 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

I'd deal Harvey for Kris Bryant NOW!

Edgy MD Jul 27 2015 07:55 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

Reports bounced around today that the Mets have inquired about Andrelton Simmons, but found the Braves' asking price too high. I think the initial reports came from Buster Olney. Met-hatin' Met fans all over the web scoffed that it must've been a short conversation. But the Braves front office has certainly proven its willingness to deal off the contracts of outsted GM Frank Wren, and I can't see any reason that wouldn't include the arbitration-eliminating deal Simmons signed. He's declined at the plate from mediocre to poor the last two years, even as he's solidified his position as top dog defensively. Anyhow, cool that they inquired a few days before the deadline, giving either party an opportunity to come back to the table.

Zvon Jul 27 2015 10:26 PM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

DocTee wrote: I'd deal Harvey for Kris Bryant NOW! This would be tempting. Especially if Wright is done.

Frayed Knot Aug 05 2015 08:30 AM Re: Let us now resume our pursuit of a new shortstop

So I got to thinking about our pre-season SS wants and as to where some of those dreamboats rank now that we're ~2/3 of the way through the season. As ranked by OPS, ML shortstops with 300+ ABs Ian Desmond = 20th Jean Segura = 21st Alexi Ramirez = 22nd Starlin Castro = 23rd ... that's out of 23 who qualify. Flores (though to be fair not a full-time SS) is 12th and Tejada (45 ABs short of qualifying) would be right behind him.