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Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

John Cougar Lunchbucket Dec 21 2015 03:54 PM

Of all Met managers probably the one I know the least about is Jeff Torborg. I was working nights then, out in the boonies, didn't have cable and the Mets were on the downswing. Most would rate him as one of the least effective skippers they ever had, since he was a high-profile get with a 4-year contract who lasted less than 1.5 years, presiding over a team that lost 90 games and another that would go on to lose 103. I was looking into how he became a Met manager and it's kind of interesting. * The Mets whacked Harrelson late in '91 and Cubbage finished out the year as interim manager. * Torborg had managed Cleveland for 3 years, then the White Sox since '89 where he was the unanimous 1990 MOY when the Sox won 94 games -- a huge improvement from his first year. He was going well enough again in 1991 to have received a contract extension -- although they faltered in August and never caught division-winning Minnesota and finished in 2nd again. * Just days after the season, Torborg was named Mets manager. * There were conflicting reports as to when -- and why -- the White Sox allowed Torborg to be taken out from under them. To my knowledge there was no "compensation" (was there?) as has been the case when managers-under-contract depart from one club to another. * New York Times: The confusion began in earnest last week with reports in Chicago that Jerry Reinsdorf, an owner of the team, had said he would have no objections to the Mets' speaking with Torborg, despite the fact that Torborg had been given a contract extension earlier in the summer. Reinsdorf later said that he had yet to be asked by the Mets, and that reports that he would permit Torborg to discuss a job with the Mets were premature. (snip) .... Al Harazin, the Mets' general manager, who conducted the negotiations with Torborg, said Wednesday night that he had obtained permission to speak with Torborg "some time ago." That comment appeared to suggest that Reinsdorf might have been approached by the Mets -- one theory has Fred Wilpon, the co-owner, playing a major role in the process -- even before Harrelson was dismissed Sept. 28. * Torborg years later: “When he said that I had to think twice about what was happening. Ron [Schueler, Chicago's GM] and I never had a cross word between us that season but he wanted to hire his own guy, so when the Mets called I took the offer. It was the best thing for me financially but it was the worst move professionally I could have made. Ironically about a half hour after I verbally told the Mets I’d take the job the Yankees called and said they were firing “Stump” Merrill and offered me the position. I told them I had already given my word to the Mets and couldn’t go back on it but I didn’t want to leave the Sox in the first place.” Crazy right? The Yankees would make a better decision promoting 3rd-base coach Buck Showalter. And the White Sox did all right with Gene Lamont, who'd "win" the division in '94. Meantime this looks like at least 2 awful Mets managers hired by Fred and given contracts way too long. Any thoughts on how Torborg was as a manager? Memories of his tenure?

Mets Willets Point Dec 21 2015 04:09 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

I remember him being one the lead "villains" of The Worst Team Money Can Buy although that's a biased account. I was at college and not paying much attention to sports at the time.

Edgy MD Dec 21 2015 04:15 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

He wore turtlenecks. And he continued the Mets managers tradition of endorsing whoever their credit card sponsor was, doing a commercial that said, "You know, wometimes I wish I could use my Manufacturers Hanover Visa (or whatever) just to buy a run." (ba-dum, ching)

cooby classic Dec 21 2015 04:21 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

He had spring loaded glasses

Edgy MD Dec 21 2015 04:30 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

I think lying somewhere among Harrelson was better than his reputation suggests; Torborg was worse than we could have possibly expected; and the talent fell off a cliff just as they were transitioning from one to the other is the likely truth, that the burst of success in Harrelson's first year was the last gallon of gas the 1980s Mets had in 'em. Firing the manager wasn't going to change that, and Harrelson's shocking losing record in in 1991 probably shouldn't have been hung totally on him so much as the trajectory the team was heading no matter what.

Benjamin Grimm Dec 21 2015 04:32 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

I mostly remember him for his quote about Bill Pecota.

Lefty Specialist Dec 21 2015 04:45 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

Local boy, went to Westfield, NJ High School and Rutgers. Not a great manager, but he inherited a team in free-fall. Even so, he didn't seem to be able to alter the tailspin much. Says that he has Parkinson's which is a bummer.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Dec 21 2015 04:50 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

Native of Westfield, NJ, our town's high school rival. BLUE DEVILS SUCK! Wore those transitions lenses, like about 2/3 of my uncles. I remember-- not sure how correctly-- a LOT of double-switches, some of them very strange.

Mets Willets Point Dec 21 2015 05:12 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

Edgy MD wrote: And he continued the Mets managers tradition of endorsing whoever their credit card sponsor was, doing a commercial that said, "You know, wometimes I wish I could use my Manufacturers Hanover Visa (or whatever) just to buy a run." (ba-dum, ching) Still sounds better than "Yeah, there's a lot of meat!"

dinosaur jesus Dec 21 2015 05:15 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

I remember him as a nine-foot-tall robot. Torborg the Great. The kids loved him.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Dec 21 2015 05:17 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

Totally off, dj. You're thinking of Dallas Green. Lefty Specialist wrote: Local boy, went to Westfield, NJ High School and Rutgers. Nipped me by a little, as always. JUST LIKE STUPID YUPPIE WESTFIELD.

Frayed Knot Dec 21 2015 05:32 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

I don't remember what first attracted the Mets to him [insert required crack about Dodger connections here], nor why Reinsdorf would have been so indifferent to letting him go [insert line about Reinsdorf being a general asshole here]. My lasting impression is that he was one of Wilpon's 'comfortable' hires, the ones where, like Art Howe years later, Fred seemed to go for the no-sharp-edges type that he thought would put a friendly face up front and bring good pr/community relations above and beyond whatever he brought to the field. To that end (although it's impossible to know how much Fred directed this) Torborg was almost immediately hooked up with WFAN. The all-sports format was still fairly new in those days and it's certainly common enough to have a show with the local manager particularly when the station is also the flagship for the team and the relation between the team & station still in the early lovey-dovey stage. So lovey-dovey in fact that someone thought it would be a good idea if he were on [u:1wh3ocu6]EVERY DAY[/u:1wh3ocu6] for a chat/Q&A with the mid-day hosts: the just then starting to bloom 'Mike and the Mad Dog' show. I remember Lupica took to calling him 'Jeff from Flushing' because he was on at least as often as even the most ambitious callers who were using the still newish medium to spout their views on all things sports. Needless to say the concept grew old after a short span and the weariness of his commitment started to show on air and the feel-good vibe gave way to the occasional testy exchanges which is certainly not what the NYM side of the pairing was hoping for. He also did commercial spots for NEWSDAY although that too ran into a few snags when he questioned a quote or two they ran which put him in the position of essentially claiming the paper he was being paid to tout was lying about something and them calling him a liar for denying it. Proof once again that the moves made largely for pr purposes often produce unintended consequences in the other direction.

Edgy MD Dec 21 2015 05:53 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

Like Art Howe, he was hired right out of another job, where his team had been consistently winning. What could be safer? D'oh! Fun fact: In 2002, Torborg was fired from his job as Miami skipper, with a 16-22 record. His replacement, Jack McKeon, took them to a world championship the next season. This season, Marlins manager Mike Redmond was also fired with a 16-22 record. Not-So-Fun Fact: When Toborg went, his pitching coach Brad Arnsberg went with him. He became so incensed at the news that then-GM Larry Beinfest said he and owner Jeffrey Loria left/fled his home 90 seconds after delivering the news, describing him as abusive and borderline violent, and barring him from coming by the park the next day to pick up his stuff. Funky Fact: Also fired that day was Torborg's son Dale, who served as strength and conditioning coach. As previously observed in this space, Dale Torborg had previously wrestled professionally under the name "The Demon," licensed/hired by KISS, Inc. to take the ring in full Gene Simmons makeup. [fimg=450]http://www.profightdb.com/img/wrestlers/thumbs-600/74003733abkissdemon.jpg[/fimg]

HahnSolo Dec 21 2015 05:56 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

He loved saying "we really hit the dickens out of the ball" on those M&MD interviews. In fact that statement is just about all I remember from his tenure.

G-Fafif Dec 21 2015 06:08 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

Struck me as a self-righteous, not-my-fault parochial school gym teacher of a manager. First Met manager I truly disliked (as opposed to George Bamberger, whom I simply never much warmed to).

Lefty Specialist Dec 21 2015 07:05 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Totally off, dj. You're thinking of Dallas Green. Lefty Specialist wrote: Local boy, went to Westfield, NJ High School and Rutgers. Nipped me by a little, as always. JUST LIKE STUPID YUPPIE WESTFIELD. You must be from Scotch Plains.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Dec 21 2015 07:27 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

[Points to nose] [With blue SPFHS-embossed foam tomahawk]

Lefty Specialist Dec 21 2015 09:11 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

(Points to son who graduated from Westfield High School and helped defeat Scotch Plains for the Inter-County soccer title in 2010)

Edgy MD Dec 21 2015 09:19 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Crazy right? The Yankees would make a better decision promoting 3rd-base coach Buck Showalter. And the White Sox did all right with Gene Lamont, who'd "win" the division in '94. Interesting thing about Showalter is that he wasn't promoted, so much as re-hired. He and the rest of the staff got fired weeks before along with Merrill. This was during the Nederlander Interregnum and then-GM Gene Michael has admitted he was grabbing at straws with uncertainty as to who he was answering to and who set his budget.

Lefty Specialist Dec 21 2015 09:19 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

dinosaur jesus wrote: I remember him as a nine-foot-tall robot. Torborg the Great. The kids loved him. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTiysOs-91w

SteveJRogers Dec 21 2015 10:10 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

Frayed Knot wrote: To that end (although it's impossible to know how much Fred directed this) Torborg was almost immediately hooked up with WFAN. The all-sports format was still fairly new in those days and it's certainly common enough to have a show with the local manager particularly when the station is also the flagship for the team and the relation between the team & station still in the early lovey-dovey stage. So lovey-dovey in fact that someone thought it would be a good idea if he were on EVERY DAY for a chat/Q&A with the mid-day hosts: the just then starting to bloom 'Mike and the Mad Dog' show. I remember Lupica took to calling him 'Jeff from Flushing' because he was on at least as often as even the most ambitious callers who were using the still newish medium to spout their views on all things sports. Needless to say the concept grew old after a short span and the weariness of his commitment started to show on air and the feel-good vibe gave way to the occasional testy exchanges which is certainly not what the NYM side of the pairing was hoping for. Torborg was even given a slot during their Super Bowl week coverage that January. Their producer at the time (probably still Chris Carlin at that point) had a tradition of having all the guests of the week have their names read in a list during end of the Friday show, and Torborg was on the master list of guests, to which both M&MD chastised the producer because Torborg was not a football spot, but rather a weekly spot that had been contracted for! In fairness, while I haven't listened to either ESPN NY or WFAN consistently in the afternoons in a long time, I'm pretty sure both NYC teams still have deals with sending the current skipper to one of the drive time Mikes for a weekly spot.

Frayed Knot Dec 21 2015 11:21 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

SteveJRogers wrote: ... I'm pretty sure both NYC teams still have deals with sending the current skipper to one of the drive time Mikes for a weekly spot. Sure, I suspect most if not all ML managers have some sort of periodic media contract (even if just for the extra income) ... but weekly not Daily! The fact that the team thought approving its then new manager for an everyday segment on its flagship station was a good idea I believe shows that they viewed the hire at least partly for perceived image purposes.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Dec 21 2015 11:38 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

Lefty Specialist wrote: (Points to son who graduated from Westfield High School and helped defeat Scotch Plains for the Inter-County soccer title in 2010) Oh, yeah? Well, I buy all my kids' shoes and Trader Joe's snacks in your town. SUCK IT, BUD! Funny, though. For the entire decade of the nineties, there was at least one of my cousins on the SPF varsity. (We're something of a futbol family.) SO much anti-Westfield chanting was done in the name of family support.

Lefty Specialist Dec 22 2015 12:54 PM Re: Let's discuss the curious case of Jeff Torborg

So YOU were the guy! And since we were speaking of Chris Carlin, I've often seen him buying bagels in Fanwood so I'm guessing he's a local, too. But last I heard, Jeff Torborg had fled the bright lights and hurly-burly of Westfield for the relative quiet of....Mountainside.