Master Index of Archived Threads
Soler
Johnny Dickshot Feb 12 2006 05:10 PM |
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Interesting peice on Soler in today's News.
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Zvon Feb 12 2006 06:55 PM |
wow.
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metirish Feb 12 2006 07:30 PM |
Makes me hope this guy makes it big, good luck to him.
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sharpie Feb 13 2006 09:14 AM |
Give us some of that Soler Power.
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Yancy Street Gang Feb 13 2006 09:23 AM |
The Mets are due for a Rookie of the Year. It would be great if Soler was at least a legitimate candidate this year.
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Elster88 Feb 13 2006 09:24 AM |
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I like it.
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Edgy DC Feb 13 2006 09:31 AM |
I think the original deal was voided and he signed a new one when he finally got his visa sorted out.
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Rotblatt Feb 13 2006 09:37 AM |
I'm glad it worked out for him--what a nightmare . . .
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Yancy Street Gang Feb 13 2006 09:42 AM |
Why is that better than Zambrano pitching great and Soler as the long man? Is it because we're all predisposed to dislike Zambrano?
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seawolf17 Feb 13 2006 09:47 AM |
Am I the only person who actually likes Zambrano?
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MFS62 Feb 13 2006 09:56 AM |
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Probably. And that includes members of his immediate family. Not his fault. Sadly, its not because of who/ what he is, but because of who/ what he isn't. Later
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Yancy Street Gang Feb 13 2006 09:57 AM |
I'd love to see Zambrano win a couple of Cy Youngs for the Mets. I think he's been unfairly hated for his part in a trade that he didn't make. The best-case scenario is him becoming as good as the Mets hoped he'd be.
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Nymr83 Feb 13 2006 10:30 AM |
the thing is that Zambrano has already shown that he can't be more thana league average pitcher, and he's usually less than that. i'd rather see if Soler can be better and give him a crack at the rotation.
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Edgy DC Feb 13 2006 10:35 AM |
Though I certainly want more from him, I disagree that he's usually less than a league average pitcher,
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Yancy Street Gang Feb 13 2006 10:35 AM |
I'm all for giving the best guy the spot in the rotation. It would be great if both Soler and Zambrano thrived; we'll very likely need replacements for Glavine and Trachsel for 2007.
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Rotblatt Feb 13 2006 01:13 PM |
Well, ERA+-wise, Zambrano's pretty much the definition of an average pitcher--ERA+ of 101 over 5 seasons and almost 700 innings. And his other peripherals, at least aside from HR/9, are average at best as well. He did post a much better BB/9 last year, but his K/9 decreased, and for someone with great stuff, he was pretty hittable--people batted .264 off of him. Maybe that's a fluke--I certainly remember a lot of seeing-eye singles off Zambrano--but it kind of seems to me like he's toned down his stuff to harnass his control, and as a result, he's become more hittable.
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Edgy DC Feb 13 2006 01:25 PM |
Well, 101 is certainly not "usually below average." But, more importantly, pitching at a league average ERA should not get somebody tagged as even average. I think we misread ERA+ to concude that, because that figure is arrived at by a vastly disporporttionate number of innings going to the best pitchers, making a pitcher with a league-average ERA over 166 innings, not an average pitcher, but a rarer and dearer thing, if not terribly remarkable.
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Rotblatt Feb 13 2006 02:51 PM |
I think it probably makes sense to call someone pitching at league average, "average." Of course, if that someone also has a WHIP, BB rate & HR rate significantly below average and a K rate significantly above average, I'd argue that he's much better than average, just really, really unlucky. In this specific case, though, Zambrano doesn't really have any mitigating circumstances.
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Nymr83 Feb 13 2006 06:01 PM |
the problem with VORP in evaluating players is that it tells you their contribution in the time they played, not in the time they SHOULD play based on their talent. for pitchers i'd like to see a park-adjusted OPS allowed, but i can't find it anywhere, ERA+ is a useful enough tool in comparing guys even if you want to fight over where average is.
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Johnny Dickshot Feb 13 2006 06:59 PM |
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That's interesting. But isn't getting into that gooey area called "talent" stand to be to Zambrano's great advantage? His results may be average or slightly above ... but just about everyone except the first seven batters in that Brewers game last August would respect his "talent" -- his combo of pitches, speed, movement... his "stuff" if you will. I'm sure Omar & Willie would tell you they're more motivated by Zambrano's talent than his ERA+ or VORP. Not saying that's a good idea.
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Edgy DC Feb 13 2006 07:34 PM |
Mlb.com, and I imagine other sources, can give you everybody's OBP yielded and Slugging yielded, and therefore their OPS yielded. You can take that and factor in the batters' park factor from baseball-reference.com.
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Nymr83 Feb 13 2006 10:27 PM |
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ok i definetaly put that wrong, what i meant was their results independent of the playing time that some manager did or did not give to them.
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