Master Index of Archived Threads


knicks suck 2016-2017

Vic Sage Jun 23 2016 06:38 PM Edited 5 time(s), most recently on Jun 23 2016 08:40 PM

A new season, a new chance to suck. Recap since the end of last season: 1) new coach - Jeff Hornaceck? Ok; gotta be better than Rambis. But if Phil was willing to go outside the family, and willing to hire a guy who doesn't use the triangle, he should have went after Thibideau. 2) Opt outs - goodbye, Afflalo and D-Will, and don't let the door hit you on your way out. 3) Trade - we sent Lopez/Grant/Calderon to Bulls for D-Rose (plus a backup guard and 2017 2nd round pick). Calderon is no loss, but Lopez was a strong player, and very important to interior defense, with a reasonable contract that had a few more years on it. Grant? We traded Hardaway to get him in the 1st round. Giving up on him this soon, for a 1-year rental? D-Rose is a shell of his former MVP self, and a liability on defense. I don't get this deal for the Knicks. Adding Rose, while losing Lopez and Grant, destroys what little defense we had, and Rose is no longer an efficient enough scorer or play-maker to make up for it. current roster: Carmelo Anthony (SF/PF) $24,559,380 Derrick Rose (PG) $21,323,252 Kristaps Porzingis (PF/C) $4,317,720 Kyle O'Quinn (PF/C) $3,918,750 Langston Galloway (G) [RFA] $2,725,003 Cleanthony Early (SF} [RFA] $1,180,431 Justin Holiday (G) $1,015,696 Rose / Thomas** / Anthony / O'Quinn / Porzingis Galloway*/ Holiday/ Early*/ D.Will** /Hernangomez ___, ____ ___, ____, ____ *RFA ** UFA Oy. So now we need a SG and a Center. The nightmare scenario is that we now go out and give a max deal to Dwight Howard! [yikes!]. But if we play Porzingis at center and Melo at PF (my preference), then we'll need 2 wing players (at SF & SG).

Nymr83 Jun 23 2016 07:22 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

the only positive i see to this trade is that for once the Knicks didn't surrender a future draft pick!

d'Kong76 Jun 23 2016 07:53 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Do you they have any future draft picks? (half joking, I didn't look). They also got a 2nd rounder for next year, don't know if it's conditional.

Frayed Knot Jun 23 2016 07:57 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

And think about how good Rose will be in the 10 games that he does play.

Vic Sage Jun 23 2016 08:39 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Rumors say we'll be keeping RFA Galloway, and re-sign UFA L.Thomas (and maybe D.Will), but maybe not Early. Also, Hernangomez is expected to coming over from Europe. We have room for a max contract or 2, but i'm not holding my breath for Durant and Westbrook.

Vic Sage Jun 24 2016 04:49 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

UDFAs signed so far: Ron Baker: 6'4, 23-year-old guard, Wichita State Marvelle Harris: 6'4, 22-year-old guard, Fresno State Chasson Randle: 6'2, 23-year-old guard, CEZ Nymburk Summer league will start soon.

Vic Sage Jul 05 2016 05:15 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

In light of how bad the SummerKnicks are, lets talk about the other FA moves: Noah (c) - 4yr/$72m Courtney Lee (SG) - 4yr/$50m Brandon Jennings (PG) - 1yr/$5m Lance Thomas (SG-SF) - 4yr/$24m Once they made the move for Rose, these other moves make sense. Though they did have to give up the cap hold on Galloway to make room to sign these guys, they can still re-sign him with the "early bird" exemption, so he's not out of the picture yet, and i hope they keep him. He's a good defensive player, athletic, erratic shot but can get hot. And i think they're going to bring the European center over, Hernangomez. Starters: Rose / Lee / Anthony / Porzingis / Noah Rotation: Jennings / Galloway* / Thomas / O'Quinn Bench: Holiday (SG),/ Hernangomez(C) **, _______ Reserve:___, ____, ____ *UFA **RFA

Vic Sage Jul 05 2016 09:40 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017 Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Jul 14 2016 08:38 PM

avi

Nymr83 Jul 06 2016 01:51 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

I don't actually hate this team, but I question their ability to win.... not win half their games and be the 6 seed in the LEast-ern conference, but actually WIN a playoff series or more. but with Dolan, 41 wins and the 8 seed seems to be the perpetual goal. they should have traded Anthony for young players and/or picks, not let go of the Lopez contract so easily (it was a great trade chip) and actually rebuilt. at least they didnt give away draft picks this time.

Vic Sage Jul 07 2016 02:31 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Nymr83 wrote: ... at least they didnt give away draft picks this time. wait; it's early yet. Galloway goes to New Orleans. S'long, Lang, and thanks for all the fish.

Vic Sage Jul 14 2016 08:38 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Galloway is gone, but we have Vujavic back? yikes. But they just signed Maurice NDour, a good defensive PF who played will in the summer league last year, and then played in Spain. All that remains now is finding a 3rd string PG for the minimum salary. Maybe one of this year's summer league bunch, Baker or Randle? Somebody else? Starters: Rose / Lee / Anthony / Porzingis / Noah Rotation: Jennings / Thomas / Kuzminskas / O'Quinn / Hernangomez Bench: ______ (PG) / Holiday (SG) / Vujavic (SF) / Ndour (PF) / Plumlee (C)

Vic Sage Oct 21 2016 07:26 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

They've announced the 15-man roster: Starters: Rose / Lee / Anthony / Porzingis / Noah Rotation: Jennings / Vujavic / Thomas / O'Quinn / Hernangomez Bench: Holiday (SG) / Kuzminskas (SF) reserve: Baker (G) / Ndour (F) / Plumlee (C) plus: Westchester D-Knicks: Early, Inglis Cut: Amundson, Tokoto, Randle (DL) Randle probably would've made the team if he didn't have a broken eye socket. As a consequence, they're thin at PG, particularly with the injury history of both Rose and Jennings. I guess they think Vujavic, Holiday and Baker can fill in at PG as needed, but i doubt it. And i'm surprised they kept Ndour over Amundson; Ndour is athletic but has no particular position (or any particularly strong skill set), and Amundson gives you professional depth. Philosophically, however, i agree with keeping the young potential talent over a veteran mediocrity on a team that isn't really going anywhere. Which begs the question of why they're keeping Vujavic over Randle, even with Randle's injury. they'll probably try to sign Randle for the D-League but he's got no obligation to the Knicks now. I do like that they kept Baker, whose a smart, gritty, defensive guard. Plumlee would've been better served in the D-League, but they might not have been able to keep him if they tried to sign him there. I'm still hoping they try to sign a veteran PG, and then either cut Vujavic (which i prefer) or try to send one of Ndour, Baker or Plumlee to the D-League.

Nymr83 Oct 21 2016 09:03 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

whats your outlook here? this looks like a 50-win team if everyone is healthy all year (hahaha) but probably anywhere from 30 to 45 with these players health histories

Vic Sage Oct 24 2016 02:09 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

30-45 wins is the average range for 2/3 of the league every year (and the knicks), so its not going out on a limb to predict that. The question is, if everything goes right, what is this team capable of? I suppose that if Melo, Rose and Noah stay relatively healthy (for them), and PZing continues to develop, then they've got a good shot of hosting a first round playoff series. But the odds of all those things happening are not exactly even money. I have little faith in Noah, and i think giving up Robin Lopez to get Rose, thus necessitating the signing of Noah, was compounding one bad decision with another. At this point in his career, Noah was just not as good as Lopez, straight up. Sure, if Rose was still Rose, swapping Lopez for Noah would be a wash, but i haven't seen Rose be Rose for years. And i think Noah and Rose will take shots from PZing, retarding the kid's development. And Melo has broken down each of the last few years; he's still a great player, but age is taking a toll on his knees. So i don't see good answers to my questions about this team. And that's even before you get to whether Phil will force the "triangle" down their throats or whether Hornacek with actually match a system to his talent. I would like to see the Knicks use a small 2-PG lineup, with PZing start at center, Melo at PF, Thomas at SF, with Rose and Jennings in the back court (with Holiday, Lee and Noah getting solid minutes off the bench). This would give them mismatches upfront and great ball movement, with enough D to get by. But, alas, Hornacek will never do this. So i see this team as a 40-win team (if Melo plays 70+ games), maybe getting an 8th seed, but probably not. In fact, i hope not. The best way to maintain mediocrity in the NBA is to eke out an 8th seed with little shot of winning a championship, while constantly missing out on top draft picks. If they can get one more young stud (preferably a PG) to pair with PZing, and then trade Melo in the off-season for another pick or 2, that's when this team will have a shot to really compete for a title. Until then, we're on a hamster wheel pretending we're getting somewhere.

Vic Sage Oct 26 2016 05:25 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

opening night in Cleveland: yeah, that went about as I expected.

Ashie62 Oct 26 2016 06:12 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

I don't understand how a team that plays in NYC at MSG can suck so badly year after year. It must be a last choice destination for the FA's, but why?

Nymr83 Oct 26 2016 07:34 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Ashie62 wrote: I don't understand how a team that plays in NYC at MSG can suck so badly year after year. It must be a last choice destination for the FA's, but why? -the Knicks can't pay them more than anyone else (and can pay them less than their current team) -the Knicks haven had the assets to "sign and trade", the only scenario under which the new team can pay as much as the current one -the Knicks cant demonstrate a "win now" environment -NY has higher taxes than many NBA states, so playing for the Knicks is a negative compared to Dallas, Miami etc In return, about the only positives the Knicks can mention are marketing and "legacy" - both of which are more or less conditional on coming here and being part of a winner.

Vic Sage Nov 15 2016 03:37 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

the Knicks beat up on the short-handed Mavs last night, which was nice. Better was that Hornacek finally gave significant minutes to a lineup that put KP at the 5 and Melo at the 4. Guess what? It worked. wow. shocker. Not. What was a happy surprise was that this lineup allowed more minutes to Holiday, who is a solid defensive guard, but also showed some scoring touch. His emergence could cover up the terrible start that Lance Thomas has gotten off to, and maybe it will give Horny the courage to give the KP-Melo frontcourt some more run. I think their best balance of offense & defense in the starting lineup is Rose-Lee-Thomas-Melo-KP, with Jennings, Holiday and Noah in rotation. They need some O off the bench, and I think Kuzminskas could develop into a scoring threat/6th man off the bench, but he needs to get more consistent minutes. Or they can put Lee on the 2nd unit for instant offense, starting Holiday instead. But I don't know why Sasha, OQuinn and Ndour ever see the floor. They should be reserved for injury duty only. And i'd like to see Chasson come up from the D-League to replace Sasha, who can become the mascot.

Vic Sage Nov 17 2016 09:43 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Good win by the Knicks last night over Detroit. Porzingis is emerging as a dominant force on both ends of the court. Melo and Rose had good games, too, with continuing contributions from Holiday. Jennings is great at pushing and moving the ball, but he couldn't hit water if he fell out of a boat. Noah grabbed 15 rebounds, but he's the worst free-throw shooter i've ever seen on the Knicks. He throws the ball at the net like a near-sighted shot-putter having an epileptic seizure. OQuinn was solid on defense against Drummond, which was a shock.

Nymr83 Nov 18 2016 01:53 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Vic Sage wrote: Good win by the Knicks last night over Detroit. Porzingis is emerging as a dominant force on both ends of the court. Melo and Rose had good games, too, with continuing contributions from Holiday. Jennings is great at pushing and moving the ball, but he couldn't hit water if he fell out of a boat. Noah grabbed 15 rebounds, but he's the worst free-throw shooter i've ever seen on the Knicks. He throws the ball at the net like a near-sighted shot-putter having an epileptic seizure. OQuinn was solid on defense against Drummond, which was a shock. "dominating force" on both ends? more like "no longer embarrassing himself" on the defensive side - which is an improvement and a welcome one. biggest shock is that nobody is hurt yet

d'Kong76 Dec 03 2016 04:40 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Watching Knicks in 60 (back to back games against the Timberloafs) I have to say I'm getting excited about 2016-17. Just thought I'd stick this here in case I want to laugh at myself at the all-star break.

Edgy MD Dec 03 2016 04:59 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

I had a brush with greatness early last week. I went to a wake, and near the end, some family members got up to speak. All the chairs in the middle of the room were filled, so I stood behind them. But as the talking wore on, I soon realized I was screening some of the older folks who were seated around the room's periphery. So I began backing up, to open up their lines of sight. But one guy, I clearly wasn't helping, because I backed up right into his toes. I turned around, and BAM! it was Hubie Brown! I was boxing out the coach! I knew he was in the family. He was the deceased's brother-in-law. So I had spotted him at family events once or twice over the years, but never approached him. But after the talking ceased, my brother, not as shy about buttonholing big shots as I am, approached him to ask about the current state of the Knicks. I figured this might be an ongoing sore spot, but Hubie was gracious. He had shrunk in later years from perhaps my brother's size (6'3") to around mine (5'9"), but his mind was still sharp as ever. He measure' basketball greatness by triple doubles, and could rattle off the TD numbers of any basketball great from George Mikan to Steph Curry. I'd've liked to point out that Wilt Chamberlain scoring 50 points a game more than makes up for whether he got 7 assists vs. 10, or in his case 7 blocks vs. 10, but I wasn't going head-to-head with a champ. He talked as much like a coach as an analyst. My brother would point out a solid player, and Hubie would come back with "Yeah, he's dynamite, once a week! A great player would bring that game every night! Coaches look for heart and it's just not there." Of another player, he said, "Yeah, he's great guy to have around. But even though his knee and shoulder are healed, his whole game is below the rim. He's gonna help a good team be better, but he'll never win a game for you." Really impressive to listen to, and I'm mostly detached from the NBA.

d'Kong76 Jan 30 2017 01:18 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

First time in some time I watched a game live and boy did I get my drama's worth with a 4OT loss. If this game, and the officials is not investigated they might as well make Vince McMahon the new commish. What nonsense.

MFS62 Jan 30 2017 02:20 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

d'Kong76 wrote: First time in some time I watched a game live and boy did I get my drama's worth with a 4OT loss. If this game, and the officials is not investigated they might as well make Vince McMahon the new commish. What nonsense. Of course the refs should be investigated. Carmello fouled out? How absurd. He NEVER gets close enough to the player he's defending to foul him. Later

d'Kong76 Jan 30 2017 02:23 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

If you didn't watch the game, sod off. It was atrociously 'reffed.'

MFS62 Jan 30 2017 02:51 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

d'Kong76 wrote: If you didn't watch the game, sod off. It was atrociously 'reffed.' So I've read elsewhere. But my Knicks suck so badly I couldn't resist. BTW- in the press and on NY sports talk radio (yeah, I know) Carmello is being called a "Ball Stopper". (They used to call that kind of ball hog a "Black Hole" but not any more lest it be deemed racial.) That lack of giving up the ball once he gets it was what I meant a while ago about my concern with him fitting into the triangle offense, where passing is a must. They're trying to trade him, but I'm not sure what team would want him at his salary. Of course, within five seconds after I hit "enter" the Nets will trade for him. And it wouldn't be the dumbest thing they've done in their history. (shaking head) Later

Vic Sage Jan 30 2017 05:35 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

i never bitch about umpiring in any sport. It's like the weather; it rains on everybody. Unless there's actual evidence, or even suspicion based on facts (not "alternative facts"); then, in that case, there is a basis for complaint and investigation. That being said, that was one of the worst officiated games i've ever seen. Melo got mauled on one end and the refs were blind; on the other, he brushed against the ball handler and the whistle blew. There is a reason we had 3/5 of the starters fouling out, plus OQuinn off the bench. And that non-call on Shroder, when he should have been T-ed up for slamming the ball into the front row with the ref standing RIGHT THERE (the ref had to retrieve the ball from a fan in the first row), was just stunning. That ref should be brought up on charges.

MFS62 Feb 02 2017 03:37 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

After last night's loss by the Nets to their crosstown rivals, Nets center Brook Lopez commented on how all the opponent's points scored off offensive rebounds led to the loss. Memo to Brook. The other team wouldn't get so many offensive rebounds if you could get some defensive ones. A peach basket nailed atop a seven foot pole in the key would get more than you do. Later

Vic Sage Feb 03 2017 03:05 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

i don't get all this "Melo for Love" trade nonsense. I'm OK with them trading Melo, but not for a lesser player with a bad back and an equally big contract. If they move Melo, it has to be for a draft pick(s), plus a bunch of short-term deals the Knicks can cut or play out. Otherwise, what's the point? Melo/Love gets us nowhere. It would actually be a good move for Cleveland, since LeBron would love to have a guy next to him who knows can create his own shot down the stretch in a close game. Love doesn't play any more defense than Melo. And as a big who shoots 3s, we've already got one of those. Love's game doesn't work next to KP.

Nymr83 Feb 05 2017 01:39 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

the only positive i see is that Love or is 4 or 5 years younger and you get something for him later. Is Melo nearing, or already at, the point where you cant get decent value back for him?

Vic Sage Feb 08 2017 07:09 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

as Casey Stengel is supposed to have said during spring training about one of the Mets young prospects: "well, he's 23, and if he works real hard, and if god willing, he has a decent chance of being 24." The fact that Love is younger doesn't impress me. He's not as good as Melo, as of today. I'd rather be stuck with 1.5-2.5 years more of Melo, at $48m-$66m (depending on whether he exercises his 2018-19 opt out) than 3.5 years of Love at $82+M

MFS62 Feb 09 2017 12:52 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Vic Sage wrote: as Casey Stengel is supposed to have said during spring training about one of the Mets young prospects: "well, he's 23, and if he works real hard, and if god willing, he has a decent chance of being 24." He said it about catcher Greg Goosen, and Goosen's age when Casey said it was (IIRC) 19. Later

Nymr83 Feb 09 2017 03:24 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

What did I miss with Oakley tonight?? OE - saw a video that was not the entire incident - Oakley shoves multiple security folks, one in the head - still can't tell what precipitated it but reports say he was trying to get at Dolan!

MFS62 Feb 09 2017 04:22 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Nymr83 wrote: What did I miss with Oakley tonight?? OE - saw a video that was not the entire incident - Oakley shoves multiple security folks, one in the head - still can't tell what precipitated it but reports say he was trying to get at Dolan! Yes. And As if my Nets didn't suck enough, now they'll be walking billboards (they're too slow to be running billboards) http://sports.yahoo.com/m/b2082ec8-d580 ... n-per.html This is really embarrassing. Later

d'Kong76 Feb 09 2017 03:03 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

This page has loading issues for me here's the story... http://nesn.com/2017/02/heres-charles-o ... -security/

d'Kong76 Feb 10 2017 09:04 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Oak banned for life from Madison Square Garden. Really, can't make this stuff up.

Nymr83 Feb 11 2017 01:31 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

d'Kong76 wrote: Oak banned for life from Madison Square Garden. Really, can't make this stuff up. Whatever happened between him and Dolan doesn't excuse the assaults on security guards who are just doing their job. the ban is appropriate. criminal charges are appropriate as well.

Edgy MD Feb 11 2017 04:19 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Depending on the details of what actually went down, which we don't know. If it's possible that folks are trying to remove him unfairly, where the injustice began is an ambiguous matter. My guess is that he brought it on himself, but I don't know.

d'Kong76 Feb 11 2017 04:38 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

There's probably some 'fake news' from both ends here.

Nymr83 Feb 12 2017 03:10 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Edgy MD wrote: Depending on the details of what actually went down, which we don't know. If it's possible that folks are trying to remove him unfairly, where the injustice began is an ambiguous matter. My guess is that he brought it on himself, but I don't know. Even if you gave him the complete benefit of the doubt and say that his removal was "unfair" that doesn't at all excuse an assault on security personnel.

Edgy MD Feb 12 2017 02:22 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

I don't know. Security personnel surrounding you, threatening to evict you over a lie, maligning you, threatening to lay hands on you? I'm not saying that's the total description of how it went down, but eventually there's a line where where we all ask how much we are willing to submit to authority just because it represents itself as authority. And a couple of fingers to the the sternum and pushoffs when folks are moving in on you isn't exactly felony assault. It's probably not right, but it's very instinctive for an athlete. I just want to see this play itself out. He was probably acting out and brandishing a big chip, but MSG's witnesses all seem to be on the payroll, for what that's worth.

d'Kong76 Feb 12 2017 03:56 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

The whole story is bizzare; I'm with Team Oak, screw Dolan and his douches.

Nymr83 Feb 13 2017 01:29 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

d'Kong76 wrote: The whole story is bizzare; I'm with Team Oak, screw Dolan and his douches. so our dislike for Dolan justifies an assault on his employees? I'm not buying it. I guess Yankee fans can say Clemens intentional headhunting of Piazza and throwing the bat shard are justified too?

d'Kong76 Feb 13 2017 01:40 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Easy dude, I'm just fartin' around... don't mean to make it another thing.

Edgy MD Feb 13 2017 02:51 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Not-so-overwhelming Pro-Dolan (and more than a little pro-Trump) demonstration outside the Garden. [fimg=700:3ihw0u6e]https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s57hc3lbobid5w2ao22p.jpg[/fimg:3ihw0u6e]

Nymr83 Feb 13 2017 03:14 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Wow. I thought trolls only lived under bridges and on the internet, but there they are outside MSG! No idea what would possess anyone to care enough to do that.

Edgy MD Feb 13 2017 03:32 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

As JC Bucket likes to say, attention is the nu cocaine. To be clear, I don't know how this is going to break, or how it should break, but there's something about tabloid stories that demands we all have a conclusive off-the-rack opinion by the time our morning coffee is done. (Look for the president to opine about it, possibly on Twitter, in the next 48 hours, possibly misspelling Oakley's name, or even calling him "Barkley.") Tabloids want to depict reserving judgment as somehow weak, and decisively rushing to judgment as strong, but it's not.

d'Kong76 Feb 13 2017 04:00 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Hard to imagine why anyone would 'root' for Dolanvision. I mean one could argue that Dolan makes Jeff Wilpon almost seem cool. Ya know, almost.

Vic Sage Feb 13 2017 06:49 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017 Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Feb 17 2017 03:55 PM

avi

Mets Willets Point Feb 14 2017 03:39 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017 Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Feb 14 2017 04:43 PM

Wasn't there a time when people on the old Metsonline Fan Forum were pining for Dolan to buy the Mets?

d'Kong76 Feb 14 2017 04:33 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017 Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Feb 14 2017 05:20 PM

Probably. I don't remember if I beat that drum or how loudly but most Knicks fans would probably agree The Dolandouche Index was lower and the state of the Knicks (while not great) was much better than say the last decade or when we were mofo'ng?

Frayed Knot Feb 14 2017 05:16 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Mets Willets Point wrote: Wasn't there a time when people on the old Metsonline Fan Forum were pining for Dolan to buy the Mets? Oh definitely!! Papa Charles Dolan was still running things back then but as soon as Cablevision/Dolans acquired MSG and the three teams (Knicks, Rangers, Liberty) that went along with it the first thing he did was install son Jimmy in charge of that part of the company. Rumor has it, btw, that Jimmy D. took a Welsh Corgi's barking personally during the opening night of Westminster on Monday and so he had security wrestle the dog to the ground and escort him out of the Garden.

Mets Willets Point Feb 14 2017 08:27 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Frayed Knot wrote: Mets Willets Point wrote: Wasn't there a time when people on the old Metsonline Fan Forum were pining for Dolan to buy the Mets? Oh definitely!! Papa Charles Dolan was still running things back then but as soon as Cablevision/Dolans acquired MSG and the three teams (Knicks, Rangers, Liberty) that went along with it the first thing he did was install son Jimmy in charge of that part of the company. That's it. I knew the name was Dolan but the first name was different.

d'Kong76 Feb 15 2017 06:44 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Suck is very valuable!

MFS62 Feb 23 2017 04:42 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

d'Kong76 wrote: Suck is very valuable! We're number 7. And the Nets actually made a deal - getting a first round draft pick (they'll have TWO this year) in return for Mr. Negative. Bogdanovic scored a lot but his +/- numbers always seemed to be more - than +. To quote Basketball HOF sportswriter Peter Vecsey (who was taking about Rick Mount) "He has the fastest first step on offense and the slowest first step on defense I've ever seen". 'Melo has his bags packed. Will Phil Jackson pull the trigger on a deal? Later

Vic Sage Feb 23 2017 02:36 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Melo ain't going nowhere he don't wanna go. Derrick Rose, on the other hand... And i hear Phil is offering OQuinn for a 1st round pick. Good luck with that, Phil.

Frayed Knot Feb 23 2017 04:42 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

MFS62 wrote: And the Nets actually made a deal - getting a first round draft pick (they'll have TWO this year) in return for Mr. Negative. Didn't the Nets deal away several first round picks in recent years to the Celtics for players who are now on social security? I know I've said this before, but the business machinations in the NBA totally confound me.

MFS62 Feb 23 2017 09:46 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Frayed Knot wrote: MFS62 wrote: And the Nets actually made a deal - getting a first round draft pick (they'll have TWO this year) in return for Mr. Negative. Didn't the Nets deal away several first round picks in recent years to the Celtics for players who are now on social security? I know I've said this before, but the business machinations in the NBA totally confound me. Yes, they dealt their #1 pick in three years and swapped this year's #1 positions*, all with with the Celtics. In return they got two formerly great players who were just coming to the end of their prime productivity. To say it didn't work out is a titanic understatement. The Nets got bupkis and the Celtics got three or four #1 picks. Since the Nets have sucked, those have been very good picks. Concerning draft day, it was good to be a Jewish Nets fan. For the past few years, I was able to celebrate Passover twice. ** The Nets GM who pulled off the trade, Billy King, was fired. If it were my choice, he shouldn't be allowed to see another basketball game(even for free) for the rest of his life. It was the worst trade in New York history since the Indians took the beads in exchange for Manhattan. Later * = IIRC the league rules limited the number of consecutive years a team could trade their #1 pick. Billy Fucking King found a way to circumvent the rule. ** = Basketball HOF writer Peter Vecsey told me that was a funny line when I sent it to him.

Frayed Knot Feb 25 2017 04:09 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Which is a bit different from the Sixers whose strategy seems to be: 1) trade every useful player in order to lose as much as possible for the purpose of stockpiling top draft picks 2) use those picks to draft really young and untested players, many of whom play the same position as each other including some who are pre-injured and so can't play for their first full season and often longer 3) wait for a year or three for those players to get healthy at which point they trade them so as to stockpile future draft picks 4) go back to step #1 This current season represents Philly's best year in the last four and thus it has upped their winning percentage since 2013 to 22% while they've openly admitted that NOT winning was their goal. Can someone explain to me why attendance for home games in that town averages as high as triple digits?

MFS62 Feb 25 2017 01:17 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Because its Philadelphia. BTW - who was their GM who came up with that franchise-destroying script? None other than Billy King. And the Nets actually gave him a second chance. (shaking head) Later

MFS62 Mar 17 2017 12:41 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Why can't the Nets play like that every night? Later

Vic Sage Mar 24 2017 09:35 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

If we finish the tank job appropriately, we could climb from the 7th pick to the 4th, with a real shot at Josh Jackson. Fingers crossed! More losses, come on down!

Frayed Knot Apr 02 2017 09:23 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Wouldn't it be more appropriate to label Derrick Rose [u:2nyqognt]Not[/u:2nyqognt] blowing out his knee as 'Breaking News'?

Vic Sage Apr 04 2017 09:27 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

best thing he's done for the Knicks all season.

MFS62 Jun 21 2017 01:04 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

While we're waiting for that other NY NBA team to make a trade, my Nets just traded Brook Lopez, their best player, along with one of their first round picks to LA for point guard D’Angelo Russell and center Timofey Mozgov Lopez could score, but not rebound. The center they got can't do either. The point guard was a former #2 pick and has been talented, but inconsistent. If he starts, it looks like Jeremy Lin will move to shooting guard. Since its too early for next season, I didn't start a 2017-2018 NBA season thread. Later

d'Kong76 Jun 21 2017 01:27 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

I will say if the Knicks trade Kristaps Porzingis (or continue to piss him off to the point where he wants to leave) for anything that doesn't bowl over the entire league I'm done with them. I'm already kinda done. But this will be done done. Done.

Vic Sage Jun 22 2017 04:41 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

I enjoy the NBA draft as much as most folks, more than some. But sports drafts are stupid and unethical ways of incorporating new players into a league. Here's yet another well-reasoned argument to end the NBA draft and stop rewarding incompetent franchises and teams that tank, while denying athletes the right to choose where they want to work (like any other employee): https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2017/3/26/ ... ree-agency Meanwhile, i'll be rushing home tonight to see if the Knicks get the French point guard (who i really want), the NC point guard (who i really don't want), or the undersized shooting guard (who i have mixed feelings about), or get surprised by one of the top 7 prospects unexpectedly dropping to them (some of which i'd prefer over the French kid, and some of whom i wouldn't -- i'm looking at you, Josh Jackson!)

Frayed Knot Jun 22 2017 10:15 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Vic Sage wrote: Here's yet another well-reasoned argument to end the NBA draft and stop rewarding incompetent franchises and teams that tank, while denying athletes the right to choose where they want to work (like any other employee) I assume this author was immediately set-upon and beaten senseless by his fellow sportswriters for attempting to ruin all their fun and also their sense of entitlement at being part of a system that seeks to control the lives of teenage hoopsters.

d'Kong76 Jun 23 2017 03:49 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Vic got his French guy in Frank Ntilikina, and Dennis Smith is getting a lot of thumbs up. Now get KP on the phone and make up, Phil. NOW!!

Vic Sage Jun 23 2017 04:10 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

of course, now everybody wants Dennis Smith because Phil took Frenchy. Time will tell... it always does. But it doesn't tell right away. Can Smith be John Wall? Maybe, but a guy who consistently gives inconsistent effort has got a bit of dog in his game and i don't want him. He's a shoot first PG, which i also don't want. He'll probably have a big immediate impact because he can score, but he's as likely to be Rod Strickland as John Wall, in my view. Character is destiny. French Frank is a long, pass-first PG with great defensive skills and court sense. His unselfishness and skinny build has made his offense a work in progress, but he's only 18 so I like his chances to develop into a George Hill-type solid PG. An all-star? Maybe not, but a Tony Parker type career wouldn't be out of the question, and i would be willing to bet that he'll be helping an NBA team win games long after Smith has washed out of the league. I don't know anything about the 2nd round picks beyond the following: *Damyean Dotson - He's a 6-6 SG out of Houston who can hit knock down open 3s, but that's about all he can do. Oh, and he was accused of rape but charges were dropped. *Ognjen Jaramaz - a 6-3 Serbian PG playing for Belgrade who can drive to the rim. He'll probably be stashed overseas until he develops.

Vic Sage Jun 23 2017 04:25 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Knicks have also signed undrafted college free agents * Luke Kornet, a 7-ft C from Vandy who is a top shot blocker, but can't defend, rebound or score. *Nigel Hayes, an undersized 6-7 PF from Wisconsin who can't shoot.

Vic Sage Jun 23 2017 05:01 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

current roster: PG: Frank Ntikilina (1st-r pick) PG: Chasson Randle PG: Ognjen Jaramaz (Belgrade) (2nd-r pick) SG/SF: Courtney Lee SG/SF: Lance Thomas SG/SF: Damyean Dotson (2nd-r pick) SF/PF: Carmelo Anthony SF/PF: Mindaugas Kuzminskas SF/PF: Maurice Ndour SF/PF: Nigel Hayes (undrafted FA) PF/C: Kristaps Porzingis PF/C: Kyle O'Quinn C: Joakim Noah C: Willy Hernangomez C: Marshall Plumlee C: Luke Kornet (undrafted FA) Free Agents: PG: Ron Baker (RFA) PG: Derrick Rose (UFA) SG/SF: Justin Holiday (UFA) SG/SF: Sasha Vujacic (UFA) current projected rotation: Ntikilina / Lee / Anthony / KP / Hernangomez (Baker)/ (Holiday) / Thomas / Kuz / O'Quinn Chasson / Dotson / Hayes / Ndour / Plumlee DL: Noah D-League: Kornet Europe: Jaramaz FA: Rose, Vujavic

Vic Sage Jun 23 2017 05:06 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Since Ntikilina probably isn't ready to be a starting PG playing 30+ minutes a night, the Knicks still need a veteran PG capable of mentoring Frenchy while running PHil's triangle. I don't think former D-Leaguers Chasson or Baker are up to the task, so i think the Knicks are still in the market for a PG. Does Rose get another 1-year deal? Would he take it? Is there somebody better on the market? Should they trade Lee and re-sign Holiday? and then, maybe, get his brother Jrue to be the PG? And is there any way to get rid of Noah? Inquiring minds want to know.

Ashie62 Jun 23 2017 07:01 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

The last French guy the Knicks drafted never played an NBA game. Who is he?

Ashie62 Jun 23 2017 10:03 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Frederic Weis Knicks 15th overall pick in the 1999 draft. Lotsa anger Knicks passed on local product Ron Artest.

MFS62 Jun 24 2017 12:45 AM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Ashie62: The last French guy the Knicks drafted never played an NBA game. Who is he? Ashie62: Frederic Weis Knicks 15th overall pick in the 1999 draft. Asking a question and then answering it? Isn't that a tad bi-polar? Later

Ashie62 Jun 24 2017 09:58 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

I'm just a little up and down now and then. Later

Vic Sage Jun 26 2017 07:58 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017 Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jun 30 2017 04:07 PM

current projected rotation: starters: Ntikilina / Lee / Anthony / KP / Noah backups: Baker*/ Thomas / Kuz / O'Quinn / Hernangomez bench: Randle (pg) / Ndour (f) / Plumlee (c) reserves: Dotson (sg),Artis (sf) G-League: Hayes (f), Kornet (c) Europe: Jaramaz (pg), Labeyrie (f/c) Addtional summer league invitees: Nathan-Mayes (PG), Barry (SG), Dominique Jones (G) FA: Baker(RFA)*, Rose, Holiday, Vujavic * Reportedly, they'll make him a qualifying offer. Good news: congrats to Willie Hernangomez for his 1st-team all-rookie selection! bad news: they're still considering bringing back D-Rose! and trading KP!! and releasing Melo!!!

Nymr83 Jun 27 2017 10:58 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Jackson says "We're listening" on Rose - can someone lend him some earplugs?

HahnSolo Jun 28 2017 12:23 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

So they're getting rid of Phil just days after the draft? After Phil drafts his "triangle" point guard? Why not part ways right after the season if this is what was planned? I suppose I should be surprised by the timing, but really not. And I have no faith that whomever Dolan brings in (supposedly Steve Mills will be handling free agency [insert eye roll]) will be a good choice.

MFS62 Jun 28 2017 12:55 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Hey, Dolan, need a new GM? Billy King is available. Later

Nymr83 Jun 28 2017 01:17 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Of course Dolan will fuck up replacing him anyway, but I am all too happy to fire a guy who goes bashing our two best players to the media. Any chance Donald Trump can appoint Dolan to an ambassadorship far far away? Preferably somewhere unsafe and without intetnet/phone access so he can stop fucking up the Knicks.

d'Kong76 Jun 28 2017 03:31 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Dysfunctional mess.

Nymr83 Jul 07 2017 05:20 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Knicks traded away Hardaway 2 years ago so that they could now offer him 70 million dollars?

Nymr83 Jul 12 2017 04:34 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

the rumor mill says Carmelo to the Rockets in a 3 or 4 team deal! i'm sure we'll get back garbage.

Vic Sage Aug 22 2017 09:20 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

So the recent flurry of signings and invites make it look like this right now (assuming Anthony stays on the team): current projected rotation starters - Sessions / Hardaway / Anthony / Porzingis / Noah backups - Baker/ Lee / Thomas / Beasley / Hernangomez bench - Randle (PG), Dotson (SG), OQuinn (PF/C) reserves - Ntikilina (G), N.Hayes (F] G-League - Kornet (F) , _____ Addtional invitees: Nathan-Mayes (G), J.Artis (SG/SF) Europe: Jaramaz (G), Labeyrie (F/C) They can hand out two "2-way" contracts, which will allow 2 of their G-League guys to also play on the Knicks (for a limited time during the season) without being counted on the 15-man roster. They've signed Kornet to a 2W deal, so they have one more, which could go to Artis, Nathan-Mayes, one of the Europeans, or somebody else. Or nobody. I'm not sure about what they plan to do with the PG position. Sessions isn't really a starter at this point, and probably can't give them more than 15-20 min/gm. Would they really start Baker? They gave him a 3-year commitment, but he's still more of a 2-guard than a point. And Ntilikina is a project; i doubt they'll play him in the rotation, much less start him, at least in the beginning. If Noah keeps playing like shit, i'm hoping that'll put OQuinn back in the rotation. Just because they gave him a bad contract doesn't mean they have to keep playing him. My preferred rotation would be: Sessions / Hardaway / Thomas / Anthony / Porz, with Baker, Lee, Beasley, OQuinn and Hernangomez coming off the bench; Dotson, Ntilikina and Hayes watching from the bench;, Kornet, Artis and Nathan-Mayes in the G-league; the Europeans still in Europe; and Noah in retirement.

Nymr83 Aug 22 2017 11:26 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

the one place i disagree is that the Knicks took Ntikilina high in the 1st round, they should play him not bury him outside the rotation. whatever marginal value Baker has over him right now is made up for by the exprience he'll gain.

Vic Sage Aug 23 2017 03:31 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

1 - Jackson drafted him, not the current regime (they'll be naturally less invested in him); 2 - all reports say he'll need alot of work to be effective, so giving him starter's minutes right away could be counter-productive to his development; and 3 - They're overpaying Baker, so they need to actually use him, or use him enough to increase his trade value. But given Sessions' age/injury history, i don't see him lasting very long (either per game, or for the season), so Ntikilina will get minutes if he shows anything in training camp and practices. He may well end up starting game 1, given the thinness at PG on this roster. Baker isn't even a legit PG. But, until training camp starts or other moves are made, this is how i see it.

Ceetar Aug 23 2017 03:33 PM Re: knicks suck 2016-2017

Why do you guys keep putting years on this thread?