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Trade Jay Bruce

Centerfield Nov 29 2016 08:00 PM

Make your best offer for Jay Bruce. Act now! Supplies will not last!

Benjamin Grimm Nov 29 2016 08:04 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

There were those rumors a while back that the Blue Jays were interested (possibly because his name is Jay) but never anything that I saw about what Toronto would offer. I'd like to see them get someone who'll help in 2017, but a decent prospect would be okay too. I just hope it's a package at least as good as Max Wotell and Dilson Herrera.

Frayed Knot Nov 29 2016 09:11 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Both Bruce & Grandy are on one-year contracts at this point and are kinda/sorta the same player, giving Sandy the luxury of going to the winter meetings next week and fielding offers for either one of them. And if the meetings get delayed on account of the CBA negotiations breaking down then he could just put an ad in CraigsList: Have two (2) 30+ corner OFs who can play some CF in a pinch -- LH stick -- good power/low-BA -- not GG material but not terrible fielders either Interesting trades considered. Will accept best offer for either/or. Call 617-I AM-Mets and ask for Sandy or leave message with John R. (but if 'Jeff' answers, hang up)

Nymr83 Nov 29 2016 09:17 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Frayed Knot wrote: (but if 'Jeff' answers, hang up) ha!

Ashie62 Nov 29 2016 09:22 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Pitching, pitching and more pitching please!

John Cougar Lunchbucket Nov 29 2016 09:24 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

This is one of those situations where I'm already convinced the guy we don't trade will either suck, get badly hurt, or both next year.

Centerfield Nov 29 2016 09:27 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: This is one of those situations where I'm already convinced the guy we don't trade will either suck, get badly hurt, or both next year. You called the right guy on Duda/Davis. I think you should make this call as well.

Frayed Knot Nov 29 2016 09:28 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: This is one of those situations where I'm already convinced the guy we don't trade will either suck, get badly hurt, or both next year. Then we better trade the other one.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Nov 29 2016 09:30 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Centerfield wrote: John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: This is one of those situations where I'm already convinced the guy we don't trade will either suck, get badly hurt, or both next year. You called the right guy on Duda/Davis. I think you should make this call as well. I think Grandy's a better player, a little, but see Bruce as potentially more useful if we lost Doodoo again since I think he's also a first baseman. In the WAPT thread I had an idea for a homecoming for Grandy

Ceetar Nov 29 2016 09:35 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Well Granderson has 43.9 career fWAR to Bruce's 17.5. Granderson's career wRC+ is 118, Bruce's is 107. If you don't believe in Conforto you can make the case that Bruce should play over him, but not over Granderson under any circumstances. There is literally no place for Bruce on this team that helps them.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Nov 29 2016 09:47 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Of course I wasn't comparing their whole careers, just what can be expected next year, and that ought to be a much closer race. Perhaps the CBA includes a surprise provision for NL DHs starting immediately. That would be a good situation for us.

d'Kong76 Nov 29 2016 09:53 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: Perhaps the CBA includes a surprise provision for NL DHs starting immediately. shudder

Frayed Knot Nov 29 2016 10:07 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Ceetar wrote: Well Granderson has 43.9 career fWAR to Bruce's 17.5. Granderson's career wRC+ is 118, Bruce's is 107. Granderson is also six years older with 2,000 more ML PAs in his rearview.

Ceetar Nov 29 2016 10:16 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Frayed Knot wrote: Ceetar wrote: Well Granderson has 43.9 career fWAR to Bruce's 17.5. Granderson's career wRC+ is 118, Bruce's is 107. Granderson is also six years older with 2,000 more ML PAs in his rearview. bet he has more in his front view too. Curtis was worth almost 2 fWAR more last year, and it was only close offensively because he had a down year and Bruce had an up year. They're not in the same class, not even with the age factored in.

Benjamin Grimm Nov 29 2016 10:26 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

I do think that Jay Bruce probably has more production ahead of him than Granderson does, but we're not talking about the remainder of their careers, just about 2017, and I think I'd rather have Granderson in 2017 than Bruce. And Bruce, as the younger player, may conceivably have more trade value (depending on the perspective of the trading partner), but that's just speculation.

Vic Sage Nov 29 2016 10:35 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Granderson is NOT coming off a down year, nor Bruce off an up year. Granderson was at or above his average Mets production in most categories, with the most HRs he's hit since he played for the Yankmees. While Bruce's year was better than his previous 2 seasons (due to a good first 1/2), it was significantly less productive than his prior 4 years. Plus Granderson will be 36 and Bruce 30. That being said, i'd rather keep Grandy.

Elster88 Nov 30 2016 01:00 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Can we keep both in case one gets hurt and/or sucks? Downsides of that idea could be: too much money, blocks a younger player, the guy assigned to the bench gets annoyed, something else?

Frayed Knot Nov 30 2016 01:14 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Well the idea is that while you don't HAVE to trade either one, the fact that the two are somewhat redundant means either/or could be trade bait in an attempt to fill a hole elsewhere. And if we're all convinced that Granderson is going to be the better player next year well then that also makes him the more valuable chip. The Puma chimes in from the Post : The Mets continue to listen to offers for Bruce, whose $13 million option for 2017 was picked up largely as an insurance policy against Cespedes’ departure. But the Mets also haven’t ruled out the possibility of keeping Bruce and trading Curtis Granderson to create outfield space.

bmfc1 Nov 30 2016 01:35 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/lets-fix ... -outfield/ Interesting column suggesting trading Conforto rather than Bruce.

d'Kong76 Nov 30 2016 01:43 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

They can't trade Conforto... he's gonna be huge. Huge, I tell ya.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Nov 30 2016 03:15 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

The only thing Jay Bruce does that's of any value to a baseball team is hit home runs, throw half-decently (though that's fading, quickly) and wear a glove (though he doesn't wield it especially well). Granderson does all that, walks, and plays some center. And he actually provides SOME marginal value when not hitting. They are NOT the same player.

Frayed Knot Nov 30 2016 03:59 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Taking the 'same player' label a bit too literally perhaps? ... especially considering that they're both LH-hitting mostly corner OFs with power, low-BAs, and high K-rates. 2013 - 2016 stats: BA: CG - .240, JB = .240 OBA: CG = .339 OBA; JB = .305 -- So, yeah, Grandy walks significantly more although maybe that's partly due to his leadoff role w/NYM XBHs/IsoP: CG = 193 / .193 IsoP; JB = 245 / .210 -- Bruce had about 300 more ABs (due to Grandy missing a chunk of 2013) but his power rate is higher too Grandy runs better, Bruce throws MUCH better, and I'd call the gloves a wash unless they're planning on using Grandy in CF I'm not going to argue against those who prefer Granderson, I just don't the gap is that huge and I think we may be a bit jaded by JB's bad first impression as if that's all he's ever been/ever will be. Tack onto the equation about whether the 36 y/o or the 30 y/o is more likely to see a decline and it melts away even more. I'm just saying that they're so much like the same player that it makes sense not to keep both. I don't care which they deal, but it makes sense to dangle both to see who bites. And, like I said, if Granderson truly is the better player than he'd likely get the better player back in a trade too.

Edgy MD Nov 30 2016 04:19 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Both Bruce & Grandy are on one-year contracts at this point and are kinda/sorta the same player, giving Sandy the luxury of going to the winter meetings next week and fielding offers for either one of them. And if the meetings get delayed on account of the CBA negotiations breaking down then he could just put an ad in CraigsList: Have two (2) 30+ corner OFs who can play some CF in a pinch -- LH stick -- good power/low-BA -- not GG material but not terrible fielders either Interesting trades considered. Will accept best offer for either/or. Call 617-I AM-Mets and ask for Sandy or leave message with John R. (but if 'Jeff' answers, hang up) I have no doubt that there's a heavily secured MLB GM forum site where executives do this exact sort of bidding. [list]Need: LH relievers (seriously!) Have: Surplus of secondbasemen Hit me up! Let's make a deal![/list:u] And it will be hacked in the next year or two. Heck, Snowden probably already has.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Nov 30 2016 06:44 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

What I'm saying is, Bruce gives you so little else outside of DONGERSDINGERSDONGERS that even in a 40-HR year, he's barely worth starting. For serious! (AND his arm's kinda shit now, too. For seriouser! Check ) Granderson and Bruce are similar at a glance, but Granderson always has been a better baseball player, in almost every way. (AND he's always walked more, which is pretty damn valuable, regardless of whether he's leading off.) If you can get someone to pay you anything remotely interesting for Country Strong, you do it. Never mind Grandy-- half-healthy DUDA's better AND cheaper.

Mets Guy in Michigan Nov 30 2016 11:28 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Should we be considering trading BOTH Bruce and Grandy? You have the $29 million man in left, Lagares in center (unless you think Granderson can play that for a full season) and then a three-headed monster in right with Conforto, Bruce and Grandy. I don't think we want Conforto to be a fourth outfielder. Or is he going to get a good look in center in the spring, leaving Lagares to be the fourth/late-inning defense guy?

Edgy MD Nov 30 2016 01:12 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

I'm guessing that, if Granderson or Bruce go, the Mets open the season with a Conforto/Lagares platoon in center.

Centerfield Nov 30 2016 02:09 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

I think they will try to trade Bruce now. Mainly to dump money, but also to get some talent back. I think this will leave them with Granderson/Lagares in CF and Conforto in RF. I think that they would only also look to trade Granderson if they were to sign Dexter Fowler, which I think is not very likely. But I think they should kick the tires. The Cubs are out on Dexter having signed John Jay.

Frayed Knot Nov 30 2016 04:12 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Then there's that other CF platoon possibility: Jose Bernabe Reyes

Ceetar Nov 30 2016 04:20 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Centerfield wrote: I think they will try to trade Bruce now. Mainly to dump money, but also to get some talent back. I think this will leave them with Granderson/Lagares in CF and Conforto in RF. I think that they would only also look to trade Granderson if they were to sign Dexter Fowler, which I think is not very likely. But I think they should kick the tires. The Cubs are out on Dexter having signed John Jay. I think they only optioned Bruce because they knew he still had some value and it'd be better to have the piece than just cut it. I don't know if they can recoup $13 million of value though. ON the other hand, but keeping Bruce and taking another OFer off the market, they're cornering the market a little bit. You can't hand Conforto anything after last year. I'm not sure you can hand Lagares anything either, though his defense is MUCH needed. If they're really planning on Conforto and/or Granderson (or Yo) in CF ever, they need to sign more K pitchers (and close with Reed if Familia is still active) Or more GB pitchers over fly ball guys.

Benjamin Grimm Nov 30 2016 04:26 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

My guess is that part of the deal with Cespedes was a promise to not have him play center field. I agree with being cautious about counting too much on Conforto. They should give him every opportunity to have a great year, but have a ready backup plan in case his 2017 turns out like his 2016 did, which is, unfortunately, a very real possibility.

TransMonk Nov 30 2016 04:47 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Yes, I read somewhere that part of the agreement was a spoken promise that Ces will not play CF. I wish Lagares was more of a sure thing in CF. I love his D and he has shown sparks on offense. I worry about his consistency and his health.

Frayed Knot Nov 30 2016 04:57 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

TransMonk wrote: Yes, I read somewhere that part of the agreement was a spoken promise that Ces will not play CF. I would love to know where his hangup against playing RF stems from. The concept of his arm in LF and Grandy's in RF is straight out of how they position players in Bizarro World.

TransMonk Nov 30 2016 05:00 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Found it: Meanwhile, the Mets will abide by Cespedes’ wishes and abandon using him in center field. That means the righty-hitting Lagares should share duty in center field with Conforto and/or Granderson, if Granderson is the one not traded. http://www.espn.com/blog/new-york/mets/ ... -jay-bruce Do we still have interest in obtaining Fowler for CF?

Ceetar Nov 30 2016 05:05 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

TransMonk wrote: Found it: Meanwhile, the Mets will abide by Cespedes’ wishes and abandon using him in center field. That means the righty-hitting Lagares should share duty in center field with Conforto and/or Granderson, if Granderson is the one not traded. http://www.espn.com/blog/new-york/mets/ ... -jay-bruce Do we still have interest in obtaining Fowler for CF? I'd have to think so, even if his CF is probably subpar. Probably depends on the market for him, If he's looking to get 4/80, maybe not, but if he starts to drop I oculd see Sandy jumping.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Nov 30 2016 05:06 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

It seems weird but Fowler is really just Granderson if he were a switch hitter with a little less power. It would seem slightly redundant to get him without trading Grandy

Ceetar Nov 30 2016 05:14 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: It seems weird but Fowler is really just Granderson if he were a switch hitter with a little less power. It would seem slightly redundant to get him without trading Grandy well yeah, but switchy and 5 years younger which means he probably fakes it in center better. Which is a pretty big deal imo. But yeah, that's extra outfield glut too and it probably coincides with moving the other guys. Granderson (and Bruce too) are going to be a little problematic I think, as part of their value probably hinges on what sort of compensation you might get in 2018 from their contracts, which of course is hinging on the CBA. So maybe Fowler only comes into play if we get past that and he hasn't signed.

seawolf17 Nov 30 2016 05:19 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

I can't see the Mets signing another big OF of any kind without letting one go somewhere first. As it is, you've got five guys for three spots.

TransMonk Nov 30 2016 05:55 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: It seems weird but Fowler is really just Granderson if he were a switch hitter with a little less power. It would seem slightly redundant to get him without trading Grandy Fowler's a real CF, though, no? Grandy could do it but would be sub-par, IMO. And is Lagares reliable enough to spend bulk time there? I'm thinking Grandy might be dangled with the thought of Cespdes/Folwer/Bruce OF with a Conforto/Lagares bench.

Centerfield Nov 30 2016 06:43 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Gotta be a little bit careful of Fowler. Last year might be an outlier. Has a .788 career OPS, and has played in mostly Colorado and Chicago. I can picture him kinda sucking here. Plus, signing a speed guy for long term, on the wrong side of 30. Doesn't feel like a Sandy move.

Frayed Knot Nov 30 2016 06:55 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Adam Rubin adds to the Bruce/Granderson speculation: Don’t be surprised if the [OF'er] traded is Granderson, not Bruce. And don’t be surprised if that trade happens next week. The Mets will listen to offers on both outfielders through next week’s winter meetings and may very well move one of them by the time the gathering in National Harbor, Maryland, breaks up on Dec. 9.

seawolf17 Nov 30 2016 07:50 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

I could see a team that needs a "veteran leadership" type guy taking a flier on Granderson if the Mets eat money. I like him a lot and I'd be sad to see him go, honestly.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Nov 30 2016 07:52 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

And if that happens, we'll have cleared out DilsonShmilson AND Grandy for a RF downgrade. Swell.

Mets Guy in Michigan Nov 30 2016 08:46 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

What are we hoping to get back in a trade? Replace d'Isappointment with a catching upgrade? Bullpen help?

TransMonk Nov 30 2016 08:50 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Toronto is interested in Bruce. I'd love to talk about Russell Martin, but that dude is making $20M for the next 3 years!

Vic Sage Nov 30 2016 09:09 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Grandy is from Chicago. White Sox could use his bat. what, in addition to Grandy, would it take to get Nate Jones?

smg58 Nov 30 2016 10:42 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Mets Guy in Michigan wrote: What are we hoping to get back in a trade? Replace d'Isappointment with a catching upgrade? Bullpen help? That's a good question. Bullpen help could be obtained just as easily via free agency. I'm not necessarily for replacing d'Arnaud, but complementing him with a guy that at least has a higher floor seems like a sensible precaution. Bruce or Granderson should be worth more than that though, especially if you're dangling them both and seeing who gets you the best return.

Edgy MD Nov 30 2016 11:22 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Bullpen help, outfield prospect, salary relief. Plenty of different types of value. An alternative to Duda would be nice. If none of the Mets outfielders can play first, they're up a creek at first if the big guy doesn't come out performing next year.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Dec 01 2016 03:18 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Salary relief might be the most likely return. Maybe to be saved for... this?

Edgy MD Dec 01 2016 03:21 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

At the 2015 deadline, they were juggling deals for Céspedes, Bruce, and Gomez. It'd be goofy if all of them ended up in the outfield at the same time.

Elster88 Dec 04 2016 08:32 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: DONGERSDINGERSDONGERS. FMan?

Fman99 Dec 04 2016 12:23 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Elster88 wrote: LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: DONGERSDINGERSDONGERS. FMan? I lean more in the other direction, if you get me. But yeah.

Ashie62 Dec 04 2016 10:13 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Marc Carig, Bruce or Grandy for a reliever with team control. [url]http://www.rotoworld.com/player/mlb/3985/curtis-granderson

John Cougar Lunchbucket Dec 04 2016 10:25 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Call me a contrarian but just because we have outfielders and need relief pitchers doesn't mean we should try to trade a 30 home run guy for a friggin relief pitcher.

Centerfield Dec 05 2016 12:25 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Yeah. I can definitely get behind that sentiment. Especially when we still need more offense.

smg58 Dec 05 2016 12:34 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

The Astros are looking to shop Evan Gattis and have two outfield openings. Gattis definitely has a higher floor than d'Arnaud and is better defensively behind the plate than most people realize. (He plays the outfield as well as I do, however.)

Benjamin Grimm Dec 05 2016 01:00 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Andy Martino says the Mets have been discussing Bruce with the Blue Jays, Tigers, and Orioles.

seawolf17 Dec 05 2016 01:08 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Ashie62 wrote: Marc Carig, Bruce or Grandy for a reliever with team control. I would trade Carig for a reliever. Any time you can get a useful part for a reporter, I say go for it.

Benjamin Grimm Dec 05 2016 01:15 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

I too would like them to get more than a 7th-inning reliever for Bruce. Maybe a reliever and a talented young outfielder. If, as I expect, Granderson sticks around for 2017, they'll still need a replacement for him in 2018. Lagares and Nimmo could be the guy for that, but having someone else in the mix would be worthwhile.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Dec 05 2016 06:29 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

I think you guys have an outsized opinion of the trade value of thirtysomething, um, offense-forward outfielders with market-rate salaries. A good reliever under multiple years of team control is about the roof for one of these guys. Any team trading for one of our corner outfielders is not going to give up a younger, talented outfielder for him.

Edgy MD Dec 05 2016 01:36 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Maybe not, but, well, it only takes one.

Ceetar Dec 05 2016 01:41 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: I think you guys have an outsized opinion of the trade value of thirtysomething, um, offense-forward outfielders with market-rate salaries. A good reliever under multiple years of team control is about the roof for one of these guys. Any team trading for one of our corner outfielders is not going to give up a younger, talented outfielder for him. no, but they might give up a single A type prospect that they've soured on but the Mets like. feel like there are probably at least a dozen of those guys out there. You can find and make talented relievers out of thin air practically, not worth weakened the team by trading Granderson for that. Bruce yes, Curtis no.

Centerfield Dec 05 2016 02:23 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

If all we can get is a Fernando Salas-type, then I'd be inclined to just hang on to both and sign Fernando Salas. Isn't it fair to say the market value for Bruce should be a ML-ready not-quite-blue-chip-but-still-promising hitter and an A ball pitcher with some upside?

Benjamin Grimm Dec 05 2016 02:27 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Yes, except that the market is a bit different in December than it is in late July. The Reds may have had fewer teams that were looking to take on a high-salary veteran at that point in the season when teams are falling into the categories of "buyers" and "sellers". But on the other hand, in July the subset teams that are buyers may be more desperate, so the Reds may have had more leverage. It's hard to say for sure.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Dec 05 2016 04:42 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Centerfield wrote: If all we can get is a Fernando Salas-type, then I'd be inclined to just hang on to both and sign Fernando Salas. Isn't it fair to say the market value for Bruce should be a ML-ready not-quite-blue-chip-but-still-promising hitter and an A ball pitcher with some upside? I think me and Radd might have a bet on this. I am taking "Winter Return" and he has "Summer Giveaway."

Vic Sage Dec 05 2016 04:52 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

wait, i'm betting on what exactly?

John Cougar Lunchbucket Dec 05 2016 04:56 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

I thought we discussed the idea of whether whatever we get for Bruce turns out to be better or worse than what we gave up to get him. I might have only baited you to take a bet on that, I forget the details. But I firmly believe (or am just rooting for) the idea that whatever we get for Bruce, I wouldn;t want to trade for Hererra and Wotell. Any takers say no? (I don't bet real money, just pride at stake)

Vic Sage Dec 05 2016 05:15 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: I thought we discussed the idea of whether whatever we get for Bruce turns out to be better or worse than what we gave up to get him. I might have only baited you to take a bet on that, I forget the details. But I firmly believe (or am just rooting for) the idea that whatever we get for Bruce, I wouldn;t want to trade for Hererra and Wotell. Any takers say no? (I don't bet real money, just pride at stake) if you mean can we get another team to give us 2 prospects (at least 1 of which is among their top 10) for Bruce, then yeah, i don't think so, and i'll take the bet. If you want to count a serviceable major league middle-inning/set-up guy (whose upside has already been determined) as being "better" than the potential of a team's top 10 prospect (whose future is unknowable at the time of the trade, but whose potential is greater than such a relief pitcher), then no, i won't take the bet.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Dec 05 2016 05:17 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Just for fun let's ask ourselves after its all done whether we'd then trade the Reds haul for the Mets haul.

Mets Guy in Michigan Dec 05 2016 05:31 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

I worry that we are selling Bruce short because we saw him at his worst. Guy had 99 RBI and a stack of homers. Granted, a big chunk of that was in the Cincy bandbox. But I fear there is thought to ship him out to clear the roster spot.

Edgy MD Dec 05 2016 05:39 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

The reality is that we got a guy leading the league in RBI, and his pace slowed considerably, suggesting his contract depreciated as an asset in the interim. And, of course, the Mets traded for eight months of him, and are now shopping six months of him. That said, if the Mets have been shrewd, that certainly doesn't mean they can't get more for him than they gave up. It's certainly a challenge, but we'll see. We're talking about the defending executive of the year! (Which will change in about 10 minutes when the 2016 award goes to Theo Epstein.)

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Dec 05 2016 07:06 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Salas wasn't what I was thinking. More like, Kelvin Herrera just before breakout, or, like, young Joe Smith. Again, if a team had a good-not-great ML-ready OF prospect, why on EARTH would they trade him for decline-phase, possibly-not-overall-good-anymore Jay Bruce instead of just playing/PT-ing him? If it seems like we're selling low, well, that might be underlined by the fact that we bought high.

Benjamin Grimm Dec 05 2016 07:11 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: Again, if a team had a good-not-great ML-ready OF prospect, why on EARTH would they trade him for decline-phase, possibly-not-overall-good-anymore Jay Bruce instead of just playing/PT-ing him? I wasn't thinking someone major-league ready. I was thinking of an outfielder who might be ready in 2018 instead.

MFS62 Dec 06 2016 02:19 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

I'm suggesting lefty hitting Bruce for righty hitting Ryan Braun, who has three or four more years on his contract (the next 2 @ 20 million). Fill in with AAAA types on both sides. Then the Mets trade Granderson for the help/ prospects needed to offset the budget bulge. Later

Ceetar Dec 06 2016 04:13 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

MFS62 wrote: I'm suggesting lefty hitting Bruce for righty hitting Ryan Braun, who has three or four more years on his contract (the next 2 @ 20 million). Fill in with AAAA types on both sides. Then the Mets trade Granderson for the help/ prospects needed to offset the budget bulge. Later Braun had almost the same wRC+ (weighted runs created) as Cespedes. That'd be a steal.

Vic Sage Dec 06 2016 10:32 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Ceetar wrote: MFS62 wrote: I'm suggesting lefty hitting Bruce for righty hitting Ryan Braun, who has three or four more years on his contract (the next 2 @ 20 million). Fill in with AAAA types on both sides. Then the Mets trade Granderson for the help/ prospects needed to offset the budget bulge. Later Braun had almost the same wRC+ (weighted runs created) as Cespedes. That'd be a steal. it's not a steal, it's a hallucination. Hey, MFS, lie down and let it pass.

MFS62 Dec 06 2016 11:30 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Vic Sage wrote: I'm suggesting lefty hitting Bruce for righty hitting Ryan Braun, who has three or four more years on his contract (the next 2 @ 20 million). Fill in with AAAA types on both sides. Then the Mets trade Granderson for the help/ prospects needed to offset the budget bulge. Later Braun had almost the same wRC+ (weighted runs created) as Cespedes. That'd be a steal. it's not a steal, it's a hallucination. Hey, MFS, lie down and let it pass. It was a genu-wine WATP, and don't you forget it. :) I was curious to see how long it would take for someone to notice/ comment on it. Later

Ashie62 Dec 07 2016 01:05 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Bruce for Braun. I would take Braun on either an analytical or subjective basis.

Nymr83 Dec 07 2016 05:55 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Braun, 33 this year, is owed a lot of money for a long time - between him and Wright the Mets could be sitting on some fat dead contracts right around the time the pitchers all become FA eligible. I still wouldnt say no to Bruce straight up, but MIL doesnt do that and i wont throw in a decent pitcher to get that done

Mex17 Dec 07 2016 11:05 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

I think that teams right now are trying to see if Sandy is going to panic and sell low on Bruce because they think that Sandy is afraid to go into Spring Training with both Bruce and Grandy on the roster. Sandy, in turn, needs to be willing to show that he is ready to play out the whole year with both of them (Grandy in CF and Bruce in RF). If that means that Conforto needs to get his playing time in Vegas this year, so be it. That's not ideal, but it's better than getting crud for a guy who has consistently displayed 25-30 HR and 80-100 RBI potential and who is still just 29 years old.

Edgy MD Dec 07 2016 01:18 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

If Alderson has demonstrated nothing else during his tenure, he's demonstrated a willingness to wait out the marketplace and work alternate partners in order to get the deal he wants.

Centerfield Dec 07 2016 02:10 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Edgy MD wrote: If Alderson has demonstrated nothing else during his tenure, he's demonstrated a willingness to wait out the marketplace and work alternate partners in order to get the deal he wants. Yup. On Braun, he may, and likely will, fade before the end of the contract, but he's coming off a strong year. 900+ OPS. Really only one off year in the past several. The guy can hit.

Nymr83 Dec 07 2016 02:45 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

where is his defense these days? its not the late 90's anymore where you trot Adam Dunn out to fake a position... or Derek Jeter.

Centerfield Dec 07 2016 03:10 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Nymr83 wrote: where is his defense these days? its not the late 90's anymore where you trot Adam Dunn out to fake a position... or Derek Jeter. No idea. But my point is that Braun is still going strong, while David is basically shot. So frustrating. You figure without the stenosis, Wright might be putting up these numbers himself.

Vic Sage Dec 07 2016 03:35 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Dec 07 2016 10:04 PM

Not that this trade is rumored or even a remote possibility, but Braun is so much a better player than Bruce that it's not even worth a discussion. For 9 of his 10 seasons, Braun's lowest OPS+ (130) is higher than any season of Bruce's career. Even Braun's worst year (113 OPS+ in 2014) is higher than Bruce's career average (109+). Over a similar number of plate appearances, Braun has averaged a WAR of 4.4/yr, while Bruce has produced 1.6. You don't like OPS+ or WAR? RC/game is 7.2 to 5.1. Come up with any evaluative measure you want, Braun is way better. And whatever his defensive deficiencies at this point, he's still a better OFer than Bruce (he is now and always was). But talking about defense for a corner OFer with a career .910 ops and a 141 OPS+ (!) is like evaluating Beyonce's sex appeal based on her personality. What fucking difference does it make? As for age and contract, Braun will play next season at age 33 (with Bruce turning 30), and Braun's contract averages $20m/yr for 4 more years (his age 33-36 seasons), neither of which are huge numbers for that sort of production these days. So it would take more than just a decent pitching prospect for the Brewers to even consider a Bruce/Braun deal, and i would hope that, in whatever alternate reality such a proposal was made, Sandy would leap at it, as long as pitcher does not include our top 5 major league starters [syndegaard-degrom-harvey-matz-wheeler). I'd be ok with Gsellman (or Lugo, Ynoa, Montero, etc.) + Bruce for Braun. If they insisted on either of our top pitching prospects, Dunn or Szapucki (instead of Gsellman etal), i'd want a decent prospect back, too. And i don't know how Wright's contract factors into this discussion at all. Oh, and i'd take Adam Dunn in his prime in a heartbeat.

Edgy MD Dec 07 2016 03:42 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

Man, and you used to argue for Bruce winning a Gold Glove.

Vic Sage Dec 07 2016 03:43 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

i did?

Edgy MD Dec 07 2016 03:45 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

It totally happened!

Vic Sage Dec 07 2016 10:02 PM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

i think i need to lie down.

Ashie62 Dec 09 2016 12:55 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

There appears to be minimal interest from other teams for Bruce or Granderson at this point.

Edgy MD Dec 09 2016 03:30 AM Re: Trade Jay Bruce

I would say that it's probably not minimal, so much as not maximal enough to entice the Mets to deal just yet.