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LoDuca/Piazza

Bret Sabermetric Mar 04 2006 04:38 PM

My seatmate at the Knicks' game last night (95 bucks for nosebleed seats!), about as knowledgable about the Knicks as I am about the Mets, swapped some info with me on the two teams. He asked me "What about this new catcher?" and I quipped "He's sort of like Bizarro Piazza." I elaborated: Not much of a hitter/ Hell of a hitter good thrower/ pisspoor thrower red-assed handler of pitchers/ candy-assed handler of pitchers You can fill out more items on my list (These lists are fun, aren't they?), but I've read in several places how LoDuca's style is to get in his pitchers' faces (think Jerry Grote after his greenie kicks in). You may not read the same articles I do, but my impression is that Piazza's role model was more like a lobotomized green vegetable than Grote on greenies. He was very supportive, let the pitchers throw whatever they wanted to, never gave them grief (which explains why they all said "Mike's a fabulous catcher." It's a great style to work with, from a pitcher's immediate perspective, but I think he didn't always get their best efforts out of them.) Anyway, I don't really want to trash Mike's catching as much as I want to discuss Loduca--has anyone else heard about his mad-Rottweiler attitude? I think it's another piece of good news for Mets fans.

Johnny Dickshot Mar 04 2006 04:51 PM

Latest on Lo Duca is that he hasn't played yet (wrist tendonitis). That's the kinda injury they always say is minor but can last for weeks.

OlerudOwned Mar 04 2006 05:19 PM

Johnny Dickshot wrote: Latest on Lo Duca is that he hasn't played yet (wrist tendonitis). That's the kinda injury they always say is minor but can last for weeks. I caught in the Daily News blurb that he said he gets that every year in Spring since he had wrist surgery 6 years ago. From the paper ]"Just take a couple of days' rest and it's fine," Lo Duca said. "When it goes away, I don't feel it for the rest of the year" So he should be ok.

Elster88 Mar 04 2006 05:26 PM

]red-assed handler of pitchers/ candy-assed handler of pitchers I'm unfamiliar with Piazza's candy-assedness.

Nymr83 Mar 04 2006 06:05 PM Re: LoDuca/Piazza

Bret Sabermetric wrote: Piazza's role model was more like a lobotomized green vegetable than Grote on greenies. He was very supportive, let the pitchers throw whatever they wanted to, never gave them grief (which explains why they all said "Mike's a fabulous catcher." It's a great style to work with, from a pitcher's immediate perspective, but I think he didn't always get their best efforts out of them.) i know you hate piazza but from where are you getting the idea that his defensive game lacked anything besides a strong throwing arm? can you show these pitchers who (you admit) liked him pitched better without him around?

soupcan Mar 04 2006 06:29 PM

I have no knowledge of any of this one way or the other but I have heard that LoDuca's tough on pitchers. The way Piazza is described doesn't surprise me though. He always had a laid-back attitude. Not so far-fetched to think that he let the pitchers call the shots. (back later tonight with pictures and a spring training report from today's events...)

smg58 Mar 04 2006 11:49 PM

LoDuca had a great year throwing out baserunners in 03 (41%), but he threw out 28% in 04 and 25% in 05. I'm not sure the "strong arm" description still applies. If the downward trend continues he won't be that much of an upgrade. As far as how he handles pitchers, let's see if there's a noticeable improvement in how the pitchers who were here last year perform. Before that, we have no real evidence to pass any judgement.

Nymr83 Mar 05 2006 12:17 AM

When our staff ERA is higher than last year will Bret blame LoDuca along with Minaya, or does he only get the credit from Mr. Piazza-hater if the Mets pitchers do better?

Bret Sabermetric Mar 07 2006 12:13 PM Re: LoDuca/Piazza

Nymr83 wrote: ="Bret Sabermetric"] Piazza's role model was more like a lobotomized green vegetable than Grote on greenies. He was very supportive, let the pitchers throw whatever they wanted to, never gave them grief (which explains why they all said "Mike's a fabulous catcher." It's a great style to work with, from a pitcher's immediate perspective, but I think he didn't always get their best efforts out of them.) i know you hate piazza but from where are you getting the idea that his defensive game lacked anything besides a strong throwing arm? can you show these pitchers who (you admit) liked him pitched better without him around? Welll, that's kinda what I'm asking here. I know I've read some articles over the years that gave me the impression that Mikey isn't the most aggressive challenger of his pitchers, but it's only since being exposed to recent stories about LoDuca's in-your-face style of interacting with his pitchers that the contrast came to mind. It's only logical that some catchers would be far more aggressive and some would be far more passive than others, and it seems very consistent with Mikey's laid-back stance that he'd be among the least likely to risk upsetting a pitcher in order to get more focussed pitching out of him. That's what I always took these "Mike's not a vocal leader, he leads by example" defenses of his style to be about. He lets you do your thing, and he does his--which is fine, unless you're thinking that Grote's style worked and that more catchers should adopt it, as LoDuca has. Of course there's also a lot of irrational hatred going on here, no two ways about that. I'll say anything at all about Pizza as long it makes him look bad. But you know that.

MFS62 Mar 07 2006 12:39 PM

I've recently read some stories that said that LoDuca has been suffereng from an Arthritic condition in his hand. Maybe that's a contributing factor in his declinine in throw-out rate. Or, it could just be that the new pitchers on the LA staff don't hold runners on as well as the pitchers he caught a few years ago. Later