Jul 19 2017 06:01 AM
Re: Steven Matz
Ceetar wrote:
Stephen Matz, by himself, has started more World Series games than Generation K combined in their career. |
I mean...
Master Index of Archived Threads
Steven Matz
| Fake Met fan | 4 votes |
| Weird wifey | 3 votes |
| Way too fragile | 9 votes |
| Unreliable | 8 votes |
| Inconsistent | 8 votes |
| No idea how to get by when his absolute best stuff isn't there | 10 votes |
| Hitting the disabled list within 5 minutes | 9 votes |
| Future author of a no-hitter for the MFYs | 4 votes |
| Won't be around the next time the Mets make the playoffs | 6 votes |
| Probably looks up to Matt Harvey | 4 votes |
| John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 16 2017 05:53 PM |
|
This guy...
|
| Edgy MD Jul 16 2017 06:01 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Looks sad a lot.
|
| d'Kong76 Jul 16 2017 06:14 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Good poll, write in: all of the above...
|
| Ashie62 Jul 16 2017 08:03 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
You forgot p---y.
|
| Ashie62 Jul 16 2017 08:42 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I would expect an MRI sooner rather than later.
|
| Ashie62 Jul 16 2017 08:58 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Stop throwing sliders Steve.
|
| Edgy MD Jul 16 2017 09:01 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Agreed, there. Pretty weird since he reportedly has only been recently bringing them back into his rep. But nothing he threw had vertical movement, leaving him dead in the water.
|
| smg58 Jul 16 2017 10:43 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
While he wasn't out as long as Wheeler, expecting him to avoid bumps in the road turned out to be overly optimistic. I think he will be fine long-term, but unfortunately I can't make any promises for the rest of this season.
|
| metirish Jul 17 2017 03:40 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Was hoping WANKER was in the poll......voted for them all except no-no for the wankers
|
| LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 18 2017 02:38 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Starting to get the Generation K kinda feeling here.
|
| Ceetar Jul 18 2017 01:24 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
|
Stephen Matz, by himself, has started more World Series games than Generation K combined in their career.
|
| LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Jul 19 2017 06:01 AM Re: Steven Matz |
||
|
I mean...
|
| Ceetar Jul 19 2017 01:16 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
They went to the playoffs twice, the World Series once. They legitimately were a few breaks from a championship. It's in no way comparable to Generation K.
|
| John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 19 2017 02:39 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I'm open to trading his butt for prospects this week. If we can hang onto deG-Syn-Whee-Gs, plus FlexMan and whomever else (Free Agent X) we could prolly survive his loss, and even given his availability issues, that WS start, lefthandedness, contract status and stuff oughta intrigue someone.
|
| Ceetar Jul 19 2017 02:43 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
|
I'm attached to Matz. I want him to become the best Met ever. His debut was my daughter's first game, so it'd be cool if that still meant something when she's old enough to understand what that means. I should probably get her first game certificate signed by him regardless though. I'm wondering if I should just mail it to Citi Field as the best route though.
|
| John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 19 2017 03:08 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
He's never going to be my favorite Met. We were onto this guy early! http://archives.thecranepool.net/11700/f1_t11720.shtml
|
| seawolf17 Jul 19 2017 03:18 PM Re: Steven Matz |
||
|
Good catch by OO in there:
|
| metirish Jul 19 2017 06:48 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
That was indeed a fun read
|
| John Cougar Lunchbucket Jul 27 2017 03:15 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
You know who sucks? Steven Matz. What garbage. What a complete buzzkill this guy is.
|
| Chad Ochoseis Jul 27 2017 03:24 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I'm looking for "Jon Niese in disguise" among the choices.
|
| A Boy Named Seo Jul 27 2017 03:41 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Wait, so we didn't get Damien Magnifico??
|
| A Boy Named Seo Jul 27 2017 03:41 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Wait, so we didn't get Damien Magnifico??
|
| smg58 Jul 27 2017 09:15 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
He's in the White House with Scaramucci.
|
| Lefty Specialist Jul 27 2017 12:24 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
So, what's the injury going to be this time? Forearm tightness? Butterflies in stomach? Wrenched ankle?
|
| MFS62 Jul 27 2017 01:31 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
|
The vapors. Later
|
| Edgy MD Jul 27 2017 01:49 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I'm seeing a paucity of curveballs thrown across the staff, but it's particularly concerning with him and Wheeler, who presumably have the best ones. And the curve provided him with his best moments last night.
|
| Ceetar Jul 27 2017 01:54 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
|
Isn't this one of the things Warthen is known for? Sliders instead of curveballs?
|
| Centerfield Aug 08 2017 01:46 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I wonder if he's healthy.
|
| Lefty Specialist Aug 09 2017 12:31 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I have to think there's something wrong. Given his history there a high probability he's pitching with an injury of some kind.
|
| smg58 Aug 09 2017 02:19 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
It may be a case of not building up a rhythm or enough stamina following an injury, in which case you just have to be patient with him. (Now granted, I'd feel a lot more confident saying that if I trusted the Mets' doctors more.)
|
| 86-Dreamer Aug 09 2017 03:01 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
He has shown great skill when healthy and has stunk when he is hurt. Unfortunately hurt more often than not. I hope he gets healthy and has a great career.
|
| Ashie62 Aug 10 2017 12:43 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Seems like a head case.
|
| John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 18 2017 12:16 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Booooo
|
| HahnSolo Aug 18 2017 12:38 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I'm done. Maybe some pitching desperate team can be fooled into thinking he's still good. Maybe Baltimore.
|
| dgwphotography Aug 18 2017 01:19 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Shell shocked. There are times where he just looks scared
|
| metirish Aug 18 2017 12:33 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
|
This, on one occasion when Wharten came to the mound to talk to him Matz looked terrified , like he was going to burst out crying.....
|
| Ashie62 Aug 18 2017 12:34 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Steven Matz. "It sucks to suck. I know that."
|
| John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 18 2017 02:59 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
He's mopey and feels sorry for himself. We should trade him for a guy who isn't mopey and doesn't feel sorry for himself.
|
| seawolf17 Aug 18 2017 04:37 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
|
"I prefer pitchers who don't give up runs, okay?"
|
| LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Aug 18 2017 05:20 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
HEY MATZ! GET YER HEAD OUTTA YER ASS AND PITCH, YA PANSY!
|
| John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 21 2017 08:40 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Good news = Matz shutting down for a while!
|
| Benjamin Grimm Aug 21 2017 08:49 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
It sadly occurred to me this morning that more than seven months will pass before the Mets again play a game that I really care about.
|
| dgwphotography Aug 21 2017 09:58 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Possible surgery for Matz:
|
| RealityChuck Aug 21 2017 10:47 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Odd thought:
|
| Ashie62 Aug 21 2017 11:04 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Maybe the kid should find another line of work.
|
| Edgy MD Aug 22 2017 12:00 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I'm guessing he's totally not going to find another line of work.
|
| seawolf17 Aug 22 2017 01:14 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
|
"Looking at your resume here, you've got a LOT of gaps in your history where you didn't seem to be doing much of anything."
|
| Centerfield Aug 22 2017 01:01 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I think the Mets owe Steven Matz a pretty big apology. The incompetence is unbelievable.
|
| Frayed Knot Aug 22 2017 02:21 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
|
Meaning what, that the team should have somehow prevented this from happening to him? I don't get it.
|
| Centerfield Aug 22 2017 02:31 PM Re: Steven Matz |
||
|
Meaning they should have diagnosed him correctly instead of labeling him "soft". http://www.nj.com/mets/index.ssf/2017/0 ... hat_t.html
|
| smg58 Aug 22 2017 03:16 PM Re: Steven Matz Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 22 2017 03:22 PM |
|
Per Mark Carig (Newsday's Mets reporter), Matz has been pitching through pain all season. If he was performing reasonably well and the pain was something that offseason rest or surgery could take care of, you could have justified letting him pitch this long. Either the Mets have a rather broad definition of "reasonably well," or somebody (medical staff, front office, or both) is failing to do their job.
|
| HahnSolo Aug 22 2017 03:19 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I think there was a bit of frustration from the front office ("this guy's hurt again?") and they probably pushed him to try and pitch through it.
|
| smg58 Aug 22 2017 03:27 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
We as fans don't know what's going on behind the scenes, and can only speculate. I feel bad about it now, but it's what we do. Nobody's paying us to run a baseball team. But while I give DeGrom plenty of credit for suggesting "Hey Steve, you should get your nerves checked," that suggestion should have come from the Mets' doctors several months ago.
|
| seawolf17 Aug 22 2017 03:48 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Mets gonna Mets.
|
| Edgy MD Aug 22 2017 04:00 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I got an idea when somebody is playing baseball wrong, or counterproductively. I really think I do.
|
| Benjamin Grimm Aug 22 2017 04:07 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I suspected he was hurt, only because his history has been that when he's healthy he pitches really well, and when he doesn't it's been because he's been hurt.
|
| Centerfield Aug 22 2017 05:07 PM Re: Steven Matz |
||
|
Yes. It's much harder to tell. Obviously we can't watch the exams unfold in front of us, with retired doctors commentating saying "Roll that back, see right there? That's where he missed it. Should have gone with the X374 scope and it would have been like reading a newspaper. Stupid." All we can do is look at the results. Look, we only follow the Mets so we can't compare apples to apples, but the Mets doctors certainly seem to be incompetent. From the article:
It's just mind boggling. "I don't know Steven. It's a head scratcher. Elbow pain. Drop in velocity, sudden negative impact on performance. Really I got nothing." Thank you Doc. I appreciate you trying. "My pleasure Steven." [shows him out of the room] "Lorraine, who's my next appointment?" [voice from offstage: "It's Jacob deGrom sir. His file is on your chair"] [thumbing through the chart] "Hmmm. Ulnar nerve in the elbow. Huh. That's something you don't see every day."
|
| Ceetar Aug 22 2017 06:26 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Did they check him for Spinal Stinosis? I mean, one guy on the team has that too. Better make sure.
|
| Ashie62 Aug 22 2017 07:16 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Same surgery as deGrom?
|
| A Boy Named Seo Aug 22 2017 07:25 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I feel bad for Matz, and if he felt like the team had this "rub some dirt on it, don't be a pussy" view of him, then yah, he's gonna try to pitch through it (and look like crap doing it). I mean, if the dude can't throw a ball without pain in the 4 days since his last start, why in the world would anyone think he'd feel good on the 5th day? Shut him down and keep digging for the cause.
|
| Ceetar Aug 22 2017 07:30 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
|
Because A. He didn't feel like the team had that view of him. He and the Mets were on the same page. and B. He COULD throw the ball without pain. It was just between starts he was having issues.
|
| A Boy Named Seo Aug 22 2017 08:57 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|||
|
So he had "elbow discomfort all season" except the days he pitched baseballs in games? And that article seems to disagree with your first point.
That doesn't sound like the Mets and Matz being on the same page, unless you mean both sides pushing for "ignore the pain, keep pitching".
|
| Ceetar Aug 22 2017 09:01 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|||
|
The articles state he had inflammation between starts.
[url]http://www.newsday.com/beta/sports/baseball/mets/steven-matz-may-need-elbow-surgery-source-says-1.14080944
|
| Ceetar Aug 22 2017 09:04 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
|
Also the diagnosis:
That doesn't exactly seem like something you just do on a whim. "Well, maybe it's this? let's try numbing the nerve!" I mean, that would've likely mandated another DL stint and both sides opted to try to pitch. And Terry's quotes are correct. He very well could've taken the ball as normal.
|
| Zvon Aug 23 2017 03:38 AM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I think you can stick a fork in Matz. He's done.
|
| Centerfield Aug 23 2017 07:42 PM Re: Steven Matz |
||||
|
It's crazy. I feel like you go into a subject with a preconception, read whatever is presented to you, then come out with the same conclusion regardless of the news might say. It's pretty clear. Matz pitched through pain all year. It affected him during, and between starts, to varying degrees of severity. Instead of persisting until they found an answer, they told him to grit his teeth and fight through it. In the end, he was hurt. In the same exact way deGrom was hurt. It's foolish. Anyway, surgery was a success. Let's hope he has the same results as deGrom.
|
| Centerfield Aug 23 2017 07:44 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
By the way, I nominate Steven Matz for the Mr. "Best Shape of My Life" Spring Training 2018.
|
| Edgy MD Aug 23 2017 07:48 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
Dude really needs to grow his hair during rehab. He's been looking way too respectable.
|
| Ceetar Aug 23 2017 08:23 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|||
|
I go into everything looking for facts. My spidey-sense goes up when I hear LOLMets style coverage that doesn't fit the facts or contradicts itself.
It's clear he pitched through pain, at various times. To varying degrees of success too. You can argue they should've shut him down and run every test imaginable until they got a conclusive answer, but you can't argue that that's the ONLY way to handle it, nor even that Matz would've consented to it. He didn't have the same symptoms as deGrom, so besides the idea that "hey, here is a thing that happens to a small subset of pitchers" there wasn't necessarily an obvious medical reason to go to the hospital to have an ultrasound-guided needle shoved into his arm to inject a numbing agent into a nerve. They DIDN'T tell him to grit his teeth and pitch through it. One singular person, somewhere in the organization, said that the topic of learning to pitch with pain could be something that Matz needs to figure out. There is no indication that they said this to Matz. That they said this to Warthen or Collins. That it's even someone with more authority than the intern getting the GM coffee. And in truth, it's a reasonable thought to a clean MRI post-surgery, if one that should ultimately be dismissed when the pain doesn't get better/change after a few starts.
I mean, clearly there should've just queried the diagnostic computer inside Matz's elbow and asked it what error it was showing. I'm not sure it's actually foolish to pitch a guy who DOESN'T have any elbow damage and is still throwing fine and is responding to pain meds and even had a stretch of success with that protocol.
|
| John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 23 2017 09:00 PM Re: Steven Matz |
|
I think what's lost in the translation in these stories is a true understanding for the degree to which all athletes deal with pain from day to day and how much or how little that differs between guys who require surgery and guys who don't. Bob Ojeda wrote a whole story in the Times that said his arm hurt every day for his entire career.
|
