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Shopping List

Gwreck Aug 21 2017 10:26 PM

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/compe ... ee-agents/ Now that we've traded 25% of the roster, saved money this year, and have huge drops in obligations for next year, I'm ready to go shopping. From this list, I think we need the following to be serious about challenging the Washingtons and Los Angeles of the league: 1. Hosmer or Duda 2. Moustakas 3. Lucroy (or maybe Wieters, if his value drops because of his crappy year) 4. Darvish 5. Reliever I'm also factoring in that we save money on our manager by shifting David into that role. And he can player-manage if he ever gets healthy.

HahnSolo Aug 21 2017 11:42 PM Re: Shopping List

Not blown away by anybody on that list. I don't think with Smith on board that first base will be a priority. Of the guys you mentioned I think Moustakas and Darvish would be at the top of my wish list.

Chad Ochoseis Aug 21 2017 11:46 PM Re: Shopping List

I was wondering what the effect on the insurance payments would be if the team moved Dabidrye into a non-playing role. My guess, having worked in large accounts insurance for a good part of my life, is that even if it technically meant that the payments would cease, the terms could be negotiated. The Mets are a prestige client, and unlike regular schlubs like you and me, prestige clients have negotiating power. And the insurance company would probably be glad to pay part of their obligation and have Wright take a FO/managerial position (or even play a symbolic game or two) rather than pay the full obligation while the Mets keep him on the 60-day indefinitely. I have to believe he's finished as an effective player, though, and I have no clue what kind of manager he'd be. He never struck me as a font of baseball wisdom. Duda, not Bruce? So we'd be saying Smith is definitely not ready yet. If we were to sign one of the ex-Met lefty sluggers, as much of a Duda fan as I am, I'd rather have Bruce, who can muddle his way through 1B almost as well as Duda, while being less than a complete flop as a corner outfielder if we need one. So, what is our outfield next year, anyway? Cespedes in left for sure. Conforto someplace. Lagares/Nimmo platoon in center and Conforto in right? I'd be happy to see Conforto in center, Bruce in left, and Smith at 1B, with the possibility of Nimmo or Lagares in center, Conforto in right, and Bruce at 1B if Smith doesn't live up to his billing. Of course, this would imply moving either Nimmo or Lagares; I don't know if we could keep them both on the bench. Or go all in with Smitty and take a run at a corner outfielder like JD Martinez, assuming Conforto in CF. Moustakas. So, we don't pick up Cabrera's option and Flores becomes our second baseman, I think, with Cecchini on the bench. Or Cecchini becomes our second baseman with Flores on the bench. I can see that. Lucroy or Wieters over d'Arnaud? D'Arnaud hasn't blown anyone away, but Lucroy's and Wieters' best years are behind them. I don't buy into WAR, but d'Arnaud's was higher this year than either Lucroy's or Wieters', and the traditional numbers were almost identical to Wieters' and not a whole lot worse than Lucroy's. D'Arnaud's turned into a pretty good defensive catcher. I'd like an upgrade, but if Lucroy and Wieters are the best available, I'll pass and give d'Arnaud another year to live up to his billing. Rotation of Syndergaard, Darvish, DeGrom, and two of Wheeler, Harvey, Gsellman, Lugo, Matz, Montero? Yeah , I guess we have to do this. Whatever happened to five aces, anyway? Relievers - I see both Ollie Perez and Eric O'Flaherty are available! Trade chips - one of Lagares and Nimmo, one of Flores and Cecchini, any number of second-rank pitchers. Don't know what that would get for us, or what we'd need, unless that could bring back a catcher better than d'Arnaud. Mostly, what we need for 2018 is for Syndergaard to not tear any more muscles and Wheeler and Lugo to come back and be OK, at least. That would be a huge boost.

Frayed Knot Aug 22 2017 03:11 AM Re: Shopping List

Unless you guys have already decided, based on 35 or whatever ABs, that Dom Smith is a bust (and convinced Sandy of such) and needs to be traded/dumped/warehoused/tased immediately, the Mets ARE NOT spending their allowance on a multi-year deal for a FA 1B next year. I have no idea why folks keep going back to this and certainly not why it seems to be their choice as to where to start a rebuild. I also have no idea why folks keep obsessing about the specifics of Wright's insurance policy. If he can play then it's a non-issue, and if he can't then it's a matter for their accounting department to deal with and essentially status quo for how it's been for nearly two seasons now. They built teams with him on the payroll and also while he's on the shelf. Of the top 50 or so issues I fret over concerning the Mets, the details of the insurance policy the Mets have on Wright is like 84th on my list.

Gwreck Aug 22 2017 03:38 AM Re: Shopping List

The Mets don't need a rebuild. They need an injection of offense. This has been the team's biggest problem for what, the last 4 years or more? They've got exactly 2 proven major league hitters in the lineup for next year: Cespedes and Conforto. Maybe 3 if you want to count Cabrera or half of Wilmer Flores.

Frayed Knot Aug 22 2017 10:31 AM Re: Shopping List

I agree they need an injection of offense, I'm just saying that there are at least four other positions -- 2nd, 3rd, C, and at least one OF slot -- where they should look to upgrade before they get around to 1st base and that, even if you want to bolster 1B in order to either platoon with Smith or to allow him more time to ferment in AAA, I can't possibly seeing that help coming in the form of a veteran FA who's likely to only be available via a multi-year deal.

Edgy MD Aug 22 2017 12:22 PM Re: Shopping List

Moustakas schmoustakas.

Ceetar Aug 22 2017 01:17 PM Re: Shopping List

Darvish. Darvish first priority. get Darvish. Darvish Darvish Darvish.

Frayed Knot Aug 22 2017 01:41 PM Re: Shopping List

Darvish: just turned 31, lotta mileage on him (full-timer in Japan starting at age 19), hasn't had a full season in MLB since 2013 (64 starts total from 2014-17) and is currently on the DL again. Not saying we should cross him off our lists but doesn't strike me as an "All-In" type either.

Ceetar Aug 22 2017 01:53 PM Re: Shopping List

Frayed Knot wrote: Darvish: just turned 31, lotta mileage on him (full-timer in Japan starting at age 19), hasn't had a full season in MLB since 2013 (64 starts total from 2014-17) and is currently on the DL again. Not saying we should cross him off our lists but doesn't strike me as an "All-In" type either. He's the best option. Could trade for someone if you prefer. Get another top flight starter.

Centerfield Aug 22 2017 02:27 PM Re: Shopping List

Frayed Knot wrote: Unless you guys have already decided, based on 35 or whatever ABs, that Dom Smith is a bust (and convinced Sandy of such) and needs to be traded/dumped/warehoused/tased immediately, the Mets ARE NOT spending their allowance on a multi-year deal for a FA 1B next year. I have no idea why folks keep going back to this and certainly not why it seems to be their choice as to where to start a rebuild. I think you are right that the Mets will not spend on a free agent first baseman. I think they, like you, are set in giving Dominic Smith a chance, no matter what. I don't agree with this strategy. I think you have to look to upgrade the offense, where ever those upgrades might be available. Sure, it would be easier to upgrade at our available positions, but good luck finding a 30 HR, 800+ OPS guy at CF or catcher. All options have to be on the table for a "win now" team. If that means Lucas Duda is the best option (cost, production, etc), then he has to be in the picture, along with everyone else. And just because you sign Duda doesn't mean you have to put Smith out to pasture. Duda might be had for a three year deal. Smith is only 22 years old and can play in the minors another season. If the right trade comes along, you take it. If not, there's no urgency. Also, if Duda doesn't work out, or gets hurt, then you plug in Smith who costs you nothing. Again, I agree with you that it need to be the first option, that seems unnecessary, but it should be an option. There's no reason a big market team should limit themselves. Frayed Knot wrote: I also have no idea why folks keep obsessing about the specifics of Wright's insurance policy. If he can play then it's a non-issue, and if he can't then it's a matter for their accounting department to deal with and essentially status quo for how it's been for nearly two seasons now. They built teams with him on the payroll and also while he's on the shelf. Of the top 50 or so issues I fret over concerning the Mets, the details of the insurance policy the Mets have on Wright is like 84th on my list. I think it's obvious. If the Mets collect insurance for the Wright contract, that opens up more payroll. If they don't, this is a money drain and limits their ability to sign productive players. Are you saying that the Mets build their team the same way whether or not Wright is a drain on payroll? I don't agree with that at all.

Ceetar Aug 22 2017 02:43 PM Re: Shopping List

I mean, i like Duda and he's a good player, but I think you might look for someone that offers a bit more flexibility, if you that player is the best choice for adding offense, in a "Smith and Duda both mashing" scenario, like someone you could play at third, or RF, in a pinch. I'm not sure either of those guys are that, though the Mets still sorta consider Flores a potential SS so I dunno. They've very obviously been okay with bad defense.

Vic Sage Aug 22 2017 03:13 PM Re: Shopping List Edited 3 time(s), most recently on Aug 22 2017 03:38 PM

while i agree about adding offense, lets first acknowledge that offense wasn't what cost them this season (they're much better than league average in runs). It was the devastation to their pitching staff that did it (with nearly the worst Runs Allowed). That being said, what they need is greater consistency in offensive production, rather the boom-or-bust lineup we've been fielding. We score a greater % of our runs on HRs than just about anybody. We go from winning an 8-7 game to losing a 7-2 game. What we need are OB guys; line drive hitters that make consistent contact, work the count, get walks, to balance the lineup. Conforto has been sort of up and down in that regard, and Cespedes is purely a streak hitter. But the description sounds like Dom Smith to me, or at least that's his hitting profile. And if we're not building with him and Rosario, then what exactly are we building with? You simply cannot build around young pitching because of its high rate of injury and inconsistency. I think sitting Smith in AAA or on the bench, while we get another boom/bust bat at 1b would be a grave error. I want to see, once and for all, if Nimmo can be a major league hitter and platoon him with Lagares in CF, with Conforto in RF. Nimmo is the kind of line-drive OB guy i'm looking for, if he can hit .300/.375/.425, but lets actually give him and Smith a season and find out. Then, at least, we'll know. I think our greatest FA needs are at either 2b or 3b, wherever we can find the most consistent bat/glove (I think Flores can play the other position, whichever one we get), at catcher, and in the starting rotation. With Familia and Ramos in the pen (and the dozen RPs we've just traded for), i think we'll be able to field a decent pen, but we simply cannot rely on Harvey, Wheeler and Matz again for the rotation. They've shown absolutely no indication that they can pitch a full baseball season in the majors without some significant injury. And Gsellman, Flexen and Montero should be depth/emergency options only. I think Syndegaard is entitled to this injury before he joins them, due to his incredible upside and full season performances to date. So I think we go into next season with Syndy, DeGrom and _____, _____, and _____. I'm willing to wait and see on the 4th and 5th slots, to see if any of the walking wounded come around, but we need at least one strong veteran pitcher that can be a #2-#3, and will eat innings in a consistent and competent manner. So I don't think Darvish is reliable enough. As for Moustakas, i don't like his offensive approach for our lineup. And Weiters? No catchers over 30 and in decline, please. What else ya got? So i want a bat at 2nd or 3rd, a solid 2-way catcher, and a good mid-rotation SPer. These are necessities; everything above that is gravy, IMO.

Frayed Knot Aug 22 2017 03:14 PM Re: Shopping List

I think you are right that the Mets will not spend on a free agent first baseman. I think they, like you, are set in giving Dominic Smith a chance, no matter what. If they believe in Dom Smith then his chance is now. If they don't then get rid of him or find some temporary option. But they're not going to stow him in the minors or use him to PH 2-3 times per week while a FA who only plays the only position he plays play out their (likely to be long) contract. I've been saying this for months now concerning Duda when folks either wanted to QO him or deal him then re-sign him: he and Smith hit from the same side and are limited to only one position so this is one OR the other. The only way to possibly do both is if Lucas can somehow agree, during the first and likely last optimal FA chance he's going to get, to sign a one-year deal, and even then I'm not sure that's the route to go. I liked big Luc as much as anyone but he's a low-average slugger, vulnerable to LHP, who turns 32 this winter and already has trouble staying on the field (<500 ABs combined in 2016-17). And if it's Hosmer, the just-turned 28 y/o All-Star coming off his best season, you're probably looking at five years minimum and maybe longer. There is plenty of middle ground between 'Smith full time with no fallback', and, 'after two weeks we deem him not ready so we must go out and sign a big market FA' Meanwhile, plenty of other spots on the roster need to be filled that DON'T have 22 y/o prospects with nothing left to prove in the minors sitting in your lap. If the Mets collect insurance for the Wright contract, that opens up more payroll. If they don't, this is a money drain and limits their ability to sign productive players. Because it's not like whether the insurance kicks in is part of some sort of decision on their part. If he can't get back to playing condition then the status quo continues as it has since sometime in 2016 -- more money for payroll ... Yay!! (I guess) If he can rehab then they either have to pay him and use him or negotiate how much of the remainder they want to pay in order to make him go away. But the team can't simply decide to choose one of those options over the other.

Vic Sage Aug 22 2017 03:36 PM Re: Shopping List

regarding payroll, i think our ownership doesn't get the benefit of the doubt that they'd put any savings back into the team rather than their pocket (or to service their debts). Look at all the deals they've just made... we received NO real prospects, just payroll relief and a shitload of hard throwing right-handed RPs with minimal success in the minors to date. If we wanted actual prospects, we would've picked up some of the salary of our outgoing guys. But no, they just wanted to save the cash. And there's no indication that they'll be willing to spend next year at this year's levels.

41Forever Aug 22 2017 03:58 PM Re: Shopping List

I agree about Dom Smith. Doesn't seem right to stash him in Vegas as an insurance policy without seeing what he can really do. The two homers so far are encouraging. Lucas seemed like a great guy and a good player. But he was really streaky and it sure seemed like he was hurt a lot. He'll go to the AL and be a heck of a DH.

Gwreck Aug 22 2017 04:34 PM Re: Shopping List

Vic Sage wrote: What else ya got? Link at top is players who will be free agents at end of season. Who do you suggest?

smg58 Aug 22 2017 04:45 PM Re: Shopping List

They need one more infielder for second or third. Otherwise, I'm OK with what they have as position players. Rosario and Smith will be better for their time spent in Queens this year. I'd be in on an ace starter like Darvish. But my interest mid-range starters would depend on a fair, honest assessment of the health of our staff. As for the pen... you have to be careful. Chapman is getting paid an awful lot for his 4.14 ERA, and Melancon is having trouble staying healthy. But failure to spend money on next year's pen is not an option.

Centerfield Aug 22 2017 04:49 PM Re: Shopping List

Frayed Knot wrote: If they believe in Dom Smith then his chance is now. If they don't then get rid of him or find some temporary option. But they're not going to stow him in the minors or use him to PH 2-3 times per week while a FA who only plays the only position he plays play out their (likely to be long) contract. Why does it have to be now? There's nothing saying Dom Smith has to be used in 2018. It's not like he's out of options. If he's called up in 2019 he'll only be 24 years old then. Just because Lucas Duda is signed to a three year deal doesn't mean Duda can't be traded in 2019, or Smith can be traded in 2019, or one of them could get hurt. Who knows. I get that there are more obvious places to upgrade, but no option should be off the table. We once had a promising young stud catcher coming back from an injury but we traded for an All-Star catcher anyway. No, Lucas Duda is not Mike Piazza, but sometimes it makes sense to take the best option available, even if it means displacing another option. Frayed Knot wrote: Because it's not like whether the insurance kicks in is part of some sort of decision on their part. If he can't get back to playing condition then the status quo continues as it has since sometime in 2016 -- more money for payroll ... Yay!! (I guess) If he can rehab then they either have to pay him and use him or negotiate how much of the remainder they want to pay in order to make him go away. But the team can't simply decide to choose one of those options over the other. I think the point Chad was trying to make was to see if the Mets, and David, and the insurance company can reach some sort of agreement that allows David to move into a non-playing role, where David still gets paid, but the insurance still covers part of it. That way, it absolutely is something that the Mets could choose, and most importantly, know what their obligations will be before going into the season.

Centerfield Aug 22 2017 04:58 PM Re: Shopping List

Meanwhile, back to the original point, as a knee-jerk reaction, I think Lorenzo Cain and Wade Davis make a lot of sense. Don't know enough about Cain to know if he's likely to hold up in CF at 31 years old, and of course Davis is a risk, coming off the surgery, but I'd be inclined to start there. Wouldn't kick JD Martinez or Yu out of bed either.

Benjamin Grimm Aug 22 2017 05:30 PM Re: Shopping List

What if they were eating crackers?

Chad Ochoseis Aug 22 2017 07:14 PM Re: Shopping List

CF got my point right about the insurance on DWright. It's not a binary situation where he either rehabs completely or doesn't. There's a good chance he rehabs to the point where he can be a .700 OPSing backup 1B. I'd want to know whether we'd have to bring him back and eat the contract in that situation, or if there are alternatives. To Vic's point that the Wilpons would use the money to buy a jackalope ranch in Mauritania or something, it's possible, but a separate issue. I'd like the Mets to preserve the resources they have; rich and stupid is at least marginally better than poor and stupid. Bruce. I want Bruce back. Dominic Smith is still a question mark. I have doubts about Cespedes' ability to stay healthy for the full season given the leg injuries this year. Bruce can slot into either of those spots if needed, or take the other corner outfield spot if Nimmo/Lagares proves to be an unproductive platoon and we have to move Conforto to CF. He demonstrated this season both that he can hit and that he's an easy guy to root for. I do think that given the way Smith chewed up and spit out the PCL this year that he's our default starting 1B in 2018, even if he's having some growing pains now. But I like the idea of having someone good who can both be Plan B at 1B and get some ABs elsewhere if Plan A works out. It probably won't happen, if only because Bruce (or any other talented hitter) probably won't want to sign on to a deal to be Plan B. But chances are that some stuff will go right for the Mets next year and some stuff will go wrong. When stuff goes wrong, Bruce would be a good guy to have around.

Ashie62 Aug 22 2017 07:19 PM Re: Shopping List

Vic Sage wrote: regarding payroll, i think our ownership doesn't get the benefit of the doubt that they'd put any savings back into the team rather than their pocket (or to service their debts). Look at all the deals they've just made... we received NO real prospects, just payroll relief and a shitload of hard throwing right-handed RPs with minimal success in the minors to date. If we wanted actual prospects, we would've picked up some of the salary of our outgoing guys. But no, they just wanted to save the cash. And there's no indication that they'll be willing to spend next year at this year's levels. Spot on. I recall Sandy saying the went a little over payroll this year and the fire sale was a way of giving it back to the owner. My guess is the Mets might be painfull frugal this off season.

Ceetar Aug 22 2017 07:34 PM Re: Shopping List

Ashie62 wrote: Vic Sage wrote: regarding payroll, i think our ownership doesn't get the benefit of the doubt that they'd put any savings back into the team rather than their pocket (or to service their debts). Look at all the deals they've just made... we received NO real prospects, just payroll relief and a shitload of hard throwing right-handed RPs with minimal success in the minors to date. If we wanted actual prospects, we would've picked up some of the salary of our outgoing guys. But no, they just wanted to save the cash. And there's no indication that they'll be willing to spend next year at this year's levels. Spot on. I recall Sandy saying the went a little over payroll this year and the fire sale was a way of giving it back to the owner. My guess is the Mets might be painfull frugal this off season. Actually, the opposite. It suggest that the Wilpons will again be willing to go over payroll for the right gamble/players. While I'd love for them to take the savings from this year and apply it directly to next year, there is some consistent business logic in making a balance sheet add up, and trying not to spend more than expected revenue. I don't love it, but they have been burned before too.. Also there's no indication that the Mets could've gotten better prospects by paying the salaries of any of these guys. And it's clearly not a "gimme whatever" trade as they very specifically targeted a certain type of player. Players with life. perhaps players who if they perfected a slider, something they seem to be able to do in NY, would be able to contribute.

Nymr83 Aug 22 2017 11:30 PM Re: Shopping List

Edgy MD wrote: Moustakas schmoustakas. Jason Bayoustakas? whoever pays him is going to wayyyy overpay and regret it before 2018 even ends.

Edgy MD Aug 22 2017 11:34 PM Re: Shopping List

What's all this I hear about Moose Tacos?

Frayed Knot Aug 23 2017 12:02 AM Re: Shopping List

Centerfield wrote: If they believe in Dom Smith then his chance is now. If they don't then get rid of him or find some temporary option. But they're not going to stow him in the minors or use him to PH 2-3 times per week while a FA who only plays the only position he plays play out their (likely to be long) contract. Why does it have to be now? There's nothing saying Dom Smith has to be used in 2018. It's not like he's out of options. If he's called up in 2019 he'll only be 24 years old then. Just because Lucas Duda is signed to a three year deal doesn't mean Duda can't be traded in 2019, or Smith can be traded in 2019, or one of them could get hurt. Who knows. Which supposes that FA 1st basemen (and their agents) are going to choose the Mets knowing the situation (and Duda most of all). That's why they get N-T clauses and/or don't choose teams where they know their liable to be dealt 1/4 or 1/3 of the way into the contract. On Wright: We're painting a scenario here where David CAN play but the Mets want to push him out at which point the insurance company joins in on take to pay some of his remaining contract they DON'T owe the team for David being unable to play? I'm not an insurance agent, nor do I tend to play one on the internet, but my impression is that I don't think that sort of action is part of their general business plan. What (some) fans seem to be hoping for here is a Prince Fielder situation where the medical staff declares David medically unable to to play the game ever again. That he's playing right now seems to blow a hole in that idea at least for now.

Lefty Specialist Aug 23 2017 12:10 AM Re: Shopping List

I think Wright is warming up to be a pinch-hitter come September so the fans can cheer him one last time, then he retires. That solves the insurance problem. But please, no Moose Tacos.

Edgy MD Aug 23 2017 12:13 AM Re: Shopping List

I think our notions of David Wright giving back tens of millions of dollars is highly speculative. I know the Mets aren't giving us much to watch or talk about but there are a lot of things that need to play themselves out before these decisions will need to be made.

Frayed Knot Aug 23 2017 12:22 AM Re: Shopping List

Lefty Specialist wrote: I think Wright is warming up to be a pinch-hitter come September so the fans can cheer him one last time, then he retires. That solves the insurance problem. The net outcome of which is Wright taking the money owed to him and in effect donating to the bottom line of the Mets and the insurance carrier. Not sure that would be the option I'd choose.

Ceetar Aug 23 2017 02:02 AM Re: Shopping List

If David WERE to walk away, I'm sure it wouldn't be empty handed. The Wilpons would work some sort of deal out with him behind the scenes. Bonilla like or A-Rod like or whatever.

Chad Ochoseis Aug 23 2017 03:29 AM Re: Shopping List

Frayed Knot wrote: Lefty Specialist wrote: I think Wright is warming up to be a pinch-hitter come September so the fans can cheer him one last time, then he retires. That solves the insurance problem. The net outcome of which is Wright taking the money owed to him and in effect donating to the bottom line of the Mets and the insurance carrier. Not sure that would be the option I'd choose. ...which was the point I was making. There's zero chance that Wright will ever be what he was, and no more than a slim chance that he'll be even a replacement level player again. The Mets would probably love to activate him briefly for sentimental/PR reasons, and then possibly employ him in a non-playing role (that was Gwreck's original suggestion, which started the whole Wright tangent). But doing that would cost the Mets the insurance they're owed, unless Wright agrees to retire. Wright's owed $47M over 2018-2020, and insurance probably covers a large chunk of that. So it could be very pricy for the Mets to employ Wright again in any capacity. And, as sweet a guy as Wright is, I doubt he'd do the Mets and the insurance company a favor and retire, leaving $47M on the table. Even Cuddyer only left $12M, I think. But the Mets have some leverage with the insurer, as they probably have a choice as to whether to activate Wright from the 60 day DL if he's only partially healed. So they can go to the insurer and say "Let us activate Wright for a month so he can get his last hurrah before taking a job in the org, and we'll accept a little less than what we're owed. Say no, and we'll just keep him on the 60 day DL for the next three years, as we can do because his shoulder is still weak, and you'll be on the hook for ever penny of his salary."

Frayed Knot Aug 23 2017 12:18 PM Re: Shopping List

But here's the thing (and this aspect of the discussion is going on in two different threads now): the Mets can't just unilaterally decide to throw David Wright into the permanent DL dungeon and throw away the key. It's why I brought up the Prince Fielder exception where medical people deemed him completely disabled (from a baseball standpoint) to the point of forever being unable to rehab and get back to playing. Maybe that will be the case with Wright in the future but it's not now and the fact that he played last night suggests we're getting further from that point, not closer. The insurance only "owes" their part of Wright's salary when he can't play. What they're not on the hook for is a situation where he can but is no longer worth the contract the Mets signed him to however many years go; hell, there are teams all over the league with 35 y/o players in that spot. But absent the sort of permanently disabled determination, a team trying to keep a medically cleared player permanently DL'd against his will so as to not pay his salary and/or recoup as much of it as possible from an insurance policy invites both a player grievance and charges of insurance fraud.

smg58 Aug 23 2017 03:06 PM Re: Shopping List

Let's see how Wright looks before passing judgement. You obviously can't take him for granted, but he's here and under contract. As long as there is at least some chance that he will be useful next season, you might as well give him the opportunity.

Edgy MD Aug 23 2017 03:09 PM Re: Shopping List

Yeah, I don't know why folks wouldn't. The Moustakas stampede can wait.

Centerfield Aug 23 2017 03:11 PM Re: Shopping List

Of course. A team cannot keep healthy player on the DL and collect insurance. As you mention it will invite a grievance and constitutes insurance fraud. But Wright is not healthy. And will never be healthy again. With his spinal stenosis, for Wright to have any chance to play, he has to perform hours of preparation, go through a rigorous stretching program, and even then, he can only play certain games. Right now, though he may be DH-ing in St. Lucie, he's certainly not healthy in that he has a pinched nerve that prevents him from throwing, and therefore, can't play the field. If the Mets were competitive, there would be no way they could waste a roster spot on that player. It's not clear what the insurance policy says in such a situation. But it certainly matters. And that's exactly why Met fans are concerned with the specifics of that policy. Just speculation, but I wonder if a deal is already in place. "Hey insurance company, we both know David isn't healthy and would be justified to sit on the 60 day through the end of the season. Still, we'd like to get him some pinch hitting appearances and give him a chance to stop on the field and wave his hat. How about you let this go, and instead of picking up 75%, we drop it down to 65%. Deal?" I can see an insurance company going for this. Negotiations over coverage are as old as insurance itself.

Ashie62 Aug 23 2017 03:17 PM Re: Shopping List

I would like to think there is a way for David to gets some September at bats and the money issues work out to the satisfaction of all. Not interested in Moustakas. Why pay for his career year?

Vic Sage Aug 23 2017 03:43 PM Re: Shopping List Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 23 2017 04:56 PM

To Vic's point that the Wilpons would use the money to buy a jackalope ranch in Mauritania or something, it's possible, but a separate issue. I'd like the Mets to preserve the resources they have; rich and stupid is at least marginally better than poor and stupid. The Pons have so much debt to service that i don't think the jackalope population in Mauritania is facing an imminent boom. And my suspicion is that our team's payroll will be equally boomless.

Edgy MD Aug 23 2017 04:01 PM Re: Shopping List

The truth is we're all pretty much utterly ignorant as to whether Wright is progressing or not. The notion that there is 0% chance of this happening and a higher likelihood of that happening is all speculation. Fortunately for everybody, he's put himself back out on the field, allowing all a chance to make an assessment over the remaining weeks. And that's important information to glean before making any of these calls, along with "Is Nimmo a leadoff hitter?" "Is Cecchini a big league infielder?" "Can Flores be an everyday threat?" "Which of these pitchers look like they can be part of a better big league staff next season?" "How much of a backup plan do we need on Smith and Rosario?" The bus may have crashed, but he story isn't written.

Frayed Knot Aug 23 2017 04:31 PM Re: Shopping List

Centerfield wrote: But Wright is not healthy. And will never be healthy again. Well, what constitutes not healthy enough to be what he once was vs not healthy enough to ever play again is the part still to be determined before the insurance company willingly swoops in and picks up their obligation of the remaining contract. I'm just fighting the notion that the verdict is already in on this issue or that the Mets can unilaterally decree it simply because it's in their financial interest to do so. Whether David gets a handful of PH appearances towards the tail end of this season barely matters in this whole thing. I assume the policy pays for when he is on the DL and stops while he's not so if he joins the team when the rosters expand in September it'll cost the Mets one month of salary. BFD. It's what kind of shape he's in from 2018 on where the real question still lies and we simply haven't got the answer to that right now. If he can play then either the Mets have to buy him out in order to make him go away or accept a desk job, or keep an overpriced player on their roster (not the first time, won't be the last). And if he can't play then he won't and the insurance covers part of it - aka: status quo.

Vic Sage Aug 23 2017 05:08 PM Re: Shopping List

what the Mets need isn't available on the FA market. Moustakas is probably the best available, but he's the wrong type of player. They need to trade for Machado, or somebody of that level/age, to make an impact at 3b. But that means paying one of those guys a max-deal, so its unlikely that will happen, given the contract they just gave to Cespedes.

Ashie62 Aug 23 2017 09:27 PM Re: Shopping List

Maybe Rosario becomes a Machado, Lindor or Correa? Not that it wouldn't be nice to have another one.