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What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Mex17 Nov 01 2017 09:32 PM

I don't see him as an option for the Mets (they are all in with Smith for better or for worse), but I do not see a place for him on the Dodgers anymore even if he is healthy and he has $21.5 million coming to him next year. Does he get a landing spot with another team or do you think that LA is going to have to eat all of that?

Nymr83 Nov 02 2017 02:23 AM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

I hope the Mets aren't "all in" on Smith at this point - a capable backup at the position would be a very wise investment at this point. that doesnt need to be Gonzalez.

Frayed Knot Nov 02 2017 02:59 AM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

The thing about the Dodgers is that they've reached this post-season with little or no contributions from a bunch of their higher paid and/or longer tenured players: - Adrian Gonzalez; $21.5 million in 2017 & 2018 - Andre Ethier; $17.5 mil + $17.5 mil option/$2 mil buyout for 2018 - Scott Kazmir; in the 2nd year of a 3-year deal for $11 mil in 2016, then $18 mil in each of 2017 & 2018 (I bet most folks don't even remember that they signed him to a FA deal just last year) - Brandon McCarthy; in 3rd year of a 4 year deal: $10 mil in 2017 & $10 more next year - Hyun-Jin Ryu; 4th year of a 5 year deal: $7 mil in each 2017 & 2018 and yet are getting much greater contributions from the likes of Logan Forsythe, Austin Barnes (over Yasmani Grandal), and minimum wage or near minimum guys like Pederson, Seager, Kike Hernandez, Bellinger, Culberson, and especially Chris Taylor In answer to the Adrian Gonzalez question, I think he's toast and the Dodgers will need to eat the money no matter where he plays next year or even IF he plays next year. 3 HRs (in 231 ABs), a diminishing glove, a .287 OBA, and maybe the slowest non-catcher in the league just ain't gonna cut it.

41Forever Nov 02 2017 03:12 AM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Taking a vacation when the team in in the World Series seemed kind of odd to me.

Benjamin Grimm Nov 02 2017 12:37 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Mex17 wrote: (they are all in with Smith for better or for worse) I'm not at all convinced of that.

HahnSolo Nov 02 2017 12:44 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Now that FK mentions it, I'm kind of interested in what's to become of Yasmani Grandal. If Barnes is their guy moving forward, I certainly wouldn't object to Sandy kicking the tires to see if Grandal is available.

Frayed Knot Nov 02 2017 12:53 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Mex17 wrote: (they are all in with Smith for better or for worse) I'm not at all convinced of that. Depends on what one means by "all in". If he's on the roster he's going to play at least most of the time, quite possibly with a RH-hitting platoon partner (maybe one of the catchers?). But it's not like they can't send him down if he doesn't hit, nor do I think they see him as a 'can't trade' guy in the same way they think of Rosario (to the extent that anyone is ever a Can't trade) The one thing I've said about Smith for 2018 is that if you're going to sign/trade-for a 1B with a multi-year deal then you need to deal him for help somewhere else. Stashing him in the minors or on the bench as a PH/defensive replacement for the next three years is a waste of a resource.

Benjamin Grimm Nov 02 2017 12:56 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

I guess we'll see if the Mets go after Eric Hosmer this offseason, as some have suggested. I agree that Smith isn't going to be displaced at first by someone like Wilmer Flores, unless Smith fails spectacularly. But I wouldn't be at all surprised if the Mets saw first base as a position that they could upgrade this winter. It may or may not happen, but I definitely don't think it's Smith "for better or worse."

metirish Nov 02 2017 12:58 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

41Forever wrote: Taking a vacation when the team in in the World Series seemed kind of odd to me. I thought this was odd too, but I wonder if it happens more than we know?

Centerfield Nov 02 2017 02:20 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Frayed Knot wrote: 3 HRs (in 231 ABs), a diminishing glove, a .287 OBA, and maybe the slowest non-catcher in the league just ain't gonna cut it. Meanwhile we are about to hand our job to a guy who had a worse OBA, and would lose a foot race to Adrian Gonzalez. More HR's though. I really hope Dominic Smith works out. Funny though, he could just as easily hit .230 as he could .330 next year.

Mex17 Dec 16 2017 09:56 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez? Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Dec 17 2017 12:15 AM

Dodgers and Braves made a mutual salary dump trade today. Gonzalez, Kazmir, Brandon McCarthy, and Charlie Culberson go to Atlanta. Kemp goes back to LA. Then the Braves DFA Gonzalez immediately. So any team in the league can now get a guy for the league minimum who as recently as 2016 produced 31 doubles, 18 HRs, 90 RBI, and a .784 OPS. But he is a 36 year old with a bad back. Does he find a home or does he stay home and get paid off?

Edgy MD Dec 16 2017 11:49 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

That's 311 homers out there on the cheap, and a few Gold Gloves. It's a shame. A year or two as somebody's lefty bat off the bench used to be a dignified closing act for these guys, but now teams can't afford a non-versatile reserve. Certainly NL teams can't. So the more readily available alternative is the James Loney plan. Swallow your pride and play AAA ball and wait until somebody's firstbaseman goes down.

Mex17 Dec 17 2017 12:13 AM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

It's a shame. A year or two as somebody's lefty bat off the bench used to be a dignified closing act for these guys, but now teams can't afford a non-versatile reserve. Certainly NL teams can't. The game has changed (fewer if no complete games anymore, more reliance on the bullpen, pitch counts, more mindfulness of "times around the order" with regard to pitchers being exposed to a lineup in a single game). . .I think that the roster rules need to change with it. My proposal: -Increase the number of players that you can dress for a game to 26. -Increase the number of players that you can carry/travel with to 28. -On a weekly basis, each team needs to submit five names (the customary amount for a starting rotation) that cannot be taken off of the active roster for that week (barring a DL assignment). That would generally prevent teams from just making a mockery of the new rules by simply taking whoever just started the most recently completed game off the roster (so, in most cases, you have to keep your entire rotation active). The idea would be to make these adjustments so that teams can keep a fresh bullpen without sacrificing a bench spot.

Nymr83 Dec 17 2017 02:19 AM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

i don't think new roster sizes are a good idea. i'd rather the advantage go to the team that gets creative within the rules. the value of multi-inning relievers should go up.

Edgy MD Dec 17 2017 02:48 AM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

I agree that growing the roster just plays into more specialization. That makes the extraordinary boring by protecting people from their flaws. You think the All Star Game is boring? Try getting that every night. Don't kowtow the rules to strategic trends. Force people to innovate within those trends. Broader limits means no innovation, just boring sameness. I'd much rather have teams with rosters of 16.

Mex17 Dec 17 2017 01:04 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Edgy MD wrote: I agree that growing the roster just plays into more specialization. I think that you might be viewing this solely upon what you believe MLB can or cannot control within it's own self, but what if it is really beyond their control? In decades past, a guy like Tom Seaver would be playing football or running track in the fall and then playing basketball or wrestling in the winter, not picking up a baseball until probably late March. Now, kids specialize in a sport year round, so younger arms are throwing more and have more tread by the time an MLB team is even in the position to draft or sign them. So it isn't really all the "fault" of MLB that the game has gone in the direction that it has. But you need to adjust to the circumstances around you. This might stand to be broken off into it's own discussion apart from the Adrian Gonzalez thread.

Edgy MD Dec 17 2017 03:35 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

It's not beyond their control.

Mex17 Dec 17 2017 03:43 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Edgy MD wrote: It's not beyond their control. How? How can MLB tell a teenager (or his parents) not to forego other sports and not to play in summer leagues, go to youth camps in the winter, or hire private coaches who work them even more, all of which result in more torque and strain and repetitiveness of motion (which is an unnatural motion to begin with) on the arm at earlier ages before they are even drafted?

Edgy MD Dec 17 2017 04:25 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Because MLB sets the roster limit and that's what they do. They control it. And if the market up the stream doesn't adjust, then they don't. From my perspective, there has never been more restraint on pitchers' workloads in youth leagues than there is now. And there were huge restraints when I was a teenager 35 years ago.

MFS62 Dec 19 2017 12:53 AM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Heard Gonzalez was DFA today. Still signed for 2 yrs of lotsa bucks. If released, he can be signed by any team for any amount and Atlanta would have to eat the rest of his salary. I'll bet they're trying to make some sort of a deal where they at least something back for him (The other team would have to pick up the salary in that kind of deal.). With the kind of production he has put up consistently, you would have thought that he would have been on the cover of lots of baseball magazines. The problem is, he [crossout:3fn1a3eq]is one ugly m***er-f***er, even when he was young.[/crossout:3fn1a3eq] never had cover-boy looks. Later

Benjamin Grimm Dec 19 2017 04:09 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Buster Olney wrote: You can assume the Mets are among teams kicking around idea of pursuing long-time All-Star Adrian Gonzalez. They're looking for a short-term add-on at the position; when healthy, he's a good hitter/defender; was just cut by ATL, and costs nothing more than minimum salary in '18.

Rockin' Doc Dec 19 2017 11:48 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

For the league minimum, I think the Mets would be crazy not to give Adrian Gonzalez a shot. The cost is negligible and at worst he could mentor Dominic Smith and be a left handed bat off the bench. Of course, there a numerous teams that could just as likely take a low cost flyer on Gonzalez. Since he is essentially a free agent , it comes down to who might be able to offer the best potential situation for him.

Nymr83 Dec 20 2017 04:39 AM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Buster Olney wrote: You can assume the Mets are among teams kicking around idea of pursuing long-time All-Star Adrian Gonzalez. They're looking for a short-term add-on at the position; when healthy, he's a good hitter/defender; was just cut by ATL, and costs nothing more than minimum salary in '18. [url]http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/21821426/new-york-mets-reach-adrian-gonzalez it went from "you can assume" to "sources have told Buster" - the natural evolution of bullshit right there. want to invent a rumor? add an unnamed source to keep the story alive a day later!

MFS62 Dec 20 2017 12:36 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Nymr83 wrote: Benjamin Grimm wrote: Buster Olney wrote: You can assume the Mets are among teams kicking around idea of pursuing long-time All-Star Adrian Gonzalez. They're looking for a short-term add-on at the position; when healthy, he's a good hitter/defender; was just cut by ATL, and costs nothing more than minimum salary in '18. [url]http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/21821426/new-york-mets-reach-adrian-gonzalez it went from "you can assume" to "sources have told Buster" - the natural evolution of bullshit right there. want to invent a rumor? add an unnamed source to keep the story alive a day later! I never trust anybody who calls himself "Buster". But in this case, I hope he's right. Later

Nymr83 Dec 20 2017 12:57 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

I'd be fine with the addition considering the non-cost and its an added bonus that if he does well the Braves are paying for it. Not really exciting though. and i'd prefer a right handed hitter with more position flexibility be added.

Edgy MD Dec 20 2017 01:21 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

We'll record that as an Eric Campbell vote. More seriously, if what's really wanted is a righthander to help Smith against lefties and to have positional flexibility when a need opens elsewhere, the team has that in Flores (or will if and when another infielder is brought in) and in Wright (or will if he recovers enough to play). This is more of a Tony Clarkian hedge against whether Smith is ready at all. The Mets could conceivably sign him and shed him during the spring, I imagine.

Nymr83 Dec 20 2017 01:36 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

yeah which is why the signing wouldn't bother me, at minimum salary he is easily disposable. my only concern is the extent to which signing him causes the Mets to throw up their 'mission accomplished' banner for infield help rather than considering him essentially a fully guaranteed salary spring-training invitee

Ceetar Dec 20 2017 02:38 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

no one's throwing up a mission accomplished banner for Adrian Gonzalez, if they sign him it'd be to compete for the 2nd backup infielder bench spot.

smg58 Dec 20 2017 02:59 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Gonzalez has enough of a track record to warrant a major league deal, which means he will probably go to the team that gives him the clearest path to playing time. I'm not sure that's us -- I would think that an AL team that did not have a set DH would be a more viable option from his perspective -- but I see no reason not to call his agent and chat.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Dec 20 2017 03:16 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

yeah of course you talk to him. He'd at worst be a "James Loney" type who could fill in, and it's porobably a matter of which team's first baseman gets injured first otherwise. No clue as to the remarks above about his looks. Geez.

Lefty Specialist Dec 20 2017 03:27 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Well, no harm in kicking the tires, but I have to believe he goes to an AL team.

Benjamin Grimm Dec 20 2017 03:36 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

John Cougar Lunchbucket wrote: No clue as to the remarks above about his looks. Geez. I don't necessarily recognize "handsome" when I see it, but I do know what "ugly" looks like, and I don't think this qualifies.

Centerfield Dec 20 2017 03:51 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Lefty Specialist wrote: Well, no harm in kicking the tires, but I have to believe he goes to an AL team. Or you know, a contender.

Edgy MD Dec 20 2017 03:56 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Benjamin Grimm wrote: I don't necessarily recognize "handsome" when I see it, ... I can sure tell you that it rhymes with "Anthony Recker."

Benjamin Grimm Dec 20 2017 04:10 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

So I've heard!

Edgy MD Dec 20 2017 04:45 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Gosh, Keef. How do you really feel? [tweet:3n43m06q]https://twitter.com/keithlaw/status/943310276375597056[/tweet:3n43m06q]

A Boy Named Seo Dec 20 2017 04:52 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

I disagree with "irresponsible" and maybe "lolmets", but the rest I'm fine with.

Frayed Knot Dec 20 2017 05:13 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

A lot of this depends on the details of whatever happened to him between 2016 when he played 156 games/633 PA of 784 OPS for a championship competitive team in the non-DH league, and 2017 when those numbers became 71 G / 252 PA / 642 OPS and he supposedly became this "can't hit, can't move" piece of trash.

Nymr83 Dec 20 2017 05:18 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Keith gets a little full of himself sometimes. 1. it is never irresponsible to reach out. maybe you suffer an injury (or three) and the guy becomes your best option down the line. 2. maybe the Mets feel that his recent results were injury-related and can improve. Does Medical Doctor Keith Law know for sure this isn't the case? 3. I'm glad Keith thinks Smith is ready. If Smith is really ready, Gonzalez won't sniff the field. nobody is saying to guarantee him any playing time or even a roster spot past the end of spring training. 4. How does Doctor of Psychology Keith Law know that he isn't an "asset" in the clubhouse. maybe he would fit right in with the Mets guys.

A Boy Named Seo Dec 20 2017 05:39 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Nymr83 wrote: Keith gets a little full of himself sometimes. 1. it is never irresponsible to reach out. maybe you suffer an injury (or three) and the guy becomes your best option down the line. 2. maybe the Mets feel that his recent results were injury-related and can improve. Does Medical Doctor Keith Law know for sure this isn't the case? 3. I'm glad Keith thinks Smith is ready. If Smith is really ready, Gonzalez won't sniff the field. nobody is saying to guarantee him any playing time or even a roster spot past the end of spring training. 4. How does Doctor of Psychology Keith Law know that he isn't an "asset" in the clubhouse. maybe he would fit right in with the Mets guys. 1. Yepp, agreed. 2. For sure. But he had a bad back that made him terribly immobile last year. Hope he's better, but most soon-to-be 36 year-old ballplayers don't tend to. 3. Yepp, agreed. 4. I'd bet this refers to him going to vacation in Europe while the Dodgers were playing the WS. Probably rankled some.

Edgy MD Dec 20 2017 05:52 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

When Keith Law sees a safe bet (and the notion that Adrian Gonzalez isn't going to set the world on fire is a pretty safe bet) he triples down. See his excoriating review of Tim Tebow. I suspect that, for prospect watchers, writing about unknown futures is so filled with grey areas, and so exposes them to accusations of "you were WRONG about Jacob deGrom! And Justin Wilson suxx!" that when they see something like solid ground, they are tempted to plant their flags in it deep.

Frayed Knot Jan 14 2018 03:23 AM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

We're presently up to: Mets are in "serious discussions" to sign Adrian Gonzalez -- Bob Nightengale and "there's a good chance this may happen" -- Jon Heyman https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2018/01/ ... zalez.html

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jan 14 2018 03:37 AM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

We need a LH bench bat anyway, may as well be this guy though I had a tiny candle for Grandyman. "Pending a physical" is the word now.

Centerfield Jan 14 2018 03:41 AM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Sounds like a no lose type of move. What exactly were his injuries last year anyway? Chronic things or something expected to heal?

Centerfield Jan 14 2018 04:07 AM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Just read up. Back issues. Herniated disk. That usually doesn’t get better on old guys. Yikes. Anyway, low risk move. I doubt they will trade Dom smith because of this.

smg58 Jan 14 2018 12:37 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

They still have better places to spend their resources, but if minimal resources were spent, it's OK.

Edgy MD Jan 14 2018 01:15 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

The Mets already have spine doctors on retainer because of Wright. It's an efficiency move!

RealityChuck Jan 14 2018 01:28 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Low risk move, but you have wonder the message this is sending to Don Smith, as they just signed two people to play his position.

Centerfield Jan 14 2018 02:10 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Edgy MD wrote: The Mets already have spine doctors on retainer because of Wright. It's an efficiency move! So here, physical is more than just a formality right? Do you bring in the spine guys now? Anyway if he’s healthy and bounces back he could be our #3 hitter.

41Forever Jan 14 2018 03:45 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

I think this is a low-risk, high-reward situation. Certainly worth exploring.

Nymr83 Jan 14 2018 04:24 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

he is already owed all that money by Atalanta - so this is a minimum salary move by the Mets just like Reyes last year - it can't hurt to bring him to Spring Training under those circumstances and find out if he has anything left/if we really need his services.

Zvon Jan 14 2018 04:52 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Centerfield wrote: Just read up. Back issues. Herniated disk. That usually doesn’t get better on old guys. Yikes. Anyway, low risk move. I doubt they will trade Dom smith because of this. This^ I'll add I'm not too thrilled. They BETTER NOT trade Smith and have Adrian our starting first baseman. Unless they get a Trout or someone similar. Ha. [attachment=0]smithchance-z18.jpg[/attachment]

seawolf17 Jan 14 2018 05:22 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

Nymr83 wrote: he is already owed all that money by Atalanta - so this is a minimum salary move by the Mets just like Reyes last year - it can't hurt to bring him to Spring Training under those circumstances and find out if he has anything left/if we really need his services. Agree. If last year's a trend, then he won't even make the roster. But if last year was the exception and he's over it, he played ten years of 156+ games before that, and in the last five since turning 30, he went .286/.344/.464 and averaged 23 homers. I'm okay with that to give Smith some time.

Rockin' Doc Jan 14 2018 05:40 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

I'm fine with having Gonzalez around as a mentor/insurance policy for Dom Smith. At the very least, he can provide provide a lefty bat off the bench.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jan 14 2018 05:44 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

[tweet:38enc4qd]https://twitter.com/Springer66/status/952581546493579264[/tweet:38enc4qd]

G-Fafif Jan 14 2018 10:19 PM Re: What is to become of Adrian Gonzalez?

An early contender for next year's tabloid voting, "oh yeah, I forgot about this" division. [fimg=400:3psja86w]http://i65.tinypic.com/2cd8r60.jpg[/fimg:3psja86w]