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Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

41Forever Oct 31 2017 12:48 AM

Nexflix announced today that the upcoming season of House of Cards will be the last, in part because of the revelations about the star. We just got Netflix this year, and as a political junkie I binged the whole series. The first two seasons were incredible, and then a definite drop in quality. Seems like they made Frank president too quickly, then didn't quite know what to do with him once he got to the White House. I don't know what they'll do with President Claire, but it will be hard to recapture what they had in those first couple of years.

metirish Oct 31 2017 02:16 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

I have never watched this, don't have Netflix......just got Kodi though so let's see

Benjamin Grimm Oct 31 2017 02:31 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

What Kevin Spacey did 30 years ago was bad, very bad. Trying to aggressively, and perhaps forcefully, "seduce" a 14-year-old boy. However... I think the criticism that he's getting from the LGBT community for his statement is unfair. I get that they resent that he's been (sort of) in the closet for many years, but given where things are RIGHT NOW, I don't know what he could have done differently. His apology was well-worded. Not one of those "I'm sorry if anyone was offended" things. He said he didn't remember the incident, but he didn't deny it. He said that he was horrified by his actions. And then he followed up by acknowledging, finally, that he is in fact gay. That last part seems to be the issue with the LGBT, that he used his coming out to deflect from his deeds. But how can a man admit to trying to have sex with a boy without also admitting that he's gay?

Ceetar Oct 31 2017 02:38 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Well, he basically blamed it on booze and seemed to excuse it because he was closeted. The complaint seems to be that he's using the standard 'celebrity coming out' PR "oh so brave!" as a cover for committing sexual assault.

Benjamin Grimm Oct 31 2017 02:47 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

[fimg=750:o1tdzha1]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNW4pkMUQAAe_eg.jpg[/fimg:o1tdzha1]

A Boy Named Seo Oct 31 2017 03:27 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

I guess his apology could have ended after the first paragraph and been ok. For close-minded people, a line between being gay and being a pedophile could be drawn if they're looking for it, and a lot of people sadly look for it.

Centerfield Oct 31 2017 03:43 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

I guess the key here is in the details. Does he not remember this particular incident because he tried seducing so many 14 year old boys that this just blends in with the rest? Is he horrified because he cannot imagine himself behaving in this way? And that this was the one incident, in his lifetime, where he approached a minor? All of this is just crazy horrible shit.

Ceetar Oct 31 2017 03:47 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

He says "If" I did. adds drunken as a modifier and then says he's sorry Rapp feels that way still. It's not the worst, but it definitely leaves open the suggestion that maybe it's not true. And that's only if you buy that he doesn't actually remember. Which is spacious at best. Did he invite him to that party? Did he know who he was? Probably.

Ashie62 Oct 31 2017 04:15 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Benjamin Grimm wrote: What Kevin Spacey did 30 years ago was bad, very bad. Trying to aggressively, and perhaps forcefully, "seduce" a 14-year-old boy. However... I think the criticism that he's getting from the LGBT community for his statement is unfair. I get that they resent that he's been (sort of) in the closet for many years, but given where things are RIGHT NOW, I don't know what he could have done differently. His apology was well-worded. Not one of those "I'm sorry if anyone was offended" things. He said he didn't remember the incident, but he didn't deny it. He said that he was horrified by his actions. And then he followed up by acknowledging, finally, that he is in fact gay. That last part seems to be the issue with the LGBT, that he used his coming out to deflect from his deeds. But how can a man admit to trying to have sex with a boy without also admitting that he's gay? There was no need for Spacey to discuss his orientation at all. No, not all molesters are gay. Spacey went to pains to tell us he is gay. So what, who cares? Way to turn the narrative KS.

Benjamin Grimm Oct 31 2017 04:21 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Of course not all molesters are gay. But when a man shows a sexual interest in a boy, there's a good chance that he's gay.

A Boy Named Seo Oct 31 2017 04:30 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Of course not all molesters are gay. But when a man shows a sexual interest in a boy, there's a good chance that he's gay. I don't know that that's untrue, but it sounds very untrue. Gay does not equal pedophile. Do straight men have sexual interest in young girls just because they're straight men? No. This is why, understandably IMO, the gay community was all, "Gee, thanks, Kevin."

Ashie62 Oct 31 2017 04:32 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

In an abuse situation I would argue that the motive would more likely be to hurt, harm and demean the victim. Its not about sex. Its about hate and pathology. Period. This hits very close to me.

Benjamin Grimm Oct 31 2017 04:35 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

A Boy Named Seo wrote: Benjamin Grimm wrote: Of course not all molesters are gay. But when a man shows a sexual interest in a boy, there's a good chance that he's gay. I don't know that that's untrue, but it sounds very untrue. Gay does not equal pedophile. Do straight men have sexual interest in young girls just because they're straight men? No. This is why, understandably IMO, the gay community was all, "Gee, thanks, Kevin." NO! Read what I wrote! I didn't say, a man who's gay is going to be interested in young boys. I said, a man who's interested in young boys you can assume that he's gay. Gay doesn't equal pedophile. Gay does equal sexual interest in someone of your own sex.

A Boy Named Seo Oct 31 2017 05:00 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Benjamin Grimm wrote: Of course not all molesters are gay. But when a man shows a sexual interest in a boy, there's a good chance that he's gay. I don't know that that's untrue, but it sounds very untrue. Gay does not equal pedophile. Do straight men have sexual interest in young girls just because they're straight men? No. This is why, understandably IMO, the gay community was all, "Gee, thanks, Kevin." NO! Read what I wrote! I didn't say, a man who's gay is going to be interested in young boys. I said, a man who's interested in young boys you can assume that he's gay. Gay doesn't equal pedophile. Gay does equal sexual interest in someone of your own sex. I did read what you wrote. Still not sure I agree that it can be safely assumed that a man interested in young boys is gay, as opposed to just a predator taking advantage of a young person (regardless of the young person's gender). You might be right, I dunno. I kinda wanna google for studies on this, but don't wanna sully my browser search history which is basically "Mets", "buzzbands", and "motorcycles".

d'Kong76 Oct 31 2017 05:01 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

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Ashie62 Oct 31 2017 07:15 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Benjamin Grimm wrote: Of course not all molesters are gay. But when a man shows a sexual interest in a boy, there's a good chance that he's gay. I don't know that that's untrue, but it sounds very untrue. Gay does not equal pedophile. Do straight men have sexual interest in young girls just because they're straight men? No. This is why, understandably IMO, the gay community was all, "Gee, thanks, Kevin." NO! Read what I wrote! I didn't say, a man who's gay is going to be interested in young boys. I said, a man who's interested in young boys you can assume that he's gay. Gay doesn't equal pedophile. Gay does equal sexual interest in someone of your own sex. I'm not sure where you are. I'm out

Centerfield Oct 31 2017 07:26 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

I think you guys are misreading BG's intent. I think what he's saying is: *If a male pedophile attempts to seduce a young boy, chances are he's probably gay. *If a male pedophile attempts to seduce a young girl, chances are he's probably straight. *Whether or not a male is straight or gay, has nothing to do with whether or not he's a pedophile. I don't know if the first two statements are true or not, but it certainly seems to follow logic. No?

Benjamin Grimm Oct 31 2017 07:33 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Thank you!

A Boy Named Seo Oct 31 2017 07:41 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

I think you guys are misreading BG's intent. I think what he's saying is: *If a male pedophile attempts to seduce a young boy, chances are he's probably gay. *If a male pedophile attempts to seduce a young girl, chances are he's probably straight. *Whether or not a male is straight or gay, has nothing to do with whether or not he's a pedophile. I don't know if the first two statements are true or not, but it certainly seems to follow logic. No? Yeah, I hear you guys. I'm just not certain the first two statements are true either, though I get they could be.

Benjamin Grimm Oct 31 2017 08:05 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

This is probably not the best week of Kevin Spacey's life. You never want to be in a situation where you're inspiring conversations like this one. I see now that Netflix has suspended production of Season Six of House of Cards.

Edgy MD Oct 31 2017 08:08 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Spinning your response to accusations of sexual crimes into an opportunity to come out as gay puts a person in league with Mark Foley and George Michael. It's deliberately changing the subject, is an insult to the public, is certainly an insult to the victim or victims, and — by conflating your orientation with your alleged misdeeds — is an insult to all gay people who live their life without being predators or exploiters.

Benjamin Grimm Oct 31 2017 08:25 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

That seems to be the general feeling, but I don't see how he could acknowledge what he did without coming out. (This thread shows that there's not universal agreement on that point.)

Edgy MD Oct 31 2017 08:39 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

He didn't quite acknowledge what he did. And it's easy. Just start by cutting that second paragraph. This isn't about you and your personal journey. And complimenting your victim as an actor is an old and cliched part of the game. That's irrelevant to the accusation — what? it's OK to molest bad actors? — but flattering the victim is continuing to trade on your status over them.

Benjamin Grimm Oct 31 2017 08:47 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Edgy MD wrote: He didn't quite acknowledge what he did. True, but it's quite possible that he doesn't remember it. I don't have a lot of experience with drunkenness, but I do have enough to know that you don't necessarily remember everything you did. I hope, for his sake, (and for the sake of other minors that he may have encountered during his lifetime) that it's the only time he ever approached an underage boy or girl like that. If it's not, and it was part of a pattern, then we're very likely to find out about it sooner rather than later. Kevin Spacey is not Bill Cosby or Harvey Weinstein. Yet. But it's very possible that things will go in that direction.

Ashie62 Oct 31 2017 08:48 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Edgy MD wrote: Spinning your response to accusations of sexual crimes into an opportunity to come out as gay puts a person in league with Mark Foley and George Michael. It's deliberately changing the subject, is an insult to the public, is certainly an insult to the victim or victims, and — by conflating your orientation with your alleged misdeeds — is an insult to all gay people who live their life without being predators or exploiters. SPOT ON!

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Nov 01 2017 02:09 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Edgy MD wrote: He didn't quite acknowledge what he did. And it's easy. Just start by cutting that second paragraph. This isn't about you and your personal journey. And complimenting your victim as an actor is an old and cliched part of the game. That's irrelevant to the accusation — what? it's OK to molest bad actors? — but flattering the victim is continuing to trade on your status over them. EXACTLY. It's like pedophile "grooming" in inverse/reverse, after the fact and externally-targeted. He is gay. He attempted to foist himself on a tween as an adult. The two are independent facts. If you're wondering what one CAN say to make things right, BG... well, some things can't be entirely resolved with apology, can they? Perhaps this is one of those. You say sorry, you change your life accordingly (assuming the apology/regret is sincere), people react however they will, and you adjust your life accordingly again.

Benjamin Grimm Nov 01 2017 08:38 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Now it looks like Dustin Hoffman is being swept up in the "Me too" tsunami. Dustin Hoffman apologizes for any inappropriate behavior alleged by past intern Legendary actor Dustin Hoffman is apologizing for "anything I might have done" on the set of a TV movie three decades ago, where a former female intern alleges she was sexually harassed. As more and more women and men step forward to tell their stories of alleged harassment and abuse at the hands of some of Hollywood's biggest power players, Anna Graham Hunter published a guest column in The Hollywood Reporter Wednesday sharing personal accounts when she worked on the set of Hoffman's "Death of a Salesman" TV film more than 30 years ago.

41Forever Nov 01 2017 09:26 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Hollywood sounds like a really creepy place.

cooby Nov 02 2017 12:01 AM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

He apologized STFU it's turning into a witch hunt

Edgy MD Nov 02 2017 03:47 AM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

There's certainly some irony that one allegation of sexual misconduct can bring down a fake president, but the real president flies on despite allegations from at least 15 separate accusers.

d'Kong76 Nov 02 2017 03:56 AM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

I miss the days of cigar insertion and cum stained dresses.

Benjamin Grimm Nov 09 2017 08:45 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Well, since we last checked in on this thread, things have gone from bad to much much worse for Kevin Spacey. His initial statement made it sound like it could have been a one-time thing that he did while he was drunk, but with all the revelations that have come out now, it's clear that if he doesn't remember this assault it's for the same reason that I don't remember every Pop-Tart I've ever had for breakfast. I only recently started watching House of Cards (we're in Season 3 now) but I always liked Kevin Spacey. I mainly knew him as a talk-show guest appearing on Letterman. He always did a great Johnny Carson impression, and did a very funny bit when he walked on while Dave was interviewing Al Pacino. But now there's no reason to doubt that Spacey is a creep of the first order.

Benjamin Grimm Nov 09 2017 08:47 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

And now Louis C.K. too. I had been expecting this one. I heard weeks ago, even before the Kevin Spacey outbreak, that Louie liked to masturbate in front of his female co-workers.

Frayed Knot Nov 09 2017 08:59 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Well, since we last checked in on this thread, things have gone from bad to much much worse for Kevin Spacey. His scenes in the not yet released movie based on the ransom kidnapping of J. Paul Getty III are being scrapped and completely re-shot despite the movie being completed and scheduled for release next month. Apparently his scene(s) weren't a major part of the flick (he was to play JP I) but still ... Christopher Plummer to step in.

Edgy MD Nov 09 2017 09:41 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

What a dis. Replace him with an actor that's 25 years older than he is.

cooby Nov 09 2017 09:44 PM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Never of Lois KC and I wish I still hadn't. Blech

Ashie62 Nov 11 2017 04:53 AM Re: Frank Underwood = Creepier than we ever thought

Goodbye Louis CK for a long long time.