Master Index of Archived Threads


Blasphemers of Jake

G-Fafif Aug 18 2018 01:28 PM

Tim Kurkjian yammered incoherently during Monday night's ESPN telecast that Max Scherzer deserves the Cy Young edge over Jacob deGrom because of his won-lost record. And this afternoon, Phillies announcer (and unmissed erstwhile Met voice) Tom McCarthy suggested deGrom should place third, behind Scherzer and Aaron Nola, because of ye olde pitcher wins. This is gonna be a tough mindset to overcome.

bmfc1 Aug 18 2018 03:19 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Michael Wilbon said on "Pardon the Interruption" that deGrom doesn't deserve the award because he doesn't win the game. Guest host Frank Isola talked about deGrom's lack of run support and Wilbon responded that deGrom needs to pitch better so his team wins. He then said that it's not about "stats" but winning. By that logic, just give the Cy Young Award to the pitcher who gets the most wins.

MFS62 Aug 18 2018 03:37 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 19 2018 07:59 AM

Tim Kurkjian is a cretinous little shit. And those are his good points. Michael Wilbon is from Chicago, so he doesn't know anything about baseball. I never liked Tom McCarthy, and thought he was a heretic. He now demonstrates I was right. In case anyone has noticed, those guys piss me off. Later

Frayed Knot Aug 18 2018 04:17 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

In fairness to Kurkjian, he was arguing that it's close between JdG and Scherzer but he gives the edge to Scherzer because the ERA is close AND Scherzer leads in strikeouts AND in WAR AND is innings pitched AND in batting average against as well as in wins. It's not like little Timmy is some kind of stuck in the mud old timer wondering why he ever sold his horse for a car. Wilbon is simply obstinate on this topic. Working as he does on an opinion show, he's set himself up as the anti-stats/anti-'millennials' standard bearer where he takes it far beyond just this particular topic. Neither he nor Kornheiser could understand it when Felix Hernandez won the AL CY with a 13-12 record while David Price was 19-6 and Sabathia was 21-7 (so it's not like the writers haven't done this before) and neither could either understand why Trout should be MVP (he wasn't) the year Miggy Cabrera won the Triple Crown and no amount of explaining how while, yes, Cabrera had a slightly better offensive year, Trout was vastly superior in fielding, running, throwing, positional value, etc., could get them off that argument. Don't care what McCarthy thinks/says but, c'mon folks, he's saying it about his own guy. Let's not pretend some of us (or Gary or Keith or Ronnie) wouldn't be making the same points if the roles were reversed (see Dickey vs Kershaw).

Edgy MD Aug 18 2018 05:21 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Yeah, I got nothing against Kurkijian. I find him to be a mostly thougthful and gracious character. As for Tom McCarthy, he got a front-row seat today.

dgwphotography Aug 18 2018 05:33 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

If the season ended today, I would give it to Scherzer, too. However, the season doesn’t end today, and if Jake can get to 14-15 wins, combined with Scherzer sliding a bit, it would make things much more palatable for Jake to win.

Vic Sage Aug 19 2018 07:47 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

dgwphotography wrote: If the season ended today, I would give it to Scherzer, too. However, the season doesn’t end today, and if Jake can get to 14-15 wins, combined with Scherzer sliding a bit, it would make things much more palatable for Jake to win. it would be more palatable to some, but not necessary to define Jake's season-long dominance. And Wilbon's "it's not about stats, it's about winning" is such standard garbage... "wins" ARE a stat, Mr. Wilbon, you stupid bastard. It's just an arbitrary one when allocated to a pitcher, as opposed to anybody else on the field, and doesn't measure what it's intended to measures. And the fact that you don't understand how stats work does not make the stats less applicable or valid. It just means you're a Neanderthal howling at the moon because you think its a ight the size of a rock that's about to fall on your head. The only thing worse than stupidity is arrogant stupidity.

Frayed Knot Aug 19 2018 07:37 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

btw, don't ya just love the sports geeks who dismiss the sabermetric aspects of baseball analysis and see it as an unholy takeover of the sport by a bunch of pocket protector wearing geeks ... and then switch immediately to discussions of Quarterback ratings as if those represent some kind of etched in stone truth or that there are more than about seven people on earth who know how they're calculated or what the number represents?

Edgy MD Aug 19 2018 07:45 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

I spent about two weeks in college once, reverse engineering, trying to figure out the formula for quarterback ratings. Got nothing. Interesting Trivia: Blasphemers of Jake have won more Grammys than The Beatles.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 19 2018 07:50 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

the Kurkjian defamation in this thread is totally off base

41Forever Aug 19 2018 07:58 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Edgy MD wrote: I spent about two weeks in college once, reverse engineering, trying to figure out the formula for quarterback ratings. Got nothing. Interesting Trivia: Blasphemers of Jake have won more Grammys than The Beatles. Bad ass.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 19 2018 08:13 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

The Defamers of Kurkjian opened on that tour, they were only okay

d'Kong76 Aug 19 2018 08:29 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

MFS62 wrote: Tim Kurkjian is a cretinous little shit. And those are his good points. Stuff like this needs backup; show your work, elaborate on why he makes the silicon chip inside your head get switched to overload? Otherwise, it's mean, pointless and brings the place down a notch... especially to visitors.

MFS62 Aug 20 2018 06:59 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

“No one loves the numbers more than I do, but numbers don’t measure everything, especially when it comes to evaluating defense. And in the end, I am going to trust Buck Showalter’s eyes more than a set of statistics devised by someone who never played the game.” Tim Kurkjian “To not look at the data is foolish, but to look at the data as having all the answers is even more foolish. It is a collision of new-school statistics and statisticians against old-school managers, coaches, and instructors. Neither side is right, neither is wrong; there is so much to be gained from listening to both sides.” Tim Kurkjian Here are quotes where he said that you have to look beyond the numbers, yet the other night he used numbers to say Jake doesn't deserve the Cy Young Award. I've heard him say similar things before, and that got me angry. He is a respected baseball reporter, but maybe his senses have been dulled by working at ESPN too long. You're right. If I called him any name, it should have been hypocrite. Later

batmagadanleadoff Aug 20 2018 09:53 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

degrom is pitching out of his mind this season. He's having a career year and I'm rooting for him as much as anybody. deGrom's about the only thing worth watching Mets-wise at this point of this lost season. But geez, has anybody been following Scherzer? I mean, really following him? deGrom's a star. But Scherzer's on a Hall of Fame trajectory. He's won as many Cy's as Tom Seaver and for all of that, Scherzer's having the best season of his career, statistically. While deGrom is coming off of what's probably the best three game stretch of his season, Scherzer's been even better over that time. So I don't see the problem with TK's comments (which I missed). But if TK's saying that right now, he'd give the Cy to Scherzer over deGrom, I'd agree. And I've figured out the absurdity of pitcher Wins and Losses back when I was a teenager, years before Bill James's Abstract was first published for the masses. There's nothing I don't know today about pitcher Wins and Losses that I didn't already know 40 years ago. So I'm not factoring Scherzer's Wins much. Anyway, this is one hell of a Cy Young battle going on. Scherzer and deGrom are neck and neck and they keep on hurling top notch outings.

Edgy MD Aug 20 2018 10:05 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

One probably shouldn't count Nola out either. The cool thing is, with all three pitchers in the same division, and one rough start possibly the difference maker in the race, their teammates may end up deciding this. The Mets play the Phils six more times and the Nats seven more times. The Nats and Phils lock up nine more times, starting tomorrow.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 20 2018 10:07 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Too bad for Jake he doesn't get to pitch against the Mets, like Scherzer and Nola.

Frayed Knot Aug 22 2018 08:08 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

All three leading NL CY candidates will be in action Thursday afternoon. deGrom vs Bumgarner in NYC while Scherzer vs Nola face each other at the same time some 300 miles to the south

Ceetar Aug 22 2018 09:00 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Edgy MD wrote: I spent about two weeks in college once, reverse engineering, trying to figure out the formula for quarterback ratings. Got nothing. Interesting Trivia: Blasphemers of Jake have won more Grammys than The Beatles. I actually calculated QB rating (well, canadian QB rating) a few years back for a job. Wrote it into a SQL formula. give it deGrom. Max has a slight edge in K-BB%, but deGrom's got a cushion in ERA/ERA-/FIP/xFIP.. but I guess if you like SIERA Max has it. Both Nola and Scherzer have a .035 better BABIP which probably means they've been a little luckier at times. Keep an eye on Patrick Corbin too. His ERA is a little higher but his other numbers are in the vicinity. It's the 73% LOB% compared to 81+ for the other guys that's making his ERA look bad. Corbin actually has more fWAR than Nola. He'll never get it, with a 4.76 ERA because he plays for the Rockies, but Jon Gray is having a pretty damn unlucky year and pitching really well. If you want a 6th guy on your list, it's Zack Wheeler.

Edgy MD Aug 22 2018 09:43 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

In Bill James Starting Pitcher Rankings, Since the Start of the Season, [list][*]Jacob deGrom has climbed from the 13th-ranked starting pitcher to the fifth.[/*:m] [*]Noah Syndergaard has fallen from the 62nd-ranked starting pitcher to the 64th (which will change tomorrow morning).[/*:m] [*]Zack Wheeler has climbed from the 182nd-ranked starting pitcher to the 80th.[/*:m] [*]Matt Harvey has climbed (!) from the 182nd-ranked starting pitcher (tied with Wheelie) to the 119th.[/*:m] [*]Stephen Matz has climbed (also !) from the 174th-ranked starting pitcher to the 125th.[/*:m] [*]Jason Vargas has fallen from the 100th-ranked starting pitcher to the 147th.[/*:m] [*]Corey Oswald has climbed from an unranked starting pitcher to the 176th.[/*:m] [*]Vance Worley has fallen from the 182nd-ranked starting pitcher to the 227th.[/*:m] [*]A.J. Griffin has fallen from the 142nd-ranked starting pitcher to the 227th (tied withe Worley).[/*:m] [*]Chris Flexen has fallen from the 182nd-ranked starting pitcher (tie) to the 227th (tied again).[/*:m] [*]Robert Gsellman has fallen from the 151st-ranked starting pitcher (tie) to the 227th (tied again).[/*:m] [*]Jerry Blevins (remember his start) has climbed from an unranked starting pitcher (tie) to the 227th (such a logjam).[/*:m] [*]Drew Gagnon has climbed from an unranked starting pitcher (tie) to the 227th[/*:m] [*]Seth Lugo has fallen from the 131st-ranked starting pitcher (tie) to the 227th.[/*:m] [*]Rafael Montero has fallen from the 182nd-ranked starting pitcher (tie) to the 227th.[/*:m] [*]P.J. Conlon has fallen from the 137th-ranked starting pitcher (tie) to the 227th.[/*:m] [*]Cody Martin has fallen from the 137th-ranked starting pitcher (tie) to the 227th.[/*:m][/list:u]

batmagadanleadoff Aug 22 2018 11:01 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

deGrom passed Kershaw, who dropped from 4th to 6th.

MFS62 Aug 23 2018 05:58 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Robert Gsellman has fallen from the 151st-ranked starting pitcher (tie) to the 227th (tied again) I wonder how he will do when the relief pitcher rankings come out. Looking at that list, I guess 227 is his lowest ranking. Later

Edgy MD Aug 23 2018 06:18 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

batmagadanleadoff wrote: deGrom passed Kershaw, who dropped from 4th to 6th. And Kershaw was #1 for like 2 1/2 years. There are a lot of guys tied at 227 (including José Fernandez!), but a handful of guys ranked even lower than that. I'd still like to have given Lugo another chance to show his merits as a starter this season.

Edgy MD Aug 23 2018 11:38 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

All three pitchers scoreless through two. SOMETHING'S GOTTA GIVE!!

Benjamin Grimm Sep 18 2018 01:59 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

SNY.com wrote: In a poll where BBWAA (Baseball Writers' Association of America) voters were asked who should win the NL Cy Young award, Mets ace Jacob deGrom was the near-unanimous choice. DeGrom received 30 of 33 first place votes in MLB.com's poll, with Max Scherzer of the Nationals receiving the other three first place votes. When it came to point total, deGrom received 153, Scherzer received 101, and Aaron Nola of the Phillies received 63.

Frayed Knot Sep 26 2018 07:48 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

So here's a way of looking at things: If the Mets had scored just three runs* in each game Jake started, his record would be (or would potentially be at the time he left the game) 21-1 with 10 No-Decisions Scherzer, under the same conditions, 23-4 with 6 ND's * 4.38 is NL league average. 4.24 is NYM per/game avg

Edgy MD Sep 27 2018 12:23 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

I think the real open question is whether Cy Young deserves the Jacob deGrom Award.

Benjamin Grimm Oct 08 2018 11:19 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

I did a Google search to see when the Cy Young winners will be announced, and it appears that it will be on November 14... at 2 a.m.! The announced time has me skeptical of the announced date. https://www.google.com/search?authuser= ... J2ts4SFDYI

d'Kong76 Oct 08 2018 11:40 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

I think there's a calandar listing of events at mlbdotcom.

seawolf17 Oct 08 2018 12:06 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Benjamin Grimm wrote: I did a Google search to see when the Cy Young winners will be announced, and it appears that it will be on November 14... at 2 a.m.! 45 has asked all sports commissioners to make any major announcements via middle-of-the-night tweet, because that's how he does it.

Benjamin Grimm Oct 08 2018 12:10 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

d'Kong76 wrote: I think there's a calandar listing of events at mlbdotcom. There is! MLB.com confirms the November 14 date, but doesn't give a time of day. I guess, whenever they do announce it, it will be within 30 minutes of 2 a.m. somewhere on Earth.

G-Fafif Oct 08 2018 12:27 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

All of these awards gets announced over MLB Network between 6 and 7 PM EST.

bmfc1 Oct 09 2018 07:53 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Even Nationals fanboy Tom Boswell says it's gotta be Jake: https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2 ... 2a548e7f39

Benjamin Grimm Nov 11 2018 05:23 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Wednesday is the day...

Frayed Knot Nov 11 2018 07:51 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

NY Times today had a note how about [u:1nigh7jb]if you only considered those games where Jake was tagged with a Loss or a No Decision[/u:1nigh7jb] (IOW, subtract out the games where he got a 'W') he would still have led the league in ERA, and by not a small margin [2.09 vs Nola at 2.37 or Scherzer at 2.53]

Benjamin Grimm Nov 13 2018 08:45 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

41Forever Nov 13 2018 09:06 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Frayed Knot wrote: NY Times today had a note how about if you only considered those games where Jake was tagged with a Loss or a No Decision (IOW, subtract out the games where he got a 'W') he would still have led the league in ERA, and by not a small margin [2.09 vs Nola at 2.37 or Scherzer at 2.53] That's incredible!

bmfc1 Nov 14 2018 04:42 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Put me down for a Cover Derby vote for this one year from now:

Benjamin Grimm Nov 14 2018 04:52 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

You'll get your chance a lot sooner than that! This cover is scheduled to be up for a vote a mere twelve days from now.

Edgy MD Nov 14 2018 07:31 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

The subtext on that for me is that Tom Seaver has completely checked out, at least as far as paying attention to baseball, or at least the Mets.

Ceetar Nov 14 2018 07:33 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Edgy MD wrote: The subtext on that for me is that Tom Seaver has completely checked out, at least as far as paying attention to baseball, or at least the Mets. It's not really about him so he's not particularly interested. Maybe whoever reached out should've phrased it as "do you think deGrom is as good as you were?"

Ashie62 Nov 14 2018 11:34 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Dicomo's take on todays events. Very nice profiles of the big three [url]https://www.mlb.com/mets/news/a-case-for-each-nl-cy-young-finalist/c-300615626 I'll go... Degrom 18 1sts Scherzer 10 1sts Nola, or whoever 2 1sts Hoping some idiots don't leave deGrom off with all the 2nd's Scherzer will get Hoping Jake and we don't get Metly effed

Benjamin Grimm Nov 14 2018 02:53 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

I think he's going to win it. But we'll know for sure in a little over an hour!

Centerfield Nov 14 2018 03:01 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Edgy MD wrote: The subtext on that for me is that Tom Seaver has completely checked out, at least as far as paying attention to baseball, or at least the Mets. Had the same thought.

Frayed Knot Nov 14 2018 04:48 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 14 2018 04:50 PM

Seaver has pretty much said as much. At most he reads box scores saying that it returns him to following the game in his old age the same way he first followed it as a kid. Y'know, he's old, has been ill, is a continent away, and has a business to run. No sin in not being a fan boy and pretending that he needs to have an opinion on everything in today's game.

batmagadanleadoff Nov 14 2018 04:49 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Landslide!! 29 1st place votes for deGrom.

Frayed Knot Nov 14 2018 04:51 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

I thought he'd win going away, but I wasn't expecting it to be THAT lopsided.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Nov 14 2018 04:54 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Blue and orange wave

bmfc1 Nov 14 2018 04:54 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

This guy prevented it from being unanimous. F him. https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sd ... staff.html The votes: https://bbwaa.com/18-nl-cy/

Frayed Knot Nov 14 2018 04:56 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

deGrom 29 1sts, 1 2nd, 0 3rd Scherzer: 1 - 29 - 0 Nola: 0 - 0 - 27 Freeland: 0 - 0 - 2

Centerfield Nov 14 2018 04:59 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Cool. Congratulations Jake!

Edgy MD Nov 14 2018 05:02 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Booooooo, John Maffei of the San Diego Union-Tribune! BOOOOOOO!!!

Ashie62 Nov 14 2018 05:07 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Amazin!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

batmagadanleadoff Nov 14 2018 05:07 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 14 2018 05:08 PM

All three homegrown Met CYA winners (Seaver, Gooden and now deGrom) also won the ROY award. Also, every right handed Met pitcher that won the ROY award would also go on to win the CYA award.

Ashie62 Nov 14 2018 05:07 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

#48 announced at 6:48. Dicomo gave it away

Benjamin Grimm Nov 14 2018 05:10 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

This is great news. Mets Cy Young winners are almost as rare as NL pennants. (Cy leads 6 to 5.) I'm sure Jacob is thrilled, and I bet his agent is too. Oh... wait...

G-Fafif Nov 14 2018 05:48 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Edgy MD wrote: Booooooo, John Maffei of the San Diego Union-Tribune! BOOOOOOO!!! There's one in every crowd. But just one.

G-Fafif Nov 14 2018 05:49 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

CY YOUNG TOTALS Every Mets pitcher who isn't Tom Seaver: 3 Tom Seaver: 3

bmfc1 Nov 14 2018 05:54 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

G-Fafif Nov 14 2018 05:57 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Marco Rubio isn't gonna like this late entry in the Tabloid Cover Derby.

Edgy MD Nov 14 2018 06:51 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

G-Fafif wrote: Edgy MD wrote: Booooooo, John Maffei of the San Diego Union-Tribune! BOOOOOOO!!! There's one in every crowd. But just one. I kid. I have a heart for the dissident.

MFS62 Nov 14 2018 07:23 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Edgy MD wrote: Booooooo, John Maffei of the San Diego Union-Tribune! BOOOOOOO!!! I've known for years that Californians didn't deserve to get major league baseball because they didn't know anything about it. Later

bmfc1 Nov 14 2018 08:31 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Frayed Knot Nov 14 2018 08:56 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

9th round draft pick out of a small college where he wasn't even a full-time pitcher; TJS almost immediately after being drafted; finally makes ML debut just weeks shy of turning 26. And now completely hits his stride at age 30 We need to remember stories like these sometimes when we're ready to give up on a prospect because he's already 22 years old and not yet a star in the big leagues.

Edgy MD Nov 14 2018 09:47 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

The thing is that from the minute he came up, his only real detour has been that ulner nerve thing at the end of 2016. But then he came back seemingly 100% even after folks questioned his velocity the next spring. Apart from that, there was a 2 1/2-start hiccup in mid-2017 during a western swing when he couldn't get anybody out. But mostly, he's invariably brought his A-game every fifth day for something close to five seasons. He's got a better WHIP as a Met than Tom Seaver. Than anybody!! With even fair-to-average luck, he'd already be among the team's top ten winningest pitchers.

Methead Nov 15 2018 05:55 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

https://www.sbnation.com/2018/11/14/180 ... rd-nl-mets I hereby demand the "badass start" be made an official stat.

seawolf17 Nov 15 2018 06:11 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

MFS62 wrote: Edgy MD wrote: Booooooo, John Maffei of the San Diego Union-Tribune! BOOOOOOO!!! I've known for years that Californians didn't deserve to get major league baseball because they didn't know anything about it. Later Seriously. Dude was probably like "OOH that's the guy with the different-colored eyes. I'll vote for him."

41Forever Nov 15 2018 06:21 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

seawolf17 wrote: MFS62 wrote: Edgy MD wrote: Booooooo, John Maffei of the San Diego Union-Tribune! BOOOOOOO!!! I've known for years that Californians didn't deserve to get major league baseball because they didn't know anything about it. Later Seriously. Dude was probably like "OOH that's the guy with the different-colored eyes. I'll vote for him." Love The News calling the guy out on the cover!

seawolf17 Nov 15 2018 06:52 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

41Forever wrote: Love The News calling the guy out on the cover! Reminds me of one of my favorite tweets: [tweet]https://twitter.com/skullmandible/status/411281851131523072[/tweet]

batmagadanleadoff Nov 15 2018 07:04 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

https://nypost.com/2018/11/15/writer-wh ... -host/amp/ Lone Scherzer first place voter hangs up on Steve Somers during radio interview.

MFS62 Nov 15 2018 07:06 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Did anyone see the guy from MLB (Jack O'Connell, who is, I think, the Treasurer) making the announcement? And I quote: "Jacob deGrom receiving more support from the baseball writers than his teammates." SHEESH!!! What a douchebag. He probably bet on someone else. Later

Benjamin Grimm Nov 15 2018 07:08 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

It's actually a pretty good line.

Ashie62 Nov 15 2018 07:24 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

I am so not watching the San Diego Credit Union Holiday bowl this year

MFS62 Nov 15 2018 07:34 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Nov 15 2018 07:40 AM

Benjamin Grimm wrote: It's actually a pretty good line. Yeah, it was. But a snide slap at the team still wasn't really appropriate when you're announcing an individual award. Its like announcing an Oscar and saying, "And the winner is _______, who won the award in a really shitty movie". Later

Ceetar Nov 15 2018 07:35 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

only the Newsday cover there is worthy of anything, the other two make sure to sneak in a bit of LOLMets.

MFS62 Nov 15 2018 07:38 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Ceetar wrote: only the Newsday cover there is worthy of anything, the other two make sure to sneak in a bit of LOLMets. I don't think the News was. It was more a shot at that one voter. But I wouldn't have expected anything better from the Post. Later

Ceetar Nov 15 2018 07:57 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

MFS62 wrote: Ceetar wrote: only the Newsday cover there is worthy of anything, the other two make sure to sneak in a bit of LOLMets. I don't think the News was. It was more a shot at that one voter. But I wouldn't have expected anything better from the Post. Later The everyone hits for Jake thing is a knock at the offense. Something that's irrelevant to his award. Also it barely makes sense so it's not even like it's a good pun. It's just big stupid words all over the place. It's bigger than the picture. And the other one 'of the times' and 'despite' are qualifiers. Fuck qualifiers, deGrom was amazing, full stop.

bmfc1 Nov 15 2018 08:45 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Booooooo, John Maffei of the San Diego Union-Tribune! BOOOOOOO!!! https://deadspin.com/huffy-dopey-cy-you ... 1830463044

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Nov 15 2018 12:10 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Ceetar wrote: Ceetar wrote: only the Newsday cover there is worthy of anything, the other two make sure to sneak in a bit of LOLMets. I don't think the News was. It was more a shot at that one voter. But I wouldn't have expected anything better from the Post. Later The everyone hits for Jake thing is a knock at the offense. Something that's irrelevant to his award. Also it barely makes sense so it's not even like it's a good pun. It's just big stupid words all over the place. It's bigger than the picture. And the other one 'of the times' and 'despite' are qualifiers. Fuck qualifiers, deGrom was amazing, full stop. I'm kind of shocked that nobody went the "A WIN FOR JAKE... FINALLY" route. In all fairness to the stupid, stupid tabloids... It is pretty newsworthy how poorly the Mets played-- relief, defense, and bats-- behind Dutch this season. Jake was historically, peak-Pedro good... and his team was much poorer in his games, in virtually every measure, than they were elsewise. They were a .438 team behind him... and .485 when not.

seawolf17 Nov 15 2018 12:20 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote: They were a .438 team behind him... and .485 when not. Right? Hell, ten wins almost led the damn staff.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Nov 15 2018 12:35 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Readers determined to be mad whenever a writer or publication is interpreted as not confirming their POV is the "real problem" with the media.

Ashie62 Nov 15 2018 12:56 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

The narrative the the 'Mets don't hit for deGrom" is almost obscene and is another example why sports talk radio sux

Frayed Knot Nov 15 2018 01:05 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Wait, so we're supposed to say, and demand that others do as well, that the Mets did hit for deGrom?!? They didn't, that's a fact. It doesn't mean they didn't hit because it was him. But it was almost comical how, every fifth day, JdG is out there pitching a gem and the other eight guys have a collective total of one hit and one walk thru six innings. And that the pattern repeated itself Every. Freakin'. Time.

Frayed Knot Nov 15 2018 01:29 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

I hereby demand the "badass start" be made an official stat. Yup! I've long said that those who complain about the 'Quality Start'* merely have to adjust their criteria to fit the level they want. Quality Start: 6 or more innings, 3 or fewer runs Super Quality Start: 7 or more innings, 2 or fewer runs BADASS Start: 8 or more innings, 1 or fewer runs * overdone complaints IMO as the complainers almost always compute it as if the pitcher pitches the bare minimum while also allowing the maximum runs each and every time ... aka: But he'd have a 4.50 ERA!!! Yeah, and a .250 hitter can have a 100 game hitting streak too, but it's not bloody likely! Also, a QS occurs less often than not and the team that gets one wins most of those games. So while a single QS doesn't really tell you much over the long haul it's better to have more of them, just like most stats.

Centerfield Nov 15 2018 01:35 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Frayed Knot wrote: Wait, so we're supposed to say, and demand that others do as well, that the Mets did hit for deGrom?!? They didn't, that's a fact. It doesn't mean they didn't hit because it was him. But it was almost comical how, every fifth day, JdG is out there pitching a gem and the other eight guys have a collective total of one hit and one walk thru six innings. And that the pattern repeated itself Every. Freakin'. Time. Exactly. The story of Jacob deGrom 2018 cannot be separated from how badly the rest of the Mets were behind him. The offense, the pen. 1985 is a season the Mets can look back at with pride. 2018 is shameful.

Frayed Knot Nov 15 2018 01:36 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

batmagadanleadoff wrote: https://nypost.com/2018/11/15/writer-who-didnt-vote-for-degrom-hangs-up-on-wfan-host/amp/ Lone Scherzer first place voter hangs up on Steve Somers during radio interview. I would have hung up on him too. Cuz unless this guy was informed ahead of time that the line of "tough" questioning was all to set up jokes, if someone started an interview with "how can you look at yourself in the mirror”, and, ”you’re only looking for 15 minutes of fame and attention”, all over a single awards vote, he deserves to be hung up on. Maybe Somers thinks, after, what, 30 years now on FAN?, that he and his brand of schtick are famous from coast to coast and to all the ships at sea. But I'm guessing he's probably not.

RealityChuck Nov 15 2018 01:41 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Frayed Knot wrote: Wait, so we're supposed to say, and demand that others do as well, that the Mets did hit for deGrom?!? They didn't, that's a fact. It doesn't mean they didn't hit because it was him. But it was almost comical how, every fifth day, JdG is out there pitching a gem and the other eight guys have a collective total of one hit and one walk thru six innings. And that the pattern repeated itself Every. Freakin'. Time. I suspect that, once they saw they were hitting badly for him, the players started pressing and not playing their game.

Mets Willets Point Nov 15 2018 01:43 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

I'm kind of surprised that Steve Somers is still alive. After reading this thread I googled him & learned he's only a few months older than my mother, but back in the 80s I thought he was much, much older.

Centerfield Nov 15 2018 02:28 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

RealityChuck wrote: Frayed Knot wrote: Wait, so we're supposed to say, and demand that others do as well, that the Mets did hit for deGrom?!? They didn't, that's a fact. It doesn't mean they didn't hit because it was him. But it was almost comical how, every fifth day, JdG is out there pitching a gem and the other eight guys have a collective total of one hit and one walk thru six innings. And that the pattern repeated itself Every. Freakin'. Time. I suspect that, once they saw they were hitting badly for him, the players started pressing and not playing their game. Does anyone have the run support numbers? I'm sure there was some difference between Jake and the other pitchers, but it's not like the team hit like the Red Sox in the other games. 23rd ranked offense isn't going to provide much run support all the way around.

Frayed Knot Nov 15 2018 02:43 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Centerfield wrote: Does anyone have the run support numbers? I'm sure there was some difference between Jake and the other pitchers, but it's not like the team hit like the Red Sox in the other games. 23rd ranked offense isn't going to provide much run support all the way around. Don't have them handy but, yeah, they were much worse when JdG pitched. Bad even by NYM 2018 standards and bad by historical standards.

Frayed Knot Nov 15 2018 02:59 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

And, btw, if you're going to get all huffy over CY votes (or MVP or whatever) no response you're going to have is going to be as good as the one Kate Upton had over the 2016 AL CY vote when Justin Verlander finished 2nd due to several writers leaving him out of their top 5 entirely which cost him enough points to drop him off the lead despite his getting almost as many 1st place votes as all the others combined. "Hey BBWAA", the then-girlfriend/now wife tweeted afterward, "I thought I was the only one who got to fuck Justin Verlander" Now THAT'S how you protest a vote!

Benjamin Grimm Nov 15 2018 03:01 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

dinosaur jesus Nov 15 2018 03:02 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Centerfield wrote: Does anyone have the run support numbers? I'm sure there was some difference between Jake and the other pitchers, but it's not like the team hit like the Red Sox in the other games. 23rd ranked offense isn't going to provide much run support all the way around. 3.5 runs a game. That's bad, and it's well below what the Mets scored overall, but it's not historically bad. Nola got 3.8, didn't pitch nearly as well, and had a much better W-L. I think Jake had bad luck on when the runs were scored. Scherzer got 5.4.

Centerfield Nov 15 2018 03:30 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Is that true? 3.5 sounds much too high. I thought I read something like if the Mets had just scored 3 runs each start, he would have won 48 games or something.

G-Fafif Nov 15 2018 03:48 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

The Last Blasphemer lays it on Randy Jones. https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sp ... story.html Twenty-nine other writers didn't have an automatic column this morning.

bmfc1 Nov 15 2018 03:51 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Michael Wilbon is a blasphemer (on PTI): "I don't value what they value. I value winning the damn game."

Edgy MD Nov 15 2018 04:17 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Michael Wilbon is an idiot. Has been for a long time. Either that or he writes and says idiotic things to get attention. This, by the way, is pretty cool. Benjamin Grimm wrote: Wait a minute ... where are the other two Seavers? For that matter, what happened to Dickey's arm?

dinosaur jesus Nov 15 2018 04:41 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Centerfield wrote: Is that true? 3.5 sounds much too high. I thought I read something like if the Mets had just scored 3 runs each start, he would have won 48 games or something. The 3.49 is according to BaseballReference. If the Mets had scored exactly 3 runs each time he pitched, he would have gone 22-1 with 9 no-decisions. But it never actually works that way. And that also assumes that the bullpen didn't give up any runs at all.

G-Fafif Nov 15 2018 04:56 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Nick Piecoro of Arizona Republic dissents from Yelich unanimity, gives 1st place MVP vote to Jake, who finished fifth overall. The antimaffei.

Frayed Knot Nov 15 2018 07:07 PM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Centerfield wrote: Is that true? 3.5 sounds much too high. As an average that's real low. And then you have to remember that 'Average' can be a misleading term. In his first four starts of the season, for instance, the Mets score 6, 8, 8, 6. And then they also later won a JdG start 12-2 Put another way, in his 32 starts they scored 3 or fewer 21 times. 0 runs scored = 3 times 1 = 6 2 = 3 3 = 9 In the other 11 games he twice got 4 runs of support. He also got 5 runs & 6 runs twice each. And then 8 runs four times and then the 12 run game already mentioned. So while the mean might be 3.49, the mode and the median is 3.0 in a year where the average runs scored per/game-per/team was 4.45

seawolf17 Nov 16 2018 07:12 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Edgy MD wrote: Wait a minute ... where are the other two Seavers? For that matter, what happened to Dickey's arm?

Benjamin Grimm Nov 16 2018 07:28 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

On last night's Mets Hot Stove, they presented a graphic that said that Jacob deGrom is one of seven pitchers to win both the Rookie of the Year and the Cy Young. Pretty cool that three of the seven were Mets, and that they were Mets for both the ROY and the CY. I don't know who the other four were, but I bet Jon Matlack feels like a stooge for not having won a Cy Young Award. Darryl Strawberry too, for that matter.

Edgy MD Nov 16 2018 09:07 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

Fernando Valenzuela won them both in the same season, although Tom Seaver and Jim Palmer and Tim Raines might have felt that Fernandomania overinfluenced the voters.

Centerfield Nov 16 2018 09:31 AM Re: Blasphemers of Jake

G-Fafif wrote: The Last Blasphemer lays it on Randy Jones. https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sp ... story.html Twenty-nine other writers didn't have an automatic column this morning. Yes, the Mets were a bad club, offensively and defensively. He didn't get run support. One emailer pointed out that if the Mets had scored two runs in DeGrom's starts, he would have been 20-6; three runs would have been 25-1; four runs 30-0. But you know what they say about ifs and buts. The numbers are what they are and — after hours of consideration — I was swayed by Scherzer’s 18-7 mark in 220 2/3 innings on an under-achieving Nationals club. I spoke with Randy Jones, a man I greatly respect. He was 22-14 with a bad Padres team in 1976 and won the Cy Young Award. In that conversation, Randy said, "Wins are the most important thing in the game. You need to pitch to the run support you get, whether that's one, two, three or 12.” I wonder exactly what Randy meant. If he meant "winning the game" is the most important thing. And that a pitcher's job is to pitch to the run support you get, then this is true. The objective of the game is to win. You win and lose as a team. If your teammates suck, it's on you to to be better. But if Randy Jones mean "Wins are the most important stat", then he's wrong. And just because some pitcher says it, it's no excuse for a sportswriter to blindly follow. Individual awards are just that. Individual awards. Judging the performance of an player independent of the performance of the other players. If that wasn't the case, the Cy Young should go to the best pitcher on the World Champions. No other pitcher accomplished "the most important thing". But that's silly. Logic like this makes me irrationally upset. "In judging an individual's performance, I will use the statistic most poorly correlated with that individual's performance." Anyone paying attention today knows that Randy Jones's 22 wins has nothing to do with deGrom's 10 wins today. In 1976 Randy had 25 complete games. That number led MLB. 11 people tied for the lead this year. That number is 2. So yes, it's true that a pitcher's job is to pitch to the run support you get. I guess in today's game, a pitcher's job is to pitch to the run support you get, while taking into account the anticipated number of runs your bullpen will give up behind you. Had we had Randy Jones, he would have known to give up -3 runs in each start.