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How to do this on $185 million

Mex17 Nov 17 2018 07:08 AM Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Nov 17 2018 05:00 PM

I know, we go over this year after year after year, but the fact remains that it is absolutely reasonable for a New York team to be in that range if they need to be in order to contend. Here are the moves that BVW can do this year to put a good team on the field at that price. . . -Do the pitcher extensions that I discussed in the other thread. 5 years/$130 million for deGrom ($26 million AAV). 3 years/$25 million for Wheeler ($7 million for 2019, $8.5 for 2020, $9.5 for 2021). One year/$7 million for Syndergaard (to keep him on par salary wise for 2019 with Wheeler, thereby making him happy and still amenable to a longer term extension down the road. . .you still control him for 2020 and 2021). -Donaldson: 3 years/$58 million ($22 for 2019, $20 for 2020, $16 for 2021) -Grandal: 3 years/$45 million ($15 AAV) -Familia: 3 years/$30 million ($10 AAV) -Miller: 2 years/$22 million ($11 AAV) -Trade Frazier. -Non tender d'Arnaud. 2019 Payroll Cespedes - $29 million deGrom - $26 million Donaldson - $22 million Grandal - $15 million Bruce - $14 million Miller - $11 million Familia - $10 million Lagares - $9 million Swarzak - $8.5 million Vargas - $8 million Wheeler - $7 million Syndergaard - $7 million Flores - $4.7 million (arbitration estimate) Conforto - $4.4 million (arbitration estimate) Matz - $3 million (arbitration estimate) Plawecki - $1.3 million (arbitration estimate) Rosario - $600,000 (pre arbitration) McNeil -$600,000 (pre arbitration) Nimmo - $600,000 (pre arbitration) Lugo - $600,000 (pre arbitration) Gsellman - $600,000 (pre arbitration) Rivera - $600,000 (pre arbitration) remaining 3 spots on the 25 man - $600,000 x 3 = $1.8 million If my arithmetic is correct, that puts us right in the $185 million sweet spot. Not over the luxury tax threshold, not even brushing right up against it, but in the range where at team with "New York" on it's road jerseys ought to be. It's completely reasonable.

smg58 Nov 17 2018 07:33 AM Re: How to do this on $185 million

I'd take this if we got this.

Centerfield Nov 17 2018 08:45 AM Re: How to do this on $185 million

This should be the minimum. Also factor in the Cespedes insurance money.

MFS62 Nov 17 2018 03:26 PM Re: How to do this on $185 million

Centerfield wrote: This should be the minimum. Also factor in the Cespedes insurance money. Has David officially said "no mas"? Where's the money? Later

Rockin' Doc Nov 17 2018 07:34 PM Re: How to do this on $185 million

Centerfield wrote: This should be the minimum. Also factor in the Cespedes insurance money. This should be the minimum, but I expect it is more than the Mets will do. I'm growing old and cynical.

Mex17 Nov 18 2018 05:05 AM Re: How to do this on $185 million

So here is another way of saying the same thing over again, but they way that I am going to say it (hopefully) will really bring it into focus because I am going to avoid hyperbole and just stick to what is known. -We know that the team has failed on the field. -We know that Jeff Wilpon has acknowledged this and we know that he has stated that he prefers better results. -We know what the team needs in order to fill the gaps on the roster and improve. (A righthanded power bat in order to mitigate the absence of Cespedes in the short term and to supplement Cespedes in the longer term. A legitimate major league starting catcher who has actually hit and also provide defense at the catching position. Multiple legitimate bullpen arms with successful track records in the later innings.) -We know the identities of players who are free agents now who would satisfy these needs and we know the general market value of those players on the open market. -We know that we are sitting on a reigning CY Young award winner in his prime. We know that the team controlls the player for two more years, but after that he is able to walk while he still would have good years left in him and that this would be a giant public relations hit if he continues to pitch at a high level when this happens. -We know that we have other pitchers as well who have shown that they can perform on a high level and we still control them as well for various periods of time. -We know the general market value of those pitchers. We also know that other teams in the past have been able to "buy out" years of free agency for still controllable players before they hit the open market via deals that provide guaranteed money to the players before free agency in excess of what they would get in arbitration while still being "team friendly" in the sense that the payout is to some degree below open market value. -We know how to add. In this instance we know how to add together the cumulative salaries of all of the above (needs + players who meet those needs + market value of the players who meet our needs + slightly under market value of the players that we need to retain prior to them hitting free agency). We are assuming that Jeff Wilpon also knows how to add. If Jeff Wilpon (and his Dad) are sincere about what he wants accomplished for this baseball franchise, is able to perform arithmetic, and sees that he is unwilling or unable to finance what the arithmetic tells him, the (once again) the next step should be obvious to all parties involved.

Centerfield Nov 18 2018 09:31 AM Re: How to do this on $185 million

I think the Wilpons are sincere in their desire to win. But I think they’re incompetent. I think they can’t afford to fund a $185 million payroll because they’ve over-leveraged the team and SNY to make up for Madoff losses. And I think they meddle too much to allow a smart GM to spend wisely even if they had that money. New GM though. So we will just have to wait and see.

TransMonk Nov 18 2018 10:25 AM Re: How to do this on $185 million

Centerfield wrote: we will just have to wait and see. I feel like this has been the Mets’ motto for a long time.

smg58 Nov 19 2018 07:26 AM Re: How to do this on $185 million

Centerfield wrote: I think the Wilpons are sincere in their desire to win. But I think they’re incompetent. I think they can’t afford to fund a $185 million payroll because they’ve over-leveraged the team and SNY to make up for Madoff losses. And I think they meddle too much to allow a smart GM to spend wisely even if they had that money. New GM though. So we will just have to wait and see. Don't overlook the role CitiField played in this. No other major American sports franchise had ever seen a drop in attendance on moving to a new stadium -- and the Mets' attendance dropped the first three years at Citi. They got tax breaks that were overly generous over the long haul, but the Wilpons paid quite a bit up front and the opening coincided with a recession and a very expensive last place team. (It didn't help that the stadium initially paid more tribute to the Dodgers and the Giants than it did to the Mets, either, or that it had fewer seats for the guaranteed sell-outs than Shea did.) The Madoff situation gets all the attention, but there was more at work.

batmagadanleadoff Nov 19 2018 07:54 AM Re: How to do this on $185 million

smg58 wrote: Centerfield wrote: I think the Wilpons are sincere in their desire to win. But I think they’re incompetent. I think they can’t afford to fund a $185 million payroll because they’ve over-leveraged the team and SNY to make up for Madoff losses. And I think they meddle too much to allow a smart GM to spend wisely ?even if they had that money. New GM though. So we will just have to wait and see. Don't overlook the role CitiField played in this.... And whose fault is that ....the stadium's? It's the stadium's fault that the Mets sucked and the stadium was small and has a Jackie Robinson rotunda and the ugliest scoreboard in all of sports and that the owners are cheap and incompetent

Centerfield Nov 19 2018 08:08 AM Re: How to do this on $185 million

It's clearly the Wilpon's fault. I think that smg is saying that the Wilpons screwed up on multiple fronts, not just the ponzi scheme.

batmagadanleadoff Nov 19 2018 08:22 AM Re: How to do this on $185 million

Centerfield wrote: It's clearly the Wilpon's fault. I think that smg is saying that the Wilpons screwed up on multiple fronts, not just the ponzi scheme. Whew! I thought all was lost.

Ashie62 Nov 19 2018 08:46 AM Re: How to do this on $185 million

Jeff said there is room to do things. I'm in!

smg58 Nov 19 2018 11:39 AM Re: How to do this on $185 million

Centerfield wrote: It's clearly the Wilpon's fault. I think that smg is saying that the Wilpons screwed up on multiple fronts, not just the ponzi scheme. Well, yeah. My point was that the Wilpons' financial issues went beyond the Madoff situation; they took for granted that the new stadium would be a cash cow, and it was the opposite of that. Some of that (the recession, obviously, although that affected every other team too) was beyond their control, but plenty of issues with the stadium (and the team) were not.

LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr Nov 19 2018 08:47 PM Re: How to do this on $185 million

Ashie62 wrote: Jeff said there is room to do things. I'm in! "I'll just have to, y'know, have Brodie check in with me from time to time, to see that there's still room. Y'know, like before each and every move. Budget? Who needs a budget? We're flexible! We'll be even more flexible once we trade our much cheaper ace, who's coming off a mild down-season."