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FotF

Edgy MD Feb 09 2019 09:32 PM

I was wondering who was going to inherit the mantle of "Face of the Franchise" from David Wright. I would guess that Jacob deGrom, coming off a Cy Young season, has to be in the catbird seat, We'll handicap him as even money. He's 50% likely with Syndergaard at perhaps 33% and Brandon Nimmo at 17%. But I think it's deGrom's at the start of the season and his to lose. This put me to thinking who the Mets FotF's have been throughout history. If we stick to the Highlander Rule ("There can be only one!"), we're looking for someone who is (1) a star, or has star qualities, (2) is relatable, (3) is willing (to be the guy to hold up the big check in the photo op with the corporate supporters of Mets charities, for instance, or to host the Make-a-Wish Foundation kid), (4) has a Q Rating that is high among moms, (5) is clean enough (at least publicly) for a box of Wheaties. A citizen. Even if you have multiple stars—or even better stars—this guy is going to be the go-to guy for media guide and yearbook covers. He's generous to a fault with the media. Needing to be relatable, it's unfortunately an advantage to be white, English-first, tenured for a period, and/or locally sourced. Needing to be almost Wheaties clean, a drug violation, an assault or DWI arrest, or a profane rap record are going to cost you points toward the crown. Not to suggest these things are moral equivalents, but you get what I mean. Two more caveats. (1) A team can open the season with one face, and things develop so as to shift the mantle mid-season. You generally don't see more than two, though, as promotional materials have to be ordered in advance, and (2) Casey Stengel was probably the true FotF from the day he was hired until the day he retired, but if you're playing at home, we're sticking to players. Here's my impression. Have at it. [th]Year[/th] [th]FotF[/th] Early 1962 Gil Hodges Late 1962 Marv Throneberry Early 1963 Marv Throneberry Late 1963 Ron Hunt 1964 Ron Hunt 1965 Ron Hunt 1966 Ron Hunt Early 1967 Ed Kranepool Late 1967 Tom Seaver 1968 Tom Seaver 1969 Tom Seaver 1970 Tom Seaver 1971 Tom Seaver 1972 Tom Seaver 1973 Tom Seaver 1974 Tom Seaver 1975 Tom Seaver 1976 Tom Seaver Early 1977 Tom Seaver Late 1977 Ed Kranepool Early 1978 Ed Kranepool Late 1978 Lee Mazzilli 1979 Lee Mazzilli 1980 Lee Mazzilli Early 1981 Lee Mazzilli Late 1981 Rusty Staub 1982 Rusty Staub 1983 Tom Seaver 1984 Mookie Wilson Early 1985 Keith Hernandez Late 1985 Gary Carter 1986 Gary Carter 1987 Gary Carter 1988 Ron Darling 1989 David Cone 1990 David Cone 1991 John Franco 1992 John Franco 1993 John Franco 1994 John Franco 1995 John Franco 1996 John Franco 1997 John Franco 1998 John Franco 1999 Mike Piazza 2000 Mike Piazza 2001 Mike Piazza 2002 Mike Piazza 2003 Mike Piazza 2004 Mike Piazza 2005 Mike Piazza 2006 David Wright 2007 David Wright 2008 David Wright 2009 David Wright 2010 David Wright 2011 David Wright 2012 David Wright 2013 David Wright 2014 David Wright 2015 David Wright 2016 David Wright 2017 David Wright 2018 David Wright 2019 David Wright

LWFS Feb 09 2019 11:04 PM Re: FotF

Jake is BEYOND Jake, but off-field... he's kind of a charisma void. Thor is pretty much there, isn't he? If he has anything APPROACHING a Cy season, he'll be undeniably facey.

nymr83 Feb 09 2019 11:53 PM Re: FotF

I don't think John Franco was the FotF from '91 until Piazza got here. If nothing else, Todd Hundley became the face when he was in the process of setting the catcher homerun record in 1996 and he kept the mantle through 1997 until at least his injury in 1998.

stevejrogers Feb 10 2019 03:49 AM Re: FotF

I'd argue Doc was still presented as such during his final years with the team. Certainly after the exodus of Carter, Hernandez and Strawberry.

Edgy MD Feb 10 2019 05:32 AM Re: FotF

All those points are strong, and I certainly considered all three. A problem with Syndergaard is that he isn't willingly submissive. If he gets to ham his way through an interview and be Thor, he's all over it, but if he's put in a media appearance that he isn't in control of, he gets all petulant and uncomfortable. There's a little too much Harvey there. But we'll see.

Benjamin Grimm Feb 10 2019 06:32 AM Re: FotF

Maybe sometimes the Mets were faceless. Or maybe sometimes the face was that of the manager. In the short term after Seaver was traded and before Mazzilli emerged, I'd say that Joe Torre was the face of the franchise. (Or Jerry Koosman more than Ed Kranepool.) And in the early years, it was most certainly Casey Stengel.

Johnny Lunchbucket Feb 10 2019 07:13 AM Re: FotF Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Feb 10 2019 08:32 AM

I'd say Zimmo is probably the current most Metmarketable locally. They can and do roll him out with no fear that he'll say the wrong the thing or get too far off message. The only thing holding him back from full-on Face-ness is the seeming lack of certainty on his hold on a job. Edit: On a national level, it's probably deGrom/Syndy

MFS62 Feb 10 2019 07:22 AM Re: FotF Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Feb 10 2019 10:36 AM

Benjamin Grimm wrote: In the short term after Seaver was traded and before Mazzilli emerged, I'd say that Joe Torre was the face of the franchise. Its amazing that Torre's face didn't scare people away. To me, the FotF is someone who, when you think of a team, you think of that person. As for Wright being the FotF in 2018, he didn't show that face until the last week of the season. I didn't think of him all year, except when we were discussing money available for acquiring players who could help the team. But I guess he was it because nobody else was really being called that by us or the press, so he gets it by default. Later

Benjamin Grimm Feb 10 2019 07:36 AM Re: FotF

I feel like Rip Van Winkle. Is 2019 already over?

kcmets Feb 10 2019 08:30 AM Re: FotF

At quick glance, Edgy's list is pretty solid. It's a little too Mazz-heavy maybe and could use a sprinkling of some Hundley? Hubie Brooks had a nice face.

Frayed Knot Feb 10 2019 08:37 AM Re: FotF

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Maybe sometimes the Mets were faceless. https://images.hellogiggles.com/uploads/2016/05/24083705/faceless.jpg>

whippoorwill Feb 10 2019 10:07 AM Re: FotF

I can't go for David Wright the past few years when he was basically absent. Any new fan wouldn't have a clue. Pick a costar, please

dgwphotography Feb 10 2019 10:54 AM Re: FotF

I'd go with Darryl in 84, and Doc in 85

batmagadanleadoff Feb 10 2019 12:30 PM Re: FotF

Getouttahere with that Gary Carter crap. Did Gary come back from the dead to manipulate and whine his way into this conversation? Also, Pedro and Beltran, maybe together, for 05 and 06 as the face of Los Mets.

batmagadanleadoff Feb 10 2019 01:35 PM Re: FotF

=batmagadanleadoff post_id=2693 time=1549827005 user_id=68] Getouttahere with that Gary Carter crap. Did Gary come back from the dead to manipulate and whine his way into this conversation? Also, Pedro and Beltran, maybe together, for 05 and 06 as the face of Los Mets.

Why would Carter ever, even for just one season, be the FotF over Hernandez?

Benjamin Grimm Feb 10 2019 02:01 PM Re: FotF

It seems like the criteria may have a bit of a "nice guy" requirement. Someone willing to play along with the company line. But I do agree that Keith was more the "face of the Mets" from 1984 through 1988 than anyone else.

Edgy MD Feb 10 2019 03:04 PM Re: FotF

=batmagadanleadoff post_id=2694 time=1549830954 user_id=68] =batmagadanleadoff post_id=2693 time=1549827005 user_id=68] Getouttahere with that Gary Carter crap. Did Gary come back from the dead to manipulate and whine his way into this conversation? Also, Pedro and Beltran, maybe together, for 05 and 06 as the face of Los Mets.

Why would Carter ever, even for just one season, be the FotF over Hernandez?


He just was. I don't think it's even particularly controversial. Just as there is no doubt in my mind that Hernandez was the better player.

kcmets Feb 10 2019 03:31 PM Re: FotF

Carter was always in front of the camera regardless of another 0-4. Called him Camera Carter when I wasn't calling Pop-up Carter. He was FotF for sure, but it kinda drove me nuts at times.

G-Fafif Feb 10 2019 03:49 PM Re: FotF

(1) a star, or has star qualities, (2) is relatable, (3) is willing (to be the guy to hold up the big check in the photo op with the corporate supporters of Mets charities, for instance, or to host the Make-a-Wish Foundation kid), (4) has a Q Rating that is high among moms, (5) is clean enough (at least publicly) for a box of Wheaties. A citizen. Even if you have multiple stars—or even better stars—this guy is going to be the go-to guy for media guide and yearbook covers. He's generous to a fault with the media. Needing to be relatable, it's unfortunately an advantage to be white, English-first, tenured for a period, and/or locally sourced. Needing to be almost Wheaties clean, a drug violation, an assault or DWI arrest, or a profane rap record are going to cost you points toward the crown. Not to suggest these things are moral equivalents, but you get what I mean. Wright was unique in that he was able to be all these things (not to be confused with "all things to all people" in the cynical sense). In fact, I don't remember the phrase "face of the franchise" existing before he came along. Though he was surrounded by incredibly decorated veterans as he established himself, he was who he became no later than his third season. If we're gonna get granular, I do think you have to be present to be the guy. David Wright did not lose the crown on paper when he disappeared from the active roster for most of his final four seasons, but when he wasn't around, he wasn't around, and he was always very careful to not big-foot onto the scene when he did make cameos. And while he was the ongoing "let's get David to take this picture with these kids" stalwart, there were stretches when he wasn't the center of attention for the media or the fans. He stepped back in 2011 when Jose Reyes was chasing the batting crown (I remember one of the beat writers noting that it was the first time he saw his colleagues crowd around somebody else after games as a matter of course) and was probably overshadowed across all criteria by R.A. Dickey in 2012. Matt Harvey was a way bigger deal than Wright in 2013, though maybe not doing the milk commercials. You can't undersell Richie Ashburn as 1962 progressed. Gil was out most of the second half of the season and Richie sort of cultivated the Marvelous persona for his teammate. Piazza was clearly The Man on The Mets in a way nobody else, not even Seaver, has ever been for the Mets (everyday player as opposed to a pitcher; larger than life baseball persona; the guy even your Mets-illiterate relatives knew about; nobody else on the roster close in terms of overall star power/Metsian equity across most of his tenure; his name and number on more backs than everybody else's names and numbers combined in a get your player merchandise at Modell's age) but he wasn't really the spokesman for the team. There was inevitably somebody else -- Franco, Leiter, Ventura, Zeile, Cameron, Floyd, Martinez -- who was more comfortable with the media. Mike was "lead by example," excusing some of his reticence with this kind of role. The PR-ishness required does seem to make the idealized Face of the Franchise role more of a Gary Carter thing a little more than a Keith Hernandez one, 1985 through 1988. Yet everything entering 1984, on the heels of his ROY season, was about Darryl taking over the world and Doc built up so much equity and belovedness that he could be suspended for cocaine use and it didn't really peel away at his popularity or even his nice guy image (nice guy made a mistake was all). Keith, of course, was Keith. This is four-headed territory. Sometimes I still can't believe we lived through this era with these kinds of characters and had such a richly textured cast behind them. After Keith and Gary declined and departed, Gregg Jefferies should have been that guy but imploded. HoJo didn't really have it in him to be that guy except on the field every other season. Going into 2019, I'd have to say Conforto is best positioned to pick up however much of the mantle deGrom isn't gripping.

Edgy MD Feb 10 2019 05:14 PM Re: FotF

I have no doubt that Gooden opens 1987 as the FotF, if he didn't open 1987 as a resident of the Smithers Clinic. As for guys who carried the banner for Wright when he was on extended leave, you can't understate the work of Curtis Granderson in the role. I can't imagine what it's like to play host to a gravely ill child, living out what may be his or her last wish in being a Met for a day, and you know the kid's heart was set on Wright, and you've got to be so gracious as to coach him or her through the disappointment and still give Junior the best day he or she may ever have. I'm struggling to get my batting average above .230 and while my teammates are getting ready for the battle I'm supposed to be delighted to be a kid's consolation prize? And yet he took up Wright's slack with such grace and enthusiasm, I imagine no family left even slightly disappointed.

G-Fafif Feb 10 2019 05:26 PM Re: FotF

Having witnessed it up close a few times, I feel comfortable asserting Grandy was as good as it got at thrilling kids of all ages with his attention, including posing for selfies while also being the on-deck batter. In general, the portion of 2015 that was sans Captain felt like the Curtis and Daniel Show before and after games, Curtis before, Daniel after. It was suggested in their mutual prime that had baseball been more like hockey, David would have worn the C, Murph the A.

Edgy MD Feb 10 2019 07:16 PM Re: FotF

=kcmets post_id=2700 time=1549837913 user_id=53] Carter was always in front of the camera regardless of another 0-4. Called him Camera Carter when I wasn't calling Pop-up Carter. He was FotF for sure, but it kinda drove me nuts at times.

The long and the short of it right there.

nymr83 Feb 10 2019 09:43 PM Re: FotF

Agreed with G-Fafif, Dickey was the FotF for at least the second half of 2012 until he was traded. people LOVED that guy

batmagadanleadoff Feb 10 2019 09:56 PM Re: FotF

Edgy MD wrote: =batmagadanleadoff post_id=2694 time=1549830954 user_id=68] =batmagadanleadoff post_id=2693 time=1549827005 user_id=68] Getouttahere with that Gary Carter crap. Did Gary come back from the dead to manipulate and whine his way into this conversation? Also, Pedro and Beltran, maybe together, for 05 and 06 as the face of Los Mets. Why would Carter ever, even for just one season, be the FotF over Hernandez?

He just was. I don't think it's even particularly controversial. Just as there is no doubt in my mind that Hernandez was the better player.


OK. I see where you're going with this. I re-read your original post, which admittedly, I skimmed if even that, once I saw the phrase FotF. But based on your criteria, I could now see a good case being made for Gary Carter. Great. He had better PR skills than Keith and wasn't ever involved in no coke scandals. Still a phony in my book.

nymr83 Feb 10 2019 10:52 PM Re: FotF

I say we need POLLS!

Edgy MD Feb 11 2019 05:39 AM Re: FotF

Edgy MD wrote: =batmagadanleadoff post_id=2694 time=1549830954 user_id=68] Why would Carter ever, even for just one season, be the FotF over Hernandez? He just was. I don't think it's even particularly controversial. Just as there is no doubt in my mind that Hernandez was the better player. OK. I see where you're going with this. I re-read your original post, which admittedly, I skimmed if even that, once I saw the phrase FotF. But based on your criteria, I could now see a good case being made for Gary Carter. Great. He had better PR skills than Keith and wasn't ever involved in no coke scandals. Still a phony in my book.

There's no doubt the Face of the Franchise role for any team is prone to phonies and semi-phonies. For more than a few, it may be the norm.

41Forever Feb 11 2019 06:54 AM Re: FotF

Edgy MD wrote: Edgy MD wrote: He just was. I don't think it's even particularly controversial. Just as there is no doubt in my mind that Hernandez was the better player. OK. I see where you're going with this. I re-read your original post, which admittedly, I skimmed if even that, once I saw the phrase FotF. But based on your criteria, I could now see a good case being made for Gary Carter. Great. He had better PR skills than Keith and wasn't ever involved in no coke scandals. Still a phony in my book. There's no doubt the Face of the Franchise role for any team is prone to phonies and semi-phonies. For more than a few, it may be the norm. I don't think it was a phony. I think he was by nature a positive person, and recognized that it's important for some to step up and deal with the media -- the best way to connect with the fans, who are the customers. We need more Gary Carters.

Johnny Lunchbucket Feb 11 2019 09:09 AM Re: FotF

People who knew Carter for decades were never able to determine with certainty how much of Carter was Carter and how much was Carter acting like "Gary Carter." I don;t think he ever knew

dgwphotography Feb 11 2019 10:02 AM Re: FotF

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: People who knew Carter for decades were never able to determine with certainty how much of Carter was Carter and how much was Carter acting like "Gary Carter." I don't think he ever knew This is where I feel the need to pull out my favorite quote by any writer about any baseball player. I think Jerry Izenberg had the best take on Gary Carter: "Gary Carter may come off like a cliché, to the point where a lot of other players mistrust him, but the genuine article comes along so rarely it can be hard to recognize when it looks you in the eye."

Edgy MD Feb 11 2019 11:04 AM Re: FotF

There was a sequence on The Baseball Bunch with a pre-Mets version of Gary Carter. TBB was a show meant for Carter. He gets to be surrounded by doe-eyed moppets and fill them with inspirational pablum like "Never give up, no matter what the odds!" or "Remember, it's not about you, but the TEAM!!" But we didn't get that Gary. We got a version that ran his team of juniors like a martinet, full of sarcasm and contempt. And it was so different than any image he would even play at during his Mets years that I loved it. If there was just a little bit more of this Gary with the Mets, Gary the Ivory Soap Salesmen might have seemed a little less unctuous and contrived. [YOUTUBE]44Cclk61fJ4[/YOUTUBE]

Johnny Lunchbucket Feb 11 2019 11:21 AM Re: FotF

Holy crap that's great.

Edgy MD Feb 11 2019 03:43 PM Re: FotF

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: Holy crap that's great. It's like Carter is suddenly possessed by John Belushi.

dinosaur jesus Feb 11 2019 08:13 PM Re: FotF

For maybe a couple of weeks in 1978: Doug Flynn.

LWFS Feb 11 2019 11:22 PM Re: FotF

"I tell him to hit third base! NOOOOOOO" And practically yelping the entire time. This is fantastic.

Edgy MD Mar 26 2019 08:40 AM Re: FotF

So, this is deGrom's to lose now, right?

MFS62 Mar 26 2019 08:46 AM Re: FotF

Edgy MD wrote: So, this is deGrom's to lose now, right? Yep. Until the day Pete Alonso writes his name in the record books. Later

Edgy MD Mar 26 2019 08:59 AM Re: FotF

Edgy MD wrote: [YOUTUBE]44Cclk61fJ4[/YOUTUBE] I just watched this again for the millionth time, and I just realized for the first time that at the end, Bench and the Chicken are conspiring to mime a conversation about how Gary's an insane maniac, surprisingly assholish, and shouldn't be allowed near children.

Edgy MD Jul 13 2019 06:09 PM Re: FotF

So, this isn't established yet, right? deGrom has moved forward, and Syndergaard backward, with Alonso and McNeil tearing out of nowhere. Robinson Canó is not the Face of the Franchise, except maybe in the ironic sense.

Frayed Knot Jul 13 2019 06:23 PM Re: FotF

Maybe we can assign different body parts to players. Like Cano being the butt of the franchise. Not sure yet who the shoulder blade of the franchise would be.

Edgy MD Jul 13 2019 06:32 PM Re: FotF

The shoulder blade is probably Conforto, no?

whippoorwill Jul 13 2019 07:02 PM Re: FotF

Edgy MD wrote: Edgy MD wrote: [YOUTUBE]44Cclk61fJ4[/YOUTUBE] I just watched this again for the millionth time, and I just realized for the first time that at the end, Bench and the Chicken are conspiring to mime a conversation about how Gary's an insane maniac, surprisingly assholish, and shouldn't be allowed near children. There's a possibility these kids are crap baseball players

smg58 Jul 13 2019 07:22 PM Re: FotF

Edgy MD wrote: So, this is deGrom's to lose now, right? Yep. Until the day Pete Alonso writes his name in the record books. Later This comment is quite a bit more prescient than was probably originally intended.

MFS62 Jul 13 2019 08:35 PM Re: FotF

Edgy MD wrote: So, this is deGrom's to lose now, right? Yep. Until the day Pete Alonso writes his name in the record books. Later This comment is quite a bit more prescient than was probably originally intended. No. It was intentional. I don't FotF around. Later

Edgy MD Feb 27 2020 04:54 PM Re: FotF

So, deGrom still holds the title, with Paul Bunyan hot on his tail?

Fman99 Feb 27 2020 08:42 PM Re: FotF

Wow, I don't know how I missed this thread a year ago. I will tell you that Lee Mazzilli was my first "favorite Met," as a little kid, before they got good, so that jives. Don't discount McNeil as a potential FotF. He's just as marketable as the Piss Missile.

seawolf17 Feb 28 2020 06:32 AM Re: FotF

It won't happen because he's blocked in too many ways, but Dom Smith could carve himself out piece of the FotF pie. He might be my favorite Met right now.

G-Fafif Feb 28 2020 06:40 AM Re: FotF

Alonso's the sizzle. DeGrom's the steak.

smg58 Feb 28 2020 06:56 AM Re: FotF

Two straight Cy's mean it's still Jake. But he has some potential challengers -- Alonso obviously, but if McNeil keeps being McNeil he's in the running. And Thor could have that big season I think he's capable of having. And who knows, maybe the old Cespedes will show up.

Edgy MD Feb 28 2020 09:05 AM Re: FotF

Jake was alone on the cover of last year's media guide. Has this year's come out yet? Cés is a longshot for the role for the same reason Johnny Damon got the job over Manny. Suburban relatability.

Vic Sage Feb 28 2020 12:26 PM Re: FotF

speaking of which, if Conforto has the mvp year we've all been waiting for, he's a dark horse.

Centerfield Feb 28 2020 12:45 PM Re: FotF

I think it's Pete.

Edgy MD Feb 28 2020 03:24 PM Re: FotF

The 2020 media guide says it's deGrom by a head. [fimg=450]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ERYxz-_XkAEtJI_.jpg[/fimg]

Edgy MD Feb 28 2020 07:21 PM Re: FotF

The way that shot is set up, it kind of looks like deGrom is the head of a triangle, but they had to crop Carlos Betrán out. Better than 50% chance that's what's going on here, right?

86dreamer Mar 02 2020 12:59 PM Re: FotF

Alonso - last year and now. Jake is most definitely greater, but Pete is the man that rallies both the team and the fans

Johnny Lunchbucket Mar 02 2020 02:24 PM Re: FotF

I think it's great that JdG is such a low-key FotF. He got better once he cut his hair too. And not 4 nothing but he threw nothing but high 90s strikes in his spring debut yesterday, easy as pie. Gotta say, I prefer the low-drama guys in our rotation, regardless of where they rank in face-ability. Gimme reliable-but-boring over exciting-but-inconsistent anyday. Worried about Stroman, wary of Syndergaard. Bring on the Trachsels of the world!

G-Fafif Mar 02 2020 04:42 PM Re: FotF

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: Gotta say, I prefer the low-drama guys in our rotation, regardless of where they rank in face-ability. Gimme reliable-but-boring over exciting-but-inconsistent anyday. DeGrom is low-key but quietly charismatic. Best of all worlds, perhaps.

G-Fafif Mar 05 2020 01:57 PM Re: FotF

Regal. That's the word for deGrom. Also the word for a Beagle somewhere in Southern California.