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Hypothesis: Anderson Hernandez = Rey Ordonez

seawolf17 Apr 08 2006 10:42 AM

Both came up as 23-24 year old middle infielders heralded for outstanding defensive range and handed a starting job on Opening Day, despite the fact that neither one could hit their way out of a paper bag, and couldn't draw a walk if you spotted him three balls and a pitchout on the fourth pitch. Ordonez sucked the Mets dry for $20,000,000 on the basis of one play on Opening Day 1996 and one home run every September. Will Anderson Hernandez do the same? I'm not a fan of Hernandez. Discuss.

Bret Sabermetric Apr 08 2006 10:50 AM

As the Past President of the "Ordonez Detractors Club," I have to say that Ordonez wasn't the problem. Every club could use a fellow with Ordonez's (and Hernandez') defensive gifts. It's just that those gifts are as a late-inning defensive sub, for which I have no problem designating a roster spot. I just don't want the team committeed to giving a LIDS 3 or 4 at bats just because they stupidly signed him to a big contract. "Oh, I seem to have shot myself in the foot? Well, maybe I'll keep firing the gun in that direction and see if anything good starts happening." As long as Hernandez is paid minimally, and used minimally, I have no problem with him occupying a roster spot. I;d rather have a bat than a glove, but you do need gloves sometimes.

dinosaur jesus Apr 08 2006 10:56 AM

Hernandez is a backup infielder who started on opening day because the starter was injured. It might have been the wrong starter (the right one having been sent to Triple A), but that's another question. Is there really any chance he's going to suck the Mets dry? Ordonez was heralded for more than outstanding range. The hype was that he was the best shortstop anybody had ever seen, which may not have been far from the truth. He was never going to be much of a hitter, but he seemed to deliberately refuse to work on making himself better. He wouldn't hit the ball on the ground, and he was terrible at stealing bases. So no, I don't see much comparison. Similar skills, but not much else in common.

Yancy Street Gang Apr 08 2006 11:04 AM

Hernandez will be Ordonez if he keeps this up for another four or five years and gets a foolish multi-million dollar multi-year contract.

Elster88 Apr 08 2006 12:58 PM

Hernandez also will not be on Ordonez's level unless he starts hitting better.

*62 Apr 08 2006 03:34 PM

Ordonez does hold the Mets record for RBI in a season (60 !!!) by a #8 hitter. AH may not get that number in his career at this rate.

Bret Sabermetric Apr 08 2006 04:59 PM

He played an awful lot, with a lot of men on base that year. I think that was the year that four Mets averaged something like 112 RBIs apiece. Fonzie, Piazza, Olerud and Ventura. The club record for RBI had stood at 105 for about forever a little while before, and these guys were averaging 112 or so. That was a great year, 1999.

heep Apr 08 2006 05:36 PM

Hernandez better start doing something with the bat, or he will not last. I like the acrobatic catches, but Jeff Kepp in Norfolk, batting behind Lastings can handle the bat alot better than Hernandez right now. Thats not to say Hernandez will not improve, but how long will the Mets take a 200 average and failed bunt attempts? By the way, I think the sleeper-prospect this year that will draw some attention is Evan MacLane, lefter starter in Binghampton. He doesn't get much attention, not an overpowering type, but seems to have a high pitching acumen, real good control, outsmart you type. Put together a real nice start this week. 2 hittter, 5 shutout innings. Anyone have have any updates on Humber?

Edgy DC Apr 08 2006 05:48 PM

Adopt McClane NOW!!!!

metirish Apr 08 2006 07:31 PM

Kaz Matsui will apparently come off the disabled list today.

mlbaseballtalk Apr 08 2006 07:45 PM

Can we deport him?

Edgy DC Apr 08 2006 08:13 PM

Wow, hardly warranted. Particularly considering his replacement's performance.

Elster88 Apr 08 2006 10:10 PM

Edgy DC wrote: Wow, hardly warranted. Particularly considering his replacement's performance. You can't possibly be surpised at this.

mlbaseballtalk Apr 08 2006 10:43 PM

I was trying for mildly funny, since the illegal immigration issues in this country tend to revolve around south of the border and neighbooring countries and islands Hence deportation for an underperforming Far East illegal! Steve

Rotblatt Apr 09 2006 06:18 AM

Pretty good comparison, based on their minor league stats. Rey-Rey in the minors (4+ years) .257/.290/.344/.634 Hernandez (5 years) .274/.319/.367/.686 Hernandez was at least productive offensively in ONE of his minor league seasons, while Ordonez was not, but they were both pretty sucky and both got a chance to start at the same age. Hernandez's big advantage is that he's stolen 125 bases in the minors with at career 70% success rate. Rey-Rey never stole anything--29 SB in his minor league career (CS not recorded). I agree with Sal. Ordonez's detracting from the club wasn't HIS fault, but that of Mets management. Ordonez never had a Mets season where he was above replacement level.

Bret Sabermetric Apr 09 2006 10:27 AM

I just figured out the phrasing of a trivia question that sould ensnare some Mets fans (though you all know the answer by reading this thread): What year did five Mets, including their regular shortstop, average over a hundred RBIs apiece? "Mets' regular shortstop" and "100 RBI season" really don't compute, do they?

smg58 Apr 09 2006 10:46 AM

It's too early to tell on Hernandez. It's not even a week into the season. He has shown some signs of developing into a competent hitter in the minors last year and spring this year. He'll never have much pop, but he does have base-stealing potential if he gets on. I'm not necessarily against demoting him -- I got the sense that Keppinger was ready but Hernandez needed more seasoning -- but that doesn't mean he's played anywhere near long enough at the major league level to draw any final conclusions.

Bret Sabermetric Apr 09 2006 11:34 AM

Can we use my trivia question on the next CPF newbie?

Rotblatt Apr 09 2006 12:01 PM

smg58 wrote: It's too early to tell on Hernandez. It's not even a week into the season. He has shown some signs of developing into a competent hitter in the minors last year and spring this year. He'll never have much pop, but he does have base-stealing potential if he gets on. I'm not necessarily against demoting him -- I got the sense that Keppinger was ready but Hernandez needed more seasoning -- but that doesn't mean he's played anywhere near long enough at the major league level to draw any final conclusions. Hernandez got hot in the minors for about 2-3 months; after that, he went back to his former level of production. 2-3 months over 5+ years is not good. I think it's safe to say that Hernandez's ceiling is that of a below-average hitter.