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IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

kcmets
Jun 23 2019 08:23 AM

NYM (37‑40) Jacob deGrom (RHP, 4-6, 3.26)

CHC (41‑35) Cole Hamels (LHP, 6-2, 2.85)

G-Fafif
Jun 23 2019 09:53 AM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

Amed Rosario – SS

Pete Alonso – 1B

J.D. Davis – LF

Todd Frazier – 3B

Robinson Canó – 2B

Carlos Gomez – RF

Tomás Nido – C

Juan Lagares – CF

Jacob deGrom – RHP



Squirrel sits, lest his bat remain sizzling.

MFS62
Jun 23 2019 10:40 AM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

Not exactly a scary 4-8.

Later

batmagadanleadoff
Jun 23 2019 12:37 PM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

Mickey gave deGrom the zero run support lineup with Amed batting leadoff, Davis batting third and Lagares batting.

kcmets
Jun 23 2019 01:02 PM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

With no McForto, it does have a settle-for-the-Sunday-split vibe.

Edgy MD
Jun 23 2019 01:12 PM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

It was nice knowing you, Strawberry.

kcmets
Jun 23 2019 01:13 PM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

1. ALONSO

2. STRAW

G-Fafif
Jun 23 2019 01:18 PM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

225 to catch Straw all-time.

G-Fafif
Jun 23 2019 01:22 PM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

The Mets have gone two seven-game stretches thus far without a Pete Alonso home run. Those are the dry spells.

kcmets
Jun 23 2019 01:27 PM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

=G-Fafif post_id=13888 time=1561317481 user_id=55]225 to catch Straw all-time.


Mere bag of shells!

Edgy MD
Jun 23 2019 01:31 PM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

Nido > Alonso?

Edgy MD
Jun 23 2019 01:52 PM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

Hmmm... I felt like Davis quit on that ball too quickly, but he almost certainly played it correctly.

Edgy MD
Jun 23 2019 02:06 PM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

Great throw, but second questionable tag by Rosario today.

Edgy MD
Jun 23 2019 02:08 PM
Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

Heck of list of options for lefty pinch-hitters today:
[list=1]

  • [*]McNeil if you're looking for a base hit.

  • [*]Conforto if you're looking for four bags.

  • [*]Smith if you're looking for either and have already burned the other guy.
    • [/list]

    Edgy MD
    Jun 23 2019 02:15 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Three innings to protect a one-run (currently) lead. Who you gonna call?



    That Poundcake guy has climbed the depth chart quickly, hasn't he?

    Edgy MD
    Jun 23 2019 02:19 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Oh, I had not realized Lugissimo was available.

    Edgy MD
    Jun 23 2019 02:24 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    http://www.iocero.com/public/eventThumb/36873_police_melbourne_1984_ic.bmp>

    Frayed Knot
    Jun 23 2019 02:44 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    I wonder what an analysis would show concerning lengthy ABs -- however you want to define them: 7 or more pitches?, 8 or more?, 10? -- both for and against.

    Now maybe it's just biased thinking, but it seems to me (and right as we're having another one courtesy of Kris Bryant) that our pitchers have a lot more of those

    to contend with as compared to what NYM hitters do to opposing hurlers. iow: we seem to serve up a whole fucking lot of foul balls.

    41Forever
    Jun 23 2019 02:49 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Rats.

    bmfc1
    Jun 23 2019 02:50 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Plenty of second-guessing here.

    dgwphotography
    Jun 23 2019 02:52 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    =bmfc1 post_id=13904 time=1561323054 user_id=73]
    Plenty of second-guessing here.



    First guessing. Gary all but said he should be pulled before the homer

    kcmets
    Jun 23 2019 02:52 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Not to second guess, but my 1.99-guess is they unnecessarily road Lugo

    into that unfortunate outcome.

    Edgy MD
    Jun 23 2019 02:55 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    =dgwphotography post_id=13905 time=1561323148 user_id=78]
    =bmfc1 post_id=13904 time=1561323054 user_id=73]
    Plenty of second-guessing here.



    First guessing. Gary all but said he should be pulled before the homer


    So did everybody in my house, including the mice.

    bmfc1
    Jun 23 2019 02:55 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    The problem is that everyone else in the BP is not reliable other than Diaz so Mickey managed for the stat--saving Diaz for the 9th--instead of using Diaz with 2-on and worrying about the 9th inning later.

    HahnSolo
    Jun 23 2019 02:58 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    I generally try to be patient but I'm ready for a new skipper.

    bmfc1
    Jun 23 2019 03:02 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Unless they score 2 or more, Diaz will have gone unused and Mickey will have saved him for a situation that never happened.

    kcmets
    Jun 23 2019 03:02 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    =HahnSolo post_id=13909 time=1561323521 user_id=63]I generally try to be patient but I'm ready for a new skipper.



    Yeah - you, Edge's mice and I.

    Edgy MD
    Jun 23 2019 03:03 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Not that it should matter, but neither should it go unacknowledged: deGrom burned by his bullpen (and his manager's bullpen deployment) again.

    kcmets
    Jun 23 2019 03:04 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    It's Wrigley, bring some lumber into the ninth and rise above...

    Edgy MD
    Jun 23 2019 03:07 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    That Canó hustle. It's moving.

    Frayed Knot
    Jun 23 2019 03:10 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    The other (though less serious) piece of strategy here was double-switching McNeil for Frazier when he brought in Gsellman.

    Now, yeah, you'll likely employ McNeil in the 9th anyway,

    - but don't you want Frazier's defense while there are tow more outs in the 8th still to get?

    - if the Mets get a big inning Frazier's spot could conceivably come up (he made the final out of the 8th)

    - you aren't using Gsellman for a second inning anyway. Either you catch up and use Diaz for the 9th or you don't and there is no bottom 9



    So all you end up doing is telegraphing exactly when you're going to PH McNeil. It'll probably be where he PHs anyway, but there's no need to pre-decide that.

    Terry used to do that a lot in his early days, but even he weaned himself off that after a while.

    bmfc1
    Jun 23 2019 03:11 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    As FK said, Mickey double-switched and put his best hitter in the 5th spot for the 9th. Put him in for Gomez.

    Edgy MD
    Jun 23 2019 03:13 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    On paper, there's no shame in splitting with the Cubs on the road.



    In reality, ugh.

    bmfc1
    Jun 23 2019 03:14 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    What a great win this would have been. Dammit.

    kcmets
    Jun 23 2019 03:14 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    The Sunday-rest-'em lineup with Jacob-on-the-mound thing is gonna stick in my

    craw all night in this important and possibly pivotal game for the season.

    Lefty Specialist
    Jun 23 2019 03:21 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    This one's on Mickey. Pure and simple.

    bmfc1
    Jun 23 2019 03:40 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Lefty Specialist wrote:

    This one's on Mickey. Pure and simple.


    He doesn't think so:
    [TWEET]https://twitter.com/MattEhalt/status/1142907778404683776[/TWEET]

    bmfc1
    Jun 23 2019 03:56 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    [TWEET]https://twitter.com/NYPost_Mets/status/1142913840679739392[/TWEET]

    G-Fafif
    Jun 23 2019 04:12 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Tim Healey just became my favorite bear reporter.

    Edgy MD
    Jun 23 2019 04:16 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    It was cool when Bonilla was menacing the reporters. Going with Vargas there just seems so Bush League.

    Edgy MD
    Jun 23 2019 05:13 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Tim Healey just became my favorite bear reporter.


    I don't know if this was meant to read "beat reporter," but it works either way. Good work.



    While walking the dogs, it struck me that this may provide a perfectly reasonable pretext for management to let go of Callaway. "We respect Mickey and what he can bring to the game, but we can't have members of our staff mistreating members of the media like that. Those guys have a difficult enough job to do as it is. Our staff represents our organization to members of the press, and this reflects on everybody. The Cubs are the enemy, not the press pool. We've been down this road before, and if we don't set a standard throughout the organization, top to bottom, we're the ones responsible when something unacceptable happens."



    "We wish Mickey the best, but this is the choice we felt we had to make to be the organization we intend to be, and frankly, we felt lucky that we were able to get a great baseball mind like Tony Muser on such short notice."

    41Forever
    Jun 23 2019 05:15 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    This might be the beginning of the end for Mickey. You can't lose your temper with the media, and you can't have your players threatening reporters.

    Edgy MD
    Jun 23 2019 05:16 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    "Also, we're pleased as tits to announce that we've traded Jason Vargas for Matt Harvey."

    Lefty Specialist
    Jun 23 2019 05:21 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Lugo can go 50 pitches? Fine, but he needs to be sharp if he's going that long. He was obviously not sharp in the 7th, and when he gave up a hit starting the 8th after a long, long at-bat which featured foul after foul after foul, that was a signal that he wasn't on point. It happens; sometimes it's just not your day.



    But no. Mickey left him in, and what happened was almost inevitable. I've seen this movie too many times this year.



    Losing his temper in the clubhouse was just a capper.

    G-Fafif
    Jun 23 2019 05:52 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Bear reporters are also welcome on Pride Weekend.

    bmfc1
    Jun 23 2019 06:00 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jun 23 2019 06:29 PM

    All he had to say was "Lugo is our best reliever [which he said] and I believed that he would get by Baez. He was ahead 0 and 2 so just one more pitch and then I would have brought in Diaz. You can blame me for being one pitch too late but I believe in these guys so I don't think that I was."



    Double-switching in McNeil so that he was the 5th scheduled batter in 9th is egregious and shows that he hasn't learned on the job. As FK said, there was no reason to double-switch. Mickey should just have had him PH for Gomez.

    whippoorwill
    Jun 23 2019 06:26 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Edgy MD wrote:

    Not that it should matter, but neither should it go unacknowledged: deGrom burned by his bullpen (and his manager's bullpen deployment) again.


    I'd like to burn this bullpen

    bmfc1
    Jun 23 2019 06:30 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    What I wrote in Mickey's imaginary message would have been impossible because Diaz never warmed up!!! Incredible.

    batmagadanleadoff
    Jun 23 2019 06:48 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    All that's left to see, now, is whether Vargas loads up a squirt gun with bleach, tomorrow.

    kcmets
    Jun 23 2019 06:52 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    I heard on radio before the Mets apologized for the lashing out at the press and

    whatnot. Mickey's clock has to be ticking. Loudly.

    bmfc1
    Jun 23 2019 06:59 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    [TWEET]https://twitter.com/TimBritton/status/1142949594453729280[/TWEET]

    Edgy MD
    Jun 23 2019 07:46 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    "The Mets sincerely regret the incident that took place ..."


    A variation on the implied absolution of the passive voice in apologies.

    metirish
    Jun 23 2019 07:47 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    An amazing day really, reminds me of Omar , Tony and Adam

    nymr83
    Jun 23 2019 07:53 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Edgy MD wrote:

    Tim Healey just became my favorite bear reporter.


    I don't know if this was meant to read "beat reporter," but it works either way. Good work.



    While walking the dogs, it struck me that this may provide a perfectly reasonable pretext for management to let go of Callaway. "We respect Mickey and what he can bring to the game, but we can't have members of our staff mistreating members of the media like that. Those guys have a difficult enough job to do as it is. Our staff represents our organization to members of the press, and this reflects on everybody. The Cubs are the enemy, not the press pool. We've been down this road before, and if we don't set a standard throughout the organization, top to bottom, we're the ones responsible when something unacceptable happens."



    "We wish Mickey the best, but this is the choice we felt we had to make to be the organization we intend to be, and frankly, we felt lucky that we were able to get a great baseball mind like Tony Muser on such short notice."


    pinning his firing this would set a dangerous precedent. When Edgardo Alfonzo has the 2025 Mets sitting at 51-30 in first place at the halfway mark and insults a reporter is he toast?



    and frankly, Mickey shouldn't get fired. a few curse words deserve an apology not someone's job. Vargas threatening a fight is a much bigger issue imo.

    41Forever
    Jun 23 2019 08:03 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    I've been yelled at as a reporter. It's part of the job to have people vent at you, and you stand there and calmly take it and move on.



    The larger issue to me is setting the conditions to allow Vargas to do that. I don't think Vargas was pissed at the reporter. It was probably pent up anger at the crap happening again and again. I suspect he wasn't defending Mickey, but was livid because of Mickey.

    Edgy MD
    Jun 23 2019 08:05 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee


    Edgy MD wrote:

    Tim Healey just became my favorite bear reporter.


    I don't know if this was meant to read "beat reporter," but it works either way. Good work.



    While walking the dogs, it struck me that this may provide a perfectly reasonable pretext for management to let go of Callaway. "We respect Mickey and what he can bring to the game, but we can't have members of our staff mistreating members of the media like that. Those guys have a difficult enough job to do as it is. Our staff represents our organization to members of the press, and this reflects on everybody. The Cubs are the enemy, not the press pool. We've been down this road before, and if we don't set a standard throughout the organization, top to bottom, we're the ones responsible when something unacceptable happens."



    "We wish Mickey the best, but this is the choice we felt we had to make to be the organization we intend to be, and frankly, we felt lucky that we were able to get a great baseball mind like Tony Muser on such short notice."


    pinning his firing this would set a dangerous precedent. When Edgardo Alfonzo has the 2025 Mets sitting at 51-30 in first place at the halfway mark and insults a reporter is he toast?



    and frankly, Mickey shouldn't get fired. a few curse words deserve an apology not someone's job. Vargas threatening a fight is a much bigger issue imo.


    Well, it was more than a few curse words.



    Beyond that, in the end, of course, it wouldn't be this incident alone, so much as the bedshit it is all part of. But that's too much to put in a statement, so make it about policy and everyone moves on.



    Fucking up in public and looking to blame it on the nearest someone else is a natural human instinct. Adults take a few deep breaths and accept ownership of their own choices and the consequences.



    I tend to hate when public sentiment is gunning for a manager. It's almost always unfair. I applaud the out-of-the-box thinking that led to Mickey's hiring, but I've found so much of what he's done as counterproductive. And even when he gets a choice right , he often lets weeks go by as he cycles through bad choices first.



    It's sort of like one of them damn curly-haired basketball coaches who arrive at a new organization with a system. Through one failure after another, he'll insist that "the system" is sound, but he doesn't have the right players for it, and the ones who are right refuse to get with the program. Years are lost an careers fade as all the possible juice that can be squeezed from that argument drip out.



    He's young, he's in shape, he's energetic, but he's as aggressively stubborn as the worst old coot of a manager.

    Fman99
    Jun 23 2019 08:16 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Yuck, as usual, Mets making headlines for all the wrong reasons. Instead of the story being Piss Missile Pete's demolishing of Straw's team record, this turns into who's calling who a motherfucker. I'm all done with Mickey. He went out to the mound. He was so close to giving him the hook. And didn't. And it blew up in his dumb overwhelmed face.

    Johnny Lunchbucket
    Jun 23 2019 10:43 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    My first thought is, this is how one acts when it's cool with them to hang out with the Trump clan during spring training.



    But I mean what else do you need

    Edgy MD
    Jun 24 2019 05:52 AM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    That was pretty much my wife's first thought also.

    Lefty Specialist
    Jun 24 2019 06:02 AM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    I think my wife's hatred of Mickey stems from that day.....she despises him and was yelling at the screen the entire 8th inning.

    41Forever
    Jun 24 2019 06:23 AM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jun 24 2019 07:31 AM

    The discussion on ESPN radio today was that Mickey probably had no choice on Diaz, and that the GM and analytic guys say no more than four outs and he could say none of that to the media. They weren't excusing his behavior, saying he gets paid to stand there and take the bullets. They also said he should be able to walk to the mound, tap his right or left arm and have a reasonable expectation that whoever walked through the gate would be somewhat competent, and Lugo has been the only one who fits that description.



    Again, not excusing, just understanding how and why it happens.

    Johnny Lunchbucket
    Jun 24 2019 06:33 AM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    More likely (in my mind) the Mets are trying to hide some physical ailment with Diaz they don't wanna talk about

    metirish
    Jun 24 2019 07:06 AM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    =41Forever post_id=13967 time=1561379017 user_id=69]
    The discussion on ESPN radio today was that Mickey probably had no choice on Diaz, and that the GM and analytic guys say no more than four outs and he could say none of that to the media. They weren't excusing his behavior, saying he gets paid to stand there and take the bullets. They also said he should be able to walk to the mound, tap his right or left arm and have a reasonable expectation that whoever walked through the game would be somewhat competent, and Lugo has been the only one who fits that description.



    Again, not excusing, just understanding how and why it happens.





    basically the same take on the Fan this morning , they were opining that maybe five managers that get to make out their own lineup without interference from the FO



    Bochy

    Roberts( maybe)

    Madden

    4

    5

    41Forever
    Jun 24 2019 07:34 AM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    From MetsBlog:



    "Mets COO Jeff Wilpon also called Healey to apoligize for the actions of Callaway and Vargas."

    Edgy MD
    Jun 24 2019 07:49 AM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    So, we have an official statement released by the organization, and a personal call from Wilpon.



    Have Callaway or Vargas apologized yet?

    Johnny Lunchbucket
    Jun 24 2019 07:57 AM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Not for nothing but the idea that Mickey is under control from some analytics overlord is a laugh. Nobody can even name who that'd be.



    Mickey is under influence from Brodie, who's taking orders from Omar, who's taking orders from Fred is more like it, though I doubt Fred is that closely aligned with the in-game. That's why I think it's more of a Fred/Omar/Brodie-to-Mickey message: Let's not let it get out that Diaz has a dead arm/forthcoming PED suspension/shoulder issue requiring extra rest.

    Edgy MD
    Jun 24 2019 08:14 AM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    The Vargas situation is as old as organizational psychology itself. Guy whose job security is most tenuous attempts to demonstrate his value by acting as the manager's heavy. I'd call it the Shelly Duncan Rule, but it flourishes most obviously in the NHL.

    A Boy Named Seo
    Jun 24 2019 12:21 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    Mickey did get the same question over and over from the beat guys, but I think part of it is the infuriating way he was "answering" the questions. Seriously, Mickey, what is the goddamn difference between 4 outs and 5? 4 outs and 24 outs, yeah, but the difference between 4 and 5 could be one pitch. Maybe yall are right and Diaz is hurting.

    ashie62
    Jun 24 2019 12:34 PM
    Re: IGT 06/23 - Metsies at Cubbies - Sunday Matinee

    I don't get it. Are in game decisions done from above? So Mickey is a provider of information and babysitter.



    I've had enuff of Syndershite also fwiw. He can be the first guy they sell in July