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Look at me, I can be ...

Frayed Knot Nov 13 2019 11:10 AM

It's no secret that the mets would like to upgrade, particularly defensively, at CF. So here The Puma speculates on potential targets for next year. Acknowledging that the FA market really doesn't have 'that type' of player, what's left is mostly trade options. - the long shot is Mookie Betts. Obviously great, but a heavy price tag and has already declared his intention to test the FA market after 2020 so that's $20-some million PLUS multiple players/prospects for one year of service More realistically on the list could include Pittsburgh's Starling Marte, SF's Kevin Pillar, or Manuel Margot w/the Padres Marte, 31, 845 OPS in 2019, $11.5 in '20, option for $12mil in '21 (wasn't he also a steroid cheat?) Pillar: possibly a non-tender candidate by the Gigantes, notched a 719 OPS last season (right about his career norm) and has been a stunningly good defensive player (mostly for Toronto). Turns 31 just after New Year's so it's possible that his defense might be a bit past its prime going forward. Margot: A first time arb eligible in 2020, the just-turned 25 y/o Dominican was a well regarded prospect [top 25 type of ratings in pre-2017] w/Boston before being part of the package dealt for Craig Kimbrel. Hasn't really lived up to his supposed potential so far [.248/.301/.387 across three season/1,400 ML ABs] Also mentioned are Boston's Jackie Bradley Jr., a terrific outfielder who might be a trade target although swings lefty where the Mets would prefer a righty and his hitting regressed after his breakout 2016 season [2017-19 = .234/.318/.409]; and Japanese FA Shogo Akiyama another lefty who turns 32 y/o in April and had some good numbers for 2015-19 w/Seibu

Edgy MD Nov 13 2019 11:17 AM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

The current personnel suggests (to my reading) that Brandon Nimmo is currently the opening-day centerfielder. Do you think they want someone to displace him or another defensive caddy, a la Lagares?

whippoorwill Nov 13 2019 11:29 AM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

He'd better work on cutting down on his Ks

Lefty Specialist Nov 13 2019 12:00 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

I don't like CF's on the wrong side of 30.

Frayed Knot Nov 13 2019 12:24 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Edgy MD wrote: The current personnel suggests (to my reading) that Brandon Nimmo is currently the opening-day centerfielder. Do you think they want someone to displace him or another defensive caddy, a la Lagares? Ideally I think they'd prefer Nimmo in a corner slot while bringing in an everyday CF w/a glove who also hits from the right side, or at worst a glove-first guy who plays vs LHPs. That, of course, brings up the question of how that affects Conforto, JD Davis, Dom, the Squirrel, and/or (dare we even say his name?) Cespedes. Brodie, btw, has apparently ruled out the idea of Rosario as a CF - which, given that the early season defensive disaster seemed more and more like the outlier rather than a sign of things to come as the season went on, strikes me as the right move.

smg58 Nov 13 2019 12:31 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Nimmo had an OPS of .995 after returning. He's playing somewhere. The question is whether you are confident enough in Smith and/or Davis to trade Conforto for a centerfielder plus something, whether you think Smith or Davis can get you the centerfielder you need, or whether you think the offense you have is worth the defensive risk. Betts isn't really a centerfielder. I'm not sure our farm system is where it needs to be to make Betts an option for 2020 anyway. The fielding bible has Marte at -9 runs saved in center on the year. Nimmo was a -2 in about a quarter of the innings. And Marte has less offensive upside going forward. Basically he's what we've already got, only less. Pillar used to be an elite defensive centerfielder, but he's been average the last two seasons. Bradley is not as good defensively (past or present) as Pillar. Margot can field the position (+6 runs saved in 900 innings), and might be had cheaply, but he's basically Lagares from a few years ago with a slightly worse glove but a slightly better bat. If you think the offense you have is worth the defensive risk, he might be a useful add for support. One guy that wasn't mentioned was Harrison Bader. He had an overly high BABIP in 2018, and a criminally low BABIP this past season. An intermediate BABIP would put him in the same offensive category as Pillar or Bradley, and better than Margot, while being the superior fielder presently to all three (+13 runs saved in 900 innings last year). The Cardinals played Dexter Fowler ahead of him against righties in the playoffs, which tells me they are undervaluing him. That's where I'd kick the tires first.

Edgy MD Nov 13 2019 12:38 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

So, oddly enough, if Juan Lagares had spent the last five yeras with some other team, they might well be interested in him. Bader is an interesting option. But I'm not sure the Cards are done with him. He'd certainly be another low-average/high strikeout/occasional power type on offense. I think he'd get his shirt torn off once or twice, but every day in between, he'd drive me crazy.

Frayed Knot Nov 13 2019 12:58 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

I'm still wary of trusting defensive metrics, especially ones that tell me that Pillar is merely average and Bradley not even that good. While I acknowledge that Pillar may be somewhat past his prime, those 'ratings', to me anyway, don't come close to jiving with the eyeball test. The upside to Margot is if you think that his offensive potential is lurking somewhere beneath the surface all ready to appear. He was maybe a bit rushed (a full-timer for SD at age 22 after being 'the big bait' in a trade) so he could be at the right age/experience for a bust-out even though even his minor league numbers were never really that great in the first place [772 OPS vs 695 in ML]. iow, he might be Lagares of five years ago only hopefully without the constant injury interruptions short-circuiting whatever offensive growth you were hoping to get from him.

Centerfield Nov 13 2019 01:15 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

It's hard to believe that the Mets will utilize whatever resources they have to a problem as minor as centerfield defense. I don't mean to downplay its importance, but if the Wilpons continue to run on a limited budget, there are far more compelling needs. Starting pitching. Several bullpen arms. And the catching situation. Brandon Nimmo may not be great in CF, but I don't see the value in signing a CF that puts Davis/Cespedes on the bench, while we go with Walker Lockett in place of Wheeler.

Johnny Lunchbucket Nov 13 2019 02:03 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

[TWEET]https://twitter.com/DPLennon/status/1194718455691300864[/TWEET] By "ramped up" they mean, "added someone other than Jeff's brother."

Edgy MD Nov 13 2019 02:52 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

=Centerfield post_id=26477 time=1573676131 user_id=65] It's hard to believe that the Mets will utilize whatever resources they have to a problem as minor as centerfield defense. I don't mean to downplay its importance, but if the Wilpons continue to run on a limited budget, there are far more compelling needs.

I'm not sure how minor it is. If they're going to improve on the non-pitching side, centerfield and catcher seem to be the most obvious targets. Obviously there's room to improve at second, but I don't think Canó is going anywhere.



Really, it's at least about replacing and/or improving upon Lagares. With Céspedes as the opening day leftfielder on paper, they're going to need a good fourth outfielder. And with Smitty and Davis currently occupying those spots, I mean to refer to a defensively good fourth outfielder.



Really, getting good, strong backups in center and catcher would go a long way. And the Mets don't particularly have any outfielders in the high minors who look like they're on the cusp of contributing.

Edgy MD Nov 13 2019 03:00 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Shogo, by the way, is no joko. He has an Ichiro swing, keeping the bat head back and following the ball to left with his head, but while he doesn't make contact as much as Ichiro, a .301 career batting average is no small satsumaimo, and his walk rate and power really amplify that. Actually, he kind of has a McNeilian profile as a hitter. Big downside is that his season ended with a broken toe, and that came on October 31. And, you know, figuring out whose game is going to translate across the Pacific is always going to take some guessing. [fimg=500]https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/TNbL1uOL_smx0Iy7f5OKv7FQtpM=/77x489:4494x2996/1200x800/filters:focal(1882x434:2600x1152)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/65553598/1060960534.jpg.0.jpg[/fimg]

Frayed Knot Nov 13 2019 03:14 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Lefty Specialist wrote: I don't like CF's on the wrong side of 30. I agree that you don't want to go too overboard with this thing, but the ones mentioned above could all likely be acquired on a short-term basis so you wouldn't run the risk that they'd begin rusting out there like the tin-man whenever it starts sprinkling during a game. With Marte (31) they'd be on the hook for just one year plus an option. Pillar (not yet 31) would either be a trade w/a one-year commitment or, if non-tendered, a FA with a length to be determined. Bradley (30 early next season) would be a one year commitment only. And Margot is just 25 The wild card would be the (32 y/o) Japanese player so his age adds to the overall unknown quantity there.

Johnny Lunchbucket Nov 13 2019 03:17 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Shogo's prosthetic right lower leg could come in handy too. Mets used to be the biggest Japanese importers since your local Honda dealer but haven't had an Asian guy since ... Dice-K?

LWFS Nov 13 2019 05:00 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Yep. Hell, even taking into account our KazMatses and such, the Mets seemed to have at least as high a hit rate among Japanese FAs as with domestic editions... though Shinjo was the only half-decent position player we ever had, IIRC.

Centerfield Nov 13 2019 05:28 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Lefty Specialist wrote: I don't like CF's on the wrong side of 30. Yeah, well fuck you too.

MFS62 Nov 13 2019 07:22 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Lefty Specialist wrote: I don't like CF's on the wrong side of 30. Yeah, well fuck you too. Still laughing out loud. Well played. Later

smg58 Nov 14 2019 01:19 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

=LWFS post_id=26491 time=1573689613 user_id=84] Yep. Hell, even taking into account our KazMatses and such, the Mets seemed to have at least as high a hit rate among Japanese FAs as with domestic editions... though Shinjo was the only half-decent position player we ever had, IIRC.

I'd argue that Kaz was a half-decent player who was burdened with All-Star expectations.

Edgy MD Nov 14 2019 01:25 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Masato Yoshii was pretty decent. Katashi Kashiwada was almost kind of decent. Dae-Sun Koo was an American hero. He should have been granted automatic citizenship.

Benjamin Grimm Nov 14 2019 02:25 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

I have no memory at all of anyone named Katashi Kashiwada.

Johnny Lunchbucket Nov 14 2019 02:34 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Kashiwada was the first Met from Japan, I believe. 1997? Takashi not Katashi That was one cool Valentine thing. 3 Japanese vets on short-term deals were as good as 3 years of David Weathers.

LWFS Nov 14 2019 04:16 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Koo was Koo-rean. We were lousy with junkballing Takahashis (Hisanori 4 Eva!) and rocket Ryotas right after CitiField opened. A regular Valentinaissance.

Edgy MD Nov 14 2019 09:00 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: Takashi not Katashi Dyslexia has gotten me and it will get all of you too! And yeah, I know Koo is Korean, of course. I just thought the floor was open to any Asian ex-pats who prospered at any level in a Mets uniform. Probably the same scouting bureau, anyhow.

HahnSolo Nov 15 2019 07:54 AM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Who was the guy hailed as "the Japanese Greg Maddux" when the Mets signed him? After a month, Bill Madden said, "instead they got the Japanese Mike Maddux"

Edgy MD Nov 15 2019 08:10 AM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

I believe you're referring to Satoru Komiyama, who rolled out of bed and ran to the police station.

Benjamin Grimm Nov 15 2019 08:13 AM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

I know that the title of this thread references the John Fogerty Centerfield song, but whenever I see the title, the tune that pops into my head is this one: [YOUTUBE]Uz5D-D7VYmY[/YOUTUBE] And wow, look at Frenchie there!

Johnny Lunchbucket Nov 15 2019 08:52 AM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

They are running together for me. I can remember Ryota Igarashi was a real disappointment given he came with the best bonafides while guys like Ken Takahashi who came with little fanfare was actually pretty reliable for a while

Frayed Knot Nov 15 2019 12:51 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Who was the guy hailed as "the Japanese Greg Maddux" when the Mets signed him? After a month, Bill Madden said, "instead they got the Japanese Mike Maddux" Seeing as how Madden's writing, then and now, basically involves taking dictation from MFY front office and/or pr types, which Yanqui, do you suppose, fed him that line?

LWFS Nov 15 2019 05:53 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: They are running together for me. I can remember Ryota Igarashi was a real disappointment given he came with the best bonafides while guys like Ken Takahashi who came with little fanfare was actually pretty reliable for a while Between junky Ken and junkier Hisanori (as our fifth starter/long man/erstwhile closer... basically, crafty lefty Lugo before Lugo was Lugo), we're 2-for-2 on Takahashis, really. Back to the thread topic, though... the Pirates have their own Alonso-lite blocking first base, so if we offer Dom Smith for Manny Margot, who blinks?

Johnny Lunchbucket Dec 03 2019 10:57 AM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Giants nontender Kevin Pillar. This guy makes too many outs but is a competent fielder with good hustle powers (he's a white CF, see) with 20-homer power. As a Lagares replacement he'd make some sense and could be a regular if plans A B C and D don't materialize.

whippoorwill Dec 03 2019 01:37 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Ever time I see this I think of Sandy Duncan in Peter Pan

Centerfield Dec 03 2019 01:46 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: Giants nontender Kevin Pillar. This guy makes too many outs but is a competent fielder with good hustle powers (he's a white CF, see) with 20-homer power. As a Lagares replacement he'd make some sense and could be a regular if plans A B C and D don't materialize. I can get behind this. How bad is Nimmo's defense in CF? Getting a full-time CF would be nice, but I wouldn't want to take Conforto or Nimmo out of the lineup. And the only place we can really play Davis is LF. Same with Ces if he comes back. I'd be cool with Pillar as a spot starter/defensive replacement. Use whatever resources we have for the rotation and pen.

smg58 Dec 03 2019 07:35 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

I'd go a year and 4 or 5 million for Pillar. He's at least decent at the plate, and even if he's closer to average than elite in center these days he's still pretty good out there. I wouldn't go nuts for him though.

Edgy MD Dec 03 2019 10:20 PM Re: Look at me, I can be ...

Figuring out a way to improve the defense while doing the least amount of damage to the offense is the challenge of the offseason for the Mets. With an expected left-to-right of Céspedes-Nimmo-Conforto, you've got no easy answers. It's unrealistic to expect Céspedes to come back with any more mobility than late-stage Moisés Alou. And even on the days he might sit, Nimmo is your centerfielder. And even if Yoenis doesn't return in a timely manner, J.D. Davis and Dom Smith are your options. Both have healthy legs and are capable of playing an average left field. But that's sort of an aspirational average. So you have three choices, at least on the face of it: [list=1] [*]Resign Lagares or sign someone like him to bump Nimmo over to a corner to replace Céspedes for late inning defense, or on what I expect will be Céspedes' frequent days off. [*]Move Nimmo or Conforto (I presume Céspedes is unmoveable) and try to replace the one they deal off with a strong defensive centerfielder who also hits enough to start. [*]Send Nimmo off to train and train and train with the best outfield coach out there, and hope for the best. [/list] Obviously, none of those are ideal, and it's going to take a lot more ingenuity than finding a replacement for Wheeler (possibly Wheeler) or upgrading in the pen.