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1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

batmagadanleadoff Jul 17 2020 11:46 AM

ESPN Announces Multi-Part 30 for 30 on '86 Mets ESPN Films announced an upcoming multi-part 30 for 30 documentary on the legendary 1986 Mets team. Highlighting their iconic season, which featured a franchise record 108-54 record and one of the greatest World Series comebacks, the series will be executive produced by Jimmy Kimmel, Sal “Cousin Sal” Iacono, ITV's Jordana Hochman, Kimmelot's Scott Lonker and MLB's Nick Trotta. Nick Davis, who was the writer and director of the PBS documentary “Ted Williams: ‘The Greatest Hitter Who Ever Lived,'” will direct the multi-part series on the team. The series will show moments on and off of the field. https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/07/09/espn-multi-part-30-for-30-documentary-1986-new-york-mets __________________________________________ The project, which will air never before seen behind-the-scenes footage of the team, will be executive produced by Jimmy Kimmel, Sal “Cousin Sal” Iacono, Kimmelot's Scott Lonker, ITV's Jordana Hochman and MLB's Nick Trotta. Nick Davis, who directed “Ted Williams: ‘The Greatest Hitter Who Ever Lived'," will direct the project. https://www.newsday.com/sports/baseball/mets/1986-mets-espn-30-for-30-1.46559037 __________________________________

G-Fafif Jul 17 2020 01:08 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Don't know what the editing will yield, but I recorded an interview for this project pre-quarantine. The film is in good hands with Nick Davis.

Benjamin Grimm Jul 17 2020 01:15 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I guess they'll have to Photoshop a mask on your face.

G-Fafif Jul 17 2020 03:29 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Benjamin Grimm wrote: I guess they'll have to Photoshop a mask on your face. Which will make it hard to tell me and Ed Hearn apart.

Ceetar Jul 17 2020 03:58 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

=G-Fafif post_id=40736 time=1595012918 user_id=55] Don't know what the editing will yield, but I recorded an interview for this project pre-quarantine. The film is in good hands with Nick Davis.

I was just about to say I'm not gonna bother and you're going to redeem it for me now..





I'm just tired of the '86 Mets. I know there are claims of unedited footage for this, but it feels like the more we find out, the worse these guys become.

whippoorwill Jul 17 2020 07:22 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I hope it's all about Sid But conversely, I hope Sid avoids it like the plague

Benjamin Grimm Jul 17 2020 08:02 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Wait... There's a plague?

LWFS Jul 17 2020 10:24 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Wait... There's a plague? Actually, there is! What more '86 stuff do we NEED to hear, really? Like Ceetar said, the more you hear about these guys, the worse it gets... and not in any more edifying, interesting ways. Was Sisk running a dogfight?

bmfc1 Jul 18 2020 11:27 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Would you rather there be another documentary genuflectating at the alter of Michael Jordan? Jeter? There might not be anything new to you but it puts the Mets in the spotlight for a few evenings and it will also be new to another generation. I can't wait for Pete Alonso to tweet about the show and tell us how much he wishes he was on that team even though Keith would have forced him to play another position. Plus, you get to see and hear G-Fafif and that's always noteworthy.

G-Fafif Jul 12 2021 06:33 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Airing September 14 and 15. [tweet] https://twitter.com/metsciti/status/1414740329065074689[/tweet] The guy in the commercial who says the ‘86 Mets were larger than life and ticks off the names of their largest is me.

Benjamin Grimm Jul 12 2021 06:40 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I can't believe you didn't mention Randy Niemann.

G-Fafif Jul 12 2021 06:49 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Shoddy editing, obviously.

Fman99 Jul 13 2021 04:27 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I'm watching the hell out of that.

Frayed Knot Jul 13 2021 05:03 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

So it's an ESPN project without the actual content being created by ESPN? Sounds like a win-win to me.

G-Fafif Aug 24 2021 01:33 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

New trailer. Mine is the head talking about players and managers coming and going. [youtube]dD5wkpJ7Kbg[/youtube]

MFS62 Aug 24 2021 01:54 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

The second night is September 15th, when many Mets fans will be celebrating Yom Kippur and can't/ won't watch TV. Words can't describe my anger. Later

kcmets Aug 24 2021 01:57 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Is DVR'ng against your religion?

MFS62 Aug 24 2021 02:11 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Is DVR'ng against your religion? Depends on how strictly you interpret doing "no work". I have no problem with it, but I'm sure there are more orthodox scholars would would say it is prohibited. But I think the timing was inconsiderate. ESPN is in Connecticut, not North Dakota. And at least some members of their on-air and production teams are Jewish, ex-New Yorkers and Mets fans*, so I'm surprised they haven't said anything to their management about this. Later * = Linda Cohen and I attended the same High Holiday service a few years ago.

kcmets Aug 24 2021 02:14 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Just busting your plums.

bmfc1 Aug 24 2021 02:16 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 24 2021 03:00 PM

Some symmetry to 1986 as Game 5 of the NLCS was scheduled for noon on Yom Kippur. I had tickets and prayed for a rainout so I could go the next day, which is what happened.

MFS62 Aug 24 2021 02:28 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

The telecast isn't going to be delayed unless something happens to ESPN Headquarters in Bristol. Hmmm. I wonder where I put my Space Laser. Later

Johnny Lunchbucket Aug 24 2021 02:49 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

There are screenings scheduled in Central Park at at Citifield on non holidays... we're going Sept 3 or 5 or something at Citifield

Frayed Knot Aug 24 2021 04:24 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

1) The recording for shows playing on the 14th and the 15th can be set back on the 13th 2) each episode will be played again (and again and again) at various times and on various ESPN outlets and/or streaming services probably as soon as the following day 3) other showings available also (see JCL's post) even prior to the home premier 4) there are all kinds of conflicts in life and folks decide what is more important to them on a regular basis. This will be one of them.

kcmets Aug 24 2021 05:02 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Frayed Knot wrote: 1) The recording for shows playing on the 14th and the 15th can be set back on the 13th 1a) If the 13th doesn't work out, one could get a goy neighbor to come over and labor over the DVR'ng lol... (done plum busting)

MFS62 Aug 24 2021 05:18 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I hope so.

kcmets Aug 24 2021 05:25 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Sending me angry PM's doesn't help matters. If you find me joking about a goy neighbor setting a DVR offensive you have issues that have nothing to do with me. Did you PM Frayed too, or just single me out? Get a grip.

MFS62 Aug 24 2021 05:55 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

He was trying to be helpful. What you did was make a wisecrack and then think it wouldn't be as bad when you said you were just kidding. Twice, even when I answered the first comment honestly. I know you thought it was funny, but it wasn't. Later

kcmets Aug 24 2021 06:01 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I disagree, and think you're being unreasonably over-sensitive. A lot.

Frayed Knot Aug 24 2021 07:11 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

=MFS62 post_id=75371 time=1629849324 user_id=60] He was trying to be helpful.

Actually I was mostly trying to opine why I think your self-described 'words fail you' anger is wildly overblown - and that's even assuming that your 'unless something happens in

Bristol' comment was in jest.



ESPN -- and every other TV station for that matter -- isn't going to simply go dark because a certain percentage within a small minority choose not to watch TV that day. They're going to

show something that somebody is going to want to watch just as they do every other day.



Sports telecasts exist on Christmas (NFL & NBA) just like the Masters final often synchs up with Easter Sunday; soccer, NFL, Wimbeldon and others broadcast on Sunday mornings when

folks are at church; MLB plays on YK and/or Rosha-howeveryouspellit most years while various athletes and fans make adjustments for Ramadan and probably a bunch of other holidays

and observances that you and I maybe haven't heard of. And when that stuff conflicts with something in the outside world, as they do all the time, then those viewers (or players: S. Koufax)

are going to need to choose how they want to handle it.

MFS62 Aug 24 2021 07:15 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Frayed Knot wrote: And when that stuff conflicts with something in the outside world, as they do all the time, then those viewers (or players: S. Koufax) are going to need to choose how they want to handle it. I agree. I was just venting. But, did you think my Space Lasers comment was serious? Later

kcmets Aug 24 2021 07:24 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

=MFS62 post_id=75395 time=1629854121 user_id=60]I was just venting.

This keeps getting better.

Frayed Knot Aug 24 2021 07:39 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

=MFS62 post_id=75395 time=1629854121 user_id=60] I agree. I was just venting. But, did you think my Space Lasers comment was serious?

No, in fact I specifically said that I assumed that one was in jest.

But that still leaves the 'words can't express my anger' comment which is, IMO, absurdly over the top when this timing presents nothing more than a choice that various people for various

reasons make all the time when a TV sked conflicts with real life, and particularly so in today's world where there are so many different ways to view something. This is not like the old days

where if your family wanted to see the WIZARD OF OZ you had a single two-hour slot per year to do so or hope that the timing worked out better for you 12 months hence.

bmfc1 Aug 24 2021 08:08 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

=G-Fafif post_id=75339 time=1629833639 user_id=55] New trailer. Mine is the head talking about players and managers coming and going. [youtube]dD5wkpJ7Kbg[/youtube]

This thread lost the lede stories:

There will be a two-night documentary on ESPN celebrating the '86 Mets.

G-Fafif is in this documentary.



You can decide which is more exciting.

kcmets Aug 24 2021 08:26 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

We all know that and are excited. Someone had to temporarily hijack things with a drama moment.

kcmets Aug 25 2021 08:15 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

And, as if on cue, here we go... Tonight in Central Park.

Bob Alpacadaca Aug 25 2021 08:28 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

=bmfc1 post_id=75404 time=1629857307 user_id=73] =G-Fafif post_id=75339 time=1629833639 user_id=55] New trailer. Mine is the head talking about players and managers coming and going. [youtube]dD5wkpJ7Kbg[/youtube]

This thread lost the lede stories:

There will be a two-night documentary on ESPN celebrating the '86 Mets.

G-Fafif is in this documentary.



You can decide which is more exciting.


It's unfortunate ESPN is using the image of the attention-seeker who interrupted the game with a dangerous stunt to illustrate the episode rather than an image of a player or actual fans.

Edgy MD Aug 25 2021 12:29 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

The parachutist himself is/was an actor/director/producer/singer/musician, so I wouldn't be surprised if he has a side hustle keeping his jump part of the story.

stevejrogers Aug 26 2021 05:08 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Bob Alpacadaca wrote: =bmfc1 post_id=75404 time=1629857307 user_id=73] =G-Fafif post_id=75339 time=1629833639 user_id=55] New trailer. Mine is the head talking about players and managers coming and going. [youtube]dD5wkpJ7Kbg[/youtube] This thread lost the lede stories: There will be a two-night documentary on ESPN celebrating the '86 Mets. G-Fafif is in this documentary. You can decide which is more exciting.

It's unfortunate ESPN is using the image of the attention-seeker who interrupted the game with a dangerous stunt to illustrate the episode rather than an image of a player or actual fans.


To be fair, how many times for promotional purposes do you see the clips of those two, unknowingly brave (pun not intended), fans congratulating Henry Aaron as he's rounding third after hitting #715.



Doesn't make it right either, I do agree with your point, but if it turned out to be harmless, does seem that visual mediums don't mind glorifying stunts like it.

G-Fafif Sep 10 2021 04:20 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Sep 10 2021 04:36 PM

Tasty appetizer to Once Upon a Time in Queens Tuesday night at 7 PM ET. (This doc is on ESPN 2; OUATIQ is on ESPN.) ESPN's E60 on Former Iran Hostage Barry Rosen and Baseball's Gift That Continues to Give Going to New York Mets Games After Release Helped Rebuild Family Bond Forty years ago, Barry Rosen was one of 52 people from the U.S. Embassy in Iran who were released after being held captive for 444 days. The release came minutes after Ronald Reagan was sworn in as President on January 20, 1981. On Tuesday night, Sept. 14, ESPN's E60 will tell the story of Rosen, who came home to a country that called him a hero, but to a family that no longer knew him. It was only after Major League Baseball gave the hostages the gift of a lifetime pass that Rosen was able to reconnect with his children at New York Mets games. Against the backdrop of Shea Stadium, and the rise of the Mets of Gooden, Strawberry, Hernandez and Carter, the family rebuilt its relationship, and it is still going strong today. “Ticket Home,” a new E60 reported by Jeremy Schaap, debuts Tuesday at 7 p.m. ET on ESPN2 and ESPN+. The program will lead into that night's airing of the new ESPN 30 for 30 film “Once Upon a Time in Queens” about the 1986 New York Mets. Former Met's player Mookie Wilson is among the people interviewed in the documentary. Others include Bud Selig, who was owner of the Milwaukee Brewers at the time and recommended to MLB Commissioner Bowie Kuhn that the hostages receive an award; former ABC News correspondent Sam Donaldson, who covered the Iran hostage crisis; and sportscasters Al Michaels and Bob Costas. “The center of the piece is the idea of family and how important family is, and for Barry I feel like that's what got him through the Iran crisis,” said Simon Baumgart, producer of the documentary for E60. “The thought of not coming home to his two very young children and his wife was something he grappled with throughout his experience, and the gift that baseball gave him really did bring that family together. “And there is the sense of history. I don't think a lot of younger people know about the Iran hostage crisis and how it impacts the world today and the sacrifices those hostages made. I think baseball realized that and rewarded them and the Rosens benefited greatly from that gift.” [tweet]https://twitter.com/e60/status/1435969177949380609[/tweet] BTW, based on Citi Field screening of first half last week, Once Upon a Time in Queens will win its division going away.

Johnny Lunchbucket Sep 10 2021 04:30 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Yeah it was good, and more Prince than Paisley Park. I'da liked to hear a little more from Orosco and Danny Heep than we got, which wasn't anything

G-Fafif Sep 10 2021 04:37 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: Yeah it was good, and more Prince than Paisley Park. Forgot to wear my raspberry beret.

G-Fafif Sep 15 2021 08:47 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

This series serves an antidote to the series just completed.

A Boy Named Seo Sep 16 2021 11:06 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Wait... There's a plague? Actually, there is! What more '86 stuff do we NEED to hear, really? Like Ceetar said, the more you hear about these guys, the worse it gets... and not in any more edifying, interesting ways. Was Sisk running a dogfight? I polished off eps 3 and 4 last night, and maybe there wasn't a lot of new info necessarily (what new info could there really be?), but the perspective of some of the guys now was pretty cool (kinda like Untold: Malice in the Palace, where hearing from Jermaine O'Neil and Stephen Jackson really landed well). Darryl seemed pretty introspective, and he and Doc seemed to understand a lot of the reasons they did the things they did. Better or worse, you can tell they've both sat through a lot of therapy. If anything, Dykstra was the guy you wanted more soundbites out of just because he says outrageous Dykstra shit, and did Mitchell become kind of endearing? Also, the soundtrack to this thing was a banger and I want it on blue and orange colored vinyl. As the current Mets shat the place up this week, I loved hiding in this thing instead.

Edgy MD Sep 16 2021 04:54 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I've just started, and they got me hook, line, and sinker when they played "Clap Hands" over the opening credits. Hardly the tone of victory, but I was playing the hell out of that record as the Mets juggernaut tore through the summer.

bmfc1 Sep 16 2021 07:18 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

The shot of Mookie leaving the field after you know had never been seen before and was incredible.

kcmets Sep 16 2021 07:37 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

My DVR'n didn't work out so well. If anyone sees a re-broadcast of these I'd appreciate it if they could share times and dates.

Frayed Knot Sep 16 2021 07:47 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

How 'bout ... like now!!!! (or almost now) ESPN 2, running all four consecutively starting at 11P. If you miss that it'll be on Saturday morning then again on Wednesday.

kcmets Sep 16 2021 07:54 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Perfect. Done. Thank you!

Edgy MD Sep 16 2021 08:26 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Just finished Chapter One. Does Tim McCarver ever appear in this? Does Vin Scully?

Johnny Lunchbucket Sep 16 2021 09:37 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Watched ep 3 tonight. That was the best of em so far, and the soundtrack gets even better. I mean, really well done

nymr83 Sep 16 2021 10:40 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

=kcmets post_id=75366 time=1629847544 user_id=53] Sending me angry PM's doesn't help matters. If you find me joking about a goy neighbor setting a DVR offensive you have issues that have nothing to do with me. Did you PM Frayed too, or just single me out? Get a grip.

What's the offense? I just stop by the goy neighbor's house so i can watch live. bring beer though. carrying beer is permitted within the erev - otherwise you may need to throw it from your house to his.

Edgy MD Sep 17 2021 02:26 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

At one point in the opening eppysode, a shot was included of a early Darryl Strawberry home run at Three Rivers Stadium (I think — it might have been an early Keith Hernandez double). As the Pirates center fielder turned hoping to play the ball off of the fence, Edgewife asks, “Wow, could his pants be any tighter?” Of course it was Lee Mazzilli.

batmagadanleadoff Sep 18 2021 10:13 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I could relate to one of the narrators questioning Frank Cashen's honesty about the Mets supposedly screwing up by leaving Tom Seaver unprotected after the '83 season - exposed to then being claimed by the White Sox. The implication was that the Mets didnt screw up but made an intentional decision to expose Seaver because the team believed it had more useful players to protect than a past his prime Seaver. The suggestion was that Cashen was engaging in calculated PR to assuage the portion of the fan base that the Mets expected to be disappointed by the loss of Seaver. I could relate to this because that's exactly what I believed was happening when Cashen issued his mea culpa on behalf of the Mets. And I wasn't bothered in the least by the Mets losing Seaver. I figured he'd get worse every season and was there mostly for sentimental reasons and as a fan attraction.

G-Fafif Sep 18 2021 11:05 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Edgy MD wrote: Does Tim McCarver ever appear in this? McCarver was scheduled. The pandemic derailed his interview, among others.

Edgy MD Sep 18 2021 12:22 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

=batmagadanleadoff post_id=78142 time=1631981628 user_id=68] I could relate to one of the narrators questioning Frank Cashen's honesty about the Mets supposedly screwing up by leaving Tom Seaver unprotected after the '83 season - exposed to then being claimed by the White Sox. The implication was that the Mets didnt screw up but made an intentional decision to expose Seaver because the team believed it had more useful players to protect than a past his prime Seaver. The suggestion was that Cashen was engaging in calculated PR to assuage the portion of the fan base that the Mets expected to be disappointed by the loss of Seaver. I could relate to this because that's exactly what I believed was happening when Cashen issued his mea culpa on behalf of the Mets. And I wasn't bothered in the least by the Mets losing Seaver. I figured he'd get worse every season and was there mostly for sentimental reasons and as a fan attraction.

Greg's done a review of this premise by revisiting every player the Mets ended up protecting, and it certainly seemed to make the position hard to sustain. As does trying to reimagine the 1984 and 1985 Mets record with Tom Seaver's numbers from those seasons added in.

batmagadanleadoff Sep 18 2021 12:47 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Edgy MD wrote: I could relate to one of the narrators questioning Frank Cashen's honesty about the Mets supposedly screwing up by leaving Tom Seaver unprotected after the '83 season - exposed to then being claimed by the White Sox. The implication was that the Mets didnt screw up but made an intentional decision to expose Seaver because the team believed it had more useful players to protect than a past his prime Seaver. The suggestion was that Cashen was engaging in calculated PR to assuage the portion of the fan base that the Mets expected to be disappointed by the loss of Seaver. I could relate to this because that's exactly what I believed was happening when Cashen issued his mea culpa on behalf of the Mets. And I wasn't bothered in the least by the Mets losing Seaver. I figured he'd get worse every season and was there mostly for sentimental reasons and as a fan attraction. Greg's done a review of this premise by revisiting every player the Mets ended up protecting, and it certainly seemed to make the position hard to sustain. As does trying to reimagine the 1984 and 1985 Mets record with Tom Seaver's numbers from those seasons added in. Well, that's hindsight, even if a worthwhile exercise. For me, at the time, the issue wasnt whether the Mets got it right, or would get it right, but whether Cashen was being honest with the fanbase. Organizations don't make those kinds of "mistakes ". Just like the Mets didn't "inadvertently" issue #24 to Kelvin Torve. The Mets either misread the room or used Torve as a Guinea pig or canary in the coal mine to gauge fan reaction. Nobody forgets that Willie Mays wore #24. That claim strains all credibility. In fact, 30 years ago, there probably wasnt an athlete in all of sports more closely associated with his uniform # than Mays and #24.

Edgy MD Sep 18 2021 01:00 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I think they do all the time. If you look at the list of guys left unprotected, virtually all teams included one or two veterans with contracts that were thought of as large at the time, thinking teams would stay away from budget-busters. I believe the Mets left Kingman and possibly Foster exposed also. Probably Staub too. OE: Here's the column. And yeah, Staub, Kingman, and Foster were all exposed.

batmagadanleadoff Sep 18 2021 04:33 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Edgy MD wrote: I think they do all the time. If you look at the list of guys left unprotected, virtually all teams included one or two veterans with contracts that were thought of as large at the time, thinking teams would stay away from budget-busters. I believe the Mets left Kingman and possibly Foster exposed also. Probably Staub too. OE: Here's the column. And yeah, Staub, Kingman, and Foster were all exposed. I just read that piece. The real shocker was that Foster was left unprotected, only after his second Mets season. If you asked me in January of '84, I'd've rather kept Foster over Seaver if I had to choose between those two. Of course, the White Sox had that same choice and they didn't choose Foster. Not then, anyways. Maybe the ChiSox needed pitching more than hitting or outfielding. Also, another way to look at the Mets approach to that draft is to separate the roster into pitchers and catchers. And also, maybe, Gooden stays in Tidewater in '84 if Seaver's still a Met.

Edgy MD Sep 18 2021 09:07 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Greg addressed that thesis too. If he stayed there, I imagine it wouldn't have been long. Davey Johson says in the documentary that he had wanted Gooden on his team since the 1983 playoff appearance with Tidewater.

Frayed Knot Sep 20 2021 08:20 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

So Lemny comes across as a deep and thoughtful thinking man's player, eh?

Edgy MD Sep 20 2021 09:12 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Having just watched the second installment, Lenny was fire, as the kids' say. I got the idea he (a) insisted on being paid for is contributions, (b) insisted on getting the money up front and in cash, (c) spent it all before the cameras started rolling, and (d) told the interviewer "nobody needs to know about this."

Edgy MD Sep 21 2021 11:35 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

"Get Metsmerized!" got more play in this documentary than it ever did in its own time.

seawolf17 Sep 21 2021 11:38 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Edgy MD wrote: "Get Metsmerized!" got more play in this documentary than it ever did in its own time. Underrated in its genius.

Frayed Knot Sep 21 2021 02:38 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Edgy MD wrote: Having just watched the second installment, Lenny was fire, as the kids' say. I got the idea he (a) insisted on being paid for is contributions, (b) insisted on getting the money up front and in cash, (c) spent it all before the cameras started rolling, and (d) told the interviewer "nobody needs to know about this." I got the idea he was a one-time prize fighter who lost often via early knockouts and was now suffering the long-term consequences.

batmagadanleadoff Sep 21 2021 03:33 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Punch drunk Lenny.

Edgy MD Sep 21 2021 04:48 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Frayed Knot wrote: Edgy MD wrote: Having just watched the second installment, Lenny was fire, as the kids' say. I got the idea he (a) insisted on being paid for is contributions, (b) insisted on getting the money up front and in cash, (c) spent it all before the cameras started rolling, and (d) told the interviewer "nobody needs to know about this." I got the idea he was a one-time prize fighter who lost often via early knockouts and was now suffering the long-term consequences. Sure, but to be fair, I've gotten that idea for at least 25 years.

Edgy MD Sep 23 2021 09:14 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: I'da liked to hear a little more from Orosco and Danny Heep than we got, which wasn't anything Just finished #3. I don't think we've gotten any HoJo appearances either. They did a chapter on how his homer sunk the Cards, but I'm not sure his latter-day self had anything to say about it. Davey mostly had a four-man pen that year, but Orosco and McDowell are the only relievers to appear in the story, and only McDowell provides commentary. Sisk, Niemann, and Anderson aren't even rumors, and it's a shame, because Sisk was a story, and Anderson was also. Anderson actually might have been two stories. Teufel (mentioned but, I think, never heard from) and Santana (seen but never mentioned) also fall by the wayside. Santana has an incidental part in the Houston series just seeing him waving at balls that seem playable. Houston had a fast rug, but he wasn't playing particularly deep. He kind of looked like a 39-year-old Derek Jeter out there. The complement for Santana was usually that he was a really "smooth" shortstop, who had a fluid motion and made plays look easy. Even back then, it seemed like a backhanded way of saying he wasn't very rangy, but it sure seemed moreso in those old films. For his part, Billy Hatcher seemed to fail to track down a few important, catchable balls also. Either I'm misremembering or there's been some revisionism over the mound conference in the Greatest Game Ever Played (GGEP). Keith and others (Knight? Davey?) report him threatening to fight (or kill) Orosco if he threw another fastball. I remembered it as him threatening Carter if he called another fastball. I'm getting old. The parallel story they tell about the revitalization of the City is really subtle, because there's a good side, and a real shit side, and it really speaks to so much of what followed — Giuliani, Trump, the Central Park Five, Letterman's jump to CBS, 9/11, The War on Terror, Trump again (who really should be a character here, and maybe a contributor), the Rise of Hipster Brooklyn, Hurricane Sandy. You can even see the rise of the 1990s Yankees in the seeds of the 1980s Mets, without too much squinting. That's a sobering thought, but ... .

G-Fafif Sep 23 2021 09:36 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Sisk fell out from the pandemic. Hojo didn't respond to requests.

Edgy MD Sep 23 2021 09:46 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Thanks. A little outsider POV might have worked also. The Mets were a national phenomenon, and perhaps even bigger than that. It would have been interesting to see how things looked from North Carolina or Michigan. The African-American commentators are fascinating, because to the last, they seem to be trying to say that (a) I ate, breathed, and slept with that team and loved it; and (b) there was something racially problematic in the culture that built up around it. They all seemed to be saying both and struggling to reconcile it themselves as the camera rolled.

Johnny Lunchbucket Sep 23 2021 09:48 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

You're darn right on Hatcher-- the footage they show is damning. I think we have all heard the Hernandez-Orosco story told both ways

Frayed Knot Sep 24 2021 04:44 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Not in the doc obviously, but Carter always denied a) that Keith was dictating pitches to him or to anyone b) using the "No way I'm making the last fucking out" comment. Both may be accurate, but both also speak to Carter projecting/protecting his image so maybe not. No catcher is going to want to agree/admit that someone else on the field not only knew better than him as far as pitch selection goes but also that he would passively cede that kind of authority onto his turf? No doubt that Keith said something along those lines but each party probably remembers the specific wording and direction plus the degree of suggestion/demand from their own perspective. The second comment, at least the specific phrasing of it, goes against Gary's squeaky clean image giving him incentive to clean it up a bit. On the other hand, this was the guy who, when Mookie took a ball to the face in ST, reacted with, 'Oh gosh darn it Mook'

Frayed Knot Sep 24 2021 05:25 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Edgy MD wrote: Frayed Knot wrote: I got the idea he was a one-time prize fighter who lost often via early knockouts and was now suffering the long-term consequences. Sure, but to be fair, I've gotten that idea for at least 25 years. Well he always was a bit hard to comprehend because a) he's a moron, and b) he usually had a monster wad of chaw in his mouth (at least the part that wasn't constantly falling out). Now is a bit different and his mouth appeared to be empty during the interviews. This time he sounded either drunk, punch-drunk, or quite possibly both.

Edgy MD Sep 24 2021 07:38 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I heard "God dug it!" when Mookie got hit. There are other times when you hear him substitute in a meaningless alternative for a profanity, which kind of undercuts Lenny's story of Carter pinning him up on the wall and F-bombing him. Latter-day Lenny's like the anti-Carter. Gary was mentally programmed to substitute in a G-rated syllable for a profanity, and Lenny is mentally programmed to substitute a profanity back in for everything else. It's maybe one of the few parts of Lenny's programming still working.

MFS62 Sep 24 2021 09:44 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: You're darn right on Hatcher-- the footage they show is damning. I think we have all heard the Hernandez-Orosco story told both ways The way I had always heard it was Hernandez telling Carter ,"If you call for another fastball, I'm going to shove it up your ass." That seems logical, because a pitcher wouldn't throw a pitch the catcher wasn't expecting, so the catcher would be crossed up. I had never heard that Hernandez said anything directly to Orosco. Interesting. Later

Edgy MD Sep 24 2021 10:28 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

The footage of Mookie's injury is still stunning, by the way.

Edgy MD Sep 25 2021 01:01 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Keith may be ambiguous about who he directed his threats to and how forcefully they were directed, but he was dead right that Orosco's next three pitches were terrific sliders. Ronnie was saying in the booth a couple of days ago how losing your velocity is not just about velocity, but a sign that a pitcher was losing his snap on his breaking pitches too. Orosco somehow lost one without the other, at least for three pitches.

Willets Point Sep 27 2021 09:04 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I watched this over the weekend and while I tend to be an overly-nostalgic person to begin with, I was still surprised out how much emotion in made me feel.

Edgy MD Sep 27 2021 09:38 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I would have liked more epilogue. I wanted the last hour of Lord of the Rings, perhaps with a different chapter on the later fates of each figure. And by "each figure," I include Stanley Jefferson and Randy Myers. In fact, I'd've wanted them offering commentary as well. Tim Corcoran and Bruce Berenyi too. I tend to think some of the most valuable perspectives come from folks who are in the circle but not of the circle — like Zeppo Marx or Marilyn Munster. But in that spirit, they got good material from Ed Lynch and Billy Beane. Interesting that they both became GMs. And how about George Foster showing up in the press box in Game Six telling the reporters to sit tight because the game wasn't over? If I had ever heard or read that, I had forgotten. Basically, I wanted the four-part series to be about 12 parts, which I guess is a way of saying they did a really good job.

Willets Point Sep 27 2021 09:49 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I feel that Bob Ojeda and Kevin Mitchell offered some of the best commentary among the players, as well as Davy. I thought they did a good job on exploring Daryl, Doc, and Keith's family and addiction problems, and I'm impressed with how candid and introspective they all are today. I could've done with less footage from "Fear Strikes Out." I'm also surprised that Keith never went into managing after watching this. And Hadji needs a spin-off series.

Edgy MD Sep 27 2021 10:00 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Keith was like a kid in a therapist's office. "I don't want to talk to you about it." "That's OK. But do you want to talk to Hadji about it?"

Willets Point Sep 27 2021 10:07 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

OMG, that's probably true!

LWFS Sep 28 2021 09:49 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Edgy MD wrote: I would have liked more epilogue. I wanted the last hour of Lord of the Rings, perhaps with a different chapter on the later fates of each figure... Basically, I wanted the four-part series to be about 12 parts, which I guess is a way of saying they did a really good job. I wanted more epilogue, too. And not just in a Met-gluttony way... in terms of completing the narrative. Honestly, I EXPECTED more epilogue. Like, if this was such a great team, why wasn't there more staying power? Hell, why wasn't there ANY staying power, really? Give me Gooden's rehab stint, Ojeda's clipper accident, Straw's LA move... and then the "fates of each figure" business. Dykstra-- who gave me a Sean Astin-"Picture of Dorian Gray"-version vibe, personally-- was THE show, along with Keith. When juxtaposed, their comments on the same players/incidents were near-perfect complements. His last little bit, though-- "the winning a Series in New York" business-- was a lot more haunting-cum-chilling than I would have expected.

Edgy MD Sep 28 2021 09:57 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Did I briefly see Diamond Dad in this?

LWFS Sep 28 2021 10:00 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Yyyyyep. (MetFairy mentioned it on FB when the thing premiered.)

Fman99 Sep 29 2021 05:09 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Still haven't watched this yet. I know, I know.

Edgy MD Sep 30 2021 05:10 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Could've use less Billy Joel content. Possibly up to 100% less.

bmfc1 Sep 30 2021 05:49 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

=Fman99 post_id=78838 time=1632913767 user_id=86] Still haven't watched this yet. I know, I know.

If you don't watch it soon, G-Fafif will haunt you.

Willets Point Sep 30 2021 05:50 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

But it was a time to remember. Anyhow, the ballpark DJ at Shea in the 1980s was always pumping out songs by Long Islanders like Billy Joel and Cyndi Lauper, so it's kind of appropriate to have them in the movie.

bmfc1 Sep 30 2021 06:08 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

The use of Tears For Fears was excellent.

G-Fafif Oct 23 2021 08:34 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Before 30 for 30, before “A Year to Remember,” even, Channel 9 produced the first full-length 1986 Mets documentary. A snippet was used in OUATIQ. Steve Albert and Steve Albert's evil twin host. [youtube]hxj8SPUuzO4[/youtube]

Edgy MD Oct 23 2021 01:21 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

This is fantastic. So much cheesy production. So much videotape-quality video. So much bad synthetic music. So much gay subtext. So much gay supertext.

whippoorwill Oct 24 2021 03:14 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Guys I gotta say my 26/27 year old self thought these guys were the cat's pajamas. My now self thinks they were creepo. Who is #42 doing the 80's version of the twerp? Ewwwww. Sid and Jesse remain as unsullyed in my mind. Even Mookie kinda makes me wonder after reading his book. Still love the 1973 Mets more than these guys...always did and always will. Gentlemen and class.

stevejrogers Oct 24 2021 06:46 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

=whippoorwill post_id=80168 time=1635110048 user_id=79] My now self thinks they were creepo. Who is #42 doing the 80's version of the twerp? Ewwwww.

The Second Spitter himself, Roger McDowell

whippoorwill Oct 25 2021 11:31 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Of course :)

kcmets Dec 28 2021 06:04 PM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

Finally watched Episode One just now. Not quite what I was expecting. Captivating and emotional.

roger_that Dec 29 2021 07:39 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I've got it on my DVR and watch snippets every so often. It's a great pandemic isolation soother for me.

Fman99 Dec 30 2021 03:45 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

This would be the sensible time for me to finally watch it, now that there's a forced absence of all things baseball due to the shitfuckery of the lockout.

Edgy MD Dec 30 2021 06:45 AM Re: 1986 Mets to get the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary treatment

I realize that what I kind of wanted was 162 episodes, and about 12 more bonus episodes tacked on to the blue ray edition.