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Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Johnny Lunchbucket Dec 03 2020 05:32 PM

Some guy on the internet says we're in serious talks on a four year deal? Joel Sherman says it's a possibility

smg58 Dec 03 2020 05:48 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

His powers number shot up last year, so I guess a lot depends on whether or not you think that's real. He also appears to be a plus defender. The presence of Francisco Alvarez in our farm system, plus the likelihood that Realmuto would require five or six years, could make McCann a good value play. As long as the money they save gets spent elsewhere, that is.

bmfc1 Dec 03 2020 05:48 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

He's not Realmuto but he's the next best C. https://www.fangraphs.com/players/james-mccann/12859/stats?position=C https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_McCann_(baseball) https://twitter.com/jamesmccann34?lang=en https://www.instagram.com/mccannon34/?hl=en (twins!)

Johnny Lunchbucket Dec 03 2020 06:12 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

I almost feel better about this dude than Realmuto, only because I associate catchers who can hit with injuries and subpar defense. Plus there's not a whole lot of unrealized upside to JTR. Otoh, this dude may or may not hit and 4 years is like 2 more than I'd be comfy with

ashie62 Dec 03 2020 06:47 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

McCann is very good, and under the radar. If not for Yasmani Grandal blocking him McCann hits 20-25 homers.

Frayed Knot Dec 03 2020 07:43 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Except that at least part of McCann's hitting is due to being platooned (much better vs LHPs: OPS+ 135 vs 89) and not having to shoulder the mantle of being an everyday catcher. iow, we shouldn't expect an automatic doubling of his stats simply by making him the lead backstop. That said, I think he's a worthwhile target to pursue even as I admit that virtually all of my knowledge on him is based on recent stuff I've read rather than any first hand knowledge.

Edgy MD Dec 03 2020 08:13 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

I know about him. It's not Christmas until McCann shoots Hans Gruber and he falls crashing into the street of the Nakatomi Plaza. Or something.

batmagadanleadoff Dec 03 2020 10:19 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

I wish we'd stop talking about money. Wanna know what I want? Realmuto. Because he's the best catcher out there. The day Steve Cohen asks me to chip in for Realmuto is the day I'll worry about money. The days of the Mets getting the 2007 version of Mike Piazza and then conning everybody into believing he's going to play eight years younger are over. Steve Cohen is about the richest guy in the whole wide world and wants to win a World Series in the next three to five years. Draw your own conclusions.

Centerfield Dec 04 2020 06:39 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

If his uptick in pitch framing is real then I'm on board. He's a pretty drastic drop off from Realmuto, but if this means Springer, another quality starter and Brad Hand, then it's worth it. I know that Cohen's resources are nearly limitless, but I think he will show restraint in his first offseason.

Centerfield Dec 04 2020 06:40 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Frayed Knot wrote: Except that at least part of McCann's hitting is due to being platooned (much better vs LHPs: OPS+ 135 vs 89) and not having to shoulder the mantle of being an everyday catcher. iow, we shouldn't expect an automatic doubling of his stats simply by making him the lead backstop. That said, I think he's a worthwhile target to pursue even as I admit that virtually all of my knowledge on him is based on recent stuff I've read rather than any first hand knowledge. Exactly right. And there are a lot more RH pitchers than lefties. It's reasonable to think his offense will drop from what he's shown the last two seasons.

batmagadanleadoff Dec 04 2020 06:46 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

=Centerfield post_id=51662 time=1607089172 user_id=65] If his uptick in pitch framing is real then I'm on board. He's a pretty drastic drop off from Realmuto, but if this means Springer, another quality starter and Brad Hand, then it's worth it. I know that Cohen's resources are nearly limitless, but I think he will show restraint in his first offseason.

So you want McCann instead of Realmuto and the reason you want the lesser catcher is because you think Cohen's gonna restrain his spending? What does one thing have to do with the other? Cohen could outbid everyone for both Realmuto and Springer easier than I could buy myself a pair of shoes.

batmagadanleadoff Dec 04 2020 06:52 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

These posts are off the wall. Cohen's one of the 30 or 40 richest guys in the world and youse are writing posts trying to justify how youse'd prefer the 8th best pitcher available iinstead of the best. What a job Fred Wilpon did on youse. It's like battered fan syndrome.

Centerfield Dec 04 2020 07:07 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Of course I'd prefer signing all of the best players available. But I don't think that's what he will do. And if he is going to limit his spending, I'd like him to use his resources on Springer and pitching. I've never asked that my owner sign all the best players, or have the highest payroll in baseball. I've only ever asked that the Mets owner fund a payroll commensurate with market size. Basically, live in the top 3-5 teams or so. Play in the same neighborhood as the Dodgers, Red Sox and Yankees. I don't think that makes me a Wilpon apologist. But as Ralph says, your mileage may vary. And I get that Steve Cohen is richer than all the other rich guys. That doesn't mean he has to spend all those riches on baseball. If he does, great. But I don't think he will and I don't think he has to.

Edgy MD Dec 04 2020 11:13 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

In my alternative reality, Brian Schneider has spent the offseason living in a bubble with J.D. Davis and teaching him how to catch. In this reality, here's James McCann catching the final out of Lucas Giolito's no-hitter, and before heading to the mound to congratulate his pitcher, taking the time to give C.B. Bucknor props for calling the game. https://twitter.com/Jomboy_/status/1298449905514577920

metsmarathon Dec 04 2020 12:37 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

how do realmuto and mccann compare as gamecallers and/or pitchframers? is there a potential advantage there that mccann might have that isn't as well captured in the usual WAR metrics?

MFS62 Dec 04 2020 01:03 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

=Centerfield post_id=51662 time=1607089172 user_id=65] If his uptick in pitch framing is real then I'm on board. He's a pretty drastic drop off from Realmuto, but if this means Springer, another quality starter and Brad Hand, then it's worth it.

This. Right now, the Mets have no lefty relief pitchers (I'm not confident about Matz' ability to work out of the bullpen).

Hand is the best available. We haven't talked much about him, but I feel he is a necessary piece to acquire.

Get Springer, another starter, McCAnn AND Hand and it will have been a very good off season.



Later

Edgy MD Dec 04 2020 05:35 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

=metsmarathon post_id=51672 time=1607110637 user_id=83] how do realmuto and mccann compare as gamecallers and/or pitchframers? is there a potential advantage there that mccann might have that isn't as well captured in the usual WAR metrics?

It's hard to say. Somebody here is much better reading defensive stats than I am. He had terrific numbers this year, but whether that's signal or noise, I cannot say. Speaking broadly, his defensive numbers are trending up and Realmuto's down, but I don't really know if I'm looking at the right numbers when I say that. My eyeball metrics, from seeing Realmuto in the division say he's is a good catcher who takes control of the game, is kind of a jerk, but mostly to the right end. A more athletic version of John Buck.

Frayed Knot Dec 05 2020 04:35 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Dec 05 2020 11:01 AM

The fact that McCann would arrive on our doorsteps with a stamp of approval right there on the package from none other than SUPER JOE McEWING means ... I dunno, maybe something, maybe not. Super Joe has been a ChiSox coach for the past couple seasons. “[McCann is] the ultimate pro, on and off the field,'' McEwing said by phone on Friday. “He's a leader and runs the pitching staff like a second manager.” “The way he communicates with the [pitching] staff and teammates, you won't have to worry about anything, ... He wants that responsibility.” ... “He's a bridge to analytics, ...Being able to combine the information with the human element, he knows how to get the best out of each individual. And when they don't have something, he adjusts.”

Lefty Specialist Dec 05 2020 06:04 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

This isn't rotisserie baseball. You're not going to get Springer and Realmuto and Bauer and every other free agent. Even though Cohen technically has unlimited money to spend, he's also got a few owners who are wary of a New York owner spending unlimited money. Steve himself said that he would not be spending like an inebriated mariner, and he wants to be a member in good standing of the boys club. So while we want everything we're not going to get everything. I'm not crazy about any catcher on a super-long deal. Even Mike Piazza broke down toward the end and he might be the greatest hitting catcher ever. I'm OK with McCann on a shorter deal. He's not Realmuto, but he's not Tomas Nido either.

Frayed Knot Dec 05 2020 10:59 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

And without even getting into a money thing or how Cohen might think he's supposed to act as the new kid on the block, we're not going to get every FA we want because there are 29 other teams out there and many of them want the same guys we want for the same reasons.

batmagadanleadoff Dec 05 2020 10:49 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

I don't expect Cohen's Mets to get every single top free agent out there. I get that there are 29 other teams, that some free agents simply won't want to play here and that Cohen might pull some punches so as not to show up the other owners. Also, the Mets might choose not to pursue some of the best free agents for reasons we'll never truly get to know. And while there's a powerfully positive correlation between a team's payroll and games won, that correlation diminshes and ceases to exist at a certain point. I don't know at what point that occurs and am fairly certain that no team has ever reached that point yet but if the goal is to win a World Series, an owner can't simply buy one because a significant chunk of baseball success is pure and dumb luck which cannot be purchased. You think the Mets are one of the 10 worst MLB teams? They're not even close. The Mets have several terrific pieces. They just had some terrible luck in 2020. My beef with this and the similar threads is posters preferring the sixth best player over the best. Tortured and contrived arguments for why McAnn would be better than Realmuto even though there couldn't be a better case for best of breed. Realmuto's the best hitting catcher, the best defensive catcher and the best pitch-framing catcher. So go ahead and wish for McAnn. That makes a lot of sense to me. And by a lot, I mean none. Jeez, I wanted the Mets to sign Reggie in '77, even though I knew that wasn't gonna happen. I wanted Barry Bonds 15 years later. I wanted Jason Giambi instead of Mo Vaughn even though I knew GIambi would never be had once the Yankees set their targets on Giambi.

Fman99 Dec 06 2020 05:16 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

This is the second best FA catcher? A guy with a career OPS under .700 and inconsistent power numbers? I'm unimpressed.

Centerfield Dec 06 2020 05:27 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

If you know that the Mets can't sign every free agent out there, then it makes sense for a fan to root for the ones they prefer. My order of preference for the top three free agents are: 1. Springer 2. Bauer 3. Realmuto Knowing it's unlikely we get all three, McCann is a nice fallback for missing out on Realmuto, who is rumored to not want to come here anyway. If we get Springer, Hand, and the best SP option (let the analytics guys figure out who this is), and McCann, I'm good. If we end up with McCann, Jackie Bradley Jr, and Cole Hamels, I'm not.

batmagadanleadoff Dec 07 2020 07:36 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

=Centerfield post_id=51722 time=1607257664 user_id=65] If you know that the Mets can't sign every free agent out there, then it makes sense for a fan to root for the ones they prefer. My order of preference for the top three free agents are:

But I don't know that the Mets can't sign every free agent out there. In fact, I think they can unless the player specifically doesn't want to play in New York. I mean, I get that they might not get every free agent they truly want, but these Mets are in as good shape to get everybody as any team ever was. Steve Cohen has more money than arab oil sheiks.



Also, I totally trust Alderson's know-how now backed by Cohen's deep pockets. I trust Sandy's vision, whatever that is or might come to be, and not to beat a dead horse but Steve Cohen's really really rich. These guys get a clean slate from me, they'll be happy to know. So whatever they do is fine by me. At least I'll know that if the Mets miss out on a free agent, it won't be for lack of effort or lack of funds or like making John Olerud an offer that was a dollar short and a day late and then pretending that it wasn't that. And my intelligence will no longer be insulted with eff Wilpon's theaters of the absurd bullshit like when he went on live TV putting his arm around Joe McEwing's shoulder and telling everybody that McEwing the fucking scrub was going to replace the 1999 version of Rickey Henderson. Or telling everybody that the Citi Field Domino's Pizza Citi Bank 2009 patch is really nice because it has the Mets orange and blue colors and it had nothing to do with a disgusting sell-out for a little bit of money. Don't even get me started on signing the has been savior Michael Cuddyer. Rey Ordonez would've never gotten 3,000 plate appearances if Sandy was in charge. Those pathetic, embarrassing days appear to be over.

Centerfield Dec 07 2020 08:12 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

=batmagadanleadoff post_id=51781 time=1607351778 user_id=68] Those pathetic, embarrassing days appear to be over.

From your keyboard...

LWFS Dec 07 2020 09:31 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

This is the second best FA catcher? A guy with a career OPS under .700 and inconsistent power numbers? I'm unimpressed. Everybody saying that he's the second-best catcher available neglects to note that it ain't a win-place-show point-getting race. I mean, Ramos was the consensus "second-best" last time around. We don't get points for "meaningful signings;" we get runs created and prevented by whomever is in the lineup. Realmuto is, even after a career "year" from McCann, considered by those who know-- and idiots like me who cite cherry- picked stats like gospel--- to be head and shoulders above McCann, a pretty-okay platoon catcher before last year (unless you guys see something different in his plate approach, a la Murphy in 2015-16). McCann seems like someone you settle for, not someone you approach. If he's asking for four years-- keeping in mind that he's just about a year older than Realmuto-- that seems a TOUGH swallow. I'm not sure the who-else-we-can-afford fangames make it easier to swallow.

Johnny Lunchbucket Dec 09 2020 10:55 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Tracky says things are "serious" https://twitter.com/martinonyc/status/1336724763641835526

Johnny Lunchbucket Dec 09 2020 11:06 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Buster busts in in a message that reads to me like he thinks Tracky is misinterpreting things or being led astray https://twitter.com/Buster_ESPN/status/1336732492422909958

Edgy MD Dec 09 2020 11:59 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Experience tells me that three years and an option is probably the length, and they're haggling over vesting clauses for the option year.

G-Fafif Dec 09 2020 03:35 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Martino now. Making it sound as if Realmuto is a potential option if McCann falls through, as opposed to the other way around, which seems more intuitive. https://twitter.com/martinonyc/status/1336783094603517953?s=21

LWFS Dec 09 2020 05:43 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Sources: LWFS Family considering pupusas for tomorrow's dinner; at moment, not getting done; family could opt for something else if plans fall through-- chicken and rice is an option

Fman99 Dec 09 2020 06:45 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

=LWFS post_id=51943 time=1607561008 user_id=84] Sources: LWFS Family considering pupusas for tomorrow's dinner; at moment, not getting done; family could opt for something else if plans fall through-- chicken and rice is an option

Christ I don't even get a hashtag here? How will I know what's trending? You insensitive bastard.

batmagadanleadoff Dec 10 2020 11:52 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

This is the second best FA catcher? A guy with a career OPS under .700 and inconsistent power numbers? I'm unimpressed. Everybody saying that he's the second-best catcher available neglects to note that it ain't a win-place-show point-getting race. I mean, Ramos was the consensus "second-best" last time around. We don't get points for "meaningful signings;" we get runs created and prevented by whomever is in the lineup. Realmuto is, even after a career "year" from McCann, considered by those who know-- and idiots like me who cite cherry- picked stats like gospel--- to be head and shoulders above McCann, a pretty-okay platoon catcher before last year (unless you guys see something different in his plate approach, a la Murphy in 2015-16). McCann seems like someone you settle for, not someone you approach. If he's asking for four years-- keeping in mind that he's just about a year older than Realmuto-- that seems a TOUGH swallow. I'm not sure the who-else-we-can-afford fangames make it easier to swallow. McAnn might be the second best catcher, but that doesn't even begin to tell the story because the gap between Realmuto and whoever the next best catcher is is enormous. This reminds me of when I played in a Strat-O-Matic league based on the 1985 season. I'm sure that I once told this story on this forum but I'll tell it again because it involves Gary Carter, 1985's best catcher and the best 1985 comp to J.T. Realmuto ---the parallels to the Realmuto/McAnn catcher FA dynamic are strong. So I played in a draft Strat-o-Matic league based on the NL 1985 season with three other friends, all knowledgeable baseball fans who knew their way around a Strat-o-Matic set. As a memory refresher, 1985 was the year of the all-Missouri World Series. The Mets were great but the Cards -- Jack Clark and seven lead-off hitters, were even better. Darryl Strawberry, rate-wise, had the best season of his career but missed about a month and half of the season with injuries. Dwight Gooden was legendary, producing one of the best pitching seasons in modern baseball history. 1985 was Carter's first and best season as a Met. Anyways, before our draft, we all wrote down our preferred draft pick if we lucked out and had the overall first pick, to be shared after the draft. I was the one who lucked out and got to pick first overall. And with the first pick, I drafted Gary Carter. Not Doc. Not Ozzie Smith who had his career year in '85. Not Willie McGee, of the .353 batting average and undeserving MVP award. Not Pedro Guerrero, 1985's best NL hitter. I picked Carter because he was the best catcher and the next best catcher wasn't even close to Carter. The gap between Carter and the next best catcher, probably Mike Scioscia, was huge. Scioscia had a good BA and OBP but very little power. And he could not stop the running game, crucial in an all-star draft league. Carter was not even close to being the best hitter of '85 and in fact, I generally batted him 7th in my lineups. But I had to have him because there was no other catcher who came close to Carter's performance. After the draft, when everyone else turned over their cards to reveal who they would've drafted had they picked first, everybody's card came up Carter. And that's the story of Realmuto/McAnn.

MFS62 Dec 11 2020 07:34 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

There have been numerous reports that he is coming. But as of now, he's just breathing hard. Later

MFS62 Dec 11 2020 12:09 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

According to SNY they still can't reach agreement. https://sports.yahoo.com/mets-free-agent-james-mccann-172128507.html Later

Centerfield Dec 12 2020 09:21 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

I think Sandy will play it level-headed. But Cohen has enough money to say "either take the current deal by 5 p.m., or I pull it and give Realmuto full asking". Maybe the personality too.

G-Fafif Dec 12 2020 10:39 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

It's done, per Heyman: James at 4 years, $40 million. Let us hope he comes of age in a Mets uniform.

batmagadanleadoff Dec 12 2020 10:42 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Great. We just got a catcher who OPS+'ed under 100 for the first five years of his career, barely cracked 100 in his sixth season, and OPS+'ed 144 in the lunatic 2020 season of the coronavirus. I'm so excited. (Not). Is Fred Wilpon still running things?

batmagadanleadoff Dec 12 2020 10:44 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

=batmagadanleadoff post_id=52072 time=1607794963 user_id=68] Great. We just got a catcher who OPS+'ed under 100 for the first five years of his career, barely cracked 100 in his sixth season, and OPS+'ed 144 in the lunatic 2020 season of the coronavirus. I'm so excited. (Not). Is Fred Wilpon still running things?

What am I missing here? That Steve Cohen just saved himself an amount of money that he probably makes in interest in two days alone without having to get out of bed?

G-Fafif Dec 12 2020 10:59 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Another James (Schapiro, a young man whose writing I recommend), has delved in. According to Statcast, McCann's batted-ball profile has been consistently improving since 2018. His hard-hit rate in 2018 was 37.1%, which was around his career average at the time. In 2019, it improved to 44.2%. In 2020, it improved again, all the way to 47.8%. His walk rate was similar: it went from 5.7% in 2018 to 6.3% in 2019 to a career-high 7.2% in 2020. So, the million-dollar question (literally): can McCann keep it up? He's almost certainly not a .289/.360/.536 hitter, but can he sustain an OPS around .800, as he did in 2019? It won't be easy, as even that season, he had a .359 BABIP. But he's now spent two consecutive seasons — albeit one shortened one — hitting the ball noticeably harder than he had before. Maybe he's made a genuine improvement, or maybe it's a fluke — or maybe, as seems most likely, it's somewhere in between. McCann hasn't just improved on offense either. His framing, a hugely important skill at which Wilson Ramos was particularly bad, has been on an upswing just as he hits free agency. In 2019, according to Statcast, McCann's framing ranked dead last in the league. However, as The Athletic reported, there are nuances to the numbers. Statcast's framing algorithm, James Fegan wrote, “grade(d) him out as among the best in the league at framing strikes at the top of the zone.” However, “the 6-foot-3 McCann was losing larger quantities of runs on pitches at the knees.” But in 2020, something changed. McCann's strike rate improved to 51.4%, eighth in baseball. In 2019, his strike rates in the three areas across the bottom of the strike zone (bottom left, bottom middle, bottom right) had been 20.3%, 44.1%, and 13.9%. In 2020, they climbed to 38.1%, 61.8%, and 31.3%. His framing at the top of the zone suffered, but not enough to offset his gains at the bottom. Vast framing improvement: career development, or one-year fluke? It depends, again, on your level of optimism. Before the 2020 season, McCann worked out with former catcher and bench coach Jerry Narron, who has instructed catchers like Jeff Mathis, Jonathan Lucroy, and David Ross. He was there to work on one thing: framing. “Up to this point in my career I've never really had anyone who was able to explain to me why the scoring worked the way that it did as far as the framing metrics go and how to improve,” McCann told Fegan. “I'll definitely be monitoring it closer than I ever have.” When he returned to the field after his workouts with Narron, his framing seemed to have improved dramatically. https://sheabridge.substack.com/p/the-ultimate-rorschach-test

MFS62 Dec 12 2020 11:23 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

=G-Fafif post_id=52071 time=1607794741 user_id=55] It's done, per Heyman: James at 4 years, $40 million. Let us hope he comes of age in a Mets uniform.

Link? Haven't seen it mentioned anywhere else yet (and believe me, I've been looking)



OE: Just saw it.

One down.

Now for at least one of the big boys. (and CF's favorite lefty reliever)

Later

Frayed Knot Dec 12 2020 11:32 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Dec 12 2020 03:30 PM

=batmagadanleadoff post_id=52073 time=1607795065 user_id=68] What am I missing here? That Steve Cohen just saved himself an amount of money that he probably makes in interest in two days alone without having to get out of bed?

Maybe that they talked to Realmuto and didn't get a good vibe, or that he told them he didn't want to play in NYC, or that he wanted a seven-year deal making this one look like the smarter of the two,

or that they were afraid if they waited too long for Plan A to come through they might lose out on Plan A and Plan B.



Or maybe they just plain fucked up and we can spend the next four seasons referring to McCann as Fakemuto.

G-Fafif Dec 12 2020 01:15 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Sep 19 2021 07:42 AM

I don't know how this is quantified, but I dig it. [tweet]https://twitter.com/jamesmccann34/status/1136701316196163588[/tweet]

Benjamin Grimm Dec 12 2020 01:51 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Todd Zeile has said that Realmuto will cost $100 million more than McCann but that he's not $100 million better than McCann. If the Mets get McCann and Springer and Bauer it will be an incredible off-season.

LWFS Dec 12 2020 01:56 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Great. We just got a catcher who OPS+'ed under 100 for the first five years of his career, barely cracked 100 in his sixth season, and OPS+'ed 144 in the lunatic 2020 season of the coronavirus. I'm so excited. (Not). Is Fred Wilpon still running things? On the plus side, he's also apparently REALLY into [URL=https://sportsspectrum.com/the-increase/2018/04/05/the-increase-anything-is-possible-james-mccann/]Jesus. I think I'd more readily buy the I-worked-on-this-and-that's-why-I'm-better-at-this explanation of the fluky-y improvement last year if he could actually explain what he was working on, specifically. (Like, say, Bauer. Or Murphy.) The underlying plate-approach numbers don't seem to reveal anything, in and of themselves.

Fman99 Dec 12 2020 03:33 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Todd Zeile has said that Realmuto will cost $100 million more than McCann but that he's not $100 million better than McCann. If the Mets get McCann and Springer and Bauer it will be an incredible off-season. I agree with this, if this is your 3rd best acquisition and it means you didn't sign a catcher for 7-8 years, then, well, there you go.

batmagadanleadoff Dec 12 2020 04:13 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Benjamin Grimm wrote: Todd Zeile has said that Realmuto will cost $100 million more than McCann but that he's not $100 million better than McCann. This just begs many more questions, the main one being -- if Realmuto's not $100M better than McAnn, then why will he cost $100M more than McAnn? And tell Todd Zeile I said he was no fucking John Olerud.

batmagadanleadoff Dec 12 2020 04:17 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Frayed Knot wrote: =batmagadanleadoff post_id=52073 time=1607795065 user_id=68] What am I missing here? That Steve Cohen just saved himself an amount of money that he probably makes in interest in two days alone without having to get out of bed? Maybe that they talked to Realmuto and didn't get a good vibe, or that he told them he didn't want to play in NYC, or that he wanted a seven-year deal making this one look like the smarter of the two, or that they were afraid if they waited too long for Plan A to come through they might lose out on Plan A and Plan B. Or maybe they just plain fucked up and we can spend the next four seasons referring to McCann as Fakemuto.

You left out that Cohen might want to establish that he's no softee pushover and isn't gonna overpay just because he can. Good one, no?

Frayed Knot Dec 12 2020 06:21 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Well, not overpaying is a good way to run things no matter what the particular motivation and overpaying could be in dollars or in years or consist of a combo of both, all of which could make the McCann deal look better in the long run. Not that we Know Realmuto is going to get a deal that his next team will come to regret ... just throwing that out as a possibility. Personally I'm leaning towards the idea that Steve & Sandy wanted to put at least one signing on the board before too much time had passed and felt that waiting on one of the catchers ran the risk of both winding up elsewhere leaving S & S to contemplate not just the drop off from Plan 'A' to 'B' but the one to whomever qualifies as Plan 'C'

Centerfield Dec 12 2020 06:30 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

=G-Fafif post_id=52071 time=1607794741 user_id=55] It's done, per Heyman: James at 4 years, $40 million. Let us hope he comes of age in a Mets uniform.

An hour after I set the deadline. You're welcome Steve.

nymr83 Dec 12 2020 07:48 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

We dont know what Realmuto will get. More importantly, we also just dont know that he was willing to come to the Mets. If I was a baseball player and I could make millions of dollars anywhere, if Miami called me up with the best offer I'd say "Florida? Fuck that" I'll judge the Mets off season by hiw it looks as a whole, not by one guy whose motivations we cant know.

batmagadanleadoff Dec 12 2020 07:58 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

=nymr83 post_id=52114 time=1607827704 user_id=54] I'll judge the Mets off season by hiw it looks as a whole, not by one guy whose motivations we cant know.

The Mets signing both Springer and Bauer won't make McAnn a better pickup than Realmuto -- at least not from what we have to go on today. What you seem to be saying is that Bill Gates walks into a working-class bar where there are 20 people in there, working there or drinking and eating there. And the average net worth of everybody in there after Gates walks in is five billion dollars.



Earlier, I wrote that I trust Sandy totally, now that he's not handcuffed and gagged by the Wilpons anymore. I stand by that. But Mcann isn't even close to Realmuto, talent-wise.



And I get to talk like this because the Wilpons don't own the Mets anymore and the Mets newest owner is one of the richest guys in the world.

Johnny Lunchbucket Dec 12 2020 08:37 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Will you please stop spelling McCann incorrectly. He's not a shoe salesman

batmagadanleadoff Dec 12 2020 08:42 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: Will you please stop spelling McCann incorrectly. He's not a shoe salesman This is all part of my early onset of dementia. McAnn. Lindnor. Perdue, I used to be a spelling bee champ. I dunno what's going on anymore.

nymr83 Dec 12 2020 08:43 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

=batmagadanleadoff post_id=52115 time=1607828338 user_id=68] =nymr83 post_id=52114 time=1607827704 user_id=54] I'll judge the Mets off season by hiw it looks as a whole, not by one guy whose motivations we cant know.

The Mets signing both Springer and Bauer won't make McAnn a better pickup than Realmuto -- at least not from what we have to go on today. What you seem to be saying is that Bill Gates walks into a working-class bar where there are 20 people in there, working there or drinking and eating there. And the average net worth of everybody in there after Gates walks in is five billion dollars.



Earlier, I wrote that I trust Sandy totally, now that he's not handcuffed and gagged by the Wilpons anymore. I stand by that. But Mcann isn't even close to Realmuto, talent-wise.



And I get to talk like this because the Wilpons don't own the Mets anymore and the Mets newest owner is one of the richest guys in the world.


this is true. but i'm not saying what you think i'm saying. my emphasis is on YOU DON'T KNOW THAT REALMUTO WAS EVEN WILLONG TO COME HERE

batmagadanleadoff Dec 12 2020 08:52 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

=nymr83 post_id=52118 time=1607831026 user_id=54] my emphasis is on YOU DON'T KNOW THAT REALMUTO WAS EVEN WILLONG TO COME HERE

That's right! I don't know whether Realmuto was even willing to play for the Mets. And I know that I don't know that. What I'm saying is that I'm not over the moon over the McCann signing. He may be the 2d best FA catcher but he's miles and miles and miles away from Realmuto. And McCann also had an extraordinarily high BABIP last season. So maybe he was just really lucky.

nymr83 Dec 12 2020 08:59 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

I'm not "over the moon" either. But they needed a catcher and this one seems fine. Lets see what else they do.

MFS62 Dec 13 2020 07:31 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

... But they needed a catcher and this one seems fine. Right. As Casey Stengel said, "If you don't have a catcher, you're gonna' have a lot of passed balls". And this one seems up to catching his share of pitches better than the guy he replaced. Later

Edgy MD Dec 14 2020 08:06 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Is this signing official yet? Are they holding off an announcement until they get Porter seated?

Johnny Lunchbucket Dec 14 2020 09:23 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Physical. Sandy said Wednesday or Thursday

Frayed Knot Dec 15 2020 04:07 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

As I suspected was most likely, timing was the major factor in the McCann signing. We had "great conversations" [with Realmuto's agents] Alderson said on Monday's Zoom call to introduce new GM Jared Porter ... “more than anything else, this was a timing issue for us,'' “We have a number of needs. We can afford to wait to fill some of them. We can't afford to wait to fill all of them.” https://nypost.com/2020/12/14/this-is-what-derailed-mets-pursuit-of-j-t-realmuto/

nymr83 Dec 15 2020 11:39 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

makes sense. you dont want to wait out Realmuto and Springer and Bauer and watch everyone else sign.

Benjamin Grimm Dec 15 2020 12:31 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

There was probably quite a dropoff to the third best available catcher.

Edgy MD Dec 15 2020 12:38 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Probably Tyler Flowers, so ... yeah, probably so.

MFS62 Dec 15 2020 12:43 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

And in two to three years, Alvarez and/or Regnault will be here and McCann can, as Yogi Berra once said about Bill Dickey, "Learn them his experience". Later

A Boy Named Seo Dec 15 2020 01:42 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Let me be in the minority to say I'm kinda psyched on McCann. His body of work over the last two seasons (almost 600 PAs) has been very good. The advanced metrics seem to suggest he's figured something out both at the dish and behind it. StatCast numbers are sexy, even. I don't think Realmuto will be light years ahead of him for the next couple of years, and as McCann and Realmuto both devolve into old, crumbling catchers, we'll have the cheaper one on a shorter contract, which will make him easier to deal with. I know moneymoneymoney-it-doesn't-matter, but the Mets were at about $153M and the CBT for 2021 is $210M. McCann adds ~$10M to that, so ~$163M, leaving $47M before they hit the threshold. Plenty to play with, and going over for the first year wouldn't hurt the Mets or Cohen at all. But the dream sweep of Springer/Bauer surely puts them over and then "hi, welcome back, Cano" in 2022 and a new CBA (with potentially new tax penalties) makes for what could be some gnarly financial books. Sure, Cohen can afford it, but I'm also sure he doesn't want to give away truckloads of money in taxes if thinks he can win at the top of the CBT threshold and invest elsewhere. /ducks

G-Fafif Dec 15 2020 01:50 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

https://twitter.com/anthonydicomo/status/1338948652262428674?s=21

A Boy Named Seo Dec 15 2020 01:56 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

#intangibles He's got it all, I tell ya

batmagadanleadoff Dec 15 2020 02:26 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Frayed Knot wrote: As I suspected was most likely, timing was the major factor in the McCann signing. We had "great conversations" [with Realmuto's agents] Alderson said on Monday's Zoom call to introduce new GM Jared Porter ... “more than anything else, this was a timing issue for us,'' “We have a number of needs. We can afford to wait to fill some of them. We can't afford to wait to fill all of them.” https://nypost.com/2020/12/14/this-is-what-derailed-mets-pursuit-of-j-t-realmuto/ The Mets say "timing" but beauty is in the eye of the beholder. So Maybe Realmuto's camp could, just the same, complain about "timing" and the Mets not coming around to Realmuto's number. Or maybe this negotiation had nothing to do with "timing" and everything to do with the Cohen Mets wanting to make a statement and establish that they're not simply going to pay everybody's "ransom" even though they could easily do so. We might never really know why the Mets signed McCann instead of Realmuto. Grain of salt on this press release.

ashie62 Dec 18 2020 11:13 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

I would have thought the White Sox more likely to sign McCann and shop Grandal.

Marshmallowmilkshake Dec 19 2020 05:48 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

I like this guy so far! https://scontent.fdet1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/131390635_10157932606663481_4054295566688151247_n.jpg?_nc_cat=108&ccb=2&_nc_sid=a26aad&_nc_ohc=Jf-xWO-yjikAX9rfLDr&_nc_ht=scontent.fdet1-2.fna&oh=91b476e20c836ee1751fda5ebaa6d631&oe=6006039F>

Frayed Knot Dec 19 2020 06:35 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

The kids call him Jimmy the Saint Plus a little James McCann history for ya.

Lefty Specialist Dec 20 2020 04:24 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Yeah the Bible verse in his signature gives us an idea what we're in for. He's gonna make Nimmo look like an atheist. Mark 10:27 And Jesus, looking upon them, said, “With men it is impossible, but not with God; for with God all things are possible.” What he should say is "With more money than God, all things are possible." If anyone's offended by the blasphemy, you can delete this. But I have a very low tolerance for God-botherers.

Fman99 Dec 20 2020 05:21 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

I like that he's excited to wear the colors and help them win. Good on him. Bring us those WORLD SERIES TITTIES or whatever he said.

nymr83 Dec 20 2020 08:28 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Lefty Specialist wrote: Yeah the Bible verse in his signature gives us an idea what we're in for. He's gonna make Nimmo look like an atheist. Mark 10:27 And Jesus, looking upon them, said, “With men it is impossible, but not with God; for with God all things are possible.” What he should say is "With more money than God, all things are possible." If anyone's offended by the blasphemy, you can delete this. But I have a very low tolerance for God-botherers. I'm not Christian and don't know the 'new testament' from a hole in the wall so maybe i'm missing something - is there something particularly offensive about that quote? like is that one of the ones used to justify hating gay people? if not, wtf is your issue?

Edgy MD Dec 20 2020 11:46 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

I'm not Christian and don't know the 'new testament' from a hole in the wall so maybe i'm missing something - is there something particularly offensive about that quote? like is that one of the ones used to justify hating gay people? if not, wtf is your issue? Incredible. See if you can guess which is which. (Nobody help him.) [FIMG=300]https://www.cam.ac.uk/sites/www.cam.ac.uk/files/styles/content-885x432/public/news/news/codexz.jpg?itok=VVF-iB5q[/FIMG] [fimg=195]https://www.do-it-yourself-help.com/images/small-wall-hole.jpg[/fimg]

Johnny Lunchbucket Dec 20 2020 11:48 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

I'm just hoping he's better than Brian Schneider, who said all the right things at his arrival, had an even better rep for staff-handling, runner-throwing-outing, and pitch-framing. Oh yes I said staff handling

kcmets Dec 20 2020 12:00 PM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Johnny Lunchbucket wrote: Oh yes I said staff handling If we're going biblical, here's one from The Book of Psalms: "thy rod and thy staff-handling -- they comfort me"

bmfc1 Sep 19 2021 07:08 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

I looked up McCann and Nido on Fangraphs. As suggested elsewhere, McCann's D is decent, with 4.8 defensive WAR. https://www.fangraphs.com/players/james-mccann/12859/stats?position=C The Mets snapped him up right quick so they wouldn't lose out on a FA C (perhaps they heard that Realmuto didn't want to be a Met or they wanted to save $ for Springer/Bauer or they wanted to make an early splash or they wanted to set the market or Sandy is bad at his job) and if they didn't get McCann they didn't want to be stuck with Nido. Except, per these numbers, they just paid much, much more for someone similar to Nido: https://www.fangraphs.com/players/tomas-nido/13755/stats?position=C McCann: Offense -12.1, Defense + 4.8, Overall +0.5 Nido: Offense -8, Defense +11.4, Overall +0.8

MFS62 Sep 19 2021 09:32 AM Re: Let us commence exchanging opinions and perspective on James McCann

Baseball reference gives Nido a +0.8 dWAR. Later