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Give it Up for Endy

Johnny Dickshot Apr 28 2006 07:54 AM

Look, as Beltran's backup you want to see this guy as little as possible. He's awfully hacky, and has almost no power, can really kill you over the course of a long year, probably isn;t poised for a lot of improvement, and is about the last guy you wanna see when need a hit. That said, in this brief period he's been forced upon us, he's had a couple a huge hits (the RBI bunt single, the hit the other day that started the 8th inning rally), stole a couple of bases and has played truly outstanding defense. He's a very, very good outfielder, at least what I've seen. So there ya go. Tip your frosty mug of Rheingold the to guy who's reign as a starting player we can't wait to see end, Endy. (ching!) (smattering of applause) (cough)

abogdan Apr 28 2006 08:48 AM

Chavez is hitting .231/.286/.282 this year. He's shown that he can be an adequate defensive replacement/pinch runner, but he's not suited at all to be an everyday CF, even on a temporary basis.

Elster88 Apr 28 2006 08:53 AM

Echo! Echo Echo Echo

Johnny Dickshot Apr 28 2006 09:35 AM

abogdan wrote: Chavez is hitting .231/.286/.282 this year. He's shown that he can be an adequate defensive replacement/pinch runner, but he's not suited at all to be an everyday CF, even on a temporary basis. Yeah, I got that. Whom do you suggest to take starts in CF, even temporalily?

MFS62 Apr 28 2006 09:50 AM

Assuming they won't bring up Lastings, there's nobody else on the major or AAA rosters who can play even adequate CF defense. Nady has played there, but he appears to approach fly balls like they'll explode on contact. What we see from Endy is what he's been doing his entire career. No surprises. But he should not be considered a regular for an extended period of time. If we had time to experiment (and another capable backup infielder) I'd like to see Woodward try to play center. Casey Stengel believed the skills of short and center were comparable, and turned Mantle, Kubek, Murcer and Tresh into pretty decent center fielders. Later

Edgy DC Apr 28 2006 10:04 AM

Edgy DC: "OK, excellent! Tying run is on second. We're in business now." Announcer: "Now, batting, Endy Chavez!" Johnny Dickshot: "Yay! Go, Endy!" Edgy DC: "No, wait. Seriously, who else is available?" Johnny Dickshot: (checking scorecard) "Well, there's Andy Hernandez." Edgy DC: "..." Johnny Dickshot: "..." Edgy DC: "Yay! Go, Endy!"

Hillbilly Apr 28 2006 10:23 AM

His D. has been great. The previous baseball administration would put just about anybody in Center. Even Bobby V. put some real hacks out there. If it's a relatively breif fill in, I prefer using the true CFer as a backup. It can get really ugly when you trade O for D in center.

smg58 Apr 28 2006 10:24 AM

Who are the extra 15 on the 40-man roster? Anybody we could painlessly drop to make room for Milledge? Nady played some CF in San Diego last year, but he also played his way back into right on a full-time basis. How good is Woodward in center?

Rotblatt Apr 28 2006 10:29 AM

Endy Chavez 2006 Runners on 13 AB, .308 AVG/.400 OBP/.385 SLG/.785 OPS Runners in scoring position 4-7, 2 BB, 1 SB Runners in scoring position, 2 out 3-4, 1 BB, 1 SB Bases loaded 1-1 Frankly, I don't think we could ask for anything more from Endy. Sure, it's flukey, but so what? In terms of generating runs when we needed them, he's been productive. And it might not be as flukey as you'd think . . . I noted after we signed Delgado, LoDuca & Franco that they all had good historical "clutch" numbers and that some staticians even noted them as possible examples of real clutch hitters. Does Endy fit this bill? 2002 - 2005 Overall 1101 AB, .259 AVG/.301 OBP/.356 SLG/.657 OPS None on 714 AB, .256 AVG/.297 OBP/.342 SLG/.639 OPS Runners on 387 AB, .264 AVG/.310 OBP/.382 SLG/.692 OPS Runners in scoring position 231 AB, .268 AVG/.326 OBP/.398 SLG/.724 OPS Bases Loaded 25 AB, .320 AVG/.346 OBP/.440 SLG/.786 OPS Scoring Position, 2 out 118 AB, .220 AVG/.303 OBP/.339 SLG/.642 OPS So his numbers rise significantly in 3 out of 4 categories, and drop from his overall numbers in the 4th (although it's still an uptick from his performance with no one on base). He's not GOOD in any of these cases aside from bases loaded, but his performance in these "clutch" situations has historically been better than that in non-clutch situations. Is Omar Minaya going all Moneyball on us by recognizing an underutilized ability to perform in clutch situations and capitilizing on it? Or is he (and our batters) simply getting lucky?

Frayed Knot Apr 28 2006 10:32 AM

Well they had to drop Iriki off the 40-man and risk losing him (they didn't) just to get Feliciano onto the big club. Yeah I know that doesn't sound like much but someone like him may come in handy if/when a starter/mid-reliever goes down. As it is, John Maine is the only likely starter on the 40 who could reasonably fill-in if we need someone (like for Bannister for instance). Omar's already said he's not bringing up Milledge - at least for now. We should get a Beltran decision - to DL or not to DL - by later today. Bannister is tentatively on the slate for Tuesday but they might need to make that call by say Sunday.

abogdan Apr 28 2006 10:34 AM

I would have DL'ed Beltran a week and a half ago and moved Nady to center with Diaz in right. If Nady showed that he couldn't play centerfield on anything but an emergency basis, DFA Valentin, and call up Milledge to man the fort for a week or two.

Yancy Street Gang Apr 28 2006 10:40 AM

A "not to DL" decision isn't really a decision. He could still be "day to day" for another week and a half.

Edgy DC Apr 28 2006 10:41 AM

I think that sometimes "clutch" hitters are good contact hitters with poor (or poorer)pitch selection skills --- both Rey Ordóñez and José Reyes spring to mind --- who pitchers typically get out by getting them to chase, but whose making-contact skills get magnified when the pitcher is forced to come after them with men on base. This is why, I suspect, that when you look to split out clutch situations, you often get guys like Steve Sax standing out (depending on how you define clutch situations, of course), rather than big-time sluggers. But I also think maybe this theory might be applicable to Tony Perez.

Johnny Dickshot Apr 28 2006 10:48 AM

Just going by Eyewitness Defense, Nady in CF misses 3 or 4 balls that Chavez got to and caught in SD and SF. Beltran may not have got to those either. Sickly-hitting little punch and judy weakling may have saved the Mets a half-dozen runs on this trip. Serious.

Frayed Knot Apr 28 2006 10:50 AM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: A "not to DL" decision isn't really a decision. He could still be "day to day" for another week and a half. Well they kind of indicated that they're going to decide something today. The supposition is that either he'll be in the lineup tonight or they'll DL him and backdate it to the last time he played.

Edgy DC Apr 28 2006 10:57 AM

They seemed to be shy about using him as a pinch-hitter the last few days, even in the extra-ininng battle of attrition, so as not to further delay the retroactive DL date.

Vic Sage Apr 28 2006 10:59 AM

All Chavez' numbers indicate to me is that he's a piece of crap hitter in just about any circumstance. That he's slightly less crappy with men on is not particularly significant... afterall, it's not as if he becomes a GOOD hitter in those situations. (and please lets not draw any conclusions from the 25 ABs with the bases loaded) Woodward played some CF last year. If we're just going day-to-day with Beltran, I'd just as soon see Woody's bat in the lineup. If he's going to be DLed for a short period, I'd prefer to bring up Diaz and move Nady to CF. If Beltran has got a more serious long-term problem, you've got to go to Milledge. The big red machine could carry Cesar Geronimo... but the Mets `06 are not a big orange `n blue machine. With the way this lineup is producing now, we can't afford to give up a slot in the lineup to guys who can't hit for shit.

Elster88 Apr 28 2006 11:04 AM

Where does the expression punch and judy hitter come from? "What is the etymology of that idiom?"

Johnny Dickshot Apr 28 2006 11:05 AM

I agree with all of that. Just asking that you raise your Rhiengolds to the job he did, against your better judgement and expectations, on this trip. Mmmmmmm... Endy.

Vic Sage Apr 28 2006 11:21 AM

oh, sure. way ta go, kid! Now here's your hat, what's your hurry...

Edgy DC Apr 28 2006 11:23 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Apr 28 2006 11:55 AM

]Where does the expression punch and judy hitter come from? Punch and Judy is the most famous of all puppet shows, about a married couple who beat the crap out of each other, usually with sticks. Kids have gone nuts for it and it's variations probably for five hundred years. Go figure. It's applied to singles hitters because rather than clout balls into the gap or over the fence, they "punch" them the other way. Once "punch" came to describe them, "judy" was added because it was associated with "punch" from the puppet show and it further implicated the singles hitter as being less than fully masculine. I don't know when it was first coined, but I remember a then-recently retired Reggie Jackson calling young Kirby Puckett a punch-and-judy hitter. Curious in light of latter-day reports of Puckett's behavior with women.

Vic Sage Apr 28 2006 11:30 AM

from Wikipedia: Punch and Judy is a popular British glove-puppet show for children, featuring Mr. Punch and his wife Judy. The performance consists of a sequence of short scenes, each depicting an interaction between the anarchic Mr. Punch and one other character (the show is traditionally performed by a single puppeteer, known as a Professor, who of course can only perform two characters at a time). The tale is this: Punch, in a fit of jealousy, strangles his infant child, when Judy flies to her revenge. She fetches a bludgeon, with which she belabours her husband, till Punch, exasperated, seizes another bludgeon and beats her to death, then flings into the street the two dead bodies. The bodies attract the notice of a police officer, who enters the house. Punch flees for his life; being arrested by an officer of the Inquisition, he is shut up in prison, from which he escapes by means of a golden key. The rest is an allegory, showing how Punch triumphs over all the ills that flesh is heir to. (1) Ennui, in the shape of a dog, is overcome; (2) Disease, in the disguise of a doctor, is kicked out; (3) Death is beaten to death; and (4) the Devil himself is outwitted. Mr. Punch wears a jester's motley, is hunchbacked and his hooked nose almost meets his curved jutting chin. He carries a stick, as large as himself, which he freely uses upon all the other characters in the show. He speaks in a bizarre rasping voice, produced by a contrivance known as a swazzle or swatchel which the Professor holds in his mouth, transmitting his gleeful cackle— "as pleased as Punch". The Punch and Judy show has deep roots; it is ultimately based on the Italian commedia dell'arte, and the figure of Punch derives ultimately from the stock character of Pulcinello. He is a manifestation of the Lord of Misrule and Trickster figures of deep-rooted mythologies. Judy was originally "Joan". "Punch and Judy" shows are also known in various other countries. In Germany Punch is called "Kasper" and Judy is "Grete". The characters date back to the 18th century in German speaking countries. In the Netherlands Punch is called Jan Klaassen, in Denmark Mester Jackel, in Italy Pulcinello (with Pulcinella as the female part), in Russia Petruschka, in Romania Vasilache and in France Le guignol. May 9, 1662 is reckoned the birthday of Mr. Punch, for that was the first time the diarist Samuel Pepys observed a Punch and Judy show near St. Paul's Church in London's Covent Garden. It was performed by an Italian Punchman, Pietro Gimonde operating as "Signor Bologna". Pepys described the event in his diary: "...an Italian puppet play, that is within the rails there, which is very pretty, the best that I ever saw, and great resort of gallants." This is considered the first written record of a Punch and Judy performance. Pepys went back several more times and continued to be amused. The Punch he saw was a marionette not a glove-puppet, and worked his show within a tent. The simplification of the show to an easily transportable booth (known as a fit-up) with a pair of sock puppet characters happened in the early 19th century. A transcript of a typical Punch and Judy show in London of the 1840s can be found in Henry Mayhew's London Labour and the London Poor. Modern performances of Punch and Judy are traditionally seaside entertainments, found in holiday resorts during the summer months. Apart from Punch and Judy, there is usually also their baby, a crocodile, and a string of sausages. The devil and Jack Ketch may also make appearances. The story changes, but the punchlines remain the same: Mr. Punch, for example, always says "That's the way to do it!" Featuring, as it does, a deformed, child-murdering, wife-beating psychopath who commits appalling acts of violence and cruelty upon all those around him and escapes scot-free, it is greatly enjoyed by small children.

Johnny Dickshot Apr 28 2006 11:33 AM

[homer simpson] (chuckling) Oh, Andy Capp, you wife-beating drunk.[/homer simpson]

Edgy DC May 03 2006 10:20 PM

Even after that emasculation of Jack Wilson went for a "reached on error," Endy Chavez is suddenly hitting .308, suckazz.

cooby May 03 2006 10:36 PM

That should have been a hit. What a ripoff.

Edgy DC May 03 2006 10:38 PM

I'm fine with it being an error. If a shortstop is in front of it, it's fair to expect him --- unlike a thirdbaseman or pitcher to have enough reaction time to make the play.

Rotblatt May 03 2006 10:55 PM

Johnny Dickshot May 03 2006 11:12 PM

Mmmmm... Endy...

Frayed Knot May 03 2006 11:53 PM

'you can't stop Endy Chavez you can only hope to contain him'

DocTee May 04 2006 12:32 AM

And of course, Punch-n-judy hitters are often refered to as "punchless". go figure

Edgy DC Jun 11 2006 12:25 PM

Endy, man, still worthy of upgiving all these weeks later.

Frayed Knot Jun 11 2006 10:33 PM

Endy also deserves some props despite the (somewhat) disparaging remarks about his throwing arm that were made about a week ago.

*62 Jun 11 2006 10:42 PM

="Frayed Knot"]'you can't stop Endy Chavez you can only hope to contain him' indeed