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Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

kcmets Jun 24 2022 08:39 AM

Dark Day in America.

Ceetar Jun 24 2022 09:11 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

of course they did it. We live in a fascist police state. They're already promising to come after same sex marriages and contraception. They might be right on one thing though, guns do present a solution be the solution to this.

MFS62 Jun 24 2022 09:15 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

What hypocrites. One day, the Federal Government overrides the States. One day, the States rule supreme. Whatever suits their nefarious objectives. Later

Willets Point Jun 24 2022 09:20 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Welp! As I spent my entire life watching the Democrats willing to throw various people and things under the bus in the name of bipartisanship - Blacks, Latinos, immigrants, LGBTQ people, the working poor, people carrying student debt, teachers, labor, people we bomb in foreign countries, the environment - I always thought that they'd fight tooth and nail for abortion rights. But so far, no. Are they going to use the power they have right now to address the white supremacist fascist elephant in the room NOW!!! Or are they going to continue sending us fundraising emails and tell us that we need a "strong Republican party?"

Ceetar Jun 24 2022 09:27 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

the last one. And the country is so desperate that it'll mostly work. (They might not get elected, but they'll get PAID). Scumbag Joe Manchin spoke up to say he's "alarmed".

Willets Point Jun 24 2022 09:31 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Then I guess a full revolution is the only option left.

Chad ochoseis Jun 24 2022 09:46 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

the last one. And the country is so desperate that it'll mostly work. (They might not get elected, but they'll get PAID). Scumbag Joe Manchin spoke up to say he's "alarmed". Now he's alarmed? The alarm has been on at full blast since Addison M. McConnell (I refuse to dignify that bastard by calling him by my name) stole the seat Scalia vacated in 2016.

kcmets Jun 24 2022 09:58 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Your real name is Cecil?

batmagadanleadoff Jun 24 2022 10:31 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Willets Point wrote: Then I guess a full revolution is the only option left. I really think it's looking that way. What other option is there when the minority rules the country --- by cheating to give them a hammerlock on political power? The Electoral College is bad enough. But then they gerrymander themselves into perpetual majorities in some states. They steal the Supreme Court, which, remarkably, washes its hands of political gerrymandering. And now they've passed new laws essentially allowing state politicians to declare election winners no matter the actual vote tallies.And if the Dems were to pass National voting rights, which they didnt anyways because Joe Manchin, this Supreme Court would make mincemeat out of that legislation. Today's decision isnt even the beginning of the horrors that are to come.

MFS62 Jun 24 2022 10:34 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

During their confirmation hearings, didn't Kavanaugh and Barrett (and maybe Gorsuch) state under oath that they felt Roe-v-Wade was settled precedent? If so, aren't they guilty of perjury? And I don't think the statute of limitations has run out on that yet. There is no appeal on this ruling, but they have to be stopped on further impinging on our rights. Later

batmagadanleadoff Jun 24 2022 10:41 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

=MFS62 post_id=97190 time=1656088460 user_id=60] During their confirmation hearings, didn't Kavanaugh and Barrett (and maybe Gorsuch) state under oath that they felt Roe-v-Wade was settled precedent? If so, aren't they guilty of perjury? And I don't think the statute of limitations has run out on that yet. There is no appeal on this ruling, but they have to be stopped on further impinging on our rights.

Their comments aren't actionable. First of all, technically they weren't lying. At the time of their comments, Roe was established precedent. They should've been asked if they thought Roe was decided correctly or asked how they'd vote if they had to decide Roe. Nobody asked those questions. Still, if their decisions today were ever made into the subject of hearings or investigations, as farfetched as that would be, they'd, among other things, be allowed to say that since their confirmation hearings, they changed their minds.

Marshmallowmilkshake Jun 24 2022 11:01 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Willets Point wrote: Then I guess a full revolution is the only option left. Or, you amend the constitution. You make things constitutional by adding them to the constitution. It's one of the checks and balances. [url]https://www.archives.gov/federal-register/constitution It's not a super-easy process -- nor should it be. But it's possible. The last amendment was in 1992. If a vast majority of people support something there are ways to make it happen. I'd support one for this.

Ceetar Jun 24 2022 11:04 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

fuck that let's murder some nazis. constitution amendment. lol. You make things constitutional by holding the people in charge's feet to the fire, maybe literally. They need to KNOW that any other choice of action will go extremely poorly, personally, for them. Change doesn't happen peacefully in a back room. Status Quo does.

Willets Point Jun 24 2022 11:06 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Who's going to amend the Constitution? The party that wouldn't even give the full $2000 in COVID relief payments that they promised they'd do if elected?

batmagadanleadoff Jun 24 2022 11:13 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Willets Point wrote: Who's going to amend the Constitution? The party that wouldn't even give the full $2000 in COVID relief payments that they promised they'd do if elected? It's a fantasy and its absurd. Two thirds of the states are gonna vote for this when the majority of states, not people, want to ban abortions? I say states because we vote by states, not by people. Two thirds of the Senate is also gonna vote for this? The most industrialized and technologically advanced nation in the world has the most retarded way of voting for things.

Willets Point Jun 24 2022 11:17 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

The Constitution, for good and for ill, was rooted in a reactionary movement to the radicalism of the American Revolution drafted by aristocratic men (many of them enslavers) who feared the "tyranny of the masses" if the Revolutionary rhetoric on rights continued unabated.

Ceetar Jun 24 2022 11:19 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

[TWEET]https://twitter.com/FarnoushAmiri/status/1540370901803433984[/TWEET] don't worry, democrats are on it.

Willets Point Jun 24 2022 11:23 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

How can they be so out of touch?

batmagadanleadoff Jun 24 2022 11:25 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

They should be going about as if their hair was on fire.

batmagadanleadoff Jun 24 2022 11:30 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Willets Point wrote: The Constitution, for good and for ill, was rooted in a reactionary movement to the radicalism of the American Revolution drafted by aristocratic men (many of them enslavers) who feared the "tyranny of the masses" if the Revolutionary rhetoric on rights continued unabated. Also, the framers believed that the Constitution should be amended, maybe even radically so, every 20 or 30 years. They understood that they couldnt possibly anticipate the changes to the culture, technology, etc. that the future would bring. Unfortunately they wrote the Constitution practically in cement. Ours is probably the most difficult Constitution to change in all of the modern industrialized world.

Willets Point Jun 24 2022 11:32 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Well, some of them did. A lot more disagreement and dare I say "polarization" back in the 1780s-1790s than our national myths are willing to admit.

Ceetar Jun 24 2022 11:36 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

constitution or not, this isn't really about that. It's about authoritarians consolidating power. citing a god, to the constitution, to states rights, to 'science' or whatever the propaganda of the day is just the packaging around controlling the populace and entrenching the power of the fascists in power.

batmagadanleadoff Jun 24 2022 11:52 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

=Ceetar post_id=97203 time=1656092161 user_id=102] citing a god, to the constitution .....

If God came up with the Electoral College, I'm unimpressed. This really undermines the idea that there's a God in the first place.

Ceetar Jun 24 2022 12:04 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

A sadistic measure, rooted in slavery, that supports the ruling class? Nah, that's on par for the christian god at least.

batmagadanleadoff Jun 24 2022 12:06 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

constitution or not, this isn't really about that. It's about authoritarians consolidating power. citing a god, to the constitution, to states rights, to 'science' or whatever the propaganda of the day is just the packaging around controlling the populace and entrenching the power of the fascists in power. How the fuck do you reason with people who, when you have them backed against the wall with all of the iron-clad logic in the world, and science, and math and reason, pull out their fucking bibles and tell you: "but the bible says this." How the fuck do you argue with that?

Centerfield Jun 24 2022 12:09 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Democracy only lasted as long as it did because there used to be some form of accountability. With partisan news and social media, it's gone. We're fucked until truth matters again.

kcmets Jun 24 2022 12:21 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

=Centerfield post_id=97208 time=1656094160 user_id=65] Democracy only lasted as long as it did because there used to be some form of accountability. With partisan news and social media, it's gone. We're fucked until truth matters again.

Pretty much. Word for word.

Ceetar Jun 24 2022 12:39 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

truth never mattered, but thanks to things like social media, we're much more aware of what's going on.

batmagadanleadoff Jun 24 2022 02:14 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

=batmagadanleadoff post_id=97191 time=1656088899 user_id=68] =MFS62 post_id=97190 time=1656088460 user_id=60] During their confirmation hearings, didn't Kavanaugh and Barrett (and maybe Gorsuch) state under oath that they felt Roe-v-Wade was settled precedent? If so, aren't they guilty of perjury? And I don't think the statute of limitations has run out on that yet. There is no appeal on this ruling, but they have to be stopped on further impinging on our rights.

Their comments aren't actionable. First of all, technically they weren't lying. At the time of their comments, Roe was established precedent. They should've been asked if they thought Roe was decided correctly or asked how they'd vote if they had to decide Roe. Nobody asked those questions. Still, if their decisions today were ever made into the subject of hearings or investigations, as farfetched as that would be, they'd, among other things, be allowed to say that since their confirmation hearings, they changed their minds.




Of course, they were misleading their Democratic questioners. They knew damn well they'd overrule Roe if given the chance. Coney Barett, straight from The Handmaid's Tale, practically had that tattooed on her fucking forehead. But Roe was precedent on the day they were questioned. That doesn't prevent a case from being overruled. Otherwise, we'd be forever stuck with bad decisions, or anachronistic decisions, or decisions that had gone stale over time. This notion of stare decisis is not so simple. On the one hand, we want stability in our laws. But we'd also like to overrule decisions that are bad or that might've once made sense but no longer do.

Lefty Specialist Jun 24 2022 02:36 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Yeah, they knew exactly where they stood. To say oytherwise is just lying. The first thing that has to be done is get a few more Democratic senators and hold the house. Then nuke the filibuster. Next on the agenda is outlawing same-sex marriage and contraception. Thomas came right out today and said those cases were wrongly decided, so they're just warming up.

Ceetar Jun 24 2022 02:41 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Nuking the filibuster, expanding the court (or the senate), even codifying abortion rights... there are few candidates vowing to do this, and the democrats as a 'unit', or their leadership, certainly aren't.

Lefty Specialist Jun 24 2022 02:43 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Also important: making DC a state. Currently their pro-choice laws could be wiped out by a Republican Congress.

whippoorwill Jun 24 2022 02:47 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

My husband texted me at work. I can't believe they had the balls to do this. What will they do next? This court has really overstepped themselves and what can we do? I saw contraceptives mentioned in a post above. Good god. And if they were to outlaw same sex marriage would that mean our same sex married friends become outlaws? All these things that seemed unthinkable are now possible. What a country.

Ceetar Jun 24 2022 02:57 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

yes, probably in Texas for instance. Having a no longer valid marriage license is a good public record for them to go after people for sodomy laws, for illegal tax filing laws, etc. Spouses may lose healthcare, etc.

batmagadanleadoff Jun 24 2022 03:06 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

=Ceetar post_id=97222 time=1656103310 user_id=102] Nuking the filibuster, expanding the court (or the senate) ....

They can expand the Senate by bringing in new states to the US. Each state gets two senators. And that should be an extreme Dem priority, about as practically high up on their list as possible. But nary a word about this tactic from the meek party. The only other way to expand the Senate, and it's not gonna happen this other way without a violent and bloody revolution, is to amend the Constitution to change the way the Senate is comprised. Ideally, representation in the Senate would be proportional to each state's population, the same way the House of Representative is made up.

batmagadanleadoff Jun 24 2022 03:24 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Good ol' Charley sums it up in one paragraph. 'If This Doesn't Light a Fire Under Our Base's Ass, I Don't Know What Will' Rep. Jim McGovern reacts to the Supreme Court's decision overturning Roe v. Wade. Excerpt (last paragraph): “Win elections,” Jim McGovern said. “If this doesn't light a fire under our base's ass, I don't know what will.” He went back into the Capitol and voted for the gun bill, which is even money to be ruled unconstitutional if it ever gets judged across the street. https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a40410841/supreme-court-roe-v-wade-jim-mcgovern/

Lefty Specialist Jun 24 2022 03:44 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

=batmagadanleadoff post_id=97228 time=1656104806 user_id=68] =Ceetar post_id=97222 time=1656103310 user_id=102] Nuking the filibuster, expanding the court (or the senate) ....

They can expand the Senate by bringing in new states to the US. Each state gets two senators. And that should be an extreme Dem priority, about as practically high up on their list as possible. But nary a word about this tactic from the meek party. The only other way to expand the Senate, and it's not gonna happen this other way without a violent and bloody revolution, is to amend the Constitution to change the way the Senate is comprised. Ideally, representation in the Senate would be proportional to each state's population, the same way the House of Representative is made up.


Every Democrat needs to be running on getting rid of the filibuster. Everything else follows from that- expanding the court, codifying Roe, DC statehood. You need to hold every Senate seat and flip PA, WI and NC. Doable, but not easy. Holding the House got a little easier this week, too.

batmagadanleadoff Jun 24 2022 03:50 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Lefty Specialist wrote: =batmagadanleadoff post_id=97228 time=1656104806 user_id=68] =Ceetar post_id=97222 time=1656103310 user_id=102] Nuking the filibuster, expanding the court (or the senate) .... They can expand the Senate by bringing in new states to the US. Each state gets two senators. And that should be an extreme Dem priority, about as practically high up on their list as possible. But nary a word about this tactic from the meek party. The only other way to expand the Senate, and it's not gonna happen this other way without a violent and bloody revolution, is to amend the Constitution to change the way the Senate is comprised. Ideally, representation in the Senate would be proportional to each state's population, the same way the House of Representative is made up.

Every Democrat needs to be running on getting rid of the filibuster. Everything else follows from that- expanding the court, codifying Roe, DC statehood. You need to hold every Senate seat and flip PA, WI and NC. Doable, but not easy. Holding the House got a little easier this week, too.


Yeah, that filibuster is a real logjam. But if the Dems conquer that, the floodgates open.

Johnny Lunchbucket Jun 24 2022 05:53 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

=Ceetar post_id=97210 time=1656095964 user_id=102] truth never mattered, but thanks to things like social media, we're much more aware of what's going on.

Gah. Were it not for social media becoming weaponized by bad actors McConnells bullshit never has a chance to happen

Ceetar Jun 24 2022 09:47 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

he would've just done it, and the media would've covered it as they did, both sidesing it. Moscow Mitch didn't do anything with social media, he merely refused to do his job and run the senate, and as a result bills didn't get passed, justices didn't get approved. That was all regardless of social media. As was the Times and all the rest of the 'regular' media doing the "BUT HER EMAILS" thing with zero journalistic integrity the days before the election. You can keep going back. Maybe if we'd had social media like now in 2004, the backlash to war crimes would've been LOUD instead of being mostly ignored by a media happy to allow Bush war crimes his way to reelection, when a failure like 9/11 happening on your watch should barely have let him finish his initial stolen term. (A failure, btw, that may have been aided by Steve Cohen's buddy lawyer that he got to whitewash the Mets front office last year) No, social media isn't making everything more hyper partisan, it's making it harder to ignore the marginalized.

Willets Point Jun 25 2022 10:14 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Anyone not calling for ending the filibuster, expanding the Court, and then passing a raft of legislation to codify rights covering everything from abortion to voting is telling you that they personally feel that they would be ok under full fascist rule.

batmagadanleadoff Jun 25 2022 10:57 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Wanna know when the filibuster gets eliminated? When the GOP sweeps back into power. How. else is the GOP gonna pass a nation-wide abortion ban? Then they can also kill Obamacare without having to go through the reconciliation process. And maybe, just maybe, then the Dems'll get off of their fucking asses. When it's too late by like 100 miles. At least we're finally getting sensible discussions on the cable news shows. At least the Dem pundits, some of them anyways, are understanding that priority A-1 is to expand the Supreme Court. History is not gonna be kind to Manchin and Sinema.

TransMonk Jun 25 2022 04:00 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Biden still does not agree with court expansion or changing filibuster per Tweets today. I don't give him as much blame as most for the state of the country right now, but he is grossly out of touch with how boxed in his party is right now.

batmagadanleadoff Jun 25 2022 04:36 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

=TransMonk post_id=97356 time=1656194400 user_id=71] Biden still does not agree with court expansion or changing filibuster per Tweets today.

What then, would the Dem plan be, if killing the filibuster and then expanding the Supreme Court are both off the table? Is Biden hoping to get a 60 seat Senate majority this November? And even then, if killing the filibuster is off the table, then Biden's gonna need at least 62 senators because Manchin and Sinema. And then what? Pass filibuster proof Dem legislation that some lower court wackadoo wingnut judge is gonna stay anyways? And then the Supremes won't lift the stay while that law and the challenge to it makes its way up the chain where, in the end, this Trump court will destroy it? Is that the plan?

TransMonk Jun 25 2022 04:58 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

I think the current Dem blueprint is to build a time machine and go back to 2014. It has about the same chance of succeeding as any of their current plans.

batmagadanleadoff Jun 25 2022 09:00 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

=TransMonk post_id=97369 time=1656197904 user_id=71] I think the current Dem blueprint is to build a time machine and go back to 2014.

lol. I guess if killing the filibuster and expanding the court are off the table, the Dems are gonna hope for bipartisan support, which has no chance as far as a voting rights bill is concerned. And it'd be too late for 2022 anyways, even if they miraculously passed one soon. The courts would, at the very least, issue a stay for the midterms on grounds that you can't apply new voting laws so close to the actual election. It's unlikely that Dems would get any bipartisan support for a voting rights bill, even for 2023 or 2024. And if they did, again, SCOTUS would kill it. That court abhors voting rights, the suppression of which, is a keystone of the GOP platform anyways.



There's really no way around the issue. Reform the courts by whatever means necessary, even it means busting norms, or suffer grave consequences. The GOP intends to repeal the entire 20th century.

MFS62 Jun 26 2022 05:48 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Well, at least she's honest about it. U.S. Rep. Mary Miller of Illinois, speaking at a rally Saturday night with former President Donald Trump, called the Supreme Court's decision overturning Roe v. Wade a “victory for white life.” https://thehill.com/homenews/ap/ap-politics/rep-mary-miller-calls-roe-decision-victory-for-white-life/

MFS62 Jul 01 2022 08:48 AM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

I'm proud to live in Connecticut. Connecticut was already viewed as a leader on abortion rights, but two new laws on the books, effective today, will expand the types of medical providers who can provide aspiration abortions, the most common type of in-clinic abortions, and provide a legal safe harbor to providers and patients against lawsuits from anti-abortion states. Later

MFS62 Jul 11 2022 12:18 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

This should bee an interesting court test to see if Texas believes what it says: https://www.today.com/parents/moms/pregnant-texas-woman-unborn-child-second-passenger-rcna37461 A woman, driving in an HOV lane, was given a ticket for driving alone. She says her unborn baby is a "person" according to Texas law. The case goes to court shortly. Stay tuned. Later

Ceetar Jul 11 2022 12:41 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

hopefully someone makes sure she appeals this (though can you appeal traffic court?) all the way up. Obviously the supreme court will just strike it down because they have no morals, but.. I dunno, is there a but? or is it just tilting at windmills at this point?

batmagadanleadoff Jul 11 2022 01:56 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

hopefully someone makes sure she appeals this (though can you appeal traffic court?) all the way up. Obviously the supreme court will just strike it down because they have no morals, but.. I dunno, is there a but? or is it just tilting at windmills at this point? It's a dangerous case. What went unsaid in the article MFS62 linked to was the whole "fetus as a person" idea. The wingnuts are pushing to treat fetuses and even embryos as persons. For now, only those living outside of the womb are "persons". The wingnuts want fertilized eggs to enjoy the same constitutional rights as us. It's also a major step to criminalizing abortions and pre-empting a Dem controlled Congress from ever passing an abortion rights bill. If fetuses are persons with constitutional rights, abortion bills would be unconstitutional insofar as they would undermine the constitutional rights of fetuses and embryos.

Ceetar Jul 11 2022 02:13 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

sure, definitely. It seems like hypocrisy on the surface, but it's not because Texas is arguing that women are lesser citizens. criminalizing abortion is just another way to achieve that christofacist agenda of women as breeders and only breeders. But part of danger is that democrats can and will treat the ruling as "aw well, guess that clump of cells is case law now, we're gonna have to give up pretending to pass abortion rights, sorry" You could easily write something that defends "preborn" as a proto-person (but not, in fact a person) that get's some measure of support, And by that I mean, the mother gets support for being pregnant. Give them that tax deduction, that stipend, that HoV lane pass, but still biologically under the purview of the mother.

Lefty Specialist Jul 21 2022 02:01 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

Holy Crap 2.0, 195 House Republicans don't think Americans should have access to contraceptives. VOTE. THEM. ALL. OUT. https://images.dailykos.com/images/1093907/story_image/birthcontrol.jpg?1658424040>

seawolf17 Jul 21 2022 06:51 PM Re: Holy Crap, They Actually Did It

It's unbelievable. Over and over.