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Totally Gross

Johnny Lunchbucket Nov 18 2023 11:44 AM

Mets hiring Kris Gross to head up amateur scouting. Was with the Astros

metirish Nov 18 2023 12:26 PM Re: Totally Gross

I don't like it

Edgy MD Nov 18 2023 01:20 PM Re: Totally Gross

He's the guy, I believe, who had to steward the Astros scouting and drafting philosophy through years of sanctions.

MFS62 Nov 18 2023 01:33 PM Re: Totally Gross

MLB Pipeline's mid season (after the trade deadline)rankings had the Astros minor league system at 30th with no top 100 prospects. They ranked the Mets 11th, with 5 top 100 prospects. I understand the rankings factor in development once a player is drafted. But despite restrictions on the number of picks he had based on sanctions, that ranking should reflect on the job Gross did scouting those players they did draft, shouldn't it? Later

Frayed Knot Nov 18 2023 02:04 PM Re: Totally Gross

Prospect rankings are merely a snapshot in time. The purpose of a farm system is to feed the ML team (through development, call-ups, or trades) so I'd put a bit more emphasis on seven straight trips to the ALCS including two WS wins than I would on one particular post trading deadline list.

Edgy MD Nov 18 2023 03:06 PM Re: Totally Gross

Word to your vicar.

MFS62 Nov 18 2023 05:43 PM Re: Totally Gross

Player development, promotion and trades that contributed to those winning years were done by other people/groups. Just because you're going to a good hospital, it doesn't mean your doctor is the best in his specialty. I'm curious how many of his draftees/ signees have contributed to those winning years before I say he was a good hire. His job was to run the organization that scouts and signs the talent that goes into the pipeline. He was at his job for years and IMO there should have been at least a few of the good players he scouted still in their minor league system at any point in time. His job here is to find talent. Let's see how well he does it here before we say if it as a good or bad hire. Later

Frayed Knot Nov 18 2023 07:46 PM Re: Totally Gross Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 19 2023 04:13 AM

I'm not saying it's either a bad or a good hire. I never heard of the guy until this very thread and I doubt you have either. What I'm arguing against is the idea of writing him off as a failure based on a momentary snapshot in time ranking as if the purpose of drafting/development is to land high on a list as opposed to contributing to the success of the ML club. It may also be worth considering that, following a string of 90 to 107 win seasons, that just maybe he hasn't been working with the highest of draft picks during his tenure.

MFS62 Nov 18 2023 08:02 PM Re: Totally Gross

A valid point. Later

Edgy MD Nov 18 2023 08:33 PM Re: Totally Gross

=MFS62 post_id=141375 time=1700354634 user_id=60]I'm curious how many of his draftees/ signees have contributed to those winning years before I say he was a good hire.

Since Gross joined the Houston system, they have produced more players (58) via the draft than any other MLB organization.


=MFS62 post_id=141375 time=1700354634 user_id=60]He was at his job for years and IMO there should have been at least a few of the good players he scouted still in their minor league system at any point in time.

Based on the data of the moment anyhow. And one moment doesn't have a definitive amount of meaning in time. And I'd hasten to add that MLB.com rankings aren't the definitive or even the most scientific snapshot.



If one team has a 22-year-old centerfielder in the minors pumping up the organizational profile and another has a 20-year-old playing center in the majors and winning games, it's the first team that wins the prospect rating game. It's the second that actually best did their job scouting and developing.



Based on the data of the moment.

batmagadanleadoff Nov 18 2023 08:50 PM Re: Totally Gross

Frayed Knot wrote: It may also be worth considering that, following a string of 90 to 107 win seasons, that just maybe he hasn't been working with the highest of draft picks during his tenure. Also, the Astros forfeited their first and second round draft picks in two consecutive drafts as part of the punishment for their role in the sign-stealing cheating scandal.

MFS62 Nov 19 2023 07:46 AM Re: Totally Gross

Edgy MD wrote: Since Gross joined the Houston system, they have produced more players (58) via the draft than any other MLB organization. That's the number I was looking for. I'm convinced. I'm much more confident in his signing and I hope he does that well or the Mets. Based on the data of the moment anyhow. I got it. Based on the data of the moment. I got it. If one team has a 22-year-old centerfielder in the minors pumping up the organizational profile and another has a 20-year-old playing center in the majors and winning games, it's the first team that wins the prospect rating game. It's the second that actually best did their job scouting and developing. I hope he brings us some of those. Later

Edgy MD Nov 20 2023 10:52 AM Re: Totally Gross

Understood. I didn't mean to double down. I just wanted to fill in the data and added more context than was necessary by the time of my post.

Centerfield Nov 20 2023 11:57 AM Re: Totally Gross

Saw this floating around. https://preview.redd.it/from-the-last-10-years-these-are-the-of-each-mlb-teams-v0-72euu6rhambb1.jpg?width=1080&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=5d4d0575c3e3e75aa4a68dd0bd66e37f3696ab35> I don't know how long Gross has been running the show, but if he's had the reigns for a while, it suggests he's done a good job.

Benjamin Grimm Nov 20 2023 12:03 PM Re: Totally Gross

What years are covered by this chart? Did it say?

Centerfield Nov 20 2023 12:40 PM Re: Totally Gross

Sorry. It says 10 years.

Lefty Specialist Nov 20 2023 01:20 PM Re: Totally Gross

Is he handy with a trash can?

The Hot Corner Nov 23 2023 11:04 AM Re: Totally Gross

Well, it would be hard for him not to improve on the Mets dismal draft record of late. I guess that is why the so many of the Mets top prospects are the ones the team traded for before the trade deadline this season.

Edgy MD Nov 23 2023 01:31 PM Re: Totally Gross

Has it been dismal? I'm not sure I know. I guess it's largely dependent on how we define "of late."

batmagadanleadoff Nov 23 2023 04:53 PM Re: Totally Gross

https://preview.redd.it/from-the-last-10-years-these-are-the-of-each-mlb-teams-v0-72euu6rhambb1.jpg?width=1080&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=5d4d0575c3e3e75aa4a68dd0bd66e37f3696ab35> The Hot Corner wrote: Well, it would be hard for him not to improve on the Mets dismal draft record of late. I guess that is why the so many of the Mets top prospects are the ones the team traded for before the trade deadline this season. Edgy MD wrote: Has it been dismal? I'm not sure I know. I guess it's largely dependent on how we define "of late." I think he's defining "of late" as consisting of a team's last 328 draft picks and "draft record" as the percentage of a team's draft picks that made it to the majors. Of late. And "dismal" means dismal.

Edgy MD Nov 23 2023 05:10 PM Re: Totally Gross

Fair enough. I'm not sure it's the most nuanced way to measure the question, but it is certainly meaningful.

batmagadanleadoff Nov 24 2023 02:29 PM Re: Totally Gross

Edgy MD wrote: Fair enough. I'm not sure it's the most nuanced way to measure the question .... Me neither. But it is what it is.