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IGT - 5/16 - Mets vs. Cards - NLCS Preview

Centerfield May 16 2006 06:05 PM

My first IGT of the year...might as well give it a shot right? (If this was supposed to be started by someone else, feel free to delete this one) I realize I'm tempting the fates with this "NLCS Preview" business, but I realized that after Lima's first start in that Braves game, I've been resorting to lucky positions on the volume dial, sitting in certain ways, trying to help the Mets win. In other words, the more superstitious I've been, the more they lose. So, in an attempt to help the Mets win, I've decided to be less superstitious. Glavine, 2 hits, 0 ER over 7 tonight. Mets win going away.

KC May 16 2006 06:09 PM Edited 2 time(s), most recently on May 16 2006 06:11 PM

METS Reyes SS Lo Duca C Beltran C Delgado 1B Wright 3B Floyd LF Nady RF Matsui 2B Glavine P =red]CARDS Eckstein SS Taguchi LF Pujols 1B Rolen 3B Encarnacion RF Edmonds CF Bennett C Luna 2B Suppan P

Edgy DC May 16 2006 06:10 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 16 2006 06:15 PM

Cliff Floyd back in the sixth hole. My early pick for PotG.

Bret Sabermetric May 16 2006 06:15 PM

Usually, don't you expect some glove from batters in the 7 and 8 (w)holes? If you're not putting Nady and Matsui for their offense, why are they in the lineup?

GYC May 16 2006 06:24 PM

Bret Sabermetric wrote: Usually, don't you expect some glove from batters in the 7 and 8 (w)holes? If you're not putting Nady and Matsui for their offense, why are they in the lineup? Who would you put there, oh almighty and knowledgable one?

Bret Sabermetric May 16 2006 06:36 PM

GYC wrote: ="Bret Sabermetric"]Usually, don't you expect some glove from batters in the 7 and 8 (w)holes? If you're not putting Nady and Matsui for their offense, why are they in the lineup? Who would you put there, oh almighty and knowledgable one? Me? I'd have Mike Cameron batting 7th and in RF, and Marco Scutaro or Danny Garcia batting 8th and at 2b. Oh, wait, you prefer the other answer: [thumb up nostril] I dunno, I just make stupid criticisms of whatever the Mets are doing. The point is that when your 7th and 8th guys can't field well, you damn well better be smacking the living piss out of the ball. OE: Or maybe I'd be thinking about moving Reyes down to the tail end for a while. And actually I probably wouldn;t have Cameron, either, since I would have traded him last June when he was fetching someone (a pitcher?)way better than Nady. I might have Diaz leading off in RF, and using Cameron's and Matsui's salary to get some much needed pitching.

GYC May 16 2006 06:43 PM

Bret Sabermetric wrote: ="GYC"] Bret Sabermetric wrote: Usually, don't you expect some glove from batters in the 7 and 8 (w)holes? If you're not putting Nady and Matsui for their offense, why are they in the lineup? Who would you put there, oh almighty and knowledgable one? Me? I'd have Mike Cameron batting 7th and in RF, and Marco Scutaro or Danny Garcia batting 8th and at 2b. Oh, wait, you prefer the other answer: [thumb up nostril] I dunno, I just make stupid criticisms of whatever the Mets are doing. The point is that when your 7th and 8th guys can't field well, you damn well better be smacking the living piss out of the ball. Why Danny Garcia? If he had any talent, he wouldn't be hitting .248 for the Columbus Clippers, and Scutaro wouldn't be hitting .173 as a backup in Oakland. Matsui's defense has actually been pretty good this year. With the exception of maybe 2 or 3 plays, he has been rather impressive (considering what we have come to expect from him). His defense has helped the Mets this year more than it has hurt. Nady wasn't moved down because of his poor hitting, and you know it. He was moved down so Floyd can get hot or something since he has been so bad. More of a confidence booster for Floyd rather than an insult to Nady.

Bret Sabermetric May 16 2006 06:50 PM

GYC wrote: Nady wasn't moved down because of his poor hitting, and you know it. . You'd be amazed by what I know and don;t know. What's Garcia's OBP at Columbus? I'll bet it's higher than Matsui's. What's Garcia getting paid?

Zvon May 16 2006 07:34 PM

Bret Sabermetric wrote: Usually, don't you expect some glove from batters in the 7 and 8 (w)holes? If you're not putting Nady and Matsui for their offense, why are they in the lineup? Thats a rediculous post Bret. Its Bret bait. ;) Okay-game dont start till eight.. Ill take the bait. Because thats our starting nine at this point in time. Should we move our best glovemen down in the order? Yea, lets bat Beltran 7th cuz of that fine glove of his. A line up is a purely offensive stratigical thing where you work in your strengths and weaknesses where they can best be in a position to help the team produce, and you use the balance of talent, such as bat as opposed to glove, in a way that makes that gloveman hurt you the least at the plate, so he can help you the most in the field. Thats not the case here. (the days of carrying a glove man in the everyday lineup may be a thing of the past. These days-they are late inning replacements) You may have a point about Nady being so low, but as stated here....where do we put him? If Floyd dont snap out of his funk, in front of him, I suppose. But Cliffs 1st game back after his lil vacation, he should be given that 6th slot. If I was running the show the lineup would be different, but Willie has already proved me wrong with what he's gotten out of LoDuca in the 2nd slot. So good thing Im not. Id be more like: Reyes SS Beltran C Wright 3B Delgado 1B Nady RF Floyd LF Lo Duca C Matsui 2B Pitcher P ...and Reyes on a short leash at this point. I think Id shuffle him afew times just to get him on his toes in the lead off spot. Dare I say with Matsui? With Floyds current performance I, as Willie is, would be trying this and that and wondering what the hell else I could do to get him hitting. Cause you just dont give up on him this soon. I cant complain with what Willie has done. LoDuca has been awsum in the 2nd slot and has been a catylist for many productive innings. Im not nearly as concerned about our lineup or offense as I am about our pitching.

Bret Sabermetric May 16 2006 07:44 PM

Garcia has walked 12 times and gotten 25 hits in 101 ABs so far. No note of HBPs but you got to think he has a few by now, so his OBP is around .333 or higher. Just one of the many 2b men who could perform at Matsui's level of ability whom the Mets have unceremoniously dumped. Of course, Zvon, there's not much room to shift these batters around. I'm mostly questioning the wisdom of having players whose bats you assess as less than stellar and whose gloves you try to hide. If Matsui can't bat higher than 8th (and he really shouldn't) and your lousy-fielding RFer can't bat higher than 7th, and your LFer is in a season-long cold spell, and your leadoff man can't get on base adequately, you've got problems.

GYC May 16 2006 07:51 PM

Saying a 26 year old struggling in AA is just as good as Matsui is just plain ignorant.

Zvon May 16 2006 07:52 PM

Bret Sabermetric wrote: Of course, Zvon, there's not much room to shift these batters around. I'm mostly questioning the wisdom of having players whose bats you assess as less than stellar and whose gloves you try to hide. If Matsui can't bat higher than 8th (and he really shouldn't) and your lousy-fielding RFer can't bat higher than 7th, and your LFer is in a season-long cold spell, and your leadoff man can't get on base adequately, you've got problems. With Nadys timely hitting, these are problems I can deal with. I give Cliff every chance to come around, at this point. Matsui's another ball O'wax, but he has shown enough improvement in the field to give his bat the chance we are giving him. He has shown some offensive output, though not in a timely (or clutch) manner. These are not the problems that concern me.

Bret Sabermetric May 16 2006 07:55 PM

GYC wrote: Saying a 26 year old struggling in AA is just as good as Matsui is just plain ignorant. I don't know if Matsui's your best example of a ballplayer who's not struggling, but I'm pretty sure that calling Columbus a Double-A team is fairly ignorant.

Gwreck May 16 2006 07:59 PM

Bret Sabermetric wrote: and using Cameron's and Matsui's salary to get some much needed pitching. How would you have dumped Matsui's salary? What pitcher(s) would you have if you didn't have to pay Matsui?

GYC May 16 2006 08:01 PM

Bret Sabermetric wrote: ="GYC"]Saying a 26 year old struggling in AA is just as good as Matsui is just plain ignorant. I don't know if Matsui's your best example of a ballplayer who's not struggling, but I'm pretty sure that calling Columbus a Double-A team is fairly ignorant. ...fair enough. I'd still take Matsui, or Hernandez, or Keppinger, over Garcia.

Willets Point May 16 2006 08:09 PM

There's this kind of warm yellowish glow in St. Louis. Kind of reminds me of the effect this thing called the sun is supposed to have. I wish I knew what the sun was like, I seem to remember it from my past but can't be sure that's its not just a myth.

Zvon May 16 2006 08:13 PM

Reyes must now teach the Cards that.... (wait for it...) errors kill.

Zvon May 16 2006 08:14 PM

OMG--Reyes gets picked off.

Zvon May 16 2006 08:18 PM

Beltran LOOKS at a third strike-----poo.

GYC May 16 2006 08:21 PM

Eckstein is a little bitch.

Zvon May 16 2006 08:21 PM

Glavine hits the Cards lead off man. .....dont get tossed LoDuca....... (a Ryan Howard RBI single in the 1st has the Phils up 1-0, vs the Brewers)

Zvon May 16 2006 08:29 PM

Everytime Pujols come up Im gonna close my eyes. ] Alomar:"Mind if we clone your bat Al?" Pujols: "You can have my bats. I can hit with any stick." Pujols dribbles out. Eck to second. Pujols may have been hurt by that foul--that would be a real shame, huh?

GYC May 16 2006 08:29 PM

He goes to the locker room injured - put him on the 3 day DL

TransMonk May 16 2006 08:29 PM

GYC wrote: Eckstein is a little bitch. I bet if Glavine throws at his head next time he'll get out of the way.

Zvon May 16 2006 08:32 PM

Glavine gets out of it. Nice. (Brews have tied it 1-1 in the 1st - i DO NOT wanna share 1st place with the darn Phils)

Zvon May 16 2006 08:33 PM

(...not even for a day)

Zvon May 16 2006 08:41 PM

Floyd gets the Mets 1st hit- a 2 out double in the 2nd. Nice. Nady---bring him home.

Zvon May 16 2006 08:43 PM

Nady LOOKS at a third strike.

Willets Point May 16 2006 08:43 PM

Bugger.

Willets Point May 16 2006 08:46 PM

The section of seats at Busch Stadium just behind home plate is so small it looks like a jury box.

GYC May 16 2006 08:49 PM

What was the problem with Matsui's defense this year again?

Willets Point May 16 2006 08:49 PM

Deeee-Peeeeeeee!

Zvon May 16 2006 08:51 PM

Nice lil play by Matsui. Or maybe we should thank Edmunds. Line out double play.

GYC May 16 2006 08:54 PM

Glavine draws a respect. Fear teh bat.

Zvon May 16 2006 08:54 PM

Im sure this dont belong in this thread, but this is where im hangin my hat tonight, so- ]May 16, 2006 CBS SportsLine.com wire reports ST. LOUIS -- Instead of rushing rookie Brian Bannister back from the 15-day disabled list, the New York Mets will give Jose Lima another start on Thursday. Manager Willie Randolph said Tuesday that Bannister, 2-0 with a 2.89 ERA, would throw on the side on Thursday and then likely will make one rehab start for Triple-A Norfolk during the weekend before returning to the rotation. Bannister has been on the disabled list since April 28 with a strained right hamstring. Randolph said it would be a sign of "panic" to use Bannister on Thursday.

Zvon May 16 2006 08:55 PM

REYES!!!!!!!!!!!

GYC May 16 2006 08:55 PM

Damnit... Reyes with a 2-run homer...

Willets Point May 16 2006 08:55 PM

How 'bout having Bannister ready in the pen for when Lima implodes. Kaboom for Jose!

ScarletKnight41 May 16 2006 08:56 PM

Reyes with a 2-Run Ka-Boom!

OlerudOwned May 16 2006 08:56 PM

Reyes homers and ensures two more weeks of flyouts. 2-0 Mets

Hillbilly May 16 2006 08:56 PM

Reyes go does deep! 2-0 Mets. That'll help the old on base %.

Rockin' Doc May 16 2006 08:57 PM

The thought of using Lima makes me panic. Nice HR by Reyes.

Zvon May 16 2006 08:57 PM

Willets Point wrote: How 'bout having Bannister ready in the pen for when Lima implodes. Not a bad idea. But Willie seems very concerned about others perceptions. That might make him look pre-panicky.

Willets Point May 16 2006 09:01 PM

You've been mooned, cha-cha.

Rockin' Doc May 16 2006 09:07 PM

I'm all for not rushing Bannister to help prevent reinjuring his hamstring, but if he can pitch in Norfolk, why is it any worse for him to pitch in St. Louis. I'd rather start him and put him on a pitch count if they're concerned of pushing him. Then if you have to pull him early, you can use Oliver or freakin' Lima as a bridge for an inning or two to get to Heilman/Sanchez/Wagner. If Willie's worried about perception why is he going to run Lima out there again. If starting Lima is a sign of panic, then using Lima is a sign of desperation.

Zvon May 16 2006 09:09 PM

Well, at least Delgado is swingin at that third strike. (Brew crew takes the lead over the Phils, 2-1)

Zvon May 16 2006 09:12 PM

Rockin' Doc wrote: I'm all for not rushing Bannister to help prevent reinjuring his hamstring, but if he can pitch in Norfolk, why is it any worse for him to pitch in St. Louis. I'd rather start him and put him on a pitch count if they're concerned of pushing him. Then if you have to pull him early, you can use Oliver or freakin' Lima as a bridge for an inning or two to get to Heilman/Sanchez/Wagner. If Willie's worried about perception why is he going to run Lima out there again. If starting Lima is a sign of panic, then using Lima is a sign of desperation. lol. Im really surprized that Bannister has been shelved this long. I know it looked bad when it happened, but still...... You have a good point there.

Zvon May 16 2006 09:17 PM

Nady comes thru with an RBI single. Nice.

GYC May 16 2006 09:17 PM

Nady gets an RBI with a RISP. Holy shit.

ScarletKnight41 May 16 2006 09:17 PM

X-Man drives in Mr. Wright :)

Hillbilly May 16 2006 09:18 PM

Nady with the big 2-out RBI

Willets Point May 16 2006 09:18 PM

2-out run-scoring hits make me happy.

Zvon May 16 2006 09:24 PM

] Alomar:"Mind if we clone your bat Al?" Pujols: "You can have my bats. I can hit with my bare hands." But not tonight, Al. Pops out. So far, so good.

metirish May 16 2006 09:24 PM

I guess Nady drove in a run huh?

Hillbilly May 16 2006 09:27 PM

With a runner in scoring position and with 2 outs!

Zvon May 16 2006 09:27 PM

metirish wrote: I guess Nady drove in a run huh? ....someone must have mentioned it. ;)

Zvon May 16 2006 09:30 PM

BIG K for Glavine. His 1st of the night- good timing.

Hillbilly May 16 2006 09:35 PM

Nice Card D. sends the Mets down in order.

Edgy DC May 16 2006 09:40 PM

This Cardinal broadcaster is amazing. He's a museum piece. I thiink he's been drunk on the air for 20 years.

GYC May 16 2006 09:41 PM

Luna doubles in Bennett. Not looking good for the Big G this inning.

ScarletKnight41 May 16 2006 09:44 PM

Now it's 3-2 after Luna scores on a close play at the plate.

Zvon May 16 2006 09:47 PM

Yea- they're chippin away at Tom. We need more runs. Glavine's pitchin well, but not with the same command Ive seen his last few wins.

Edgy DC May 16 2006 09:48 PM

Some funny minor-league type promotions going on between innings. "Win a pizza"; "Win an eye exam."

Zvon May 16 2006 09:52 PM

Edgy DC wrote: Some funny minor-league type promotions going on between innings. "Win a pizza"; "Win an eye exam." ..and i could use both. :\ Wright with a 2 out single. Be BIG here Cliffy.

Zvon May 16 2006 09:54 PM

A single is good nuff. 1st and 3rd,Nady up. Is Floyd hurt? Is he limpin?

Hillbilly May 16 2006 09:54 PM

Cliff gets his second hit of the night. First and third.

Hillbilly May 16 2006 09:55 PM

No two out RBI this time for Nady. How about a 1-2-3 from Tom?

Zvon May 16 2006 09:56 PM

Nady leaves em. (Phils have tied the Brewers, 2-2, in the 7th)

Willets Point May 16 2006 10:00 PM

Hillbilly wrote: No two out RBI this time for Nady. How about a 1-2-3 from Tom? No such luck.

Willets Point May 16 2006 10:01 PM

Who is this Cardinals announcer who gargles a lot and sounds like a cajun stereotype?

Willets Point May 16 2006 10:01 PM

Pull. Glavine. Now!!!!

Zvon May 16 2006 10:01 PM

The Mets keep Pujols in check so far. Rolen singles. I really hate that bum. Glavine walks Encarnacion. Lets get that pen warm.

Zvon May 16 2006 10:03 PM

Another huge and timely strikeout by Glavine.

Willets Point May 16 2006 10:03 PM

We're doomed.

TransMonk May 16 2006 10:04 PM

="Willets Point"]Who is this Cardinals announcer who gargles a lot and sounds like a cajun stereotype? Mike Shannon

Edgy DC May 16 2006 10:05 PM

That strikeout looked good to me. If you ever get a chance to see Kathleen Madigan, she does 15 minutes of material on Mike Shannon.

ScarletKnight41 May 16 2006 10:05 PM

Crap - tie game after six innings :(

Zvon May 16 2006 10:06 PM

Cards tie it-shit- but we get Encarnacion at third...thats big. Squeltch that rally.

TransMonk May 16 2006 10:06 PM

Crapbuckets...looks like another nailbiting night. 3-3 here, 2-2 in Milwaukee.

Hillbilly May 16 2006 10:08 PM

The rain looks like it might cause a delay. So it may be a long nail biting night.

Edgy DC May 16 2006 10:10 PM

Rally song: Yeah, you got... satin shoes! Yeah, you got... plastic boots! Y'all got... cocaine eyes! Yeah, you got... speed-freak jive! Can't you hear me knockin'?! On your window ? Can't you hear me knockin'?! On your door? Can't you hear me knockin'?! Down your dirty street, yeah? Help me baby Ain't no stranger Help me baby Ain't no stranger Help me baby Ain't no stranger Can't you hear me knockin'?! Ahh, are you safe asleep? Can't you hear me knockin'?! Yeah, down the gas light street, now Can't you hear me knockin'?! Yeah, throw me down the keys Alright now! Hear me ringing Big bell tolls Hear me singing Soft and low I've been begging On my knees I've been kickin' Help me please Hear me prowlin' I'm gonna take you down Hear me growlin' Yeah, I've got flatted feet now, now, now, now Hear me howlin' And all, all around your street now Hear me knockin' And all, all around your town

metirish May 16 2006 10:11 PM

Glavine out Valentin hitting, and he's out as I type....

Hillbilly May 16 2006 10:12 PM

Galvine gone for the pitch hitter that is promtly retired. How about a two out rally to Give Tommy a cahnce for the W.

TransMonk May 16 2006 10:17 PM

Let it rain!!!

Edgy DC May 16 2006 10:17 PM

Rally song effects rule.

Zvon May 16 2006 10:18 PM

YES!!!!!!!! Huge RBI double by LoDuca plates Reyes after the big stolen base. Damn, LoDuca can be clutch, esp when it comes to helping his pitcher stay on the up side of a decision.

Hillbilly May 16 2006 10:18 PM

Reyes the sparkplug and The Duke make my wish come true. How about some thunder from the middle of the lineup to go with the heavier rain?

Rockin' Doc May 16 2006 10:18 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 16 2006 10:18 PM

LoDuca with the double to right and Reyes brings the go ahead run. Lets get some insurance.

metirish May 16 2006 10:18 PM

Glavine back on track.....very cool as rally song works.

Zvon May 16 2006 10:21 PM

(an awsum fielding play by Burrell (of all people) cuts down a Brewer at the plate to keep that game tied. Burrell bare hands a line single on a bounce and hurled it home, a perfect throw. Looks like Hardy of the Brewers was injured in the play at the plate)

Hillbilly May 16 2006 10:22 PM

Have fun Met fan (and those freed from specific cheering interests). I'm leaving the IGT to enjoy the rest of this one in a different location. Night and LGM!

Edgy DC May 16 2006 10:22 PM

Lefty specialist Tyler Johnson on to face Delgado, who is trying to give Duaner Sanchez a pad.

Gwreck May 16 2006 10:23 PM

OOTS: Burrell threw out JJ Hardy at the plate in the bottom of the 8th, still tied in Milwaukee. Bonus baseball in Atlanta, still FLA 2 ATL 2.

Rockin' Doc May 16 2006 10:26 PM

Delgado grounds out to first to end the inning. Mets 4 Cardinals 3 as we go to the seventh inning stretch.

TransMonk May 16 2006 10:27 PM

Long stretch as the tarp comes out.

Gwreck May 16 2006 10:28 PM

Freakin' rain.

Nymr83 May 16 2006 10:28 PM

BULLSHIT. I swear umpires are under orders to make all rain-related decisions to the benefit of the home team.

Willets Point May 16 2006 10:29 PM

So much for sun in St. Louis.

cooby May 16 2006 10:32 PM

Well it is 9:30

Nymr83 May 16 2006 10:33 PM

yay steve somers! rain ain't so bad...

Zvon May 16 2006 10:33 PM

Gwreck wrote: Bonus baseball in Atlanta, still FLA 2 ATL 2. Willis pitched well, but gave up a bomb in the 9th to allow the Braves to tie it. Florida regains the lead 3-2, but Willis wont get a desicion in this one.

Zvon May 16 2006 10:44 PM

Braves come back in their half to beat Florida,.....damn. Phils throw the game away in the 9th with an error and lose 3-2.

Gwreck May 16 2006 10:45 PM

Zvon wrote: Willis pitched well, but gave up a bomb in the 9th to allow the Braves to tie it. Florida regains the lead 3-2, but Willis wont get a desicion in this one. Atlanta comes back to win in bottom of the 11th. Texas scores off Rivera to take the lead against the MFYs in the top of the 9th. Brewers "walk-off" on a throwing error by Phillies pitcher Ryan Franklin.

TransMonk May 16 2006 10:45 PM

Damien Miller pulls it off again. Brew Crew beats Philly in the bottom of the ninth on error by the pitcher. Now Philly knows how we feel.

Zvon May 16 2006 10:54 PM

pics from 2nights game. We couldnt teach the Cards that errors kill (thnx Jose) but we taught em that foul balls hurt.

Zvon May 16 2006 10:56 PM

Reyes makes up for it by teaching em that homers help.

Centerfield May 16 2006 11:12 PM

SNY playing the clincher from '86 again. I think I know this game by heart. McCarver explaining to us what an "oxy-mah-ran" is.

metirish May 16 2006 11:15 PM

CF that is so funny...the way Tim says the word, sounds like it was the first time he ever heard the word oxymoron.

Centerfield May 16 2006 11:21 PM

Radar makes it seem like the rain will end tonight, but I don't know how long they'll wait. It also indicates that the hardest rain is still to come.

Edgy DC May 16 2006 11:23 PM

I don't think I have it in me.

Rockin' Doc May 16 2006 11:29 PM

Looks like this could be a while. I think I'll call it a night.

Centerfield May 16 2006 11:31 PM

I have a good feeling about this Magadan kid. I think he's going to be a star in NY for a long time...win a few batting titles...in a few years, we'll all have forgotten Keith Hernandez. You heard it here first.

Centerfield May 16 2006 11:44 PM

Starting back up at midnight. Anyone else here? Bueller? Bueller?

metirish May 16 2006 11:44 PM

Game back on says Gary, midnight our time....

TransMonk May 16 2006 11:45 PM

I'm riding it out...I've come this far.

Willets Point May 16 2006 11:46 PM

Huzzah!

Zvon May 16 2006 11:51 PM

strike that photo---reverse it.

TransMonk May 17 2006 12:04 AM

Game on! Heilman in to face the Cards in the 7th.

Frayed Knot May 17 2006 12:04 AM

Now all we need is three quick outs ... then another cloud bust!

Willets Point May 17 2006 12:10 AM

Wasn't it an official game already before the rain delay?

TransMonk May 17 2006 12:12 AM

Beautiful barehand grab by Wright to throw out Eckstein. We head to the 8th.

Zvon May 17 2006 12:17 AM

Wright with the lead off double. Lets get some insurance. Id really like Glavine to get the win here tonight.

Zvon May 17 2006 12:18 AM

Floyd takes one for the team. 1st & 2nd. 0 out.

Zvon May 17 2006 12:19 AM

Nady bunts--wow, and errors kill as Luna bobbles it and Wright comes around to score. I like.

Willets Point May 17 2006 12:20 AM

Hey Luna, you're fired!

TransMonk May 17 2006 12:20 AM

Error on Pujols fielding Nady's sac bunt...that's right NADY's sac bunt. Mets up 5-3 no outs in the 8th.

DocTee May 17 2006 12:20 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 17 2006 12:22 AM

Hard for Glavine to get the win when he was lifted after 6. I'm Garry Templeton--charter member of the superfluous letter team-- "if I ain't startin, i ain't departin'"--

TransMonk May 17 2006 12:21 AM

Glavine is still the pitcher of record.

Gwreck May 17 2006 12:22 AM

Matsui bunts 'em over, c'mon Old Man of the Sea!

TransMonk May 17 2006 12:23 AM

There are about 700 drunken fans left at New Busch...they are obnoxious.

Zvon May 17 2006 12:24 AM

DocTee wrote: Hard for Glavine to get the win when he was lifted after 6. Is he not in line for this decision? Old man river provides more insurance with an RBI single. Mets up 6-3

DocTee May 17 2006 12:24 AM

How many drunken posters are left at the CPF??

TransMonk May 17 2006 12:25 AM

I wouldn't mind batting around a couple of times this inning...make those umps wish they had called the game.

Willets Point May 17 2006 12:25 AM

Zvon May 17 2006 12:26 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 17 2006 12:27 AM

wow! Pujols is getting hurt all over the field. He slips on the ondeck circle!

TransMonk May 17 2006 12:26 AM

WOW!!!! He hit hard!!!

Willets Point May 17 2006 12:26 AM

OWWWWWWW! I hope he's okay. On replay I see that at least he didn't hit his head.

Zvon May 17 2006 12:27 AM

Reyes drives one in! 7-3. YEAAAAAAAAAAAAbaby

Rotblatt May 17 2006 12:28 AM

I'm starting to like rain delays . . .

DocTee May 17 2006 12:28 AM

]DocTee wrote: Hard for Glavine to get the win when he was lifted after 6. Is he not in line for this decision? Apparently so-- I stand corrected.

Zvon May 17 2006 12:29 AM

TransMonk wrote: I wouldn't mind batting around a couple of times this inning...make those umps wish they had called the game. HaHaHa--i agree 100%

Zvon May 17 2006 12:33 AM

Beltran keeps it goin with a bloop single. Franco scores-8-3.

Gwreck May 17 2006 12:35 AM

Gonna be Julio time real soon.

Rockin' Doc May 17 2006 12:35 AM

I did some paper work for the office and decided to check in before going to bed. This was worth staying up for. There should be some sweet dreams tonight.

Zvon May 17 2006 12:41 AM

Sanchez comes on and pitches a perfect 8th. Pujols is OH (my ass) for four.

Zvon May 17 2006 12:49 AM

Okay--3 outs 2 go. Julio will get the 9th.

Willets Point May 17 2006 12:52 AM

Here's Julio. What the mama saw was against the law!

Zvon May 17 2006 12:54 AM

..well mama looked down and spit on the ground every time his name is mentioned....... Julio may not last a third of an inning, as the 1st two Cards reach. Oliver and Wagner are up in the pen.

Zvon May 17 2006 12:55 AM

Julio gets an out. YAY!

Zvon May 17 2006 12:57 AM

Julio gets Luna to pop out foul to Delgado. Nice.

Zvon May 17 2006 01:01 AM

Julio gets it done. Mets win 8-3 and thats the way to start this series in St Loo.

Willets Point May 17 2006 01:01 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 17 2006 01:02 AM

Game over ... would you like your spanking with habanero sauce?

TransMonk May 17 2006 01:02 AM

Good game. Nice to beat the Cards and have Albert go 0-4. Let's do it again tomorrow...without the rain.

Edgy DC May 17 2006 07:13 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 17 2006 08:59 AM

Paul Simon references are a nice capper to this IGT. Thank you to the holdouts.

Elster88 May 17 2006 08:50 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 17 2006 09:02 AM

Bret Sabermetric wrote: Usually, don't you expect some glove from batters in the 7 and 8 (w)holes? If you're not putting Nady and Matsui for their offense, why are they in the lineup? Matsui has played a very good second base this year.

Elster88 May 17 2006 08:52 AM

Bret Sabermetric wrote: Garcia has walked 12 times and gotten 25 hits in 101 ABs so far. No note of HBPs but you got to think he has a few by now, so his OBP is around .333 or higher. In AAA. The fact that you're making a case for Garcia is fairly pathetic. JMO, of course.

Bret Sabermetric May 17 2006 09:03 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 17 2006 09:10 AM

Not quite so pathetic as you might think. There is usually a fairly close and predictable relationship between AAA performance and MLB performance, and depending on the league, it may actually be harder to put up certain stats in AAA than it is in MLB. I don't know about the MLEs (Major League Equivalents) between Columbus and Norfolk and MLB these days, but I wouldn't be surprised if it were pretty close. My larger point is that--over the course of several hundred MLB games, not just a handful of recent performances--Matsui has performed under the average MLB second baseman, particularly defensively, and the harm done by replacing him with a replacement level AAA secondbaseman would be marginal. The gain financially, of course, would be enormous. In fact, can we look up the Mets' W-L with Hernandez in the lineup and wiht Matsui? I wonder what that would show, as long as you're so interested in short-term performance levels. (She's my daughter. Are you suggesting that hits are not hits, and errors are not errors, at any level of play?) OE: Garcia's lifetime OBP in MLB, going into this season, is .345, slightly above league average, Matsui's is .320, slightly below..

Elster88 May 17 2006 09:08 AM

Bret Sabermetric wrote: In fact, can we look up the Mets' W-L with Hernandez in the lineup and wiht Matsui? I wonder what that would show, as long as you're so interested in short-term performance levels. True enough...it is a short term fielding performance that I am speaking of. But I don't think W-L with Andy and W-L with Kaz is the way to judge things, even in the short term. I'd still go with things like fielding percentage and OBP in those cases. In which case Kaz is probably still outperforming Andy.

Bret Sabermetric May 17 2006 09:11 AM

Elster88 wrote: ="Bret Sabermetric"] In fact, can we look up the Mets' W-L with Hernandez in the lineup and wiht Matsui? I wonder what that would show, as long as you're so interested in short-term performance levels. True enough...it is a short term fielding performance that I am speaking of. But I don't think W-L with Andy and W-L with Kaz is the way to judge things, even in the short term. I'd still go with things like fielding percentage and OBP in those cases. In which case Kaz is probably still outperforming Andy. I'm just shocked that you like certain short-term performances while dismissing others.

Elster88 May 17 2006 09:14 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 17 2006 09:21 AM

Bret Sabermetric wrote: ="Elster88"] Bret Sabermetric wrote: In fact, can we look up the Mets' W-L with Hernandez in the lineup and wiht Matsui? I wonder what that would show, as long as you're so interested in short-term performance levels. True enough...it is a short term fielding performance that I am speaking of. But I don't think W-L with Andy and W-L with Kaz is the way to judge things, even in the short term. I'd still go with things like fielding percentage and OBP in those cases. In which case Kaz is probably still outperforming Andy. I'm just shocked that you like certain short-term performances while dismissing others. Which others am I dismissing again? W-L record? Do you really think that is a good indicator of Kaz's playing ability over Andy's? There are no other factors which could skew the results? Did Andy ever have to play in a game that Jose Lima pitched in?

soupcan May 17 2006 09:15 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 17 2006 09:18 AM

Willets Point wrote: Wasn't it an official game already before the rain delay? This confused me as well. In Philly it was official after 4 & 1/2 innings with the home team ahead. Fine I get that, I understand it. If the home team had not been winning it would have been official after the home team and finished out the bottom of the 5th if one team had a lead. Last night after the Mets took a 4-3 lead in the top of the 7th, it started raining hard with 2 outs and Rolen up in the bottom of the 7th. I assumed that as long as at least 5 full innings had been played that it was an official game and could be called at any time. Cohen however said that since the visiting team took a lead in the top of an inning that was not completed after the 5th that if the game had to be called it would not be an official game but rather a 'suspended' game. I was confused but after thinking about it, it makes sense. The home team would have to have the same amount of opportunities to score I guess. So since the Mets went ahead in the top of the 7th, the Cards would have to be given a chance to bat in their half of that inning. I assume that once Rolen had made the third out then it would have been official. Is that right?

Methead May 17 2006 09:17 AM

A nice win. I waited out the rain, but as soon as they put a quick 3 runs on the board, I called it a night. Nice to see they got another one after I left.

Edgy DC May 17 2006 09:22 AM

Yes, the bottom of the seventh broought the gmae to regulation.

soupcan May 17 2006 09:35 AM

Edgy DC wrote: Yes, the bottom of the seventh broought the gmae to regulation. Thanks, I never knew this. Always thought 5 innings made a game no matter what. While I'm on the subject here's another rules question - Men on first and second less than two out - batter hits a ground ball that hits the runner going from first to second. Runner's out of course, but is the ball dead and the batter awarded first? If so does the runner who was at second automatically advance to third? This came up at a little league game and I was arguing just this. Runner is out, ball is dead, batter awarded first, runner on second advances. No one seemed to be as convinced of their opinions as I so we went with my call. Was I right?

Frayed Knot May 17 2006 09:35 AM

]Cohen however said that since the visiting team took a lead in the top of an inning that was not completed after the 5th that if the game had to be called it would not be an official game but rather a 'suspended' game. I was confused but after thinking about it, it makes sense. The home team would have to have the same amount of opportunities to score I guess. So since the Mets went ahead in the top of the 7th, the Cards would have to be given a chance to bat in their half of that inning. Right. When a team takes a lead in an otherwise-official game during the middle of an inning but rain prevents the inning from being complete, the result has to revert back to the last whole inning - as if the 7th (in this case) had never happened. Had that actually happened (game not being resumed) I think we would have set some kind of record for the two worst-timed rain-shortened games in a one-week span.

metirish May 17 2006 10:40 AM

] Mets could clear way for Glavine's exit Never mind that $12 million club option for 2007 that the Mets included in left-hander Tom Glavine's restructured contract: There is little chance the team will exercise it. The Mets have agreed informally to decline the option if Glavine wants to return to the Braves next season, according to a source with knowledge of his contract. The restructured deal also includes a "poison pill," FOXSports.com has learned – a $3 million bonus if Glavine makes the All-Star team in '06 and '07 and a $2 million bonus if he makes it only in '07. By defeating the Cardinals on Tuesday night, Glavine, 40, improved to 6-2 with a 2.43 ERA — All-Star caliber numbers. Both the Mets and Braves figure to want him next season; he is now just 19 victories short of 300. Thanks to the All-Star bonuses, Glavine's club option with the Mets could be worth $14 million or $15 million — both prohibitive numbers. If the Mets want to keep Glavine, they almost certainly would negotiate a new deal at a lower salary. Glavine restructured his contract with the Mets to reduce his '06 salary from $10.5 million to $7.5 million. In return, he received the $12 million club option and a $5.5 million player option for '07, both with a $3 million buyout. The new deal protects Glavine if he suffers a serious injury later this season; his player option amounts to disability insurance. The value of that option will increase by $1 million each if he pitches 180, 190 and 200 innings, maxing out at $8.5 million. http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/5612148

Elster88 May 17 2006 10:54 AM

Frayed Knot wrote: ]Cohen however said that since the visiting team took a lead in the top of an inning that was not completed after the 5th that if the game had to be called it would not be an official game but rather a 'suspended' game. I was confused but after thinking about it, it makes sense. The home team would have to have the same amount of opportunities to score I guess. So since the Mets went ahead in the top of the 7th, the Cards would have to be given a chance to bat in their half of that inning. Right. When a team takes a lead in an otherwise-official game during the middle of an inning but rain prevents the inning from being complete, the result has to revert back to the last whole inning - as if the 7th (in this case) had never happened. I don't think this is true. If the game gets called off all together they just start a new game from scratch.

ScarletKnight41 May 17 2006 11:01 AM

No Elster - it would be a suspended game and it would be resumed from the point of the last complete inning.

Gwreck May 17 2006 11:01 AM

="Elster88"] ="Frayed Knot"]Right. When a team takes a lead in an otherwise-official game during the middle of an inning but rain prevents the inning from being complete, the result has to revert back to the last whole inning - as if the 7th (in this case) had never happened. I don't think this is true. If the game gets called off all together they just start a new game from scratch. No, Frayed Knot has it right. You start a new game from scratch if it isn't an official game. If it is an official game, then you can end it if one team is ahead. If no team is ahead, you have to keep going. No team was "ahead" because the Cardinals hadn't had the chance to bat in the 7th. If the Cardinals were ahead (instead of the Mets) when the tarp went on the field, they could've called the game and the Cardinals would have won.

Elster88 May 17 2006 11:21 AM

Elster88 wrote: ="Bret Sabermetric"] Elster88 wrote: ="Bret Sabermetric"] In fact, can we look up the Mets' W-L with Hernandez in the lineup and wiht Matsui? I wonder what that would show, as long as you're so interested in short-term performance levels. True enough...it is a short term fielding performance that I am speaking of. But I don't think W-L with Andy and W-L with Kaz is the way to judge things, even in the short term. I'd still go with things like fielding percentage and OBP in those cases. In which case Kaz is probably still outperforming Andy. I'm just shocked that you like certain short-term performances while dismissing others. Which others am I dismissing again? W-L record? Do you really think that is a good indicator of Kaz's playing ability over Andy's? There are no other factors which could skew the results? Did Andy ever have to play in a game that Jose Lima pitched in? Don't forget to respond to this one, Bret.

Elster88 May 17 2006 11:22 AM

="Gwreck"] ="Elster88"] ="Frayed Knot"]Right. When a team takes a lead in an otherwise-official game during the middle of an inning but rain prevents the inning from being complete, the result has to revert back to the last whole inning - as if the 7th (in this case) had never happened. I don't think this is true. If the game gets called off all together they just start a new game from scratch. No, Frayed Knot has it right. You start a new game from scratch if it isn't an official game. If it is an official game, then you can end it if one team is ahead. If no team is ahead, you have to keep going. No team was "ahead" because the Cardinals hadn't had the chance to bat in the 7th. If the Cardinals were ahead (instead of the Mets) when the tarp went on the field, they could've called the game and the Cardinals would have won. Well that just doesn't seem fair.

Bret Sabermetric May 17 2006 11:27 AM

Elster88 wrote: Elster88 wrote: ="Bret Sabermetric"] Elster88 wrote: ="Bret Sabermetric"] In fact, can we look up the Mets' W-L with Hernandez in the lineup and wiht Matsui? I wonder what that would show, as long as you're so interested in short-term performance levels. True enough...it is a short term fielding performance that I am speaking of. But I don't think W-L with Andy and W-L with Kaz is the way to judge things, even in the short term. I'd still go with things like fielding percentage and OBP in those cases. In which case Kaz is probably still outperforming Andy. I'm just shocked that you like certain short-term performances while dismissing others. Which others am I dismissing again? W-L record? Do you really think that is a good indicator of Kaz's playing ability over Andy's? There are no other factors which could skew the results? Did Andy ever have to play in a game that Jose Lima pitched in? Don't forget to respond to this one, Bret. Turn both of Lima's losses into wins. Now do the math.

Elster88 May 17 2006 11:39 AM

Bret Sabermetric wrote: ="Elster88"] ="Elster88"] Bret Sabermetric wrote: ="Elster88"] Bret Sabermetric wrote: In fact, can we look up the Mets' W-L with Hernandez in the lineup and wiht Matsui? I wonder what that would show, as long as you're so interested in short-term performance levels. True enough...it is a short term fielding performance that I am speaking of. But I don't think W-L with Andy and W-L with Kaz is the way to judge things, even in the short term. I'd still go with things like fielding percentage and OBP in those cases. In which case Kaz is probably still outperforming Andy. I'm just shocked that you like certain short-term performances while dismissing others. Which others am I dismissing again? W-L record? Do you really think that is a good indicator of Kaz's playing ability over Andy's? There are no other factors which could skew the results? Did Andy ever have to play in a game that Jose Lima pitched in? Don't forget to respond to this one, Bret. Turn both of Lima's losses into wins. Now do the math. Forget Lima's starts for a second then. My point is that a team's W-L record is not a good indicator of individual performace. Don't you agree? 2nd question---which measurement was I willifully ignoring?

Bret Sabermetric May 17 2006 12:08 PM

Elster88 wrote: ="Bret Sabermetric"] Elster88 wrote: Elster88 wrote: ="Bret Sabermetric"] Elster88 wrote: ="Bret Sabermetric"] In fact, can we look up the Mets' W-L with Hernandez in the lineup and wiht Matsui? I wonder what that would show, as long as you're so interested in short-term performance levels. True enough...it is a short term fielding performance that I am speaking of. But I don't think W-L with Andy and W-L with Kaz is the way to judge things, even in the short term. I'd still go with things like fielding percentage and OBP in those cases. In which case Kaz is probably still outperforming Andy. I'm just shocked that you like certain short-term performances while dismissing others. Which others am I dismissing again? W-L record? Do you really think that is a good indicator of Kaz's playing ability over Andy's? There are no other factors which could skew the results? Did Andy ever have to play in a game that Jose Lima pitched in? Don't forget to respond to this one, Bret. Turn both of Lima's losses into wins. Now do the math. Forget Lima's starts for a second then. My point is that a team's W-L record is not a good indicator of individual performace. Don't you agree? 2nd question---which measurement was I willifully ignoring? All we have with Hernandez is short -term performance. If you're going to deny me that measure, then I've got nothing. 2nd question--see above. You're basically ignoring any positives I can show you with Hernandez, of which the strongest is how well the Mets played when he was here. I sorta like individual W/L records. I think they're underutilized, because while you get a lot of short-term freak results, over the long haul, Ws and Ls are what the game's about. I always wondered what Piazza's w/l record was compared to his substitutes. I'm sure it was good, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't nearly as good as people think it was, which is one reason why I'd wanted him dealt.

Willets Point May 17 2006 12:20 PM

Maybe there should be a +/- rating for baseball like in hockey. How many runs your team scores when you bat in an inning vs. how many they score when you don't come to bat. Also defensive scores, how many runs allowed in innings on the field vs. innings on the bench/dl. Could be interesting to see the cumulative stats, although I'm not sure what useful info they'd provide.