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Scoring the Game

Centerfield May 10 2006 12:06 PM

One of the things I want to be able to teach my son is how to score the game. So recently, fearing I had forgotten a lot of it, I started scoring games again. It was then that I realized that I never really learned how to do a lot of things and instead, use a lot of my own little tricks. The problem is, I don't know if what I'm doing is the right thing or not...and I don't want to pass along bad information to my son. So, a couple of questions: 1. When you turn the lineup over in one inning, what do you guys do? What I do (let's say it's the 4th inning) is to continue in the column for the 5th, and then put a line to show where the 4th ended. In the 5th, I just use the same column again. Is this how it's supposed to be done? 2. Advancing on throws: I draw a line and then note it "OT" (on throw). I'm almost certain this isn't right. 3. Runners advancing. If Reyes moves from second to third on a Beltran single, I draw the line, then note between 2B and 3B "1B-8" signifying single by the CF. If Reyes scores from second on a Beltran single, I put the same notation next to third base showing that Reyes went from second to home. Is this right? Thanks for the help.

Elster88 May 10 2006 12:11 PM

1) I use only the one column for the entire inning (unless they bat around), just go to the top of it when the leadoff guy comes up.

Methead May 10 2006 12:13 PM

I don't think there's a right or wrong way to score games, although I have my own way of doing it. If an inning turns over, I do it the same way you do, but I wouldn't continue the 5th in the "5th" column... I'd just shift every inning over to the right by one, and re-number them at the top of the scorecard. As far as advancing runners, I usually draw a solid line to show how far they got on their own, and dashed lines to show how far they advanced for other reasons. I don't write anything to show how they advanced unless it's a steal or passed ball or whatever.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 12:14 PM

I don't think there's any one way to do it. Everyone has their own style. Where you put OT I always would but a T. I've heard that when a team sends ten or more batters to the plate in an inning, you're supposed to "divide the box." That never made sense to me. Unless you know in advance that they're going to bat around, you wouldn't leave enough space. I do what you do, I infringe upon the next inning, and then I draw a dark solid line around the "bulge" to show that those entries belong to the previous inning. And I hope that the next inning is a quick one, otherwise the scorecard is a hopeless mess. When I fill out a scorecard, I always include the players' uniform numbers along with their name and position. If Reyes singles, for example, and goes to third on a hit by Lo Duca, I'll put a 1B in the lower right corner of Reyes' box, and a 16, in a circle, in the upper left. The circled 16 is kind of like a cross-reference, showing that Reyes got to third as a result of whatever Lo Duca did. This is something that I made up, and I don't know if anyone else does anything similar. But it always seemed like the easiest way for me.

Edgy DC May 10 2006 12:19 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 10 2006 12:56 PM

1) If the team bats around, the ffifth-inning column becomes part of the fouth, with a line where the turnover took place. Even if you forget that line, you know where it took place because of where the lineup picked up in the next column. The sixth column becomes the seventh inninng, etc. 2) Why not? Part of the fun of scoring is individual variations. 3) That's more notation than I do. Good for youse. Dring that 14-inning marathon, Keith showed a nice trick, where he outlined all the at-bats against a particular pitcher in a highlighter pen, then outlined that pitcher's name in the same color on the other team's side of the card. It makes it easy to add up to what he's responsible for, makes for quicker reference, and makes the thing look cooler. It won't do anything to dispel the "Keith is gay" position, but I liked it.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 12:26 PM

Also, I never bought into the conventional way of marking base hits: one horizontal line for a single, two for a double, three for a triple, and four for a homer. I always write 1B, 2B, 3B, and HR. I should also say that it's probably been more than a decade since I've scored a game, with one exception, a minor league game I attended in Tennessee last year.

Methead May 10 2006 12:31 PM

Here's an example of one of my scorecards... the classic "10-run 8th" game.

soupcan May 10 2006 12:33 PM Re: Scoring the Game

Centerfield wrote: 1. When you turn the lineup over in one inning, what do you guys do? What I do (let's say it's the 4th inning) is to continue in the column for the 5th, and then put a line to show where the 4th ended. In the 5th, I just use the same column again. Is this how it's supposed to be done? I do the same as you Centerfield wrote: 2. Advancing on throws: I draw a line and then note it "OT" (on throw). I'm almost certain this isn't right. Instead of 'OT' I'll write '4-3' or whatever the play was. Centerfield wrote: 3. Runners advancing. If Reyes moves from second to third on a Beltran single, I draw the line, then note between 2B and 3B "1B-8" signifying single by the CF. If Reyes scores from second on a Beltran single, I put the same notation next to third base showing that Reyes went from second to home. Is this right? I do a very similar thing, everyone has their own style. My bugaboo is an inning-ending forceout. What do you do for the batter? The runner is out 6-4. I write the 6-4 in the batter's box but then it looks like there were 4 outs in the inning.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 12:35 PM

I show the batter reaching first on a fielder's choice. In the runner's box, I'd put the 6-4 in the second base position, maybe with an FO next to it.

Centerfield May 10 2006 12:36 PM

Thanks for the help. I wasn't sure if there was an "official scoring method" or if there is just an "official scorer" who scores the game in whatever way he pleases. Shifting the innings over does make more sense. I think I'll do it that way from now on.

Johnny Dickshot May 10 2006 12:36 PM

Never guess Meat was an architecht, wouldya? I download the "enhanced vertical scorecard" from baseball-scorecards.com. My scorecards look like Meat's, except for the cool architect handwiriting, and I draw a line from home plate to the part of the field the ball was hit. I indicate advancing on throws with a semicircle arrow over the diamond with the notation "th." My dad taught me some whacky version which I appreciated but replaced with my own system once I had to score games as a reporter.

KC May 10 2006 12:38 PM

Last winter I made a list of about thirty-forty things that can happen in a ball-game and made up a fake scorecard with it to illustrate scoring to a friend of mine who wanted to learn for his softball team. I gotta find that thing and scan it, it's pretty fun and we might get a kick out of picking it apart for stuff.

soupcan May 10 2006 12:44 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: I show the batter reaching first on a fielder's choice. In the runner's box, I'd put the 6-4 in the second base position, maybe with an FO next to it. I used to do this too but technically the batter doesn't reach first and it looks weird, like the inning ended when the runner got picked off or something after the batter reached base safely. Maddening.

Centerfield May 10 2006 12:45 PM

Poor Robin made 3 outs in 2 innings.

Willets Point May 10 2006 12:48 PM

Johnny Dickshot wrote: I download the "enhanced vertical scorecard" from baseball-scorecards.com. You mean this? Got to add it to permanent links if so.

Johnny Dickshot May 10 2006 12:52 PM

Yes sir, that's the one. You can score balls and strikes if you like on it, though I must say I've never found a satisfying way to do that. I'vee tried filling in the boxes 1, 2, 3 etc., or 1S (swinging strike 1), 2backwards s (for called strike on the second pitch) and F for foul, and 1L (first pitch ball low), 2H (second pitch ball high) etc. but then they start fouling them off and I lose count of pitches and sequence. Most often I only note the count when it gets to be 0-2 or 3-0

Diamond Dad May 10 2006 12:54 PM The art of the scorecard

keeping a "book" is becoming a lost art. At my son's little league game a few weeks ago, I handed one of my assistant coaches the score book and said, "here, keep the book" while I went to work with the boy who was going to be the next pitcher. When I game back, he handed me the book and had not written a thing on it. I looked at him quizzically and asked why he hadn't written anything and he looked at me like a cow looking at an ocoming train and said, "I thought you just wanted me to hold it for you." He had no idea how to record a game in a scorebook. I've been teaching Mini Knight how to score -- he's pretty good at all the basics now (good handwriting practice, too!), but he gets confused on odd plays. There is no "correct" way to keep a book, although I'd say that the object is that somebody else -- not you -- should be able to figure it out, so you should not use such individualized markings that only you know the code! I like to indicate each "out" by putting a number in a circle. so, if a runner is forced out at a base on a fielder's choice ("FC") and is the third out of the inning, I'll have a "3" in a circle in that box to indicate that was the final out, even though the batter is shown as reaching base on FC and he was the last batter of the inning. I like to draw an extra thick solid line underneith the box for last batter faced by each pitcher, to differentiate the at-bats against each pitcher in the game, but I like Keith's method (for an announcer who has a table to write on and a supply of colored highlighters!) Most TV or Radio announcers use extra large scorebook pages so they can write in notes to themselves like "lined hard to 2b -- great play by Kaz" so when they are looking back at the at-bats of each hitter they are reminded of things to say about the previous at-bats. on a small traditional scorecard you don't have that much space, but I will put an exclamation point next to a great defensive play. It's great to have a scorecard of a game to look back on. I have one hanging on the wall of my office in a frame -- along with the ticket stub from the game -- September 17, 1986. Last out was Chico Walker: "4-3"

seawolf17 May 10 2006 12:55 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: I show the batter reaching first on a fielder's choice. In the runner's box, I'd put the 6-4 in the second base position, maybe with an FO next to it. But that runner doesn't get credit for first base. I just put "FC" in the box, then mark the runner out at whatever base it happens. I made my own scorebook on Excel to fit my needs and brought it to Staples to have it bound; it has no inning numbers across the top, so I don't have to cross out numbers and make a mess. It also allows me to keep all my games from one year in the same book.

soupcan May 10 2006 01:01 PM Re: The art of the scorecard

Diamond Dad wrote: It's great to have a scorecard of a game to look back on. I have one hanging on the wall of my office in a frame -- along with the ticket stub from the game -- September 17, 1986. Last out was Chico Walker: "4-3" I took the scorecards from the first games my kids attended, put the ticket stubs and a picture of them at that game on a board, had them mounted and framed. The kids like them but I like them better.

Edgy DC May 10 2006 01:02 PM

]My bugaboo is an inning-ending forceout. What do you do for the batter? I write a big fat "FC" and leave it at that. Nothing gave me better pleasure as a manager than consulting the book on a batter, realizing he grounded to second, yelling to the secondbaseman, "Brian, he hit it to you last time," watching the kid cheat into the hole and making another play. You can see the empowerment of knowledge derived from records inflating the kid's person.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 01:02 PM

Well, he doesn't get "credit" for the base, but at the end of the inning, there's one guy left on base, and it's the guy who reached on the fielder's choice.

Centerfield May 10 2006 01:04 PM Re: The art of the scorecard

soupcan wrote: I took the scorecards from the first games my kids attended, put the ticket stubs and a picture of them at that game on a board, had them mounted and framed. The kids like them but I like them better. What a great idea. I'm going to steal it from you and pretend I came up with it.

Elster88 May 10 2006 01:06 PM

Hey! Stealing it and pretending it was my idea was my idea!!!

soupcan May 10 2006 01:10 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: Well, he doesn't get "credit" for the base, but at the end of the inning, there's one guy left on base, and it's the guy who reached on the fielder's choice. Is that true? The batter is counted as LOB even though he didn't reach base? That's not right.

Willets Point May 10 2006 01:10 PM

At the July 4 game last season whenever I missed a play MiniKnight filled me in on what to score.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 01:11 PM

Two outs, runner on first. Batter grounds into a force out. There's one man left on base. It shouldn't matter (as far as LOB statistics go) whether the play was at second base or at first, it's still an LOB.

soupcan May 10 2006 01:13 PM

If you say so I believe you but if the guy doesn't reach base he shouldn't count as LOB. That's messed up.

cooby May 10 2006 01:14 PM

When I used to keep score for my son's little league games I always hated when there was a fielder's choice and the kid that hit into it (and sometimes their less informed parents) would insist that it was a hit, because "they were safe!" Gotta admit though, when my husband played softball and I kept score, some of those guys acted more like babies than the kids did when they didn't agree with my scoring.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 01:16 PM

When I'd score a Little League game, like for nine-year-olds, any time somebody hit a fair ball and got on base (except in the case of force outs) I scored it a hit. In other words, there was no such thing as an error. At that level, I figure that any fair ball that the fielder can't handle, for whatever reason, should be a hit.

cooby May 10 2006 01:17 PM

Yeah, I agree with that. When they hit 11 or 12 though, they should be fielding cleanly, or no longer playing. Sounds harsh I know.

Centerfield May 10 2006 01:21 PM

cooby wrote: Yeah, I agree with that. When they hit 11 or 12 though, they should be fielding cleanly, or no longer playing. Sounds harsh I know. I'm glad cooby never came to my Little League games.

cooby May 10 2006 01:22 PM

Aw, CF I'm sure you are a good fielder :)

Centerfield May 10 2006 01:27 PM

Actually I was ok in the field. Hitting the ball was another story. Which is I why I golf now. Now that the ball is stationary, I almost never strike out anymore.

Rotblatt May 10 2006 01:31 PM

Johnny Dickshot wrote: I'vee tried filling in the boxes 1, 2, 3 etc., or 1S (swinging strike 1), 2backwards s (for called strike on the second pitch) and F for foul, and 1L (first pitch ball low), 2H (second pitch ball high) etc. but then they start fouling them off and I lose count of pitches and sequence. I went through a period like that, where I'd put x's for strikes & o's for balls. I did a little superscripted c if it was a called strike or f if it was a foul. Ultimately, I decided it was rude to whomever I was at the game with, as I payed no attention to them (as opposed to next-to-no attention to them). For force outs: Reyes walked with 2 outs. LoDuca grounds to second baseman, who flips to SS at second to get the force out. In Reyes's box, solid line from HP to 1st, labeled BB. A line halfway between first & second, with a hatchmark at the end of the line. In bottom left-hand corner of Reye's box, #3, circled. In LoDuca's box, 4-6. Bottom right-hand corner of his box is filled in to indicate that his was the last at bat. in general: At the start of each inning, I'll look at the scoreboard and put the pitch count up at the top of the column from the previous inning. I like to keep track of the number of pitches thrown per inning. Dunno why. If there was a good defensive play, I'll throw an astrix by the marking. So if Reyes makes a nice diving stop, then flips to Matsui for the force out, I'll write 6*-4. If, on the other hand, it's a routine ground ball but the throw goes wide and Matsui has step off the bag and tag the runner, I might write 6-4*. The hope is that I'll be able to look at the scorecard and remember what the asterix is for. For pitcher changes, I'll put double hatchmarks inbetween the boxes. So let's say Cliff hit a home run off Myers, who was then replaced by Gordon to face Wright: In Cliff's box, filled-in plate. On the line separating his & Wright's box, I'll put in two hatchmarks ( | | ) so I know that there was a pitching change. I enjoy scoring games although I never do anything with them--it's more the action of scoring during a game that appeals to me.

Methead May 10 2006 01:38 PM

I used to score games while I was watching them on TV, but I'd usually get bored with it by the 4th or 5th inning. My friend and I used to play Nintendo Baseball and score THOSE games. God, what nerds. I'll have to start noting advancements on throws... if I ever drag my ass to another game.

cooby May 10 2006 01:45 PM

When I was in high school and learning shorthand, I used to do the play by play in shorthand for practice

seawolf17 May 10 2006 01:48 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: Two outs, runner on first. Batter grounds into a force out. There's one man left on base. It shouldn't matter (as far as LOB statistics go) whether the play was at second base or at first, it's still an LOB. No it isn't. The batter did not reach first base, so how could he be left there?

soupcan May 10 2006 01:49 PM Re: The art of the scorecard

Centerfield wrote: ="soupcan"] I took the scorecards from the first games my kids attended, put the ticket stubs and a picture of them at that game on a board, had them mounted and framed. The kids like them but I like them better. What a great idea. I'm going to steal it from you and pretend I came up with it. No problemo - I also indicated on the scorecard time of game and who was there. On one of them we went with my brother-in-law and his then-girlfriend. When his now-wife saw it about a year ago she wasn't too thrilled that the ex occupies a somewhat 'permanent' place in family lore. ="Rotblatt"]For force outs: Reyes walked with 2 outs. LoDuca grounds to second baseman, who flips to SS at second to get the force out. In Reyes's box, solid line from HP to 1st, labeled BB. A line halfway between first & second, with a hatchmark at the end of the line. In bottom left-hand corner of Reye's box, #3, circled. In LoDuca's box, 4-6. Bottom right-hand corner of his box is filled in to indicate that his was the last at bat. Ooh I like that - I'm stealing it and pretending it was my idea.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 01:58 PM

seawolf17 wrote: ="Yancy Street Gang"]Two outs, runner on first. Batter grounds into a force out. There's one man left on base. It shouldn't matter (as far as LOB statistics go) whether the play was at second base or at first, it's still an LOB. No it isn't. The batter did not reach first base, so how could he be left there? Of course it is. There was one runner on base when the final out was made, so there's one LOB. LOB is a team stat, not an individual stat. There's one LOB; it doesn't matter which player it is.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 02:02 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 10 2006 02:02 PM

This is from answers.com ]In a baseball game, the number of plate appearances for each team must be equal to the number of batters put out, scored, and left on base. A box score is in balance (or proved) when the total of the team's times at bat, bases on balls received, hit batters, sacrifice bunts, sacrifice flies and batters awarded first base because of interference or obstruction equals the total of that team's runs, players left on base and the opposing team's putouts. If a box score is unbalanced, then there is a logical contradiction and thus an error somewhere in the box score. In my example, for the inning to be in balance, you need to credit the team with an LOB. Four batters. Three outs. Without the LOB, it's unbalanced.

Elster88 May 10 2006 02:02 PM

seawolf17 wrote: ="Yancy Street Gang"]Two outs, runner on first. Batter grounds into a force out. There's one man left on base. It shouldn't matter (as far as LOB statistics go) whether the play was at second base or at first, it's still an LOB. No it isn't. The batter did not reach first base, so how could he be left there? Technically, he did reach first base.

Centerfield May 10 2006 02:06 PM

Yancy is right. That's why you say "Beltran reached on a fielder's choice." He doesn't get credit for a hit because an out was recorded, but he certainly did reach base.

soupcan May 10 2006 02:08 PM

Don't mess with Yancy. OE: Does it count towards the batter's OBP?

Edgy DC May 10 2006 02:10 PM Edited 2 time(s), most recently on May 10 2006 02:28 PM

]Technically, he did reach first base. Neither did I with Kathleen Hanley because she turned her head and gave me her cheek. But is that what we're talking about? Two guys come up with a runner on first and two down. Both ground it hard directly to the secondbaseman more or less in the same spot. On one play, the secondbaseman throws to the shortstop and erases the runner. On the other, the secondbaseman, in a different mood perhaps, he nails the battter at first. Haven't these two guys done the same thing in the same situation with the same eventual result? Shouldn't they statistically get the same credit and discredit?

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 02:12 PM

soupcan wrote: Don't mess with Yancy. OE: Does it count towards the batter's OBP? Nope, doesn't count towards OBP. At least, not as a positive factor. It does count as a plate appearance, so it would decrease the OBP.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 02:13 PM

Edgy, you may get bitten by your own precedent here. We're all going to have to find images of Kathleen Hanley and ask you to identify which one is the one who turned her cheek.

Willets Point May 10 2006 02:17 PM

="Yancy Street Gang"]Edgy, you may get bitten by your own precedent here. We're all going to have to find images of Kathleen Hanley and ask you to identify which one is the one who turned her cheek. I hope it's this one: She's got nice cheeks. The other one I found is a nun and I hope Edgy wasn't trying to kiss a nun! On an unrelated note, Yancy & I are no longer the Franco twins!!!

Elster88 May 10 2006 02:20 PM

Which cheek was it Edgy?

Edgy DC May 10 2006 02:27 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 10 2006 02:29 PM

I've kissed nuns. They always turn their cheeks. Except Sister Delfina, who was really really small, and I always got the top of her head. Kathleeen is long since no longer a Hanley, and I don't know what she is now.

soupcan May 10 2006 02:28 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: ="soupcan"]Don't mess with Yancy. OE: Does it count towards the batter's OBP? Nope, doesn't count towards OBP. At least, not as a positive factor. It does count as a plate appearance, so it would decrease the OBP. If a batter hits into an FC with less than two out and reaches base safely doesn't that increase his OBP? So with 2 out if the same batter hits into an FC and he technically becomes an 'LOB' - then it should count toward his OBP. no?

Gwreck May 10 2006 02:31 PM

soupcan wrote: If a batter hits into an FC with less than two out and reaches base safely doesn't that increase his OBP? So with 2 out if the same batter hits into an FC and he technically becomes an 'LOB' - then it should count toward his OBP. no? No in both cases. OBP is Hits, Walks, HBP / PA. Nothing gained for reaching base on errors/fielder's choices/etc.

soupcan May 10 2006 02:41 PM

Okay - it makes more sense now. Merci beaucoup.

Diamond Dad May 10 2006 02:47 PM OBP

Batter who hits into 4 fielder's choices is still 0-4. Can be 0-4 and score 4 runs, but you're still 0-4 and your BA and OBP for the game is .000

seawolf17 May 10 2006 02:58 PM

Daryl Boston is on first base with two outs. Charlie O'Brien, The Slowest Man In America, hits a sharp grounder to second. They force Boston at second; inning over. Charlie O, barely makes it twenty feet down the line before turning right and heading back to the dugout to don his gear. How does he count as a "left on" when he never got there? It's not right.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 03:00 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 10 2006 03:16 PM

Read the above from answers.com. A runner was left on base. It's really that simple. And remember, it's a team stat. It doesn't matter WHO was left on base. Charlie O'Brien doesn't get credited with anything.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 03:02 PM

Here's another Kathleen Hanley: She's an artist at Cheatham Theater And here's the nun that Willets mentioned:

Edgy DC May 10 2006 03:09 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 10 2006 03:14 PM

Both very sweet I'm sure. but I know not the name the former Ms. Hanley goes by now. It was Kathleen's superior friend Kristen that I ended up dating.

cooby May 10 2006 03:11 PM

You dated a Mother Superior?!?

Edgy DC May 10 2006 03:16 PM

Yes, our high school makeout music was: "Sister Kristen, now the time has come..." You peeps...

MFS62 May 10 2006 03:18 PM

From that picture, I'd have to say that Billy Joel was right. They do start much too late. Later

Frayed Knot May 10 2006 03:20 PM

]For force outs: Reyes walked with 2 outs. LoDuca grounds to second baseman, who flips to SS at second to get the force out. In Reyes's box, solid line from HP to 1st, labeled BB. A line halfway between first & second, with a hatchmark at the end of the line. In bottom left-hand corner of Reye's box, #3, circled. In LoDuca's box, 4-6. Bottom right-hand corner of his box is filled in to indicate that his was the last at bat. That's pretty much what I do as well. Whenever a baserunner is out advancing to a base I use the hatchmark to indicate that (out stretching; out trying 1st to 3rd on single, etc.) and then a small notation next to it as to how; like 'CS' for caught stealing, '8-2' if out tagging, etc. I also use the circled number thing to indicate which out of the inning it is - but only when I think it's neccesary because the outs occured "out of sequence". For instance if LoDuca K's in the above example and then Delgado grounded into the force then the circled numbers ('1' in LoDuca's box, '2' in Reyes's) help you remember that LoDuca's out occured before Reyes's. Sometimes it can be even more confusing if odd base-running plays happen.

Willets Point May 10 2006 03:20 PM

And Frayed Knot dutifully returns the topic to scoring baseball games for the top of page 4.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 03:21 PM

Willets Point wrote: On an unrelated note, Yancy & I are no longer the Franco twins!!! We'll both be Strawberries for a while, though. You're much closer to Darryl than I am to whoever's next. Maybe I need to participate more often in the IGT's so I can increase my post count faster.

cooby May 10 2006 03:21 PM

Oh come on. Edgy dating a Mother Superior completely knocks that gay icon status for a loop.

Frayed Knot May 10 2006 03:22 PM

Willets Point wrote: And Frayed Knot dutifully returns the topic to scoring baseball games for the top of page 4. I don't have any sex w/nuns stories to add. I've led such a sheltered life.

Elster88 May 10 2006 03:22 PM

Let's stop here before any former altar boys start spilling their guts about the priests.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 03:23 PM

You don't have to give up hope, Mr. Knot. There are a lot of single nuns out there.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 03:25 PM

Frayed Knot May 10 2006 03:25 PM

I'd venture to say that most nuns are single. Problem is, I'm not Catholic.

Edgy DC May 10 2006 03:28 PM

Must. Change. Thread. Direction.

cooby May 10 2006 03:30 PM

That's a cute bikini.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 03:30 PM

I'd pick this one:

Frayed Knot May 10 2006 03:31 PM

"Scoring" has taken on several meanings in this thread.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 03:32 PM

Or this one:

cooby May 10 2006 03:32 PM

I just hope CF's original questions have been answered to his satisfaction Edit: Yancy, hahahhhahah! I gotta stop laughing, I am starting to cough again

Elster88 May 10 2006 03:36 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: Oh my.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 03:37 PM

Are nuns eligible for the Pretty thread?

Elster88 May 10 2006 03:38 PM

I was about to add her. The one sticking out her tongue of course.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 03:39 PM

Natcherly.

Edgy DC May 10 2006 04:03 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on May 10 2006 04:05 PM

Dust! Main! Chread! Thirection!

Willets Point May 10 2006 04:05 PM

Oh come you set that on a tee for cooby when you wrote "superior friend." You HAD to know what was coming.

Elster88 May 10 2006 04:06 PM

It should be Chead and Thrirection.

Edgy DC May 10 2006 04:12 PM

]Oh come you set that on a tee for cooby when you wrote "superior friend." ]You HAD to know what was coming.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 04:15 PM

Edgy's desperately trying to change this from a sexy nun thread to a Batman thread.

Willets Point May 10 2006 04:16 PM

Uh-oh, I've got the angry Batman on my case now. So um, my favorite baseball score is WW for "Wasn't Watching" even if it was originally attributed to Phil Rizzuto.

Willets Point May 10 2006 04:17 PM

="Yancy Street Gang"]Edgy's desperately trying to change this from a sexy nun thread to a Batman thread. Of course, Batman is a gay icon:

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 04:18 PM

seawolf17 May 10 2006 04:22 PM

In a vain attempt to refocus... I also use a simple lowercase "out" when I miss a play that resulted in one.

Willets Point May 10 2006 04:23 PM

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 04:23 PM

Daredevil's mother was a nun.

Centerfield May 10 2006 04:23 PM

The term "out" has also taken on a second meaning in this thread.

seawolf17 May 10 2006 04:24 PM

(sigh)

Edgy DC May 10 2006 04:27 PM

The term "hit" is going to take on a new meaning if you keep imposing sexualized nun imagary into my already messed-up romantic history.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 04:29 PM

There's no sighing in baseball!

cooby May 10 2006 04:37 PM

this would make a boffo avatar

Willets Point May 10 2006 04:40 PM

I don't think Mrs. Payton would approve.

Gwreck May 10 2006 04:50 PM

[Yanking this back on topic] Re: Marking the advancement of baserunners. Interesting that you use "T" to mark advancement on a throw. I was always under the impression that the official term for that was "runners moved up" (and hence the abbreviation RMU). My love of scoring came from a love of boxscores as a kid -- and that term I learned from the NY Times boxscores, which is the only place I see that line in the boxscore used. I can't seem to find an official definition though.

Methead May 10 2006 04:55 PM

I'd see the difference as : RMU = guy on 2nd moving to 3rd on a grounder to the right side T = guy singles, advancing to 2nd on a throw to the plate

Gwreck May 10 2006 04:56 PM

Methead wrote: I'd see the difference as : RMU = guy on 2nd moving to 3rd on a grounder to the right side T = guy singles, advancing to 2nd on a throw to the plate I was pretty sure though that guy moving 2nd to 3rd on grounder is advancing on a fielder's choice. Unless he's not forced?

Methead May 10 2006 05:00 PM

Heh. True... I guess I'm thinking in terms of RMU as a boxscore notation, rather than a note on a scorecard.

Yancy Street Gang May 10 2006 05:01 PM

I think the term "fielder's choice" only applies to a batter who reaches first base. But I could be wrong on that one. I used T to indicate a runner advancing on a throw long before there was an RMU acronym. If a runner advances from second to third on a ground ball out, I'd mark the corner for third base with the uniform number of the batter who grounded out. Again, that's the method I made up; it's possible that I'm the only one who does that.

Elster88 May 10 2006 05:10 PM

The opposite can be true. If, on a grounder, the fielder inexplicably threw to first, the runner is said to have advanced to first on a fielder's choice. Or on a grounder with runners on first and second, if the lead runner is gotten at third, then the runners reached first and second on fielder's choices.

Willets Point May 10 2006 05:25 PM

Gwreck is good at yanking the thread back on topic. We probably said all that could be said regarding sexy nuns and gay batmen anyhow.

Gwreck May 10 2006 06:22 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: I think the term "fielder's choice" only applies to a batter who reaches first base. But I could be wrong on that one. See, now I think I remember. (Thanks Yancy!) You're right, a fielder's choice can only be scored if a runner advances to first base. Otherwise it's "normal" advancement on a play (without a specific "official" scoring term). And that I don't have a system for, although I think I might incorporate your idea...

Elster88 May 11 2006 09:28 AM

Gwreck wrote: ="Yancy Street Gang"]I think the term "fielder's choice" only applies to a batter who reaches first base. But I could be wrong on that one. See, now I think I remember. (Thanks Yancy!) You're right, a fielder's choice can only be scored if a runner advances to first base. Otherwise it's "normal" advancement on a play (without a specific "official" scoring term). And that I don't have a system for, although I think I might incorporate your idea... Incorrect. It is as I explained it. IIRC, it is pretty much anytime a fielder has choices and gets an out but someone else advanced --- although it's dependent on whether the official scorer called an error.

Yancy Street Gang May 11 2006 09:33 AM

From MLB.com: ] FIELDER'S CHOICE is the act of a fielder who handles a fair grounder and, instead of throwing to first base to put out the batter runner, throws to another base in an attempt to put out a preceding runner. The term is also used by scorers (a) to account for the advance of the batter runner who takes one or more extra bases when the fielder who handles his safe hit attempts to put out a preceding runner; (b) to account for the advance of a runner (other than by stolen base or error) while a fielder is attempting to put out another runner; and (c) to account for the advance of a runner made solely because of the defensive team's indifference (undefended steal).

soupcan May 11 2006 09:33 AM

Elster88 wrote: Incorrect. It is as I explained it. IIRC, it is pretty much anytime a fielder has choices and gets an out but someone else advanced --- although it's dependent on whether the official scorer called an error. I agree with Elstah on this and that's how I always score it.

Frayed Knot May 11 2006 09:57 AM

You can pretty much use the term "Fielder's Choice" in either case, but FC is specifically designed to account for the batter; the fielder could have gotten him out but chose to do something else instead - ergo it's an out against the batter's record. Saying that a runner advanced on an FC can be true but it's really no more descriptive than a runner advancing on say a fly out; it's simply a runner moved up where the fielder may or may not have had an option of making a different out.