Master Index of Archived Threads


The Knicks Suck Reloaded

TheOldMole May 30 2006 01:54 PM

Stephon Marbury says he wants to die a Knick. This is almost too perfect a straight line.

Vic Sage May 30 2006 02:11 PM

i know guys from my old neighborhood who would happily accomodate him. ...and my old neighborhood is Marbury's old neighborhood, too.

MFS62 May 30 2006 06:07 PM

About the thread title - what's a "reloaded"? Later

TheOldMole May 31 2006 11:06 AM

Means I couldn't find the original "Knicks Suck" thread.

Centerfield Jun 22 2006 08:33 AM

Larry Brown fired. Isiah in as coach.

Elster88 Jun 22 2006 08:38 AM

Another 40 million going his way for doing nothing?

metirish Jun 22 2006 08:42 AM

Just amazing , not surprising but still what a mess this organization is..

Farmer Ted Jun 22 2006 08:45 AM

Not only does that idiot Thomas have the front office, he has the court now, too. "Sometimes decisions work and sometimes they don't," Dolan said. When is this moron going to figure out that his decisions NEVER work?

metirish Jun 22 2006 09:06 AM

]Another 40 million going his way for doing nothing? From the NYT article... ] Yet Dolan's disenchantment went far beyond the poor results on the court, and he ultimately fired Brown for a number of other transgressions. The Knicks, contending that Brown violated several provisions of his contract, fired him "for cause," and thus do not intend to pay him balance of his contract, in excess of $40 million http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/22/sports/basketball/22cnd-knicks.html?hp&ex=1151035200&en=087efd39ccbfa525&ei=5094&partner=homepage

Elster88 Jun 22 2006 09:08 AM

Wow. I wonder what they're talking about.

MFS62 Jun 22 2006 09:20 AM

TheOldMole wrote: Means I couldn't find the original "Knicks Suck" thread. I knew that, but preferred to think of it to be your way of describing an anatomical noun. Later

Frayed Knot Jun 22 2006 11:00 AM

"The Knicks, contending that Brown violated several provisions of his contract, fired him "for cause," and thus do not intend to pay him balance of his contract, in excess of $40 million" Yeah, good luck with that.

metsmarathon Jun 22 2006 02:30 PM

"Larry Brown was fired by the Knicks this morning after just one, surprisingly tumultuous season as their head coach." is this above sentence grammatically correct? it seems to me there should be perhaps either no comma between one and tumultuous, or there should be a second comma after tumultuous. it just doesnt look right. the grammar, and the firing, both. stupid knicks.

Centerfield Jun 22 2006 03:06 PM

I think it looks grammatically correct, but I'll defer to the editor on that. It is, like a lot of things Knick, certainly clumsy.

Edgy DC Jun 22 2006 03:14 PM

metsmarathon is correct. When metsmarathon is correcting your punctuation, you are not having a good day.

metsmarathon Jun 22 2006 04:00 PM

hey, i'm the resident grammar cop at work!

KC Jun 22 2006 04:24 PM

Larry Brown has dicked teams before, it's not like Knicks fans haven't been dicked by elite coaches before anyways. He's old and probably not going to be in the best of health going forward anyways ... not that I know. I hope he gets his entire salary just so Dolan has to pay it. Of course, it will be reflected on the next cable increase. Fuck the SC indicator too. I just hated Thomas as a player. I hated his face, I hated his act, I hated the the he was helping his momma get her high blood under control commercials while controlling his dribbling. Fuck those Pistons teams too. Watching him patrol the sidelines will be impossible for me. No. Fuck him and fuck Dolan, sell the team NOW!!!!

MFS62 Jun 22 2006 04:35 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jun 22 2006 07:42 PM

I hated Him as a collegian. I didn't know much about him at the time. His team was in the NCAAs and he had the ball in the closing seconds with an opportunity to beat a team I really disliked at the time (UCLA? Duke?). Or maybe I was rooting for Bobby Night. Anyhow, Thomas came down the right sideline to set up the play--- and dribbled the ball off his foot out of bounds. And he still had that punk grin on his face. Later

Nymr83 Jun 22 2006 06:02 PM

]clooegian. Collegian?

MFS62 Jun 22 2006 07:43 PM

yes. Later

Johnny Dickshot Jun 22 2006 08:23 PM

]sell the team NOW!!!! Misty-colored memmmmmmories.... of the wayyyy we were...

Elster88 Jun 23 2006 07:12 AM

metsmarathon wrote: "Larry Brown was fired by the Knicks this morning after just one, surprisingly tumultuous season as their head coach." is this above sentence grammatically correct? it seems to me there should be perhaps either no comma between one and tumultuous, or there should be a second comma after tumultuous. it just doesnt look right. the grammar, and the firing, both. stupid knicks. Put the grammar aside for a second. What the HELL is the word "surprisingly" doing in that sentence???

Edgy DC Jun 23 2006 07:17 AM

I imagine the surprise is that Larry Brown's teams tend to win. Now winning may not preclude tumultousness, depending on your definition of "tumult,"

Elster88 Jun 23 2006 07:24 AM

There was no surprise about this season. For the non-winning, everyone except Vic realized this team sucked long before Opening Night. For the tumult, Larry is a "my way or the highway" controlling coach who focuses on defense and team play, Stephon Marbury is the most uncoachable player in the history of basketball (who focuses on creating his own offense off the dribble during every play), and Isiah Thomas not only conspicuously hangs out in one of those tunnels during every home game keeping an eye on everything, but he's the worst GM in the history of basketball. Not a recipe for tranquility.

metirish Jun 23 2006 08:51 AM

I hope next season the Knicks lose even more games, Thomas is a snake along with Mills and Dolan is an absolute fool to be listening to them, Brown has his history but at least he has a good coaching resume, what was once a model franchise is now the biggest joke in sports.

soupcan Jun 23 2006 09:07 AM

="Frayed Knot"]"The Knicks, contending that Brown violated several provisions of his contract, fired him "for cause," and thus do not intend to pay him balance of his contract, in excess of $40 million" Yeah, good luck with that. Totally. If I'm Brown I am holding them up for the entire $40 mil. Even if it means that I have to remain an employee in some capacity. How cool would it be to go to a Knick game, go to the bathroom and there's Larry Brown mopping the floor with a shit-eating grin on his face?

Elster88 Jun 23 2006 09:11 AM

LOL, soupcan.

RealityChuck Jun 23 2006 09:36 AM

metsmarathon wrote: "Larry Brown was fired by the Knicks this morning after just one, surprisingly tumultuous season as their head coach." is this above sentence grammatically correct? it seems to me there should be perhaps either no comma between one and tumultuous, or there should be a second comma after tumultuous. Not a grammar issue, but you're right that it needs either two commas or none. I'd go with none, but two works from a punctuation standpoint.

metsmarathon Jun 23 2006 12:17 PM

from wikipedia (quick! edit it so i'm wrong!) [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comma_%28punctuation%29]comma[/url] ] Grammar The comma has several uses in English grammar: back to the knicks sucking... boy do they suck.

Edgy DC Jun 23 2006 12:30 PM

There should be a comma after "boy."

Vic Sage Jun 23 2006 12:32 PM

Elster88 wrote: There was no surprise about this season... everyone except Vic realized this team sucked long before Opening Night.. Yes, 88, everyone realized it except for me... me and the number of professional sportstalk prognosticators who thought they were at least a .500 team, likely to get into the playoffs. If everybody knew this team would fail to win 30 games this season, why was the constant theme for every sports show and column that covered the Knicks that "wow, how could this happen to a team with this much talent?" Obviously you called it right, and we all called it wrong. But stop painting me as a lunatic for having disagreed with you at the outset.

Vic Sage Jun 23 2006 12:43 PM

here is the thread where we first addressed Brown's firing: http://cybermessageboard.ehost.com/getalife/viewtopic.php?t=381&start=260

TheOldMole Jun 23 2006 01:16 PM

If you bracket "surprisingly" with commas, it suggests that it's a surprise that there was only one tumultous season. Leave out the commas and the suggestion is that it's surprising how tumultous it was.

Elster88 Jun 23 2006 02:04 PM

Vic Sage wrote: ="Elster88"]There was no surprise about this season... everyone except Vic realized this team sucked long before Opening Night.. Yes, 88, everyone realized it except for me... me and the number of professional sportstalk prognosticators who thought they were at least a .500 team, likely to get into the playoffs. If everybody knew this team would fail to win 30 games this season, why was the constant theme for every sports show and column that covered the Knicks that "wow, how could this happen to a team with this much talent?" Obviously you called it right, and we all called it wrong. But stop painting me as a lunatic for having disagreed with you at the outset. My apologies (SC = zero) I was trying to joke around, only since we've had this discussion a few times before. I won't play the "I told you so" card anymore.

Vic Sage Jun 27 2006 01:26 PM

Dolan and Thomas held a joint press conference to which only the local beat writers and Dolan's own network, MSG, were invited to attend. Dolan the made the following points: - He claimed that he was still willing to keep Larry until their last meeting, when Larry refused to take any responsibility for his mistakes last year... in fact, Brown refused to acknowledge he'd even made any mistakes. He described Brown's mistakes as including - the repeated violatation the team's stated media policy (prohibiting anybody from communicating with players through the press), despite numerous requests for him to stop; - making numerous proposals to other Asst GMs and GMs for unauthorized trades, thus undercutting Isiah's ability to make trades; - advocating for the Jalen Rose and Steve Francis deals, and then failing to play them and knocking them in the press; and furthermore... - demanding that Dolan waive both of them, as well as Marbury, James, and 2 others, requiring MSG to take $180M hit, as a condition for Brown to continue coaching; and - finally, by undercutting Isiah's authority as a GM, and by bashing the players he'd himself requested, and by failing to return many of Isiah's calls, Brown had damaged his relationship with his boss. When Brown refused to acknowledge any of this, Dolan fired him. Then, the shocker... Dolan announced that Isiah has ONE YEAR to turn things around or he'll be fired, too! Isiah looked stunned by that news, and was unusually quiet about the situation, except to say how angry and dissapointed he is with Brown for putting him in this position, and expressing confidence that he can turn things around this year. question: HOW MUCH OF THIS IS TRUE AND HOW MUCH IS SELF-SERVING BULLSHIT? I would take comfort in Dolan's declaration regarding Isiah's short leash, except that all Thomas need do to keep his job is show real, "measurable improvement". And since they only won 29 games last year, it'll be hard for them NOT to show improvement. question: IF THEY LOSE 50+ GAMES AGAIN NEXT YEAR, WILL DOLAN FIRE HIMSELF? If not, then that ray of hope at the end of the tunnel is likely just another oncoming train, returning on its regular route to run over Knicks fans once more.

metirish Jun 27 2006 01:30 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jun 27 2006 01:59 PM

] Then, the shocker... Dolan announced that Isiah has ONE YEAR to turn things around or he'll be fired, too thought Thomas looked shocked when Dolan said that, certainly it looked like that was news to him....I hope he falls flat on his face, what kind of Knick fan does that make me?...

Nymr83 Jun 27 2006 01:44 PM

it makes you the kind of fan this team needs, the kind that realizes that one or even five bad years are just fine as long as they lead to something better. if going 0-82 gets rid of thomas while going 31-51 keeps him i'd rather lose every game because it is in the best long-term interest of the team (imo) to get rid of him.

Centerfield Jun 27 2006 02:36 PM

I imagine the press conference was an absolute joy for everyone in the Detroit front office.

TheOldMole Jun 27 2006 04:41 PM

I didn't start out by rooting against Isaiah, but I sure am now.

Rockin' Doc Jun 28 2006 08:06 PM

Renaldo Balkman? The Knicks are absolutely clueless. They deserve to suck.

MFS62 Jun 28 2006 08:08 PM

Two in a row for the Nets from UCONN. They needed a backup point guard - check The needed an athletic shot blocking rebounder - check The Knicks picked a "Who the fuck is HE?" - double check. Nice. Later

Edgy DC Jun 29 2006 07:04 AM

Brown files grievance over firing from Knicks June 29, 2006 NEW YORK (AP) -- Former Knicks coach Larry Brown filed a grievance with the NBA against the team, saying New York owes him the remainder of his salary after firing him, according to published reports Thursday. Brown, who says the Knicks should pay him $40 million, filed the grievance Wednesday, the New York Daily News and New York Post reported. The Knicks, who fired the coach after one season, claim they're not obligated to pay the full amount because Brown violated terms of his contract. The Knicks contend Brown broke Madison Square Garden policy with his roadside interviews, a decision the team believes could save them millions. Brown's contract had a clause that designates NBA commissioner David Stern as the arbitrator in any financial dispute he has with the Knicks. "I've been requested by both sides to help arbitrate," Stern told the New York Post. "I don't think there's any timetable to what we're doing." In Brown's lone season in New York, the Knicks stumbled to a 23-59 record -- second worst in the NBA and matching the most losses in club history. But Brown's public feud with Stephon Marbury and criticism of other players may have angered owner James Dolan more than the losing.

Methead Jun 29 2006 08:19 AM

I think it's time for the Knicks to show us the plan.

MFS62 Jun 29 2006 08:25 AM

Methead wrote: I think it's time for the Knicks to show us the plan. They don't need no steenking plan. They need an inside presence, an unselfishpoint guard, a good coach and a good GM. The plan will take care of itself. Later

Elster88 Jun 29 2006 08:43 AM

MFS62 wrote: They need an inside presence, an unselfishpoint guard, a good coach and a good GM. Well that's a relief, seeing as how the Knicks have none of those things, haha.

Rockin' Doc Jun 29 2006 11:38 AM

Yeah, but they will soon have a 6' 5.5" small forward without an outside shot. They're a lock to win at least 25 games next year. Hey, Isiah assembled this collections of malcontents and egos, so now he has to try to get them to actually play as a team. Good luck with that small task. Thankfully, I gave up caring about the NBA 8-10 years ago. Only a sense of morbid curiosity (likely resulting from this thread) made me look at the Knicks draft choices.

Vic Sage Jun 29 2006 01:33 PM

sigh.

MFS62 Jun 29 2006 01:36 PM

Some pretty funny stuff here. His darts hit their target more often than not. ]Winners and losers By Dan Wetzel, Yahoo! Sports June 29, 2006 In terms of pure entertainment, the NBA draft never ever fails to deliver. From the suits, to the names, to the haircuts, to the bozo selections, to the impeccable ESPN commentating crew of Dan Patrick, Screamin' A. Smith, Jay Bilas and Greg Anthony, you just can't lose. If they could figure out how to do this thing weekly, it would be bigger than "American Idol." Where else do you get the Portland Trail Blazers selecting a 6-foot-11 English guy that no one has seen play, and Patrick, in lieu of real commentary, immediately deadpanning, "He was discovered bagging groceries?" Patrick then threw it to Fran Fraschilla, the "international guru" who made a "paper or plastic" crack. Just imagine the confusion that engulfed Zach Randolph when he heard a potential teammate might have a "bag" and "paper." That, folks, is NBA draft magic. The Trail Blazers were all over the first round. But what were the odds that despite selecting three players and making four trades they still didn't get the guy named Douby? That seemed like the biggest lock since Travis Outlaw was in the draft and, naturally, Portland snatched him up in the first round in 2003. Of course, the Blazers did land someone nicknamed "Spanish Chocolate" (Sergio Rodriguez) whom Patrick, when mentioning the player's propensity for turnovers, declared "he keeps both teams in the game." And you wonder why David Stern stopped the proceedings at one point to ask whether ESPN would praise any of the picks. Why should they? It's all part of the fun on one of the great nights in sports and entertainment. So without further ado, here are the NBA draft's winners and losers. WINNER: Portland Trail Blazers I know the ESPN crew was claiming Portland didn't need to make all those trades to wind up with Texas center LaMarcus Aldridge, Washington guard Brandon Roy, Spanish Chocolate, the English Grocery Bagger and, in a trade with the Boston Celtics, Raef LaFrentz and Dan Dickau. But who cares? In the end, the Blazers got an athletic big man (Aldridge) and the best player in the draft (Roy), rid themselves of Sebastian Telfair, who was a lottery mistake two years ago and hasn't done much but a half-decent documentary since, and added a couple white guys the season-ticket holders always like. Not that Portland is going to begin contending in the Western Conference, but that is a better team post-draft than pre-draft. As a bonus, none of the players appear to have outstanding arrest warrants, recently starred in the California Penal League or went to Baylor under Dave Bliss. It's a start. LOSER: Isiah Thomas The NBA draft is Christmas in June for Detroit Lions president Matt Millen, the day that Isiah Thomas reaffirms to everyone that it is he, and not Millen, who is the worst executive in professional sports. Called a "bum" by one Knicks fan in the crowd, Train Wreck Thomas used the 20th pick on an undersized forward out of South Carolina who never averaged double-figure points or rebounds, exasperating even the mild-mannered Bilas and prompting him to rip Isiah to shreds. In addition to his general manager duties, Thomas was named Knicks coach late last week and was immediately declared a lame duck by owner James Dolan, who has all the brains of a Manhattan manhole cover. Nothing ensures maximum effort like letting the players know that, if they lose, the coach that is screaming at them to pass the ball will be fired. Fortunately, with a roster that includes Stephon Marbury, Eddy Curry and Stevie Franchise Killer, effort is never a question with the Knicks. Anyway, Isiah needs immediate help to save his career. So, naturally, he takes Renaldo Balkman, a prospect that no one thought was going to crack the top 40 picks. After Bilas ripped the move out of shock – "he's a second-rounder … no one would have made this pick" – he tried to recover by comparing Balkman to a potential Dennis Rodman. Yeah, well, the Potential Dennis Rodman averaged 4.6, 4.8 and 6.3 rebounds a game the last three years. Unless Balkman has a lot of tattoos, a drinking problem and a habit to land ridiculously hot women, I can't see where Rodman fits in the discussion. On the bright side, Balkman was the MVP of the NIT. That says something, right? WINNER: Connecticut Huskies Marcus Williams, who once led the nation in steals, fell to the 20s as questions about his character and conditioning plagued him, but four Huskies – Rudy Gay (No. 8, traded to Memphis), Hilton Armstrong (No. 12, New Orleans), Williams (No. 22, New Jersey) and Josh Boone (No. 23, New Jersey) – went in the first round. They all have guaranteed contracts. Another Husky, Denham Brown, went to the Seattle SuperSonics in the second round. George Mason had no one selected. So UConn has that going for it, which is nice. And, judging by some of these guys' effort during the year, they might actually think they got one over on the Patriots. Meanwhile, those Mason guys, now preparing for life in middle management, had to be sitting at home cursing their fate. "I crushed that guy in the Elite Eight and now I am in management training for Wal-Mart and he's about to hit the VIP room at Scores?" LOSER: Boston Celtics Randy Foye, a big, tough, mature and ready-to-help combo guard out of Villanova, was selected at No. 7 with Boston's original pick. Brandon Roy, a big, tough, mature and ready-to-help guard out of Washington and arguably the best player in the draft, was selected at No. 6, a selection that was later used in a trade for the No. 7, Boston's original pick. If you can follow the above paragraph, the Celtics, who have a small window to win before Paul Pierce falls from his prime, could conceivably have had either Foye or Roy – two players that would have made an immediate impact. Instead, they traded the pick for a fading Theo Ratliff and Sebastian Telfair, an inconsistent, undersized point guard who in two years in Portland showed he still needs at least two years to become anything. Does that make sense to you? Well, in the trade with the Blazers, the Celtics got rid of Raef LaFrentz's dog three-year contract. Of course, they picked up Ratliff's dog two-year contract. And yes, there is still the Allen Iverson trade possibility, but for the purpose of this column, we are talking about Wednesday night only. So how about then trading a future No. 1 for a faded Brian Grant and the rights to Rajon Rondo, an inconsistent, undersized point guard who in two years at the University of Kentucky showed he still needs at least two years to become anything. In fact, Rondo isn't even Telfair. He has no outside shot, no basketball acumen and not much other than fantastic athletic ability. On a positive note, Rondo did just oversee two of the worst seasons in UK history, so he has that working for him. WINNER: New Jersey Nets Marcus Williams may have stolen some laptops and showed up at some workouts a bit heavy, but the guy can really play the point. He was an assassin in so many games as the one Husky with true heart in crunch time. Everyone had him as the No. 1 point guard on the board and here he falls to the Nets, with an aging Jason Kidd. Whereas Rod Thorn is not Isiah Thomas, New Jersey jumped at the gift. It says here Williams is going to be a very good player for a very long time. WINNER: Memphis Grizzlies One of UConn coach Jim Calhoun's secrets for success is his ability to take once-aloof talents and teach them to develop a champion's heart. He got the most out of Donyell Marshall, Ray Allen, Caron Butler, Ben Gordon and others through the years. For some reason – a failure that probably cost him a third national title – Calhoun could never get that switch to flip inside Rudy Gay during the forward's two years in Storrs. That said, while Gay may let the game come to him too often, he was still the most talented player in college basketball last season. At 6-foot-9 and amazingly smooth, his potential is extreme. Maybe Gay just becomes a classic glider in the NBA. But maybe he is a megastar. The Grizzlies now have a big-time talent that can put them over the top. In a trade with the Houston Rockets, it cost them Shane Battier, a solid player but not one that was going to elevate the franchise's fortunes. That's a worthy roll of the dice. WINNER: Spanish Chocolate Not the chocolate companies of Spain, which received a lot of free marketing due to the colorful nickname of guard Sergio Rodriguez. No, I mean Sergio Rodriguez, the man. He was picked by the Phoenix Suns at No. 27, then traded to Portland for cash and cash only. The deal offers Rodriguez a unique perspective on life. It is rare – unless, of course, you are a Southeastern Conference recruit – that you are bartered exclusively for monetary considerations, which is why man, through the ages, has long struggled with defining his actual quantifiable worth. Sergio, of all people, now knows. Hegel would be jealous. LOSER: Seattle SuperSonics The Sonics are fighting fan disinterest while trying to get Washington tax payers to pony up for a new stadium. So what do they do to drum up interest on draft night with the 10th overall selection? Maybe work a trade to get hometown hero Brandon Roy? Or local favorite Adam Morrison? No. How about pick up Senegal's Saer Sene, who they will keep overseas to save money. I can't imagine why that franchise is in trouble. WINNER: Dan Patrick So the dye job is unnerving, but he is exceptional hosting this thing. He is appropriately light, doesn't act like this is too important and, unlike Chris "You're with me, Leather" Berman, doesn't tip off the pick 10 seconds before it is announced with some horrible pun or play on words. He even knew how to use Stephen A.'s well-needed emotion properly while balancing in the more straight-forward Bilas and Greg Anthony. The NBA always has better halftime and postgame shows than other sports (it's a shame TNT can't loan out Charles Barkley) because the league doesn't act like this is the War on Terror. I can't wait until next year. WINNER: J.J. Redick We had serious questions about his game. He may be the ACC's all-time leading scorer with an undeniable shooting touch, but he can't create his own shot, drive the lane or play defense. He looked like the Trajan Langdon or Mateen Cleaves of this draft – a rotation guy at best. But the Orlando Magic gets him and suddenly he is with a team that has a drive-and-pass point guard in Jameer Nelson and a double-team-drawing big man in Dwight Howard, who is also a menacing shot blocker who can clean up those defensive embarrassments. Redick might get some open looks. He couldn't have dreamed it up much better. LOSER: Dick Vitale We are still a fan of Vitale, but after his gush fest with Redick (even joking J.J. owes him tickets for all the positive pub), he can no longer wonder why they call him Duke Vitale. Yeah, he's positive about all college guys (unless they leave early) and is generally a great thing for college basketball, but sometimes enough is enough. WINNER: Chicago Bulls Chicago wanted some size and some athletes and it got them in 6-9 Tyrus Thomas out of LSU, Portland's 6-9 Viktor Khryapa and 6-7 Thabo Sefolosha of Switzerland. The Bulls basically decided that Thomas and LaMarcus Aldridge were equals and then smartly got Portland to give them a decent bench guy (Khryapa) to make the decision for them. That's good draft management. In reality, Thomas has better potential because he is such a breath-taking athlete who has received minimal coaching. The interesting thing about Sefolosha is that he is known by some as the best defensive player in Europe, which is like being declared the thick side of Adam Morrison's mustache. But, then again, that's life at the NBA draft. Later

Elster88 Jun 29 2006 01:48 PM

]That seemed like the biggest lock since Travis Outlaw was in the draft and, naturally, Portland snatched him up in the first round in 2003. Copycat

Elster88 Jun 29 2006 01:50 PM

]WINNER: Connecticut Huskies Marcus Williams, who once led the nation in steals, fell to the 20s as questions about his character and conditioning plagued him, but four Huskies – Rudy Gay (No. 8, traded to Memphis), Hilton Armstrong (No. 12, New Orleans), Williams (No. 22, New Jersey) and Josh Boone (No. 23, New Jersey) – went in the first round. They all have guaranteed contracts. Another Husky, Denham Brown, went to the Seattle SuperSonics in the second round. George Mason had no one selected. So UConn has that going for it, which is nice. And, judging by some of these guys' effort during the year, they might actually think they got one over on the Patriots. Meanwhile, those Mason guys, now preparing for life in middle management, had to be sitting at home cursing their fate. "I crushed that guy in the Elite Eight and now I am in management training for Wal-Mart and he's about to hit the VIP room at Scores?" I'm getting angry all over again.

Vic Sage Jun 30 2006 08:44 AM

second thoughts on first impressions... i was furious on draft night. Balkman? over Williams? AAAARGGHHHH! But i've been giving it some thought. Williams obviously had enough red flags to drop out of the lottery all the way down to 20. So it wasn't just the Knicks who didn't pick him. And, if you made a list of Knicks needs going into next season, defense and toughness would've been at the top of my list, not scoring. So getting a defensive SF and a defensive G makes sense to me. Especially in a draft as unremarkable as this year's was. HOWEVER... Picking Balkman at #20 reminds me of Omar's trade of Cameron. It wasn't that he traded Cameron that bothered me, nor the acquisition of Nady. It was the undervaluing of assets that fueled my ire. Cameron is a 30/30 gold glove CFer. Despite injuries, he still had value. Many teams (including the BoSox before they traded for Crisp) were searching for such a player. But Minaya gave him away for a marginal part-time player. Why? Because he was too impatient to wait for the right deal. He had to clear salary to sign Wagner, and trade for LoDuca and Delgado. Cameron-Nady was not a "value" trade. Same thing with picking Balkman. Isiah might be right, and though the kid is likely not the second coming of Ron Artest, he might prove to be a valuable role-player, shutting down the other team's hot scoring wing. However, there was every indication that he could've been had at #29, and probably in the 2nd round as well. So, when presented with the opportunity to pick at #20, with a lottery pick still on the board, why not trade down? I can understand Isiah's reluctance to pick Marcus Williams. Red flags all over, as i said. Plus an abundance of PGs already on the Knicks' roster. Lets remember Isiah is on a 1-YEAR DEAL so picking a potential "PG of the future", especially one who is as likely to be Pearl Washington as he is Mark Jackson, was not on his agenda. Marbury is his guy, for better or for worse. But a PG with lottery-pick talent obviously has value to SOME team at the bottom of the 1st round, evidenced by the Nets picking him at 22. More than likely there was a team who might've taken a gamble on Williams' upside for the small cost of a 2nd round pick. If the knicks had swapped 1st rounders and picked up a 2nd round pick, they still could've gotten Balkman and Collins (who i kind of like), and another player who might have developed into something. Maybe a big man they could've left in Europe for a year, like the Nets did with Kristc a few years ago. Because they still need a big, rebounding shot-blocking PF/C. But they didn't do it. Isiah says Phoenix would've taken Balkman at 21 or 27, but Phoenix has denied it. Who can say what is true? But what is true is that the Knicks were sitting there with a highly projected talent on their plate. If they didn't want him (and I understand why they didn't), they should've turned that opportunity into greater value than they ultimately obtained. THAT is my beef with the pick. I actually think Balkman and Collins can fit nicely into a rotation next year. I tend to trust Isiah's draft judgment (if nothing else). But he certainly could have done better, given the situation he found himself in. And THAT is why I sigh... :( current roster: PG - Marbury / Robinson / Collins** SG - Francis / Crawford / Richardson SF - J.Rose-x / Lee / Balkman** (Woods*, Udoka*) Pf - Frye / M.Rose / Taylor-x C - Curry / James (Butler*) * free agents ** rookies -x expiring contract Isiah said in today's NYPost he isn't looking to trade the expiring contracts of Rose and Taylor, intending to just let them expire after this season, to try and eventually get some cap room. He also said they are unlikely to use the cap exceptions for FAs. Apparently, Dolan has not only put Isiah on a short leash, but on a budget as well. He's also repeatedly rebuffed requests for any of his rookie class of last year. So, while he'd like to move Rose and Taylor, Dolan won't let him. And while he'd like to move Francis, James and Richardson, they'll be impossible to move under these constraints. At this point, i'm just hoping they re-sign Butler, who showed promise last season, or some big defensive PF/C who can grab a few rebounds and block a few shots. I'm also hoping that, with Brown gone, Francis and Rose will get minutes and show up to play, and that playing for Thomas rejuvenates Marbury, and Isiah can instill some confidence in the kids. A .500 season is possible. a playoff berth unlikely but within striking distance. One thing for sure, they won't suck as much as last year. I don't see how they could... or how ANY team could. Projected rotation (based on current roster): starters (5): Marbury / Francis / J.Rose / Frye / Curry subs (4): Crawford / Robinson / Butler* / Balkman bench (3): Lee, M.Rose, Collins IR (3): Taylor, Richardson, James

ABG Jul 05 2006 09:15 AM

Well the Bulls got Ben Wallace, which, along with their already good young team, makes the likelihood that their pick will be in the mid to late twenties. Why should we care? Because the Knicks will be swapping picks with the Bulls next year, assuming the Bulls want to (ha!) What a great trade.

Elster88 Jul 07 2006 02:15 PM

[url]http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/060707[/url] The second to last section (LeBron's) is basically speculative...um...crap. But it still makes me loathe Isiah more. Which I didn't think was possible.

Elster88 Jul 07 2006 02:17 PM

]current roster: PG - Marbury / Robinson / Collins** SG - Francis / Crawford / Richardson SF - J.Rose-x / Lee / Balkman** (Woods*, Udoka*) Pf - Frye / M.Rose / Taylor-x C - Curry / James (Butler*) * free agents ** rookies -x expiring contract The saddest part of this....and there are quite a few sad parts....is the number of expiring contracts.

TheOldMole Jul 08 2006 02:53 AM

They're stuck with everybody.

Elster88 Jul 10 2006 12:14 PM

Supposedly, the link on [url=http://sports.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=and%201%20mix%20tape&page=multimedia&src=m_fp&rT=sports]this page[/url] shows a player doing a 720 degree dunk. I don't believe it, but can neither confirm nor deny from the computer that I am currently sitting in front of.

Rockin' Doc Jul 10 2006 08:39 PM

I'd give him credit for 540 when he dunked it and the final 180 was on the way down after the dunk. Pretty impressive none the less. They really play tough defense on that travelling streetball tour of And 1 Mix Tape.

Vic Sage Jul 12 2006 09:45 AM Summer League

I've been watching some of the summer league games. young Knicks playing pretty well, with a starting 5 of Robinson, Collins, Balkman, Lee and Frye. Frye sprained an ankle in one of the early games, and hasn't played since. Robinson, on the other hand, broke his nose and continued playing. He made a circus dunk on a breakaway that summarized the best and worst aspects of the modern game. Instead of getting benched for it, Isiah was "i hope he does more of that". Clearly, the reins are off this kid, for better or worse. Collins has showed absolutely nothing so far. Likely a 12th man or an IR guy. Balkman has played like you'd expect, strong, good runner, good rebounder for his size, can finish, but can't shoot worth a damn. On D, he can stay with his guy, and works hard, but leaves his feet too soon. he dives for every loose ball. He'll be an adequate bench guy, giving you 10-15 high energy minutes defending the other team's SG or SF. But the really great thing to watch is David Lee. I've always liked this kid and i never understood why Brown jerked him around so much, considering he's exactly the kind of smart, hard-working, talented player that Brown likes. His lack of an outside shot should've been worked on, not cause to bury him. When playing smaller, quicker SFs, he should've defended the PF, not yanked out of the lineup. Now, finally getting an opportunity, he's been scoring 15-20 points with 10+ reb/game. His shooting has progressed and he continues to play with the kind of all-out hustle and D he's always had. He has great hands, which gets him steals and rebounds, and allows him to be an excellent finisher and interior passer, and a pretty good ball-handler for his size. In fact, he was amongst the best players in Vegas this last week, according to this article: http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2516764 Hopefully, Isiah will start him this season, upfront with Frye, and he'll continue to develop as the kind of DeBusscherian big small forward he seems he can be. He lacks great quickness necessary to defend the quicker SFs, and he lacks size and strength to effectively defend against stronger PFs, but with those great hands, he has enough quickness, strength and, more importantly, smarts and determination, to play overall good D at either position. If he can consistently hit a mid-size J, he could be a regular 15-pt/10-reb/4-assist/2-steal guy, which would make him a borderline all-star. In fact, i think his likely upside is better than Frye's.

MFS62 Jul 12 2006 11:04 AM

About Lee: ]Hopefully, Isiah will start him this season, upfront with Frye, and he'll continue to develop as the kind of DeBusscherian big small forward he seems he can be. He lacks great quickness necessary to defend the quicker SFs, and he lacks size and strength to effectively defend against stronger PFs, but with those great hands, he has enough quickness, strength and, more importantly, smarts and determination, to play overall good D at either position. If he can consistently hit a mid-size J, he could be a regular 15-pt/10-reb/4-assist/2-steal guy, which would make him a borderline all-star. Or, another Dave Budd. Later

Vic Sage Aug 02 2006 09:55 AM

How much does Eddie Curry suck, you ask? I just came across this bit of analysis by Matt Buser in his "Big Picture: Market Watch" column on Yahoo fantasy sports: ]EDDY CURRY LINE: 05-06 final standings For those of you who need a refresher, I established the Eddy Curry Line to help point out how truly anemic Eddy Curry's overall game is. The standard: a player must average more turnovers than assists, steals, and blocks combined – in order to qualify, you must have played in at least 41 games and recorded at least 20 minutes of playing time per game. I am pleased (and not surprised) to announce that, for the fourth consecutive season, Curry was comfortably in this territory. In 72 games, Curry recorded 103 positive stats (19 assists, 28 steals, and 56 blocks) and 179 turnovers, good for a pristine 0.58:1 ratio. The only other player to join Curry at this level of ineptitude this past season was Jamaal Magloire. In 82 games, he recorded 165 positive stats (56 assists, 29 steals, and 80 blocks) and 166 turnovers, just barely in the negative with a 0.994:1 ratio. Congrats, or perhaps condolences, to Magloire. The bottom five among qualifiers in the Eddy Curry Line standings were as follows: Ben Wallace (5.51:1), Charlie Bell (4.73:1), Brevin Knight (4.70:1), Rasheed Wallace (4.62:1), and Chauncey Billups (4.58:1).

Vic Sage Aug 02 2006 10:54 AM

Its an amusing stat, but is it "cherrypicking" to create a category that is unflattering to Curry? well, Curry does suck, so its hard to make that argument. still, the stat doesn't include rebounds as "positive stats", or even just offensive rebounds. 2ndly, it doesn't put the positive/negative ratio in context of a player's scoring. for example, if you add Curry's 6 reb/gm avg to his ratio, it averages out to about 7.5 "positive" / 2.5 "negative, for a 3:1 ratio. vs, for example, Timberwolves center Mark Blount = 7.1/2.4 = 2.96:1 I would think that, if you found the ratio of "positive" to "negative" stats (including rebounds), Curry would still have a crappy one, but maybe not THE worst (especially if you then put that ratio in a scoring context). so instead of the "Curry Line", maybe it should be referred to as a "Blount intstrument"?

Vic Sage Aug 07 2006 08:16 AM

Knicks just signed FA Jared Jeffries from Washington, for the full mid-level exception. He's a good defensive, athletic, young front-court player, who can't score. He takes Butler's spot on the roster, filling up the 15-man roster. [u:d5214f91aa]possible depth chart:[/u:d5214f91aa] PG - Marbury / Robinson / Collins** SG - Francis / Crawford / Richardson SF - Jeffries / Balkman** / J.Rose -x Pf - Frye / Lee / M.Rose / Taylor-x C - Curry / James ** - rookies x - expiring contract [u:d5214f91aa]Possible rotation:[/u:d5214f91aa] starters (5): Marbury / Francis / Jeffries / Frye / Curry subs (5): Crawford / Robinson / Balkman / Lee / James bench (2): Richardson, M.Rose IR (3): Taylor -x, J.Rose - x, Collins**

Giant Squidlike Creature Sep 12 2006 03:11 PM

Demoting this to the archives for the time being, but give a ringy-dingy when y'all have some Knicks news and it'll return to the NBF.