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Who's zoomin' who?

soupcan Oct 16 2006 09:15 PM

I get the distinct impression from things I've heard and quotes I've read during this Cards-Mets series that the Cardinals are going out of their way to disrespect my favorite team From Pujols saying that Glavine 'wasn't very good' in Game 1, to LaRussa giving no credit to the Mets hitters last night, saying basically that if his hitters were given fastballs down the middle they would've hit them too. What's up with that? Doesn't it go against conventional wisdom not to rile your opponent up? Anybody else thinking this? I'd be curious to see what Mets players have to say about this, if anything, should they be lucky enough to win the series.

Edgy DC Oct 16 2006 10:00 PM

I think we should pick the lineup out of a hat tomorrow night.

soupcan Oct 16 2006 10:02 PM

And that would address this issue how?

Edgy DC Oct 16 2006 10:04 PM

It would be a humiliating way to beat them.

soupcan Oct 16 2006 10:06 PM

I can't believe that they don't respect the Mets I just don't understand the strategy - if in fact is their strategy and not just my over active imagination. Do you see the same trend?

Edgy DC Oct 16 2006 10:26 PM

I guess they're taking responsibility for their performance. It's pretty de rigueur in this age of talk radio looking to rip people for not doing so.

Rockin' Doc Oct 16 2006 10:42 PM

Sounds like La Genius is disrespecting his own pitchers at the same time he is trying to discredit the Mets hitters.

metsmarathon Oct 16 2006 10:59 PM

i think he's trying to rile his own team up. "they aren't better than you, and yet they beat you. wtf, guys! sack up, and kick some ass"

cooby Oct 16 2006 11:07 PM

Rockin' Doc wrote: Sounds like La Genius is disrespecting his own pitchers at the same time he is trying to discredit the Mets hitters. Exactly

Nymr83 Oct 17 2006 12:32 AM

Edgy DC wrote: I think we should pick the lineup out of a hat tomorrow night. green, loduca, pitcher, reyes, wright, delgado, valentin, beltran, chavez lets do it! (well, bat the pitcher 9th but otherwise what the hell!)

metirish Oct 17 2006 09:07 AM

Not all Cardinal players are talking crap. http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/story/462431p-389042c.html

Johnny Dickshot Oct 17 2006 09:09 AM

I think it's indicative of an unhappy Cardinal's nest. Despite the success of winning the division it's been a difficult year for them with injuries and stretches of uninspired play. I'm pretty sure LaRussa's been on the job longer than any NL manager and despite lots of stronmg finishes, no World titles. You wonder if he gets the boot if they don't turn this around. They will have to with an injured Pujols (?!?) and an unhappy Rolen: ]Rain, Plot Thicken: Pujols, Rolen are story of day By Joe Strauss ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH Tuesday, Oct. 17 2006 A daylong rain postponed Monday's Game 5 of the National League Championship Series, allowing Cardinals starting pitcher Jeff Weaver and New York Mets 40-something lefthander Tom Glavine to return tonight on regular rather than short rest. The inclement weather did nothing, however, to hide growing concerns about Albert Pujols' tight right hamstring and, by extension, lingering frustration with third baseman Scott Rolen's discontent. Cardinals manager Tony La Russa conceded Monday afternoon that Pujols' production and mobility against the Mets are being hampered by a condition that has nagged him for much of the last two months but become particularly acute since the division series. "We've been watching him run. He's been told to stay under control," La Russa noted. "The other day when he scored in the first inning from first base I was holding my breath." The reigning National League most valuable player has so far been held to four hits without an RBI in the 2-2 NLCS. He is without an RBI in the last six games, a span of 21 at-bats, and labored noticeably to run out ground balls in Sunday's 12-5 loss. La Russa suggested Pujols' hamstring pull is serious enough that he may consider playing either rookie Chris Duncan or Scott Spiezio at first base should it deteriorate further. "The other thing you worry about is two outs, ninth inning, and there's a ball in the hole. What is he going to do, check up, or is he going to run?" La Russa said. "It would not be out of the question that if he was on third base with one out, to win the game I would pinch run for him. "I think it's not just soreness. He's had a problem before that was significant enough to mention." Pujols has dealt with hamstring issues at some point in each of six major league seasons but still led the club in stolen bases last season and until recently had continued to push for extra bases. Pujols' baserunning has come under increasing scrutiny since the first round of the playoffs. He was doubled off first base on right fielder Juan Encarnacion's shallow fly ball in the fourth inning of Game 1. Pujols appeared to have trouble reversing himself on the play after straying more than halfway to second base. On Sunday night, Mets first baseman Carlos Delgado received an error for dropping a throw resulting from a Pujols grounder that deflected from third baseman David Wright to shortstop Jose Reyes. Reyes' throw still beat Pujols by a step, but Delgado dropped the assist. Monday afternoon, La Russa attributed Pujols' recent power outage to the No. 3 hitter's inability to drive off the right leg. "I know he's proven he can still hit line drives. But it's tougher for him to generate that big power push. But he can hit a line drive out of the park," La Russa said. Pujols was among the first wave to depart Busch Stadium after Monday's game was postponed and could not be reached regarding La Russa's description. The manager said that Pujols admitted a growing problem when he recently approached him, and contrasted the situation to that involving sore-shouldered Rolen. Rolen chafed when benched for Game 4 of the first round against the San Diego Padres and in Game 2 of the NLCS against Mets rookie John Maine. Communication between the two has been strained ever since Rolen referred to his late-season absence against Houston Astros ace Roy Oswalt as being "benched." Without advance notice from La Russa, Rolen was surprised to find his name nowhere on Thursday's lineup card. The manager countered that Rolen's reaction in Houston convinced him that whatever explanation he offered would not be acceptable. "He has sway. I gave him a lot of discussion," said La Russa, who did not play Rolen against the Padres after Rolen admitted to a "weak" left shoulder. La Russa and team trainers had approached Rolen repeatedly about the condition of his surgically repaired shoulder and received assurances it was fine. "I gave him a half dozen honest reasons why I didn't play him in Houston. His interpretation was I benched him," La Russa said. "I think it's hypocritical to sit him down and explain why I'm not going to play him this game." Rolen played in Games 3 and 4 and was on Monday night's lineup card. The third baseman insisted Monday that the shoulder would not require further treatment or special exercises following the season. Rolen had nothing more to say about his handling but admitted he and the manager have not spoken since last Monday. Addressing the critical nature of tonight's game, Rolen said, "I think Game 5 may have more meaning than Game 2. I don't have any numbers to back that up, but if we go into New York having to win two games, not that it can't be done, but it puts our backs against the wall a bit."

TheOldMole Oct 17 2006 09:18 AM

Scott Speizio seems to be their answer to everything. And Rolen -- just can't be happy, anywhere he goes. And to think I used to want him on the Mets.

Yancy Street Gang Oct 17 2006 09:20 AM

]Addressing the critical nature of tonight's game, Rolen said, "I think Game 5 may have more meaning than Game 2. I don't have any numbers to back that up, but if we go into New York having to win two games, not that it can't be done, but it puts our backs against the wall a bit." Now that's insightful!

Johnny Dickshot Oct 17 2006 09:28 AM

Yup, Rolen's a real stiff.

Edgy DC Oct 17 2006 09:34 AM

He's also a heckuva player that has given them more than I expected. Pujols, meanwhile is worth more as a statue, standing on first base, and walking out his hits than Speizio is healthy. To think we beat them in 2000 with a mostly disabled McGwire. "Wait for the muscleheads to break down... the Mets Way."

Frayed Knot Oct 17 2006 09:37 AM

When the NYDN was reporting it's 'Albert the Grouch' article the other day following his Glavine comments, it also cited an anonymous StL writer as thinking that it was a good thing that he was getting this type of exposure so now the rest of the country would find out what the local scribes already knew; that 'Prince Albert' could be a bit of a pain who wasn't always as pure as his image. Not quite Bonds-like perhaps, but perhaps 'Barry Lite' in the uncooperative/prima donna department. The thing is, it's less likely that that sort of thing gets out when it occurs in a one-newspaper town and that paper is given to being sympathetic to the party line exchange for their near exclusive access. A strong personality like LaRussa (or Whitey before him) is closer to a big-time college coach who, when he wants a story portrayed with a particular slant, is more likely to get his way than he would if multiple outlets were competing for a unique angle on things.

soupcan Oct 17 2006 09:44 AM

That's a good point. Not seeing a lot of Cardinal games I really only knew about Pujols' personality through fluff pieces in magazines. Watching him during the games though, he seems to constantly be instructing his teammates or scowling at them for some reason or another, not taking the extra base when he thinks they should, not making the routine play. Maybe he's right and is trying to be a leader but when I, as a fan, notice that it strikes me as being overly demonstrative and I can't imagine that his teammates appreciate it. The surlyness with reporters surprises me because I've never heard about it coming from him but its not like thats unprecedented for a superstar (Steve Carlton, Eddie Murray, etc.)

Yancy Street Gang Oct 17 2006 09:46 AM

I can't remember, but how many years had Barry Bonds been playing before we learned that he was a jerk?

Johnny Dickshot Oct 17 2006 09:49 AM

I think there's lots of suspicious things about Pujols. Like, his whole background: Dominican teenager shows up at a St. Louis private school for his senior year of HS and gets drafted by the local team in something like the 13th round, summarily breezes through the minors and arrives basically the best player ever from Day 1 of his career. His trainer is fingered in a steroid scandal by Deadspin, which retracts the story suddenly. Frequent hamstring issues. Let's go spread more rumors.

MFS62 Oct 17 2006 09:55 AM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: I can't remember, but how many years had Barry Bonds been playing before we learned that he was a jerk? Depends on when he was playing. And where. I remember reading a story about a pre-draft report filed by a major league scout when Barroid was in college. IIRC, it said: "He will be a very good player for whichever team drafts him. And I hope like Hell it isn't us". And, While Eddie Murray had a stern image to the press, when he got to the Mets, there were many stories written about how his teammates liked him. Later

Frayed Knot Oct 17 2006 10:10 AM

Yeah, teammates liked Murray (a lot), and, maybe to a lesser extent, guys like Carlton and George Hendrick who had bad reps with the press. Bonds never did have that kind of support. Somewhat against my better judgement I recently read the Jeff Pearlman book; 'Love Me, Hate Me' (or something along those lines). I'm usually not into athlete bios - and, unlike the issue-driven 'Game of Shadows', this is a total Barry bio - but I grabbed it out of the local library. Anyway, no matter how big of an A-hole you people thought BB was ... double it ... triple it ... quadruple it if you want ... and you're still not close. And it's not like he suddenly became an ass when he started making the big money; he was an ass in w/Pittsburgh, and ass in the minors, an ass in college, an ass in HR ... you get the picture.

metirish Oct 17 2006 12:50 PM

From the same paper that Dickshot posted the article..... ] Surly Pujols mirrors Bonds at his worst By Bryan Burwell ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH 10/17/2006 Sports Columnist Bryan Burwell [More columns] As he made another hasty and all-too-predictable retreat out of the Cardinals' clubhouse early Monday night, Albert Pujols snatched a crisp white game jersey off a locker stall hook, tossed it over his broad shoulders then slipped out the back door barely uttering a word. As he shuffled down one of Busch Stadium's well-lit back corridors, past the World Series banners and National League pennants that decorated the walls, Pujols already had tugged his dark knit cap down snugly over his head, zipped up the front of his dark sweat suit jacket and gruffly looked back over his shoulder as he prepared to walk out into the miserable, rainy St. Louis night. The National League Championship Series' biggest star had just been presented a gift from Mother Nature when the all-day rains soaked this baseball-crazed city, forced Game 5 to be postponed for 24 hours and gave Pujols and his tender right hamstring muscle an extra day's rest. Only Pujols didn't quite see it that way. "Nah, I wanted to play today," he grumbled before disappearing behind a pair of swinging double doors. It was another day and another night of watching the best player in baseball behave like the bright glare of baseball's postseason was burning a hole in the back of his neck as if he was in an interrogation room. It was another day and another night of trying to understand why he wasn't basking in the warm glow of his own celebrity, why he couldn't quite comprehend why this should be the best of times of his baseball life, not the most unpleasant. For some odd reason, Pujols has once again turned the NLCS into a joyless pursuit of excellence rather than an extraordinary opportunity to display his singular greatness, and I just don't get it. He comes to the ballpark every day and treats people with a needless surly demeanor. Instead of seizing on the chance to step onto baseball's big postseason stage and impress the nation's baseball press with his athletic brilliance, he instead has made quite the impression in the worst kind of way. "Get out of my freakin' locker — you people are a pain in the (butt), you know that?" he snarled last week inside the crowded Shea Stadium visitors' clubhouse after Game 1 was rained out. The greatest hitter in baseball is turning into a mirror image of the man who so gruffly held that title before him. Pujols is turning into Barry Bonds, and believe me, this is not a compliment. This cranky postseason routine is nothing new. It's actually quite reminiscent of his surly behavior at the start of last year's NLCS in Houston, when his foul mood and uncooperative attitude seemed to affect the entire team as the Cards trudged through the early part of that series as if the games were a joyless burden rather than a carefree pleasure. And just as things were starting to look as bad as they could get when the Astros took a three-games-to-one advantage, Pujols lightened up and showed the side of his personality that many of us in St. Louis know but rarely see anymore. Exactly one year ago to the day, Pujols stood in the middle of the visitors' clubhouse in Houston sporting a broad smile and telling everyone that something magical was in the air. "Can we pull off a miracle?'' Pujols asked then. "Of course we can. We just need to win one game. If we can do that, if we can just get past tomorrow, it puts all the pressure on them." He was smiling. He was lighthearted. He was a picture of calm in the midst of a potential storm. And guess what happened the next night? Pujols crashed the most memorable home run of his career, off Brad Lidge, and the Cardinals won Game 5. So now here we are on the first anniversary of that incredible blast, and it seems fitting that Pujols and the Cardinals should be reminded of how good it can be when he doesn't treat the hectic playoff environment with such disdain. Just to be clear, this is not a belated diatribe against his remarks about Mets ace Tom Glavine. He's not the first nor the last great athlete I've met with a competitive fire who refuses to submit to any idea that an opponent got the better of him. Every great athlete I've known or observed closely, from Michael Jordan to Martina Navratilova, from Tiger Woods to Chris Evert, accepted defeat in the same manner. It was never something you did to them, it was always something they did to themselves. "You didn't win. I lost." But here's something else all the great ones have in common: The intense heat of a championship stage always feels comfortable to them. This is not a time to be angry. This is not a time to be miserable. This is a time to crash the walls, Albert, not a time to act like the walls are crashing in on you. http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/sports/columnists.nsf/bryanburwell/story/F7934A0ACA0197ED8625720A0015E4AE?OpenDocument

metirish Oct 17 2006 07:55 PM

Gary reports that after this article came out today pujols could be seen having harsh words with the writer on the field during BP....a little sensitive heh.