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Defeatism

Rotblatt Oct 17 2006 11:46 PM

Carpenter v. Maine? I mean, let's be serious. And even if we're fortunate enough to upset the Cardinals tomorrow, we've got scrubs pitching on Thursday. We had a nice season, and considering we lost two of our top three starters, it's no wonder we couldn't make it to the World Series. May as well just lay our bats down and go quietly into that good night. We'll get 'em next year.

Willets Point Oct 17 2006 11:50 PM

Bullshit! The Mets will go down fighting if they don't clinch the pennant. Carpenter is not great shakes and I think we can count on Maine and the pen. Game 6 will be a Mets victory, you can count on it!

Zvon Oct 17 2006 11:59 PM

Baseball means never throwing in the towl. Never. It might not look so good, but- its baseball-anything can happen. Keep yer chin up... Stiff upper lip and all dat... Dont stop believin.... (im gonna write a book of cliches)

cleonjones11 Oct 18 2006 12:22 AM

Willets Point wrote: Bullshit! The Mets will go down fighting if they don't clinch the pennant. Carpenter is not great shakes and I think we can count on Maine and the pen. Game 6 will be a Mets victory, you can count on it! We have played most of the season with AAA pitchers. Goodnight sweet prince Rutgers 6-0 #19

cleonjones11 Oct 18 2006 12:24 AM

Cliff Floyd could audition for Dancing with the Stars

Iubitul Oct 18 2006 06:00 AM

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?

MFS62 Oct 18 2006 07:31 AM

Iubitul wrote: Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Nobody stop him. He's on a roll. Later

metirish Oct 18 2006 08:43 AM

Carpenter was nothing great at Shea last time out...Mets win tonight.

Yancy Street Gang Oct 18 2006 08:51 AM

I think that goes in the optimism thread. So would this: Maine is due for a good start. (I think.)

cooby Oct 18 2006 09:10 AM

( wrong thread )

soupcan Oct 18 2006 09:15 AM

Screw defeatism. I think what I'm seeing is a lot of the younger guys taking this harder than those of us who were old enough to really enjoy, remember and truly appreciate '86. I learned a few things that postseason - and if you don't remember it as vividly as I do, the tension now is nothing compared to then. I learned that the Mets making the postseason and winning a World Series was NOT a once in a lifetime thing. It will happen again. I learned that the postseason is all about highs and lows. Nothing is a gimme. I learned that just when it looks like its all gonna come crashing down it can turn around literally in the blink of an eye. Buck up campers, there's lots of great, tense, exciting, nail-biting baseball to be played. Keep the faith.

cooby Oct 18 2006 09:20 AM

]the tension now is nothing compared to then. He's got that right

Yancy Street Gang Oct 18 2006 09:39 AM

Soupcan speaks with the wisdom of his years. I only disagree with one thing: There's no guarantee that the younger fans will see a World Championship in their lifetime. Any 90-year-old Cubs fan will tell you that. But yes, it's supposed to be tense. And with the tension comes the possibility that you'll lose. If we knew the Mets were going to win, this wouldn't be as enthralling. And winning wouldn't be as much fun if not accompanied by the sense of relief that we didn't lose. Win or lose, being this wrapped up in October baseball has been great! You can talk all you want about "meaningful games in September." The Mets have been playing meaningful games in October. Sure, I'm disappointed in last night's loss. But that doesn't mean this hasn't been a great month. Our story may yet have a happy ending with a champagne party in Detroit. But if the season ends tonight, it's still been great.

ScarletKnight41 Oct 18 2006 09:46 AM

I have to tell you, I am just enjoying the fact that the Mets made it to the NLCS. When El Duque went down the day before the NLDS, I thought that it was over. We were taking MK to the game the next day, and we didn't have a pitcher. He was at one of the NLCS games in 2000, but he doesn't have a clear memory of that - this was the first playoff game that he would clearly remember for the rest of his life, and I feared that it would be a bloodbath. But Maine and the bullpen came through well enough, Wagner didn't entirely blow the save, and the Mets one. Not only that, but we were there to witness the double play at home plate, which people will be talking about for years! From my perspective, everything beyond that was gravy. Winning the NLDS with the pitching staff that we fielded was a longshot, to say the least. Getting to Game 6 of the NLCS is a moral victory in and of itself. Hopefully there will be two more champagne celebrations. But, as Yancy said, no matter what happens, this has been a great season.

soupcan Oct 18 2006 09:50 AM

This is something that Met fans can laud over Yankee fans. Odd as it sounds we appreciate the 'moments'. I don't think Yankee fans have been able to truly appreciate their regular seasons in quite some time and that's too bad for them. Our team plays baseball, their team plays 'trophy-ball' and if their season doesn't end with one then they've got nothing. Me? Well my baseball season has been a lot of fun...so far.

Rotblatt Oct 18 2006 09:59 AM

I totally agree, Scarlet--this has been a great season, and that we rolled over the Dodgers and are making a fight of it against the Cardinals is a testament to the quality of our team. My brain keeps telling me that--and that it ain't over yet--but emotionally, I'm still bummed, and the hope I have (and I do have some!) is tinged with desperation. I remember our postseasons in 1999 against Atlanta and 2000 against the MFY a lot more clearly than I do 1986 . . . But barring catastrophic injuries, we'll get another chance very, very soon even if we don't pull this out. Long-term, I think we're in good shape. But in the short term, I might wallow a bit. And get a bit savage to the MFY fans in my office. Those fuckers think this is funny, when I was nothing but kind to them when their crappy ass team went up in flames. Lesson learned: don't ever try to take the high ground with Yankee fans.

ScarletKnight41 Oct 18 2006 10:03 AM

I don't see their team anywhere but the golf course at this point. Where do they get off giving anyone a hard time? At least the Mets didn't roll over and play dead on the field.

soupcan Oct 18 2006 10:22 AM

Rotblatt wrote: Lesson learned: don't ever try to take the high ground with Yankee fans. ALWAYS take the high ground.

metsmarathon Oct 18 2006 11:26 AM

where yankee fans are concerned, you're automatically on the high ground.

Edgy DC Oct 18 2006 11:38 AM

Not necessarily so.

Vic Sage Oct 18 2006 01:37 PM

ScarletKnight41 wrote: I Getting to Game 6 of the NLCS is a moral victory in and of itself.. WTF? The Mets had the best team in the NL this year, with a record of 97-65... 9 games better than SD & LA, and and 14 games better than St.L's 83-78 just-above-.500 record. We were 3rd in Runs/game, 3rd in ERA and 1st in payroll. StL wasn't in the top 5 in any of those categories. And you consider losing the pennant to St.L a moral victory? Well, i consider it an immoral loss. I think we're sunk, and i don't see the sunny upside y'all seem so cheered up by. but thats just me. woo woo, lets go mets. yea.

Iubitul Oct 18 2006 01:38 PM

The sunny upside is that there is still a game tonight.

Vic Sage Oct 18 2006 01:40 PM

yes, with a Cy Young candidate going up against an adequate rookie. You have to live in utter blackness to see the bright side of that matchup.

Rotblatt Oct 18 2006 01:50 PM

Vic has clearly embodied the spirit of this thread. And we're definitely a long-shot to win tonight.

old original jb Oct 18 2006 01:50 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: ... And with the tension comes the possibility that you'll lose. If we knew the Mets were going to win, this wouldn't be as enthralling. .... You really mean they could really...LOSE? Say it ain't so.

Iubitul Oct 18 2006 01:53 PM

Vic Sage wrote: You have to live in utter blackness to see the bright side of that matchup. I don't think you realize just how true this line is...

Centerfield Oct 18 2006 02:30 PM

We're gonna fucking lose. If we don't get to Carpenter in the first tonight, it's just a matter of time before Maine gets unraveled. Early deficit, Cards tack on through the middle innings and win going away. At least we can save ourselves the indignity of watching Trachsel piss away our season tomorrow.

metirish Oct 18 2006 04:13 PM

Why even play? ] "They [the Mets] saw the great Chris Carpenter. They saw a guy that was not at the top of his game and they couldn't finish him or finish us off," La Russa said. "That, to me, is why he's great. If he goes out there [tonight] and he's his normal self, they will see the greatest of the great."

Willets Point Oct 18 2006 04:27 PM

Sophocles would say that Mr. LaRussa has hubris.

Hillbilly Oct 18 2006 04:31 PM

http://www.earthstation1.com/Churchillia/wc411029.ram Listen to this you defeatists and sac up. Never Give In! LGM!

metirish Oct 19 2006 10:27 AM

In 112 career starts Perez has only started one on short reast.

Rotblatt Oct 19 2006 11:02 AM

While Suppan has crappy overall numbers away from home this season, he hasn't allowed an earned run in his last three away games. His poor overall numbers are dragged down by poor starts against the Braves (9 ER), the Padres (7 ER), and the Pirates (8 ER). His last such start took place more than 3 months ago. Since July 15, his Away line reads: 7 GS, 42.7 IP, 1.90 ERA, 1.26 WHIP, 21 K, 11 BB, 2 HR

Centerfield Oct 19 2006 11:11 AM

We're gonna fucking lose. Suppan has been lights out the second half and is a big-game pitcher. He beat Asshead in Game 7 in 2004 and he should have no problem beating Oliver Perez.

Willets Point Oct 19 2006 05:35 PM

No team in major league history has won more do-or-die Game 7s than the Cardinals, who are 9-4 in those instances. Source