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Alfonso Soriano

Should the Mets open negotiations with Alfonso Soriano?

Yes	26 votes
No	5 votes

Yancy Street Gang Nov 03 2006 01:37 PM

From Newsday: ="Wallace Matthews"] Omar, Sori's your guy November 3, 2006 Sometimes the solution to a seemingly complex problem is so simple, so obvious, you can't believe someone hasn't thought of it already. And you figure there must be some logical reason why it can't be done. In this case, the problem is the Mets' lineup holes in leftfield and at second base. The solution is Alfonso Soriano. It's so simple, so obvious, it can't be real. But try as I might, I am unable to talk myself out of it. Not only is it real, it is ridiculous. The Mets have the needs. Soriano has the goods. Omar Minaya has Fred Wilpon's money. If there's a reason why this shouldn't happen, I'm listening. Soriano is a free agent who happens to play both positions the Mets need to fill. He prefers second base, but even playing a reluctant leftfield for the Washington Nationals in 2006, he led the league in assists. Imagine if he actually liked the position he was playing. He also was a leadoff hitter for a last-place team who knocked in 95 runs and hit 46 home runs while playing half his games in a ballpark as big as Arlington National Cemetery. Imagine what those numbers could be at Shea, batting fifth or sixth in a lineup behind the likes of Jose Reyes, Paul Lo Duca, David Wright and the Carloses. Other than the salaries, nothing in baseball is guaranteed, of course, but you can be sure that had Soriano been at the plate in the bottom of the ninth inning with the bases loaded and the season on the line in NLCS Game 7, he would have swung at that 0-and-2 pitch from Adam Wainwright. And the 0-and-1 pitch, and the 0-and-0 pitch. That is the way Soriano plays. Fearless, aggressive and maybe a tad reckless. The odds are good that, like Carlos Beltran, Soriano would have struck out to end Game 7 and send the Mets and their fans into an offseason of disappointment and uncertainty. But at least Soriano would have gone down fighting, something the Mets did not do at the end of their season. Four of the last six outs were by strikeout, two of them looking, the last one on a curveball that cut across the zone for strike three to end the season with the bat sitting on the Mets' most expensive shoulder. If it were up to me, Soriano would bat fifth in next year's lineup, after Carlos Delgado, or sixth, behind Wright, who just got his first important postseason hit. Too bad for the Mets it came in an exhibition game in Japan. What the ninth inning in Game 7 called for was a little more aggressiveness, a little less caution. That is what Soriano brings to the Mets, along with a little more excitement to a team that left with a cloud of disappointment and uncertainty hanging over an otherwise brilliant season. Although his team won 97 games and its first division title in 18 years, Mets general manager Omar Minaya has a winter shopping list as long as Julio Franco's career stat line, and it ought to start at the doorstep of Soriano. He will not come cheap - think Beltran money for five years at least - but if Minaya wants him as badly as he wanted Pedro Martinez, Tom Glavine and Beltran, there is little to stand in the way. Soriano knows New York and likes it here. He still owns an apartment in the area. And unlike the rest of the Mets and most of the Yankees, he is a proven postseason performer, or have you forgotten his home run off Curt Schilling in the eighth inning of Game 7 of the 2001 World Series? That broke a tie at 1 and left the Yankees six outs away from a fourth consecutive world championship, if only Mariano Rivera could have held the lead in the ninth. That was done when Soriano was 25 years old and comparatively puny. Now he is one of the most feared hitters in baseball, a man who can play two positions capably, and both of them are positions in which the Mets are lacking. Last year's leftfielder, Cliff Floyd, is an expensive, often-injured free agent. His time here is up. His replacement, Endy Chavez, is a wizard with the glove whose theft of Scott Rolen's bid for a home run forestalled the inevitable in Game 7. The Mets can get by with his bat at the bottom of the lineup if they opt to return Soriano to second, his position of choice. If they believe $15 million a season is too much to spend on a second baseman, they can send him to left and pursue free agent Julio Lugo to play second, or even ancient Ray Durham, who hit 26 homers for the Giants. Either way, Soriano adds a dimension to the lineup that was missing at the moment it was needed most. The Mets had better not begin their offseason the way they ended their postseason: caught looking.

metirish Nov 03 2006 01:39 PM

Yes they should,play him at second and see if Milledge cal play left field.

TransMonk Nov 03 2006 01:41 PM

Yes...he's the best offensive option available.

Yancy Street Gang Nov 03 2006 01:42 PM

Unless he demands a tent, they have to talk to him.

soupcan Nov 03 2006 01:46 PM

Yes please.

MFS62 Nov 03 2006 01:59 PM

It appears that playing for Frank Robinson has matured him. No more of the reported grousing about being moved to a new position. He moved and did well at it. And I've read that when they were both with the Yankees, he and Randolph got along very well. Other than the strikeouts, why not? The positives seem to outweigh that one negative I had about him. Later

Sandgnat Nov 03 2006 02:02 PM

Who is the lone dissenter amongst us? I'd be interested in hearing why they voted no.

Edgy DC Nov 03 2006 02:04 PM

'Cuz I'm stupid.

Sandgnat Nov 03 2006 02:05 PM

So much for fostering dialog.

sharpie Nov 03 2006 02:07 PM

I'd be happy keeping Valentin at second if Soriano were in left.

Edgy DC Nov 03 2006 02:08 PM

I just have this protectionist streak I couldn't stifle before voting.. Obviously, the question as phrased ("Should the Mets open negotiations with Alfonso Soriano?") is a no-brainer. Of course they should, and I'd retract my vote if I could.

Yancy Street Gang Nov 03 2006 02:11 PM

I agree that the question wasn't a great one, but I just wanted to kick off this thread. If I asked, "Should the Mets sign Alfonso Soriano?" then everyone would bring their own assumptions into it like they did with the first Lastings for Zito poll I opened this summer, and the results were equally worthless.

Johnny Dickshot Nov 03 2006 02:12 PM

Polls are pretty much worthless, and I almost never vote in them.

Vic Sage Nov 03 2006 03:03 PM

I don't know why Soriano should expect "beltran money". When Beltran signed his deal, he was younger, a premiere defensive CFer, and played well with others. Soriano is 31, a defensive liability, and a bit of a headache. Plus, his style of play (lack of strike zone discipline, relies purely on talent) is the kind that, IMO, generally shows an earlier career decline than those players whose production is based on skills and savvy rather than pure talent. Of course, price is dictated by the marketplace, so if there are a number of teams in desperate straits bidding on his services, he could get "beltran money". But I'd rather the Mets overpay him for 3 years than pay "market value" for 5 years or more.

Yancy Street Gang Nov 03 2006 03:06 PM

I doubt that a three-year deal will get it done, though. I think he can be signed for five. The Mets (or whoever signs him) might have to swallow hard and take the risk of overpaying an underproducing player at the tail end of the contract. That's what they did with Pedro and Glavine, to apparently mixed results.

Nymr83 Nov 03 2006 03:13 PM

the mets arent desperate for hitting though, i wouldnt take that chance on a hitter...i think i'd have to pass on a 5 year "beltran money" contract to soriano.

metirish Nov 03 2006 03:43 PM

Where would you hit him in the lineup?,I'm thinking fourth behind Beltran or fifth behind Delgado.

sharpie Nov 03 2006 03:53 PM

I'd hit him fifth with Wright moving up to third and Beltran to second but where he hits isn't really that important. If he hits sixth we'd have a hell of a sixth place hitter.

Nymr83 Nov 03 2006 04:07 PM

i'd move beltran up a spot and bat him 5th, but assuming they want to keep loduca 2nd i'd bat soriano 6th, a power-bat that doesnt get on base belongs behind the guys who can

Johnny Dickshot Nov 03 2006 04:11 PM

]the mets arent desperate for hitting though Sez you.

TransMonk Nov 03 2006 04:12 PM

Where to hit Soriano would really depend who else the Mets get to compliment the team (i.e. who's in left if Sori plays 2B, or who's at 2B if Sori plays left). Unfortunately, it seems to me that Soriano's abilities would create a managers nightmare. He hits for power and is fast but strikesout a ton. No matter where you put him, there are weaknesses to be had. He's obviously not going to lead off. IMO he strikesout too much to bat 2nd. I can see 3rd with moving Beltran to 2nd...that would provide 3 speedy guys at the top of the lineup and also keeps the lefty-righty thing inline. Not 4th or 5th. Batting him 6th or below really depends on who is around him. What if we keep Floyd? That would give you Soriano, Floyd, Green or some combination thereof before the pitcher. That's a lot of Ks at the bottom of the lineup.

Yancy Street Gang Nov 03 2006 04:16 PM

I really don't think Floyd is going to be part of the equation. If the Mets sign Soriano and decide to put him at second base, I think you can consider Endy Chavez as a left field candidate. He doesn't give you the kind of offense you typically want from a left fielder, but he does give you what you'd want from a secondbaseman. So Soriano and Endy could be a good combo for second and left.

Vic Sage Nov 03 2006 05:34 PM

Endy is great as a 4th OFer, but i don't think starting him in LF makes sense. He doesn't hit enough for a corner OFer. We'd be better off with better defense at 2b, by signing somebody cheap like Aurilia, and playing Soriano in LF, where he is less likely to cause alot of damage. Reyes (s) Wright (r) [with his patience, baserunning and discipline, hitting 2nd behind Reyes would be like they MFY's Ricky/Mattingly 1-2 punch] Beltran (s) Delgado (L) Soriano (r) - surrounded by a guy with a .400 ob% in front, and a decent contact guy behind him, and his speed breaks up the slowpokes. Green (L) LoDuca (r) [finally hitting where he belongs] Aurilia (L) - punch at the bottom

KC Nov 03 2006 06:05 PM

I could be wrong, but wasn't Wallace a Soriano basher not all that long ago?

TransMonk Nov 03 2006 06:44 PM

Vic Sage wrote: Reyes (s) Wright (r) [with his patience, baserunning and discipline, hitting 2nd behind Reyes would be like they MFY's Ricky/Mattingly 1-2 punch] Beltran (s) Delgado (L) Soriano (r) - surrounded by a guy with a .400 ob% in front, and a decent contact guy behind him, and his speed breaks up the slowpokes. Green (L) LoDuca (r) [finally hitting where he belongs] Aurilia (L) - punch at the bottom I don't think 113 Ks and 66 walks are an indication that a player has patience and discipline. Not that he might not get better, but David gets fooled as much as anybody on the team at the plate and has no business batting second.

seawolf17 Nov 03 2006 06:48 PM

We won 97 games with LoDuca batting second. He bats second. Get Rich Freaking Aurilia off this team.

Nymr83 Nov 03 2006 06:53 PM

TransMonk wrote: ="Vic Sage"] Reyes (s) Wright (r) [with his patience, baserunning and discipline, hitting 2nd behind Reyes would be like they MFY's Ricky/Mattingly 1-2 punch] Beltran (s) Delgado (L) Soriano (r) - surrounded by a guy with a .400 ob% in front, and a decent contact guy behind him, and his speed breaks up the slowpokes. Green (L) LoDuca (r) [finally hitting where he belongs] Aurilia (L) - punch at the bottom I don't think 113 Ks and 66 walks are an indication that a player has patience and discipline. Not that he might not get better, but David gets fooled as much as anybody on the team at the plate and has no business batting second. k's are the same as other outs i dont want aurilia either

seawolf17 Nov 03 2006 07:10 PM

I'll partially take back what I said about Aurilia; he had a surprisingly good 2006. He had a $1.3 million contract last year; if we can get him cheap, a la Jose Valentin, I'd take him.

Edgy DC Nov 03 2006 07:16 PM

I remember Mattingly batting third (behind Randolph) through most of the Rickey Henderson Yankee tenure.

RealityChuck Nov 03 2006 07:23 PM

Of course we should talk to guy. The question is what he wants and if it'll be worth it, but you can't begin to determine that without negotiating.

Rockin' Doc Nov 03 2006 10:17 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 04 2006 03:32 PM

I definitely think that Soriano is a good potential fit for he Mets. If he could be signed for 4 years with an option for reasonable money, it would be a great deal for the Mets. I do find it funny that just a year or two ago, most here, including myself, wanted no part of Soriano on the Mets. After a monster season for the Nationals and a change in position, suddenly many of us have changed our tunes on Soriano. That said, I'd be fine with him playing left field and letting Valentin play second base another year. That would free up Milledge for potential trade bait for starting pitching. I would also be fine with Soriano taking over at second base and giving a platoon of Milledge/Chavez a shot at left field. Edited: to correct blatant typographical errors

metirish Nov 03 2006 10:18 PM

] I do find it funny that just a year or two ago, most here, including myself, wanted no part of Soriano on the Mets. After a monster season for the Nationals and a change in position, suddenly many of us have changed our tunes on Soriano. I was thinking the same thing today....

Frayed Knot Nov 03 2006 11:25 PM

At least part of the 'Anti-Soriano' feeling here was in response to the occasionally suggested [u:6a10d8c2e0]Soriano for Reyes[/u:6a10d8c2e0] type swaps. And just to play devil's advocate here' - he's coming off a career year, meaning we'd be paying for that while probably getting somewhat less - already 31, a lengthy contract takes him until age ... ??? - the one place our offense ranked below par this year was in OBP, exactly the kind of guy Sorino is NOT - (reportedly) wants superstar money for a less-than complete player who does not play a middle position - a bit of a non-hustler with occasionaly bouts of on-field brain-farts None of which screams 'DON'T TOUCH HIM', just that there's always a price at which you go to plan B

metirish Nov 03 2006 11:28 PM

FK ,at times you are the voice of reason here......you make some great points....especially on OBP.

patona314 Nov 03 2006 11:32 PM

Frayed Knot wrote: At least part of the 'Anti-Soriano' feeling here was in response to the occasionally suggested Soriano for Reyes type swaps. And just to play devil's advocate here' - he's coming off a career year, meaning we'd be paying for that while probably getting somewhat less - already 31, a lengthy contract takes him until age ... ??? - the one place our offense ranked below par this year was in OBP, exactly the kind of guy Sorino is NOT - (reportedly) wants superstar money for a less-than complete player who does not play a middle position - a bit of a non-hustler with occasionaly bouts of on-field brain-farts None of which screams 'DON'T TOUCH HIM', just that there's always a price at which you go to plan B 1)too much $$ 2)too many K's batting in the 6 hole

cleonjones11 Nov 04 2006 12:46 AM

Ex MFY Troublemaker Alfonso Sorryanus? No

Iubitul Nov 04 2006 08:15 AM

While his numbers look good on paper, and he may behave due to his relationship with Willie, I'm still leaning towards no, unless the money is right. With the numbers he put up this year, the money won't be right, because at least one stupid team will offer him too much...

Johnny Dickshot Nov 04 2006 08:18 AM

I generally think we can do it without him, and ought to (as if we aren't already) looking into how to pull it off that way. The scary thing, as I mentioned already, is the possibility he lands in Philly and whether that is at work somehow.

Nymr83 Nov 04 2006 09:22 AM

why is that scary? they couldn't win with Abreu, a better player.

Valadius Nov 04 2006 09:57 AM

Chemistry, chemistry, chemistry. I don't want a whiny iron-gloved second baseman on my team.

Johnny Dickshot Nov 04 2006 10:11 AM

Nymr83 wrote: why is that scary? they couldn't win with Abreu, a better player. So they should stop trying to get good players?

smg58 Nov 04 2006 11:54 AM

The Phillies need a lot more pitching than they have for them to even start scaring me. I don't know if my yes vote is all that meaningful, because I think you should talk to every free agent at this point, and then decide who the right guys in the right price ranges are. I still think starting pitching is the #1 priority, but if the price on Soriano turns out to be more reasonable than the price of any of the top starters, my priorities could change pretty quickly.