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Met Fact and Opinion III

Edgy DC Nov 07 2006 11:19 PM

On advice from the Thread Doctor, I'm going to let One Fact and Go die (althought you all may try and keep it alive) and relaunch Met Fact and Opinion. A key to this thread is that you try and keep the distinction between fact and opinion clear, as you'll have plenty of opportunity for both. You post a fact about the Mets, and the next contributor posts his or her opinion about that fact, before posting their own fact. It should look something like this: Fact: Kevin Kobel was from Buffalo. _________________________ Opinion: He should have stayed there. Fact: Both the Mets World Series MVPs wore 22. __________________________ Opinion: Nady would've been the third. Fact: Wes Westrum's middle name was Noreen ________________________ And so on. I open with a fact. Fact: Kevin Mitchell has denied killing anybody's cat.

Nymr83 Nov 07 2006 11:37 PM

Opinion: he's full of shit Fact: Jose Reyes raised his OBP 54 points and his SLG 101 points from 2005 to 2006.

patona314 Nov 08 2006 08:37 AM

Opinion: He will be the next "Willie Mays" Fact: Bobby Valentine was 536 - 467 w/a .534 winning percentage w/the Mets

RealityChuck Nov 08 2006 08:58 AM

Opinion: Valentine lost his enthusiasm for managing in New York after 9/11. Fact: Dave Kingman led the league in home runs with the lowest BA of any HR champ.

Edgy DC Nov 08 2006 09:17 AM

Opinon: Kingman lost his enthusasm for refining his not-insignificant secondary skills relatively early in his career. Fact: Darryl Strawberry debuted May 6, 1983, going 0-4, with Mario Soto starting for Cincinnati. The Mets won in the thirteenth on a walkoff homer by George Foster, Darryl scoring ahead of him with the winning run.

soupcan Nov 08 2006 09:39 AM

Opinion: Darryl never wanted to be the Black Ted Williams he wanted to be the next Reggie Jackson. Fact: In the winter of 1987, the main scoreboard at Shea Stadium was redesigned/upgraded/modernized. The redesign incorporated additional space below the out-of-town scoreboard to list a RF and LF umpire that would be utilized during postseason games in anticipation of the Mets playing in the postseason frequently in the years to come.

Johnny Dickshot Nov 08 2006 10:49 AM

Opinion: The scoreboard was better when it wasn't a gigantic Budweiser ad. Fact: In 1967, the outfield walls at Shea were painted white, but met with a poor reception and were re-painted green in a few weeks.

Edgy DC Nov 08 2006 10:55 AM

Opinion: Joe Torre did everybody a big favor during his tenure by suggesting the walls be pulled forward a few feet in right or left, removing the ambiguity about whether the brick facade of the stands were in play or not. Fact: Mike Stanton holds the Mets record for appearances by a pitcher with 83 in 2004.

patona314 Nov 08 2006 11:18 AM

Opinion: Mike Stanton is Yankee Scum Fact: When the Mets won Game 6 of the 1986 World Series, Doug Sisk was warming up in the bullpen and would have pitched the next inning for the Mets if Mookie had made out after the Mets tied the game.

Nymr83 Nov 08 2006 11:19 AM

Opinion: I hope nobody is used often enough in the regular season to break that record next year Fact: Box Seats at Shea were only $10 in 1987 source: [url]http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9B0DE1D61F3DF932A05753C1A961948260[/url]

Edgy DC Nov 08 2006 11:24 AM

Two facts on the table. Can one opinion respond to them both?

DocTee Nov 08 2006 11:27 AM

opinion: Had Sisk been used, $10 would have been too much to see the NL champs play in '87.

ScarletKnight41 Nov 08 2006 11:43 AM

patona314 wrote: Opinion: Mike Stanton is Yankee Scum Hey Rookie - I like how you think <g>

Edgy DC Nov 08 2006 11:45 AM

DocTee owes us a fact.

DocTee Nov 08 2006 11:48 AM

oops: FACT: Former Met Jay Payton is testing the free-agent waters.

Yancy Street Gang Nov 08 2006 12:11 PM

Opinion: Jay getting kissed by Liza Minnelli is one of the more lasting images from the 2001 season. (Isn't Lasting Image a young Mets outfielder?) Fact: As a Met, Mike Piazza only led the National League in an offensive category once: GIDP in 1999.

Johnny Dickshot Nov 08 2006 12:29 PM

Opinion: If GITP or LITP (grounded into or lined into triple play) was an official stat, Piazza would up near the top too, and that talk radio bozos would mention it while denigrating a player. Fact: The Mets turned a triple play against the Giants 5/31/64 when Orlando Cepeda lined to SS Roy McMillan, who stepped on second to get Jesus Alou and threw to first to force Willie Mays. It was the 14th inning of a 23-inning game the Mets would lose 8-6.

Edgy DC Nov 08 2006 12:42 PM

Opinion: Amazin'. Fact: When Joe Torre went to Atlanta, he took fellow firees Rube Walker, Joe Pignatano, and Bob Gibson. He also re-hired Dal Maxvill who coached under him with the Mets in 1978.

Elster88 Nov 08 2006 12:53 PM

Opinion: If not for Mariano Rivera, Joe Torre would be widely considered one of the worst managers of all time instead of one of the best. Fact: Bernard Gilkey holds the all-time Metly record for doubles in one season.

iramets Nov 08 2006 01:01 PM

Opinion: Gilkey and two teammates (Lance Johnson, Todd Hundley) had career years in 1996. Fact: The 1996 Mets had a losing record.

patona314 Nov 08 2006 01:17 PM

Opinion: please don't remind me of the 91 to 96 Mets, I just ate lunch. Fact: Joel Youngblood was the first player to play for two different teams in two different cities on the same day and get a hit.

HahnSolo Nov 08 2006 01:33 PM

Opinion: He did it to double up on meal money. Fact: Jerry Koosman was 3-0 with a 2.39 ERA in four World Series starts with the Mets.

Vic Sage Nov 08 2006 02:05 PM

O: Kooz should have won the CY in 76 over junkballer Randy Jones. F: The `69 Mets is the only WS winning team in at least the last 60 years to have 2 starting pitchers with ERA+ of 160 or better.

Johnny Dickshot Nov 08 2006 02:09 PM

Opinion: It should have come as no surprise they were unable to repeat, given their offense. Fact: Dave Williams this year became the first Met to make his debut wearing the racing stripes uni since Joe Vitko in 1992.

RealityChuck Nov 08 2006 03:17 PM

Opinion: Williams has the most undistinguisable name in sports. He really needs a good nickname. Dave "The Bruiser" Williams, for instance. Fact: The Mets were the last team for both the last active NY Giant (Willie Mays) and the last active Brooklyn Dodger (Bob Aspromonte)

Yancy Street Gang Nov 08 2006 03:22 PM

Opinion: It would be nice if I live long enough to see the Mets become the team of the last active New York Yankee. Fact: The Mets have an all-time record of 1,770 and 1,640 at Shea Stadium. They only have to win 17 home games over the next two years to clinch a winning record there.

Elster88 Nov 08 2006 07:17 PM

RealityChuck wrote: Opinion: Williams has the most undistinguisable name in sports. He really needs a good nickname. Dave "The Bruiser" Williams, for instance. LOL That's a great one. I'm liking this thread. Pats on the back all around.

Edgy DC Nov 08 2006 07:51 PM

Opinion: Stadium features are way overplayed. Home is what you make it. Fact: In 1985, young Bret Saberhagen's wife gave birth their son Drew William, the same night as the infamous Don Denkinger call which helped Kansas City to the World Championship.

SteveJRogers Nov 08 2006 08:10 PM

Opinion: Young Drew Saberhagen can say his first full day on the planet truely was the best day of his father's life, in more ways than one Fact: Cleon Jones is the only member of the Mets Hall of Fame to have played for the Mets to not have a Met uniform be represented on his bust in the Diamond Club lobby

DocTee Nov 08 2006 08:19 PM

Opinion: Steve J Rogers spends too much time looking at busts in the Diamond Club Lobby. Fact: Former Met and current Minny skipper Ron Gardenhire was born on an air force base in Germany.

Zvon Nov 08 2006 09:05 PM

Opinion: Gardenhire is not reluctant to get tossed for the team. As of July 15, 2006, the Twins manager has been ejected 26 times in 3 and 1/3 seasons. Fact: On opening day in 1996, Ozzie Smith and the Cardinals faced the Mets during shortstop Rey Ordóñez's major league debut. After Ordóñez's stunning relay throw to home plate from his knees during his first major league game, Ozzie Smith responded "I can definitely say he is the second-coming of me."

Elster88 Nov 08 2006 09:55 PM

They have busts in the Diamond Club lobby?

Willets Point Nov 08 2006 10:03 PM

Elster88 wrote: They have busts in the Diamond Club lobby? Not since the era of Doc and Straw. Well maybe Tony Tarasco, but that was in the parking lot.

metirish Nov 08 2006 10:05 PM

Big Mo had busts..

metirish Nov 08 2006 10:09 PM

] On opening day in 1996, Ozzie Smith and the Cardinals faced the Mets during shortstop Rey Ordóñez's major league debut. After Ordóñez's stunning relay throw to home plate from his knees during his first major league game, Ozzie Smith responded "I can definitely say he is the second-coming of me." When I was first a Mets fan Rey was my fave player, I couldn't believe his defence... FACT Doc Gooden will be set free tomorrow(all the best)

patona314 Nov 08 2006 10:51 PM

Opinion: Doc (for all his glory) was the most dissapointing Met ever to wear the uniform. Fact: In 1984, Ron Darling issued the most walks in a season for a rookie Met Pitcher (104).

soupcan Nov 08 2006 11:04 PM

Opinion: Ron Darling's wife Toni was a hottie. Fact: On September 14, 1977 Nino Espinosa pitched a complete game 3 hit shutout against the Phillies at the Vet beating them 1-0 and handing eventual 23 game winner, and '77 Cy Young winner, Steve Carlton one of his 10 defeats that year in the process.

metirish Nov 08 2006 11:04 PM

Opinion..Darling was not a rookie in 84. FACT Throughout major league history only the 1899 Cleveland Spiders (20-134) lost more games in a single season than the 1962 Mets.

patona314 Nov 08 2006 11:23 PM

metirish wrote: Opinion..Darling was not a rookie in 84. FACT Throughout major league history only the 1899 Cleveland Spiders (20-134) lost more games in a single season than the 1962 Mets. get your facts straight: http://www.baseball-reference.com/d/darliro01.shtml

metirish Nov 08 2006 11:28 PM

So even though he started five games in 83 he's still a rookie in 84?....I'm asking because I don't know...

patona314 Nov 08 2006 11:35 PM

Determining rookie status: A player shall be considered a rookie unless, during a previous season or seasons, he has (a) exceeded 130 at-bats or 50 innings pitched in the Major Leagues; or (b) accumulated more than 45 days on the active roster of a Major League club or clubs during the period of 25-player limit (excluding time in the military service and time on the disabled list).

patona314 Nov 08 2006 11:42 PM

Opinion: I don't care about the Cleveland Spiders Fact: Reingold was the first company to advertise a "lite" beer through baseball advertising. it was called Gablingers. Don't hold me to this one, but I think it's true

RealityChuck Nov 09 2006 09:10 AM

Confirmation: Yes, it's true, and Gablinger's was a major disaster for the company. A beer ahead of its time. Opinion: Beer is the most vile-tasting alcoholic beverage sold regularly in the US. Fact: The Mets were alerted to Nolan Ryan by a Shea Stadium concession vendor.

soupcan Nov 09 2006 09:43 AM

Ahem - ="soupcan"]Fact: On September 14, 1977 Nino Espinosa pitched a complete game 3 hit shutout against the Phillies at the Vet beating them 1-0 and handing eventual 23 game winner, and '77 Cy Young winner, Steve Carlton one of his 10 defeats that year in the process. Thank you.

Iubitul Nov 09 2006 09:50 AM

="soupcan"]Opinion: Ron Darling's wife Toni was a hottie. Actually, I think this qualifies for a fact...

smg58 Nov 09 2006 10:29 AM

RealityChuck wrote: Confirmation: Yes, it's true, and Gablinger's was a major disaster for the company. A beer ahead of its time. Opinion: Beer is the most vile-tasting alcoholic beverage sold regularly in the US. Fact: The Mets were alerted to Nolan Ryan by a Shea Stadium concession vendor. Opinion: They should have consulted with said vendor before dealing Ryan for Jim Fregosi. Fact Since Rick Peterson left Oakland, none of the big 3 of Hudson, Mulder, and Zito has been as good.

soupcan Nov 09 2006 10:35 AM

HEY! HEY! HEY! HEY! HEY!!!!!! ="soupcan"]Ahem - ="soupcan"]Fact: On September 14, 1977 Nino Espinosa pitched a complete game 3 hit shutout against the Phillies at the Vet beating them 1-0 and handing eventual 23 game winner, and '77 Cy Young winner, Steve Carlton one of his 10 defeats that year in the process. Thank you. Harrrumph.

Elster88 Nov 09 2006 10:39 AM

smg58 wrote: Fact Since Rick Peterson left Oakland, none of the big 3 of Hudson, Mulder, and Zito has been as good. Sorry, this is an opinion. It's an opinion I happen to agree with, but an opinion nonetheless.

soupcan Nov 09 2006 10:43 AM

I hat you all...

Edgy DC Nov 09 2006 10:47 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 10 2006 12:54 AM

Yeah, let's bump Smiggy's opinion-laced factoid and put Soup's rudely bumped fact back on the table. More proof that pretty womens make menfolk stupid.

Iubitul Nov 09 2006 12:21 PM

Trading Nino Espinosa to the Phillies for Richie Hebner was a bad trade In 1974, Felix Millan had a higher OBP (.317) than Slugging percentage (.311)

patona314 Nov 09 2006 12:39 PM

Opinion: Did he really need to choke up on the bat THAT much? Fact: Craig Swan won the 1978 NL ERA title (2.43) despite missing a month with gastroenteritis and recording only nine victories

Zvon Nov 09 2006 11:40 PM

Opinion: Swans windup and delivery reminded me of Tom Seaver in every way except for the results. Craig didnt literally stink in 1978, but figuratively did, due to his ailment. Fact: A historical highlight of the Mets 1987 season was Darryl Strawberry and Howard Johnson becoming the first teammates ever to hit 30 homers and steal 30 bases in the same season.

SteveJRogers Nov 09 2006 11:52 PM

Opinion: Another Metly example that you really are playing with a ticking time bomb when you work with a patch work pitching staff all year long. Fact: Despite being known as a pitching rich franchise, two guys who with the exception one a one year return, who last pitched for the Mets 29 years ago are still in the top three all time in all major Metly pitching categories

patona314 Nov 10 2006 12:01 AM

seaver and kooz. unless i'm wrong, no opinion needed Fact: Mike Stanton was a Met (think i'm gonna puke now)

Zvon Nov 10 2006 12:31 AM

Opinion: I hated Stanton. He sucked. Fact: Numbers retired by the Mets: 37(Stengel)/14(Hodges)/41(Seaver)/42(J.Robinson-retired by MLB). Although not officially retired, two other numbers are being held out of circulation: '8' for Gary Carter (since his 2003 induction into the Hall of Fame) and '24' for Willie Mays (for 25 seasons after his departure* and since the year 2000), *Rickey Henderson (99&'00) and Kelvin Torve (10 games in '90) wore '24' during their brief stints with the Mets.

Edgy DC Nov 10 2006 01:15 PM

Opinion: I wish teams cycled all 101 available numbers. That way they'd come around less frequently. Fact: On July 16, 1999, the New York Times reported that Mets minor league player Vincente Rosario was found not guilty in the alleged gang rape of a woman in a Port St Lucie motel. The next day, a correction noted that the player's name was Vicente Rosario, not Vincente, and his lawyer was Harvey Slovis, not Slovin.

SteveJRogers Nov 10 2006 10:32 PM

Opinion: Edgy seems to obtain alot of news about Mets and their minor league personell. A bit TOO much! =;) Fact: This past year was the 10th anniversary of the true start of the Internet Mets Community with the launch of Bryan Hoch's MetsOnline.net after finding a surprising lack of web presence on the Mets GenK trio of Isringhausen, Wilson and Pulsipher.

soupcan Nov 10 2006 11:21 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 10 2006 11:55 PM

Opinion: In retrospect those three didn't really deserve much 'web presence', now did they? Fact: In game 3 of the 1969, 1973 and 1986 World Series', the Mets leadoff hitter hit a homerun in their respective first at-bats of the game. In Game 3 of the 2000 World Series, Mets leadoff hitter Timo Perez struck out swinging in his first at-bat.

SteveJRogers Nov 10 2006 11:38 PM

Opinion: Agee, Garrett and Dykstra all had Metly careers of distinction. Perez did not. Karma at work? Fact: The Mets appear to be running out of room on their pennant display out in RF

DocTee Nov 11 2006 12:08 AM

Opinion: Celebratory banners should celebrate pennants and world championships, nothing else. FACT: The Mets wore pillbox hats in 1976 (on occasion)

SteveJRogers Nov 11 2006 12:19 AM

Opinion: Thankfully it was only one year for the Mets! Somehow the Pirates thought a Bi-Centennial Celebration meant it had to last ten years! Fact: The Mets, Yankees, Dodgers, Twins, Giants, and Red Sox have all made the postseason at least once per decade since the 1960's. Throw in the A's for since the 1970's

Johnny Dickshot Nov 24 2006 09:08 PM

Opinion: The Twins accomplishment is the most impressive. Fact: Wally Backman's 1982 season ended when he broke his collarbone in a bicycle accident

Nymr83 Nov 24 2006 09:44 PM

Opinion: thats just not fair, Rothlisberger and Kent both received less severe injuries in motorcycle accidents Fact: The Mets' new stadium will have about 10,000 less seats than Shea.

metsguyinmichigan Nov 24 2006 09:55 PM

Opinon: That means there can be 10,000 fewer people booing Braden Looper when the Cards come to town in 2009 -- if they're still hauling his greasy butt on their roster at that point. Fact: Clem Labine was the first Met to wear No. 41.

Elster88 Nov 24 2006 10:56 PM

metsguyinmichigan wrote: Opinon: That means there can be 10,000 fewer people booing Braden Looper when the Cards come to town in 2009 -- if they're still hauling his greasy butt on their roster at that point. This is also a fact. You guys never play right.

smg58 Nov 24 2006 11:19 PM

Elster88 wrote: ="metsguyinmichigan"]Opinon: That means there can be 10,000 fewer people booing Braden Looper when the Cards come to town in 2009 -- if they're still hauling his greasy butt on their roster at that point. This is also a fact. You guys never play right. Now now. We don't know if Looper's butt really is greasy. Well I don't, at any rate.

smg58 Nov 24 2006 11:29 PM

metsguyinmichigan wrote: Fact: Clem Labine was the first Met to wear No. 41. Opinion: Nobody'd remember his name if he wore a different number. Fact: Jose Reyes raised his OBP by over 50 points this past year, and his SLG by over 100 points.

Nymr83 Nov 25 2006 03:22 AM

Opinion: he'll regress in 2007, but will return to his 2006 production for several consecutive years after (a prediction is an opinion, right?) Fact: Carlos Beltran received $119 million over 7 years from the Mets, Carlos Lee received $100 million over 6 years from the Astros. (Omar looks like a genius now isn't part of the "fact" right?)

Edgy DC Dec 13 2006 04:36 PM

Opinion: The signing looks smart and the Yankees needing a centerfielder at the time and not grabbing makes it even better. The fact that they ultimately decided to spend their money on Johnny Damon? That makes it better still. Better, better, better. Fact: On August 22, 2000, with the Mets being blown out, Bobby Valentine called Derek Bell in to pitch. Derek's first pitch was clocked at 47 miles per hour.

Johnny Dickshot Dec 13 2006 04:56 PM

Opinion: I will never know quite what degree of humiliation Derek Bell felt to be a guy widely believed to have been paid too much, but I imagine he felt some when included in that Hampton trade. Fact: Hubie Brooks returned to the Mets in 1991.

Vic Sage Dec 13 2006 05:14 PM

O: As the #3 overall pick in 78 draft, i always thought he'd be more for the Mets than he was. As it turned out, the best thing he did was get traded to the Expos for Gary Carter, bringing the final piece of the championship puzzle to NY. F:SNY will now feature 3 players from the 86 team in its pre- and post-gme broadcasts: Keith, Ron and Lee Mazzilli.

sharpie Dec 13 2006 05:29 PM

Opinion: Three guys on one of those shows is one too many. Fact: Derek Bell wore sunglasses when he pitched that one inning.

attgig Dec 13 2006 05:36 PM

O: Derek Bell would have still thrown 47 mph if he didn't wear sunglasses. F: Mets have had only one player manager in its history - Joe Torre.

Yancy Street Gang Dec 13 2006 05:48 PM

Opinion: If Willie had flopped badly this year, Julio Franco might have become the second player-manager in Mets history. Fact: Yogi Berra spent 11 seasons wearing a Mets uniform.

SteveJRogers Dec 13 2006 06:14 PM

Opinion: There are a few out there (don't worry I'm not one) that feel Berra is a bit of a phony for burying the hatchet and returning to the MFY "Family" Fact: This year marked the first time since 1988 that the Mets played a postseason game in pinstripes

Nymr83 Dec 13 2006 06:44 PM

Opinion: it shouldn't be the last time, wear the traditional stripes at home and the grays on the road. keep the black uni crap out of the playoffs. Fact: Kaz Ishii was 3-9 with a 5.14 ERA and 1.5 WHIP in 2005, the Mets gave him 16 starts.

G-Fafif Dec 13 2006 07:28 PM

Opinion: Ishii was worth the risk given the lack of serious alternatives (Matt Ginter) and the price to get him (Jason Phillips). Fact: Mike Cubbage managed the final seven games of 1991 and was never given another managerial job in the bigs.

Edgy DC Jan 15 2007 04:15 PM

Opiniion: Mike Cubbage looked like John Denver. Fact: Bill Almon was the number one pick in the country in 1974.

smg58 Jan 15 2007 08:46 PM

Opinion: The list of #1 overall picks in the MLB draft is, with a small number of exceptions, really unimpressive. Fact: Moises Alou's OPS has exceeded .900 in each of the last 3 seasons.

G-Fafif Jan 15 2007 09:36 PM

Opinion: Moises Alou's hot start will win him enough fan goodwill to withstand a June decline. Fact: No Met played as many as 45 games at second base in 2004, a year in which the Mets themselves played 162 games.

Johnny Dickshot Jan 16 2007 11:36 AM

Opinion: We'll miss Kaz Matsui in 2007. Fact: 347 innings, 456 strikeouts. Armando Benitez.

iramets Jan 16 2007 11:58 AM

Fact: Kaz Matsui had a .671 OPS during his Mets' career, and his offense was better than his defense. Opinion: if the Mets miss him for a second in 2007, they're in very serious trouble.

Johnny Dickshot Jan 16 2007 12:02 PM

Fact: Posters in Met Fact/Opinion are to post an opinion on the previous guy's fact, not the previous guy's opinion, and leave a fact for the next guy to respond to, not an opinion. Opinion: This can't be too hard to figure out. Returning to the last Fact: Fact: 347 innings, 456 strikeouts. Armando Benitez.

iramets Jan 16 2007 12:07 PM

Sorry. Whenever I see the name "Kaz Matsui," I lose all reason and good judgment.

smg58 Jan 16 2007 12:21 PM

Johnny Dickshot wrote: Opinion: We'll miss Kaz Matsui in 2007. Fact: 347 innings, 456 strikeouts. Armando Benitez. opinion: I guess I was one of the many who couldn't forgive his blow-ups against the Braves in September 01, but Benitez was much better than he generally got made out to be, and it's unfortunate that we basically got nothing for him. fact: Soriano got 8 years at $18M per year, and Zito got 7 years at $18M per year.

Frayed Knot Jan 16 2007 12:57 PM

Opinion: I'm glad the Mets aren't responsible for either one of those contracts Fact: More than 1/4 of the walks that Rey Ordonez received as a Met (64 of 251) were intentional.

iramets Jan 16 2007 01:14 PM

Opinion: More than 3/4ths of the praise Rey Ordonez received as a Met was irrational. Fact: Paul LoDuca hit 60% of his HRs last year between April 29th and May 13th.

RealityChuck Jan 16 2007 01:15 PM

Opinion: LoDuca is pretty smart defensively. Fact: Dave Kingman had the lowest batting average for a home run champion.

soupcan Jan 16 2007 01:30 PM

Opinion: Kingman was a poor man's Mark McGwire. Fact: After 435 career games Jose Reyes has only three less doubles (82 to 85) six less homeruns (33 to 39), 41 less runs scored (352 / 301) and 64 less hits (588 / 524) than Captain Intangibles had after 480 games from the start of their careers.

metirish Jan 16 2007 01:36 PM

opinion: Reyes should NEVER be mentioned along with Jeter until he has won at least four WS rings. Fact: Willie Randolph is in the last year of his contract.

Edgy DC Jan 16 2007 01:43 PM

Opinion: Listening to my sister's mook boyfriend try to spin Met success as a reflection on the Yankees because Randoph is the manager was excruciating. Excruciating: Almost qualifies as fact. Fact: Tom Hausman was the first player ever signed by the Mets as a professional free agent.

G-Fafif Jan 16 2007 03:03 PM

Opinion: As bullpen roles were evolving, Tom Hausman's contribution to the midsummer surge of 1980 made him that team's MVP. Hausman was Turk Wendell without the crazy. Fact: In addition to tickling the ivories of the stadium organ, Jane Jarvis often played in Shea's Charcoal Room after games in the mid-'60s for the entertainment of season-ticket holders.

Edgy DC Jan 16 2007 04:35 PM

Opinion: A swinging jazz chick must have been quite bored playing "Charge!" fanfares and other ballpark fare all those years. Fact: The Mets took righthanded pitchers with their first five picks, and five of their first eight, in the 2006 amateur draft.

Willets Point Jan 16 2007 05:16 PM

Opinion: It would help if those pitchers are ready to succeed in the big leagues right quick. Fact: Yogi Berra's middle name is Peter.

SteveJRogers Jan 16 2007 05:29 PM

Opinion: Tom Seaver's politicing his way to a Game 6 start in the 1973 WS very well may have cost Yogi Berra his job Fact: Phil Mankowski was sports talk show host (and sleazebag) Sid Rosenberg's favorite Met growing up

metsguyinmichigan Jan 16 2007 10:28 PM

Fact: Phil Mankowski was sports talk show host (and sleazebag) Sid Rosenberg's favorite Met growing up

Opinon: Not even Mankowski's mother liked him THAT much, and for good reason.

Fact: Derek Jeter should not be mentioned in the same sentence as Jose Reyes until Yankee hacks -- Verducci and Kalpisch, I'm talking to you -- can come to grips that Jeter is an overrated product of luck (Slide, Giambi, dammit!) showmanship (catch ball, run 30 feet, dive in stands, rub face in kid's hot dog so ketchup looks like blood) a cheap right field home run porch and the Yankee hype machine.

Edgy DC Jan 16 2007 10:43 PM

Rewind. Just a bit of editorializing in your facts there.

metsguyinmichigan Jan 16 2007 10:54 PM

="Edgy DC"]Rewind. Just a bit of editorializing in your facts there. Oops. Sorry about that. Jeter hype in a Mets forum freaks me out. Fact: Future Yankee mascot Don Zimmer was the Mets first third baseman and was quickly banished.

Edgy DC Jan 16 2007 10:57 PM

metsguyinmichigan wrote: Oops. Sorry about that. Jeter hype in a Mets forum freaks me out. I hear you. Irish gets a pass... for now.

Edgy DC Jan 17 2007 11:20 AM

Opinion: Zimmer's probably a decent guy, but took the loyal soldier act too far and came to regret it. Fact: On team rosters for much of the Spanish-speaking baseball world, a player's batting and throwing preferences are listed as "D" for "Derecho" or "Z" for "IZquierdo."

RealityChuck Jan 17 2007 12:17 PM

Opinion: English speaking fans will probably have to know that fact in the future. Fact: If one particular voter hadn't split his vote between the two, and had voted solely for him, Jerry Koosman would have shared Rookie of the Year with Johnny Bench.

iramets Jan 17 2007 01:12 PM

Opinion: Thus saving the voters from having made another choice where they elected an inferior lifetime performer. Fact: Koosman was one of the last pitchers to have won 20 and lost 20. Now its rare that a pitcher does either in a career.

G-Fafif Jan 17 2007 04:29 PM

Opinion: Either Jim Bunning and Jerry Koosman should both be in the Hall of Fame or neither should be in the Hall of Fame. Given their relatively close careers, it confounds me that one won consistent support and eventual induction while the other garnered all of 4 votes. I don't think either should be in, but the wide disparity between the respective consideration given each man is what really gets to me. Fact: Carlos Beltran hit 5 ninth-inning home runs in the 2006 regular season.

Willets Point Jan 17 2007 04:43 PM

Opinion: I would have settled for one ninth inning home run in the 2006 post season. Or even a double. Fact: Tim Teufel is the only Met born in Greenwich, CT.

SteveJRogers Jan 17 2007 05:57 PM

Opinion: Tim Teufel may have been the happiest of all Mets when Bill Buckner essentially let him off the hook in Game 6 Fact: Tug McGraw's son married a woman who's first name is essentially a one word description of Ya Gotta Believe

cleonjones11 Jan 18 2007 12:10 AM

Opinion: Philip Humber is not ready for 150 innings plus at any level in his first full injury free season Fact: Randy Tate pitched a one-hitter for the Mets

dinosaur jesus Jan 18 2007 12:43 AM

Opinion: Either you're confused or you're shitting everybody. Fact: Randy Tate never pitched a one-hitter for the Mets.

RealityChuck Jan 18 2007 09:13 AM

No, but Tate did carry a no-hitter into the seventh inning before losing it (August 4, 1975). Opinion: Tate was just another in a long line of prospects the Mets brought to the majors before they were ready. Fact: The day before the 1969 season started, Newsday published an article predicting the Mets would be World Champs.

G-Fafif Jan 18 2007 02:20 PM

Opinion: The silliest thing in baseball is the preseason prediction that offers complete records for every team in the Majors and then how each postseason series, down to the number of games required, will be determined seven months into the future. Fact: David Cone (1992), Bobby Bonilla (1995), Rick Reed (2001) and Armando Benitez (2003) were each traded in the same season that they were chosen as Met representatives on the N.L. All-Star team.

Edgy DC Jan 18 2007 02:30 PM

Opinion: the reasons behind those trades aren't altogether unrelated. Fact: In 1978, Rusty Staub became the first player to log 162 games in a single seaason at DH.

SteveJRogers Jan 19 2007 07:13 PM

Opinion: Thanks to Interleague this is no longer possible, even if it means David Ortiz 14 or so times at 1st! Fact: There is probably more stuff available (card sets, postcards, books, ect) about the 1969 Mets than any other Met squad, with that 1962 one coming a close second

ScarletKnight41 Jan 19 2007 07:53 PM

Facts have to be more solid than that. Probablies are for Opinions.

SteveJRogers Jan 19 2007 08:01 PM

Fair enough Fact: There are more books and tribute card sets out there on the 1969 Mets than any other squad in team history, with the 1962 Mets behind them.

Frayed Knot Jan 19 2007 10:54 PM

="SteveJRogers"]Opinion: Thanks to Interleague this is no longer possible, even if it means David Ortiz 14 or so times at 1st! Fact: There is probably more stuff available (card sets, postcards, books, ect) about the 1969 Mets than any other Met squad, with that 1962 one coming a close second Your opinion is a fact and your fact an opinion. Therefore, I'm stealing this one. Fact: "In 1978, Rusty Staub became the first player to log 162 games in a single seaason at DH." O: Met fans of the early '80s who lobbied for the NL to institute the DH because we had Rusty on the team annoyed the shit out of me. Either it's a good rule or it's not. It's not good or bad based on whether it'll help your team this particular season. F: Julio Franco is the oldest ML player to hit a HR (you may have heard of this one recently)

Yancy Street Gang Jan 20 2007 08:28 AM

Opinion: Julio Franco is a good guy, but he shouldn't be on the Mets active roster. Fact: The Mets were one of only two organizations (the Orioles are the other) to have seven farm clubs in 2006. All other organizations had six.

G-Fafif Jan 20 2007 03:06 PM

Opinion: It will be very strange having the Mets' top farm club not in Norfolk, not in the International League, not in the Eastern time zone, but I doubt it will make a great deal of material difference in terms of player development, New Orleans' unique status among cities (pre- and post-Katrina) notwithstanding. Fact: A field level box seat to a Mets game at Shea Stadium thirty years ago was four bucks.

SteveJRogers Jan 20 2007 03:25 PM

Opinion: Even considering the rate of inflation ticket prices today are sky high, though still the most affordable of the four major sports. Fact: Last season was the first time since 1979 that all televised Met games were done by the same crew