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Baseball Card Thread, Relaunched

seawolf17 Jan 18 2007 11:31 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jan 18 2007 11:51 AM

Weird to start this thread with an MFY image, but I thought this was freaky - I saw it on a baseball card board I visit. That's a 1994 SP Holoviews Carlos Delgado card (when he was a catcher!), with a hologram in the bottom right corner... of Don Mattingly. Theoretically, that's supposed to be of the same player; the hologram is freaky enough as is, but it's just bizarre when it's the wrong player. The correct card: Error cards are funny.

metirish Jan 18 2007 11:35 AM

I saw this card in person.....

Edgy DC Jan 18 2007 11:38 AM

Not that I'm seeing much in that hologram, but what I'm seeing looks like Carlos Delgado. Looks dark-skinned. Looks to have a colored v-neck jersey, looks like a Blue Jay logo on the cap.

Benjamin Grimm Jan 18 2007 11:43 AM

Maybe you're only seeing the second of the two cards, Edgy. The first card has a hologram that's clearly Don Mattingly.

Edgy DC Jan 18 2007 11:47 AM

Yeah, I'm just seeing a big break between the first two paragraphs. I guess there's an image there not loading for me.

seawolf17 Jan 18 2007 11:52 AM

Relinked the image... perhaps better now?

metirish Jan 18 2007 12:01 PM

[quote="seawolf17":3del09gj]Relinked the image... perhaps better now?[/quote:3del09gj] nope,I still see Donnie baseball...

Edgy DC Jan 18 2007 12:12 PM

Nope. My browser is clearly configured so as to block images of the alleged Hit Man.

Kong76 Jan 18 2007 05:53 PM

I got these 86 TCMA postcards during the summer. I don't know the history behind them ... were they a Shea giveaway? There's 40 of 'em ... anyway, here's Davey ... the dot on his head is one of those defect spots ....

SteveJRogers Jan 18 2007 07:12 PM

Those were made by TCMA and were the semi-official postcards of the Mets for a couple of years in the mid-80's. Later years they were done by a fellow named Barry Colla and now actually are done by the Mets, and given away at some function they do for the Starlight Children's Foundation. Anyway, those TCMAs were not given away at Shea, but advertized through Met publications and such, essentially send-a-ways. These days the sets will pop up at card shows and the like, the set isn't rare by any stretch. Distinguishing feature of the 1986 set of course is a very blue rendering of the 25th Anniversary logo on the back of all of the cards.

cooby Jan 18 2007 08:01 PM

I don't remember what year we got ours, but we have a Mackey Sasser and a Jeff Torberg postcard, received after we wrote letters to those two Mets. Mackey's doesn't have a personal message (to my daughter) but Susie Torberg wrote me a nice note on the back of Jeff's. So they were also used by the players as correspondence. What year would that be, around 1991?

Kong76 Jan 18 2007 08:06 PM

Thanks for the backround info. I knew they weren't rare ... the bozo that I bought them from had a whole box of them and charged me five bucks for a pack when I knew he gave two packs to a friend of ours for free. I probably would have bought 2 or 3 packs if I didn't know that and probably still should have.

Vic Sage Jan 19 2007 08:18 AM

my daughter is now getting into collecting baseball cards. She got the Topps 06 complete box set for xmas, and has put them into 9-card sleeves in a binder (organized by team). i never really collected cards (i was/am a comic book junkie), so i don't really know the ins and outs, and i don't know how to advise her. i've suggested she stick to Topps, because they're the "real ones", as far as i'm concerned. Obviously, i know rookie cards are valuable, and i know she's going to want to get as many Mets cards as she can. Is there a preferred internet source for well-priced old mets cards? rookie cards? annual sets? Is there a preferred style of storage, organization, etc, to which i can refer her? Any other thoughts or suggestions?

Johnny Dickshot Jan 19 2007 08:31 AM

Vic, I don't the answer to that, but as a kid the most enjoyable thing about baseball cards was that there was no "right way" to treat them, organize them, whatever. Let her do what she wants with them. I used to build forts with mine. Oh, btw, here's a pretty interesting bb-card blog: [url]http://cardboardgods.blogspot.com/ He can write some.

seawolf17 Jan 19 2007 08:39 AM

Topps is kinda the "old guard." They're still generally the most approachable from a young person's standpoint; the basic set is relatively inexpensive and easy to find (everywhere from hobby stores to Target). As far as online sources go, I'm a member of The Bench, which is a baseball card discussion board where we do a pretty good deal of trading (I've been a member for a year, and I've made almost 200 trades). I've picked up a lot of cards that way, both Metly and not. My advice for new collectors would be to pick something and stick with it. There is an enormous amount of variety, both price-wise and idea-wise, in the market right now. I collect three things: cards of my favorite players (Kevin McReynolds, Keith Hernandez, Pete Harnisch, Wright and Reyes), Topps base sets (1976 - my birth year, 1980-88 - the years I was a big-time collector as a kid, and 2006+), and Mets Topps cards, as a fun history-type project to build with Miniwolf some day. I'd advise her to do the same. If she wants Mets cards, tell her to go for it; eBay is a good start, as I've picked up a lot of things there also. If she needs help, shoot me an e-mail or a PM and I'll help her out. She can use me as a reference on the Bench if she'd like. (I don't know how old she is; there are a good number of kids on the board, but not really anyone younger than high-school age.) I'd also advise her to register at beckett.com -- they have a free "My Collection" tool where she can catalog what she has, and she can easily see the values of her collection. If she wants to pay, she can get the full online price guide, but I don't know that it's worth it; you can generally figure out what you need from the My Collections pages. (It'll give you the total value of each folder, but not individual values -- but if you move cards around between folders, it's really easy to see the value of one card if it's in a folder by itself, or if you move it out of a folder, you can just do the quick math to figure out the difference in the price of the total folder.) As far as storage, I keep my sets and my player collections in binders, and my extra cards that I use for trading in 800-count boxes. Storage can actually get pricey if you want it to, but you can pick up storage boxes cheaply at your local baseball card shop. I'm very willing to help if need be, or if you or she have specific questions. Let me know. My site is linked on my profile here, as well as at the Bench. edit: JD's right. There's no "correct" way to do it. Just tell her to do what she wants to do with them. My ten-year-old cousin collects, and has some relatively valuable cards (game-used relics, gold parallels, etc.) just jammed in with everything else. I cringe every time I see them, but ultimately, it's his collection, and he can do whatever he wants with it.

Edgy DC Jan 19 2007 09:07 AM

Our forts were seven stories tall. I have a picture somewhere.

seawolf17 Jan 19 2007 09:43 AM

And all you fort-building folks who have boxes of 1976 Topps laying around the house, please stick them in a box and send them to me. Thanks.

Vic Sage Jan 19 2007 11:05 AM

thanks, wolfie. that was helpful. and of course there's no "correct" way... i asked if there was a "preferred" way. as a kid, i "preferred" to play "colors"... its like war with bb cards, matching colors would win. we also "flipped" cards.

Methead Jan 19 2007 11:16 AM

When I first discovered ebay, I went nuts buying a lot of cards I wanted as a kid but couldn't afford. When I lived in Brooklyn, I focused on Dodgers cards from the 1950's. My favorite set is the 1952 Bowman. They're awesome. For example, I've got this Gil Hodges card... As well as this Pee Wee Reese.

SteveJRogers Jan 19 2007 05:20 PM

[quote="Vic Sage"]my daughter is now getting into collecting baseball cards. She got the Topps 06 complete box set for xmas, and has put them into 9-card sleeves in a binder (organized by team). i never really collected cards (i was/am a comic book junkie), so i don't really know the ins and outs, and i don't know how to advise her. i've suggested she stick to Topps, because they're the "real ones", as far as i'm concerned. Obviously, i know rookie cards are valuable, and i know she's going to want to get as many Mets cards as she can. Is there a preferred internet source for well-priced old mets cards? rookie cards? annual sets? Is there a preferred style of storage, organization, etc, to which i can refer her? Any other thoughts or suggestions?

There is a "Mets Memorabillia Club" out there (no clue if anyone there is responsible for the cobweb filled MetsCollector.com) run by a guy out in Oceanside, New York and every two years he prints out a hefty "Mets Memoribillia Checklist" that catalouges just about EVERYTHING you can think of.

Oddball sets, official team 8x10's, postcards, programs (including other team's programs that featured Metly images), books, pennants, pins, and just about every other darn thing that a Met has been pictured on

The last edition, this past year, was on a CDRom file. I can send you the data for the card portion of it

Kong76 Jan 19 2007 05:34 PM

Dave Berman! I was in that 'club' and used to get newsletters. The checklist books were great for people obsessed with completing different facets of Mets' collecting. He also used to sell stuff, at kinda ridiculous prices, but he had everything Mets you could want to collect. Haven't got a mailing in years, figured he re- tired from it or grew ill or something. OE: I pc'd your post and glossed over your link (which looks interesting) and that there is a computer data version of the Berman checklist?

SteveJRogers Jan 19 2007 06:08 PM

[quote="KC":2oe3bbiz]Dave Berman! I was in that 'club' and used to get newsletters. The checklist books were great for people obsessed with completing different facets of Mets' collecting. He also used to sell stuff, at kinda ridiculous prices, but he had everything Mets you could want to collect. Haven't got a mailing in years, figured he re- tired from it or grew ill or something. OE: I pc'd your post and glossed over your link (which looks interesting) and that there is a computer data version of the Berman checklist?[/quote:2oe3bbiz] I don't think so, I think it's just whatever the person(s) has images of as opposed to an organization of Met memorabilia I found the site in 2005 here as Edgy found it looking for an image of Larry Bowa that was from the 1991 Wiz "Every Met To Ever Play" set, and it does not appear to have been updated since

Kong76 Jan 19 2007 06:34 PM

I think we're confusing each other. Forget about the site, you said you have a CD (a year old) of something ... is it by Berman's Mets Memorabilia club?

SteveJRogers Jan 19 2007 06:47 PM

[quote="KC":1aebgvuk]I think we're confusing each other. Forget about the site, you said you have a CD (a year old) of something ... is it by Berman's Mets Memorabilia club?[/quote:1aebgvuk] The CD is Berman's. Also up to date since 2005

Kong76 Jan 19 2007 07:05 PM

Huh, maybe I was blackballed. I just stopped hearing from him/them (what- ever) and never knew why as I said earlier.

seawolf17 Feb 12 2007 11:35 AM

Saw this on one of the baseball card boards I visit: That's five different Marcus Giles cards, all produced by Upper Deck, combined to make a neat tableau.

Benjamin Grimm Feb 12 2007 11:52 AM

That second one looks a lot like those 1971 Topps cards that I love so much.

Johnny Dickshot Feb 12 2007 12:08 PM

2 and 5 are the only ones not hideously overdesigned

Frayed Knot Feb 12 2007 12:17 PM

The sequence should show him morphing into a Padre

Benjamin Grimm Feb 12 2007 12:27 PM

[quote="Johnny Dickshot":39x4v4bb]2 and 5 are the only ones not hideously overdesigned[/quote:39x4v4bb] I don't object as strongly to number 1 as you do. That doorknob thing is a little weird, though, but I wouldn't call it hideous. Numbers 3 and 4 are, exactly as you say, hideously overdesigned. I think that cards that look like those are a big part of what keeps me from rekindling my long dormant interest in baseball cards.

seawolf17 Feb 12 2007 02:09 PM

2 and 5 are both vintage-style reprints. #2 is from the 2002 Upper Deck Vintage set, where yes, they did use a style similar to the 1971 Topps design; #5 is a reimagining of the original 1989 UD set, with current stars. It was part of an insert set in one of the recent UD sets. Topps has done quite a bit with vintage styles; their 06 Topps Heritage parallels the '57 set, and their 06 Bowman Heritage parallels the 1949 Bowman set. The 07 Topps Heritage, due in March, parallels the 58 Topps set.

Johnny Dickshot Feb 12 2007 02:17 PM

Like the full-bleed photo on the Chris Ray card. Love them '58 Topps. Distinctness and style out the ass on those.

seawolf17 Feb 12 2007 02:22 PM

The other vintagey thing they're doing is that in every vintage-style set, they're issuing a certain subset of cards that are shortprinted. Frustratingly, Jose Reyes was shortprinted in both the '03 and '05 Topps Heritage sets, so I haven't tracked those down yet.

SteveJRogers Feb 14 2007 08:20 PM

This is the what the 2007 David Wright Topps Base card looks like. I like the "intent" of throwing back, but its still on the bit much side, especially with the silver action going on

seawolf17 Feb 15 2007 07:45 AM

Should be out next week. I, for one, am actually excited, because now that Wright is an Official Topps Spokesperson, there will be a lot of neat Wright inserts and bonuses in the set.

OlerudOwned Feb 26 2007 01:10 PM

It must be fun to work at Topps. Can you find the mistakes in Derek Jeter's '07 card? http://www.sportscollectorsdaily.com/la ... jeter.html

Edgy DC Feb 26 2007 01:32 PM

It's hard to tell. Is that the President standing up and yelling at him? Don't presidents get corporate boxes so they're not easy targets? Is Mickey Mantle in the hole with a bat? Are they wearing hime pinstripes on the road? Is that an actual "NY" on his breast? It looks like "...ES."

Benjamin Grimm Feb 26 2007 01:45 PM

Are they technically "mistakes" if they're intentionally Photoshopped into the picture?

Edgy DC Feb 26 2007 01:47 PM

I like how the president is in focus and his seating partners are not.

metsguyinmichigan Feb 26 2007 02:07 PM

Well there are two big mistakes. Jeter is hitting the ball, and there's no Tom Verducci on the side telling Jeter how great he is. Not that I'm bitter. Much.

Benjamin Grimm Feb 26 2007 02:08 PM

And I can't see Jeter's halo.

metsguyinmichigan Feb 26 2007 02:12 PM

[quote="Yancy Street Gang":338ndwi1]And I can't see Jeter's halo.[/quote:338ndwi1] Badass!

seawolf17 Feb 26 2007 02:21 PM

Yeah, that card's an embarrassment. I'm down with Photoshopping guys into their new uni's: (Okay, so that image is still a little unsettling.) ...but that Jeter is going too far.

metsguyinmichigan Feb 27 2007 07:50 AM

I had a little fun mocking this card on the blog today. Jeter and Mantle are always fair game. Enjoy! http://metsguyinmichigan.blogspot.com/

Benjamin Grimm Feb 27 2007 09:05 AM

You stole my halo line! If I had an attorney, you'd be hearing from him! (Or her!)

Edgy DC Feb 27 2007 09:16 AM

Yup. How about a little citation when you borrow? Meanwhile, Wayne Grezky's Honus Wagner card has sold for $2.35 million.

metsguyinmichigan Feb 27 2007 12:17 PM

[quote="Yancy Street Gang":340tskcq]You stole my halo line! If I had an attorney, you'd be hearing from him! (Or her!)[/quote:340tskcq] My apologies. That shall be corrected.

Benjamin Grimm Feb 27 2007 01:53 PM

No biggie. You didn't really have to give me credit, and you can remove that if you like. A stolen joke is a compliment, not a cause for complaint.

metsguyinmichigan Feb 27 2007 05:50 PM

[quote="Yancy Street Gang":3iukg51l]No biggie. You didn't really have to give me credit, and you can remove that if you like. A stolen joke is a compliment, not a cause for complaint.[/quote:3iukg51l] Nope, it would be like Verducci giving Jeter credit for an ARod home run! But seriously, I'm surprised Topps let that happen. It sure could have been a lot worse.

seawolf17 Feb 27 2007 06:40 PM

My problem is this... I'm going to need that Jeter card for my set. Do I sell it now, get $100 bucks for it, and hope the price bottoms out and I can pick one up later? Hmmm....

SteveJRogers Feb 27 2007 06:56 PM

I'm sure you'll get a few suckers even after the market bottoms out. My dad actually bought this Ryan card that was marked up (not an insane markup, maybe a few bucks more than it was worth) because the dealer said it was a "rare oddity" with Ryan throwing a football.

SteveJRogers Feb 27 2007 07:01 PM

Now here is my question. How long will it take before someone takes that card, cut signatures of Mantle, GWB and Jeter (or somehow get Jeter and Dubbya to sign it) and puts THAT on eBay and for how much!

cooby Feb 27 2007 07:12 PM

I read somewhere that that football was photoshopped in.

OlerudOwned Feb 27 2007 07:16 PM

[quote="seawolf17":76unyoxm]My problem is this... I'm going to need that Jeter card for my set. Do I sell it now, get $100 bucks for it, and hope the price bottoms out and I can pick one up later? Hmmm....[/quote:76unyoxm]Doubt you'll get much cash for it unless you find a real sucker, apparently they're going to leave it in as the real Jeter card, so it'll be as common as any other.

seawolf17 Feb 27 2007 07:21 PM

Thing is, it's selling on eBay for almost that much. I know in my head that the price will bottom out... so do I sell now, then pick it up for a couple of bucks down the road? Or does the price stay up, so I have to spend fifty bucks to get it back for my set? Bleh. Wish I'd pulled two.

seawolf17 Feb 28 2007 07:43 AM

Okay, I listed it. We'll see what happens...

seawolf17 Feb 28 2007 10:32 AM

I added ten bucks to my Buy It Now at the last minute... apparently, I should have added more; it sold in fifteen minutes.

G-Fafif Mar 02 2007 05:23 AM

My main man Jason gets to the root of his collecting in today's Flashback: http://faithandfear.blogharbor.com/blog ... 74506.html

Johnny Dickshot Mar 06 2007 08:04 AM

Do I hear $385.5 million? Topps agrees to $385.4 million takeover Published: March 6, 2007 - 9:36 am (AP) — Topps Co. Inc., known for sports cards and Bazooka bubble gum, said Tuesday it accepted a $385.4 million takeover offer from a buyout group that includes Michael Eisner, the former chief executive of The Walt Disney Co. The buyout group, which includes The Tornante Co., founded by Mr. Eisner, and the Chicago-based private equity firm Madison Dearborn Partners, has agreed to pay $9.75 for each Topps shares, which represents a premium of 9.4% over the stock's Monday closing pricing of $8.91 on the Nasdaq Stock Exchange. The deal has been approved by the Topps board. Topps said in a statement that the deal still faces regulatory approval and a vote by Topps shareholders, but is expected to close in the third quarter. The company also said it ''intends to solicit superior proposals from third parties during the next 40 days.'' Mr. Eisner stepped down in 2005 after more than two decades years as chief executive of Disney, the entertainment and media company that owns theme parks, movie studios and the ABC, Disney and ESPN television networks. Topps was founded in 1938 and makes Major League Baseball, NFL, NBA and other trading cards. In addition to Bazooka bubble gum, it owns the candy brands Ring Pop and Push Pop. ''This will be a change in ownership, not a change in direction,'' Topps Chief Executive Arthur Shorin said in a statement.

Edgy DC Mar 06 2007 08:17 AM

Wow, an industry leader that grew more tiresome seemingly with each innovation gets gobbled up by an innovator like Michael Eisner. I boggle at what the future holds.

metsguyinmichigan Mar 06 2007 01:36 PM

Got some good old fashioned rack packs at Target today. I must say that the El Duque card, with him in his 1986 throwback uniform, is a beautiful thing.

Edgy DC Mar 23 2007 09:02 AM

I dislike this stuff, and it's part of what turns me off of cards. Brown: First look at Soriano isn’t so real Ron Gardenhire pitching batting practice. Not the first image you want to find when opening your first pack of baseball cards of the season. Roger Clemens delivering a fastball like a 24-year-old might. That would be splendid. Albert Pujols following through on his swing after crushing a hanging curveball. Awesome. That’s how you open a pack of cards. Ron Gardenhire throwing to Nick Punto, for all we know – that’s just not right. Upon closer examination of the Gardenhire card and the rest of this particular pack of 2007 Topps cards, though, Gardy nearly was the only genuine article in there. That, and the gum – which now is hermetically sealed in plastic to protect the cards, is soft to the chew, sugarless and more tasteless than ever. Almost everything else was an illusion. Alfonso Soriano’s first Cubs card, also, was in this pack. A nice shot, possibly in San Francisco, of Soriano in the batter’s box. Wearing a Cubs uniform. Except, he didn’t play for the Cubs a season ago. He played for Washington. It’s not from spring training. No baseball card company is that quick. It’s not from the future. DeLorean stopped making cars that go 88 mph. It’s clearly a photo from 2006, meticulously doctored to look like 2007. Baseball card companies, especially Topps, have a long history of monkeying with photos. In the old airbrush days, when players Dave Kingman and Bobby Bonds modeled new uniforms sometimes on the hour, their baseball cards would look like fuzzy dreams. The photo of Kingman in his 1978 Topps card looks like the person it depicts – who started with the New York Mets, went cross-country to the San Diego Padres, headed north to the California Angels and sprinted back east to the New York Yankees, before doing a bizarre U-turn and landing with the Cubs in the off-season. The Kingman card and others like it were obviously fake. It was an earnest attempt by Topps to stay current. Technology wouldn’t allow them to also look good doing it. Technology has almost caught up. The No. 270 Soriano card is a remarkable forgery – Topps might prefer “photo illustrationâ€

seawolf17 Mar 26 2007 07:38 PM

In my quest to complete the Mets Topps team sets going back to 1962, I got this Bobby Klaus card along with five other 1966s in the mail today. What's up with Bobby's brother? I'd think "ex-major leaguer" isn't the most interesting thing about... um, him?

Kid Carsey Mar 26 2007 08:03 PM

I can probably help you out, if you want to post or email me a 60's wish list.

Edgy DC Mar 26 2007 08:13 PM

It should say, "Bobby's brother looked hot in her tennis whites." I'd say it's a poor likeness:

Johnny Dickshot Mar 26 2007 09:20 PM

There was a dyslexic imbecile giving the cartoonist the caption. It should have read: Bobby's ex-brother is a big teaser.

Edgy DC Mar 26 2007 09:41 PM

I was thinking: "Bobby's mother is sexy, big, and eager."

seawolf17 Apr 02 2007 01:54 PM

Another chapter from the curious baseball card photo department... this one of Dinger, the Rockies' mascot, from the 2007 Topps Opening Day set: You're telling me the most recent photo Topps could get of the Rockies' mascot was from 1997? From R to L: Bruce Benedict (1997-1999) in the Mets dugout, the Jackie Robinson 50th anniversary sleeve patch, and what might be Rey Ordonez on the left. I love the idea behind these mascot cards, but some of the photos are just bizarre.

Benjamin Grimm Apr 02 2007 02:05 PM

I'd never seen (or heard of) Dinger before. He looks too much like he's from the cast of Barney for my liking. I think he's Baby Bop's cousin. Iccch. The team should have been named the Bears. They could at least have a bear as the mascot.

Benjamin Grimm Apr 02 2007 02:09 PM

And while I'm at it I also think the Rockies' ballpark should look like a pagoda. So there!

SteveJRogers Apr 02 2007 04:05 PM

Here is Mr. Met's card, not his Rookie Card interestingly enough In 2006 Upper Deck had a three card promotion set featuring Mr. Met, The Phillie Phanatic and the Red Sox's Wally

SteveJRogers Apr 02 2007 04:09 PM

Actually, that does look like an old shot in the UD card. Has to be mid 90's, after we ditched the tail of the S and before the Black

metsguyinmichigan Apr 03 2007 11:51 AM

[quote="seawolf17"]Another chapter from the curious baseball card photo department... this one of Dinger, the Rockies' mascot, from the 2007 Topps Opening Day set: You're telling me the most recent photo Topps could get of the Rockies' mascot was from 1997? From R to L: Bruce Benedict (1997-1999) in the Mets dugout, the Jackie Robinson 50th anniversary sleeve patch, and what might be Rey Ordonez on the left. I love the idea behind these mascot cards, but some of the photos are just bizarre.

Most frightening thing about that photo is the fact that someone has a mascot card from the Topps Opening Day set in a hard sleeve. That card will never be worth as much as the container.

Now, Mr. Met might....

seawolf17 Apr 10 2007 05:00 AM

Just got the complete 1983 and 1984 Topps sets on uncut factory sheets, six poster-sized sheets from each year. I'm very excited; I've wanted some uncut sheets for years. Don't quite know what to do with them now that I have them -- my original intent was to frame and hang them, but they're really enormous! I need to buy a bigger house with more walls.

SteveJRogers May 03 2007 07:30 PM

Okay, that is clearly Jerry Koosman on this fine Topps 1974 card spotlighting the 1973 NLCS. The site where this is being sold on, Beckett.com (well the person selling the card anyway) lists it as 1974 Topps #471 Jon Matlack NLCS Eh, see this every so often, but it's just funny seeing the wrong player credited on a lot. My guess is the seller is getting his images confused, because this is Jon's 1974 Topps card: BTW, I wonder why Rose v. Harrelson wasn't spotlighted.

seawolf17 Jun 05 2007 10:19 AM

Retro sets are all the rage. Topps is doing another Allen & Ginter set, and Upper Deck is doing a new 1933 Goudey set. In keeping with the A&G tradition of adding non-baseball notable figures to their set (the '06 set featured people like Jennie Finch, Hulk Hogan, and the Japanese hot-dog eating guy), the '07 set features Ken Jennings, among others. And in other news, Topps Series 2 is out, featuring a Dice-K card variation with the front entirely in Japanese: edit: Oh, and this might be my new favorite baseball card ever. The 2007 Bowman Jose Reyes:

DocTee Jun 05 2007 10:29 AM

That Reyes card is beautiful. Did Topps-- or any other maker-- get one of Endy's NLCS catch, a la our own Zvon? I'd love to see that

seawolf17 Jun 05 2007 10:32 AM

That's the back of the 2007 Topps Co-Signers Matsuzaka card. And yes, that says "Drafted: Mets #1 - June 2000". Suck it, Billy Traber.

DocTee Jun 05 2007 10:34 AM

why an asterik for 2005 and 2006 to note the same thing? wouldn't one suffice?

seawolf17 Jun 05 2007 10:35 AM

Yep. #193 in last year's Update set. If the Mets win that game, then it probably gets its own card, but...

Willets Point Jun 05 2007 10:39 AM

Ooh an error card. They spelled Fuckingmolina's name wrong.

DocTee Jun 05 2007 10:59 AM

It's a shame the Endy image isn't on it's own card-- that pic hardly does the catch justice.

Benjamin Grimm Jun 05 2007 11:04 AM

metsguyinmichigan Jun 05 2007 02:04 PM

[quote="Yancy Street Gang":3iw8dg99][/quote:3iw8dg99] Absolutley amazing! That 1972 set is my favorite!

Zvon Jun 05 2007 05:37 PM

ahhhh--the '72 set brings back memories.

SteveJRogers Jun 05 2007 06:18 PM

Any sighting of a Pedro Feliciano card in a 2007 set so far? And I guess that shot of Tucker in the NLCS highlights set is as close as a Michael Tucker in a Met uni set that I'm going to get for the 2006 NL East Champs Postseason Roster Team Set

cleonjones11 Jun 06 2007 10:49 PM

Game used swatches and Autographs of just about any Mets are available on Ebay..The cheapest place to buy...Just picked up a Gote 2005 Topps Chrome Fan favorite Auto for 5 bucks..

Johnny Dickshot Jun 07 2007 04:27 AM

This is interesting, somewhat TOPPS IS SUED By ZACHERY KOUWE June 7, 2007 -- Topps and some of its directors have been slapped with a lawsuit by rival Upper Deck, which wants to launch a hostile offer for the iconic baseball card maker that could derail a $385 million takeover by former Disney boss Michael Eisner. Upper Deck, which is joined in the suit by shareholder Northwood Investors, claims Topps breached a confidentiality agreement that was signed when the companies started merger negotiations. Upper Deck is seeking to get out of the agreement, which prevents it from launching a tender offer. Upper Deck has also sought an injunction to block shareholders from voting June 28 on the company's deal with Michael Eisner. Topps agreed on March 6 to be bought for $384.5 million, or $9.75 a share, by Eisner's Tornante Co. and buyout firm Madison Dearborn Partners. In late May, Upper Deck topped Eisner's bid by $1.00 a share, but the company claims Topps has shut Upper Deck out from negotiations and has refused to turn over sensitive financial information. The deal with Eisner has caused several large Topps shareholders, who also have representatives on the company's board, to launch a proxy contest against the other directors, who they have dubbed "the seven dwarfs." "This lawsuit shows that Upper Deck is serious about acquiring Topps but is being blocked by Eisner and the company's management team," said one angry shareholder. Topps claims it has negotiated in good faith with Upper Deck and there is significant antitrust risk in selling the company to a rival. "This action challenges a type of unlawful conduct which is occurring with greater frequency" in which "private equity funds have 'persuaded' management to take public companies private based on promises of continued employment and increased equity participation," Upper Deck said in the complaint. A hearing on the suit is scheduled for June 11 in Delaware Chancery. Shares of Topps rose 5 cents to close at $10.26 as investors bet Upper Deck will eventually win the deal or Eisner will raise his offer.

cleonjones11 Jun 07 2007 03:15 PM

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Farmer Ted Jun 11 2007 01:18 PM

Apparently George Mitchell is using the Barry Bonds rookie card as evidence/proof that Barry did, in fact, use steroids. http://www.funny.com/_fc/0/2/fn.5120.jpg

Edgy DC Jun 11 2007 01:20 PM

I'd hate to see what they have posted at unfunny.com

Benjamin Grimm Jun 11 2007 01:26 PM

You can see for yourself: http://www.unfunny.com/

Edgy DC Jun 11 2007 01:44 PM

I'd hate to.

SteveJRogers Jun 17 2007 05:34 PM Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Jun 17 2007 05:45 PM

Two Wagners, uh thats Billy, not Honus The one on the left is Wagner's regular issue #109, the second can be found in the Mets factory set of 14 (numbered NYM9) It's highly possible Topps just wanted to replace all horozontial cards in those factory packs since every other card is exactly the same as the regular issue, well save for being numbered NYM1-NYM14. The guess probably comes from the fact that the "infamous" Jeter card is not in the Yankee factory set

SteveJRogers Jun 17 2007 05:42 PM

Oh, In case you were wondering, here is the listing of who is in that Met factory set, which can be found at Shea, hobby stores and other places where cards are sold, great for a starter set: Wright Reyes Beltran Valentin Green Hernandez Martinez Milledge Wagner Lo Duca Alou Delgado Glavine Humber (RC)

seawolf17 Jun 20 2007 01:44 PM

Not a fan of what we on the baseball card boards call "band-aid" or "sticker" autographs, but at least Endy's got his own card. Selling for decent dollars on eBay, which is too bad, because it would be nice to own. I got outbid on an autographed 8x10 photo of "The Catch" at a silent auction a few weeks back. I'm such a cheap bastard.

SteveJRogers Jul 10 2007 02:41 PM

The Catch shows up nice on Endy's Upper Deck card, #381 Well it does on the actual card! Well Upper Deck doesn't want photo stealing, but ebay doesn't mind

DocTee Jul 10 2007 05:14 PM

Zvon's montage is better. By far.

Benjamin Grimm Jul 10 2007 05:31 PM

seawolf17 Jul 12 2007 10:55 AM

Well, I bit the bullet and I have one of those autographed Endys coming my way. It'll be a neat piece to add to my collection. Speaking of collecting, I've just been selected to join the mod team over at The Bench, so if you're a card collector and would love to talk about it, there's a very large, active, and open trading community just waiting for you! Make sure you list me as a reference!

seawolf17 Aug 01 2007 06:32 AM

Hey! I'm surprised that nobody's jumped on the chance to own a piece of game-used bat from a guy who's 0-for-6 in his career! (Yeah, he has two career RBI, but they came as groundouts against Braden Looper and some guy named Jose Cabrera, so they don't count.)

G-Fafif Aug 24 2007 11:44 AM

Collecting 1972 Topps...in real time. (Forgive the two self-links in one day.)

seawolf17 Oct 05 2007 08:22 AM

Finally, Topps has answered the call of Mets fans everywhere and produced a Rick Peterson card. The Peterson -- and the other coaches (there's a Jerry Manuel too) are included in a new 55-card box set (available for $19.99 at your local baseball card shop). Not a bad idea; I do wish we had a better season to commemorate, but whatever. Picked this baby up a few weeks ago for fifteen bucks: There's something so wrong about a Tom Seaver Red Sox autograph, but hey, for fifteen bucks, I have a Seaver auto in my collection. Picked this one up for less than five bucks also: Not that you need to have a Brian Cole auto, but he is dead and all, so it's an interesting historical footnote. Besides, didn't the Mets name some sort of minor league award after him?

seawolf17 Oct 27 2007 02:28 PM

Work on my autograph collection, part one, is nearly complete: Row 1: Kevin McReynolds, Jim Rice, Pete Harnisch, Tom Seaver, Bud Harrelson, Sid Fernandez, Frank Catalanotto Row 2: Jim Bouton, Ryan Freel, Nick Capra, Ed Kranepool, Whitey Herzog, Howard Johnson, Rusty Staub (signed "Le Grande Orange" Rusty Staub) Row 3: Dave Righetti, Duke Snider, Endy Chavez, Joe Nathan, Gary Carter, Bobby Jones, Bruce Sutter Row 4: Jose Reyes, Keith Hernandez, Juan Encarnacion Kind of a motley collection. Some are superstars (Seaver, Snider), some are personal favorites (Mac, Mex, Kid, El Sid), some are guys with whom I share a birthday (Freel, Encarnacion, Bouton, Capra), some are hometown guys (Harnisch, Catalanotto). Some in person, some certified card company autos. Still looking for a Wright to plug in there, and I'll probably replace the Bobby Jones with someone better eventually. Already working on frame #2.

seawolf17 Dec 05 2007 06:00 PM

A lovely baseball-card related holiday gift for the card lover on your list: the "Rated Rookie" shirt. Love it.

seawolf17 Dec 13 2007 01:10 PM

Anyone have any idea who this is?

Edgy DC Dec 13 2007 01:33 PM

This may seem goofy, but I think it's a pre-moustache Craig Swan.

seawolf17 Dec 13 2007 01:37 PM

Swan was actually my guess too, but he was a nobody in 1975. (Or was he a top prospect?)

John Cougar Lunchbucket Dec 13 2007 01:58 PM

I think its an actor. It's not Shea he's pitching in yet he's wearing a home uni.

DocTee Dec 13 2007 02:15 PM

Fifteen cents per pack and mouth slicing gum to boot-- thems were the days.

metsmarathon Dec 13 2007 03:34 PM

[quote="seawolf17"]A lovely baseball-card related holiday gift for the card lover on your list: the "Rated Rookie" shirt. Love it.

personally, i like the billy ripken shirt. makes a great gift!

seawolf17 Dec 13 2007 03:59 PM

[quote="metsmarathon"][quote="seawolf17"]A lovely baseball-card related holiday gift for the card lover on your list: the "Rated Rookie" shirt. Love it.

personally, i like the billy ripken shirt. makes a great gift!
Yeah, I was torn between those two.

Methead Dec 13 2007 04:25 PM

"the "Rated Rookie" shirt" That. Is. Awesome.

DocTee Dec 13 2007 04:28 PM

The Jewboys logo is classick. Love the Strawberry tee, too. Amazin' Mess, not so much.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Dec 13 2007 06:18 PM

$32. Dude.

seawolf17 Dec 14 2007 07:52 AM

Yeah, for a T-shirt. Not happening.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Dec 14 2007 07:56 AM

The 'bucket family had the misfortune to run into a guy Mrs. Bucket knew from the local new-parents group last weekend. He'd launched his own baby-clothing line and as a good-neighbor gesture, I picked one out while they got reacquainted. Twenty fucking eight dollars. Happy holidays you f-ing crook.

seawolf17 Jan 21 2008 10:06 AM

I'm going to throw this out there, since I haven't tried it here. I spend a good amount of time on a baseball card trading site, but I've tapped most folks there dry. Any chance anyone around these parts has some extra old Mets cards laying around that they don't know what to do with? I'm putting together a Mets collection for MiniWolf, and I'm done with everything from 1962-1979, except these: 1962 Topps 29 Casey Stengel 572 Bob G Miller 1963 Topps 292 Pumpsie Green 316 Norm Sherry 393 Ken MacKenzie 419 Tracy Stallard 469 Jay Hook 495 Frank Thomas 511 Charlie Neal 528 Carl Willey 550 Duke Snider 566 Cliff Cook 1964 Topps 527 Larry Bearnarth 536 Elliot/Stephenson 556 Dillon/Locke 582 Rod Kanehl 1966 Topps 385 Ken Boyer 402 Jim Hickman 421 Roy McMillan 464 Larry Bearnarth 480 Dick Stuart 534 Eilers/Gardner 561 Choo Choo Coleman 574 Hepler/Murphy 589 Lou Klimchock 1967 Topps 470 Bob Shaw 522 John Stephenson 533 Jack Fisher 537 Chuck Estrada 555 Don Cardwell 561 Sandy Alomar 568 John Sullivan 574 Jerry Buchek 593 Wes Westrum 606 Ron Taylor 1968 Topps 45 Tom Seaver 486 Cal Koonce 503 Al Jackson 536 Bill Short 1970 Topps 575 Cleon Jones 712 Nolan Ryan 1971 Topps 513 Nolan Ryan 596 Mike Jorgensen 725 Gary Gentry 1972 Topps 445 Tom Seaver 655 Jerry Grote 673 Dave Marshall 707 Tim Foli 722 Bill Sudakis 755 Jim Fregosi 781 Jim McAndrew I'm not looking for anything in mint condition -- really, anything but, as I'm looking to do this on the cheap -- but I'd be interested in whatever anyone might have.

bmfc1 Jan 31 2008 08:45 AM

To those in the know, what is this card? Thanks. http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l165/ ... /10273.jpg

AG/DC Jan 31 2008 08:46 AM

Looks like fabric swatches.

seawolf17 Jan 31 2008 09:31 AM

That would be two uni pieces and a bat piece (Knight). It's from Topps' Triple Threads set, a pretty high-end set with tons of interesting inserts like that.

AG/DC Jan 31 2008 09:42 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Feb 16 2008 05:25 PM

(stickler)If it's commemorating that play, it should be Mookie's bat, as Knight's wasn't involved.(/stickler)

seawolf17 Jan 31 2008 09:52 AM

Yeah, they're not so much on getting minor details correct as much as they are just putting the players together. They had pieces from all three guys, they stuck them together. The End.

SteveJRogers Jan 31 2008 10:01 AM

If you think thats bad, there have been situations where the jersey swatch doesn't even match the team the player is photographed with! For example, I've seen cards of Seaver as a Red, but with an obvious Mets jersey swatch!

bmfc1 Jan 31 2008 10:04 AM

Thanks. You said that it was "high-end." What is the value and what year was it issued?

seawolf17 Jan 31 2008 10:07 AM

2006, and as best I can tell, it either books $60 or $50 (likely $60, because I'm assuming from the background and the numbering that it's the "emerald" variation).

metsguyinmichigan Jan 31 2008 10:12 AM

[quote="SteveJRogers":2h5b6cp4]If you think thats bad, there have been situations where the jersey swatch doesn't even match the team the player is photographed with! For example, I've seen cards of Seaver as a Red, but with an obvious Mets jersey swatch![/quote:2h5b6cp4] That's nothing. Once I got a Seaver jersey swatch card, and it had red pinstripes. I thought for a minute and realized Seaver never once was on a team that had red pinstripes. So I called the company, Fleer, and they said the Seaver swatches got mixed up with Pat Burrell swatches, so they card had Burrell's striped Phillies uniform on them. Ick. I wrote a story about it. The "collector" in the story is actually me.

bmfc1 Jan 31 2008 11:27 AM

[quote="seawolf17":2maq0c6m]2006, and as best I can tell, it either books $60 or $50 (likely $60, because I'm assuming from the background and the numbering that it's the "emerald" variation).[/quote:2maq0c6m] Thank you seawolf.

seawolf17 Feb 01 2008 09:04 AM

The Smoking Gun has a first look on the Presidential Candidate insert set in Topps' 2008 set, which comes out next week: http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/ye ... opps1.html

metsmarathon Feb 01 2008 09:50 AM

i think the candidates should've posed for topps' cameras specifically, holding assorted baseball paraphernalia, perhaps imitating notable cards of yore, like hillary holding kirby puckett's gigantic bat from the '92ish set, or mike huckabee standing in for billy ripken.

AG/DC Feb 01 2008 09:53 AM

What gives with Senator Clinton's big honking watch?

seawolf17 Feb 01 2008 10:03 AM Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Jun 03 2008 12:32 PM

That is a rather mannish watch, isn't it? Yikes. Nice shots of Huckabee's wandering eye, Bill Richardson lurking in the shadows like a kid-toucher, and Rudy saying "Don't you understand? It was all me on 9/11."

Benjamin Grimm Feb 01 2008 10:29 AM

Do you say these are being inserted into baseball card sets?

SteveJRogers Feb 03 2008 10:49 AM

Not a baseball card, but check out this nifty McFarlane custom on ebay

SteveJRogers Feb 03 2008 10:51 AM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm"]Do you say these are being inserted into baseball card sets?

Yup. I guess a way to spurn some causal interest in the base set, rather than completing an actual set on it's own.

The Allen & Ginter sets even feature non-sport figures, including ex-Presidents and such.

AG/DC Feb 15 2008 10:13 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Feb 15 2008 10:22 AM

Here's a unique lot. Six Tidewater Tide cards, early seventies, b/w, autographed, sponsored by a sandwich shop. Five of the six eventually made the team, and the sixth is an Andy Kauffman character. http://cgi.ebay.com/Group-of-6-signed-T ... otohosting

Kong76 Feb 15 2008 10:19 AM

Wow, a signed Jerry Cram card! I'm half tempted to bid, but snider5 looks like he's hard corps.

SteveJRogers Feb 16 2008 04:54 PM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm"]Do you say these are being inserted into baseball card sets?

FYI, while not part of the 1972 baseball card set, check out these 1972 Topps cards

Lot-of-9-1972-TOPPS-PRESIDENTS-AND-CANDIDATES-CARDS

seawolf17 Jun 03 2008 12:32 PM

Old skool Ron Darling.

metirish Jun 03 2008 12:38 PM

Junior Mint The enduring popularity (and ubiquity) of the 1989 Upper Deck Ken Griffey Jr. card. By Darren Rovell Ken Griffey, Jr. rookie card. The most famous card in the history of pictures on cardboard is the T206 Honus Wagner, so rare that one of them sold for more than $2 million last year. The most well-known card of the modern era is the 1989 Upper Deck Ken Griffey Jr., the No. 1 card in the company's inaugural set. As Griffey nears the 600-home-run landmark, sales of the Upper Deck No. 1 are as brisk as always, with buyers snapping up a couple of dozen every day on eBay at prices ranging from $15 to $300. These two cards, the bookends of the collecting phenomenon, are exact opposites. The Wagner is the white whale of the card trade: elusive, highly coveted, and known to drive men to madness. The Griffey is the childhood lust object that everyone's mother saved, arguably the most popular, most widely held baseball card of all time. When Griffey welcomed collectors to the very first Upper Deck set, investment was just about to trump fun in the card world. Kids had started putting their collections in plastic sheets and hard cases rather than bicycle spokes and shoe boxes, and investors would cross-check every card picked from a pack against the latest issue of Beckett's price guide. It was in this environment that Upper Deck launched in 1989 as the first premium baseball card, protected from the threat of counterfeiting with a hologram on each card, protected from the stain of the wax pack thanks to its unprecedented foil wrappers. There was no gum included, and packs cost an industry-high $1. Baseball cards were serious business. The Griffey card was the perfect piece of memorabilia at the perfect time. The number the card was given only furthered the prospect of his cardboard IPO. Junior was chosen to be card No. 1 by an Upper Deck employee named Tom Geideman, a college student known for his keen eye for talent. Geideman earned his rep by consistently clueing in the founders of The Upper Deck, the card shop where the business was hatched, on which players would be future stars. Geideman took the task of naming the player for the first card very seriously. Using an issue of Baseball America as his guide, Geideman knew that card No. 1 would belong to Gregg Jefferies, Sandy Alomar Jr., Gary Sheffield, or a long-shot candidate, the phenom they called "The Kid." It's probably the most thinking Geideman ever did compiling a checklist, save for the 1992 Upper Deck set when he assigned numbers that ended in 69 to players with porn-star-sounding names. (Dick Schofield at No. 269, Heathcliff Slocumb at No. 569, and Dickie Thon at No. 769.) Despite the fact that Griffey had yet to crack the majors, Geideman had the confidence that the top pick in the 1987 draft would live up to his pedigree. It goes without saying that this was a genius selection. You could imagine how the people at Topps felt when Junior became an instant superstar—and they hadn't even included him in their 792-card set. From the very beginning, card buffs saw the Upper Deck No. 1 as not just a collectible, but as an investment. Baseball card fans, who had once traded away duplicate cards in a quest to compile a complete set, started hoarding as many Griffeys as they could. Collectors' hands would shake when they saw Griffey's face in their pack, confident that this card would be the key to financing a college education. But the truth was that even though Upper Deck printed fewer cards than its contemporaries—Donruss, Fleer, Topps, and Score—in this case, supply came close to meeting demand. Today, many people face the reality of unloading their Griffeys at a heavy discount on eBay. On May 4, for example, you could find two people selling two separate lots of 11 Upper Deck card No. 1s. One guy was selling a lot of 26, which eventually went for $760. It comes as no surprise that the Griffey card is the most-graded piece of cardboard in the history of the hobby. (Card grading, if you're unaware, is done by services that slap a card in between plastic and evaluate exactly how pristine it really is.) Professional Sports Authenticator has graded 51,800 Griffeys, while Beckett has graded about 25,400. (PSA's second-place card is the 1985 Topps Mark McGwire Olympic rookie card, with 46,000 grades. Beckett's No. 2 is the 2001 Upper Deck Tiger Woods card, which has been graded about 21,500 times.) A Griffey that was graded a perfect 10 once sold for north of $1,000. Now it would go for closer to $275. "Raw," ungraded Griffeys sell for $15 to $50. (By comparison, Donruss and Fleer versions of the Griffey rookie, from graded to ungraded, usually range in price from $1 to $20.) Despite Griffey's illustrious career—some might call it disappointing relative to all the hype—it's amazing that the card could even command a couple hundred bucks, given how common it is and how many of them seem to be in great condition. More than 1 million Griffey cards were printed. In Upper Deck's original mailing to dealers, the company said it would sell 65,000 cases of card packs. With 20 boxes in a case, 520 cards in a box, and 700 different cards in the set, there would be about 965,000 of each card produced for the boxes. Combine that number with the amount of Griffeys in the untold number of "factory sets," and you'd have your production run. Given the number of Griffey cards in circulation, there have long been rumors of an illicit reason for the card's ubiquity. Upper Deck, the legend goes, knew that printing the cards was just like printing money. As such, there was a sheet the company could run with 100 Griffey cards on it, instead of the standard sheet that had just one Griffey in the top corner along with 99 pictures of other players. "If that existed, I never saw it," says Buzz Rasmussen, Upper Deck's plant manager at the time. Rob Veres of Burbank Sportscards, a memorabilia dealership with a warehouse of 30 million cards, says that if Griffeys were produced in greater quantity than other cards, he would've expected to come across larger collections of the card. If there was no funny business, why are the Griffey cards so abundant? The most natural explanation is that more were saved. Figure that about 95 percent of Frank DiPinos, Henry Cottos, and Steve Lombardozzis have hit the garbage can, while a huge percentage of the Griffeys have survived. Some dealers also swore to me that, although Upper Deck claims its packs were sequenced randomly, there was in fact a predictable pattern in the company's boxes that became valuable to learn. Therefore, the unopened Upper Deck packs that remain are less likely to have Griffey cards stashed inside them. There's one more reason for the Griffey profusion. While the card might not have received an extra production run, there was extra attention paid to its condition coming out of packs and factory sets. Because the Griffey was card No. 1, it resided in the upper-left-hand corner of the printing sheet. It was therefore more susceptible to miscuts and corner bends. Being the first card in the factory set also turned some of the Griffeys blue, the color of the box. Card collectors and dealers who received less-than-perfect Griffeys would write in to complain to Upper Deck. The nascent company—surely understanding that its products would be seen as investments—couldn't afford any bad PR at that early stage. According to Jay McCracken, then the company's vice president of marketing and sales, the customer service desk was the place to find stacks of new Griffeys. The company was more than happy to exchange the bad card for a pristine one to keep its customers happy. That came in handy a decade later when the value of a Griffey would be determined by the card graders. When Griffey hits home run No. 600, don't look for the value of Upper Deck No. 1 to skyrocket. After all, there's likely a card in circulation for every person living in the city centers of Cincinnati and Seattle. That sheer quantity, though, does mean that the lasting image of Ken Griffey Jr. won't be anything he does on the baseball field. It will be a picture of an overjoyed teenager in an airbrushed Mariners hat. http://www.slate.com/id/2191533

seawolf17 Jun 03 2008 12:55 PM

It's probably the most thinking Geideman ever did compiling a checklist, save for the 1992 Upper Deck set when he assigned numbers that ended in 69 to players with porn-star-sounding names. (Dick Schofield at No. 269, Heathcliff Slocumb at No. 569, and Dickie Thon at No. 769.) Nice!

John Cougar Lunchbucket Jun 03 2008 12:57 PM

Yes, I was impressed with that too. Crooked card dealers around that 91-93 time were selling unopened packs of 1990 Upper Decks on the idea you might find a Griffey inside, like a lottery ticket or something.

themetfairy Jun 03 2008 01:11 PM

[quote="seawolf17":2owo9lz9] Old skool Ron Darling.[/quote:2owo9lz9] Cool find Seawolf - love it!

seawolf17 Aug 14 2008 07:51 AM

Keith's in the 2008 Topps Triple Threads set... but... Oops.

AG/DC Aug 14 2008 08:04 AM

Kind of looks like he'd have a sweet righthanded stroke.

metsguyinmichigan Aug 14 2008 09:07 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 14 2008 10:02 AM

I love this Joe Smith card withe the Wonder Wheel in the background.

batmagadanleadoff Aug 14 2008 09:50 AM

[quote="metsguyinmichigan"] I love this Joe Smith card withe the Wonder Wheel in the background.

I love this shot of the Wonder Wheel with Joe Smith in the background.

seawolf17 Nov 16 2008 11:45 AM

Finally finished picking up the full set of Keith Hernandez parallel cards from the 08 Topps Triple Threads set. The top left is "gold", the bottom right is "sepia"... although they look the same on the scans. And the reversed negative makes me laugh.

Edgy DC Dec 15 2008 07:43 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Dec 15 2008 07:46 AM

"Casey at the Bat" as recited by some of the greatest --- or notable, or notorious --- baseball cards in history: http://baseballcardblog.blogspot.com/20 ... t-bat.html Brilliant. I especially like the APBA card thrown in there.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Dec 15 2008 07:44 AM

Yeah that thing is the best.

seawolf17 Dec 15 2008 07:53 AM

I figured I'd repost this here so it doesn't get lost in the "first" thread, and so we can save it for posterity. My first major league game, and all the participants therein, in autographed baseball card form.

Edgy DC Dec 15 2008 08:04 AM

So my questions about that awesome board. Why is Hubie coming after the pitcher, when he was a starting player and you seem to be laying out the players with deference to the starring lineup? Why is Kingman (and maybe Youngboold) depicted in non-Metly state?

seawolf17 Dec 15 2008 08:18 AM

[quote="Edgy DC":1te4o5cj]So my questions about that awesome board. Why is Hubie coming after the pitcher, when he was a starting player and you seem to be laying out the players with deference to the starring lineup? Why is Kingman (and maybe Youngboold) depicted in non-Metly state?[/quote:1te4o5cj] Thanks for reposting the q's. I don't know why Hubie and Youngblood are out of order. I'll switch them tonight. You're right about the lineup thing, though. There are a few wrong-teamed players. Ken Oberkfell is a Giant, Tom Herr is a Phillie, Neil Allen is a Cardinal (he was a Met then), and Kingman's a Cub. Youngblood's correct. I don't think Kingman has a certified Mets card autographed, and the other three I picked up online. I sent a Mets card to Neil Allen c/o his team this summer, but never got it back from him. I'll probably re-send to Herr this summer, and maybe Obie will sign with Buffalo this year. We might go up there this summer, so I'll try to get him to sign in person.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Dec 15 2008 08:19 AM

I'm impressed with the orange paint

G-Fafif Dec 15 2008 08:24 AM

Holy fuck, you've got the umpire's card in there. Jesus fucking Alou, that thing is beautiful.

themetfairy Dec 15 2008 08:31 AM

Nice memento wolf!

seawolf17 Dec 15 2008 10:55 AM

The orange paint actually came with the house, which was nice. A few more of my autograph frames: Recent Mets: 1986/1988 Mets: Old School Mets: What do these guys have in common?

soupcan Dec 15 2008 11:15 AM

[quote="seawolf17"]What do these guys have in common?

None of them have ever been in my kitchen.

Edgy DC Dec 15 2008 11:18 AM

Some Greco-American blood in each of them.

G-Fafif Dec 15 2008 11:30 AM

[quote="soupcan":v5car4du]None of them have ever been in my kitchen.[/quote:v5car4du] Cheers!

seawolf17 Dec 15 2008 11:57 AM

Ha! No, it's way more obscure than that. We all (all of them and I) share a birthday.

G-Fafif Dec 16 2008 10:29 PM

Seawolf's June 12, 1982 handiwork inspires a post from my partner here.

seawolf17 Dec 17 2008 08:00 AM

Sweet. Can you link my blog in there? (http://sbuchris.blogspot.com) I posted about Jason's post this morning.

G-Fafif Dec 17 2008 08:52 AM

Link added. You mind if we run the picture itself?

seawolf17 Dec 17 2008 09:01 AM

Let me host it somewhere else, not in my personal photobucket. I'll re-post the link.

seawolf17 Dec 17 2008 09:03 AM

http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak- ... 87_484.jpg

Benjamin Grimm Dec 17 2008 09:34 AM

I like how he mentioned that he'd never be able to find an Anna Benson card. The thing is... he's wrong!

metirish Dec 17 2008 09:43 AM

[quote="G-Fafif"]Seawolf's June 12, 1982 handiwork inspires a post from my partner here.

Very cool all round , love the cards.


EDIT - that's quite a depressing lineup featured in the piece by Jason.

The Mets' starting lineup was Gerald Williams, Jeff Keppinger, Cliff Floyd, Richard Hidalgo, David Wright, Brian Buchanan, Jason Phillips, Wilson Delgado and Kris Benson, an assemblage so bad that after seeing it on the scoreboard, you would have been forgiven for expecting to see Lorinda de Roulet and Mettle the Mule. The pitchers were Benson, Pedro Feliciano and a rapidly putrefying John Franco. Met cameos were made by Danny Garcia, Eric Valent, Vance Wilson and a nearing-the-end Todd Zeile.

G-Fafif Dec 17 2008 09:47 AM

Frame is pictured here. Same one as in this thread, actually.

seawolf17 Dec 17 2008 09:49 AM

[quote="G-Fafif"]Frame is pictured here. Same one as in this thread, actually.

Ooh! You linked to my other Shea post also. I don't know if I ever posted that here. Very cathartic at the time.

G-Fafif Dec 17 2008 09:51 AM

[quote="Benjamin Grimm":34rikxr9]I like how he mentioned that he'd never be able to find an Anna Benson card. The thing is... he's wrong! [/quote:34rikxr9] I'll alert Jason. And he though he had every Mets card.

batmagadanleadoff Dec 18 2008 09:56 AM

[quote="seawolf17"] Old School Mets:

Neat stuff, seawolf. From what set is your Frank Thomas card? I've seen that Thomas image before, but never that card.

seawolf17 Dec 18 2008 11:05 AM

[quote="batmagadanleadoff":m3ypagcl]Neat stuff, seawolf. From what set is your Frank Thomas card? I've seen that Thomas image before, but never that card.[/quote:m3ypagcl] Frank Thomas visited the Pool (last summer?) and took some questions from us, and his publicist offered to send autographed cards to us that they had custom made.

seawolf17 May 15 2009 07:54 AM

Reached 300 autographed Mets cards with today's mail (Sam Perlozzo and Joe Vitko, who had the honor of being #300). Some stats, from Agee to Zachry: 1962 Mets: 12 (Anderson, Cisco, Craig, Herrscher, Hickman, Hook, Hunter, Jackson, Kranepool, MacKenzie, Pignatano, Thomas) 1969 Mets: 18 (Agee, Boswell, Charles, Garrett, Gaspar, Grote, Harrelson, Jackson, Jones, Kranepool, Martin, McGraw, Ryan, Seaver, Shamsky, Swoboda, Taylor, Weis) 1986 Mets: 36 (Anderson, Backman, Berenyi, Carter, Cashen, Darling, Dykstra, Elster, Fernandez, Foster, Gibbons, Gooden, Harrelson, Hearn, Heep, Hernandez, Horwitz, Davey Johnson, HoJo, Kiner, Knight, Leach, Lyons, Magadan, Mazzilli, McDowell, Mitchell, Niemann, Orosco, Pavlick, Bill Robinson, Santana, Stottlemyre, Straw, Teufel, Mookie) Non-Met Mets: 9 (Matthew Broderick, the late Brian Cole, Ralph Kiner, Gary Cohen, minor leaguers Yusmeiro Petit & Curtis Pride, WFAN's Steve Somers and Ed Coleman, Gov. David Paterson) Not Yet Mets: 10 (Tim Redding, Fartinez, Ike Davis, Scott Moviel, Cory Sullivan, Shawn Bowman, Kirk Nieuwenhuis, Dillon Gee, Josh Thole, Nick Abel) Non-players: 10 (Davey, Oberkfell, Robinson, Stottlemyre, Frazier, Herzog, Howard, Manuel, Cashen, Perlozzo) Incoming: 8 (Acevedo, Ambres, Blocker, Duncan, Dyer, Kroll, Marrero, Schaffer) Gone: 7 (Agee, Cole, McGraw, Milner, Bill Robinson, Dock Ellis, Sturdivant) Longest Alphabetical Run: 5 (Franco-Franco-Franco-Frazier-Fregosi) Largest Alphabetical Gap: 16 (Melvin Mora to Xavier Nady) Alomars: 0/3 Castillos: 1/4 (Luis) Ernandezes: 3/9 (Keith H, Sid F, Anderson H) Francos: 3/3 (John, Matt, Julio) Johnsons: 2/7 (Davey, HoJo) Joneses: 4/8 (Bobby, Chris, Cleon, Randy) Millers: 2/5 (Dyar, Keith) Smiths: 2/5 (Joe, Dick) Living CPF Top 100 Mets I'm missing: 38 Ojeda, 52 Gentry, 57 McAndrew, 64 Hunt, 65 Fisher, 68 Myers, 69 Lynch, 73 Aguilera, 81 Viola, 85 Murray, 86 Falcone, 87 Sisk, 92 Flynn, 94 Lance Johnson, 98 Zeile

Edgy DC May 15 2009 08:03 AM

You've got to get yourself a Vern Hoscheit if your 1986 is going to be complete.

G-Fafif May 15 2009 09:59 AM

What do non-Mets Mets who don't have their own cards sign? Or is there an Upper Deck Ed Coleman set I'm not aware of?

seawolf17 May 15 2009 02:54 PM

For both the non-Mets and the not-yet-Mets, I made custom cards, some with the Shea logo, some -- for those future Mets who will have no Shea connection -- without. I'll scan some tonight if I remember.

seawolf17 Jul 09 2009 07:22 PM

Tom Heise becomes #371 today. 1962 Mets: 13 (Anderson, Bouchee, Cisco, Craig, Herrscher, Hickman, Hook, Hunter, Jackson, Kranepool, MacKenzie, Pignatano, Thomas) 1969 Mets: 22 (Agee, Boswell, Charles, Dyer, Garrett, Gaspar, Grote, Harrelson, Heise, Jackson, Jones, Koosman, Kranepool, Martin, McGraw, Pfeil, Ryan, Seaver, Shamsky, Swoboda, Taylor, Weis) 1986 Mets: 36 (Anderson, Backman, Berenyi, Carter, Cashen, Darling, Dykstra, Elster, Fernandez, Foster, Gibbons, Gooden, Harrelson, Hearn, Heep, Hernandez, Horwitz, Davey Johnson, HoJo, Kiner, Knight, Leach, Lyons, Magadan, Mazzilli, McDowell, Mitchell, Niemann, Orosco, Pavlick, Bill Robinson, Santana, Stottlemyre, Straw, Teufel, Mookie) Non-Met Mets: 12 (Matthew Broderick, the late Brian Cole, Ralph Kiner, Gary Cohen, minor leaguers Yusmeiro Petit, Nick Abel, & Curtis Pride, WFAN's Steve Somers and Ed Coleman, Gov. David Paterson, Jay Horwitz, 1986 WS Broadcaster Vin Scully) Not Yet Mets: 11 (Ike Davis, Scott Moviel, Cory Sullivan, Shawn Bowman, Kirk Nieuwenhuis, Dillon Gee, Josh Thole, Brad Holt, Tobi Stoner, Andy Green, Ruben Tejada) Non-players: 13 (Davey, Oberkfell, Robinson, Stottlemyre, Frazier, Herzog, Howard, Manuel, Cashen, Perlozzo, Baylor, Hough, Pavlick) Incoming: 9 (Brazell, Jason Anderson, Cangelosi, Figueroa, Templeton, Lima, Rigo Beltran, Daubach, Valdez) Gone: 8 (Agee, Cole, McGraw, Milner, Bill Robinson, Dock Ellis, Sturdivant, Spahn) Longest Alphabetical Run: 6 (Alexander-Alfonzo-Allen-Allensworth-Almon-Almonte, Franco x3-Frazier-Fregosi-Friend, Pena-Perez x3-Perlozzo-Person, Snead-Snider-Soler-Somers-Sosa-Spahn) Notes: The addition of Jason Anderson makes another run of 6 as well, and finding a Pete Smith or Roberto Petagine auto would make a run of nine. Largest Alphabetical Gap: 15 (Tom Gorman to Jeremy Griffiths) Alomars: 0/3 Andersons: 3/4 (Craig, Marlon, Rick) Bells: 1/4 (Jay) Castillos: 1/4 (Luis) Clarks: 3/3 (Brady, Mark, Tony) Ernandezes: 3/9 (Keith H, Sid F, Anderson H) Francos: 3/3 (John, Matt, Julio) Green(e)s: 0/5 Jacksons: 1/3 (Al) Johnsons: 3/7 (Ben, Davey, HoJo) Joneses: 4/8 (Bobby, Chris, Cleon, Randy) Martinezes: 2/5 (Fernando, Pedro the younger) Millers: 2/5 (Dyar, Keith) Murrays: 0/3 Perezes: 3/3 (Oliver, Timo, Yorkis) Phillips: 1/4 (Jason) Reeds: 4/4 (Darren, Jeremy, Rick, Steve) Smiths: 2/5 (Joe, Dick) Taylors: 2/5 (Chuck, Ron) Valent(in)(e)s: 3/5 (Eric Valent, Jose Valentin, Bobby V) Walkers: 0/3 Wilsons: 4/5 (Mookie, Paul, Preston, Vance) Living CPF Top 100 Mets I'm missing: 38 Ojeda, 52 Gentry, 57 McAndrew, 64 Hunt, 65 Fisher, 68 Myers, 69 Lynch, 73 Aguilera, 81 Viola, 85 Eddie Murray, 86 Falcone, 87 Sisk, 92 Flynn, 94 Lance Johnson, 98 Zeile

metirish Aug 31 2009 11:15 AM

News for the industry Can Topps Save Baseball Cards?-Major League Baseball just signed an exclusive deal with the legendary card maker

Benjamin Grimm Aug 31 2009 11:21 AM

I'm even further removed from baseball cards than I am from comic books. Much further removed. Maybe Disney should buy Topps.

metsguyinmichigan Aug 31 2009 11:28 AM

I used to be huge into cards, even writing a weekly column in the paper's sports section about them. Now I just get the Topps factory set each year, and a couple packs when they first come out because I can't help myself. I'm not too far from finishing my 1970, 1971 and 1972 Topps sets -- down to a handful of high numbers in each -- which would give me a run from then to the present. I had all the Mets from 1962 on, until the companies made it impossible with the inserts and 1 of 1s and short-prints. There's a dealer in Iowa who sends me Mets team sets he builds from breaking down boxes, so I still have a pretty complete run of regular-issue Mets.

John Cougar Lunchbucket Aug 31 2009 11:32 AM

Here's a great article on the death and after-death of trading cards, from SI: [url]http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1159241/1/index.htm August 24, 2009 The Last Iconic Baseball Card Twenty years ago one teenager made a bet on the stardom of another teen, whose rookie card would become one of a kind. It would also signal the beginning of the end of a once-thriving industry LUKE WINN It is mid-July, three weeks to the day before Major League Baseball will announce that, starting in 2010, it is awarding the exclusive rights to produce trading cards with MLB team logos and nicknames to Topps. I am in Carlsbad, Calif., receiving a tour of the headquarters of Upper Deck, which has produced licensed baseball cards for the past 20 years and is Topps's only remaining competitor in a cratering market. We're in a fenced-off area of the warehouse known as the Game-Worn Jersey Room. It is where memorabilia go to slaughter, cut up into hundreds of pieces that will eventually be affixed to insert (or chase) cards, which are placed in random packs in the hopes of enticing collectors. More than 10,000 chopped-up items are stored in plastic bags on rows of metal shelves. For my visit Mark Shaunessy, the supervisor of this operation, has laid out an assortment of yet-to-be-cut artifacts on a table, including jerseys belonging to LeBron James and Grady Sizemore (with real dirt stains!), a bat of Derek Jeter's and baseballs signed by Joe DiMaggio and Walter Johnson. In the middle of this collection is something that was certainly neither worn nor used in major league baseball, let alone the NBA, NFL or NHL: a sequined, neon-green strip of fabric. "That," Shaunessy says, "came from Miley Cyrus. It was her headband. We're going to do cuts of that too." Would you believe that a 16-year-old's hair accessory is far from the strangest thing on display? To its left is a Baggie labeled FRAGILE: TITANIC COAL—containing actual coal pulled from the ship's wreckage. Chris Carlin, the marketing manager leading my tour, informs me that in a baseball set called Goodwin Champions, coming out in September, "there are going to be landmark insert cards: stuff like Titanic coal, the sands of Iwo Jima, Dead Sea salt." Inside perhaps the last packs of fully licensed MLB cards that Upper Deck will ever make, buyers might also find equine hair, with actual hair-sample cards of Kentucky Derby winners Funny Cide and Smarty Jones. (The human hairs of Beethoven and Che Guevara were contained in a pack earlier this year.) Farther to our left is a briefcase. Its brass nameplate reads S.D. JR., for Sammy Davis Jr. Its leather, its lining, perhaps even the nameplate will soon be cut up and attached to cards. "Just got these in—they're Farrah Fawcett's," says Shaunessy, referring to a pair of olive cargo pants. They seem absurdly small. Carlin wonders whether he could even fit one leg in the waist. The sports trading card industry is dealing with an uncomfortable present and an uncertain future. The sales of cards peaked in 1991 at $1.2 billion, according to estimates by Sports Collector's Digest, but slid to $400 million by the turn of the century and to $200 million last year. MLB is banking on Topps, now owned by former Disney CEO Michael Eisner, to reattract kids and streamline product offerings. Upper Deck put out 16 baseball sets in 2009 and says that it will continue to make cards with its MLB Players Association license in 2010, though none of the subjects can appear bearing a team logo. A lawsuit by Upper Deck challenging Topps's exclusive deal is also a possibility, a company source told SI last week. Even so, there's no guarantee that the existing customer base—hard-core hobbyists for whom even jersey swatches are becoming passé—will stay on board. Insert cards have been around for years. Will pop-culture ephemera be enough of a draw? When someone's pack yields a poly-cotton swatch that once hugged the backside of a Charlie's Angel, what will be the reaction? Arousal? Shock? Or, worse, indifference? You have to go back 20 years to find a landmark baseball card: Ken Griffey Jr.'s 1989 Upper Deck Star Rookie, the number 1 card in that set. That was Upper Deck's rookie year too, and the company stormed onto the scene that March with a wildly successful premium product. Branded the Collector's Choice, it was twice as expensive as its peers' (99 cents per pack, compared with 49 cents for such top competitors as Topps, Fleer, Donruss and Score) and twice the quality (packaged in foil with color photos on both sides and a hologram on the back). But this is what mattered: Upper Deck had the undisputed Griffey rookie card. Topps and Score didn't have the foresight even to include the Mariners' 19-year-old phenom in their first-edition sets, while Donruss and Fleer were virtual afterthoughts in the hobby's frenzy over Upper Deck's premiere. By the time, say, Derek Jeter came along in the 1990s, the market had become oversaturated with Upper Deck copycats; the Yankees shortstop had eight different rookie cards. When Albert Pujols arrived in 2001, he had 43. In '89 Griffey stood alone, and his card's value has held up reasonably well: at a high end of $40 in the most recent Beckett Baseball. But as his 21-year, surefire Hall of Fame career comes to an unremarkable end in Seattle, it appears unlikely that baseball cards will regain the cultural significance they had 20 years ago. The Kid's Upper Deck debut could very well be the last iconic rookie card ever made. The image of Griffey that became part of collecting lore, with his blue turtleneck and 'fro-mullet tucked beneath his cap, was doctored. In his home office in Corona, Calif., 75 miles north of Upper Deck's headquarters, Tom Geideman hands me a Polaroid that had been sitting atop a binder of Griffey cards and says, "This—it's cut off a little bit—but this is the original photo." Griffey's wearing the navy-blue hat of Seattle's Class A affiliate, the San Bernardino Spirit, whose logo is a silver S over a red star. The picture was taken by the late V.J. Lovero, an Angels team photographer who shot Griffey and his father for a Sports Illustrated feature in 1988. Lovero sold one of his extras to Upper Deck, which airbrushed the hat royal blue, erased the star, made the S yellow and—ta-da!—completed the makeover. Geideman has the Polaroid because he was the one who, at age 18, put Kid Griffey on the card. In June 1988, when Bill Hemrick, the owner of The Upper Deck, an Anaheim card store, Richard McWilliam, a CPA, and Paul Sumner, a publishing company executive, founded the Upper Deck Company in Yorba Linda, Calif., they made Geideman, a rabid card collector, their first employee. They paid him $15 an hour, gave him business cards that said product analyst and entrusted him with choosing players for the 700 cards in that first edition. Geideman set aside the first 26 spots for a subset called Star Rookies, and the logical number 1 card was Mets wunderkind Gregg Jefferies, who had been a two-time minor league player of the year; Brewers infielder Gary Sheffield and Padres catcher Sandy Alomar Jr. were also reasonable choices. Griffey had been injured late in 1988 and didn't seem likely to make the Mariners' big league roster in '89. But Geideman, whose birthday was less than six months after Griffey's, had been tracking Junior through Baseball America and believed he had the biggest upside. When Upper Deck did its first test runs of the '89 set, Geideman told the press workers not to discard the number 1 Griffeys. "I remember saying," he tells me, 'You don't want to rip up hundred-dollar bills.'" Sets are defined by their rookies, and the Griffey pick was a defining set for Upper Deck. After making the Mariners out of spring training in '89, Griffey was an immediate sensation. Geideman, who briefly attended Cal State--San Bernardino, dropped out of school to work full time at Upper Deck after it relocated to Carlsbad. He would leave the company in 1994 to become the marketing director for The Score Board, a card-and-memorabilia company in Cherry Hill, N.J., and when it declared bankruptcy in '98, Geideman joined with a coworker to form SAGE, a niche sports-card brand that makes autographed sets of NFL prospects that are released during the window between the end of college football season and the start of the NFL season. Griffey, however, is still a presence in Geideman's Spanish Mission ranch: In a display case just off the kitchen is a triptych with Griffey's '88 San Bernardino road jersey, autographed on the front; an '89 Mariners home jersey; and a 2000 Reds jersey, when he was wearing number 30 instead of 24. Geideman also has cards mixed into the display, and after we're done examining the jerseys, he points to an Upper Deck prototype of Lions running back Barry Sanders, from '91, the year of Brett Favre's debut. "That was the year we started doing football," Geideman says, "and the guy doing that set felt the need to make his mark and put a guy at Number 1." There's a reason no one remembers that card: "He picked Dan McGwire." Before a Mariners game in Baltimore in June, I ask Griffey about the '89 card. He's Upper Deck's longest-tenured spokesman, and this year the company bought 89 of his rookies back from dealers, asked him to autograph them with the inscription 20 YEARS, then inserted them into baseball packs. He says he was never in awe of the card (which fetched $150 as recently as 2000), having already grown up in major league clubhouses. He points to the printout of the card that I'm holding and says, "That hairstyle, that hat. That's why we don't keep it around the house, so my son doesn't see it." Trey, his 15-year-old son, is sitting two feet away, traveling with the team on summer break. It seems that he hasn't been effectively sheltered from the card. He's rocking the same hairstyle his dad did in '89. "I've already seen it," Trey says. "Grandma showed it to me." Trey says that he has no interest in collecting cards. "I bet if I brought home a pack of football cards, you'd look at them," Griffey says. Trey is big into football, but his dad's suggestion elicits only a shrug. "What do you think about now, son?" Griffey asks. "Girls?" Card shops have died off at an alarming rate, down from some 5,000 in the early '90s to 500 now, according to Sports Collector's Digest—but the original Upper Deck shop in Anaheim still exists, albeit under a different name at a different location, neither of which Geideman is completely sure about. Our first stop is at its original location, a minimall at the corner of State College and La Palma, in a dreary section of town. Its old address—1050 State College Boulevard—no longer exists. A guy running the minimall's pet store tells us that the shop moved a short drive south on State College 17 years ago. The shop has been renamed Win Lose or Draw Sportswear, and when we get there, Bruce Gershenoff is the only one inside. He bought The Upper Deck from Hemrick in 1988 for $50,000, and the shop is now a '90s time warp: Aside from a shelf of New Era fitted hats, most of the clothing hasn't been updated in 15 years. After Geideman reintroduces himself (they met in '88), Gershenoff explains why he changed the name. When the card market started crashing in '93 and Upper Deck's corporate offices fell behind on payments for services and supplies, their bad credit seeped into Gershenoff's rating and hampered his ability to restock the store. He incorporated as Win Lose or Draw in '95 but had already given up on cards a year earlier, around the time of the baseball strike, a tipping point for the card industry. "My sales from '88 to '92 were $10,000 to $13,000 a month, and the cost of goods was only $1,000 to $2,000 a month," Gershenoff says. "Then they started putting out so much product, raising the price on packs and putting in chase cards that caused people to stop trying to make sets. Kids ran away. Hobbyists got aggravated because they couldn't afford everything, and speculators backed off because of oversaturation. By '94 my sales were $3,000 a month, and new products were up to $5,000 a month. I had to get out." He still has some old packs near the cash register. I ask what he does with them. "I don't even do a hundred a month in cards now," Gershenoff says, "so if somebody comes in and spends $25, I give them a 50-cent pack: '88 Score, '91 Fleer. If they spend $50, I give them a dollar pack: '91 Stadium Club, '91 Upper Deck. A lot of people say, 'I don't want them.' I'll ask, 'Maybe you have a neighbor who's been a good kid?' And sometimes they'll say, 'O.K., I've got a nephew or some Jack I can give them to,' but a lot of times it's just, 'No thanks. I've got a ton sitting at home and nothing to do with them.'"