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Willie Deserves Better.
metirish Jan 24 2007 09:41 AM |
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I had an old thread about this months ago but I can't find it..must say I agree with Wally and Klapisch on this,maybe not the way they express themselves but the main point is valid.
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Johnny Dickshot Jan 24 2007 09:52 AM |
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metirish Jan 24 2007 10:04 AM |
No thanks,I'm having some coffee instead.
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Johnny Dickshot Jan 24 2007 10:06 AM |
Sorry, didn't mean to offend you; I just hate pretty much everything Wally Matthews has to say. He's about as out-of-touch with my perspective as any baseball writer has ever been.
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metirish Jan 24 2007 10:09 AM |
I didn't take offence at all, and yeah Wally is an asshole,IIRC he had less than flattering things to say about Willie after the NLCS, still I would like to see Willie get a deal done before the season.
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Yancy Street Gang Jan 24 2007 10:13 AM |
I don't think there's any such thing as a "lame duck" manager, unless you count those last few games managed by Art Howe after he was fired.
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metirish Jan 24 2007 10:19 AM |
What concerns me more than Willie getting a big pay day is a possible distraction it would be if he went into the season without a new one,and it would be a big distraction I would think...maybe he's bolt to the Bronx after the season...
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KC Jan 24 2007 10:23 AM |
Wally's nothing more than a Mets' fan rabblerouser ... always has been.
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Frayed Knot Jan 24 2007 10:29 AM |
This has been a topic all week: Bill Madden on Sunday; Kalpisch & Matthews here; M&MD yesterday, and I think it's mainly because ... well because there's just not that much else to talk about until the substanative articles on the Super Bowl (to the extent that any of them are substanative) start up next Tuesday.
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iramets Jan 24 2007 10:39 AM |
Yeah, and I think it's a taking at cheap shot at anti-Mets writers like [name your least fav columnist here] who sometimes contrive ways to criticize your team. But maybe they're defending your team here by attacking Willie.
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KC Jan 24 2007 10:47 AM |
If you're talking to me, ira, I don't think it's a cheap shot at all. The problem
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Edgy DC Jan 24 2007 10:58 AM |
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Klassick Klapisch.
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holychicken Jan 24 2007 11:19 AM |
The fact of the matter is that Willie SHOULD be thankful for the job. Noone else seemed to want to give him a chance and the Mets did.
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metirish Jan 24 2007 11:22 AM |
Well if Willie should be thankful for the job then the Mets should be thankful they have him...
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holychicken Jan 24 2007 11:33 AM |
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I don't see the connection. FTR, I don't think Willie is a bad manager. As one (or both) of the articles pointed out, he does have a clubhouse full of stars and works in one of the toughest markets and managed to guide them almost all the way to the WS. So in that respect, he has done a good job. However, he wasn't able to to prove that he was able to do this until the Wilpons and Omar gave him a shot. So sure, he deserves a raise, however, I also believe that he should be giving a discount to the organization for giving him a shot. Granted, I have no idea what numbers they are talking about. . . if they are even talking about numbers at all . . . I just think that the immediate assumption that the Wilpons are being cheap and that they should be throwing money at Willie kind of ignores what they did for him.
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iramets Jan 24 2007 12:22 PM |
Also a good GP to follow is to resist buying extra years on a contract just to prevent making someone a lame duck. If the Wilpons think "We never want to get committed to a manager for longer than we think we'll need im," then just don't offer your manager a long-term contract. In this case, WIllie deserves guaranteed money through '07 and maybe '08, but IMO the Mets would be foolish to sign him to big money beyond '08. That's a lot of time there for things to go VERY sour (not just with Willie, but with any manager) --pay the man whats he's worth for as long as you think you'll want him to manage, but if he needs what's he's worth (in annual salary) for two or three times as long as you're comfortable, then you need to let him walk. There's a lot of good managers out there
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86-Dreamer Jan 24 2007 01:06 PM |
it seems to me that every Wally article I make the mistake of reading contains at least one incorrect fact along with his off-base analysis. Although it is not material to his main point, Wagner did not blow a save in Game 2 of the NLCS:
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Edgy DC Jan 24 2007 01:17 PM |
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You needn't have cut it off there. It's also untrue that the Mets failure to advance any further really had anything to with the lack of life in Tom Glavine's arm.
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smg58 Jan 24 2007 01:35 PM |
I do think Randolph has earned a raise. I don't know any specifics on the negotiations, though, and this is something that didn't need to be resolved yesterday. I'm perfectly willing to assume for the time being that this will be resolved to everybody's satisfaction eventually.
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MFS62 Jan 24 2007 09:12 PM |
Daily News says its a done deal.
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vtmet Jan 24 2007 09:16 PM |
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I don't really know what is the right salary for a manager that is still a relative "newbie" but has been successful in improving his team both years of his leadership...Obviously, he shouldn't be getting Bobby Cox type of money, but from from what I've read today, the Mets are rumored to be offering $900K per season...from the following list, how many of these guys would you rather have managing the Mets over Willie:
Yet, Willie would be getting paid less than everyone, except Melvin, who he would barely be edging out...(that is, IF, the rumored $900K was what the Mets think he should get)...
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vtmet Jan 24 2007 09:24 PM |
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Good...Willie's not perfect, but I'm glad that they got it done...not much details, but a very respectable $2M for '09 season... Ok...now that this is out of the way...what do the NY baseball writers have to write about for the next 3 weeks while waiting for pitchers/catchers to report? I think they are fresh out of topics...
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metirish Jan 24 2007 09:49 PM |
I'll take no credit for this....:)
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KC Jan 24 2007 09:52 PM |
Pretty funny that while Michael Kay was having an embolism today on the
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Frayed Knot Jan 24 2007 10:30 PM |
So it looks like all that wailing from the columnists was much ado about nothing in the long run. Well, either that or they'll claim that it was their columns the spurred the team to make the deal. Yeah, that's the ticket.
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metirish Jan 24 2007 10:35 PM |
Wally will probably write how the Mets stiffed Willie....
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Gwreck Jan 25 2007 01:51 AM |
Looking at that chart, one could theoretically argue that Willie might be a little overpaid.
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SteveJRogers Jan 25 2007 07:29 AM |
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Actually Wally and Michael Kay (who spent his entire first hour on this) will probably be congratulating themselves as the "reason" for the Mets "doing the right thing"
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Edgy DC Jan 25 2007 08:09 AM |
Let's start a campaign to get Gardenhire his payday.
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metirish Jan 25 2007 08:22 AM |
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I'll start a thread later.....
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metirish Jan 25 2007 09:00 AM |
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The money breakdown....
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Vic Sage Jan 25 2007 10:18 AM |
this puts him 10th overall next season, and his 3-4 year average puts him in the Leyland/Sciosia/Francona/Bochy range, which is probably a bit high for a 2-year man, but not egregiously so. A good deal overall, for both sides.
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Edgy DC Jan 29 2007 09:14 AM |
This was a good idea for an article with Ken Davidoff going back and reviewing each of Willie Randolph's failed interviews. Not a lot of substance comes out, but at least one team seemed to have shied away because maybe they felt he was more interested in succeeding Torre (and maybe interested in using their team as a stepping stone). What's interesting is that he wasn't the only guy to turn down the Reds offer. Twelfth time was a charm for Willie
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metirish Jan 29 2007 09:25 AM |
Well if we are to believe what the baseball people are saying in that article then the interview process was not nearly as bad as some make it out for Willie.....and what has lying about fighting in Vietnam got to do with coaching the Blue Jays?
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Edgy DC Jan 29 2007 09:43 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jan 29 2007 10:31 AM |
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Well, some of it has to be reading between the lines. And part of the "bad"-ness of it all was the sheer volume of interviews and opportunities he fell short of, making it look like he was a token minority interview to validate the teams' hiring process in the face of Selig's aggressive affirmative action plan. And whether or not that's true, the notion has got to take a toll on a man's dignity.
Quite a bit when Johnson was using combat stories to motivate his players and it all turned out to be crap. It was a pretty sad story. The lie took on a life of its own and it was almost as if he had come to believe it himself. The team, for what it's worth, didn't fire him immediately. He came back to start the season but a few weeks into spring training they got the notion that he had lost the team.
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Frayed Knot Jan 29 2007 09:52 AM |
From his first try with the Blue Jays:
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metirish Jan 29 2007 10:07 AM |
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Oh,Ok,that explains that....has he been out of the game since I wonder.
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