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Pelfrey or Die

Johnny Dickshot Apr 24 2007 11:39 AM

Now that the cranepool is no longer about Mets history but about its present, let's discuss Mike Pelfrey. I think he's looked like crap so far and could use some time with the Zeffs. Whaddayouthink?

metirish Apr 24 2007 11:48 AM

Do you think he has good mechanics?,not sure how to explain this but they look weird at times.

Gwreck Apr 24 2007 11:49 AM

I agree, but keep in mind that your alternatives are Jorge Sosa, Chan Ho Park, and Jason Vargas. Some ML-seasoning might be worthwhile, especially if Maine and Perez continue to pitch well.

iramets Apr 24 2007 11:53 AM

Just wanted to commend the subtle allusion to NH's state motto in the thread title. Carry on.

Willets Point Apr 24 2007 11:55 AM

I didn't think it was subtle but I like it all the same. I don't get to watch every game and it seems that I've not seen Pelfrey pitching at all this season so I can't really add a comment there.

Benjamin Grimm Apr 24 2007 11:56 AM

I'd give him at least a few more starts to get comfortable.

ABG Apr 24 2007 12:01 PM

iramets wrote: Just wanted to commend the subtle allusion to NH's state motto in the thread title. Carry on. I'm not sure I like the consequences if I support sending Pelfrey to AAA.

Johnny Dickshot Apr 24 2007 12:05 PM

Not suggesting we're necessarily better if he goes away for awhile but could turn out he's better if he does. To me he just looks awfully raw, very inconsistent. Absorbing some inconsistency is the price of developing a stud, it's just a question of how much punishment is enough.

Edgy DC Apr 24 2007 12:08 PM

He's hardly sinking the ship. I think (and hope) that what they choose to do will have as much to do with Pelfrey as with the team. He's only allowed one kerbanger, and that's good, but the strikeouts aren't there, and that's surprising. Finding your strikiout pitch --- yeah, I'd guess that's worth a trip to AAA. But I think two-three more starts are in order before concluding that it's missing.

iramets Apr 24 2007 12:09 PM

Willets Point wrote: I didn't think it was subtle I read it three or four times, and said it aloud once, before I got it. Of all the strategies designed not so much to win April games, but more like "take your nasty-tasting medicine now so you'll feel better in the long run," starting a young guy in the rotation (where this club is vulnerable) seems prudent, far more so than sticking Burgos in to face tough batters in key spots, or even sitting Wright down for Newhan for a few games.

soupcan Apr 24 2007 12:16 PM

I hope we get a couple of nibbles soon. This is painful.

iramets Apr 24 2007 12:18 PM

soupcan wrote: This is painful. Did you zip up with reckless haste again?

soupcan Apr 24 2007 12:25 PM

No perfesser, I read one of your posts. ZING!

Willets Point Apr 24 2007 12:38 PM

iramets wrote: ="Willets Point"]I didn't think it was subtle I read it three or four times, and said it aloud once, before I got it. Well I'm 30 miles from the NH border so I guess I have an advantage on you as far as state motto familiarity goes.

smg58 Apr 24 2007 02:43 PM

It's only two starts. If you decided that he won the job in the spring, you owe him at least a few more starts before you change your mind on that. As far as New Orleans goes, Jason Vargas has looked pretty good so far (3.42 ERA, 1.14 WHIP, 19 K and 5 BB in 23.2 IP), and Sosa has looked very good (1.38 ERA, 1.04 WHIP, 24 K and 4 BB in 26 IP). Park, on the other hand, has struggled (ERA over 6 due to 4 HR in 16 IP). I'd have to assume Sosa is next on the depth chart right now.

MFS62 Apr 25 2007 09:33 AM

Interesting about who would be brought up if Pelfrey isn't ready yet. Traditionally, teams have looked at the budget when making these decisions. And Sosa is making over $1 million, Park about half of that and Vargas probably less than that. Omar has shown that he doesn't do things the way other GMs do. But in this case, I'm predicting it would be Sosa brought up first. Its a nice problem to have, because if the others pitch well, they could become nice trade bait come the deadline. Later

Edgy DC Apr 25 2007 09:41 AM

I don't see why budget would be an issue, except that maybe if a guy is called up and tanks, a more expensive guy is easier to return to AAA.

MFS62 Apr 25 2007 09:56 AM

I dunno. Just past observations over the years,nothing specific to point to. Seems that if a team is paying a guy a lot of money, they'd rather be spending it on a major leaguer. But your point about passing through waivers is well taken. Later

ABG Apr 25 2007 11:42 AM

Right now, I choose death.

Willets Point Apr 25 2007 11:45 AM

I'll take tea & cake.

Nymr83 Apr 25 2007 11:47 AM

homeruns by John Mabry arent good. I'd still give him 1 or 2 more starts before i make a change.

Centerfield Apr 25 2007 11:50 AM

At this point, I'm inclined to choose "Die".

Rockin' Doc Apr 25 2007 07:10 PM

If it were up to me I would likely give him one more start, but if the results were no better, then I would send him down for some hopeful retooling in New Orleans. Pelfrey would probably benefit from some time in New Orleans to get his act together and gain some confidence with a few (hopefully) successful outings. He seems to be lacking something right now. I don't know whether it is the lack of a reliable out pitch, a good second pitch to go with his fastball, adequate control, or maybe some confidence, but something definitely seems to be missing right now.

metirish Apr 25 2007 07:51 PM

Omar when asked today about Pelfrey.... ] “You have to keep your eyes on him and see where you are,” Minaya said. “Right now, he’s going to get another start. But I reserve the right to speak to my manager. I haven’t spoken to him yet about today’s outing.” Sosa is 3 - 0 with a sparkling 1.38 earned run average for New Orleans while striking out 24 and allowing only one homer in 26 innings.

Centerfield Apr 25 2007 08:15 PM

Good answer by Omar.

Edgy DC Apr 25 2007 08:33 PM

Speak to your pitching coach too. And Sosa's AAA manager and pitching coach. And the Crane Pool. And your teddy bear.

Kid Carsey Apr 25 2007 08:34 PM

C: >>>Good answer by Omar<<< He's more artuculite in print I'm sure for some people.

metirish Apr 25 2007 08:39 PM

="Kid Carsey"]C: >>>Good answer by Omar<<< He's more artuculite in print I'm sure for some people. That's my fault,I left out "know what I mean"..

Kid Carsey Apr 25 2007 08:50 PM

I was making a dumb joke by misspelling ... I'm dumber than Omar.

metirish Apr 25 2007 08:51 PM

I knew that KC....

Batty31 Apr 25 2007 08:51 PM

Kid Carsey wrote: I was making a dumb joke by misspelling ... I'm dumber than Omar. Hmmmm...I was going to call you on that one. Nice save.

Willets Point Apr 25 2007 08:53 PM

I didn't even notice it was spelt wrong.

Johnny Dickshot Apr 25 2007 08:53 PM

="metirish"] ="Kid Carsey"]C: >>>Good answer by Omar<<< He's more artuculite in print I'm sure for some people. That's my fault,I left out "know what I mean".. that's funny. know what i mean?

smg58 Apr 26 2007 07:05 AM

The leash had to have gotten tighter on Pelfrey. I basically agree with Rockin' Doc at this point. I'm still hoping to see him work through his troubles, but if he can't keep the Mets at least close while he's on the mound, at some point you go to plan B. Right now Sosa would be the best option. Humber has done very well his last two starts, but based on his spring I'm inclined to give him a full year in AAA unless there's an emergency.

iramets Apr 26 2007 07:39 AM

]“You have to keep your eyes on him and see where you are,” Minaya said. “Right now, he’s going to get another start. But I reserve the right to speak to my manager. I haven’t spoken to him yet about today’s outing.” That 40 words, by my count. Two-word alternative: "No comment." One-word alternative: "Maybe." zero-word alternative: [sheepish shrug] So that's at least 38 words' worth* of meaningless blather. *see "I wandered lonely as a cloud" for concision and meaning.

metirish Apr 26 2007 07:42 AM

Come on ira,if Omar had said no comment you might have said he could have explained things better instead of giving the standard GM BS.

iramets Apr 26 2007 07:44 AM

If I've got to hear your BS, please make it as pithy as possible.

iramets Apr 26 2007 07:48 AM

"I'm not sure yet" also works. That's four words. "Willie and I will discuss it"--that's six. My point being that Omar takes up to 600% or 900% more words to express the simplest thought he has. If he hits his thumb with a hammer he isn't going to say "Ow!" like you or me. He's going to say something like "That really hurts, as far as I can tell, just by feeling the sensation I just felt, you know what I mean? That really counts as a negative experience, but I'll consult with members of my staff just to make sure that I felt what I felt."

Edgy DC Apr 26 2007 08:03 AM

"Willie and I will discuss it" is exaclty the kind of churlishness you're hanging Willie for. You're not exactly a legend of succinctness of brevity yourself.

iramets Apr 26 2007 08:07 AM

Edgy DC wrote: "legend of succinctness of brevity". One or the other, please. I can tolerate verbosity or a lack of content much better than I can tolerate the combination of both. If you're going to be wordy, then at least say something meaningful. If you're going to say nothing, then at least be brief.

Edgy DC Apr 26 2007 08:13 AM

I agree. Thanks.

MFS62 Apr 26 2007 05:12 PM

="MFS62"]I dunno. Just past observations over the years,nothing specific to point to. Seems that if a team is paying a guy a lot of money, they'd rather be spending it on a major leaguer. But your point about passing through waivers is well taken. From Today's Daily News: ]But even though nobody in the Met high command was ready to say Pelfrey is on trial again, he is fully aware there's a pennant race to be run here, and despite yesterday's proclamation, Randolph is not likely to give him much more time to turn it around. For one thing, Pelfrey has options. For another, Jorge Sosa, whom the Mets are paying $1.25 million to pitch at Triple-A, is 3-0 with a 1.38 ERA in four starts for New Orleans and has given up only one homer in 26 innings. Later

Kid Carsey Apr 26 2007 06:03 PM

ira: >>>That 40 words, by my count. Two-word alternative: "No comment." One-word alternative: "Maybe." zero-word alternative: [sheepish shrug] So that's at least 38 words' worth* of meaningless blather.<<< Theo would have "shown us the plan". Someone besides me oughta go pull one of ira's endless rants about something that he gets in his jaws for ten days and chews on until it's liquefied and displays that he does the exact same thing sometimes as he's saying Omar does. Too many words to hammer home the point that you hate the Mets, Willie, Omar, Shea, Pete Flynn, his grass, and the dirt on the tiles in the the mez- zanine bathroom. Here's my response sans meaningless blather .... WE GET IT.

Edgy DC Apr 26 2007 06:37 PM

="MFS62"] ="MFS62"]I dunno. Just past observations over the years,nothing specific to point to. Seems that if a team is paying a guy a lot of money, they'd rather be spending it on a major leaguer. But your point about passing through waivers is well taken. From Today's Daily News: ]But even though nobody in the Met high command was ready to say Pelfrey is on trial again, he is fully aware there's a pennant race to be run here, and despite yesterday's proclamation, Randolph is not likely to give him much more time to turn it around. For one thing, Pelfrey has options. For another, Jorge Sosa, whom the Mets are paying $1.25 million to pitch at Triple-A, is 3-0 with a 1.38 ERA in four starts for New Orleans and has given up only one homer in 26 innings. Later I'm going to hope that ERA speaks louder than the salary. The difference between his salary and Park's relatively meaningless if Park is the one that's 3-0 and 1.38.

Frayed Knot Apr 26 2007 09:02 PM

btw, Torre: 5:15 today - 'Jeter's bruised thigh is fine, he was even fine to play yesterday (the rainout) so he's no problem for today' 7:10 - Jeter out of the lineup with a bruised thigh

iramets Apr 27 2007 12:21 AM

Kid Carsey wrote: [Someone besides me oughta go pull one of ira's endless rants about something that he gets in his jaws for ten days and chews on until it's liquefied and displays that he does the exact same thing sometimes as he's saying Omar does. Too many words to hammer home the point that you hate the Mets, Willie, Omar, Shea, Pete Flynn, his grass, and the dirt on the tiles in the the mez- zanine bathroom. Here's my response sans meaningless blather .... WE GET IT. You get that I hate all that stuff I don't hate but not that I'm starting to hate you? Clearly, you're in need of further explication of my position, plus a good reading-comprehension course.

Kid Carsey Apr 27 2007 05:12 AM

ira: >>>You get that I hate all that stuff I don't hate but not that I'm starting to hate you?<<< No comment. ira: >>>Clearly, you're in need of further explication of my position, plus a good reading-comprehension course.<<< Maybe.